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[CALL TO ORDER / MOTION TO APPROVE SEPTEMBER 17, 2025 AGENDA]
ORDER THE FINDING COMMISSION MEETING FOR WEDNESDAY, SEPTEMBER 17TH.UM, THANKS FOR COMING TONIGHT.
FIRSTLY, WE'LL LOOK AT IT, WE'LL APPROVE THE AGENDA FOR THIS EVENING, WHICH IS FOUND A SHORT AGENDA.
I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE AGENDA.
UM, PUBLIC COMMENT, WE TAKE A MINUTE IN CASE SOMEBODY COMES IN.
ALRIGHT, WE ARE, UH, WE'RE GOOD ON THAT.
[GENERAL DISCUSSION ITEMS]
WE'LL MOVE INTO OUR GENERAL DISCUSSION.WE'VE GOT TWO ITEMS TONIGHT, WHICH WAS THE PLANNING COMMISSION RULES, WHICH WE TALKED ABOUT LAST MONTH AND HAVE BEEN FLOATING OUT THERE FROM, UM, ZACH FOR THE COUPLE MONTHS NOW.
BUT WE TALKED ABOUT A LITTLE BIT, AND THEN WE'RE GONNA GET THAT VERY DETAILED.
UM, TRAFFIC SAFETY AND, UH, AND, UH, WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO ABOUT THAT.
WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT GONNA TALK ABOUT, UM, RIDGE PIKE TONIGHT.
SO WE'RE GONNA GO ABOUT THOSE TWO THINGS.
SO LET'S GET STARTED WITH THE, UH, HUBER PROVINCE TOWNSHIP PLANNING.
THESE WERE WRITTEN BY ZACH, UH, OUR ATTORNEY WHO'S NOT HERE TONIGHT, AND HE'S PROBABLY HAPPY ABOUT THAT.
I MEAN, YEAH, GENERALLY WHERE WE'RE AT WITH THIS IS ZACH WENT THROUGH AND MADE THE CHANGES WE TALKED ABOUT FROM LAST MONTH.
THE COPY I SENT AROUND IN THE PACKET SORT OF HAD THOSE CHANGES MARKED UP.
THIS IS THE, THIS IS WHAT IT WILL LOOK LIKE IF YOU ADOPT IT TONIGHT.
SO I, I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S REALLY MUCH DISCUSSION LEFT TO BE HAD.
BUT WE, WE MADE THE CHANGES THAT YOU SUGGESTED FROM LAST MONTH.
JERRY, JUST FOR YOUR INFORMATION, WE, UH, WE TALKED ABOUT THIS AT THE LAST MEETING A LITTLE BIT.
WE'VE MADE A FEW MINOR CHANGES, RIGHT? THERE WAS SOME DISCUSSION AROUND, UH, YOU KNOW, NOT, NOT THAT WE'RE ANY KIND OF, UH, BUT YOU KNOW, JUST MAKING SURE EVERYBODY FELT COM THAT WE FELT THAT THE PUBLIC WOULD FEEL COMFORTABLE BEING TOLD THAT WE'RE GONNA CUT YOU OFF.
RIGHT? SO WE, WE TRY TO BE, WE TRY TO BE VERY, UM, COGNIZANT OF THESE RULES IN TERMS OF TRYING TO TELL PEOPLE WHEN THEY COME UP AND THE NEXT TIME WE HAVE A MEETING, LIKE WE DID A FEW, A COUPLE MEETINGS AGO, THAT WE, UH, WE TELL 'EM THESE RULES ARE NOW IN PLACE.
UM, YOU KNOW, NOT THAT WE HAVE TO BE RIGID ON 'EM, BUT THAT WE CERTAINLY ARE GOING TO TRY TO ENFORCE THEM WHEN PEOPLE START DUPLICATING THINGS OR IF THEY GO ON TOO LONG.
AND CERTAINLY IF THEY GET RUDE OR, UH, OUT OF HAND, WE'RE GONNA STOP.
SO, SO, UH, THAT'S WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT, ZACH.
LIKE JEFF SAID, ZACH MADE A FEW CHANGES THAT WE RECOMMENDED AND THIS IS I GUESS, THE FINAL RESULT IF YOU WANT IT TO BE.
WELL, THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.
EVERYBODY QUESTIONS ON IT OR COMMENTS? I THINK THAT, UH, ZACH, UH, DID A VERY GOOD GUY AT REPRESENTING OUR DISCUSSIONS.
AND I, AND I THINK ALL THE CHANGE THAT HE MADE WERE, ARE APPROPRIATE.
AND, UH, OUR POINT WITH, I THINK OUR INTENT, WE WOULD, WE WOULD IMPLEMENT THESE JEFF AND AT EVERY MEETING OR JUST THE ONES THAT WE KNOW, THEY'RE GONNA BE A LITTLE SENSITIVE.
WELL, I THINK IT'S, I THINK IT'S JUST A MATTER OF THINGS ON RECORD.
THAT'S ALL THIS IS, IS IS TO HAVE THIS ON RECORD.
BUT NOW IF, IF, IF, IF THERE WERE, IF ONE PERSON HERE, THAT'S PROBABLY A POINT.
THERE'S ONLY TWO OR THREE PEOPLE.
THEY, THEY COULD, AND IT'S UP TO YOU OR ONE OF US.
NO, THAT'S NOT, CALL THIS, THAT'S WHAT THIS SAYS.
THAT'S ALL DISCRETION OF THE COMMISSION.
YOU KNOW, WE CAN LIMIT, UH, DO WHATEVER.
BUT THE POINT IS, THIS IS A MATTER OF, OF THESE ARE THE RULES, BUT, BUT THE RULES SAY AT THE DISCRETION AND, AND WE DON'T WANT TO, YOU KNOW, DUPLICATIONS.
SO THESE WILL REALLY GO INTO EFFECT IF WE DO HAVE A, A LARGE CROWD OR A LARGE, IN THEORY, TECHNICALLY THEY'RE ALWAYS IN EFFECT, RIGHT? BUT YOU COULD FALL BACK TO THEM IF WE'RE HAVING A MEETING WHERE WE DO KNOW THAT THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE YOU CAN SAY, LOOK, AND WE WE'RE GONNA MAKE A POINT TO HAVE A STACK OF THEM IN THE BACK, JUST ON, ON PERMANENT FILE, SO TO SPEAK, AND JUST SAY, LOOK, WE'RE GOING TO, TO BE USING, BECAUSE WE HAVE A LOT OF PEOPLE SPEAKING TONIGHT, WE'RE GONNA FALL BACK TO THE RULES AND REGULATIONS FOR PUBLIC MEETINGS.
IF YOU NEED, IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS, I THINK THAT'S, PLEASE GRAB THAT.
I DON'T KNOW THE TERM FALL BACK, BUT WE ARE GONNA ADHERE, ADHERE TO THESE.
AND I THINK THAT'S THE POINT I WAS TRYING TO MAKE.
YOU KNOW, WE, IF, IF IT'S A LARGE CROWD, WE'LL SAY SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IT'S JUST ONE OR TWO PEOPLE AND BOB ASKS A QUESTION, A PERSON ANSWER, THEN I, YOU KNOW, WE'LL GIVE A CHANCE TO TALK ABOUT, AND THAT'S ALL THEY'RE MEANT TO DO IS JUST REALLY TO BE BE IN PLACE.
AND IF WE NEED TO USE THEM, WE HAVE THEM WRITTEN DOWN SO IT'S FAIR AND UPFRONT.
SO THEN ON THE RECORD, THESE ARE THE, THESE ARE THE GUIDELINES REGULATIONS THAT WE WANNA
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FOLLOW.AND SO UNDERSTAND EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDING THAT, AND THERE'S NO FURTHER QUESTIONS.
WE'LL TAKE THE MOTION TO ADOPT THESE RULES, UH, WHEN THE PLANNING COMMISSION SEES NECESSARY TO, UM, ADHERE TO THAT.
WELL, I ONLY HAVE ONE QUICK QUESTION.
HAVE 'EM, UH, COPIES IN THE BACK ROOM.
WILL THEY ALSO, OR SHOULD THEY BE ON THE WEBSITE? I COULD, I CAN PUT THEM ON WEBSITE.
WE PUT THE OTHER, THE RULES AND REGULATIONS FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND THE ZONING HEARING BOARD.
ARE THEY ON THE WEBSITE? THE ZONING HEARING BOARD'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT.
SO, UM, JUST BECAUSE THAT'S RUN AS A TRIAL BY THE ATTORNEY WHO SORT OF SITS AS THE JUDGE.
SO THAT'S A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT.
HE, HE SETS THE RULES FORWARD IN THOSE MEETINGS.
I DON'T THINK THE PLANNING, I DON'T THINK THE BOARD RULES ARE, ARE ON THERE.
I THINK AT THE TOP OF EVERY MEETING I CAN TALK, I'LL LOOK INTO IT.
HOW ABOUT THAT? I MEAN, I I HAVE NO PROBLEM PUTTING THESE ON THE WEBSITE.
WELL, I WOULDN'T WANT TO PUT 'EM ON IF, IF THE SUPERVISOR DON'T OKAY, I'LL, I'LL TAKE A LOOK AT IT.
MY VOTE WOULD BE, I, I LIKE TO, YOU KNOW, HAVE STACKS BACK THERE, ESPECIALLY WHEN IT'S A HOT TOPIC MEETING.
WE MENTION IT, WE TALK ABOUT IT, WE CAN PUT IT IN THE AGENDA FOR THAT MEETING WHEN WE KNOW IT'S A HOT MEETING.
BUT I WOULDN'T, UH, IF, IF THE SUPERVISOR KNOWS, I DON'T THINK OURS CAN DO IT.
WELL, BUT, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE OTHER, OTHER THINGS.
THERE ARE OTHER THINGS THAT HAPPEN AT OTHER MEETINGS RIGHT.
THAT AREN'T PART OF THESE GUIDELINES.
BUT AS JEFF HAS COMMENTED BEFORE, YOU KNOW, IF THERE, IF WE KNOW THERE'S BAZILLIONS OF PEOPLE, UM, THERE'S A SIGNUP SHEET THE BACK OF THE ROOM, PLEASE SIGN UP AND WE'LL, YOU KNOW, TAKE EVERY PERSON.
WE WANT TO HEAR FROM EVERYBODY, BUT WE'LL TAKE YOU IN ORDER BASED ON, WELL, I, BASED ON THE, I THINK, SO THAT'S A, THAT'S A SEPARATE ISSUE.
I, I THINK JERRY'S POINT IS GOOD ON MULTIPLE LEVELS.
I NEED TO LOOK AND SEE IF THE BOARD IS ON THERE AND IF THE BOARD DOES HAVE SOME RULES AND MAYBE THERE DOES NEED TO BE SOMETHING ON THE WEBSITE ABOUT IT THAT WE DON'T HAVE TO BE MORE OPEN SO THAT PEOPLE CAN FIND THAT, THAT WE CAN REFER 'EM TO THAT ON THE WEBSITE.
I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH IT, BUT I DON'T WANT TO BE, IF THEY'RE NOT ON THERE, I JUST DON'T THINK WE, THEY SHOULD LEAVE THAT POINT, POINT TAKEN AND, AND SOMETHING I WILL LOOK INTO ON A MORE GLOBAL LEVEL AND SEE WHAT WE WANT TO DO.
YEAH, I THINK THAT'S A GOOD POINT.
SO WITH THAT ALL SAID, IF THERE'S NOTHING ELSE, LET'S TAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THESE, UH, MOVING FORWARD AND, UH, UH, AND THEN WE'LL MOVE ON.
UH, I'LL MOTION THAT WE, UH, APPROVE THESE AS REWRITTEN.
UH, AND MOVE FORWARD THAT, UH, THESE WILL BE THE, UH, RULES OF CONDUCT TO GUIDE OUR MEETINGS.
JERRY HAS MADE A MOTION AND I'LL TAKE A SECOND, I'LL SECOND THAT.
WE WILL, WE WILL, WE WILL, WE WILL, WILL KEEP THESE.
AND, AND, UH, I'LL LET YOU KNOW ABOUT THE WEBSITE AND WHAT YEP.
WHAT THE OVERALL OPINION OF THE ADMINISTRATION IS ON THAT.
SO, UH, THE NEXT IS DISCUSSION OF TRAFFIC SAFETY, WHICH, UH, BRIAN, WE ALREADY COMMENTED.
THAT WAS A NICE THING YOU SENT US.
ALSO, WHY DON'T YOU, UH, WHAT ARE YOU GONNA, HOW ARE WE GONNA, DO YOU GONNA GO THROUGH IT OR, UH, SO REALLY I JUST WANT TO, YOU KNOW, SUMMARIZE THE SUMMARY
UM, SO, YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN TALKING AND LOOKING AT THE CRASH CORRIDORS, UM, THAT WERE IDENTIFIED IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
WE TALKED ABOUT THOSE BACK IN MAY.
WE TOOK A LOOK AT THOSE IN MORE DETAIL LAST MONTH.
UM, AND AS, AS YOU ALL REQUESTED, WE HAVE GONE THROUGH ALL OF THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT WE HAD AND PUT TOGETHER A, AN ESTIMATED CONSTRUCTION COST AND DESIGN COST, UH, FOR EACH OF THOSE, UH, SPECIFIC AREAS.
AND THEN, UM, WE'VE ALSO GONE THROUGH THE PROCESS OF GIVING YOU WHAT WE BELIEVE TO BE A PRIORITY FOR THOSE, RECOGNIZING THAT IT'S UNLIKELY THAT IN ONE FELL SWOOP WE'VE GOT HALF A MILLION DOLLARS SITTING AROUND TO, TO MAKE SOME TRAFFIC SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS.
ALTHOUGH THOSE, THAT WOULD BE GREAT.
UM, YOU KNOW, RECOGNIZING THAT THERE ARE OTHER THINGS COMPETING FOR THOSE FUNDS.
WE'VE TRIED TO IDENTIFY WHAT THE, THE BIGGER BANG FOR THE BUCK WOULD BE AS FAR AS SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS.
SO, UH, YOU KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, A COUPLE OF THE ONES THAT ARE, THEY'RE IDENTIFIED AS A HIGHER PRIORITY ARE THINGS WHERE WE'VE SEEN A FATALITY.
UM, AND THAT WOULD BE THE, THE LIGHTING THERE ON RIDGE PIKE, UH, YOU KNOW, PEDESTRIAN FATALITY.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE MINIMIZE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR THAT TO HAPPEN.
AGAIN, THAT BECOMES A HIGHER PRIORITY THAN THE OTHER ONES.
YOU KNOW, THAT'S ALMOST HALF OF YOUR, THE COST OF ALL OF THIS.
BEING THAT THE R HAVE MENTIONED HERE, EACH APPROACH, STATE ROUTE 4 0 0 2, STATE ROUTE OH, 29.
DOES THE STATE HAVE NO RESPONSIBILITY IN THAT? UM, FOR THE MOST PART, UNFORTUNATELY NO
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UM, SO WELL DON'T SUGARCOATSO IN THE, IN THE COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA, THE MUNICIPALITIES OWN AND ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR MAINTAINING ALL OF THE TRAFFIC SIGNALS.
UH, SO FOR THE MOST PART, THESE ARE IMPROVEMENTS THAT WOULD BE HAPPENING AT TRAFFIC SIGNALS.
UM, IN SOME CASES, UH, YOU KNOW, WE'VE IDENTIFIED WHERE WE HAVE POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT COMING IN THAT WOULD BE AFFECTING THINGS.
AND THEREFORE THOSE HAVE BECOME MAYBE A, UM, UH, A MEDIUM PRIORITY, UH, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING ALONG, UH, 29 OR, WELL, THAT ONE ACTUALLY, UM, THAT, THAT ONE'S A DIFFERENT STORY.
BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, THE, THE CORDED UP OF PROVIDENCE, UH, YOU KNOW, THOSE ARE DEVELOPMENTS THAT ARE ALREADY THERE.
UM, AND SO THOSE ARE THE ONES THAT ARE ON, ON THE LIST HERE.
UM, SO JUST IN TAKING A LOOK AT THIS TABLE, IF YOU LOOK AT THE HIGH PRIORITY ITEMS, ACCEPTING THE LIGHTING, OKAY.
'CAUSE THE LIGHTING REALLY IS AN ITEM OF IN AND OF ITSELF, BUT IF YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THE OTHER HIGH PRIORITY ITEMS, UM, YOU'RE LOOKING AT A CONSTRUCTION COST OF ABOUT $50,000.
YOU ADD ON $20,000 FOR DESIGN COSTS AND, UH, A $5,000 COST TO, TO PUT A BID PACKAGE TOGETHER TO DO THAT.
AND THAT WOULD TAKE CARE OF ALL OF THE HIGH PRIORITY ITEMS EXCEPT FOR THE LIGHTING.
UM, SIMILARLY, IF YOU LOOK AT THE, THE MEDIUM PRIORITY, UH, DOING THE SAME MATH, THAT THAT GROUPING ENDS UP AT 78,000.
SO COULD THAT VERY EASILY BE BROKEN OUT INTO A MULTI-YEAR PROJECT? ABSOLUTELY.
UM, THE OTHER PIECE THAT IS NOT ON NUMERICALLY ON THE LIST, UH, BUT IS THERE IS A FOOTNOTE.
UH, WE HAD TALKED LAST, LAST MONTH ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY OF SOME RED LIGHT CAMERAS.
UH, I'VE DONE A LITTLE BIT MORE RESEARCH INTO HOW THOSE GET IMPLEMENTED.
UH, AND WHAT WE HAVE FOUND FROM OTHER MUNICIPALITIES EXPERIENCE IS THAT THERE IS NO REAL EXPENSE TO THE MUNICIPALITY TO GET THOSE DESIGNED AND INSTALLED.
THE WAY THEY ARE OPERATING IS THAT THE INITIAL, UH, RECEIPTS THAT COME IN FROM THE TICKETS FOR THE RED LIGHT RUNNING PAYS FOR THAT UPFRONT COST.
UH, SO THERE'S NO INITIAL OUTLAY EXCEPT FOR, UH, WE, WE'VE ESTIMATED, YOU KNOW, $2,500 OF, OF TIME TO KIND OF COORDINATE WITH THEM, COORDINATE WITH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT AND, AND KIND OF PUT THE TWO TOGETHER AND, AND GET THAT PROCESS ROLLING.
AND, YOU KNOW, JUST MAKING SURE THAT THE TOWNSHIP'S INTEREST ARE PROTECTED AS THEY GO THROUGH THEIR PROCESS.
WHO, WHO PROVIDES THE UPFRONT, UH, PAYMENTS SO THAT NO, UH, THERE, THERE ARE RED LIGHT RUNNING, UH, COMPANIES OUT THERE.
UH, THERE ARE ENTITIES THAT DO THIS FOR A LIVING, AND THEY UPFRONT THE COST, THEY COME OUT, THEY DO THE DESIGNS, THEY DO THE CONSTRUCTION.
AND THEN THE WAY THAT SYSTEM IS SET UP IS THAT AS THE RECEIPTS START TO COME IN, THEY GET PAID BACK FIRST.
AND WHAT, WHAT PERCENTAGE OF THE, OF WHAT GETS, WHAT THE FINES, WHAT PERCENTAGE OF THE FINES DO THEY GET? I INITIALLY, THEY GET EVERYTHING HOW LONG UN UNTIL THEIR COSTS HAVE BEEN PAID BACK, AND THEN THE MONEY GOES INTO COUNTRY.
AND THEN, UH, SO THEN NO, ACTUALLY THE, THEN THE MONEY GETS SPLIT.
UH, IT COMES TO THE TOWNSHIP TO TAKE CARE OF OPERATIONS AND MAINTENANCE COSTS.
UH, BECAUSE WHAT HAPPENS IS, UM, IT DOES FALL ON THE POLICE DEPARTMENT TO ACTUALLY REVIEW THE INFORMATION THEY GET FROM THE RED LIGHT COMPANY AND TO ACTUALLY ISSUE THE TICKETS.
AND SO THERE'S SOME, YOU KNOW, MANPOWER EXPENSES FOR THAT.
SO THE TANGENT GETS REIMBURSED FOR THAT.
UH, AND ONCE THAT IS, IS TAKEN CARE OF, THEN ANY ADDITIONAL FUNDS THAT THE CAMERAS GENERATE IN REVENUE GOES INTO A STATEWIDE FUND, UH, WHICH WE THEN AS A MUNICIPALITY CAN APPLY FOR A GRANT TO GET PROJECT FUNDING THROUGH THAT.
AND AS A, A PARTICIPATING MUNICIPALITY, WE GET A HIGHER PRIORITY OF RECEIVING THOSE GRANTS THAN A MUNICIPALITY IF IT'S NOT PARTICIPATING AND NOT PUTTING MONEY INTO THE ACCOUNT.
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WHAT OF THESE RECOMMENDED IMPROVEMENTS ON HERE, CAN WE OFFER A CAMERA TO MAYBE TRY TO PROVE THAT AREA OR THAT INTERSECTION? I THINK THE CAMERAS ARE INDEPENDENT OF THESE EQUIPMENTS THATCAN WE PREVENT ANY OF THOSE IN HERE TO GET STARTED? YEAH.
UM, AND, YOU KNOW, SHOULD HAVE HAD THAT LIST TOGETHER FOR YOU.
BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, IN, BASED ON THE, THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT WE HAD LAST, LAST MONTH, THERE WERE SEVERAL, I THINK THERE ARE FOUR OR FIVE DIFFERENT INTERSECTIONS THAT WE SAID.
UM, AND THE ALL LOOKING AT THE ALL RED, LET'S SEE IF I CAN FIND IT.
SO, UM, ARE, ARE YOU SAYING, TOM, THAT THE, THE CAMERAS, WHICH ONES OF THOSE INTERSECTIONS WITH CAMERAS WOULD, WOULD ALL, WOULD MINIMIZE THE NEED TO SPEND THE MONEY ON THESE? OR, OR, AND YOU COULD SAY MINIMIZE, BUT I'M SAYING OPTIMIZE THE TRAFFIC CONTROL.
OH, WELL, I, I WOULD, WITHOUT DOING ALL THIS CONSTRUCTION AND ALL THIS ESTIMATED COST THAT HE'S ESTIMATING THAT WE'D HAVE.
SO FOR INSTANCE, ON THE ONE THAT'S WHAT GOING ON HERE, 211,000 BUCKS, THIS LIGHTING, WELL THAT'S, YOU KNOW, COULD THAT, COULD WE PUT A CAMERA THERE TO MINIMIZE THE COST AND OPTIMIZE THE TRAFFIC CONTROL? THAT THAT ONE WAS MORE ABOUT PEDESTRIAN.
AGAIN, AN EXAMPLE I'M SAYING IS THERE ON HERE THAT WE COULD DO WHAT I JUST SAID, MINIMIZE THE COST, BUT OPTIMIZE THE CONTROL.
I, I THINK, UM, BASED ON OUR CRASH ANALYSIS, I DON'T KNOW THAT ONE NECESSARILY AFFECTS THE OTHER, UH, WHERE WE'RE SEEING CRASHES RESULTING FROM PEOPLE THAT ARE RUNNING THE RED LIGHTS.
UM, WE'RE NOT SUGGESTING SOMETHING ELSE THAT WOULD COST ENGINEERING AND CONSTRUCTION FUNDS AS AN ALTERNATIVE.
IT'S THE RED LIGHT RUNNING CAMERAS THAT ARE THE, THE SOLUTION FOR THAT PROBLEM.
WHAT YOU'VE GOT IN FRONT OF HERE ARE OTHER THINGS LIKE PEOPLE TURNING LEFT WHERE THEY SHOULDN'T BE MAKING A LEFT.
ANY OF THESE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE REALLY INDEPENDENT, WOULD BE FULFILLED BY NO.
OR, UH, OPTIMIZED BY USING A CAMERA? NONE OF THESE SPECIFIC ONES NO.
BUT THERE ARE OTHER AREAS IN THE TOWNSHIP WE CAN DO, CORRECT? YEP.
UH, SO TOWNSHIP LINE AND PROVIDENCE SHOPPING CENTER IS A SPOT.
UM, THE OTHER ONES ARE, IT LOOKS LIKE I THOUGHT COLLEGEVILLE AND ARCOLA, UH, YEP.
I BELIEVE THAT WAS ONE OF 'EM.
COULD WE MAKE, COULD WE SEND THIS DOCUMENT AND THAT DOCUMENT MM-HMM
TO THE SUPERVISORS AS RECOMMENDATIONS? SURE.
ALTHOUGH, I GUESS WHAT I WILL SAY IS THE, THE DOCUMENT THAT YOU RECEIVED YESTERDAY YES.
UM, SO IF WHAT IF WHAT YOU'RE ASKING, WHAT I CAN DO IS I COULD BE, I COULD JUST MODIFY IT SLIGHTLY TO ADD INTO THIS CHART THE INTERSECTION WHERE WE'D RECOMMEND PURSUING THE RED LIGHT RUNNING CAMERAS SO THAT IT'S SPECIFICALLY IN A, IN A SIMPLE FORMAT.
AND I'M JUST LOOKING AT THE CAMERAS JUST AS A, BECAUSE THIS IS GONNA TAKE SOME WORK BY THE SUPERVISORS IN TERMS OF FINDING FUNDING AND APPROVING AND ALL THAT.
BUT IF WE COULD DO THE CAMERAS TO GET SOMETHING STARTED IN THE TRAFFIC CONTROL DEPARTMENT WITH A MINIMAL END OF COST OF SAYING, LET'S TRY IT.
WELL, I WOULD THINK THAT THE CAMERAS SHOULD BE A NO BRAINER.
RIGHT? I MEAN, IT DOESN'T COST THE TOWNSHIP ANYTHING.
IT'S A NO BRAINER TERMS COST THAN OTHER, THAN THE POLICE DEPARTMENT.
WELL, BUT ALSO THE PUBLIC, YOU KNOW, THE PUBLIC DOESN'T LIKE THIS KIND OF THING.
SO I THINK THE SUPERVISORS HAVE TO TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT WHEN THEY'RE LOOKING AT IT.
IT'S LIKE, IS THIS SOMETHING THE PUBLIC WANTS? I MEAN, IF THE PUBLIC SAYS, GEE WHIZ, I WANT TO RUN RED LIGHTS.
I MEAN, BUT THEY'RE, THEY'RE AGAINST, THEY'RE AGAINST, YOU KNOW, I THINK MOST PEOPLE, AND I KNOW I AM, MOST PEOPLE ARE AGAINST, UH, THE GOVERNMENT TAKING MORE CONTROL OVER YOUR LIFE.
RIGHT? I MEAN, NOBODY SHOULD BE RUNNING A RED LIGHT.
EVERYBODY AGREES THEY'LL RUN RED LIGHTS, RIGHT? EVERYBODY KNOWS THAT.
BUT WHEN YOU START PUTTING CAMERAS ON PEOPLE AND YOU START INPUT, YOU KNOW, INFILTRATING THEIR PRIVACY, THAT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENT ISSUE.
BREAKING DOWN AS TO WHAT THE RED LIGHT, I MEAN, DO YOU GET HALFWAY THROUGH WHEN IT TAKES YOUR PICTURE? DO YOU GET ALL THE WAY THROUGH? ONLY YOU, YOU GET SIX INCHES OVER THE LINE? FORGOT ONE.
YEAH, THAT'S YOUR LICENSE PLATE, BOB.
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IT WORKS IS THEY ACTUALLY HAVE TO DEMONSTRATE MULTIPLE PICTURES.SO THEY HAVE TO SHOW YOU YEAH.
IT'S GONNA BE ON THE, UH, THEY HAVE TO SHOW A PICTURE OF YOUR VEHICLE BEFORE THE STOP BAR AND THE LIGHT IS RED.
THAT'S A PROOF, THAT'S PROOF THAT YOU COULD, YOU, YOU WERE BEHIND THE STOP BAR WHEN IT WAS RED.
AND THEN A FIXTURE OF YOU TRAVELING THROUGH THE INTERSECTION AND EXACTLY.
AT ONE POINT I'M THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT MAY DEPEND ON THE EXACT SETUP OF THE CAMERAS AND WHERE THEY CAN DEMONSTRATE THAT, HOW FAST THEY'RE GOING THROUGH, YOU KNOW, THEY PROBABLY HIT THE FLOOR AS SOON THEY HIT THE STOP.
BUT, YOU KNOW, BOTH, THEY HAVE TO DEMONSTRATE BOTH OF THOSE.
AND, AND THE WAY IT WORKS IS THAT THE, THE RED LIGHT CAMERA COMPANY DOES AN INITIAL SCREENING.
SO THEY GET, YOU KNOW, A HUNDRED REPORTS A DAY.
OH, THIS COULD HAVE BEEN, AND THEN THEY DO AN INITIAL SCREENING AND GO, NO, THAT'S NOT REALLY, NO, NO, NO.
HERE ARE THE 25 THAT WE BELIEVE ARE TICKETABLE OFFENSES.
THEY THEN GET PUSHED TO THE POLICE DEPARTMENT, POLICE DEPARTMENT REVIEWS, CONFIRMS MAYBE THEY THROW OUT ANOTHER COUPLE IF THEY SORT CHOOSE AND THEN THE TICKETS GET ISSUED.
I HAD NO IDEA THAT'S HOW IT WAS WITH A LOT OF THESE RECOMMENDATIONS.
UM, THE BOARD AND THE POLICE, THEY'RE GONNA TAP, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO TAKE SOME MORE INVESTIGATION, MORE TIME INTO IT.
SO I, I THINK WHAT WE'RE NOT, NOT TRYING TO TROUBLE, BUT WHAT WE'RE SORT OF LOOKING FOR TONIGHT IS JUST FOR RECOMMENDATION TO MOVE THIS FORWARD TO THE BOARD IF YOU WANT TO CHANGE ANY OF BRIAN'S PRIORITIES, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT YOUR PRIORITY, YOU REFLECT THAT YOU WANT SOMETHING DIFFERENT BESIDES ME AND YOU WANT IT TO BE HIGH.
WE CAN CERTAINLY MAKE THAT CHANGE.
UM, RIGHT NOW I THINK WE'RE JUST LOOKING TO GET THIS INTO THE BUDGET CYCLE SO THAT EXACTLY.
SO THAT THEY CAN TALK ABOUT IT.
THAT'S, NOBODY KNOWS IT'S, WE ALL AGREE AIN'T GONNA GET DONE NEXT WEEK.
BUT THE, BUT THE BOARD IS, OR GILMORE ASSOCIATES IS THE MEETING WITH THE BOARD ON THE 30TH AT THEIR BUDGET WORKSHOP THAT'S OPEN TO THE PUBLIC.
AND AS BILL JUST SAID TO ME, YOU KNOW, MAKE SURE THIS GETS IN THERE SO THAT WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT.
THAT'S ALL WE WANT TO, AND THAT WAS THE REASON WHY WE WANTED TO JUST TONIGHT, TONIGHT.
SO YOU COULD, SO WE CAN FORWARD EXACTLY YOUR RECOMMENDATION SO THAT IT DOES GET BUDGETED.
AND I GUESS THE ONLY, ONLY THING I WOULD PROBABLY SAY IS, IS THAT, YOU KNOW, THE, UH, THE LIGHTING ISSUE, THE $211,000, UH, IS A BIG INDEPENDENT, YOU KNOW, SINGLE OUTLAY.
AND THAT'S NOT, NOT 'CAUSE I WANT TO CHANGE THE PRIORITIES, BUT THERE MAY BE, IF THERE'S SOME OTHER MEDIUM ITEMS THAT THAT COULD GO IN TO THE BUDGET, UH, THAT DOESN'T ADD UP TO 211.
I DON'T MEAN, I DON'T KNOW HOW THE BUDGET STANDS, BUT, SO THAT, THAT'S UP TO THE SUPERVISORS AND TIM FERMAN AND YOU KNOW THEM TO DISCUSS, YOU KNOW, HOW TO SPEND THESE KINDS OF DOLLARS.
BUT I'M JUST SAYING THAT ALTHOUGH THE 211 IS A HIGH PRIORITY, IT MIGHT BE WORTH MOVING SOMETHING THAT'S 10,000.
YOU COULD DO ALL OF THE MEDIUM PRIORITY AND LOW PRIORITY AND NOT GET TO THE 211.
AND SO IS THAT A BETTER BENEFIT THAN SPENDING THE TWO 11? I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT.
THE ONLY OTHER, THE OTHER THING I WOULD ASK IS, IS THERE NOT KNOWING THE DETAIL OF WHAT'S IN THE TWO 11, LIKE HOW MANY LIGHT FIXTURES THAT IS, IS THERE A SORT OF A PHASED APPROACH TO THAT THAT WOULD OFFER SOME BENEFIT? LIKE IF YOU ONLY DID HALF OF IT OR A THIRD IT, DOES THAT NOT MAKE SENSE? BECAUSE IT WOULDN'T BE ECONOMICAL, YOU KNOW, PART OF IT RESULT IN ANY BENEFIT BENEFIT, RIGHT? YEAH.
THE, THE CHALLENGE WITH LIGHTING IS AS SOON AS YOU GO IN TO LOOK AT LIGHTING, THERE IS A STANDARD THAT REQUIRES A MINIMUM LIGHT LEVEL.
UM, AND SO BASED ON THE, THE WIDTH OF THE ROAD AND THE, YOU KNOW, EVERYTHING ELSE, YOU REALLY HAVE TO GO IN WITH THIS NUMBER OF LIGHT FIXTURES IN ORDER TO ACHIEVE THAT, THAT LIGHT STANDARD.
YOU KNOW, COULD YOU GO IN WITH HALF OF THE LIGHTS AND YOU'LL SKIP EVERY OTHER ONE YOU COULD, BUT NOW YOU'RE GONNA HAVE LIGHT POCKETS AND DARK, DARK POCKETS.
AND SO NOW ARE, ARE THERE OTHER OPTIONS? UH, CERTAINLY CAN, CAN THERE BE A DISCUSSION WITH, WITH PICO AND SAY, HEY, CAN WE LOOK AT POTENTIALLY PUTTING SOME STREETLIGHTS ON SOME OF YOUR EXISTING POLES AS OPPOSED TO HAVING A, A NEW INDEPENDENT STREETLIGHTS STANDALONE THEY DO ALREADY.
WHICH SURE THEY HAVE A LOT OF 'EM.
SO WOULD THAT BE POSSIBLE AND WHAT'S
[00:25:01]
THE COST, YOU KNOW, TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE GOT THIS TO YOU TONIGHT.YOU KNOW, WE DIDN'T SPEND THAT KIND OF TIME TO LOOK AT ALL OF THOSE
MY FEELING ON WHAT YOU JUST SAID, JOE, THOUGH, IS THAT I THINK THIS IS PERFECT.
I THINK WE JUST SAID IT TO THE WAY IT IS.
THEY'RE SMART ENOUGH PEOPLE, SUPERVISORS SMART ENOUGH TO SAY, WELL, GEEZ, OKAY, THAT'S A HIGH PRIORITY TWO 11,000, LET'S DO FIVE OF THE LEADING PRIORITIES.
AND, AND YOU KNOW, WE'LL GET BACK TO THE HIGH PRIORITY I THINK, I THINK WE DON'T CHANGE IT.
WE LET 'EM KNOW THAT'S A HIGH PRIORITY UNDERSTANDING THAT THEY'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO DO THAT.
NO, I AGREE A HUNDRED PERCENT.
I'M JUST, THIS IS JUST A RECOMMENDATION.
SO THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, I'M HOPING THEY'RE, THEY'RE GONNA LOOK AT IT AND SAY, OKAY, WE SEE THAT'S A HIGH PRIORITY, BUT WE CAN'T AFFORD THAT RIGHT NOW.
RIGHT? SO LET'S DO TWO OF THE MEDIA ONES.
AND, AND THAT'S PART, PART OF THE BEAUTY, EXCEPT FOR THAT LARGE TWO 11 AND THERE'S 103 FOR THE QUEUE DETECTION UP ON, UH, TOWNSHIP LINE ROAD AT LINFIELD TRAP.
ASIDE FROM THOSE TWO, YOU'RE LOOKING AT A, A LOT OF RELATIVELY SMALL COSTS.
I, I MEAN, I DON'T WANT TO DIMINISH IT, BUT YOU'RE LOOKING AT $10,000 AND $20,000 TYPE IMPROVEMENTS.
AND SO TO A CERTAIN EXTENT, THE SUPERVISORS CAN SAY, OKAY, WE HAVE X NUMBER OF DOLLARS FOR SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS THAT WE'RE GONNA IMPLEMENT, AND WE'LL FIGURE OUT HOW MANY, YOU KNOW, WE'LL START WITH THE HIGH PRIORITY ONE AND HOW MANY CAN WE DO? THAT'S THEIR JOB.
AND I'M, I'M SURE THEY'RE ACCUSED SOMETIMES OF NOT BEING SAFETY ENOUGH CONSCIOUS, YOU COULD SAY, WE ADDRESSED MOST OF ARE HIGH ISSUES, HIGH ACCIDENT ISSUES, AND EVEN SOME OF THE MEDIUM.
SO, SO WE, WE COULD SEND THIS DOCUMENT ALONG WITH A SEPARATE DOCUMENT SAYING, HERE'S ANOTHER THING TO LOOK AT TO MR. MR. SUPERVISORS OF, UH, CAMERAS FOR, FOR THE CAMERA.
SO WHAT, WHAT ACTUALLY WHAT I, IF, IF YOU'RE OKAY WITH IT, WHAT I WOULD SUGGEST IS I TAKE THIS DOCUMENT, I'LL JUST ADD A SEPARATE TABLE TO IT THAT WOULD OUTLINE THE RED LIGHT CAMERA LOCATION, AND THEN WE'LL SEND THAT OVER TO THE, WITH, WITH, WITH THE SUMMARY THAT THAT INDICATES THAT THIS IS A, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU WANNA PHRASE IT, BUT A NO COST TO THE TOWNSHIP.
UH, SOLUTION TO HELP MINIMIZE SOME OF SOME OF THE TRAFFIC ISSUES.
AND OBVIOUSLY THEY'RE GONNA, THEY'RE GONNA ASK YOU LIKE WE DID HOW THIS WORK, IF YOU'RE NO.
THE NICE THING ABOUT WHAT YOU'VE DONE HERE IS TO, BY RECAPPING IT ALL IN THIS ONE SHEET, IT'S MANAGEABLE, IT'S EASY.
YOU KNOW, YOU GET INTO THIS TURN, THAT TURN, IT GETS A LITTLE COMPLICATED.
SO, SO OUR PLATE, OUR, OUR CHARGE AT THIS TIME IS TO RECOMMEND THOSE TWO DOCUMENTS OR ONE DOCUMENT WITH INCLUDING THE CAMERAS SAYING, UH, AS RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS FOR THEIR NEXT, UH, FOR CERTAINLY FOR THEIR BUDGET PLANNING, UH, CORRECT PROCESS.
BOB'S MADE A MOTION THAT WE, UH, FORWARD THIS ON THE SUPERVISOR AS RECOMMENDATIONS.
AND, AND LET ME PUT INTO THE OFFICIAL RECORD, WHICH, UH, BRIAN, GREAT JOB.
YEAH, I MEAN THAT REALLY, REALLY KIND PUTS IT RIGHT THERE.
AND, AND LIKE I SAY, NOW THE SUPERVISORS CAN DO THEIR JOB AND SAY, HERE'S WHAT THE MONIES WE HAVE, HERE'S WHAT WE'LL TRY TO WORK ON.
AND I, I THINK THAT'S A GOOD, NICE WORK.
AND, AND JEFF, I PRESUME, YOU KNOW, YOU KIND OF COMMUNICATE WITH TIM AS PART OF HIS DEVELOPING THE BUDGET TO PRESENT TO WHAT WE JUST DISCUSSED AND YES.
HAVING HIM SOMEHOW DO WHATEVER MAGIC, WHATEVER WE DO, HE DOES WHATEVER WE DO.
BUT, BUT I WILL, I WILL HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH HIM THAT, THAT OF WHAT GILMORE WILL BE TALKING TO HIM ABOUT.
THIS INCLUDED AND, AND SOME OTHER THINGS.
AND THAT THEY, AND HE KNOWS THAT THEY'RE ON THE AGENDA FOR THE 30TH AND WE FEEL STRONGLY THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE NEEDS TO BE MONIES BUDGETED FOR TRAFFIC SAFETY AND, AND HE NEEDS TO INCLUDE WHATEVER THE SUPERVISORS AGREE TO.
WHAT, YOU KNOW, AND I THINK, I THINK PART OF THAT ARGUMENT, AND THAT'S A GOOD POINT, JOE, BUT PART OF THAT ARGUMENT IS WHEN YOU'RE TALKING TO TIM OR WHOEVER YOU'RE TALKING TO ABOUT THIS, SAY, YOU KNOW, AS I ALL THIS DEVELOPMENT THAT WE HAVE IN THE WORKS, THIS TRAFFIC ISSUES BECOME MORE IMPORTANT.
AND YOU WOULDN'T HAVE ANY ACCIDENTS IF THERE WAS ONLY A FEW HOUSES AROUND.
RIGHT? WE WOULDN'T HAVE TO BE HOUSES.
NO, NO PROVIDENCE CENTERS OR WHATEVER.
THAT'S A REALLY GREAT WORK, UH, PRESENT.
THE ANSWER TO GREAT JOB, BRIAN.
[00:30:01]
IF, IF ONE PERSON'S LIFE IS SAFE ABSOLUTELY ABOUT IT.THAT'S CHEAP MONEY COMPARED TO LIFE, YOU KNOW, WITH THAT THEY SHOULD APPROVE EVERYTHING
[DISCUSSION: FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS]
FUTURE AGENDA, UM, OCTOBER ONE, WHICH WILL BE HERE BIZARRELY WILL BE HASSAN ROAD.HASSAN ROAD IS A 14 LOT SUBDIVISION, UM, ON HASSAN ROAD OVER HERE.
THAT WILL BE ON THE AGENDA FOR THEIR TENTATIVE SKETCH REVIEW AND POTENTIAL RECOMMENDATION FROM YOU.
SPOTLESS CAR WASH WILL BE ON THERE FOR THEIR TENTATIVE AS WELL FOR A DISCUSSION AND POTENTIAL RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD.
LEMME JUST SAY SOMETHING ABOUT, IF I COULD INTERRUPT YOU ONE SECOND.
CAR WASHES, WHAT'S GOING ON? I DON'T KNOW.
THEY'RE ALL, WHAT'S GOING ON? YOU SEE THE ONE DOWN IN FEEDS FIELD, THAT LITTLE RITE AID, THAT'S GONNA BE A CARWASH.
AND THEN THEY JUST BUILT, REBUILT THE ONE ON UH, LEWIS ROAD.
REMODELED IT, MADE IT ALL BIG HERE.
NOW WHAT'S GOING ON? WHY ALL SUDDEN THESE CAR, WHY I I I, I DON'T KNOW.
LING TO ME TOO, WHERE DOES THIS COME FROM? ALL A SUDDEN, FROM ONE THING, THE PRICES ARE GOING UP, IF YOU'VE NOTICED ON THE NEW ONES.
WELL I KNEW, BUT THEY MUST FIGURE THAT PEOPLE ARE WILLING TO PAY THAT MONEY.
I THINK THEY'RE JUST GOING UP LIKE CRAZY.
I KNOW SPOTLESS AS A COMPANY SEEMS TO BE HITTING THAT WE MUST BE A TARGET MARKET, NOT WE KNOW FOR PROVIDENCE, BUT SOUTHEAST PENNSYLVANIA MUST BE A TARGET MARKET.
IS THAT A SPOTLESS ONE FEED? YOU WANNA PHOENIX SO SPOTLESS AS WELL.
YEAH, BUT WAIT TO SEE WHAT THAT WAS GONNA BE.
THEY THEY MEASURED IT WHEN THEY MADE THEIR PRESENTATION THAT THEY WERE, THEY WERE BUILDING ONE IN, IN.
WELL, I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT WAS, MAYBE THEY DID, BUT I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT WAS IT BECAUSE I, I DON'T SEE THAT AS A CAR WASH PLACE.
WHAT? WELL, RIGHT THERE IN THE CORNER.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE R AID R FOR THIS CLOSED AS I DRIVE BY THERE, I'M LIKE, WELL, YEAH, YEAH.
I MEAN WASH, WASH, I MEAN THAT'S OUT OF OUR CONTROL IS UPPER PROVIDENCE.
WE CAN'T REALLY DO MUCH WITH IT.
BUT, BUT I LOOK AT THAT, I'M LIKE, YEAH, WHAT SURPRISE.
YOU KNOW WHAT, WHAT IS ALL THE SUDDEN HAPPEN IN THAT PEOPLE THINK ABOUT THINGS DIFFERENTLY? FOR ONE THING, THEY'D RATHER HAVE MORE FREE TIME AND JUST DRIVE THROUGH THE CAR WASH RATHER THAN EVERYBODY WASH THEIR OWN CAR.
YOU KNOW, SOME PEOPLE HAVE HOAS CONTROLLING HOAS.
THEY WON'T LET YOU WASH YOUR CAR.
WE CAN WASH, WE LOOK WASH IT TRUCK ALL THE TIME.
IT JUST, IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, MAYBE WE OUGHT TO AUTO GROUP PUT OUR MONEY TOGETHER AND INVEST IN A CARWASH.
THAT'S ONLY IF WE, THAT WE INVEST TOO MUCH COMPETITION ONLY, ONLY IF WE CAN PLAY THAT 1970 SONG ON A LOOP.
SO LENNAR FROM 1000 CAMPUS DRIVE, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU REMEMBER THIS.
THEY ASKED FOR A ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT FOR TOWNHOUSES ON CAMPUS DRIVE THE 1000 CAMPUS DRIVE.
IT'S AN EXISTING OFFICE BUILDING.
THEY CAME IN WITH A, A PROPOSAL FOR TO CHANGE THE ZONING AND THEIR PLAN WAS FOR 120 TOWNHOUSES.
THEY'VE COME BACK AND THEY STILL WOULD LIKE TO PUT RESIDENTIAL THERE, BUT THEIR PLAN NOW CALLS FOR 72 TOWNHOUSES.
SO THEY'RE STARTING THE PROCESS BACK UP.
YOUR ROLE IN THIS IS TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD AND TELL THE, TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD IF YOU THINK IT IS WORTHWHILE MOVE FORWARD OR, OR NOT.
AND THEN THE BOARD WILL HAVE TO TELL 'EM THE SAME THING AND, AND THEY'LL SEE IF THEY CAN GET A HEARING FROM THE BOARD ON THE ZONING.
SO YOU, YOU PLAN ON PUTTING ALL THREE'S ON AGENDA FOR THAT? YEAH.
LE LENAR, I THINK SPOTLESS CAR WASH AND LENNAR ARE FAIRLY BENIGN APPLICATIONS.
I'VE HEARD THAT THERE'S SOME RESIDENCE ON FELL AND THE OTHER ROAD THAT'S BACK THERE BY HASSAN, I NEVER KNEW BACKWARDS.
I IDEA IT IT IS, IT IS THE PROVIDENCE.
IT'S ONE OF, IT'S A TOLL DEVELOPMENT WENT UNDER DAVE PEARSON FOR A WHILE.
UM, IT, BUT THEY, THERE'S SOME RESIDENTS BACK THERE THAT, THAT AREN'T A FANS OF THIS FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND.
SO THAT ONE IS ON THE AGENDA THAT MIGHT DRAW SOME PEOPLE OUT.
I I, I DON'T KNOW THAT IF, IF YOU'RE MAKING ME SPECULATE, THAT WOULD BE THE ONE THAT DRAWS PEOPLE OUT.
SPOTLESS CAR WASH, THEY HAD A DECENT AMOUNT FOR THE ZONING HEARING BOARD, IF I REMEMBER RIGHT, JOE? CORRECT, YES.
THEY, THERE WERE QUITE A FEW PEOPLE WHO HAD PROBLEMS WITH SIGHT CRIMES AND TRAFFIC ISSUES AND, BUT I THINK THEY WORKED MOST OF THAT OUT WITH THEM THERE.
WE, WE STILL GET PEOPLE, BUT THIS WAS WHAT THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO DO IS WORK THOSE DETAILS OUT.
AND THE LAST PLAN I SAW THAT I THOUGHT WAS SOMEWHAT OF A REVISED PLAY AND UH, I WASN'T QUITE SURE THAT THEY MET ALL OF THEIR COMMITMENTS THAT THEY MADE DURING THAT MEETING IN THE PLAN THAT I SAW.
WELL, AND THAT'S WHAT WE HAVE TO REVIEW.
I MEAN I SO THE ZONING PLAN BOARD APPROVED IT.
AGAIN, THEY, THEY APPROVED THE USE THERE 'CAUSE THE USE WAS NOT IN THE ORDINANCE.
AND THEN THERE WAS CONDITIONS THAT WERE PUT UPON THAT.
I KNOW SOME OF IT WAS FENCING IN THE BACK, SOME OF IT WAS ABOVE THE BUFFERING.
[00:35:01]
I'D HAVE TO LOOK AT THE, AT THE ACTUAL DECISION FROM THE ZONING HEARING BOARD TO REALLY, AND I WILL SUMMARIZE THAT IN MY MEMO.FENCING, THOSE KINDS OF ISSUES.
MY COVER MEMO WILL HAVE THAT SUMMARY ON THERE SO THAT YOU KNOW WHAT TO LOOK FOR IN THE PLAN.
UM, AND I DON'T THINK LENNAR'S GONNA DRAW A LOT OF PEOPLE AGAIN, YOU, YOU NEVER KNOW.
BUT I I I THINK HAVING THESE THREE THINGS ON THE AGENDA, I THINK IT BE A FAIRLY QUICK MEETING.
THEN NO, OCTOBER 15TH IS CANCELED.
THE, THERE'S STILL GOING TO BE SOMETHING GOING ON HERE.
THERE'S, THERE'S AN OPEN SPACE REFERENDUM WORKSHOP, DISCUSSION FORUM.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT THEY'RE QUITE CALLING IT, BUT NATURAL LAND TRUST WHO'S BEEN SPEARHEADING THAT AND HELPED US DETERMINE THE FINANCIAL END OF IT.
BUT NOW THEY'RE SORT OF WORKING ON THE POLITICAL END OF IT IS USING THE ROOM AND THEN BRINGING IN SOME SPEAKERS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
I WILL BE HERE, THE ATTORNEY WILL BE HERE, BUT WE WON'T BE PRESENTING ANYTHING.
UM, YOU'RE WELCOME TO COME TO LISTEN, JOE JUST SAT THROUGH MOST OF IT ON MONDAY AT THE, AT THE BOARD MEETING.
YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S A DISCUSSION.
UM, I'LL BE HERE TO ANSWER SPECIFIC QUESTIONS ABOUT ZONING.
ZACH WILL BE HERE TO ANSWER SPECIFIC QUESTIONS ABOUT THE LAW OF IT AND, AND THE LEGAL ISSUES.
OTHER THAN THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU GUYS GET THE NIGHT OFF, SO, BUT YOU'RE GONNA HAVE AN ENVIRONMENTAL FACULTY THAT NIGHT.
THEY WILL, THEY, WE WILL HAVE THAT BEFOREHAND JUST BECAUSE WELL TWO OF THE FOUR, TWO OF THE FIVE MEMBERS ARE ON THE, THE THREE OF THE FIVE MEMBERS ARE ALREADY GONNA BE HERE.
AND IT WOULD BE, IT IS A GOOD MEETING TO SORT OF GET BACK INTO THE SWING OF THINGS AND WE'LL LOOP YOU BACK IN WHEN YOU GET BACK FROM VACATION.
WELL, I, UH, LOOKING WAY AHEAD TO NOVEMBER.
I KNOW NOVEMBER 1ST WE'LL PROBABLY HAVE THE, THEY'VE, I JUST HAD A DISCUSSION TODAY.
THEY WANNA GET IN THE NOVEMBER CYCLE TO HAVE THE MEETING ON NOVEMBER 5TH.
AND I THINK IT'S NOVEMBER 17TH FOR THE, UH, THE BOARD, WHATEVER THE BOARD MEETINGS THAT MONTH, THEY WANNA BE ON THAT CYCLE.
AND ONE OTHER THING FOR THAT MEETING RIDGE BY ZONING, I DON'T THINK THAT'S GONNA BE ON, ON A REGULAR MEETING THAT WE WILL HAVE TO DO THAT IN DECEMBER.
'CAUSE WE DON'T HAVE A LOT IN DECEMBER.
UM, THERE'S ANOTHER LAND DEVELOPMENT.
WHAT ABOUT MID-NOVEMBER? OH, MID-NOVEMBER.
MID-NOVEMBER THE 19TH IS ALLEGED STEVE.
OKAY, THAT'S, WE'LL HAVE RIDGEBACK ZONING ON THAT MEETING.
WE'LL HAVE, UM, ON THE NOVEMBER 5TH MEETING IT WILL BE HASSEN ROAD.
WHY AM I DRAWING A BLANK ON THAT ONE? OH, HIGH, HIGH REAL ESTATE THEY PUT IN THERE, UM, THEY'VE REVISED THEIR PLANS.
WELL, I JUST DIDN'T KNOW BY HIDE.
THAT, THAT IS THE OTHER ONE THAT'S ON THERE.
AND TO LET YOU KNOW THAT THE, UM, AT THE BOARD MEETING ON MONDAY, THE, THE BRIDGET COLLEGE BOARD WHO MADE A PRESENTATION TO US EARLIER IN THE MONTH.
UM, THE BOARD OBVIOUSLY HAS A LOT OF QUESTIONS.
THEY, THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT, NOBODY SAID, SURE, JUST GO AHEAD, LET'S JUST GET THIS DONE.
OBVIOUSLY
THEY, THERE'S BEEN SOME, YOU KNOW, DISCUSSION ABOUT IT OF WHAT THEY CAN DO.
YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF, I THINK BILL WAS SORT OF ECHOING A LITTLE BIT OF WHAT KEVIN SAID AT THE MONTH.
YOU KNOW, WHERE, LOOK, YOU'VE GOT THIS BIG SEA OF PARKING, YOU'RE JUST FILLING IN.
THIS IS WHAT HE TOLD ME THAT YOU'RE JUST FILLING IN SOME EMPTY SPACES.
YOU KNOW, LET'S, LET'S TAKE A LOOK AT THAT.
SO THEY'RE GONNA MOVE FORWARD.
WE'RE GONNA HAVE AN INTERNAL DISCUSSION WITH STAFF ABOUT WHAT THEIR SORT OF THEIR NEXT STEPS AND IF THEY CAN, YOU KNOW, WHAT THEY'RE WILLING TO DO ON THE PLANS FROM WHAT OUR INTERPRETATION OF IT IS.
SO EVERYBODY SAID, WELL, THREE 50 IS AN AWFULLY HIGH NUMBER, BUT THEY'RE NOT, THEY'RE NOT ON ANY FUTURE AGENDA.
NO, I'M JUST LETTING YOU KNOW THAT.
YEAH, LET'S JUST ASSUME WE PUT AN APPLICATION.
LET'S JUST ASSUME, I THINK THAT WE WOULD ALL AGREE THAT THAT'S, AND I THINK BILL JUST TOLD US THAT IT'S A TERRIBLE COMPLAINT.
WHAT CAN WE DO AND MAKE, THIS IS TOO PREMATURE, BUT WHAT CAN WE DO NOW TO STOP THIS? WELL, YOU, YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO ANYTHING BECAUSE THE ZONING ISN'T IN PLACE TO DO ANY OF THAT.
SO THEREFORE THE, THIS SOLELY RESTS ON THE BOARD.
I MEAN, YOU COULD MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD OBVIOUSLY, BUT THIS SOLELY RESTS ON THE BOARD TO SCHEDULE A HEARING TO ADOPT THAT ZONING.
AND THEY DON'T HAVE TO SCHEDULE THAT.
I HAVE TO FOLLOW THE, THE NPC CLASS.
IF THE ZONING ISN'T IN PLACE, WE CAN'T APPROVE ANYTHING BECAUSE THE ZONING'S NOT IN PLACE.
WE DON'T HAVE TO APPROVE ANYTHING.
IF, IF THEY DRAW UP SOME ZONING AND WRITE SOMETHING UP, YOU COULD TAKE A LOOK AT THAT ZONING.
WE COULD HAVE THEM OUT LIKE LENNAR, LIKE ANYBODY ELSE.
AND YOU COULD SAY, WE DON'T RECOMMEND THIS, THIS ZONING BECAUSE WE DON'T LIKE THE NUMBER OF HOUSES YOU THAT THIS ALLOWS, REVISE THAT NUMBER DOWN.
NOW THEY CAN STILL GO TO THE BOARD AND THE BOARD CAN TELL 'EM THE SAME THING.
[00:40:01]
OR LIKE PROVIDENCE TOWN CENTER APARTMENTS, THE BOARD COULD SAY WE'RE OKAY WITH IT.WE'RE SORRY THE PLANNING COMMISSION DOESN'T LIKE IT, BUT WE'RE OKAY WITH IT.
'CAUSE THAT'S THEIR PREROGATIVE.
BUT CAN IT EVEN BE AS DRASTIC AS DOWNSIZE YOUR THREE 50 TO WHATEVER TO ZERO TO ZERO
I MEAN YOU CAN BASICALLY SAY WE'RE NOT, I DON'T WANT YOU CAN MAKE YOUR RECOMMENDATION COULD BE WE DON'T WANNA CHANGE THE ZONING AT ALL.
YOUR RECOMMENDATION CAN BE ANYTHING YOU WANT IT TO BE.
BUT ALSO THAT IF OUR RECOMMENDATION IS SOMETHING THAT'S NOT FEASIBLE THAT SOMEBODY COULD JUST OVERRIDE BECAUSE YOU WELL, YEAH, I MEAN THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S FOR YOU TO DECIDE.
BUT IF THE PLA ZONING'S IN PLACE AND IT'S NOT IN PLACE NOW, THEN WE WOULD, YOU KNOW, THAT THAT WOULD LEAD US TO MAKE THAT WE COULD MAKE THAT RECOMMENDATION.
SAM WILL, BUT WE WOULD MAKE THAT RECOMMENDATION BECAUSE YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK ANYBODY WANTS TO SEE THAT YOU GO PAST THERE.
WHY YOU WON'T THERE ALL THOSE TREES DOWN THE CREEK TIMES, IT'S RIDICULOUS.
MAYBE WE NEED TO LOOK AT OUR SDO AND YOU KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, THE TEARING THE TREES DOWN, MAYBE THERE'S A PENALTY FOR TAKING TREES DOWN.
THEY'VE GOT A PLANT ONE THAT'S EQUAL TO IT.
I DON'T KNOW WHETHER THAT'S, THAT'S NOT EVEN, WELL WE HAVE, WE HAVE SOME OF THAT IN THE ORGANIZATION, BUT I WOULD LIKE TO SEE ZERO.
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE, LEAVE IT ALONE.
THEY COME BACK TO US WITH SOMETHING TO LOOK AT.
WE CAN MAKE THAT DETERMINATION.
THAT'S WHAT I WOULD LIKE TO DO.
WE CAN DO, BECAUSE, AND AGAIN, I'M, WE DON'T WANT TO, I DON'T WANNA HAVE THAT HEARING NOW OR THAT DISCUSSION NOW, BUT I'M JUST SAYING IS THERE'S SOMETHING WE COULD DO TO JUST SAY, I DON'T EVEN WANT 150, NOTHING NOW, UNLESS THEY WANT TO BUILD ON SOME OF THAT ALREADY PURVIEW SERVICE THAT THEY BUILT YEARS AGO.
A LOT OF PARKING LOTS THERE THAT THEY CAN'T NEED ALL THAT PARKING.
WELL, IT'S NOT THAT UPPER PROVIDENCE HASN'T LET ANY DEVELOPMENT IN, I MEAN, QUITE THE CONTRARY, WE GOT 3000 ROUGHLY PLUS OR MINUS WAITING.
SO THEY HAVE, THEY KNOW THEY HAVE SOME WORK TO DO.
I MEAN, I, I DON'T WANNA SPEAK FOR THEM, BUT THEY KNOW THEY HAVE WORK TO DO.
THE ONLY FEAR IS THAT, AND I HOPE THAT PEOPLE WOULD COME OUT ON THAT ONE BECAUSE THERE'S NO REAL HOUSING THERE THAT THEY'RE AFFECTING.
THERE'S NO, THERE'S NO HOUSING PLAN AROUND.
THERE IS SOMEBODY TO SAY, WELL, WE DON'T NEED THAT IN OUR BACKYARD.
BUT, YOU KNOW, I WOULD HOPE THAT PEOPLE WOULD RECOGNIZE THE GREEN SPACE AND WANT TO PROTECT IT.
AND, AND THAT'S A VERY VALID POINT.
AND I I I, I DON'T WANNA MAKE THEIR ARGUMENT FOR THEM.
WHAT THEY REALLY NEVER GOT A CHANCE TO BRING UP TO YOU, BUT WHAT BROUGHT UP AT THAT AT THE BOARD MEETING WAS THAT THE PROPERTY WAS VALUED AT ONE POINT IN TIME AT $500 MILLION.
IT, THEY BOUGHT IT FOR $142 MILLION.
SO YOU'VE ALREADY LOST ALMOST $400 MILLION OF PROPERTY VALUE THERE.
FROM AN ASSESSED VALUE STANDPOINT, WE'VE LOST OVER A HUNDRED MILLION DOLLARS OF ASSESSED VALUE AND TAXABLE VALUE ON THERE.
SO TO THAT WAS THE POINT THEY MADE WITH, WITH THE, WITH, AND THAT SORT OF RESONATED WITH A COUPLE OF THE SUPERVISORS IS, YOU KNOW, THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT WE'RE NOT GETTING IS AFFECTING EVERYTHING ELSE.
AND I'M NOT SAYING THAT THE BOARD NOW THINKS, OKAY, YEAH, JUST GO AHEAD AND DO IT SO WE GET MORE TAXABLE REVENUE.
THEY WANNA APPROACH IT IN A VERY SMART WAY.
YOU WANNA APPROACH IT IN A VERY SMART WAY.
BUT I, I THINK JUST SAYING WE WANT TO JUST NOT DO ANYTHING.
MAYBE IF, IF MY RECOMMENDATION IS TO BE A LITTLE BIT MORE OPEN-MINDED AND, AND SAY, LOOK, LET'S TRY TO DO SOMETHING.
SO, BECAUSE IF THAT PROPERTY VALUE CONTINUES TO GO DOWN, EVENTUALLY YOU'RE GONNA GET A LAND USE THERE THAT YOU REALLY, REALLY DON'T WANT.
WHETHER THAT'S WAREHOUSES OR SOMETHING ELSE THAT, THAT WE REALLY, REALLY DON'T WANT.
WELL, WHY CAN'T BE, WHY CAN'T IT BE PRESERVED FIXED? WHO'S PAYING FOR THE PROPERTY VALUE THAT WAS ONCE THERE, THE PROPERTY VALUE AND THE TAX REVENUE.
I KNOW YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE TAX, RIGHT.
BUT YOU ALSO, WITH ALL THE OTHER HOUSING WE GOT COMING IN, LOOK IT, IT, IT IS ALL THE BALANCING ACT.
I'M JUST, WHEN YOU ARE LOOKING AT THIS ONE PROPERTY SPECIFICALLY, OR EVEN LENNAR OR YOU KNOW, QUEST, WHEN WE, WHEN WE HAD THAT DISCUSSION, YOU HAVE TO LOOK AT THE PROPERTY VALUE THAT, THAT IT WAS, AND WHAT IT NEEDS TO BE FOR THIS TOWNSHIP TO KEEP THE BUDGET WHERE IT IS.
I MEAN, WE'RE ALREADY TALKING ABOUT THE DECREASED BUDGET FROM LAST YEAR BECAUSE OF PROPERTY VALUES THAT HAVE BEEN REDUCED.
THERE SEEMS TO BE A GLUT OF PEOPLE REDUCING THEIR PRO THEIR ASSESSED VALUES RECENTLY SO THAT THERE'S A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF, THERE'S A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF LOWER INCOME THAT THE TOWNSHIP IS GETTING.
BUT THE, BUT YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU THROW OUT NUMBERS TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY PRESENTED THE BIG NUMBER OF, OF REVENUE TAX REVENUE.
BUT THE HUGE CHUNK OF THAT IS IN SCHOOL
[00:45:01]
TAXES, YOU KNOW, RIGHT.DOESN'T AFFECT TOWNSHIP REVENUE.
WELL, IF YOU LOOK YEAH, I'M NOT MAKING AN ARGUMENT FOR THEM IT WAS $9 MILLION THAT WAS TOWNSHIP NOT SCHOOL BOARD.
BUT, WELL, I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU SAID 2% OF OUR BUDGET.
I DON'T OUR BUDGET, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NUMBERS WERE.
ALL I'M SAYING IS IS THAT HAVE, BE CAREFUL WHAT YOU FILL OUT THE NUMBERS YEAH.
DIFFERENTIATE BETWEEN TOWNSHIP REVENUE VERSUS SCHOOL TAX REVENUE VERSUS COUNTY REVENUE.
AND, AND WHEN I SPEAK, I'M REALLY ONLY SPEAKING ABOUT US TOWNSHIP TO BE PERFECTLY FRANK.
BECAUSE TO ME, THE SCHOOL DISTRICT'S GONNA DO WHAT THE SCHOOL DISTRICT'S GONNA DO.
I CAN'T CONTROL WHERE THEY'RE SPENDING THEIR MONEY OR WHAT THEY'RE TAXING.
I COULD, I GUESS IF I WENT TO THE BOARD OR GOT ON THE BOARD, DID SOME OF THAT STUFF, BUT THAT AIN'T HAPPENING.
SO, UM, IT IS, I I'M JUST TRYING TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION HAS A FULL SCOPE OF WHAT THE ISSUES ARE.
AND I'M NOT SAYING THAT THAT, THAT WE SHOULD JUST SAY, YEAH, OKAY, DO WHATEVER.
JUST MAKE SURE OUR TAX, MAKE SURE OUR BOTTOM LINE GOES THROUGH THE ROOF.
WE JUST NEED TO APPROACH THIS IN A VERY SMART WAY THAT NOT ONLY PRESERVES GREEN AND PROPERTY, BUT ALSO TAX BASE.
SEE, BUT MY ARGUMENT TO THAT IS THAT THERE, THERE'S, AND, AND BILL JUST SAID IT TODAY, AND IF YOU HAVEN'T DROVE BACK IN THROUGH THERE, DO THAT.
'CAUSE YOU CAN DO IT, JUST PULL IN AND, YOU KNOW, JUST, YOU CAN DRIVE THROUGH IT AIN NOBODY'S GOING TO PULL YOU OVER OR ANYTHING, BUT, BUT THERE'S SO MUCH PROPERTY BACK THERE THAT IS NOT DEVELOPED.
I MEAN, IT IS, IT IS SEMI DEVELOPED PARKING LOTS OR IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, AND, AND, AND AGAIN, THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S A THAT IS AN ABSOLUTELY VALID POINT.
I JUST, I JUST WANT THERE TO BE AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHY THEY ARE ASKING THIS.
I I THINK SOMETIMES WE GET CAUGHT UP IN LIKE, WELL THEY'RE JUST ASKING FOR IT SO THEY CAN MAKE MORE MONEY.
THEY'RE NOT ASKING FOR IT SO THEY CAN MAKE MORE MONEY.
THEY'RE ASKING SO THEY CAN MAKE IT A VIABLE PROPERTY.
RIGHT NOW IT'S NOT TO THEM, IT'S NOT A VIABLE PROPERTY AND MAYBE THIS ISN'T THE RIGHT AVENUE FOR THEM TO GO THROUGH IN THE PLANNING COMMISSION'S MIND.
BUT LET'S, WE NEED TO APPROACH IT AND SAY HOW CAN WE MAKE THIS A VIABLE PROPERTY FOR THE LANDOWNER, BUT ALSO WHAT THE TOWNSHIP WANTS.
WELL, AND MAYBE IT'S NOT, NOT THE $500 MILLION ANYMORE, BUT MAYBE IT IS SOME DENSITY OR THE HOSPITAL OR SOMETHING THAT ALLOWS THEM TO PUT PEOPLE IN THE BUILDINGS THAT ARE EMPTY.
BUT THERE'S SO MANY BUILDINGS THAT ARE ALREADY EMPTY WELL IN THAT AREA.
BUT THAT'S WHAT, THAT'S WHAT THEY, THEY THAT'S, I'M STARTING TO MAKE THEIR ARGUMENT FOR THEM AND I DON'T WANT TO DO THAT.
BUT THEIR INTENTION IS TO BUILD THE HOUSING AND BUILD THE HOSPITAL OR THE GENERAL MEDICAL BUILDING SO THAT THE PEOPLE THAT ARE HERE AND THE PEOPLE THAT WORK HERE CAN SORT OF GO IN BETWEEN AND THAT ALL OF THE PEOPLE THAT ARE OVER HERE AND ALL THE PEOPLE IN THE REST OF THE TOWNSHIP SPUR PEOPLE MOVING BACK INTO THEIR EXISTING BUILDINGS.
I'M NOT SAYING IT IS, I'M NOT, AGAIN, NOT MAKING THEIR ARGUMENT FOR THEM, BUT THAT IS THEIR ARGUMENT.
BUT THAT IS A LITTLE BIT SELFER.
IT'S NOT A LITTLE BIT SELF-SERVING.
WE GOTTA LOOK AND SAY THAT THAT'S NOT SERVING THE CON.
AND, AND, AND THAT'S THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE HERE FOR.
IIII DON'T WANT THIS TO BE THEM WALKING IN WITH ANY PLAN AND YOU JUST GOING NO, NO, DOWN THE STREET, WE'RE GONNA BUILD WHAT, NEXT MONTH, 4 25 OR WHATEVER.
AGAIN, I, I UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT, BUT THE PLANNING COMMISSION ISN'T IN A POSITION TO WHERE WE CAN TO THIS.
YOU CAN SAY NO TO THE ZONING AND WE CAN BE FLEXIBLE AND WE BE COMPROMISING AND WE CAN WORK THINGS OUT THAT ARE BEST FOR THE TOWNSHIP.
THAT'S WHAT I THINK WE NEED TO DO.
THE, THE THE SAYING NO, NO, WE'RE NOT BUILDING ANYTHING ELSE.
NO, WE'RE NOT ALLOWING ANYTHING ELSE IS IT'S SOMEWHAT SELF-DEFEATING BECAUSE THE, I I I THINK WE NEED TO COME UP WITH A COMPROMISE.
I'M NOT SAYING THAT A COMPROMISE MEANS A HUNDRED.
I'M NOT EVEN SAYING MEANS 75 OR 25.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT COMPROMISE IS.
BUT WE NEED TO BE OPEN-MINDED BECAUSE THERE ARE LARGER RAMIFICATIONS OTHER THAN IT'S JUST A LOT OF UNITS.
I KNOW IT SOUNDS LIKE WE'RE, EXCUSE ME, BRO, WE'RE SOUNDS LIKE WE THOUGH WE'RE, WE'RE CONTRADICTING OURSELVES BECAUSE WE'RE ALSO, WE JUST SPENT WHAT, LAST MONTH OR TWO MONTHS AGO, LOOKING AT OPEN SPACES AND SAYING, WE DON'T WANT MORE BUILDING HERE.
WE DON'T WANT MORE BUILDING HERE, BUT I'M SAYING IT'S OKAY TO BUILD HERE.
YEAH, I KNOW IT SEEMS THAT WAY, BUT STILL THE SAME TENSION.
AND WE'RE SAYING WE DON'T WANT ANY BUILDING OVER HERE, BUT OKAY, HE CAN BUILD OVER HERE.
[00:50:01]
THAT'S WHAT WE WROTE IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.I MEAN THAT'S, THAT WAS THE WHOLE POINT OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN WAS TO FOCUS THE DEVELOPMENT THAT IS GOING TO COME INTO THIS TOWNSHIP, TO THE ROUTE 29 CORRIDOR AND THAT AREA THAT ALREADY HAS THE INFRASTRUCTURE AND ALREADY HAS THE TRAFFIC AND ALL THAT OTHER STUFF IN THERE ALREADY.
I DON'T THINK ANY OF US REALIZED THAT PROPERTY WAS IN JEOPARDY.
YOU KNOW, WE LOOKED AT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
WE DIDN'T, WE DIDN'T, YOU KNOW, WE DID SHAME ON US, BUT WE DIDN'T, WE DID, WE DIDN'T, I DON'T REMEMBER SAYING THIS PIECE OF PROPERTY IS IN GENERAL, WE SENT THAT WHOLE CORRIDOR.
WE SAID THAT WHOLE QUADRANT WAS BECAUSE OFFICES DOWN, BECAUSE OF THE OTHER DEVELOPMENT, BECAUSE OFFICE IS VACANT THAT OTHER AVENUES OF PRESERVATION AND DEVELOPMENT NEED TO BE APPROACHED FOR THAT AREA TO MAKE SURE THAT WE CONTINUE THE, THE FINANCIAL TAX BASE.
THAT, THAT, THAT ALREADY AFFORDS US.
THAT'S WHAT, AND I UNDERSTAND YOU DO THIS EVERY DAY THOUGH.
YOU, SO YOU RUN, YOU RIGHT, WE DO THIS ONCE A MONTH AND WE'RE TRYING TO REMEMBER ALL THIS.
SOMETIMES WE DON'T, WE DON'T GET IT THAT TOM, I THINK WE'RE GETTING OFF TRACK AND THIS IS A PUBLIC MEETING, SO WE DON'T NEED TO DO THAT.
AND, AND SOMETIMES I I, I, IT MIGHT FALL ON DEAF EARS A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE I'M TALKING SO MUCH AND I GET THAT I, I I'M NOT HERE TO MAKE AN ARGUMENT FOR OR AGAINST ANYTHING.
I'M JUST, MY ONLY HOPE AND DESIRE THROUGH ALL OF THESE THINGS IS YOU KEEP AN OPEN MIND AND YOU MADE THAT POINT BECAUSE WE HAVE TO, WE CAN'T JUST STOMP THE STOMP ON THE GROUND AND SAY NO, BUT IN MY, AND AND, AND YOU ANSWER TO THAT POINT AGAIN, I'M, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT, MAYBE WE ARE HAVING A DEBATE HERE, BUT I THINK THIS, THIS PLANNING COMMISSION HAS BEEN VERY OPEN TO A LOT OF DEVELOPMENT, YOU KNOW, LIKE WHITAKER ROAD, YOU KNOW, WE RECOMMENDED THAT.
AND A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE AGAINST IT.
AND SO I THINK WE'VE BEEN VERY GOOD AT, YOU KNOW, GIVING THE DEVELOPMENT PEOPLE A LOT OF LEEWAY.
YOU KNOW, I THINK WE'VE DONE THAT, BUT BOY, I, I DRIVE PAST
WELL, I THINK WE'LL SEE THE EXTENT THEY COME FORWARD WITH WHATEVER RECOMMENDATION THEY HAVE, AND WE CAN VOICE OUR OPINIONS AND, BECAUSE SOMETIMES I KNOW WE'RE ON THE BUILDING, WE, WE SHOULD, AND I TRY LIKE HELL TO KEEP AN OPEN MIND.
MAYBE I DON'T PROFESS THAT ALL THE TIME, BUT I DO.
SO, YOU KNOW, WE ALL LIVE HERE.
THAT'S WHY IT'S SET UP THAT WAY.
WELL, AND, BUT IT'S HARD TO SOMETIMES DIFFERENTIATE, RIGHT? WE'RE LOOKING, WE HAVE, SOMETIMES WE HAVE TO LOOK AT WHAT'S GOOD FOR, FOR THE TOWNSHIP OR THE WHOLE, BUT SOMETIMES WE SAY, WELL, RESIDENT, YOU KNOW, AND THAT'S THE BALANCING ACT IS IS LOOKING AT IT ON THE WHOLE RIGHT.
BECAUSE IT, IT IS BEYOND JUST, I DON'T LIKE TRAFFIC.
I THINK THE SCHOOLS ARE CROWDED AND BELIEVE ME, I, LIKE I SAY, WE DID CORONA.
I THINK IT'S A PERFECT EXAMPLE.
YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY'S AGAINST THAT.
BUT WE, WE RECOMMENDED THAT THING BECAUSE YOU KNOW, IT, IT PROBABLY IS A GOOD, A GOOD DEVELOPMENT FOR THIS AT THIS POINT.
BUT SOMETIMES YOU GOTTA JUST SAY NO, GO BACK.
WE GOT A LOT OF INTERESTING THINGS HAPPENING, BUT LET'S GET THIS DAMN CAR WASH BILL, BECAUSE THAT'S IMPORTANT.
YEAH, WE'RE GONNA HAVE GOOD CAR.
IT DOESN'T HAVE ANY PEOPLE LIVING IN IT.
AND THEY WON'T AFFECT OUR SCHOOLS EITHER.
UM, SO ARE WE GOOD, JEFF? EVERYTHING'S EXPLAINED.
WE'RE GOOD FOR, UH, SO OCTOBER 15TH IS, IS DONE.
AND THEN NOVEMBER THAT WILL COME OUT, I'M SURE AT THE NEXT MEETING.
WHAT, WHAT'S ON THE AGENDA OFFICIALLY? YEAH.
SO WITH THAT, ANY OTHER ISSUES, QUESTIONS, FEEDBACK? DO WE HAVE ANY GOOD MAPS OF THAT AREA BLOWN UP ACROSS THE STREET WHERE THE PHARMACEUTICALS ARE? WELL, HALF MY LIFE IS MAKING MAPS.
WHAT DO YOU WANT? I MEAN, SOMETIMES I FEEL LIKE I DON'T, YOU GUYS DON'T KNOW WHAT THE HECK I DO THIS DOWN
NO, IF YOU WANT A SPECIFIC MAP OR SOMETHING SPECIFICALLY BLOWN UP AND LARGER, TELL ME WHAT YOU WANT.
WASN'T THAT IN THAT IT WAS, YES.
THERE WAS A MAP IN THERE THAT WE HAD.
NO, IT WASN'T BIG, IT WAS JUST, IT WASN'T BIG 11.
IT SHOWED, IT SHOWED THE, IT SHOWED THAT AREA, THE AREAS I THINK AT LEAST DOWN TO THE PATH AFTER TRAIL DOWN TO THE UH, RIGHT.
I HAVE AERIALS THAT ARE FROM JULY 11TH.
I MEAN, IF YOU WANT SOMETHING PRINTED, I CAN CERTAINLY GET YOU SOMETHING.
I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
[00:55:01]
AUR BOB'S MADE A MOTION.DO I HAVE A SECOND? I'LL SECOND IT.