[00:00:01]
OKAY.[CALL TO ORDER / MOTION TO APPROVE JUNE 18, 2025 AGENDA]
OKAY.WE'RE GONNA CALL ORDER OUR PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING FOR WEDNESDAY, JUNE 18TH, UH, 2025.
AND, UH, FIRST ORDER OF BUSINESS IS TO, UH, APPROVE THE AGENDA FOR THIS EVENING, WHICH I THINK EVERYBODY HAS IN FRONT OF THEM.
AND I'LL TAKE A MOTION AND A SECOND, I'LL MAKE A MOTION.
BOB'S MADE A MOTION TO APPROVE.
SO AS YOU CAN SEE, WE HAVE A SHORT AGENDA ANYHOW.
UM, NOBODY WILL BE HERE TONIGHT.
WE'RE JUST GONNA TALK ABOUT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND THAT KINDA STUFF.
[PUBLIC COMMENT FOR NON-AGENDA ITEMS]
SO NEXT THING IS A PUBLIC COMMENT FOR NON AGENDA ITEMS. SO DOES ANYBODY, UH, HAVE ANY COMMENT FROM, OH, WE DO.DID WE HAVE A COMMENT? NO, WE DO NOT.
JUST, JUST SPEAK INTO THE MIC, PLEASE.
YEAH, INTRODUCE YOURSELF TOO, PLEASE.
IT COULD BE AN AGENDA ITEM IF YOU CALL IT A FUTURE TOP ITEMS. OKAY.
IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE ANYTHING.
MY FIRST QUESTION, YOU KNOW, I LIVE ACROSS FROM ONE 40 WHITAKER, AND MY UNDERSTANDING WAS THAT THE LEASE FOR OPEN SPACE WAS SOMETHING TO BE DETERMINED BY THE SUPERVISORS.
AND NOW ONE 40 WHITAKER IS ON THE AGENDA FOR YOUR JULY MEETING.
SO MY FIRST QUESTION IS, HAS THAT LEASE LEASE ISSUED BEEN DECIDED BY THE SUPERVISORS? NO, IT HASN'T BEEN DECIDED THAT THEY HAVE SAID THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT, THE PLAN TO GET SOME PUBLIC COMMENT TO COME THROUGH THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND THEN EVENTUALLY TO THEM TO, FOR THEM TO MAKE THEIR DETERMINATION.
THAT BRINGS UP ANOTHER QUESTION.
I HAVE EVERYBODY, ALL MY NEIGHBORS HAVE OPINIONS ON WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN AT ONE 40 GRAM
BUT THEY'RE YOUNG AND THEY'RE BUSY AND THEY DON'T THINK THEY'RE GONNA MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
AND SO THEY'RE NOT COMING TO THESE THINGS.
DO YOU WANT US TO GO TO THEM? NO.
SO THAT KIND OF BRINGS UP A THING.
WOULD A PETITION BE SOMETHING IF THEY SIGN IT AND I BRING IT? SURE.
WOULD THAT BE NOTICED? YEAH, IT'S DONE ALL THE TIME.
I KNOW, BUT THE LAST TIME I SOLD PETITION, IT SORT OF WASN'T DONE THE RIGHT WAY AND THE SUPERVISORS DIDN'T REALLY LOOK AT IT.
WELL, I'M NOT SPEAKING FOR THE SUPERVISOR SPEAKING FOR US.
I MEAN, WE'LL LOOK AT IT AND WE'LL TAKE IT INTO ACCOUNT AND, YOU KNOW, HEAR YOUR ARGUMENT AROUND IT.
UM, AS FAR AS THE SUPERVISORS, I DON'T, I DON'T, I CAN'T SPEAK FOR THEM.
SO IT DOES HAVE A LITTLE BIT MORE CLOUT THEY BE HERE, BUT THAT'S NEXT BEST.
I KNOW YOU, YOU ARE ALSO WELCOME TO HAVE THEM EMAIL ME.
OBVIOUSLY MY EMAIL'S ALL OVER THE PLACE.
YOU'VE EMAILED ME A COUPLE TIMES.
NONE OF THE SUPERVISORS ANSWERED MY EMAIL.
THEY TEND NOT TO, BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO SIT UP HERE AND MAKE DETERMINATIONS.
I CAN'T SPEAK FOR THEM, BUT IN MY OPINION, I THINK IT'S HARD FOR THEM TO REALLY COME OUT AND ANSWER QUESTIONS UNLESS IT'S IN A PUBLIC FORUM.
SO THAT, THAT'S I THINK WHY YOU, YOU MAY GET SOME RESPONSE, BUT YOU MAY NOT ALWAYS GET A RESPONSE.
SO, AND DOES THE PETITION HAVE TO HAVE A CERTAIN FORM? THERE IS, THERE IS A LEGAL FORM.
I KNOW I DON'T DETERMINE STERLING'S OPINION ON THIS.
AND SO THERE IS A LEGAL FORM, A LEGAL FORMAT THAT YOU HAVE TO GO THROUGH WITH A PETITION FOR WHEN YOU'RE RUNNING FOR OFFICE OR CERTAIN OTHER THINGS.
UM, I DON'T THINK THIS BODY HERE IS WORRIED SO MUCH ABOUT HOW FORMAL IT'S, I THINK MR. STARLING'S COMMENTS ABOUT THE LAST PETITION THAT WAS DISCUSSED WAS IT WAS PUT UP ON CHANGE.ORG AND THE PERSON DIDN'T HAVE THE RIGHT TOWNSHIP.
THEY HAD SUPERVISORS FROM MONTGOMERY TOWNSHIP SIGNING IT.
THEY HAD PEOPLE FROM OHIO SIGNING IT.
IT DOESN'T CARRY A LOT OF WEIGHT WHEN IT'S PEOPLE FROM OHIO.
AND AS I, IF I REMEMBER RIGHT, HE WANTED THEM TO HAVE HAND SIGNATURES RATHER THAN TYPED IN THAT.
UM, THAT THAT IS, I, YES, I DON'T THINK YOU'RE WRONG IN STATING THAT, BUT I THINK THAT THAT IS HIS OPINION.
THIS BOARD WILL TAKE IT FOR WHATEVER VALUE THEY DECIDE TO GIVE IT WHEN YOU BRING IT.
I DON'T THINK WE'RE THAT FORMAL.
WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT IT, OF COURSE, BUT JEFF SAID, YOU KNOW, IT'S SIGNED BY PEOPLE THAT LIVE IN, UH, YOU KNOW, SOME OTHER TOWNSHIP OR ANOTHER STATE.
WE'RE NOT GONNA GIVE IT MUCH CREDENCE.
WELL, BUT, BUT WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU KNOW, THAT IT IS,
[00:05:01]
YOU KNOW, THE PEOPLE THAT ARE SIGNING IT AREN'T THE PEOPLE THAT ARE SIGNING IT.AND YOU KNOW, ALL WE CAN TELL IS BY LOOKING AT THEIR SIGNATURE AND MAKE SURE THAT IT LOOKS LEGITIMATE.
BUT I, AS FAR AS THAT FORM OF FORMALITY, I DON'T BELIEVE THERE IS.
I MEAN, I THINK THE ISSUE ABOUT HAVING A SIGNATURE ONLY IT VERIFIES THAT, THAT THIS IS A REAL PERSON THAT IS PARTICIPATING IN THE PETITION RATHER THAN SAYING, WELL, 80 RE 80 NEIGHBORS.
WELL, WE DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT'S REALLY FINE.
AND, AND TO BE PERFECTLY FRANK, WE, WE HAVE RUN INTO SOME ISSUES WITH SOME PETITIONS LIKE THAT.
WE HAD A, A POLICY BACK 10, 12, 15 YEARS AGO FOR TRAFFIC CALMING THAT IF YOU WENT OUT AND GOT YOUR NEIGHBORS TO SIGN THAT YOU WANTED TRAFFIC CALMING, AND THEY ALL AGREED THAT A CERTAIN, WITHIN A CERTAIN AREA WHERE YOU WANT A TRAFFIC CALMING THING.
AND THEY ALL AGREED, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD LOOK INTO IT AND WE WOULD MOVE IT FORWARD.
SOMEBODY BROUGHT US A PETITION WITH THAT.
COUPLE HALF THE NEIGHBORS CAME OUT AND SAID, WHY ARE YOU PUTTING THIS IN HERE? WE DON'T UNDERSTAND.
TURNS OUT THE PERSON THAT HAD BROUGHT THE PETITION TO US HAD FORGED MOST OF THEIR SIGNATURES.
SO THAT'S ALWAYS A LITTLE BIT OF A CONCERN IS THAT THERE'S NO, THERE HAS TO BE A VALID WAY OF UNDERSTANDING IT, GIVEN WHATEVER WAY YOU WANT TO.
BUT THERE IS A VALIDATION TO A FORMAL PETITION PROCESS.
YEAH, WE'RE, WE'RE, WE'RE, WE'RE GOOD.
SO JUST BRING IT, WE'LL LOOK AT IT.
AND AGAIN, IF YOU OR WHOEVER WANTS TO EMAIL ME AND JUST SAY, HERE ARE MY COMMENTS FOR THE PLANNING COMMISSION, I WILL GIVE THEM TO, I WILL ALWAYS MAKE SURE THEY HAVE WHATEVER COMMENTS I HAVE.
YOU KNOW, I DON'T SHARE ALL OF MY EMAILS.
I DON'T THINK I SHARED OUR EMAIL WITH THEM.
'CAUSE IT WASN'T ADDRESSED IN THAT.
BUT IF SOMEONE SENDS ME AS THE PLANNING ZONING DIRECTOR, AN EMAIL SAYS, PLEASE GIVE THIS TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
THEY'LL GIVE IT WHATEVER VALUE THEY DECIDE TO GIVE IT.
I DON'T KNOW WHY PEOPLE HAVE A STRONG OPINION, BUT THEY DON'T DO ANYTHING WITH IT.
DO YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? WELL, THAT'S A SHAME THAT THEY DON'T FEEL THAT THEY HAVE A SAY BECAUSE, UH, YOU KNOW, WE CERTAINLY LISTEN TO EVERYBODY AND WE TRY TO, YOU KNOW, MAKE THE DECISION BASED ON, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY'S OPINION AND, AND THE BEST FOR THE TOWNSHIP, BUT THEY SHOULDN'T FEEL THAT THEY DON'T HAVE A VOICE.
I THINK WE, WE TRY TO MAKE, LET EVERYBODY KNOW THAT'S WHAT I'M RUNNING UP AGAINST.
THEY ALL HAVE AN OPINION, BUT I SAY, WELL EMAIL 'EM AND THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN.
WELL, AND THAT, THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT HAPPENS WITH A LOT OF THINGS.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S UNFORTUNATE.
UM, I'VE BEEN COMING TO LOTS OF MEETINGS AND OPEN SPACE IS A BIG THING AND ONE F 40 WHITAKER, IT'S ALREADY A PART OF THAT IS ALREADY DEEMED OPEN SPACE.
AND WE'RE KIND OF THINKING ABOUT NOT HAVING IT BE OPEN SPACE.
AND I, THAT'S PART OF THE POINT.
IT'S VERY CONTRADICTORY TO ALL THE MEETINGS I'VE BEEN AT SINCE IT'S OPEN SPACE ALREADY.
AND TO ME, OPEN SPACE IS OPEN SPACE, NOT A FANCY PLAYGROUND THAT BRINGS IN A WHOLE LOT OF PEOPLE AND DOESN'T HAVE MUCH OPEN SPACE.
AND I THINK THAT SPACE IS PERFECT FOR BIRD TOWEL
WELL, I WILL SAY THAT THE ISSUE THAT THE SUPERVISORS HAVE BEEN ADDRESSING AND DEALING WITH AND TALKING ABOUT IS HOW TO PRESERVE THAT OPEN SPACE THAT'S THERE WITHIN LEGAL REQUIRE, WITHIN THE LEGAL BOUNDARIES THAT THEY CAN.
AND THAT'S PART OF THE QUESTION THAT THEY'VE BEEN LOOKING AT.
I DON'T OFTEN SPEAK FOR THE BOARD, BUT IN THIS CASE I WILL AND SAY THAT THEY ALL WANT TO PRESERVE THAT OPEN SPACE.
BUT THERE ARE LEGAL, OTHER LEGAL THINGS THAT MAY AFFECT PORTIONS OF THAT SITE.
AND SO WE'RE BALANCING AND WE'RE WORKING THROUGH THAT.
AND MY LAST COMMENT IS, I LOOK AT THE MAP AND THERE'S OPEN SPACE, LOTS OF PLACES, BUT PEOPLE LIKE ME AND MY NEIGHBORS, EVEN THOUGH THEY DON'T SAY IT WOULD LIKE OPEN SPACE WHEN THEY WALK OUT THEIR DOOR OR LOOK OUT THE WINDOW TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AT OPEN SPACE, NOT HAVE TO GET IN THE CAR AND DRIVE FIVE MILES TO SEE IT.
I, I, I WOULDN'T, I WOULDN'T DISAGREE WITH THAT.
IT'S UNFORTUNATELY, AND THE REASON OPEN SPACE IS SO IMPORTANT RIGHT NOW IS THAT IT'S GOING AWAY QUICKLY.
SO WE'RE TRYING TO STOP IT AT THIS POINT.
BUT THE THING THAT ANYBODY IN THIS TOWNSHIP NOW CAN REALLY LOOK OUT THERE AND NOT SEE SOME OTHER BUILDING, IT'S PROBABLY PAST THAT BARN.
THAT DOOR'S BEEN OPEN FOR A LONG TIME AND I DON'T THINK WE'RE GONNA GET IT BACK.
BUT IF IT'S THERE, WELL, AND, AND AGAIN, WE'RE NOT GONNA MAKE THAT DECISION.
THAT'S A SUPERVISOR, THAT'S A ZONING ISSUE.
AND UH, AND THAT'S REALLY THEIR ISSUE.
YOU KNOW, WE'RE JUST APPROVING THE PROPERTY BUILD, YOU KNOW, THE, THE PLANS THEY FALL ON OUR, OUR TOWNSHIP RULES.
UH, YOU KNOW, AND, UH, I AGREE.
I MEAN, YOU KNOW, WE ARE, THE TOWNSHIP'S BIG ON OPEN SPACE RIGHT NOW.
THAT'S WHAT WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT BASICALLY TONIGHT.
AND, UM, AND IT, IT SEEMS, IT SEEMS, UH, YOU KNOW, TO, TO TAKE IT AWAY WHEN IT'S ALREADY THERE DOESN'T SEEM TO BE COUNTERINTUITIVE.
AND THIS IS TOTALLY NOT SOMETHING
[00:10:01]
I SHOULD EVEN COMMENT ON, BUT I WOULDN'T MIND SOMETHING ACROSS THE STREET WHERE THEY WANT TO TEAR DOWN THAT BEAUTIFUL OLD SCHOOL AND PUT UP RESIDENTIAL THINGS.IF THEY JUST HAD CONSIDERATION FOR MAKING IT NOT LOOK LIKE A CITY AND HAVING A LITTLE GREEN SPACE AND NOT ALL LIKE CAT.
AND DO YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? WELL, THAT'S PART OF OUR JOB AND WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT ALL THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT'S PART OF OUR JOB.
WHENEVER THE SUPERVISORS MAKE A DECISION ON, ON, ON THAT, ON THAT QUESTION, THE ZONING QUESTION.
AND WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT ALL THOSE THINGS AND, AND HOPEFULLY, YOU KNOW, WITHIN, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE RESTRICTIONS TOO.
LIKE JEFF SAID, WE CAN DO CERTAIN THINGS, BUT WE CERTAINLY WANT TO MAKE IT LOOK AS NICE AND AS YOU KNOW, AS, AS, AS, AS PLEASING AS POSSIBLE.
BECAUSE HE SAID THE MEADOWS HAS A HIGHER DENSITY THAN WHAT IS PLANNED FOR ONE 40 WHITAKER.
I WOULD NOT MIND LIVING ACROSS THE STREET AND LOOKING AT THE MEADOWS BECAUSE THEY HAVE GREEN SPACE AND, AND THE WAY THEY PLANNED IT, IT LOOKS KIND OF NICER THAN THE PLANS I SAW FOR ONE 40 WHITAKER.
WELL COME BACK WITH KNOW WE DO, DO THAT ONE AGAIN, BECAUSE THAT'S, THAT'S PART OF WHAT WE DO IS, IS TRY TO, UH, IS TRY TO MAKE THAT PLEASING AS POSSIBLE.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S REALLY OUR, OUR JOB WHEN IT GETS TO THAT POINT, AS SOON AS THE SUPERVISORS MAKE A DECISION ON WHAT THE NEXT STEPS ARE AND NOT CUT DOWN WHAT THE GOOD TREES.
WELL, IF, IF THE, IF THE, UM, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY DEPENDING ON HOW THEY RULE, THAT WOULD BE THE, THAT WOULD BE THE, THE CLAIM OR, YOU KNOW, THE DEVELOPER'S DECISION.
WHAT CAN WE DO FOR YOU TONIGHT? I HAVE NO COMMENTS TODAY.
OKAY, SO, UM, WITH THAT WE'LL MOVE
[GENERAL DISCUSSION ITEMS]
TO OUR GENERAL DISCUSSIONS, WHICH IS, UM, UH, OH, THE MINUTES FROM MAY 21.UH, WILL YOU BE DISCUSS YOU, WE JUST NEED TO PROVE RIGHT? YES.
UH, SO HAS ANYBODY LOOKED AT THE MINUTES? I THINK THEY'RE ATTACHED HERE.
UH, AND EVERYBODY, IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, COMMENTS, UH, IF NOT, I'LL TAKE A MOTION.
I'LL MAKE IT, I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, MEETING MINUTES FROM MAY 21ST, 2025.
ALRIGHT, JOE, MAY MOTION, DO WE HAVE A SECOND? YEAH, I'LL SECOND THAT MOTION.
SO WE'LL MOVE ON TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ACTION ITEM, WHICH IS THE OFFICIAL MAP, THE RIGHT OF WAY IN THE, UH, RIDGE PIPE ZONING.
SO, UM, ACTUALLY TONGUE AS A QUICK ASIDE, CAN YOU JUST EXPLAIN, CAN YOU SORT OF GIVE A TWO MINUTE RECAP OF MONDAY NIGHT? I WAS GOING TO DO THAT.
AND SO THANK YOU FOR SAYING THAT.
I WAS GONNA, I WAS GONNA DO THAT.
UM, AND, AND PLEASE JUMP IN BECAUSE I'M NOT SURE I UNDERSTOOD WHAT HAPPENED ON MONDAY NIGHT.
UM, JOE, YOU ALSO, UM, I MADE A PRESENTATION TO THE SUPERVISORS ON MONDAY, SORT OF AN UPDATE TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION, WHAT WE WERE DOING, AND I DIDN'T FOCUS ON EVERYTHING WE'RE DOING.
I MEAN, JEFF HAD A, A PICTURE OF THE, UH, DEVELOPMENT MAP UP THERE, YOU KNOW, THE APPLICANT MAP.
AND, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT'S SELF-EXPLANATORY.
WE JUST SAID WE'RE WAITING FOR THE NEXT STEPS IN SEVERAL DIFFERENT, UH, UH, PROJECTS THAT ARE ONGOING IN THE TOWNSHIP.
UH, REALLY WE FOCUSED ON TWO AREAS.
ONE WAS THE, UM, UH, THE, UH, THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP, UH, OR THE ROAD MAP, UH, THAT WE'VE ALL LOOKED AT.
WE'VE APPROVED IT ALREADY IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, BUT NOW WE'RE KIND OF EVEN LOOKING AT SOME OF THOSE ROADS AGAIN.
AND, UM, AND, AND DOING THOSE, THE, THE SUPERVISORS HAD A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT, A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT THAT.
THEY DIDN'T REALLY UNDERSTAND WHAT ALL THAT MEANT.
AT LEAST THAT WAS MY PRE NOT THAT THEY DIDN'T UNDERSTAND THAT.
THEY JUST HAD A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT HOW THAT WORKS, HOW, HOW THAT, WHAT WE'RE DOING AND WHAT'S THE BENEFIT, WHAT'S, WHAT'S THE REASON WHY WE'RE DOING IT AND WHY IS IT GOOD TO CLASSIFY ROADS AND RECLASSIFY 'EM AND ALL THAT STUFF.
SO, YOU KNOW, BETWEEN JEFF AND I, WE TRIED TO ANSWER THOSE THE BEST WE COULD.
I THINK THEY, THEY UNDERSTOOD, THEY, I THINK THEY'RE FOR IT, RIGHT? NOBODY WAS AGAINST IT.
I JUST DON'T THINK THEY FULLY UNDERSTOOD WHAT THE PURPOSE OF THE, OF THE MAP WAS, THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP IN THE, IN THE, IN THE ROADMAP.
SO, UH, WE EXPLAINED THAT AND, UH, I THINK THEY CAME AWAY WITH THAT, WITH AN UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT WE'RE DOING AND WE'RE SUPPORTIVE OF WHAT WE'RE DOING.
AND, UH, UM, AND, UM, THEY WERE, YOU KNOW, QUESTIONS WERE ANSWERED AND I THINK THEY WERE HAPPY.
THEN WE MOVED ON TO OPEN SPACE WAS THE OTHER BIG THING WE TALKED ABOUT.
AND THIS IS WHERE I GOT CONFUSED, BECAUSE THERE'S A LOT OF DIFFERENT PEOPLE WORKING ON OPEN SPACE, WHICH I GUESS, I DON'T KNOW IF WE KNEW THAT OR NOT, OR IF THIS BOARD KNEW THAT I NOT NECESSARILY DID.
BUT THERE'S A LAND TRUST, UH, THERE'S A COMMITTEE OUT THERE THAT WAS FORMED BY THE SUPERVISORS, UH, TO, UH, LOOK INTO OPEN SPACE IN THE LAND TRUST ISSUE.
AND YES, I'LL EXPLAIN A LITTLE BIT BETTER.
[00:15:01]
TO THREE TO FOUR MONTHS HAVE DECIDED THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO POTENTIALLY PUT A REFERENDUM ON THE BALLOT FOR ATTACKS ON A, AN EARNED INCOME TAX AND, AND AN INCREASE TO THE TAX, TO THE PROPERTY VALUE TAX, UM, TO THE PROPERTY TAX.IT'S SORT OF A TWO-HEADED MONSTER.
THE BOARD HAS DECIDED WHAT THE STRUCTURE OF IT, OR AT LEAST STAFF HAS DECIDED WHAT THE STRUCTURE OF IT IS IN TERMS OF A PERCENTAGE OF EIT AND A PERCENTAGE INCREASE TO THE, TO THE PROPERTY VALUE, UM, OR TO THE, THE, UH, THE PROPERTY TAX.
AS PART OF THAT, THEY'VE ALSO FORMED OR SUGGESTED TO SOME PEOPLE THAT THEY FORM A POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEE.
AND LORI HIGGINS, BILL FELTON FROM THE EAC, WHO WE ALL KNOW KEVIN'S WIFE.
I DIDN'T KNOW IF YOU WERE ACTUALLY HOW THAT RELATIONSHIP, WHAT THAT OFFICIALLY IS.
THE NAMES ARE DIFFERENT, BUT YOU NEVER KNOW.
UM, SO KEVIN'S WIFE FORMED A POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEE CALLED, YES.
I'M NOT SURE IF THAT STANDS FOR SOMETHING OR NOT, BUT IT IS JUST CALLED, YES.
SO THE, THEIR GOAL IS TO GET OUT, PUT YARD SIGNS OUT TO MAKE PEOPLE AWARE OF IT, TO GET PEOPLE TO VOTE.
THE BOARD WAS INTRODUCED TO THE REFERENDUM LANGUAGE ON MONDAY, AND ON NEXT, ON THE NEXT BOARD MEETING IN JULY, THEY WILL VOTE WHETHER OR NOT TO PUT IT ON THE BALLOT.
AND AT THAT POINT IT GOES TO MONTGOMERY COUNTY BOARD OF ELECTIONS.
THEY VET THE LANGUAGE AND THEY, UM, IT WILL BE ON THE BALLOT FOR THE ELECTION IN NOVEMBER.
DO YOU DO THAT WITH ONLY THREE MEMBERS HERE? I I THINK THEY CAN.
I MORE THAN LIKELY, SEE SINCE I'VE FOUND OUT THERE'S ONLY BE THREE MEMBERS, MOST VOTES FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS HAS TO BE A MAJORITY OF THE MEMBERS.
NOT A MAJORITY OF THOSE PRESENT.
I THINK FOR THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
'CAUSE YOUR ADVISORY CAN BE A MAJORITY OF THOSE PRESENT.
IT'S A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT, BUT, SO THEY HAVE TO GET ALL THREE TO DO IT.
BUT THAT'S, IF THEY ALL THREE YOU SAY YES, THEN IT'S OKAY.
SO THEN IT WILL GO ON THE BALLOT.
SO OVER THE NEXT FEW MONTHS YOU WILL SEE MORE SIGNS, MORE DISCUSSION OF IT.
THERE'LL BE IT AT TOWNSHIP EVENTS AND OTHER EVENTS.
UM, SORT OF SECONDARY TO THAT THOUGH IS THE PROCESS FOR COMING UP WITH HOW WE IDENTIFY THE LAND, THE PIECES THE TOWNSHIP WANTS, HOW WE WORK THROUGH THOSE, HOW WE PRIORITIZE THOSE.
IF THE, IF IT GETS ON THE BALLOT AND IF IT PASSES DETENTION WILL TO FORM AN OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE.
THE STRUCTURE OF THAT HASN'T REALLY BEEN DECIDED YET.
IT IS JUST A GROUP THAT WILL ADVISE THE BOARD, LIKE YOU ADVISE THE BOARD OF OPEN SPACE THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO ACQUIRE, OR DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS THAT WE'D LIKE TO REQUIRE.
THEY SORT OF START THE PROCESS SAYING, WE'VE IDENTIFIED THESE PEOPLE.
THE BOARD SORT OF STARTS A NEGOTIATION FOR THEM.
BUT THAT'S ALSO SOMEWHAT OF THE ROLE OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
SO WHETHER OR NOT IT PASSES OR WHETHER OR NOT THERE'S MONEY, ADDITIONAL MONIES OR, OR AN OPEN SPACE FOR REFEREND PUT ASIDE, THIS PLANNING COMMISSION CAN STILL DO THOSE SAME THINGS.
WE CAN STILL GO THROUGH THE PROCESS AND IDENTIFY PARCELS AND, AND ASK THE BOARD TO POTENTIALLY ACQUIRE THESE PIECES OR ACQUIRE THE DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS, WHATEVER IT IS.
THAT'S THE SAME ROLE THAT RIGHT NOW THE PLANNING COMMISSION SERVES FOR THIS TOWNSHIP.
SO I THINK THAT'S WHERE A LITTLE BIT OF THE CONFUSION CAME IN IS THERE'S SORT OF A TWO-HEADED MONSTER GOING AT IT, AND THEY'RE DOING SOME WORK THAT WE'VE ALREADY DONE, BUT IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WILL CONTINUE TO MOVE FORWARD UNTIL THE, AN OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE REPLACES US.
NOW, YOU WILL ALWAYS HAVE THAT ADVISORY ROLE.
YOUR ADVISORY ROLE IS ALWAYS ONE OF THE LAST AND PIECES OF ADVICE GIVEN TO THE BOARD.
SO THE OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE CAN COME TO YOU AND SAY, WE WOULD LIKE YOUR SUPPORT IN THIS, ACQUIRING THESE PIECES.
SO YOUR, YOUR ROLE WILL STILL BE THERE.
IT JUST MAY BE SLIGHTLY CHANGED IF THE OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE AND IF THE REFERENDUM PASSES.
YEAH, I THINK TOM, I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE POINTS THAT TOM MADE TOWARDS THE LATTER PART OF HIS PRESENTATION WAS, YOU KNOW, WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THIS CIRCLE OR WHATEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT, OF, UH, YOU KNOW, WHO, WHO'S, WHO TELLS WHO TO DO WHAT AND WHO'S ADVISING WHO TO DO WHAT.
AND WHAT YOU JUST SAID KIND OF MAKES SENSE TO ME.
ALTHOUGH, WELL, IT DOESN'T, I THINK IT, IT MAKES SENSE, BUT I'M NOT, BUT AT THE SAME TIME I SAY, 'CAUSE I, YOU'RE RIGHT, JOE, I DID SAY THE SUPERVISOR AT THE END THERE WE'RE LOOKING FOR YOUR DIRECTION RIGHT.
ON WHAT YOU WANT US TO GO AFTER.
I MEAN, WE, I TOLD HIM WHAT WE THOUGHT WE WERE GOING TO DO.
WHICH WAS IDENTIFY PROPERTIES, WHO OWNS 'EM.
IS THAT A VIABLE ONE TO GO AFTER? THAT KIND OF STUFF.
AND THEN WHAT IS THE PROCESS FOR DOING THAT? WELL, THE LAST THING BILL SAID WAS, BUT WELL, THAT'S WHAT THE NATIONAL LAND TRUST IS GONNA DO TOO.
SO I'M STILL NOT SURE REAL CLEAR ON WHAT OUR ROLE IS.
WELL, I AGREE, BUT, BUT JEFF JUST SAID THAT THEY'RE GOING TO APPOINT AN OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE FROM, FROM A CONTRACTUAL SOMETHING THAT DOESN'T EXIST TODAY.
AND WE HAVE HAD ONE IN THE PAST.
WE DO NOT HAVE ONE NOW FROM A CONTRACTUAL STANDPOINT,
[00:20:01]
NATURAL LANDS TRUST ROLE IS TO WORK ON THE BALLOT LANGUAGE AND GETTING THE REFERENDUM PASSED.IF THEY HAVE A ROLE PAST THAT, THE SUPERVISORS WILL HAVE TO NEGOTIATE THAT ROLE AND WHATEVER THAT IS, ONCE THAT PASSES.
AND I UNDERSTAND THAT, JEFF, I CERTAINLY UNDERSTAND IT, BUT I, I THINK THAT THE IMPRESSION I GOT WAS THAT THEY SEE A ROLE FOR THEM MOVING FORWARD.
NOW, MAYBE THEY CHANGE THEIR NAME TO THE COMMITTEE.
WELL, THE COMMITTEE HAS TO BE RESIDENTS, SO NATIONAL.
THAT'S WHAT I, MAYBE THEY JUST MOVE THIS, THIS, YOU KNOW, NATIONAL LAND TRUST NAME TO SOMETHING ELSE.
AND THEY, WELL, NATURAL TRUST, NATURAL LAND TRUST IS A, IS AN OUTSIDE CONSULTANT LIKE I AM.
SO WHEN THEY APPOINT THE OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE, THEY'LL LOOK TO A MEMBER OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION, A MEMBER OF THIS BOARD OR THAT BOARD, WHATEVER IT MAY BE, NEW MEMBERS, NEW VOLUNTEERS TO COME OUT AND TO, TO SERVE IN THAT ROLE LIKE WE'VE DONE FOR THE EAC TO SORT OF SET THAT UP.
BUT WHAT I'M, WHAT I'M LEADING UP TO IS THAT I, I DON'T KNOW, THIS IS JUST MY OPINION.
I DON'T WANT TO DO A LOT OF WORK AND THEN FIND OUT THAT THEY'RE GONNA REPORT A COMMITTEE THAT'S GOING TO LOOK AT OUR WORK AND SAY, WELL, WE DON'T AGREE WITH THIS AND CHANGE IT ALL AROUND.
I WOULD LIKE TO WAIT TO SAVE THE BOARD WHEN THEY MAKE THE DECISION TO PUT IT ALL, WHICH I'M SURE THEY'RE GONNA DO.
I WOULD HOPE THEY WOULD GO THEN HAVE THEM TELL US WHAT THEY WANT US TO DO AS OPPOSED TO THIS COMMITTEE AS OPPOSED TO THE TRUST, THE LAND TRUST GROUP, WHATEVER, ALL THE GROUPS ARE INVOLVED.
I WOULDN'T, I DON'T WANNA PUT A LOT OF TIME AND EFFORT INTO SOMETHING THAT IS NOT NECESSARILY GONNA BE THE WHAT DIRECTION THAT THE BOARD WANTS TO GO.
WELL, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT, AND THAT THAT DOES MAKE SENSE.
UM, I, I THINK THAT THE STEPS WE'RE TAKING FOR THE OFFICIAL MAP AND WHAT WE'VE DONE FOR THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ARE STILL YOURS.
AND BY MPC, BY THE MUNICIPALITY'S PLANNING CODE ARE ONLY YOURS.
THEY WOULD NOT BE PART OF WHAT AN OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE DOES.
AN OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE WILL LOOK AT OUR MAP AND SAY, OKAY, LET'S, LET'S TALK TO THOSE PARCELS.
THEN THEY MAY IDENTIFY SOME OTHERS, AND THEY'RE CERTAINLY WITHIN, THAT WOULD BE WITHIN THEIR PURVIEW TO DO.
BUT YOUR ROLE IS STILL AND WILL ALWAYS BE AN ADVISORY BOARD ON THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, ON ZONING, ON OPEN SPACE, ON MAPPING, ON ALL OF THOSE THINGS.
WE DON'T WANT TO DUPLICATE EFFORTS AND MAYBE ONCE WE ADOPT THE OFFICIAL MAP, WE SORT OF START FOCUSING ON OTHER THINGS.
WELL, THAT'S WHERE MY POINT, I THINK THAT'S WHERE I'M AT.
AND I THINK WHAT I THINK WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS, AND HELP ME HERE, IS LOOKING AT THE OFFICIAL MAP, WE CAN IDENTIFY AND APPROVE, THESE ARE ALL THE OPEN SPACES THAT WE HAVE, AND WE CAN APPROVE THAT AS THE PLAN THAT THESE ARE THE OPEN SPACES WE'VE DESIGNATED.
NOW THERE ARE OTHER STEPS THAT WE HAVE TO TAKE TO GO THROUGH WHATEVER WE GO THROUGH.
I'M, I THINK THE NEXT STEP, IT SOUNDS LIKE THE POSITIVE OF THIS COULD BE THAT IF OUR ROLE IS TO, AND, AND WE'VE DONE SOME OF THIS IN, IN STRATEGIZING THE MAP, THIS COMMITTEE THEN TAKES THE NEXT STEP, WHICH MAYBE THE ACTION ITEM IS TO ACTUALLY GO OUT AND START DOING THE NEGOTIATIONS MM-HMM
AND, AND START IMPLEMENTING, OR AT LEAST IDENTIFY PRIORITY TARGETS.
BUT AGAIN, I THOUGHT THAT'S WHAT WE WERE GOING THROUGH.
KNOW THAT'S WHERE, BUT HERE'S THE THING.
OUR, OUR SCOPE IS JUST WIDE FOR PLANNING WITH ALL THE DIFFERENT THINGS THAT WE DO.
THEIRS IS GOING BE JUST ONE THING.
I, I'M THINKING THAT MIGHT BE THE POSITIVE SPIN ON THIS IS, YOU KNOW, THAT THEY'RE THE, THE IMPLEMENTATION ARM OF US, SORT OF, YOU KNOW, I HAVEN'T, THEY HAVEN'T IDENTIFIED THAT ROLE YET.
NO, I KNOW YOU'RE RIGHT TO, TO BE PERFECTLY HONEST, EVERYTHING IS SORT OF IN FLUX, RIGHT? SURE.
I MEAN, BECAUSE THE, BECAUSE THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN WAS ADOPTED IN NOVEMBER BECAUSE THAT THE FOCUS, PART OF THE FOCUS OF THAT PLAN WAS A NEW ATTITUDE TOWARDS OPEN SPACE, A NEW PUSH TO ACTUALLY GO ACTIVELY GO AFTER OPEN SPACE WHERE THIS TOWNSHIP'S NEVER DONE THAT BEFORE.
THEN THE REFERENDUM COMES UP BECAUSE I MEAN, THE, THE SUPERVISORS DO LOOK AT THE BUDGET AND GO, OKAY, WELL IF WE WANNA BUY THIS, WHERE'S THE MONEY COMING FROM? IT, IT IS AN AVENUE FOR THEM TO HAVE AN ADDITIONAL SOURCE OF REVENUE.
AND, AND, YOU KNOW, LET'S SORT OF TAKE THE, GET THIS ADOPTED IF YOU'RE READY TO GET THIS ADOPTED, AND THEN BY THEN, IT'S REALLY GONNA BE LIKE TWO OR THREE MONTHS BEFORE WE KNOW IF THEY HAVE PASSED A REFERENDUM.
AND BY JANUARY 1ST, THEY'LL HAVE AN OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE IF IT PASSES.
AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT, WHAT THAT ROLE IS GONNA BE, BUT WE'LL WORK THROUGH THAT BETWEEN WHEN IT GETS APPROVED.
AND, AND JANUARY 1ST, KEN? UH, WELL, MY FAVORITE PART OF THE MEETING MINUTES FROM THE LAST MEETING WAS WHEN IT SAID KEVIN BUSH ASKED QUESTIONS.
SO I KNOW KEVIN IS BROUGHT TO ASK QUESTIONS.
UM, CAN YOU WRITE THIS DOWN? YEAH.
[00:25:01]
UM, THE OFFICIAL MAP HAD, IT COMES FROM THE, WHAT'S THE NAME OF THE LAW? THE, THE M-P-C-M-P-C.IT'S NOT JUST TO ADVISE THE SUPERVISORS ON WHICH PARCELS TO, AND IT'S ONE OF OUR, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE, THIS BODY'S WAYS THAT WE CAN FURTHER ELABORATE ON WHAT'S IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE RIGHT OF WAY.
MAP IS ANOTHER ONE, ET CETERA.
AND THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT THE SUPERVISORS CAN TAKE INTO ACCOUNT FOR A VARIETY OF USES.
IF THEY GET THIS NEW AUTHORITY THROUGH THE OPEN SPACE REFERENDUM, THEN IT'S ANOTHER AVENUE THAT THEY COULD TAKE BECAUSE THE OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE, YOU KNOW, COULD SEND A RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISOR.
WE COULD SEND A RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISORS AND THEY COULD IGNORE THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS.
IT'S ALL ADVISORY, BUT THIS CARRIES SOME ADDITIONAL WEIGHT BY, UH, BEING CONSISTENT WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND HAVING OUR OWN KIND OF ENABLING LEGISLATION.
I JUST DON'T, I'M NOT SURE I SEE THAT.
I DON'T UNTIL, UNTIL, I MEAN, WE CAN DO THE MAP AND APPROVE THAT.
I MEAN, THAT, THAT WE SHOULD, BUT, YOU KNOW, THE, THE LAND TRUST PEOPLE, WHAT MAP ARE THEY WORKING FOR? BECAUSE THEY HAVE THEIR OWN MAP.
THEY DO, BUT IT'S INFORMATION I PROVIDED TO THEM.
BUT SHOULD THERE JUST BE ONE MAP? THEIR MAP IS, IS THAT MAP IS USED FOR THE POLITICAL SIDE OF IT.
YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THERE'S A POLITICAL SIDE OF IT, AND THEN THERE'S, THERE'S THE ADMINISTRATIVE SIDE OF IT.
THE ADMINISTRATIVE SIDE OF IT IS JUST COMING UP WITH THE FORMULATION OF THE LANGUAGE.
THE MAP THAT THEY PRESENTED AT THE MEETING AND THE MAP THAT THEY HAD AT THE CAR SHOW THIS WEEKEND WAS REALLY THEIR INTERPRETATION OF WHAT CAN BE PRESERVED.
AND I'LL BE PERFECTLY FRANK, I DON'T AGREE WITH EVERYTHING THAT THEY HAVE ON THAT MAP, BUT KATE AND I, WHO WERE AT THAT, WAS AT THAT MEETING, WENT BACK AND FORTH ABOUT IT.
AND THERES CERTAIN THINGS THAT ARE SHOWN ON THERE FOR CERTAIN REASONS.
AND THERE ARE CERTAIN THINGS THAT I DON'T SHOW ON MY MAP FOR OTHER REASONS.
I CAN GO INTO WHY I DON'T SHOW WHAT I SHOW ON MY MAP, LIKE A SECTION BY GLAXOSMITHKLINE, BECAUSE IT'S NOT AN AREA THAT IT, YOU KNOW, NOT BY GL OR NOT BY GLAXO SMITH.
BECAUSE IT'S AN AREA THAT WON'T BE DEVELOPED BECAUSE OF THE RULES AND REGULATIONS THAT ARE IN PLACE.
THERE'S AREAS THAT ARE, THAT ARE STATE OWNED, THAT ARE COUNTY OWNED THAT I WOULDN'T NECESSARILY SHOW ON MY MAP, BUT THEY'VE SHOWN ON THEIRS BECAUSE THEY SAY, WELL, WE JUST WANT TO, SOMETIMES IT'S JUST WE WANT TO SHOW MORE.
AND I'M NOT SAYING IT, IT'S REALLY, IT'S, IT IS A MAP THAT HAS VALUE.
BUT FROM MY STANDPOINT, I HAVE SOME, I HAVE, I'VE HAD SOME QUESTIONS ABOUT IT.
I'M GLAD TO HEAR YOU SAY THAT, JIM, BUT I'M NOT SURE THE SUPERVISORS FELT THAT WAY.
I THINK THEY LOOK AT THAT MAP TOO, AND THEY'RE SAYING, OH LOOK, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, THEY'RE LOOKING AT THAT MAP AT THIS POINT.
NOW MAYBE THEY CAN BE EDUCATED AND SEE THE DIFFERENCES.
BUT AS A MEETING ON MONDAY NIGHT, THEY LOOKED AT THAT MAP AND I THINK THEY WERE, YOU KNOW, THEY, I GOT THE IMPRESSION THEY FELT THAT WAS THE MAP.
AND WHEN THIS MAP COMES IN FRONT OF THEM, THEY'LL UNDERSTAND THAT THIS IS THE MAP.
AND I'M NOT SAYING THAT JUST TO BOOST MY OWN EGO FOR A REASON.
SO WE PROVIDE AN INDEPENDENT OF WHATEVER THE LAND TRUST DOES.
THIS IS OUR TAKE ON WHAT WE THINK IS OPEN SPACE AND, YOU KNOW, RESIDENTIAL.
BUT IT'S, YOU KNOW, AND IF YOU'RE THE PUBLIC OUT THERE, YOU'RE LOOKING, AND THERE'S TWO MAPS OUT THERE.
WELL, THE PUBLIC DOESN'T SEE THE LAND TRUST PAD.
WELL, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY SEE.
THEY, IT WAS, IT WAS ON DISPLAY.
THE PUBLIC DOESN'T SEE WELL, BUT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN IS ON THE WEBSITE.
AND THIS WILL GO ON THE WEBSITE.
NO, THAT WILL NOT GO ON THE WEBSITE BECAUSE, JUST TO REITERATE SOMETHING, I, BUT THEY'RE PUBLICIZING IT, JOE.
I MEAN, THEY'RE HAND OUT BROCHURES WHERE THEY DON IT AND EVERYTHING.
SO THEY'RE, THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT I'M GONNA MAKE AN ASSUMPTION THAT ALTHOUGH WE'RE ALL VOLUNTEERS, YOU KNOW, AS A, YOU KNOW, AN INSTRUMENTALITY OR SOMETHING OF THE, OF THE TOWNSHIP, LIKE, WE ARE NOT GONNA GO PUT LAWN SIGNS.
WE ARE NOT GONNA GO TO BOOTHS.
WE'RE NOT GONNA KNOCK ON DOORS AND SAY, PLEASE VOTE FOR THIS REFERENDUM.
THAT IS WHAT THE POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEE IS DOING.
IS THEY'RE TRYING TO ADVOCATE FOR THE TOWNSHIP TO HAVE THIS ADDITIONAL ABILITY AND AUTHORITY TO PRESERVE MORE OPEN SPACE.
THAT'S A FUNCTION THAT, THAT WE CAN'T FILL.
AND SO, TO SOME EXTENT, THAT MAP THAT THEY'RE USING IS REALLY MORE JUST ABOUT MESSAGING THE POTENTIAL.
BUT AS I UNDERSTAND THAT THE ACTUAL, UM, REFERENDUM, IT WOULD GIVE AUTHORITY TO THE SUPERVISORS.
SO AGAIN, THE SUPERVISORS COULD IGNORE THEIR MAP, THEY COULD IGNORE OUR MAP, WHATEVER.
IT JUST ALLOWS THE SUPERVISORS TO HAVE AN ADDITIONAL RESOURCE TO PURCHASE LAND THAT THEY, AS THE ELECTED OFFICIALS OF THE TOWNSHIP.
[00:30:01]
AND, AND I, I THINK WE'RE SORT OF CONFLATING STEP ONE WITH STEP TWO.STEP TWO IS REALLY THE ACQUISITION IDENTIFICATION OF THOSE PARTIALS THAT WE NEED TO WORRY ABOUT LATER.
RIGHT NOW, WHAT WE NEED TO, FROM MY GUIDANCE OF MY PLANNING COMMISSION, IS TO GET THIS MAP ADOPTED.
IT'S A SNAPSHOT IN TIME THAT SAYS, THIS IS THE LAND WE THINK IS WE SHOULD PRESERVE.
THESE ARE THE ROAD PROJECTS WE THINK SHOULD BE COMPLETED.
THESE ARE THE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE TRAILS THAT WE THINK SHOULD BE PUT IN.
THAT'S ESSENTIALLY WHAT THIS MAP SAYS.
WHETHER OR NOT THEY MOVE FORWARD WITH IT AS A BOARD FUNDING IT THROUGH THE OPEN SPACE REFERENDUM, OR JUST INCREASING THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT THEY PUT IN THE BUDGET FOR IT.
THAT'S UP TO THE BOARD TO DECIDE.
AND, AND THEY WILL MAKE THAT DECISION WHEN THEY MAKE THAT DECISION.
AND THAT'S MY EXACTLY MY POINT.
I WENT TO THAT MEETING ON MY, I TOLD YOU THAT WHEN I WALKED IN HERE, I SAID, MY MEETING AFTER THAT CONVERSATION, AFTER THAT PRESENTATION BY THE TRI, I SAID, MY MEETING NOW IS, MY PRESENTATION HAS NOW CHANGED.
BECAUSE I'M SAYING, YOU KNOW, I, I THOUGHT WE WERE GONNA TELL, WE'RE GONNA HELP YOU IDENTIFY THE PROPERTIES TO WHO OWNS THEM.
YOU KNOW, ALL, ALL THAT WE'RE PUT TOGETHER A PROCEDURE FOR GOING AFTER.
BUT NOW I'M SAYING, NO, WE'RE NOT GONNA DO THAT.
YOU TELL US WHAT YOU WANT US TO DO.
BUT I, I THINK ADMINISTRATIVELY OUR ROLE IN PRESERVING OPEN SPACE CAN STILL BE THAT SOMEWHAT, BUT WE HAVE TO LOOK AT IT FROM THE DEVELOPMENTS WHEN THEY COME IN TO MAKE SURE THAT, LIKE MR. RAKI SAID, YOU KNOW, THAT WHEN YOU PUT A DEVELOPMENT IN, YOU HAVE OPEN SPACE IN THAT DEVELOPMENT.
YOU HAVE GREEN IN THAT DEVELOPMENT THAT WE'RE NOT PAVING THE WHOLE THING.
YOUR POINT WAS, AND, AND AS YOU AGREE, TOM, THAT'S WHAT WE DO HERE.
AND SO, SO WE CAN'T CONTROL WHAT APPLICATIONS COME IN, BUT WE CAN CONTROL WHAT HAPPENS IN THOSE APPLICATIONS AND WE CAN WORK WITH THOSE APPLICATIONS TO MAKE SURE THAT THE OPEN SPACE ISN'T FOUR LITTLE CORNERS OF, OF A HUNDRED SQUARE FEET.
THAT IT IS, THAT IT IS WHATEVER WE CAN DO WITHIN THE ORDINANCE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE PRESERVING WHAT WE CAN.
YOU KNOW, AND AGAIN, TO YOUR POINT, YOU KNOW, CERTAINLY THIS, UH, POLITICAL ACTION GROUP IS GONNA DO THAT, BUT YOU KNOW, A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT I'M, YOU KNOW, IN THIS, THIS TOWNSHIP FOR OVER 30 YEARS AND, UH, YOU KNOW, EIGHT NOW ON THE EIGHT OR NINE ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
AND A LOT OF PEOPLE ASK ME, WHAT DO YOU THINK, TOM? GIMME YOUR OPINION.
AND AT THIS POINT, I'M NOT SURE WHAT THAT IS, RIGHT.
BECAUSE I'M NOT SURE WHAT, WHAT THE WHOLE PROCESS IS.
SO TO SAY THAT JUST THE POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEE, THIS, THIS COMMITTEE, THIS GROUP DOESN'T HAVE A SAY.
I THINK THE PEOPLE ARE, ARE LOOKING AT US.
IF THEY KNOW YOU ARE ON THIS PLANNING COMMISSION, THEY KNOW YOU'RE A MEMBER, THEY'RE GONNA ASK YOU.
AND IT'S NOT JUST THE POLITICAL ACTION GROUP.
IT'S GONNA GIVE THEIR ADVICE OR GIVE THEIR OPINIONS.
IT'S NOT JUST WE'RE GONNA GIVE AN OPINION.
I THINK WE ARE NOT GONNA PUT A SIDE OUT, BUT I THINK WE CERTAINLY GONNA GIVE OPINIONS.
THE POINT I'M TRYING TO MAKE IS THAT, THAT THAT MAP, THE NATIONAL LANDS MAP OFFICIALLY IS NOTHING.
THIS MAP THAT WE WOULD ADAPT IS LITERALLY THE OFFICIAL MAP.
BUT IF YOU'RE, IF YOU COME TO THE CAR SHOW, THEY GO TO SUNDAY AND THEY HAVE A BOOTH THERE, IT SAYS LAND TRUST ON.
AND THEN PEOPLE GO UP AND SAY, WHAT ARE YOU GUYS DOING? AND THEY SAY, HEY, HERE'S WHAT WE'RE DOING.
AND THEY'RE HANDING THEM A MAP.
I WOULD SAY, WHAT MAKES YOU THINK THOSE PEOPLE AREN'T GOING HOME SAYING MAP, LOOK AT THIS MAP.
SO IF YOU, IF THEY'RE ASKING YOU, YOU KNOW, NO, THEY'RE NOT ASKING ME.
WELL, THE TRUST WAS NOT THERE.
WELL, LORI WAS, SHE'S REPRESENTING THE TRUST.
NO, SHE'S REPRESENTING THE TOWNSHIP AND THE POLITICAL ACTION.
WELL, I KNOW, BUT SHE'S REP, SHE WAS HANDING OUT MAPS THAT WERE DEVELOPED BY THE LAY OF TRUST.
BUT AGAIN, AND I CAN'T SPEAK FOR TO WHAT LORI SAID, BUT SHE SHOULD SAY, THESE ARE POTENTIAL PROPERTIES.
AND THAT'S, WE TAKE IT TO SORT OF THE NEXT LEVEL AND SAY, THESE ARE THE PROPERTIES THAT RIGHT NOW ARE A PRIORITY FOR THE TOWNSHIP.
I'M NOT SAYING THAT ONE IS OVER, THAT ONE IS A HIGHER PRIORITY THAN ANOTHER PROPERTY, BUT FOR US, EVERYTHING IN YELLOW ON THIS MAP IN FRONT OF YOU ARE THE PARTIALS THAT WE WANT TO SEE MOVING FORWARD.
WE, WE ARE RECOMMENDING TO THE BOARD THAT THEY TAKE SOME ACTION ON.
AND AT THIS POINT, I THINK THAT WE SHOULD BE DONE.
I THINK WE SHOULD ADOPT A MAP.
HERE'S THE MAP WE THINK IS OUT THERE.
THEN WHATEVER THE SUPERVISOR WILL DO WITH OUR MAP OR THE OTHER MAP OR WHAT OUR OWN MAP, IT'S UP TO THEM.
AND AS, AS MAYBE THE LAST THING, WHATEVER YOU REPRESENT TO YOUR NEIGHBORS OR YOUR FRIENDS OR PEOPLE THAT ASK YOU IS WHAT YOU REPRESENT.
MY ONLY CONCERN IS WHEN YOU REPRESENT YOURSELF AND SAY, THE PLANNING COMMISSION THINKS THIS, AND WE ALL AGREE ON THIS AND YOU THAT YOU CAN'T SAY, WELL, KEVIN SIGN SURE.
AND I DON'T HAVE, YOU CAN PUT UP THE YARD SIGN FOR WHOEVER YOU WANT TO VOTE FOR.
FROM A ZONING OFFICER STANDPOINT, I HAVE SO LITTLE CONTROL OVER SIGNS.
BUT IT IS SIGNS, WHATEVER YOU DO IS FINE, AS LONG AS YOU DON'T REPRESENT YOURSELF AND SAY, THE PLANNING COMMISSION IS GOING TO DO THIS FOR YOU.
NOT GOING, I'M NOT PREDICTING, BUT IF WE MADE A DECISION ON
[00:35:01]
SOMETHING, WELL ABSOLUTELY.WE'VE ALREADY MADE THE DECISION.
AND YOU SAY, WELL, HERE'S WHAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION DID.
BUT IF YOU'RE IN SAYS, WHAT DO YOU THINK OF THIS? AND YOU SAY, WELL, YOU KNOW, MY PLANNING COMMISSION, ALL OF US ARE IN FAVOR OF, I'M NOT SAYING YOU WOULD DO THAT.
I'M JUST SAYING THAT IF, I KNOW PEOPLE HAVE, BUT I MEAN, PEOPLE DO ASK THOSE TYPES OF QUESTIONS.
I BELONG TO A LOT OF GROUPS IN THIS TOWNSHIP? ARE WE, YOU CAN ASK THOSE QUESTIONS.
LIKE WE'RE NOT EVEN, I ASSUME WE DON'T EVEN HAVE THE ABILITY TO ENDORSE A, A, A VALID INITIATIVE AS THE BODY.
I MEAN, I WOULD HAVE TO DEFER TO ZACH ON THAT.
I, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT THING, BUT WHAT WE CAN DO IS WE CAN SAY, HERE IS LAND THAT WE THINK SHOULD BE PRIORITIZED FOR, AND THAT, AND THAT.
AND THAT'S WHAT THIS IS SPECIAL MAP IS.
AND RIGHT NOW, THAT'S OUR RULE TODAY.
AND THAT'S DIFFERENT FROM WHAT I STOOD UP THERE ON MONDAY, BECAUSE I THOUGHT IT WAS GONNA BE TOTALLY DIFFERENT.
'CAUSE I DIDN'T HAVE, I HAD NO CONCEPT.
AND THAT'S THE FIRST TIME THAT, THAT ANYTHING REALLY HAS BEEN, OTHER THAN THE, THE CAR SHOW WAS REALLY, AND IN MY MIND, THAT WAS REALLY THE FIRST TIME ANYTHING WAS ROLLED OUT PUBLICLY FOR THAT REFERENDUM.
IT HAD BEEN TALKED A LOT ABOUT WITH STAFF.
I'VE BEEN IN PROBABLY FIVE OR SIX MEETINGS WITH NATURAL LAND TRUST AND, AND STAFF AND THE ATTORNEYS TO WORK THROUGH THE LANGUAGE AND STUFF LIKE THAT.
AND SO TO BE CONFUSED AT THIS POINT IS PERFECTLY NATURAL.
I MEAN, YOU KNOW, WHEN I SEEN THAT ON, IN, YOU KNOW, AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT LORI WAS TELLING PEOPLE, BUT I KNOW SHE WAS SEEING A, NOT LIRE PAPERS.
BECAUSE AT SOME POINT THE, THE, THE SUPERVISORS HAVE TO SAY, OKAY, HERE'S EVERYBODY'S ROLE OR HERE'S, WE'RE ALL GONNA STEP BACK AND THIS IS THEIR ROLE.
AND THEN WE'LL ALL DECIDE SOMEBODY HAS TO MAKE THOSE CALLS AT SOME POINT.
AND I THINK ONCE THEY GET THE, THE, IF THEY PUT THE BALLOT INITIATIVE ON THERE, IT WILL BECOME MORE CLEAR.
AND, AND SO, AND IF IT PASSES, IT WILL DEFINITELY BECOME MORE CLEAR BECAUSE STATUTORILY WE HAVE TO COME UP WITH A BODY.
AND WE HAVE TO SET A PROCESS IN PLACE.
SO LET'S JUST, LET'S LOOK AT HIS MAP AND, YOU KNOW, MAKE WHATEVER, UH, DECISIONS WE NEED TO MAKE FROM THIS.
IS THAT OPEN SPACE DEFINED BETWEEN, UH, WILDERNESS AND UR, JUST LOOKING AT THAT PATCH OF LAND? IT'S OUT AT THE ENTRANCE TO VODA.
THE, THAT, SO, WELL THE TOWNSHIP HAS SPECIFIC POLICIES ABOUT HOW OFTEN IT MOWS CERTAIN AREAS.
CERTAIN AREAS GET MOWED ONCE A YEAR, TWICE A YEAR.
THE AREA BY WHERE WE LIVE GETS MOWED MORE OFTEN.
IT JUST, IT JUST, THEY DEFINE THAT.
AND THAT'S PUBLIC WORKS AND PARKS AND RECREATION.
UM, I DON'T THINK THERE'S REALLY BEEN, WE DON'T REALLY HAVE A TEST CASE AT THIS POINT TO SAY WHAT THE SUPERVISORS WANT TO PRESERVE AND NOT WANT TO PRESERVE.
YOU KNOW, WE'VE HAD SOME PARCELS COME UP AND WE'VE STARTED TO LOOK AT THEM AND THEN, YOU KNOW, WE HEAR THE BOARD'S NOT INTERESTED IN THAT ONE, OR THEY ARE INTERESTED IN THIS, THEY AREN'T INTERESTED IN THAT.
SO THERE HASN'T REALLY BEEN ANYTHING THAT'S GOTTEN TO THE POINT TO WHERE THEY'RE SO COMMITTED THAT THEY CAN MAKE A STATEMENT SAYING, THIS IS THE KIND OF PROPERTY WE WANT.
BUT ONCE THE REFERENDUM COMES IN, THAT'S DIRECTION THAT WE'RE GOING TO EXPECT THEY GIVE TO THE OPEN SPACE COMMITTEE, TO THIS BOARD, TO WHOEVER, WHATEVER BOARD IS PART OF IT.
THE INTERESTING ABOUT THE LAY TRUST THAT THEY DID IT, THEY HAVE A LOT MORE INFORMATION THAN WE HAVE.
I MEAN, THEY HAD, YOU KNOW, THEY HAD MILL TRADES AND, AND WELL THEY'RE FOCUSING ON THAT.
SO, SO YOU KNOW, RIGHT NOW THE SUPERVISOR'S LOOKING AT IT, I, I'D BE LOOKING AT THOSE PEOPLE TOO.
'CAUSE THEY HAD A LOT MORE OF THE DETAILED INFORMATION THAT WE DON'T HAVE.
AND, UH, SO YOU KNOW WHAT THEIR TRIP, THE LAND TRUST PEOPLE SAID IS, IF YOU PASS THIS AT THEIR SUGGESTIONS AT THIS RATE, UM, IS GOING GENERATED ABOUT A MILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS A YEAR NOW, A MILLION AND A HALF DOLLARS ISN'T GONNA BUY MUCH PROPERTY
UM, SO IT'S GONNA BE FIVE YEARS OR MORE BEFORE YOU BUILD UP ENOUGH, UH, REVENUE TO REALLY GO AFTER SOME OF THE, AT LEAST THE LARGER PIECES.
UM, SO, SO IT WAS, IT WAS, IT WAS, IT WAS INTERESTING TO HEAR THEIR, THEIR THEIR TAKE AND WHERE THEY THINGS GOING.
BUT I THINK AT THIS POINT, LET'S JUST LOOK AT THE MAP, MAKE A DECISION AND LET'S MOVE ON AND WE'LL JUST WAIT AND SEE WHAT THE NEXT STEPS ARE.
AND AGAIN, HOPEFULLY THEY WILL GIVE US SOME DIRECTION AT SOME POINT.
I THINK IT, IT IS, EVERYTHING'S KIND OF UP IN THE AIR RIGHT NOW.
AND LIKE I SAY, I, YEAH, I AGREE.
I THINK THEY, I WAS, I, YEAH, I WAS SURPRISED BY ALL THE WHOLE THING.
IT WASN'T A BAD THING, IT JUST WAS A, YOU KNOW, JUST WAS A DIFFERENT DIRECTION.
SO WHAT DO WE NEED TO DO HERE, JEFF? UM, IF YOU ARE READY TO MOVE THE OFFICIAL MAP AND THE RIGHT OF WAY, MAP ON IF YOU WANT TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION AND WE SEND TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND THEY ADOPTED.
WELL, BEFORE WE DO THAT, DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY CHANGES? IF THERE'S OTHER CHANGES, YOU CAN MAKE A RECOMMENDATION WITH THOSE CHANGES OR WE CAN COME BACK IN A MONTH WITH THOSE CHANGES MADE.
[00:40:01]
THAT'S WHAT WE WERE SUPPOSED TO DO.WE SAID WE LET'S EVERYBODY LOOK AT THIS THING AND SEE IF THERE'S ANY, I DID ADD A LOT OF THE, THE OPEN SPACE ALONG THE RIVER THAT, THAT I THINK WE COMMENTED ON.
THAT WAS A GOOD DAY AND A HALF OF MY LIFE FIXING THAT ON THE STREET ISSUE.
CAN I ASK, KEVIN HAS A QUESTION.
UH, I WAS RAISED BY JOURNALIST, IT'S NOT MY FAULT.
UM, WAS THE POTENTIAL ROAD PROJECTS ALWAYS PART OF THE MAP OR IS THAT YES.
AND THAT WAS IDENTIFIED BY BOEING, THEIR POTENTIAL, I MEAN, THERE'S NOT NECESSARILY ANY FUNDING, BUT AS PART OF KIND OF THIS KIND OF TIES INTO THE RIGHT OF WAY MM-HMM
UM, AND THIS BAG, YOU KNOW, KIND OF SOMEWHAT BLEND TOGETHER.
UM, SO JEFF, JEFF, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, HESS FARM, THAT WAS A DONATION.
UH, DO YOU MEAN THE TAYLOR FARM? I SHOULD, NO, I'M TALKING ABOUT THE HESS PROPERTY OFF, OFF OF OFF MILLER HESS.
THAT WAS A DONATION BY THE HESS FAMILY.
AND THAT WAS, AS LONG AS SOME MEMBERS STILL ALIVE, THEY RETAIN IT, BUT WHEN THEY PASSED, IT GOES TO THE NO, THE BUILDER HAS PRESERVED IS OUR PROPERTY.
IT HAS BEEN PROBABLY SOMEBODY'S LIVING THERE, RIGHT? NO, I DON'T THINK THERE'S A, THERE'S NO
I THOUGHT SOMEBODY'S STILL LIVING THERE.
NOW THAT ONE IS, UM, IT IS THE JOYCE PROPERTY.
YOU MIGHT BE CONFUSING THAT, BUT THAT'S ON, UM, LEWIS ROAD AS YOU HEAD TOWARDS IT, BORDERS THE, THE PROPERTY.
HE HAS A LIFE LEASE SO HE CAN LIVE THERE UNTIL, OKAY.
WHATEVER THAT CHOICE, MAYBE HE DOESN'T NECESSARILY MAKE HIMSELF, BUT WHATEVER THAT HE CAN LIVE THERE FOR AS LONG AS HE NEEDS TO.
AND THEN ONCE HE CHOOSES NOT TO LIVE THERE, IT'D BE, IF WE TAKE IT OVER, WE ALREADY DO MAINTENANCE ON IT.
WE ALREADY DO THE WELL, I DO THAT.
WE ALREADY DO A LOT OF THE WORK ON IT.
I WAS JUST CONFUSED BECAUSE I KNOW THEY, THEY, BUT THEY MUST BUT UP, RIGHT? YEAH, THEY DO.
WELL, AGAIN, I THINK A LOT OF US, IF IT MAY, SUPERVISOR WON'T WHEN IT GETS TO THIS REFERENDUM, BUT, YOU KNOW, I DON'T, I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD.
SOME PEOPLE LAUGH WHEN I MENTIONED THIS THE OTHER NIGHT, CHUCK OR SMIRKED AT LEAST.
UM, I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD TOTALLY ROLL OUT THAT OPPORTUNITY THAT, YOU KNOW, WE COULD APPROACH SOMEBODY ABOUT DONATING THIS LAND IF THEY HAVE REAL LOVE FOR THE LAND, IF THEY WANNA SEE IT CONTINUE.
AND OF COURSE THERE'S, I GUESS THERE'S TAX BENEFITS FOR THAT PERSON TO DO THAT TOO.
SO I DON'T THINK, UH, I DON'T THINK JUST THE INITIATIVE IS THE ONLY REASON WE SHOULD NOT, OR DO NOT, OR DO, UH, APPROVE THESE PROPERTY TO PRIORITIZE.
UH, AND AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT PROCESS IS TO APPROACH SOMEBODY AND ASK THEM FOR, UH, DONATIONS OR TO THINK ABOUT IT AS A DONATION.
BUT, UM, UH, THERE'S OBVIOUSLY PROOF IN THIS TOWNSHIP THAT THAT DOES HAPPEN.
SO, WELL, WE'RE KIND OF FOCUSING ON PURCHASED THE HESS PROPERTY WAS, UM, THAT WAS A DONATION.
THE, THE HESS PRESERVE WAS A DONATION.
THE TAYLOR FARM WAS A, A TRADE FOR HIGHER DENSITY AT PROVIDENCE CORNER.
SO UP IN THAT AREA, IT IS A LOT OF DIFFERENT PROCESSES TO GET THAT PROPERTY UP THERE.
BUT AGAIN, I THINK THAT'S WHAT THE BOARD HAS ADDRESSED TO ME, SAID WE WANT TO USE ALL OF THOSE OPPORTUNITIES.
SAME THING WITH THE, WITH THE TRANSFER OF DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS ORDINANCE USE THAT WE HAVE COMING UP HERE IN THE NEXT COUPLE WEEKS FOR TAKING SOME PROPERTY RIGHTS FROM DOWN ALONG THE SKU AND PUTTING 'EM UP ON MENNONITE ROAD AND MAKING THAT DENSITY A LITTLE MORE DENSE.
I MEAN, THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS OUT THERE THAT WE, WE, WE WANT TO USE.
IT JUST SEEMS LIKE RIGHT NOW WE'RE FOCUSING ON THE LAND TRUST THING AND, AND THE INITIATIVE.
BUT I DON'T WANT TO LOSE SIGHT THAT WE SHOULD, THIS BOARD SHOULD NOT CONSIDER A PIECE OF PROPERTY BECAUSE IT MIGHT BE WE DON'T HAVE THE MONEY RIGHT NOW OR WHATEVER THE, THE THING IS, WE SHOULD LOOK AT OTHER ALTERNATIVES.
WELL, AND AS I SAID ON MONDAY NIGHT, YOU KNOW, I DO SIT IN ON ME, YOU KNOW, I WILL HAVE DEVELOPERS COME IN, POTENTIAL DEVELOPERS, POTENTIAL LAND OR LANDOWNER WITH POTENTIAL DEVELOPERS THAT WILL COME IN AND SAY, LOOK, WE'RE THINKING OF DEVELOPING THIS PROPERTY AND THIS MAP WHEN IT'S IN PLACE, WILL GIVE ME THE AUTHORITY TO SAY, HEY, LOOK, YOU KNOW, THE TOWNSHIP IS LOOKING BUYING, WOULD LOVE TO BUY THIS PROPERTY, OR WOULD LOVE TO PRESERVE THIS PROPERTY.
CAN WE ENGAGE IN DISCUSSIONS WITH THAT WITH YOU ON THAT? AND THEN MOVE THAT FORWARD.
AND IT BECOMES A BOARD QUESTION AT THAT POINT.
AND YOU KNOW, RIGHT THERE PROCESS INVOLVED.
BUT THIS GIVES ME A LITTLE BIT, ESPECIALLY, I MEAN, THERE'S A FEW PIECES IN HERE THAT I KNOW THAT PEOPLE HAVE COME AND ASKED ME ABOUT THAT, THAT I'M JUST LIKE, WE REALLY WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THIS AS OPEN SPACE.
I'M SURE MR. SIRKI WOULD LOVE THAT.
AND, AND ANOTHER ONE WHERE, LIKE ANOTHER AUTHORITY THAT THIS MAP COULD INFLUENCE RIGHT? WOULD BE IF SOMEBODY CAME IN AND THEY WANTED A, A ZONING VARIANCE ON A PARCEL THAT WE HAD IDENTIFIED AS A PRIORITY FOR OPEN SPACE, IT WOULD GIVE
[00:45:01]
THE ZONING BOARD MORE GROUND TO STAND ON TO DENY THAT VARIANCE, RIGHT? YES.SO THERE A, TO YOUR POINT, THERE'S A WHOLE BUNCH OF DIFFERENT YEAH, WE, I DON'T WANNA LOSE SIGHT OF THOSE OTHER YEAH.
IT'S ALL MY POINT WAS, AND I'M I'M SAYING THIS BOARD IS, I JUST HOPE THE SUPERVISOR AND I KNOW THEM.
SO DID ANYBODY WANT TO ADD OR SUBTRACT OR, UH, MAKE ANY CHANGES OR WHAT, UH, UH, OPTIONS OR ANYTHING TO THIS PANEL? I REVIEWED IT.
I THINK JEFF MADE THE CHANGES IN ADDITIONS AND WE TALKED ABOUT THAT MEETING AND AS WE DISCUSSED EARLIER, I MEAN, I THINK, UM, THIS IS STEP ONE, RIGHT? AND YOU KNOW, WE ALWAYS CAN GO BACK AND MODIFY IT.
SO, UM, AT SOME POINT IN TIME, WE NEED TO, WE NEED TO MAKE THE STATEMENT AND GET THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO, TO SIGN ON.
AND THAT THEN BECOMES THE OFFICIAL MAP THAT EVERYBODY, JEFF, THE DEVELOPERS CAN WORK FROM.
AND AS WE MOVE FORWARD, UH, I MEAN, I THINK THIS IS A VERY IMPORTANT STEP TO, UH, TO, TO, FOR US TO TAKE, TO GET THIS APPROVED.
SO SOMEBODY WANT TO MAKE A PROPOSAL TO, UH, ADOPT THIS, THIS, UH, DOCUMENT.
UH, WHICH IS, IS IT NUMBERED OR ANYTHING, JEFF? OR IS IT NO, NO.
IT'S, UM, EVEN THE MOTION WOULD BE TO RECOMMEND THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS IS THEY ADOPT THE OFFICIAL MAP.
AND IF YOU WANT TO ADD IT IN THERE, THE, THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP AS SHOWN TONIGHT.
DO YOU WANT TO MAKE IT TWO SEPARATES OR DO YOU WANT TO WAIT AND DO IT TOGETHER? I, I THINK YOU COULD DO LET THIS ONE OFF THE TABLE.
SO WE WANNA MAKE A MOTION THAT THE, UH, THAT THIS MAP, THE OPEN SPACE MAP, IF WE WANT, CALL IT THAT JUST OFFICIAL MAP, MAKE IT THE OFFICIAL MAP FOR, FOR UH, UH, THE TOWNSHIP AND THE SUPERVISORS TO, UH, APPROVE.
DOES ANYBODY WANNA MAKE THAT MOTION? I, I'LL MAKE THE MOTION.
UH, I I'D LIKE TO, UH, MOTION THAT, UH, THE CURRENT DRAFT OFFICIAL TOWNSHIP MAP, THE, UH, UM, I'M USE THE RIGHT WORDS HERE.
RECOMMENDED, UH, FOR APPROVAL.
CAN WE, CAN WE, JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT, SO THERE'S NO AMBIGUITY, CAN WE JUST SAY THE MAP DATE OF JUNE 18TH, 2025? THAT WOULD BE FINE'S.
AND THEN THAT THEN WE'RE ALL SAYING WE ALL KNOW WHAT MAP WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
SO WE'LL ADD THAT, JERRY, IS THAT OKAY IF I ADD THAT TO YOU? ABSOLUTELY.
THANK YOU TO, THAT'S A GREAT CLARIFICATION.
AND THEN, SO I'LL TAKE A SECOND TO THAT.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS? COMMENTS OR, OR, OR OR OPINION? SO WE'RE GONNA, UH, TAKE A VOTE.
ALL IN FAVOR OF APPROVING THE JAN.
MAP IS OUR OFFICIAL OPEN SOURCE.
JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT NOBODY'S BLENDING.
OH, I DIDN'T KNOW, I DIDN'T KNOW IF YOU WERE GONNA SAY NAMES.
I DIDN'T KNOW IF WE WERE ASKING HEAVY BECAUSE YOU WANTED, HOW DO YOU THINK THERE'S ANY NAMES? YOU'RE RIGHT.
ALRIGHT, SO NOW WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP.
I THINK THAT'S THE ONE THAT, UH, BOWMAN MADE.
THAT IS THE ONE THAT BOWMAN MADE.
UM, I HAVE NOT CHANGED ANYTHING FROM THEIR MAP THAT, UM, FEBRUARY, 2025 IS, IS THEIR MAP.
UM, THEY DID CLEAN THE GRAPHICS UP A LITTLE BIT AS WE TALKED ABOUT AS JERRY POINTED TODAY.
SO, UM, I DON'T, I DON'T HAVE ANTHONY'S LIST OF EXACTLY WHAT CHANGED ON THIS.
I JUST KNOW THAT WE TALKED ABOUT IT.
WE'RE PRETTY COMFORTABLE WITH IT BEFORE WE MADE THE CHANGE OF TRAFFIC ENGINEER AND OUR TRAFFIC ENGINEERS LOOKED FROM GILMORE HAS LOOKED AT THIS AND THEN THEY'RE COMFORTABLE WITH IT AS WELL.
NOW, UH, TO JOE'S POINT EARLIER, IF WHEN, AND LET'S HOPE THE, SOME MIRACLE, BUT LET'S SAY THAT, UH, PARKHOUSE STARTS, THEIR DEVELOPMENT IS FINISHED TWO YEARS FROM NOW, 5, 3, 10 YEARS, WHATEVER IT IS, WE CAN REVIEW THIS AGAIN AND LOOK AT SOME OF THOSE ROADS IN THAT AREA AND MAKE ABSOLUTELY MAKE, BECAUSE THAT'S GONNA, I'M SURE GONNA AFFECT THOSE ROADS ONCE YOU GET 600, 700 PEOPLE MOVING AROUND.
I THINK AS WE CAUGHT WITH THE OFFICIAL MAP, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE THE ABILITY AND AUTHORITY TO MODIFY THESE AND RECOMMEND CHANGES TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AT ANY TIME.
AND I THINK THAT BECOMES PART OF OUR OBLIGATION AS, AS, AS WHATEVER DEVELOPMENTS MAY BE PRESENTED IN THE FUTURE.
UM, I MEAN THESE ARE, I'LL SAY LIVING DOCUMENTS, BUT AGAIN, WE NEED TO HAVE A STAKE IN THE GROUND TO, TO START FROM THAT, THAT CAN BE USED.
THAT, THAT JEFF SAID, WHEN HE TALKS TO DEVELOPERS, YOU KNOW, THIS IS A FEEDER ROAD OR ARTERIAL ROAD, YOU KNOW, YOU GOTTA CONFORM TO CERTAIN SIDEWALK RESTRICTIONS, CURBING WHAT, YOU KNOW, IT GIVES HIM LEVERAGE TO DEAL WITH DEVELOPERS AS THEY COME AND PRESENT PROPOSALS TO, UH, UH, TO DO SOMETHING DIFFERENT.
UH, WITH, WITH THE TOWNSHIP PROPERTIES, IF YOU WANT ME TO START MENTALLY ADDING THIS TO LIKE A YEARLY REVIEW, SO IN, WHEN WE HAVE A SLOW TIME OR WHEN I CAN, YOU KNOW,
[00:50:01]
TYPICALLY DECEMBER'S A LITTLE SLOWER, WE MAY NOT HAVE TO MAKE BEGINNING OF JANUARY'S A LITTLE SLOWER.I CAN BRING THESE TWO MAPS BACK OUT, PRINT THEM OUT, AND WE CAN GO THROUGH THEM, HAVE THIS SAME TYPE OF SESSION WHERE WE GO THROUGH AND JUST SAY, LOOK, IS THERE ANYTHING YOU WANT TO CHANGE? IS THERE ANYTHING YOU SEE THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT JUMPS OUT AT YOU? I'LL SORT OF SAY, WELL, MY OPINION IS ON IT.
WE CAN START DOING THAT ON A YEARLY BASIS.
I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT.
I THINK IT'S, IT'S A GOOD EXERCISE FOR US.
I THINK THIS MAP IS CERTAINLY SOMETHING WE SHOULD LOOK AT ON A YEARLY BASIS.
AND, AND, AND THE OFFICIAL MAP, I MEAN, LET'S HOPE THAT, UH, SOME OF THESE OPEN SPACES GET AGREED, ACQUIRED SOMEHOW, RIGHT? AND THE, AND THE MAP CHANGES, RIGHT? SO IS EVERYBODY, UH, I KNOW WE JUST GOT THIS RIGHT AWAY, BUT WE'VE HAD THIS, THIS WAS THE ONE BOWMAN MADE, BUT WE HAD THE OTHER ONE THAT UH, UH, YOU KNOW, UH, WHAT'S HER NAME? NO, IT'S BOWMAN.
NO, WHO WAS THE BOWMAN? WHO WAS, UH, ANTHONY? ANTHONY BOWMAN.
ANTHONY FROM, FROM ANTHONY VALENCIA.
SO HE DID THIS MAP, BUT OUR BRIAN FROM GILMORE, OUR NEW TRAFFIC CONSULTANT HASN'T LOOKED AT IT.
SO, SO, BUT, BUT YOU DON'T KNOW IF HE HASN'T MADE ANY CHANGES AS FAR AS YOU NO.
NO, I, I THINK RIGHT NOW HE'S JUST SORT OF COMFORTABLE WITH HOW IT IS.
AND AS YOU KNOW, WE'RE FOR, HE'S LOOKING AT SOME LONGER TERM THINGS AND THIS WILL BE PART OF THAT.
SO, SO THIS ISN'T ANYTHING NEW.
SO IF ANYBODY HAS ANY ADS OR SUBTRACTS ON THIS, ANY ANY COMMENTS, FEEDBACK? I THINK IT LOOKS GOOD.
YOU HAVE A QUESTION? PLEASE PUT A DOWN.
I ASKED A BUNCH OF THE FIRST TIME AND, OKAY.
SO THEN I'LL TAKE A MOTION ON THIS ONE TOO, TO, UH, TO ADOPT THIS AS OUR OFFICIAL RIGHT OF WAY MAP OF THE TOWNSHIP, UM, TO PRESENT TO THE SUPERVISORS FOR THEIR APPROVAL, UH, AT THIS POINT WITH A YEARLY REVIEW.
UM, UH, CONTINGENT, UH, MOVING FORWARD, I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE ULTIMATE RIGHT OF WAY MAP, DATED FEBRUARY, 2025.
AND, UH, I SECOND, I'LL SECOND THAT MOTION.
SO, ALL IN FAVOR OF MAKING THIS OUR OFFICIAL MAP.
SO NOW YOU, YOU'LL PRESENT THOSE TO, UH, TO, I WILL GET THOSE QUEUE UP FROM THE BOARD.
I DON'T QUITE KNOW WHAT THEIR SCHEDULE'S GOING TO BE YET, BUT WE WILL GET THOSE IN PROCESS.
WE HAVE TO GO THROUGH A FULL HEARING.
SO IT'S, IT'S A LITTLE MORE FORMAL.
WHAT'S THAT? EXPLAIN THAT TO ME.
WHY? WHEN WE ADOPT THE ZONING ORDINANCE OR WHEN WE ADOPT THE, THE, THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, WE HAVE TO GO TO THE MEETING, WE HAVE TO GET THE BOARD TO APPROVE US ADVERTISING FOR A HEARING, THEN MOVE ON TO, UM, WE SEND IT OUT FOR COMMENT TO ALL THE MUNICIPALITIES AROUND US, MONTGOMERY COUNTY, CHESTER COUNTY, THEY GET TO COMMENT ON IT.
I CAN NEVER REMEMBER WHICH TO COMMENT ON IT.
THEN AFTER THAT, WE CAN HAVE A HEARING AT THE BOARD SUPERVISORS.
MOST OF THE TIME THOSE HEARINGS ARE PRETTY ADMINISTRATIVE AND JUST LIKE, THIS IS THE MAP, THIS IS WHY WE DID IT.
DO YOU APPROVE IT? IT'S MORE LIKE A LEGAL THING.
IT'S JUST BECAUSE IT'S, THE MAPS ARE SET IN, IN THE MUNICIPALITY'S PLANNING CODE.
THERE'S A, THERE'S A PROCEDURE FOR ADOPTING THEM.
I THOUGHT, I THOUGHT THEY JUST SAID IT.
SUPERVISOR SAID YES, IT'S THERE.
THERE'S SOME THINGS THAT ARE, THEY'RE A LITTLE BIT MORE FORMAL.
SO, UH, SO THAT FINISHES THAT AND, UM, OFFICER, WE GONNA TALK ABOUT RIDGE PIPE ZONING.
WHAT'S GOING ON UP THERE? SO, RICH PIKE, THE MAIN STREET CORRIDOR IN THERE, I'M NOT REALLY SURE IT'S OUR MAIN STREET, BUT IT IS, SOME OF IT IS CALLED MAIN STREET.
UM, THE SECTION UP FOR PROVIDENCE IS, IS SLIGHTLY MORE THAN A MILE LONG.
UM, ACCORDING TO THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP AS, UM, OUR CURRENTLY ADOPTED RIGHT OF WAY MAP, NOT THE ONE YOU JUST RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL, IT IS AN ARTERIAL WITH A HUNDRED FOOT RIGHT OF WAY, OR NO, I'M SORRY.
IT IS THE, THE MAP THAT YOU ARE NOW RECOMMENDING FOR ADOPTION SHOWS AS AN ARTERIAL WITH A HUNDRED FOOT RIGHT OF WAY.
THAT'S THE CHANGE FROM, IT'S A CHANGE FROM A DESIGNATION AS A COLLECTOR, WHICH ONLY HAS AN 80 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY.
UM, PART OF WHAT OUR OLD OFFICIAL RIGHT OF WAY MAP OUR OLD RIGHT OF WAY MAP SAID WAS THE AREA THAT SOME AREAS WERE 80 FEET, SOME AREAS WERE A HUNDRED FEET RIGHT OF WAY THAT WERE REQUIRED.
SO THE NEW MAP WILL CLARIFY THAT AND CHANGE THAT A LITTLE BIT.
UM, THERE'S, IT SHOULD SAY 12,000 TO 13,000 AVERAGE DAILY TRIPS.
SOMEHOW I LOST THE ONE ON THAT, BUT THAT'S ACCORDING TO PENDOT.
THAT'S THE AVERAGE DAILY TRIPS FOR THE SECTION OF, OF, OF RIDGE PIKE.
12 TO 13,000 CARS EVERY DAY GO THROUGH THERE.
UM, MOST OF THE ROAD IS A ONE LANE WITH A CENTER TURN LANE TO KLEIN ROAD, FOUR LANES UNTIL YOU GET TOLE ROAD.
AND THEN IN FRONT OF THE TARGET BETWEEN THE TARGET AND THE LIDLE, IT'S, IT IS FOUR LANES WITH THE
[00:55:01]
CENTER TURN LANE, THE SPEED LIMIT IS 45.UM, THERE'S THREE TRAFFIC LIGHTS, WHICH I DIDN'T REALLY, I'M SORRY, TWO TRAFFIC LIGHTS, WHICH I DIDN'T REALLY NOTE ON THIS LIST.
BUT THAT'S AT TOWNSHIP LINE ROAD, WHICH IS THE BORDER OF THE TOWNSHIP IN KLEIN.
AND THE, UM, THE ENTRANCE TO THE TARGET SHOPPING CENTER, UM, YOU CAN SEE THAT BY THAT BLUE LINE.
WE HAVE THIS NEAR MAP, UH, MAPPING SOFTWARE THAT NOW WHEN YOU DRAW A LINE, IT'LL SHOW YOU THE TOPOGRAPHY AND IT'S A LITTLE BIT ELONGATED, BUT IT, BUT I THINK IT SHOWS YOU IT'S, IT IS A NEAT REPRESENTATION OF WHERE THE TARGET AND, AND GIANT IS PRETTY FLAT.
BUT AS YOU GET FARTHER EAST ON THE, AS YOU TRAVEL FARTHER EAST, IT REALLY BECOMES MORE OF A ROLLING HILLS AND IT, IT DOES GET FAIRLY STEEP.
I THINK THEIR, UM, THEIR VERTICAL IS SLIGHTLY OFF IN TERMS OF SCALE FROM THERE, BUT I THINK THAT'S TYPICALLY FROM WHAT HAPPENS TO ASK TO HAPPEN WITH THESE THINGS.
UM, THE LAND USES AS WE'LL GET TO IS, IS A MIX OF INDIVIDUAL AND COMMERCIAL AND RESIDENTIAL UNTIL TOWNSHIP LINE ROAD.
THEN YOU REALLY GET OVER IN, YOU GET A LOT MORE COMMERCIAL AS YOU DRIVE INTO LIMERICK.
UM, A LOT OF INDIVIDUAL DRIVEWAYS WILL, I'LL SHOW YOU THE PARCEL MAP HERE IN A FEW, AND YOU CAN REALLY SEE THAT EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THOSE HAS A DRIVEWAY COMING ONTO RIDGE PIKE AND, AND IT JUST CREATES MORE TRAFFIC.
UH, THE CRITICAL INTERSECTIONS I THINK ARE SHOWN ON THERE.
UM, GREENWOOD AVENUE, KLEIN ROAD, AND PENNY PACKER.
UM, THOSE ARE THE THREE UNSIGNED INTERSECTIONS THAT, THAT PROBABLY NEED SOME MORE TRAFFIC CONTROL.
WHETHER IT'S, YEAH, I'M, I, I KNOW JERRY, I KNOW JERRY'S GONNA ADVOCATE FOR GREENWOOD AVENUE IN A HARD WAY, BUT, UM, AND, AND, AND TOM, YOU BROUGHT IT UP AT THE MEETING ON MONDAY, WAS WAS THAT THAT IS, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING THAT IS, THAT IS A CRITICAL PATH FORWARD FOR THE TOWNSHIP FOR TRAFFIC CONTROL IN THIS AREA.
WELL, I, YEAH, I I I WAS BASING THAT ON WHATEVER DEVELOPMENT WE DECIDE.
I MEAN, I YOU TRAVEL EVERY DAY, JERRY.
BUT, UH, I DON'T SEE ANY PROBLEM WITH PENNY PACKER AND, UH, BRIAN AT THIS POINT NOW, AND I'M NOT SAYING, I'M NOT SAYING THAT THEY NECESSARILY NEED SIGNALS.
I MEAN, THAT'S, I'M NOT A TRAFFIC ENGINEER.
I'M JUST SAYING THOSE ARE THE THREE SORT OF CRITICAL INTERSECTIONS IN THERE THAT HAVE NO TRAFFIC CONTROL TO THEM.
THE CLIENT'S GONNA CHANGE WITH THAT NEW DEVELOPMENT TOO, SO.
THEY'RE GONNA HAVE SOME DEVELOPMENT UP THERE.
SO THAT, THAT, THAT MAY CHANGE A LITTLE BIT.
UM, PENNY PACKERS IS, YOU KNOW, THAT'S KIND OF THE RELIEF ROAD.
AND THEN PENN AND MAYBE LYNNFIELD TRAP NEEDS TO BE PUT IN HERE TOO.
PENN PACKER AND LYNNFIELD TRAP, THAT AREA IS, IT'S ON THE DOWNWARD SIDE OF THAT HILL.
THE, THE SIGHT LINES AREN'T GREAT.
UM, YOU KNOW, AND THEN WHEN YOU GET TO GREENWOOD AVENUE THAT'S COMING FROM THE NORTH, TRYING TO CROSS THERE IS, IS JUST A NIGHTMARE.
I AM SURE YOU KNOW THAT RECENTLY A, UM, A LARGE PIECE OF THAT, THAT REALLY PROBABLY THE END OF OUR, OF OUR TOWNSHIP, UM, A LARGE PIECE OF PROPERTY THERE AT THE END, BUT PAST THE NEW LIDS, THEN YOU HAVE THE STRIP MALL AND ALL THAT.
THEN THERE WAS A SERVICE GARAGE THERE FOR YEARS.
AND THEY GONE OUT OF BUSINESS.
SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS, UH, THAT THEY ARE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE SELLING OR GOING ALREADY GONNA BE DONE TO THAT DEVELOPER.
HAVE YOU HEARD OF THAT? WELL, NO.
THEY HAVE AN ACTIVE, THEY, IT IS SPOTLESS CAR WASH HAS PUT IN A ZONING HEARING BOARD APPLICATION FOR THAT PROPERTY.
UM, THEY HAVE, THEY WANNA PUT A CAR WASH INTO THAT SITE THERE THAT DOESN'T REALLY FIT WITH ZONING.
WE'LL GET INTO MORE ZONING LANGUAGE LATER AND I CAN SORT OF TELL YOU WHERE, WHAT'S HAPPENED.
BUT ESSENTIALLY PART OF MY ROLE AT THE TOWNSHIP IS TO BE, AS A ZONING OFFICER, IS PROVIDE ZONING, INTERPRETATION LETTERS.
WHEN SOMEONE, SOMEONE COMES TO ME AND SAYS, I WANT TO BUILD THIS HERE, CAN I DO THAT? I'M THE ONE WHO SAYS YES OR NO.
AND SAY, YES, YOU CAN DO THAT.
AND THIS IS ONE OF THOSE CASES WHERE I HAD TO SAY, NO, YOU CAN'T DO THAT.
THEY WERE LOOKING AT IT AS A PERSONAL SERVICE SHOP.
AND AGAIN, WE'LL GET INTO THE ZONINGS FOR TOWARDS THE END OF THIS, BUT A PERSONAL SERVICE SHOP FOR MY INTERPRETATION OF THE ZONING IS A DOCTOR'S OFFICE, A LAWYER'S OFFICE, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING, A JEWELRY STORE, SOMETHING THAT'S SMALLER SCALE THAT, WHAT ARE YOU CALLING THAT, JEFF? PERSONAL SERVICE.
SO, UM, AS OPPOSED TO THE OTHER BUILDINGS THERE, THE OTHER, WELL JERSEY MICS THAT RIGHT.
LET ME LET, ACTUALLY, LET ME JUST POSTPONE THIS CONVERSATION FOR A COUPLE MINUTES.
LET ME GO THROUGH SOME THINGS AND THEN I PROMISE YOU WE WILL GET TO THAT AND IT'LL MAKE MORE SENSE WHEN WE GET TO THAT.
SO WHAT I'M GONNA SHOW YOU IS I WENT, I BASICALLY FROM A GOOGLE STREETS OR A GOOGLE EARTH VIEW, I SORT OF DROVE DOWN THE CORRIDOR.
JUST MY GOAL FOR TONIGHT IS JUST TO HELP YOU UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHAT'S THERE.
WE MAY THINK WE KNOW IT, AND EVEN I THINK I KNOW IT PRETTY WELL ON THERE, BUT UNTIL YOU LIKE ALMOST STOP AND LOOK EVERY 50 FEET, YOU DON'T QUITE SEE IT.
SO WHAT I'VE DONE IS I HAVE A 10 SLIDES HERE THAT SORT OF WALK US DOWN THE CORRIDOR TO SORT OF SHOW WHAT'S THERE.
[01:00:01]
THAT'S COOL.SO THE MAIN STREET CORRIDOR SHOWING ATTACHED BLIND INTERSECTION, IT IS NC ZONING ON THE PLAN TO THE LEFT, ON THE PICTURE TO THE LEFT.
SO WAWA, WHICH IS ON THE RIGHT, THAT'S WHERE THE, THE NORTHERN THAT THE CORNER UP HERE.
THIS IS THE WAWA THAT'S PART OF COMM COMMUNITY AND REGIONAL SHOPPING CENTER.
THIS IS PART OF NC, WHICH IS GABRIEL CONVENIENCE COMMERCIAL.
UM, NEIGHBORHOOD CONVENIENCE COMMERCIAL.
THAT IS, THAT IS THE ZONING THERE.
UM, THEIR EXISTING LAND USES, THERE ARE, ARE, ESPECIALLY IN THE NC PORTION OF IT, WHICH IS REALLY THE PORTION THAT, THAT I THINK WE SHOULD BE MORE CONCERNED WITH, IS IT IS THEY'RE NON-CONFORMING RESIDENTIAL PERSONAL SERVICES OF THE BANK.
AND AS YOU JUST POINTED OUT, THE FORMER AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR PLACE THAT IS NOW PUTTING IN, NOW STARTING A PROCESS TO BECOME A CAR WASH.
UM, THEN THE NEXT SORT OF STEP DOWN STEP EASTWARD ON THE ROAD IS THE MAIN STREET CORRIDOR, THE EXISTING RETAIL.
THAT'S WHERE YOU'VE GOT THE TARGET AND THE GIANT, WHICH ARE THE BUILDINGS ON THE RIGHT, THE LARGE WHITE ROOFS ON THE, ON THE RIGHT.
THE SMALLER ONES ON THE LEFT THERE OF, OF, OF THE ROAD ARE THE LIDLE.
UM, THERE'S THIS MATTRESS STORE, THE DENTAL STORE, THE BEER AND WINE STORE.
JERSEY MIKE'S, JERSEY MIKE'S, UM, YEAH, I NEVER MISSED JERSEY.
MUST I NEVER MISSED JERSEY MIKE'S.
UM, SO THAT SEEMS EXISTING RETAIL HERE.
BUT WHAT THIS SLIDE ALSO SHOWS IS PROBABLY THE LARGEST AREAS OF OPEN SPACE THAT ARE LEFT ALONG THE CORRIDOR.
YOU HAVE THIS PIECE HERE, WHICH COMES ALL THE WAY BACK, AND TECHNICALLY IT'S IN THIS TREE AREA HERE.
IT'S SORT OF A UPSIDE DOWN NEBRASKA SHORE SHAPED PIECE WITH A PANHANDLE.
THEN YOU HAVE, THEN YOU HAVE A LARGER OPEN SPACE OVER HERE THAT'S BISECTED BY, UM, SOME POWER LINES.
AND WE'LL SEE THE POWER LINES BETTER IN THE NEXT SHOT.
BUT, UM, THIS IS ONE OF THE AREAS THAT I KNOW, I'M SURE WE'VE TALKED, I'M SURE WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THERE WAS A POTENTIAL FOR A HOSPITAL TO COME IN HERE ABOUT SIX TO NINE MONTHS AGO, MAYBE A YEAR AGO, THAT PROPOSAL'S DEAD.
UM, BUT THE BIG QUESTION IS, WHAT, WHAT CAN AND SHOULD HAPPEN HERE RIGHT NOW REALLY FOR THE, THE SIZE OF THESE PROPERTIES? IT'S REALLY, IT'S REALLY RETAIL.
I MEAN, YOU, YOU'RE LOOKING AT LARGER, BIG, LARGE, LARGE, LARGER STORE DEVELOPMENT WOULD GO HERE.
UM, WE DID HAVE THE PUSH FOR WHEN YOU GET TO THE, THE NEXT PIECE HERE WHERE, WHERE WE SHOWED NUMBER THREE.
SOME OF YOU WERE STILL ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION THEN FOR THE, THAT WAS THE PULTE DEVELOPMENT THAT CAME IN FOR A WHILE.
AND I'M SURE JOE WAS HERE AT THOSE MEETINGS.
SO ONE WHERE LABELED NUMBER ONE, THAT'S 18 ACRES.
AND NUMBER THREE IS ABOUT NINE ACRES BISECTED BY THOSE, THOSE THE POWER LINES YOU CAN'T DEVELOP UNDERNEATH THEM.
YOU COULD RUN A ROAD UNDERNEATH THEM, YOU COULD, YOU KNOW, DO SOME THINGS UNDERNEATH THEM, BUT, UM, YOU CAN'T REALLY BUILD ANYTHING IN THERE.
SO THOSE ARE GONNA BE SOMEWHAT DISCONNECTED FROM EACH OTHER.
BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THIS WHOLE QUARTER, WHICH WE'LL SORT OF GET TO AT THE END, THIS IS REALLY THE, THE BIGGEST AREA OF DEVELOPMENT POTENTIAL OF, YOU HAVE A QUARTER THAT HAS 13,000 TRIPS TO IT EVERY DAY.
13,000 CARS GOING BY IT EVERY DAY.
MAYBE THAT'S NOT A HUGE NUMBER, BUT PEOPLE WILL STILL LOOK AT IT FOR A RETAIL OR SOME OTHER DESIGNATION THAT, THAT, THAT CAN GO IN THAT AREA.
UM, BACK ON AND NUMBER ONE, THE, THE FORMER SERVICE STATION.
SO THE, THE PERSON WHO WANTS TO PUT THIS CAR WASH OR WHATEVER THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT, THEY, THEY ARE NOT THE SAME PEOPLE THAT OWN THE SHOPPING CENTER THERE NEXT TO 'EM.
AND THEN, UH, THERE NUMBER ONE IS WHERE THEY WANT THE NO, NO DOWN.
NO, IT, IT'S, I THOUGHT IT WAS DOWN ALL THE OTHER SIDE OF, OF, UH, YEAH, IT, IT IS THIS PIECE RIGHT HERE ON THE NORTH SIDE.
UM, AND THEN THE SECOND QUESTION I HAVE JEFF, IN NUMBER ONE ALSO THE HOUSE THAT'S THERE, THAT HOUSE THAT SITS ON RIDGE, UM, WHAT'S THE, WHAT'S THE STACK? WHAT IS THAT? WHO OWNS IT? WHAT DO WE OWN IT OR WHAT IS THE, THESE HOUSES HERE BEHIND ONE HOUSE? IT'S ALL BY ITSELF SITTING THERE.
THE FORMER PSYCHIC PSYCHE CLAIMS PLACE.
WELL, I'M SORRY, I DIDN'T, I DIDN'T KNOW IF YOU REMEMBERED THAT BECAUSE IT NO, I DO, I DO REMEMBER THAT.
YEAH, THE PSYCHE HOUSE THAT'S OWNED AT A PRIVATE INDIVIDUAL.
UM, I, FOR A WHILE WE DID HAVE, UM, AUTOZONE.
I THINK THE AUTOZONE CAME IN AND THEN WHEN THE HOSPITAL WAS REALLY PUSHING FOR THIS, I THINK THEY SORT OF OUTBID AUTOZONE AND THEY, THE, WHOEVER THE HOSPITAL WAS STARTED HAD AN AGREEMENT WITH 'EM.
I DON'T KNOW THE STATUS OF ANY OF THAT.
[01:05:01]
THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY HAS TO BE SOLD TO SOMEBODY IF THEY WANT TO DEVELOP THIS IN THAT AREA.AND THAT PIECE IS, IS LESS THAN HALF AN ACRE, SO THERE'S NOT A LOT YOU CAN DO WITH IT.
UM, BUT FROM A PLANNING STANDPOINT, WHEN THEY WERE LOOKING AT DEVELOPING THAT, WE WEREN'T SURE THE BANK WAS VERY, VERY, OR THE, THE HOSPITAL WAS VERY EARLY AND WE WEREN'T EVEN SURE IT WAS A HOSPITAL.
WE WERE PLANNING TO MAKE SURE THAT IF THAT DEVELOPED AS A RETAIL SITE, LIKE AN AUTO ZONE, THAT IT WOULD WORK WITH THE PARCELS BEHIND IT.
SO THERE'S A PIECE OF RIGHT OF WAY THAT RUNS ALONG.
IT'S THE GREEN STRIP THAT'S RIGHT BY THE YELLOW ROOF, UH, IF YOU CAN SEE THAT VERY WELL.
BUT GO IN A LITTLE BIT, SEE, SEE THE YELLOWISH ROOF GREEN STRIP AND THAT, THAT GREEN STRIP THAT'S ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF THE ROAD ISLE ROAD.
SO KLEIN ROAD THAT IS RIGHT AWAY OWNED BY THE TOWNSHIP.
THE IDEA WAS AT SOME POINT, ACCORDING TO OUR LAST OFFICIAL MAP, WAS TO EXTEND, AND I'M GONNA DRAW ON MY THINGS HERE, UM, TO EXTEND A, THAT'S NOT TO EXTEND A ROAD.
IS THIS NOT WORKING BASICALLY TO A HIGHLIGHTER? YEAH, BECAUSE IT'S REALLY, REALLY, LET ME TRY THAT PEN.
BASICALLY, LET ME JUST DESCRIBE IT.
BEHIND THE SHOPPING CENTER FOR LID AND THROUGH AND ADJACENT TO THE BANK.
THERE'S TOWNSHIP RIGHT OF WAY THROUGH THERE.
SO THAT WE WOULD CREATE A RELIEF ROAD FOR, FOR RIDGE PIKE, SOMETHING THAT IF IT WAS TO DEVELOP AS SHOPPING RETAIL ALL ALONG THERE, THAT YOU WOULDN'T HAVE TO LEAVE A SITE THAT WAS THE NUMBER THREE, GO OUT ON A RIDGE PIKE, COME BACK INTO TO NUMBER TWO, GO OUT FOR NUMBER TWO, AND THEN COME BACK INTO NUMBER ONE SO THAT THERE WAS SOME ROAD THAT WOULD GO ALL THE WAY THROUGH THAT.
AND THEN THERE WOULD BE A LIGHT AT CLIMB ROAD.
AND THEN THREE, THE PORT, THE PORTION YOU CAN'T SEE IS UP THERE, UP AT THE VERY UPPER EDGE OF THE SLIDE IS AKKA ROAD, THAT THERE WOULD BE ANOTHER ROAD THAT WOULD COME OUT THERE.
AND THAT'S PART OF THE REASON THAT I STILL HAVE IT IN MY HEAD, THAT THOSE ARE CRITICAL INTERSECTIONS.
THAT THAT WOULD BE PART OF THE RELIEF ROAD THROUGH THERE.
AND DEPENDING ON HOW WE GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS AND UM, HOW, WHAT DEVELOPMENT WE THINK WE WANT TO ENCOURAGE THROUGH HERE, IF WE WANT TO ENCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT AT ALL, THAT ROAD MAY STILL BE A PRIORITY FOR THE TOWNSHIP, OR AT LEAST SOMETHING THE TOWNSHIP WANTS TO PUT IN.
WHAT ABOUT THAT OTHER HOUSE UP THERE? SECTION THREE? IT'S ON, UH, GOING OUT WITH THE ABANDONED HOUSE.
WHO OWNS THAT? IT'S PART OF THAT PROPERTY.
THE LAST I HEARD IT WAS, IT WAS A, A FAMILY TRUST AND THEY ALL LIVED IN FLORIDA.
UM, AND I HAVE ABOUT, WITH NUMBER ONE AND NUMBER NUMBER ONE I HAVE ABOUT BIANNUAL EVERY YEAR, EVERY OTHER YEAR MEETINGS WITH THAT PROPERTY OWNER, UM, THE GENTLEMAN AND HIS FAMILY ARE, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE TRYING TO FIND OUT AND THEY'RE TRYING TO DEVELOP IT AND THEY'RE ALWAYS CHECKING WITH ME TO MAKE SURE THAT NOTHING'S CHANGED.
YOU KNOW, WHAT THE TOWNSHIP WANTS, THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO WHAT ABOUT THE HOUSE THAT WAS JUST REMODELED? THEY MADE A FLOOR OUT OF IT.
WHAT? THAT THAT I MEAN THAT ZONE CORRECTLY? YEAH, THAT'S ZONE CORRECTLY.
SO THAT'S GONNA STAY, RIGHT? THAT HAS TO BE IN THE PLAN.
AND THE SAME WITH THE, UH, WITH WIND SERVICE STATION THERE.
THAT'S AND YOU KEEP STILL THUNDER.
HAD WE TRAVEL EAST, YOU CAN SEE THE NEXT SECTION, THE TOP PORTION.
JUST REALLY QUICK, I KNOW I DIDN'T MEAN TO SEE YOUR THUNDER, JUST TO NOT GLOSS OVER NC.
COULD YOU BRIEFLY DESCRIBE WHAT THOSE THREE PARCELS ARE ZONED FOR BEYOND JUST THE, I MEAN, I WENT AND READ IT, BUT YOU KNOW, I, I'M GONNA, YOU'RE GONNA GET THERE AND I'M GONNA GET THERE.
I'M JUST TRYING TO DESCRIBE WHAT'S THERE NOW, AND THEN WE WILL, HOPEFULLY IT MAKES SENSE AT THE END.
UM, SO YOU CAN SEE HERE, THIS IS THE TOP PORTION OF THIS PULTE PIECE.
WE'LL CALL IT THE PULTE PIECE, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM IN HERE.
SO THAT'S SORT OF THE END OF, OF THE OPEN AREAS OF YOUR LEFT.
AND THEN AS YOU TRAVEL ALONG THE QUARTER, YOU REALLY GET A LOT OF INDIVIDUAL PROPERTIES, RIGHT? UM, INDIVIDUAL HOUSES, INDIVIDUAL USES.
UM, STARTING WITH, YOU HAVE YOUR, YOUR THE GARAGE, YOU WERE JUST ASKING, AS YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT TOM.
YOU'VE GOT, UH, THE PAW DOG, DAYCARE, DAYCARE, AND THAT'S A PRETTY BIG PIECE.
AND THEY'VE GOT SOME PROPERTY IN THE BACK.
UM, IT'S A BIG, IT'S KIND OF A MIXTURE OF PERMITTED AND NONCONFORMING USES.
UM, YOU KNOW, THERE'S EVERY CONSTRUCTION TYPE IN THERE.
THERE'S SOME BRAND NEW CONSTRUCTION, THERE'S SOME REUSE.
YOU CAN SEE THAT WITH THE, WITH THE, THE PUPPY PAWS.
UM, THE BIGGEST QUESTION I HAVE FOR SOME OF THESE IS THE LONG-TERM VIABILITY OF, OF SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENTIAL OR MULTI-FAMILY RESIDENTIAL IN THERE, IN EXISTING HOUSE, IN EXISTING BUILDINGS.
[01:10:01]
THAT THE, THE, THE SMALL RETAIL CENTER THAT WE HAVE IT, I BLEW UP THE SIGN BECAUSE I THOUGHT THE SIGN WAS INTERESTING.AND THIS IS PROBABLY TWO YEARS OLD.
I KNOW THERE'S SOME NEWER USES IN THERE.
THIS BUILDING, WHEN IT WAS BUILT, AND THIS IS, WELL, I MEAN THIS IS 2000 10, 11, 12, SOMEWHERE IN THERE.
IT TOOK A GOOD FOUR OR FIVE YEARS TO EVEN GET A SINGLE TENANT.
AND ONLY IN THE PAST FOUR OR FIVE YEARS HAS MR. MOSCARELLA WHO BUILT THIS REALLY FILLED IT OUT.
UM, AND IT, AGAIN, IT'S A WIDE VARIETY OF USES.
I KNOW THAT ONE OF THESE USES CAME OUT AND THE BUILDING INSPECTOR WAS SAYING THAT THERE'S A A DAY SPOT GOING IN.
SO WE USED SOME RESIDENCE IN THERE TOO, RIGHT? NO, NO APARTMENTS ABOVE.
THOSE ARE MORE OFFICE BUSINESSES.
I THINK THAT'S WHERE THE DAY SPA IS GOING.
THE FIRST FLOOR IS, IS THERE'S A PIZZA PLACE, WHICH I'VE NEVER EATEN THERE, BUT I'VE HEARD IT'S REALLY, REALLY GOOD.
THAT'S, THAT, THAT'S PROBABLY MY HAIR FROM FAVORITE FRIDAY NIGHT PLACE.
SO YEAH, I, I'VE HEARD NOTHING BUT GOOD THINGS ABOUT IT.
AND THEN SORT OF AT THE OTHER END AT, AT JERRY'S FAVORITE INTERSECTION AT, AT, AT, AT GREENWOOD, YOU SEE THAT WE'VE GOT THE, THE DAYCARE ON ONE SIDE, THE CHURCH ON THE OTHER SIDE.
UM, LY THE CHURCH IS STILL ACTIVE AS FAR AS I KNOW.
THERE WAS SOMETHING, UM, YOU KNOW, PARKING AROUND THE BACK CHAIR.
AND THEN THE, PROBABLY THE, THE LAST PART ABOUT IT, YOU KNOW, WELL THIS IS THE RESIDENTIAL AND THIS IS SORT OF WHAT I MEAN ABOUT THE LONG TERM VIABILITY OF, OF RESIDENTIAL.
IT REALLY IS RIGHT UP ON THE ROAD.
HOUSING INSIDE IS A LITTLE ROUGH ON THE OUTSIDE, BUT I GET THAT BECAUSE YOU'RE RIGHT UP ON RIDGE PIKE.
IT'S NOT LIKE YOU COULD BE OUT THERE MOWING YOUR YARD.
UM, YOU CAN SEE THE, THE, THE BIGGEST HOUSE IN THE PICTURE.
THAT ONE'S BEEN OBVIOUSLY INTERNALLY SUBDIVIDED, WHETHER OR NOT, WHETHER OR NOT THAT'S A CONFORMING USE.
IT'S NOT A NON IT, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S A ILLEGAL NONCONFORMITY OR NOT.
I HAVEN'T REALLY LOOKED AT IT.
I JUST KNOW THAT YOU CAN TELL THERE'S, SO ALL THESE, ALL THESE HOUSES ARE INDIVIDUAL LOTS AND OWNED BY INDIVIDUALS.
THEY'RE NOT CONNECTED WITH THE BIGGER PIECES AT ALL.
UM, HERE YOU CAN SEE AGAIN, MIXED AND TRANSITIONAL USES THE UPPER RIGHT PICTURE.
IT'S HARD TO SEE 'CAUSE THERE'S A LOT OF TREES.
UM, THAT'S JUST SORT OF FINISHING UP.
I KNOW THE BUILDING INSPECTOR'S BEEN DEALING WITH THAT A LOT.
YOU'VE GOT THE, THE ALL SPORTS DOME, WHICH I KNOW I ONLY DRIVE BY PRETTY MUCH DURING THE DAY, BUT FOR A KID THAT'S INVOLVED IN SPORTS, LIKE MY KID, YOU WOULD THINK I'D BE THERE MORE.
BUT IT, IT DOESN'T SEEM WELL USED TO ME, BUT I AGREE, YOU NEVER SEE ANYBODY IN PARKING LOT.
SO IT, IT IS A LITTLE DIFFERENT.
AND THEN YOU HAVE WHAT'S ON THE PICTURE IS DIRKS.
I KNOW THAT THERE'S A, UM, I THINK A, A FLOORING COMPANY IS NOW TAKING IT OVER AND WE'VE HAD SOME DISCUSSIONS WITH THEM, BUT YOU HAVE SOME TRANSITIONAL PROPERTIES, TRANSITIONAL USES IN THE, IN THE BUILDING.
THE OTHER BUILDING, THE SQUARE BUILDING, THAT'S MORE, UM, I THINK IT IS SOME, SOME APARTMENTS IN THERE.
AGAIN, THESE ARE ALL SORT OF EXISTING NONCONFORMITIES AND WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE LEGAL, THAT'S ALWAYS THE QUESTION I HAVE.
BUT I DON'T THE BOARDS EVER SAY TO GO OUT AND GET ME.
I CAN'T GO OUT AND GET RID OF THE
SO, UM, NOW THE, UH, THE, UH, DOME BUILDING, THE BIG, UH YEP.
IS THERE ANY PROPERTY BEHIND THAT THAT'S LEFT? THERE IS, THERE'S NO PROPERTY THEY CAN DEVELOP AS PART OF WHEN THAT WAS, WENT THROUGH THE PROCESS.
UM, THE BOARD AT THE TIME PUT A CONSERVATION EASEMENT ON THE BACK PARTS PORTION OF THE PROPERTY.
SO THERE'S TECHNICALLY A SOCCER FIELD BACK THERE.
BUT FROM WHAT I HEAR FROM PEOPLE WHO LOOK TO RENT SOCCER FIELDS, IT'S TOO MARSHY.
SO I DON'T THINK IT EVER REALLY GETS USED.
BUT THAT WAS HIS, THE DEVELOPER'S ANSWER TO HAVING NO DEVELOPMENT BACK THERE WAS TO PUT THAT BACK THERE.
UM, AND THEN FINALLY, YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE IS A DECENT AMOUNT OF AT RISK PROPERTIES.
THERE'S THE HOUSE YOU TALKED ABOUT THAT'S PRETTY MUCH DIRECTLY ACROSS FROM PEN PACK OR THAT'S THE UPPER LEFT HAND HOUSE.
THERE'S ONE OF THE THREE OR FOUR HOUSES I SHOWED YOU IN THAT OTHER RESIDENTIAL RIGHT UP ON THE ROAD IS THE ONE IN THE MIDDLE.
I, I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS OCCUPIED OR NOT.
I'M, I'M GOING TO HAZARD A PROFESSIONAL GUESS AND SAY PROBABLY NOT.
UM, BUT IT, UH, YOU KNOW, SO THOSE I, I KIND OF WORRY ABOUT.
THERE'S THE OTHER PIECE THAT IT'S A LITTLE HARD TO SEE IN THIS PICTURE, BUT IT IS, IT IS GOT A BOARDED WINDOW.
THE ULTIMATE ROAD RIGHT AWAY WOULD PROBABLY WIPE OUT SOME OF THE PORCHES AND EVERYTHING ELSE.
UM, YOU CAN SEE HERE, I MEAN, THERE WAS A FIRE HERE YEARS AGO.
I DON'T EVEN KNOW, I DON'T KNOW WHEN, BUT IT'S STILL BOARDED UP.
IT'S A FAIRLY SIGNIFICANT, YOU KNOW, PIECE OF
[01:15:01]
PROPERTY.I ALWAYS THOUGHT THAT WAS ABANDONED, BUT I, I, I THINK IT PROBABLY IS OR IT IS WITH THOSE BORDERED WINDOWS, EVERYTHING.
SO, UM, BUT YOU KNOW, THE QUARTER'S NOT WITHOUT CHARACTER.
I MEAN, YOU'VE GOT THE CHURCH, WHICH I THINK IS A GREAT OLD BUILDING.
YOU'VE GOT THIS, WHICH, THAT LOOKS OLD.
I, I THINK FROM LOOKING AT STREET VIEW AS BEST I COULD, I COULDN'T GET A GOOD PICTURE OF IT TO PUT UP HERE.
YOU THINK IT'S MULTI, THAT'S WHY YOU WENT TO ARCHITECTURE SCHOOL.
UM, YOU THINK IT'S MULTIFAMILY? I THINK IT'S MULTIFAMILY.
AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW IF, BUT THIS ONE, WHEN THERE'S MORE THAN ONE POWER METER ON THERE, TYPICALLY THAT MEANS THAT THERE'S YEAH.
YOU KNOW, WIRES GOING IN, THAT'S FOR SURE.
AND THAT STONE WALL IS KIND OF FAMOUS TOO, ISN'T IT? I I, I THINK SO.
I, I THINK IT'S WASN'T THAT PART OF A SUBDIVISION AND THERE WAS NOT MOVING THAT WALL? SO THERE WAS A SUBDIVISION THAT CAME IN YEARS AGO, AND WE'LL GET TO THE PARCEL MAP THAT, THAT TRIED TO PUT FOUR OR FIVE PROPERTIES ON THE BACK OF IT.
AND WE WENT, I THINK THE PLANNING COMMISSION, THE BOARD WENT ROUND AND ROUND ABOUT YOU NEED TO WIDEN THE ROAD OR YOU AT LEAST NEED TO DEDICATE IT.
BUT WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT HOW FAR THE WALL IS.
AND THEN I, I DON'T KNOW IF THEY JUST, I THINK THEY WALKED AWAY.
I THINK, I THINK THEY STILL, I THEY DID LIVE THERE AT THE TIME.
BUT I DON'T KNOW IF THEY STILL DO LIKE, BUT LIKE GEORGE WASHINGTON SLEPT ON THAT WALL OR SOMETHING.
I MEAN THAT, THAT'S DEFINITELY OLDER THAN MY HOUSE AND THAT TREE.
SO, AND THEN THIS HOUSE I LOVE, I MEANT TO DRIVE BY THERE THIS AFTERNOON TO SEE IF IT'S STILL THAT SAME COLOR.
I, I KNOW THAT, I KNOW SHE'S PAINTED IT THREE OR FOUR DIFFERENT COLORS.
UM, SO I MEAN THERE, THERE'S DEFINITELY SOME CHARACTER TO THIS AREA THAT, YOU KNOW, WE WANT TO PRESERVE THROUGH THIS PROCESS AND UNDERSTAND DURING THIS PROCESS.
UM, SO NOW, NOW GREENWOOD IS THE TOWNSHIP END? NO, IT DOES GO FARTHER THAN THAT.
IT GOES NOT TO THE, YEAH, THE ALL SUPPORT, THIS SHOWS THE PARCELS A LITTLE BIT BETTER.
AND IT'S, IT'S THE YELLOW LINES IN THERE.
SO THE YELLOW IS RICH IS IS THE ROAD.
UM, YOU CAN SEE ALL OF THIS IS THE LIDELL SHOPPING CENTER IN HERE.
YOU CAN SEE ALL OF THE LITTLE PARCELS IN THERE.
THERE'S LARGER PARCELS IN HERE.
UM, YOU CAN SEE THIS WOULD'VE BEEN THE HOSPITAL, BUT IT DOES GO ALL THE WAY BACK TO, UM, THE ROAD THAT I'M DRAWING A BLANK ON, OFF OF TOWNSHIP.
UM, SO, BUT YOU CAN SEE THIS IS A FAIRLY SIGNIFICANT PIECE OF PROPERTY.
I MEAN, IT IS THREE TIMES THE SIZE OF THE LID SHOPPING CENTER.
JUST TO GIVE YOU A MENTAL CONTEXT FOR IT.
UM, THERE'S ALSO THESE PIECES HERE, WHICH I THINK WE SORT, WE SORT OF SKIPPED OVER, BUT WE DIDN'T, YOU KNOW, THAT, THAT THE KEY HOPE PROPERTY, AND I'M SURE YOU REMEMBER THE KEY HOPE ZONING PROPOSAL THAT RIGHT.
THERE WAS AN INDUSTRIAL OR AN INDUSTRIAL FLEX SPACE THAT WAS SUGGESTED FOR THIS.
THERE'S THE, THE, THE WOOTENS NURSERY, WHICH I THINK IS PROBABLY HAS A GREAT BUSINESS.
THEY ALWAYS LOOK LIKE THERE'S PEOPLE IN THERE.
BUT FROM A PLANNING STANDPOINT, I HAVE TO LOOK AT IT FROM, IS THAT A LONG TERM USE OF THAT PROPERTY? IT'S NOT NECESSARILY, I MEAN, IT'D BE GREAT IF SOMEONE COMES IN, BUT MOST OF THE TIME THOSE USES DON'T MAKE IT PAST THE NEXT GENERATION.
SO, SO YOU ALWAYS HAVE TO BE WORRIED ABOUT THAT.
UM, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, ALONG RIDGE PIKE YOU CAN SEE ALL THE DIFFERENT SIZE SMALLER PARCELS DOTTED INTO HERE.
THAT'S A PRETTY BIG PARCEL THERE.
I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT WAS THIS ONE.
YEAH, THIS IS THE PARCEL HERE THAT THEY LOOKED TO SUBDIVIDE.
DID THEY, THEY LOOKED TO BRING A ROAD, I THINK, IF I REMEMBER RIGHT, THEY WANTED TO BRING A ROAD OFF OF, UH, THIS IS LINFIELD TRAP.
THEY WANTED TO BRING A ROAD IF OF OFF OF LINFIELD TRAP AND HAVE I THINK THREE OR FOUR LOTS IN THE BACK, IF I REMEMBER RIGHT.
BOB, DO YOU REMEMBER THAT? UM, NOT REALLY.
I DO REMEMBER THE DRIVING, UH, MOVIE THEATER, WHICH I THINK IS WHERE STAPLES IS TODAY.
YES, IT WAS A DRIVING, IT WAS A PRETTY GOOD SLICE PLOT OF LAND AT ONE TIME.
I MEAN IT'S, IT IS THIS HERE, I MEAN, IT IS, IT'S FAIRLY SIGNIFICANT.
THAT WAS ALL DEVELOPED AS ONE PIECE.
UM, IT'S REALLY QUITE ORGANIZED THAT CORNER.
WELL, AND I DON'T THINK THAT THAT THE PLAN FOR THESE PIECES IN TERMS OF A RETAIL CONNECTION AND EXPANDING THE RETAIL WAS NECESSARILY A BAD PLANNING THOUGHT AT THE TIME.
IT'S JUST THAT TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT ISN'T HAPPENING ANYMORE.
WHERE, I MEAN, YES, WE HAVE QUEST COMING, THE QUEST FOR DEVELOPMENT HERE ON THE CORNER, BUT THOSE ARE FEW AND FAR BETWEEN.
THEY JUST DON'T, THAT'S JUST NOT WHAT DEVELOPERS ARE ASKING FOR NOW.
SO YOU CAN SEE OVER HERE ON THE LEFT, THIS IS THE, THIS IS THE, UH, THE ALL SPORTS BUILDING.
THAT'S THE EDGE OF THE TOWNSHIP IN, IN THAT AREA.
GREENWOOD AVENUE IS, IS RIGHT ABOUT HERE.
[01:20:01]
UM, SO YOU'VE GOT SOME VACANT PARCELS IN THERE, SOME SMALLER PARCELS.UM, THE NEXT, THIS SLIDE I REALLY WANT WAS REALLY MORE GEARED TO SHOW YOU, YOU KNOW, IN LIMERICK GOING TO THE WEST, THAT IT IS, YOU'RE SEEING SOME REDEVELOPMENT OF EXISTING PARCELS.
YOU'RE SEEING NEWER RETAIL, BUT THERE IS A LOT OF UNDEVELOPED LARGER PARCELS OF LAND.
I KNOW, I KNOW LIMERICK IS ALSO GOING THROUGH THIS EXERCISE.
I DIDN'T HAVE A CHANCE TO REACH OUT TO BERETTA, MY COMPATRIOT OVER THERE TO SORT OF SEE WHERE THEY ARE WITH IT.
BUT THAT'S SORT OF WHAT I'M HOPING TO DO WITH THE NEXT STEP IS TO SORT OF MESH IT TOGETHER SO WE CAN LOOK AND HOPEFULLY SORT OF WORK WITH EACH OTHER.
THAT'S WHAT ABOUT ON THE, AFTER YOU PASS, UH, THE, UH, ALL SPORTS, THAT'S TRAP.
THAT'S THE BLUE AREA THERE, THERE.
IT'S A, IT IS PRETTY MUCH OF A MIXED USE.
UM, I MEAN A LOT OF IT IS THE, THE SMALLER, UM, THE, THE THE SMALLER SINGLE REDEVELOPED RETAIL SPOT.
UM, WHETHER THAT'S A SALON, I THINK THERE'S A SALON IN THERE.
I THINK THERE'S A, UM, A KIDS' CLOTHING STORE OR CONSIGNMENT SHOPS, THINGS LIKE THAT.
UM, BUT YOU DO HAVE SOME NEWER DEVELOPMENT, UM, RESIDENTIAL.
OH, WELL THEY'VE BUILT THAT MUSIC STORE TOO, OR SOME MUSIC.
YEAH, THERE, THERE'S A STORE IN FRONT.
UM, THAT'S, THAT'S SOME OF THE NEWER DEVELOPMENT THEY'VE HAD IN THERE.
BUT THEN THIS SHOWS, I THINK THAT THE, THE PARCEL'S A LITTLE BIT BETTER.
THERE ISN'T, YOU KNOW, THE SAME.
IT GIVES YOU A LITTLE BETTER CONTEXT OF WHERE IT FITS AND, AND WHAT, SO, SO BACK DOWN TO THE TRA UM, TO THE TARGET, THAT PIECE OF PROPERTY BEHIND WAWA, THAT'S STILL DEVELOPABLE? DEVELOPABLE? NO, THAT GREEN SPACE, THAT'S THEIR STORMWATER CONTROL.
IF YOU DRIVE UP THERE, IT IS A HUGE IT HUGE BEHIND THE WAWA.
AND I MEAN IT, YOU KNOW, SAME THING WITH THE, THE WALL THAT'S NEXT TO STAPLES.
IT'S THING THEY PUT ALL THE STORMWATER INTO ONE SPOT RATHER THAN HAVING ALL OVER THE PLACE.
THEY ALSO, IF YOU LOOK AT STAPLES, WHICH IS THIS BUILDING, YEAH.
THAT'S GOT A DIFFERENT ROOF THAN THESE TWO BECAUSE THIS WAS SUPPOSED TO BE A GREEN ROOF.
THAT GREEN ROOF LASTED ABOUT SIX, EIGHT MINUTES.
BUT WHEN YOU COME, THIS IS KLEIN ROAD, WHEN YOU SORT OF CREST KLEIN ROAD, WHEN THAT FIRST WENT IN, YOU COULD SEE THAT IT WAS GREEN AND IT WAS A LITTLE SCRAGGLY, BUT IT WAS, IT WAS DEFINITELY A GREEN ROOF THAT DIDN'T, I MEAN, I JOKE ABOUT SIX MINUTES, BUT IT PROBABLY WASN'T ANY MORE THAN ONE GIRL.
SO WHAT IS IT NOW? THEY, THEY COVER IT OR NO, MY GUESS IS THAT THEY JUST, IT, WELL IT'S PROBABLY JUST DEAD PLANS IF THERE'S ANY PLANS LEFT.
BUT THEY HAVEN'T MADE IT WHITE OR PAINTED? NO, THEY HAVEN'T PAINTED IT OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
I MEAN THESE AERIALS ARE PROBABLY FROM 2 20, 24.
THAT'S ANYTHING CURRENT, BUT YEAH.
SO, SO WHAT ARE WE GONNA HEAR ABOUT THIS CAR WASH? OKAY, WE'RE GONNA HEAR ABOUT IT RIGHT NOW.
SO WHAT THE ZONING THAT'S ALLOWED NOW IN THE NC, OUR CRSC IS SORT OF ITS OWN ISLAND AND IT'S ONLY THAT ONE SHOPPING CENTER.
SO WE'RE NOT GONNA TOUCH THAT FOR RIGHT NOW.
BUT PARCEL PARCELS AT, AT HALF AN ACRE, THEY'RE ALLOWED A PERSONAL SERVICE SHOP, WHICH IS BARBER DRY CLEANING LAUNDRY, UM, DRIVE UP SMALL PARKING LOT, WALK IN, TAKE CARE OF BUSINESS, LEAVE A PROFESSIONAL BUSINESS MEDICAL OFFICE WITH A SOLE PRACTITIONER.
SO WHEN JERRY PUTS OUT HIS OWN SHINGLE, HE CAN PUT HIS ARCHITECTURE FIRM RIGHT THERE
JERRY'S JOINT, JERRY JERRY'S JOINTS.
UM, SO, UM, ON PARCELS ARE MORE THAN ONE ACRE.
AND THIS IS WHAT THE CAR WASH AND, AND WEST JACKSON FITS UNDER IT'S RETAIL SALES PROFESSIONAL AND BUSINESS MEDICAL OFFICE WITH FOUR FEWER PRACTITIONERS COMBINED USES OF THREE HALF ACRE USES.
AND AS A CONDITIONAL USE THE BANKS WITH A DRIVE THROUGH THE OFFICE BUILDINGS AND A GAS STATION, UM, OR OTHER AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR FACILITIES.
THE CAR WASH WANTED TO COME IN AS EITHER A PERSONAL SERVICE SHOP
IT IS HAVE A QUEUING LINE, HAVE VACUUMS AND ALL THAT OTHER STUFF.
UM, IT DIDN'T FIT AS A GAS STATION OR OTHER AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR FACILITIES, EVEN THOUGH THERE IS LANGUAGE IN THERE, UM, USES RELATED TO, OR SIMILAR AS, I COULDN'T MAKE THAT CONNECTION BECAUSE JUST FROM A LOGISTICS STANDPOINT, THE ATTORNEYS AND I WENT BACK AND FORTH ABOUT THAT.
SO WHAT THAT GAP, WHAT THAT CAR WASH IS DOING NOW IS THEY ARE GOING TO THE ZONING HEARING BOARD TO GET SOME VARIANCES.
THEY WILL GO THERE AND IF THEY GET THEIR VARIANCES, THEN THEY WILL COME BACK
[01:25:01]
HERE AND THEY WILL, THEY WILL GO THROUGH A LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS IN FRONT OF YOU.SO THEY'RE LOOKING TO WHAT ADD TO THE GAS STATION AUTOMOTIVE REPAIR LANGUAGE.
THEY'RE BASICALLY LOOKING TO HAVE THE ZONING HEARING BOARD SAY, JEFF IS WRONG.
YOU FIT IN HERE, YOU CAN FIT IN HERE, YOU CAN FIT IN HERE.
BUT WE, IT MAKES SENSE THAT YOU CAN USE THIS PARCEL THAT WAY.
OUR ZONING ORDINANCE JUST DOESN'T ADDRESS IT THAT WAY.
SO, AND THEN THE LAST ONE IS PARCELS AND YOUR TAKE ON THAT PROBABILITY IS WHETHER OR NOT THEY GET IT.
I I DON'T THINK IT SHOULD BE AN ISSUE.
I, I MEAN THEY HAVE TO, THEY HAVE TO GO IN THERE AND THEY HAVE TO SAY WHAT THEIR HARDSHIP IS.
THEY HAVE TO SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, IT CAN'T BE ECONOMIC, IT CAN'T BE, THEY HAVE TO SAY, WELL, IT'S ODDLY CONFIGURED PARCEL OR IT IS A, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN'T GET, YOU CAN'T USE THE PROPERTY FOR ANYTHING OTHER THAN THIS.
IF I WAS THEIR ATTORNEY, MY ARGUMENT WOULD PROBABLY BE, LOOK, JEFF IS SLIGHTLY OFF HERE.
SAYING, BUT WE THINK HE'S SLIGHTLY WRONG.
I I DON'T HAVE ANY, YOU KNOW, CONCERNS.
JUST CURIOUS WHAT YOU'RE GETTING.
I MEAN, WHEN I'M NOT BEING RECORDED, ASK MY OPINION ON WHAT, HOW OFTEN THE ZONING HEARING COURT GIVES OUT WILL THINK ABOUT
IN THE ORDINANCE AS AN ALLOWABLE USE OF THE CRSC.
SO IT'S NOT LIKE YOU DIDN'T ANTICIPATE IT.
THAT WOULD BE THE OTHER, IF WE DIDN'T PUT IT IN THERE ANYWHERE, IT WOULD, THEY WOULD COME IN AND THEY'D SAY, WELL, WE'RE GONNA APPLY FOR A CURATIVE AMENDMENT BECAUSE YOU DON'T ALLOW FOR THIS USE ANYWHERE.
THAT WOULD BE THEIR OTHER ALTERNATIVE.
IF I CAME BACK AND SAID, NO, I DON'T ALLOW, IS THERE ANYBODY ELSE OR IS THIS A BEING? IS ANYBODY ELSE LOOKING AT THIS PROPERTY OR NOT THAT I'M AWARE OF.
I THOUGHT MAYBE THAT THE SHOPPING CENTER MIGHT WANT TO EXTEND THERE.
I KNOW THAT THE SHOPPING CENTER PUT IN FOR A RIGHT TO KNOW REQUEST.
THE OWNERS OF THE SHOP OF RETAIL SITES, THEY PUT IN A RIGHT TO KNOW REQUEST TODAY TO LOOK AND SEE THAT PLAN.
BUT I DON'T, YEAH, I'M NOT SURE THAT THAT CAR WASH FITS INTO THEIR MODEL, BUT THAT'S WHY I WONDER IF THEY WERE LOOKING AT IT TOO.
IF THEY STILL OWN THE PROPERTY WHERE THE, WHERE THE JERSEY MICE IS.
'CAUSE IT'S THAT PROPERTY'S SPLIT NOW.
THEY DID A MINOR SUBDIVISION LYLE'S ON ITS OWN PIECE AND THEN THE REST OF THE SHOPPING CENTER'S ON ITS 'CAUSE LYLE WANTED TO OWN THEIR OWN PROPERTY.
IF THEY STILL OWN THE OTHER PIECE, THEY HAVE EVERY RIGHT TO COME TO THE ZONING HEARING BOARD, WHICH IS NEXT WEEK.
IT'S ON THE 24TH TO COME IN AND MAKE AN ARGUMENT OF WHATEVER THEY WANT TO.
SO, UM, WHAT THIS SHOWS IS THE PARCELS AS NC ALLOWS THEM, SO THE, THE BREAK GREEN PARCELS, THE BREAK GREEN LINES ARE THE HALF ACRE OR SMALLER PARCELS? NOT VERY MANY OF 'EM.
NOT VERY, I MEAN THEY'RE, THEY'RE KIND OF CONNECTED TO THE RED ONES, WHICH THE RED IS, UM, ACRE OR GREATER BETWEEN AN ACRE AND THREE ACRES AND EVERYTHING THAT ON MY SCREEN IS BLUE BUT DOESN'T SHOW UP REALLY AS BLUE.
EVERYTHING ELSE IS THREE ACRES OR ABOVE.
SO WHEN YOU GO BACK TO THE EXISTING USES, THOSE THREE CATEGORIES APPLY IN THOSE THREE SPOTS, COULD SOMEBODY AGGREGATE THE PARCELS? ABSOLUTELY.
DO THEY HAVE TO COME THROUGH? UM, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE REVERSE OF THE SUBDIVISION.
DO THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH A PROCESS THAT COULD BE A CHECK THERE? OR IS THAT A RISK THAT THOSE PURPLES BECOME BLUES? THAT IS A RISK.
IT IT, IF SOMEONE CAME IN TODAY AND THEY HAD, UM, THIS WHOLE SECTION HERE THAT ISN'T HIGHLIGHTING, BUT THE LARGER SECTION BETWEEN NEXT TO THE, THE GREEN PIECE ON THE NORTH SIDE OF THE ROAD.
IF THEY CAME IN ALL OF THOSE AND SAID, HERE I'M PUTTING IN A HOME DEPOT BECAUSE IT'S MORE THAN THREE ACRES AND I CAN DO THAT.
I, THEY DON'T REALLY HAVE TO GO THROUGH CONSOLIDATION.
IT'S PART OF THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS THAT THEY SHOW THEY HAVE OWNERSHIP RIGHTS TO THOSE PARCELS AND SAY THEY'RE ALL GONNA BE CONSOLIDATED BECAUSE THE, THE SORT OF NEBRASKA LOOKING PIECE THAT WAS PULTE AND THEY HAD TWO OR THREE OTHER PARCELS THAT THEY WERE LOOKING TO JOIN.
AND WHAT HAPPENED TO PULTE AGAIN? DID THEY JUST DECIDE IT WASN'T THE, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS NEVER WANTED, NEVER VOTED ON THEIR APPLICATION.
BUT PULTE GOT THE SENSE, AT LEAST I'M SPEAKING FROM MY OPINION OF WHAT PULTE THINKS.
THEY GOT THE SENSE THEY WEREN'T GONNA GET IT PASSED ANYWAY.
SO THEY HELD OFF AND THEN I THINK THEY JUST FINALLY WITHDREW THEIR APPLICATION.
BUT THAT WAS, YOU REMEMBER THAT WAS FOR PURE RESIDENTIAL.
AND OUR CONTENTION WAS, WE GET THAT MAYBE THE BACK SHOULD BE RESIDENTIAL BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT GONNA PUT SOMETHING BACK THERE THAT'S A LITTLE AWKWARD AND SURROUNDED BY HOUSES.
BUT REALLY THE FRONT WE STILL WANT TO BE, AT THE TIME OUR THOUGHT WAS WE WANTED IT TO BE RETAIL.
WEREN'T THERE SOME ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES WITH THAT PROPERTY AS WELL? THEY ARE.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT, UM, WHEN YOU LOOK AT THIS,
[01:30:01]
AND AGAIN, THIS IS SLIGHTLY EXAGGERATED.THAT DIP IS WHERE IT IS AND THEN THE, THAT DIP IS WHERE PEN PACKER COMES OUT AND THAT'S A LOW SPOT ON THE PROPERTY, BUT THEN IT ALSO GOES UP TO THE HIGH SPOT.
SO IT'S, I MEAN IT IS GOT SOME SLOPE TO IT AND THERE'S A CREEK RUNNING THROUGH IT.
BUT WASN'T THERE A, SOME KIND OF DUMPING GROUND OR SOMETHING AND WELL, YOU COULD TELL HOLES AND THAT'S WHAT I MEANT BY ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES.
THERE WAS A LOT OF OTHER ISSUES AS I RECALL.
I'M NOT AWARE OF ANY, WE DON'T HAVE TO DWELL ON THIS, BUT NO, BUT NO, I I I DON'T REMEMBER THAT.
I REMEMBER THERE BEING SOME ISSUES THAT THE NEIGHBOR NEIGHBORHOOD KIDS WERE USING IT AS A, AS A BMX PARK OR A MOTORCYCLE PARK.
BUT OTHER THAN THAT, IS THERE ANY INTEREST, I'M ASKING THIS TO THE BOARD.
IS THERE ANY INTEREST? YEAH, KEEP INTERRUPT.
ANY INTEREST IN UM, UM, OBVIOUSLY A LONG RIDGE MAKING THAT, UH, RETAIL, KEEPING IT RETAIL, BUT FOR THE BIGGER PIECES IN THE BACK, GOING BACK TOWARD THE RESIDENTIAL, KEEPING ANY OF THAT OPEN SPACE, ANY INTEREST IN AT ANY OF THAT FOR OPEN SPACE? I JUST THROW THAT OUT THERE AS A QUESTION.
WELL, I DID KIND OF SIMILAR TO YOUR, YOUR QUESTION, YOU KNOW, AND I WAS CURIOUS WHAT THE, I DON'T KNOW, WHAT WOULD IT BE? THE WETLAND DEVELOPMENT LAWN, YOU KNOW, LIKE WHAT, WHAT WOULD THAT PARCEL LOOK LIKE DEVELOPED? WOULD IT STILL HAVE SOME OPEN SPACE? YOU KNOW, AND THEN LOOKING AT THE HOUSES BEHIND, WHICH I THINK IS WHAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE GETTING AT, YOU KNOW, IF SOMEBODY CAME IN AND DEVELOPED THIS AS CRSC, THEY COULD PUT A, THE HOME DEPOT LOADING DOCK RIGHT UP TO THAT PERSON'S BACKYARD, RIGHT? SURE, SURE.
THE PLAN, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, YOU SEE THE BREAK GREEN PIECE AT THE BOTTOM, WE, THE ROAD GOING INTO THE DEVELOPMENT STARTED THERE AND LOOPED BACK AND THE LARGE FLAT SPACE THAT IS HERE IS GENERALLY KIND OF FLAT.
THAT'S WHERE ALL THE HOUSES WORK.
SO ALL OF THIS SORT OF REMAINED AS OPEN SPACE AS
UM, AT ONE POINT THEY TALKED ABOUT GIVING A TOWNSHIP AND DEVELOPING A POCKET PARK THERE, WHICH DIDN'T MAKE A WHOLE LOT OF SENSE BECAUSE IT WAS RIGHT ON RIDGE PIKE.
UM, WELL I GUESS MY QUESTION, THE PORT AGAIN IS THAT, IS THIS SPACE WORTH, FOR LACK OF A BETTER WORD, SAVING OPPOSED TO THE JUST RIGHT ALONG RIDGE PIKE LETTING THAT BE RETAIL, BUT SAVING LIKE THAT BIG OPEN SPACE? OR IS THAT JUST SO FAR LIKE OUT OF IT FOR THE GEN FOR THE THAT'S MAJORITY OF THE TOWNSHIP.
DOES IT REALLY, YOU KNOW, WELL, I, I THINK, I THINK YOUR QUESTION HAS VALUE.
I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE NEED TO, FOR KEEP IN MIND AS WE MOVE FORWARD IN THIS PROCESS.
BECAUSE RIGHT NOW, AS I THINK JERRY JUST SAID, YOU COULD PUT THE HOME DEPOT RIGHT UP AND HAVE THE LOADING DOCK RIGHT BEHIND SOMEONE'S BACK BACKYARD BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT IT ALLOWS.
BUT AS WE GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS, MAYBE WE WRITE, REWRITE THE ZONING TO BUFFER THOSE THINGS OUT SO THAT YOU CAN'T PUT SOMETHING UNLESS YOU HAVE FRONTAGE, UNLESS YOU'RE RIGHT ON RIDGE PIKE AND EVERY, AND WE FIND A WAY TO CONSERVE THE BACK HALF OF THESE PROPERTIES.
AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS THINKING.
AND, AND I THINK IT'S A GREAT IDEA TOO, YOU KNOW, STILL ALLOWING SOMETHING ON THE FRONT HALF AS YOU'RE SAYING, BUT THEN YEAH, YOU KNOW, BACK TO BACKING YOUR WAY INTO SOME OPEN SPACE THAT THE DEVELOPER PROVIDES.
THE OTHER THING, BUT WHEN YOU, KEVIN, QUESTION IF WE DO, IF WE WOULD AGREE TO THAT, MY QUESTION WOULD BE THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE TOWNSHIP, 90 PLUS PERCENT OF IT IS NOWHERE NEAR HERE.
SO WHAT WOULD IT BE OTHER THAN JUST, I MEAN, YOU REALLY WOULDN'T PUT A PARK OR ANYTHING BACK THERE, WOULD YOU? I MEAN NO, BUT BUT YOU COULD HAVE TRAIL CONNECTIONS.
'CAUSE THAT THE, SORRY TO CUT YOU OFF THAT, THAT'S HIGH VOLTAGE RIGHT AWAY, RIGHT? YEAH.
SO I, I I MOUNTAIN BIKE A LOT.
I HAVE MOUNTAIN BIKED IN A LOT OF PARKS THAT, I'M NOT SAYING THIS NEEDS TO BE A MOUNTAIN BIKE THING, BUT A LOT OF PARKS WHERE THE, THE OWNERS OF THAT, RIGHT, ALTHOUGH IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S ON PARCEL HERE, BUT THE, THE OWNERS OF THAT HIGH VOLTAGE RIGHT AWAY ALLOW FOLKS TO PASS THROUGH IT RECREATIONALLY.
SO IT'S A, EVEN INFORMALLY RIGHT NOW, IT'S AT LEAST A WILDLIFE THING.
I GUARANTEE YOU THERE'S DEER GOING RIGHT AROUND THOSE FOUR EDGES WALKING THROUGH IN A REALLY SAFE AREA.
SO THAT'S ALSO IN A WAY SOME LIKE FREE OPEN SPACE.
MY INTEREST IN SAVING WOULD BE SAVING IT.
IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, WHO EATS ANOTHER 400 HOUSES, HUNDRED HOUSES AND YOU WERE ABSOLUTELY NOT WRONG.
AND, AND I THINK THOSE, AGAIN, QUESTIONS WE SHOULD JUST SORT OF KEEP IN OUR BACK POCKET AND UNDERSTAND THAT AS WE GET THROUGH THIS PROCESS, HOW DO WE PRESERVE THAT? AND THEN WHAT IN ZONING CAN WE REQUIRE IT TO BE? YEAH.
WHEN IT'S PRESERVED, WHETHER THAT'S A PARK, I DON'T THINK THE TOWNSHIP IS REALLY LOOKING TO HAVE A PARK, BUT IS IT SOMETHING THAT WE GET A CONSERVATION EASEMENT ON? IS IT SOMETHING THAT WE SAY
[01:35:01]
ALLOW SOMEONE TO BUILD HIGHER DENSITY RETAIL OR WHATEVER TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT UPFRONT IN THEY KEEP IT, IF THEY KEEP IT OPEN AND BACK.I WOULD, I I MY INTEREST TO GET POINT, IT WOULD BE THAT WILDLIFE NUMBER ONE AND NUMBER TWO IS JUST, WE JUST DON'T NEED 200 MORE HOUSES IN THIS TOWNSHIP.
WE JUST DON'T NEED, WELL, AND THOSE, THOSE SORT OF GO TO MY NEXT STEPS.
UM, WE, WE STILL NEED TO SORT OF LOOK AT NC AND CC ZONING AGAIN TODAY WAS SORT OF, I WANTED TO GIVE YOU ALL A SENSE OF JUST WHAT WAS THERE, SOME INITIAL QUESTIONS, THINGS LIKE THAT.
I WANT TO GO THROUGH NC AND CRSC ZONING IN A LITTLE BIT GREATER DETAIL WITH YOU.
I WANNA LOOK AT EVERY LAND USE.
I WANT TO GO THROUGH EVERY, I'M GONNA DRIVE UP AND DOWN THE STREET AND PICK OUT EVERY LAND USE AND SAY AND REALLY GET A SENSE OF WHAT'S THERE.
IF IT'S UNDERDEVELOPED, IF IT'S UNDERUSED, IF IT'S RENTAL PROPERTY, IF IT'S IN LEGAL NONCONFORMITY, ALL OF THAT.
UM, AND THEN I WANT YOU TO UNDERSTAND WHAT OTHER AREAS OF THE TOWNSHIP ARE, ARE ZONED IN C OR CRSC SO THAT KNOWING IF WE MAKE CHANGES HERE, WHAT OTHER CHANGES COULD BE AFFECTED.
AND THAT, YOU KNOW, WHAT THAT MEANS IS, DOES THAT MEAN WE REWRITE NC AND THAT SORT OF GOES TO THE NEXT STEP AFTER THAT.
IS IT CHANGES IN EXISTING ZONING? DO WE REZONE IT, DO WE MAKE A NEW ZONING DISTRICT? WHAT DO WE DO? AND THOSE, THAT'S SORT OF STEP THREE IN THIS PROCESS AND THEN STEP FORWARDS TO BE DETERMINED.
IT IS HOW WE IMPLEMENT IT AND WHAT THOSE THINGS WE SORT OF, AGAIN, WE'RE GETTING THE VISION OF WHAT THE CORRIDOR IS NOW.
UM, THE NEXT WE'LL SORT OF GET THE CORE OF WHAT IT COULD BE AND HOW IT COULD DEVELOP.
AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE GONNA LOOK AT JASON MUNICIPALITIES AND LAND USE ANALYSIS.
AND THEN AFTER THAT, THAT'S WHEN WE REALLY SORT OF GET THE NITTY-GRITTY AND YOU START TO TELL ME THIS IS WHAT I WANT TO BE.
THIS IS WHERE I DON'T WANT TO SEE DEVELOPMENT HAPPEN.
THIS IS WHERE I WANNA SEE DEVELOPMENT UP ON THE ROAD.
I DON'T WANNA SEE HOUSES, I DON'T WANNA SEE, YOU KNOW, I WANNA SEE FOUR MORE CAR WASHES.
'CAUSE I HAVE SEVEN CARS, MR. BRIGHT
SO EITHER WAY, SO THIS IS THE STEPS AGAIN, ANY SORT OF THESE REZONINGS AND, AND OBSERVE ALTERNATE CHANGING ANY OF THE ZONING.
IT'S, IT IS GONNA BE A PROCESS.
I DON'T WANT TO JUST JUMP IN AND HAND YOU A PIECE OF PAPER AND SAY, HERE'S WHAT I THINK.
WELL, I I THINK THAT, I THINK THIS IS A GOOD PLACE TO START.
I, I HAD FORGOTTEN HOW MUCH PROPERTY WAS STILL THERE.
YOU KNOW, YOU DRIVE A BRIDGE TO SEE THE STREET FRONT AND I'M THINKING IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, THE STREET FRONT AND, AND I JUST WOULD HATE TO SEE 200 HOUSES BACK THERE.
I JUST WOULD HATE TO SEE I AGREE.
AND, AND OR YOU KNOW, A, A HIGH RISE OR WHATEVER.
AND AS KEVIN SAYS, I MEAN WE NEED TO SOMEHOW PROTECT SOME OF THIS AREA.
WE GET FOR BIKERS, HIKERS OR WILDLIFE, I DON'T CARE.
BUT BOY, BOY, I WOULD JUST HATE TO SEE YOU GET DEVELOPMENT HOUSES.
I, I I REALLY LIKED HOW YOU LAID THIS PRESENTATION OUT.
CAN WE ALL GET A COPY OF THIS PLEASE? OH SURE.
UM, AND I, AND YOU KNOW, I'M HEARING YOU GUYS OVER THE LAST COUPLE OF MEETINGS TOO AND, AND IT'S ALMOST LIKE YOU GET, YOU GET A DEVELOPMENT AND BY THE TIME YOU GET IT, YOUR HANDS ARE TIED.
BUT LIKE DOING THIS SORT OF THING IN, WHAT IS IT? NNCR, NC NC AND THEN UM, OTHER AREAS TOO I THINK IS THE WAY THAT WE CAN, I MEAN I KNOW THERE'S A LOT OF WORK DID HERE JEFF.
IT'S A GREAT PRESENTATION BUT YOU KNOW, THIS MAKES IT SO MUCH CLEARER WHEN YOU, YOU KNOW, YOU THINK OF OPEN SPACE, THIS, THIS REALLY PUTS IT RIGHT IN YOUR FACE WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT IT.
IF YOU COULD DO THIS FOR OTHER AREAS, AND I'M NOT TRYING TO GIVE YOU WORK.
I KNOW YOU GOT ENOUGH WORK TO DO, BUT IT'S SO HELPFUL WHEN YOU ACTUALLY SEE IT.
YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU LOOK AT IT, YOU SAY, WOW, YOU DON'T WANT TO SEE A HIGH RISE OR SOMETHING IN THERE OR YOU KNOW, CONDOS OR SOMETHING.
WELL THIS WAS THE AREA WE PICKED FIRST, BUT THERE, YES, I KNOW THAT THESE ARE, WE ARE GONNA DO THIS SORT OF ANALYSIS WITH OTHER AREAS IN THE TOWNSHIP, WHICH IS RIGHT IN YOUR FACE MAN.
IT REALLY MAKES, IT MAKES IT COME TO LIFE.
IT MAY NOT ALWAYS, THIS IS SORT ONE AREA 'CAUSE IT'S NC THE NEXT AREA MIGHT BE THE CRSC ZONING THAT, AND MAYBE THAT'S A NATURAL TRANSITION FOR WHERE THE OAKS MARKETPLACE, THE EXPO CENTER IS AND MAYBE LOOKING AT THAT AND SAYING HOW DO WE CHANGE THAT? BECAUSE THAT ZONING IS JUST A FIAS.
WELL BUT I'M JUST SAYING, I'M JUST SAYING THE WAY YOU PRESENTED THIS, JUST THIS AREA, IF, IF WE MOVE TO THIS OTHER SPACE, IF YOU CAN CONTINUE TO DO THAT, IT MAKES IT VERY EASY TO UNDERSTAND AND SEE WHAT'S GOING ON.
YOU KNOW, WHEN I WAS THINKING ABOUT THIS LAST WEEK, I WAS LIKE, HOW, HOW DO I SORT OF GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS AND I KNOW MENTALLY WHAT I GO THROUGH AND I THOUGHT I JUST HAVE TO PUT THAT DOWN IN A PRESENTATION SO THAT YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT MY PROCESS IS FOR GOING THROUGH THESE THINGS.
'CAUSE IT REALLY, IT REALLY CLEARED IT UP FOR ME.
'CAUSE LIKE I SAY, WHEN I DRIVE WITHOUT RIDGE, I JUST THINK OF THE, YOU KNOW, FRONT WHAT YOU SAY FRONT END.
FRONTAGE, YOU KNOW, AND I'M NOT THINKING ABOUT ALL YOU'RE DOING 50 MILES AN HOUR, 45.
THE AERIAL VIEWS REALLY HELP A LOT.
[01:40:02]
ALRIGHT, SO WHAT DO WE NEED TO DO JEFF? JUST UH, UM, I'LL START WORKING ON THE NEXT STEPS.I MEAN WE WILL START, I'M GONNA TALK TO THE ADJACENT MUNICIPALITIES.
I'M GONNA DO A LAND USE ANALYSIS ON WHAT CAN BE BUILT THERE, WHAT'S THERE NOW.
UM, AND THEN WE'LL, I'LL SHOW YOU THE OTHER AREAS IN THE TOWNSHIP THAT ARE ZONE NC OR CRSC OR, OR ANY OF THE COMMERCIAL DISTRICTS.
I'LL MAYBE NOT GET INTO THE FINER DETAILS OF, OF EACH AREA, BUT I'LL SHOW YOU WHERE THEY ARE AND WHAT AND WHAT THEY LOOK LIKE.
SO, SO FOR THIS PARTICULAR RIDGE, PIKE, IF WE, IF, IF, IF, AND I DON'T KNOW, WE DO IT NOW OR WE DO IT NEXT MEETING OR WHATEVER, WE DECIDE THIS IS OUR PRIORITY OPEN SPACE AREA, LET'S JUST SAY WE, SO DO WE THEN PRESENT THAT TO THE SUPERVISOR? I, I THINK, NO.
WHAT WE DO IS WE WORK THROUGH AND WE, WE REDO THE ZONING AND BECAUSE IT'S ALL BASED IN ZONING.
AND, AND PART OF WHAT WE SAY IS WHEN WE READ, WHEN ASSUMING WE REWRITE SOME ZONING OR PUT SOMETHING NEW IN ZONING, PART OF THE LEGISLATIVE INTENT IS TO PRESERVE THE OPEN SPACE ALONG THIS COURT OR SO IS IT AS SIMPLE AS SAYING, OKAY, YOU KNOW, WE, WE ARE OKAY WITH RETAIL ALONG THE FRONT AND BACK 200 FEET OR IS THAT HOW THAT WORKS? BUT THE REST OF IT HAS TO STAY OPEN.
IS THAT, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT? IN THE MOST SIMPLEST TERMS? YES.
I'M NOT, I DIDN'T MEAN THAT TO BE INSULTING.
IN THE MOST BASIC SENSE, THAT'S WHAT THE ZONING ALARMS WILL SAY.
THERE'S GONNA BE A LOT OF TECHNICALITIES AND A LOT OF THINGS THAT WE HAVE TO WORK OUT.
AND YOU, ZACH HAS TO GET INVOLVED RIGHT.
I'M JUST TRYING TO UNDERSTAND MY OWN HEAD WHAT THE NEXT STEPS ARE.
YEAH, BECAUSE IT SEEMS, IT SEEMS LIKE, I THINK JOE, YOU'VE MADE THIS POINT A FEW TIMES.
IT SEEMS LIKE WE, WE, WE, WE IDENTIFY THIS STUFF AND THEN WE KIND OF LOSE TRACK OF WHAT, WHAT DO WE ACTUALLY, WHAT'S THE BOOTS ON THE GROUND, WHAT DO WE DO? CORRECT.
SO I WANNA MAKE SURE WE DON'T, 'CAUSE I, THIS IS VERY, I THINK IT WAS VERY GOOD.
SO I'D LIKE TO DO, MAKE SOME DECISION ON THAT PIECE
[DISCUSSION: FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS]
AS SOON AS WE CAN OR WHATEVER YOU THINK THE NEXT STEP WOULD.WELL, WE'LL PROBABLY BE, UM, I'M LOOKING AT THE SCHEDULE ONLY BECAUSE IT'S SUMMER.
WE SORT OF HAVE A, A LITTLE BIT OF A BACKLOG OF, OF, OF LAND DEVELOPMENTS FOR THE, FOR THE, YOU KNOW, FUTURE AGENDA.
JUST FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS. SO JULY 2ND WE'VE CANCELED JULY 16TH WOULD BE THE WHITAKER DEVELOPMENT QUEST REDEVELOPMENT IN LOVERS LANE.
YOU THINK ALL THREE WILL PRESENT THAT SAME THING? I, I, I THINK THEY WILL.
I I THINK THEY'RE FAIRLY CLOSE.
MOUNT RAINIER DAY, OR SORRY, MONTCLAIR DAY.
OH, IS THAT MONTCLAIR DAY? I'VE LIVED IN OH THREE MONTHS AND I SOMETIMES GET THEM.
IT'S KIND OF ALL THAT CORRIDOR AND IT'S ALL THE SAME ATTORNEY.
SO IT KIND OF WORKS OUT THAT WAY.
AUGUST 6TH, UM, THAT WOULD BE THE COLLEGE OF THE MULTIFAMILY, WHICH IS THE HIGH REAL ESTATE UP ON PERMA BOULEVARD AND MILLENNIUM STAGE, WHICH IS SIX 50 EGYPT ROAD.
UM, THOSE ARE BOTH 10, BOTH PRELIMINARIES WHERE THEY'RE THEIR SECOND STEP.
UM, AND KEVIN, I STILL AM WORKING ON THE TIMELINE CHART.
I HAVE A FEW DRAFTS I'M STILL WORKING ON THAT I HAVEN'T FORGOTTEN ABOUT IT.
UM, AND THESE MAY KIND OF GO AWAY.
I'M KIND OF GETTING THE SENSE THAT NEITHER OF THEM ARE REALLY GONNA BE READY, BUT AT 5 92 SOUTH MENNONITE ROAD, THE AGRI THAT WAS ADOPTED, THEY'RE TAKING THE NEXT STEP FOR CONDITIONAL USE AND UM, AND TENTATIVE SKETCH.
BUT I GET THE SENSE WHEN I EMAIL THIS TO THE, TO THE ATTORNEY SAYING, HERE'S MY PROPOSED, HERE'S MY THOUGHTS ON THE SCHEDULE.
I'LL TALK TO MY TEAM, WHICH USUALLY MEANS YEAH, WE'RE NOT GONNA BE READY.
SO THEY STILL HAVE TO DO ZONING TOO FOR THE PICKLEBALL, RIGHT? OR NO, THEY'D HAVE TO GO TO THE ZONING HEARING BOARD FOR THAT.
YEAH, THAT'S SEPARATE CYPRESS PLACE.
I HAD A MEETING THAT'S THE, UM, WORKFORCE HOUSING AND THE WARRIORS FOR BAPTIST.
THAT ONE, UM, THAT BACK ON THAT.
THEY, THEY'RE NOT AN OFFICIAL APPLICATION YET, BUT THEY HAVE COME TO US AND SORT OF SHOWED US WHAT THEIR DRAFT EVENTS IS GONNA LOOK LIKE.
LIKE, AND SO THEY, I THINK THEY'RE GONNA BE MAKING AN OFFICIAL APPLICATION.
SO NOW WE'RE TOO LATE TO CHANGE THE ZONING AND ANYTHING? WELL, NO.
THEY'RE ASKING FOR A CHANGE TO THE ZONING.
BUT COULD WE ADD SOMETHING TO, TO PREVENT? WE DON'T NEED TO.
WELL, I THINK, WELL, RIGHT NOW IS PREVENTIVE.
IT IS PREVENT RIGHT NOW THEY CANNOT DO THAT.
WE COULD, WE COULD ADVISE THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO NOT, NOT APPROVE THE ZONING CHANGE.
WE WE'RE GONNA WAIT ALL AS WELL AND THE ZONING BOARD AS WELL.
UNDERSTAND WE BACK TO, UH, ATTEND THAT MEETING IF THAT WOULD APPROPRIATE AND COME UP WITH A LAUNDRY LIST OF WHY, WHY WE FEEL THE WAY WE FEEL.
WELL, LET'S, LET'S HAVE FEELINGS LATER.
LET'S HAVE NOW LET'S HAVE FEELINGS LATER.
UM, AND THEN ONLY 'CAUSE IT WOULDN'T FIGURE, I KNOW IT SORT OF RUNS ASIDE, BUT THE ENVIRONMENTAL ADVISORY COUNCIL MEETING ON THE 16TH.
UM, WELL, UNLESS WE GET AGENDA ITEMS, WE'RE KIND OF, SORT OF AT A LULL BECAUSE BIRD TOWN IS BEING TAKEN CARE OF BY THE PARK BOARD AND LOCAL CLIMATE ACTION PLANS DONE.
[01:45:01]
SO UNLESS WE SORT OF COME WITH SOME AGENDA ITEMS, WE MAY NOT HAVE THAT MEETING.AND ONE OF THE, WE JUST, WE JUST IS ARE WE, WOULD THAT VALID THE BURN TIME? WE'RE OFFICIALLY BURN DOWN, I GUESS.
WE HAVE TO SEND A A HUNDRED DOLLARS.
ARE WE NOW C CONS? ARE WE CONTINUALLY GONNA BE SHARING WITH PARKS, RECREATION, OR ARE WE GOING BACK TO NO, WE'RE GOING BACK TO OUR OWN MEETINGS.
UM, YEAH, I KNOW YOU HAVE A CONFLICT WITH THE PARTNER YEAH.
BUT, UM, NOW THERE'S A CHANCE THAT ANY OF THIS CAN CHANGE.
THIS IS SORT OF MY, WHERE WE ARE IN THE TIMELINE WITH PEOPLE.
SO I, BECAUSE THERE'S ONLY THREE BOARD MEMBERS ON THE JULY 21ST MEETING, THERE'S ONLY THREE BOARD MEMBERS, ONE OF THESE.
AND BECAUSE IT'S VACATION SEASON, ANY ONE OF THESE COULD PULL OFF AT ANY TIME AND JUST SAY, HOLD US OFF FOR A COUPLE MONTHS.
THAT WOULD BE NICE IF THEY WOULD.
I I HATE TO DO THREE IN ONE NIGHT.
THAT'S A LOT OF, THAT'S A LOT OF, THEY'RE NOT VERY STRAIGHTFORWARD.
YOU KNOW, YOU WANT TO GIVE EVERYONE IT'S RIGHTFUL.
'CAUSE THEY'RE BOTH, YOU KNOW, WELL WHITAKER FOR SURE AND LOVER'S LANE ARE BOTH VERY CONTROVERSIAL, SO.
I SUSPECT THERE'LL BE, UH, I ASSUME SOME RESIDENTS THAT WOULD LIKE TO COME AND VOTE.
SO I HOPE WE GIVE 'EM ALL ENOUGH SIGNS.
BE WILL GIVE THEM NUMBER, HOPEFULLY SOME PEOPLE FROM ONE 40 WHITAKER, OR AT LEAST SOMEBODY WILL BRING A PETITION.
SO THAT'S WHERE I, THAT'S SORT OF WHERE I'M AT.
I PROBABLY TALKED YOUR EARS OFF.
YOU KNOW, DOES THAT MEAN THAT PERHAPS MAYBE SEPTEMBER WE'LL SEE THE NEXT RIDGE PIPE? YES.
THAT, THAT, THAT, THAT WAS SINCE I WANT, I DIDN'T WANNA PUT IT ON THERE YET, BUT NOW THAT WE'VE GONE THROUGH THIS EXERCISE AND YOU GUYS LIKE WHERE WE'RE AT, I'M GONNA AIM FOR SEPTEMBER TO HAVE MORE INFORMATION AND, AND THE NEXT STEP IN THIS PROCESS.
I'LL THINK, UH, I THINK BOB'S GONNA SAY SOMETHING.
OH, I WAS, UM, THE ZONING OR THE, NOT THE ZONING ORDINANCE, BUT THE, UH, SUBDIVISION ORDINANCE AND ALL THOSE THINGS WHERE, WHERE DO WE STAND ON THAT? ARE THEY UP TO DATE OR THEY ARE.
I MEAN, THERE'S SOME THINGS THAT, THAT NEED TO BE MORE UP TO DATE.
THERE'S SOME THINGS THAT WE NEED TO APPROACH.
AND RIGHT NOW FROM THE COMP PLAN WHERE WE TALK ABOUT WHAT WE WANT TO UPDATE, WE, WE ARE STARTING WITH BRIDGE PIKE.
ONCE WE SORT OF GET MAYBE HALFWAY THROUGH BRIDGE PIKE, I'LL SAY, WHAT DO YOU WANNA START ON NEXT? BECAUSE I'VE GOTTA START PLANNING FOR THAT IN MY HEAD.
AND SO WE SEE WHERE YOU WANNA GO NEXT.
WHETHER THAT'S REDOING THE REST OF THE COMMERCIAL DISTRICTS, BECAUSE WE'RE ALL GONNA BE COMMERCIAL LAND DEVELOPMENT EXPERTS AT THAT POINT.
UM, OR WHETHER IT'S TO, TO LOOK AT INDUSTRIAL OR WHATEVER THE NEXT STEP IS.
I DON'T HAVE THEM ALL MEMORIZED.
JERRY'S GOT THE BOOK IN FRONT OF HIM, SO I, I WON'T BELABOR IT.
SO I THINK THERE'S SOME IMPROVEMENT THAT WE CAN DO THAT ISN'T COMPLICATED.
BUT LIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, THE SUBDIVISION RIGHT DOWN HERE AT THE CORNER OF ROUTE 29, THE HOUSES ARE PRACTICALLY RIGHT ON THE ROAD.
I REALLY THINK THERE SHOULD BE SOME DISTANCE BACK.
AND I, UNFORTUNATELY, I THINK I WAS ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION, WE JUST GOT ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION WHEN THAT ONE CAME IN.
BUT, UM, THEY SHOULD BE BURNED UP A LITTLE BIT.
YOU LOOK AT HOW SOME AREAS ARE, IT, IT JUST COULD BE IMPROVED.
AND THAT'S ONE THING THAT WE DO NEED TO PROBABLY, AND THAT'S MAYBE A LITTLE BIT MORE JEN, IS THE SUBDIVISION SIDE OF IT, WHICH IS MORE THE TECHNICAL DETAILS, BURING PIPING, THINGS LIKE THAT.
WHAT DO WE NEED TO DO IN A CLEANUP ORDINANCE? THAT'S SOMETHING THAT I THINK WE CAN START TO, YOU KNOW, PUT SOMETHING TOGETHER.
IT'S SOMETHING THAT ALWAYS NEEDS TO BE DONE, BUT IT'S SUCH A LOT OF WORK.
'CAUSE ONCE YOU START ONE OH, ADD THAT.
OH, ADD THAT YOU'RE LIKE 17 PAGES JUST BRINGS THINGS UP AND WELL, THE SUBJECT OF TREES MENTIONED.
DO WE HAVE ANYTHING ABOUT TREES? WELL, IN THE SUBDIVISION, LAND ELEMENT ORDINANCE, THERE'S PLANTING GUIDELINES AND PLANTING REQUIREMENTS.
SO IF YOU TAKE ONE OUT, YOU GOTTA PUT ONE BACK.
OUR TREE REPLACEMENT ORDINANCE IS NOT THAT STRONG.
WE DID, WE HAVE A SECTION THAT SAYS TREE REPLACEMENT ORDINANCE AND WE'VE KIND OF TRIED TO ENFORCE IT, BUT IT REALLY HAS NO TEETH TO IT.
IT IS SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD, THERE'S VERY HEAVY INSTRUCTIONS IN THERE ON HOW TO CUT 'EM DOWN.
I, I THINK THAT'S, THAT COULD ALSO BE CONSIDERED.
I MEAN, IF WE HAVE A, AN ACTION ITEM ABOUT REVIEWING DESIGN GUIDELINES, IT SEEMS LIKE THAT FALLS INTO THAT CONVERSATION, YOU KNOW? MM-HMM
TREE PRESERVATION, BURNS, YOU KNOW, BUFFERING.
SO YEAH, WE, AND I THINK ONCE WE ALL GET INTO IT, WE GET MORE MATURE ON THIS BOARD.
WE LEARN THOSE KIND OF THINGS.
WE LEARN THE IMPORTANCE OF THOSE THINGS.
I THINK WE LEARN BUFFERING ING.
[01:50:01]
AND IS IS SAYING YOU GET MORE MATURE TO STAY AWAY.WELL THAT, THAT'S SORT OF A GIVEN.
I'M SORRY, KEVIN EXCLUDE YOU MY FRIEND.
I HAD A RECENT MILESTONE BIRTHDAY, BUT I'M NOT TELLING YOU WHICH ONE IT WAS.
UH, I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
AND THANK YOU FOR THE, UH, FOR STICKING AROUND.