[00:00:06]
[CALL TO ORDER / MOTION TO APPROVE April 16, 2025 AGENDA]
WE'RE CALLED TO ORDER THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING FOR UPPER PROVIDENCE TOWNSHIP OR WEDNESDAY, APRIL 16TH, 2025.AND WE'RE GONNA START TONIGHT WITH, UH, LOOKING AT, UH, THE, UH, APPROVAL OF THE AGENDA FOR THIS EVENING, WHICH WE HAVE IN FRONT OF US.
LOOKS LIKE WE ONLY GOT ONE APPLICANT AND A LOT OF PEOPLE AGAINST IT ARE HERE.
UM, AND THEN A COUPLE GENERAL DISCUSSION ITEMS, UH, THE MAPS IN FRONT OF US, STUFF LIKE THAT.
SO I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE AGENDA.
ANYBODY WANTS TO DO IT? I'LL MAKE THAT MOTION.
AND THEN WE'RE GONNA TAKE PUBLIC COMMENT FOR NON AGENDA ITEMS, PLEASE STEP FORWARD.
AND THEN THE APPLICATION TO BE
[APPLICATIONS TO BE HEARD ON April 16, 2025]
HEARD TONIGHT IS FROM THE, UH, LOWER PO VALLEY REGIONAL SOAR AUTHORITY FOR A RISE UP TOWER TOWERS, TOWERS CONDITIONAL USE.AND YOU'RE GONNA TELL US WHAT THAT'S ALL ABOUT, I'M SURE.
SO PLEASE IDENTIFY YOURSELF AND WE'LL GO FROM THERE.
UM, I'M WITH OBERMEYER, REDMOND, MAXWELL, AND HIPPEL.
WE'RE HERE ON BEHALF OF RISEUP TOWERS.
UM, THIS PROPERTY IS LOCATED AT 1 0 1 STATION AVE.
UM, THIS IS, LIKE YOU MENTIONED, OWNED BY THE LOWER MIN VALLEY REGIONAL SEWER AUTHORITY.
UM, RISE OF TOWERS WILL BE THE LESSEE OF THIS PROPERTY.
UM, JUST A SMALL PORTION OF THE PROPERTY AS THE PLANS WILL SHOW.
UM, THIS RISE OF TOWERS IS ESSENTIALLY A TOWER DEVELOPMENT COMPANY.
THEY SPECIALIZE IN DEVELOPING TOWERS ON PUBLIC PROPERTY.
UM, CURRENTLY THE PROPERTY AT 1 0 1 STATION AVE IS A SEWAGE TREATMENT PLANT.
UM, IT IS A LARGE 20 PER, UH, 20.89 ACRE PARCEL.
UM, SO THIS PORTION OF THE PROPERTY THAT WOULD OCCUPY THE TOWER IS OFF TO THE SIDE OF THE SEWAGE TREATMENT PLANT, IS REALLY GOOD LOCATION FOR THIS TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT.
UM, AND RZA TOWERS OBVIOUSLY THINK SO.
UM, AS WELL, THEY'VE ENTERED INTO A LEASE WITH THE AUTHORITY.
THE AUTHORITY WOULD ACTUALLY, UM, GROSS OR WOULD BE, WOULD HAVE RIGHTFUL RIGHTS TO, UH, 40% OF THE GROSS RENT OF THE, TO THE AUTHORITY DIRECTLY.
UM, AS WELL AS THE TOWNSHIP WOULD HAVE RIGHTS TO AN ANTENNA ON THE VERY TOP OF THE TOWER FOR EMERGENCY USES.
I THINK, UM, MY CLIENT HAS BEEN TALKS WITH THE POLICE DEPARTMENT, UM, AND OTHER EMERGENCY SERVICES.
UH, SO LIKE I MENTIONED, IT'S 180 FOOT TOWER FACILITY WITH ADDITIONAL EQUIPMENT.
RIGHT NOW OUR ANCHOR TENANT IS T-MOBILE.
UM, THERE IS ANOTHER TOWER, I SAY TOWER LIKE THIS BECAUSE IT'S A, IT'S RATHER SHORT.
UM, IT'S HOW FAR WOULD IT BE? LIKE LESS THAN A HALF A MILE AWAY, MAYBE A QUARTER A MILE THOUSAND FEET, THOUSAND FEET.
UM, SO THERE IT IS ON TOP OF A BUILDING.
AND THAT BUILDING IS, IN OUR OPINION, DILAPIDATED AND IT'S MAKES IT REALLY DIFFICULT FOR PEOPLE TO MAINTENANCE THE FACILITIES THAT ARE CURRENTLY ON THAT TOWER.
SO IS THIS GONNA REPLACE THAT ONE ESSENTIALLY? YEAH.
SO T-MOBILE, UM, IS OUR, LIKE I SAID, OUR ANCHOR TENANT.
SO THEY'D BE MOVING OVER TO OUR TOWER AND THEN LIKE LEAVE VERIZON, WHICH THE OTHER TENANT ON THE CURRENT, THE EXISTING TOWER, UM, YOU KNOW, WOULD LIKELY MOVE OVER AS WELL.
UM, WHO I'M TALKING TO BACK HERE, THIS IS NATE, UM, FROM ED FIVE.
THEY'RE THE DEVELOPER OF THE PLANS AND THIS PROJECT.
UM, SO IF YOU HAVE MORE TECHNICAL QUESTIONS, HE CAN COME UP AS WELL, BUT I'LL KEEP ROLLING THROUGH IT.
WE ARE SEEKING A CONDITIONAL USE.
UM, THE, WE DISCUSSED WITH YOUR ATTORNEY, THE CODE'S WRITTEN A LITTLE, THE ORDINANCE IS WRITTEN A LITTLE FUNNY.
UM, BUT ESSENTIALLY COMMUNICATION FACILITIES ARE PERMITTED IN THIS DISTRICT, WHICH IS M TWO.
UM, BUT BECAUSE IT IS A TALL TOWER FACILITY, IT REQUIRES A CONDITIONAL USE.
SO THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE SEEKING YOU A RECOMMENDATION TO MOVE FORWARD TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO DO OUR FULL CONDITIONAL USE HEARING.
UM, THE, YEAH, LIKE I MENTIONED, THERE'S A TOWER.
THERE IS A, AN ANTENNA ON TOP OF THE TOWER FOR THAT WOULD BE FREE AND RENT FREE TO THE TOWNSHIP FOR, UM, EMERGENCY SERVICES.
[00:05:02]
YOU KNOW, CONDITIONAL USE IS REALLY A, WHETHER THE USE IS A THREAT TO HEALTH SAFETY AND WELL THE WELFARE OF THE COMMUNITY.AND WE BELIEVE THAT THIS LOCATION, ESPECIALLY BECAUSE ITS CURRENT USE, IS A SEWAGE, SEWAGE TREATMENT PLANT.
UM, AND THE CURRENT NEARBY, UH, AS YOU CAN SEE, SOME OF, THERE'S SOME COMMERCIAL BUSINESSES NEARBY, SO THERE'S A NEED FOR CELL SERVICE IN THESE AREA.
UM, THAT'S NOT REALLY BEING MET WITH THE CURRENT, UH, TOWER THAT'S EXISTING.
SO THIS WOULD BE A GREAT IMPROVEMENT TO THE AREA AND BE ACTUALLY A LITTLE BIT OUT OF THE AREA, BUT TALLER SO THAT IT CAN SERVICE MORE CUSTOMERS IN THIS, IN THIS AREA, ESPECIALLY AS THE COMMUNITY CONTINUES TO GROW AND HOPEFULLY MORE COMMERCIAL BUSINESSES ENTER THAT, UM, DEVELOPMENT.
SO I THINK THAT'S OUR GENERAL OVERVIEW, UM, RELATIVELY STRAIGHTFORWARD FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE.
AND WE'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS SPECIFICALLY TO THIS.
HOW FAR ARE WE GONNA BE ABLE TO SEE THAT? I MEAN, THAT'S PRETTY HIGH, RIGHT? SO YOUR CO AND THEN I THINK YOUR SPOT IS WONDERFUL.
I MEAN, WHAT COULD BE BETTER? SO, SO IT TAKES A BEAUTIFICATION QUESTION OUT OF IT, DOESN'T IT?
SO ACTUALLY YOUR CODE PERMITS 200 FEET, UM, 180 IS WHAT WE THINK IS PERMITTED OR APPROPRIATE FOR THIS AREA.
UM, THERE'S SOME RATHER LARGE TREES BY THERE.
SO FROM THE GROUND YOU PROBABLY WON'T SEE A TON.
I KNOW THERE'S A, A WALKING PATH SORT OF NEARBY.
UM, IF YOU, OBVIOUSLY IF YOU'RE RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET FROM IT, YOU'LL BE ABLE TO SEE IT.
UM, BUT FROM THE HIGHWAY AND FROM THE BLOCKING PATHS, YOU GENERALLY WON'T BE ABLE TO SEE IT BECAUSE OF THE TREE COVERAGE THAT WE WON'T BE TOUCHING, WE'LL BE RIGHT ALONG THE EDGE OF THE TREES.
SO FROM THAT SIDE, FROM THE RIVER SIDE, YOU REALLY WON'T BE ABLE TO SEE IT.
AND THEN, UM, YOU KNOW, FROM THE HIGHWAY, MAYBE BE ABLE TO SEE THE VERY TOP OF IT.
SIMILAR TO SOME OTHER LIKE LARGE.
THAT'S THE WORST THING THEY SEE ON 4 22 THAT WE'RE ALL HAPPY
DID A LOT WORSE THINGS HAPPENING ON 4 22.
NOW THE NEXT QUESTION IS, IS OUR STORE RATES GONNA COME DOWN THAT ASK THAT QUESTION.
HEY, I MEAN, WITH THIS DEAL THEY MIGHT, WHO KNOWS? YEAH, I KNOW YOU CAN'T ANSWER THAT.
THE, THE UH, ANTENNA THAT IS CURRENTLY THERE IS REPLACING THIS ONE'S REPLACING.
IS THAT GONNA BE TORN DOWN? WE DON'T HAVE, WE DON'T OWN THAT PROPERTY, SO I CAN'T NECESSARILY SPEAK TO WHAT THAT OWNER'S INTENTION IS.
UM, THOSE ARE ON ON ANOTHER BUILDING.
YOU DON'T OWN THAT TOWER? NO, NO, THAT AND, AND I, THAT'S WHY I KEPT SAYING TOWER.
'CAUSE IT'S ON THE TOP OF A BUILDING AND THAT BUILDING IS TO BE CANDIDLY FALLING DOWN.
UM, IT'S, IT'S RATHER DILAPIDATED.
SO THE PEOPLE THAT MAINTENANCE THAT FOR T-MOBILE, WHO WE ARE IN CONTACT WITH, UM, DON'T LIKE TO SEND THEIR MAINTENANCE STAFF OUT THERE BECAUSE THEY'RE WORRIED FOR THEIR SAFETY, WHICH IS WHY WE'VE BEEN IN CON LIKE IN CONTACT WITH THEM ABOUT, IT WOULD BE NICE IF YOU GUYS KNEW THAT THAT ONE WAS GONNA BE, YOU KNOW, WHAT WAS GOING TO HAPPEN WITH THAT.
I HATE TO SEE IT JUST SITTING THERE, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, I THINK NOT IF IT'S NOT USED.
I I'M NOT SAYING IT'S YOUR RESPONSIBILITY, BUT IT NICE YOU WOULD'VE KNOWN THAT COMING HERE SAYING, HEY, WE'VE TALKED TO THESE PEOPLE THAT'S GONNA BE TORN DOWN OR ELIMINATED OR WHAT OR REUSED OR SOMETHING.
I, YEAH, I THINK I JUST HATE TO SEE IT SITTING THERE, BUT WITHOUT BEING USED.
YEAH, WE CAN MAYBE GET SOME MORE INFORMATION ABOUT THAT.
I, I DO THINK AN ADAPTED REUSE WAS HOPEFULLY IN THE CONVERSATION, BUT IT, IT'S IN RATHER POOR CONDITION, WHICH IS WHY, YOU KNOW, WE ARE SEEING WELL THAT'S JUST ANOTHER REASON TO GET RID OF IT, RIGHT? BECAUSE CERTAINLY DON'T WANT TO FOLLOW ANYBODY.
AND THEN EVERYBODY IN THAT AREA WOULD BE LOSING, UM, SERVICE IF YOU HAVE T-MOBILE OR VERIZON.
WE'VE ALSO, YOU, YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN PUSHING AND PART OF THE COMP PLAN TALKS ABOUT THE COMMUNITY REGIONAL SHOPPING CENTER AND REWRITE THAT.
SO, YOU KNOW, HOPEFULLY MULTI-PRONGED ATTACK WILL GET THEM TO WORK ON THAT BUILDING.
ARE YOU WHERE THAT'S AT JEFF SPECIFICALLY? WE, I TALKED TO THE PROPERTY OWNER AND THEY'RE KIND OF HAVING IT HAWING ABOUT IT BECAUSE THEY LIKE TO BE ABLE TO JUST DO WHATEVER THEY WANT TO DOWN THERE AND PUTTING ANY MORE RESTRICTIONS ON IT OR FORCING THEM TO IMPROVE THINGS I UNDERSTAND ISN'T QUITE IN THEIR RIGHT.
BUT, UM, I, I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN STILL MOVE FORWARD ONCE WE GET PAST THE, YOU KNOW, THESE COMP PLAN ISSUES.
UNDERSTAND I SAID IT'S NOT YOUR ISSUE GUYS.
UM, AND I UNDERSTAND CORRECTLY THE REASON YOU NEED A CONDITIONAL USE IS BECAUSE OF THE HEIGHT IN THIS DISTRICT? NO, NO.
SO IT, IT'S A LITTLE CONFUSING.
SO SPECIFICALLY YOUR CODE FOR M TWO IS THE SECTION IS 305 5 9
[00:10:02]
I, WHICH IS PERMITTED USES AND ALLOWS FOR COMMUNICATION FACILITIES.HOWEVER, THAT IS SUBJECT TO 300 DASH 24 E, WHICH IS SPECIFIC TO TOWER FACILITIES, WHICH REQUIRES A CONDITIONAL USE.
AND THAT, UM, SU AND WITHIN THAT SECTION IT SUPERSEDES OTHER SECTIONS.
YEAH, IT'S A LITTLE, IT'S A, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO KINDA GET THIS WAY, BUT NO, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE DRAFT, I THINK YOUR BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WANTED THIS TO BE A PERMITTED USE, BUT IT, UM, YOU KNOW, SUBJECT TO OTHER CONDITIONS.
THE OTHER THING THAT OCCURRED TO ME, YOU WERE, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE LOOK OF IT, UM, I'VE SEEN SOME TOWERS THAT HAVE KIND OF WHAT LOOK LIKE FAKE TREE BRANCHES ON THEM.
WOULD THIS BE THAT KIND OF TOWER OR IS THAT, SO THAT'S CALLED STEALTH TECHNOLOGY.
UM, I DON'T BELIEVE THAT THIS IS CONTEMPLATED RIGHT NOW.
I THINK MY CLIENT WOULD BE OPEN TO THAT CONVERSATION.
UM, I DON'T, I GO, WE GO BOTH.
SOMETIMES I THINK THE STEALTH TECHNOLOGY LOOKS REALLY BAD, HONESTLY.
AND THEN SOMETIMES I THINK IT'S OKAY.
UM, I, I DON'T THINK IT'S CONTEMPLATED, BUT I KNOW THAT MY CLIENT WOULD BE OPEN TO, UH, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER YOU GUYS THINK IS PROPER.
YOU GUYS HAVE SEEN THOSE? YEAH, THE ONE I AGREE SOMETIMES THEY DON'T.
YEAH, THEY DON'T LOOK VERY GOOD THOUGH.
I, I JUST THOUGHT I WOULD ASK.
SO YEAH, IT'S KIND OF A GOLD MAKING A JOKE OUT IT.
AND THEN, UM, THERE IS A CONTEMPLATED EQUIPMENT CENTER ON THE GROUND THAT WILL BE SURROUNDED BY EIGHT FOOT FENCE.
UM, AND AGAIN, WE'RE, WE'RE OPEN TO ANY TYPE OF BEAUTIFICATION OF THAT FENCE AS WELL.
DO, UH, DO THESE TYPES OF TOWERS REQUIRE ANY KIND OF REGULAR MAINTENANCE? LIKE ARE THERE VEHICLES COMING AND GOING AND THAT KIND OF THING? YEAH, SO IT'S SEMI-REGULAR.
UM, THEY ARE, THEY'RE I GUESS, MONITORED REMOTELY.
AND THEN IF AS NEEDED THEY GO.
AND THEN I WOULD SAY MAYBE MONTHLY SOMEBODY CAN GO WITH THE, UM, EQUIPMENT ON THE GROUND IS NOT SUITABLE FOR HUMAN OCCUPATION.
IT'S A BUILDING FOR MAINTENANCE PURPOSES ONLY.
UM, AND MAINTENANCE PROFESSIONALS WOULD BE ABLE TO COME IN PRETTY EASILY OFF OF, UM, STATION F MM-HMM
SO THERE'S NOT MULTIPLE, YOU'RE NOT GONNA PUTTING MULTIPLE TILE TOWERS THERE AT SOME POINT? OH NO, JUST ONE.
WE'RE HOPING TO DO SOME OTHER PLACES, BUT YEAH, JUST HERE ONE AND DONE.
I'M LOOKING THROUGH APPLICATION.
YEAH, THAT CONFUSED ME A LITTLE BIT.
IF THIS WAS LIKE, YOU'LL GO, YOU COME BACK SIX MONTHS FROM NOW AND SAY WE WANNA PUT UP ANOTHER TOWER.
SO THE ONE TOWER YOU CAN HAVE MULTIPLE CARRIERS ON IT.
UM, YOU KNOW, THE BUSINESS IS GETTING MORE THAN ONE, YOU KNOW, MAKES IT MORE WORTH IT MONEY, MONEY WISE.
UM, BUT YEAH, SO WE WOULDN'T NEED ANOTHER ONE IN THIS AREA FOR MOST CARRIERS.
I THINK WE CAN HAVE UP TO, YOU CAN FIT FOUR CARRIERS.
FOUR CARRIERS, WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, THE FOUR MAIN CARRIER.
I JUST WANTED TO DO WHAT THE TOWERS, THAT'S YOUR NAME.
JEN OR, OR ANTHONY, YOU GUYS HAVE ANYTHING YOU WANT TO THROW OUT THERE? ANY TRAFFIC PROBLEMS, SEE AREA HAPPENING? YOU WANNA REROUTE ANYBODY OR NOTHING ON MY BUILD A BRIDGE OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT? NAH, I THINK WE'RE ALRIGHT.
HOW ABOUT THE SOAR WATER? UH, ANY PROBLEM THAT
UM, AS FAR AS THAT, IT ALL GOES.
THERE'S AN EXISTING CURB DEPRESSION OUT ON STATION AVENUE.
IS THIS DRIVEWAY GONNA BE USING THAT? DO YOU KNOW? IT'S NOT.
THERE'LL BE A NEW CURB COMING IN THERE.
THAT'LL JUST TAKE COORDINATION, PROPERTY LINES LINED UP WITH THE EXISTING FENCING AND EVERYTHING.
UM, IN MY MIND, THE SITE, HOWEVER, IS IN THE FEMA FLOOD LANE.
SO, UM, I HAD WRITTEN A DRAFT LETTER AND YEAH, YOU MIGHT GET A REVISED SKETCH.
WELL, THAT WAS, I HAD APPROACHED THE, UH, THEIR, THE MAIN ATTORNEY, UM, MARK, MARK, MIKE, MIKE.
UM, AND I HAD MENTIONED IT TO HIM THAT WE HAVE THIS, THAT THE ENGINEER LOOKED AT IT, THAT THERE WAS A FLOODPLAIN.
THEY LOOKED AT MOVING IT TO SOMEWHERE THAT WAS NOT IN THE FLOODPLAIN.
I WASN'T SURE WHERE THAT WAS WHEN WE WERE TALKING.
TURNS OUT THERE REALLY ISN'T ANYWHERE THAT'S IN THE FLOODPLAIN.
SO THEY'RE FULLY AWARE THAT THEY NEED TO GET A VARIANCE FROM THE, FROM THE ZONING HEARING BOARD AND THEY'LL MAKE THAT APPLICATION AFTER THEY GET THROUGH THE CONDITIONAL USE PROCESS.
AND I THINK ZACH AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT CONDITIONING THE CONDITIONAL USE APPROVAL.
IF THE BOARD SO GRANTS IT WITH THAT IN MIND.
YEAH, THESE WOULD BE TWO SEPARATE APPROVALS.
UH, THERE'S REALLY NO SPECIFIC REQUIREMENT THAT YOU GO FOR ONE OR THE OTHER.
UM, YOU KNOW, YOU JUST, IF IF THEY GET THE CONDITIONAL USE APPROVAL, THEN THEY WOULD JUST CONDITION IT ON THE VARIANCE RELIEF.
IF THEY DIDN'T GET THE VARIANCE RELIEF, THEN THEY WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THE PROJECT.
[00:15:01]
I MEAN, I'LL JUST NOTE CELL PHONE TOWERS HAVE THEIR OWN COMPLETE SEPARATE STATUTORY REGULATORY THING WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.UM, IN TERMS OF WHERE YOU CAN PLACE THEM KIND OF LEEWAY THAT YOU NEED TO GIVE FOR THEM.
UM, THE IDEA IS THAT YOU DON'T WANT TO HAVE ONE MUNICIPALITY NECESSARILY PREVENTING THE IMPLEMENTATION OF A NATIONWIDE SELF NETWORK.
SO, UM, WITH THAT BEING SAID, ARE YOU GUYS FILLING A, A GAP IN SERVICE THAT EXISTS OR IS THIS JUST LIKE A REPLACEMENT QUID FOR, OR ONE FOR ONE? SO STAND UP.
I WORK FOR EDGE FIBER AND WIRELESS DEVELOPMENT.
UM, WE ARE A, UH, THIRD PARTY THAT WORKS WITH RISE UP ON, UH, MOST OF THEIR DESIGNS.
UM, UH, I'M SORRY, WHAT WAS YOUR QUESTION? JUST, IS THIS FILLING A GAP IN SERVICE THAT YOU'VE IDENTIFIED OR JUST REPLACING AN EXISTING FACILITY? THIS IS IN REPLACEMENT OF THE FACILITY THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ON THE ROOFTOP.
HOWEVER, BEING SITUATED AT A HIGHER ELEVATION, THE 180 FEET, WE EXPECT BETTER COVERAGE AS A RESULT OF THAT.
SO IT'LL BE AN IMPROVEMENT ON COVERAGE AS WELL AS REPLACING WHAT IS GONNA BE LOST FROM.
AND IS THE, IS THE EXISTING ANTENNA ON, IS THAT ON THE WATER TOWER THAT'S DOWN THERE OR IT, IT'S ON A BUILDING.
WAS THERE ANY EFFORT TO, TO LOOK INTO PUTTING SOMETHING ON THE WATER TOWER? I ASSUME THAT WAS EXPLORED THE WATER TOWER? I, I DON'T BELIEVE SO.
I'M, I'M NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT SURE.
I KNOW THAT T-MOBILE ALWAYS TRIES TO REUSE THEIR, I'M SAYING T-MOBILE 'CAUSE THAT'S OUR ANCHOR CARRIER, UM, ALWAYS TRIES TO REUSE WHAT THEY ALREADY HAVE.
IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S MORE EXPENSIVE TO BUILD A NEW TOWER OF COURSE.
UM, SO I KNOW THAT THEY WERE LOOKING AT OTHER LOCATIONS IN THIS GENERAL AREA, BUT THERE IS A LOT OF ACTIVITY BECAUSE OF ALL THE COMMERCIAL USES IN HERE.
SO THERE, UM, I DON'T, I CAN'T SPEAK TO WHAT T-MOBILE DID.
I KNOW THAT RISE UP WAS REACTING ESSENTIALLY TO WHAT T-MOBILE'S NEEDS WERE.
UM, AND THIS LOCATION WAS IDEAL AND I DON'T KNOW HOW HIGH THE, THE YEAH, THAT'S GONNA BE MY, MY NEXT QUESTION.
WHAT, WHAT OF THAT WATER TOWER? DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA? I HAVE NO IDEA.
I, I'M NOT SURE ABOUT THE WATER.
I KNOW IT'S NOT A HUNDRED, IT'S NOT 180, IT'S NOT PART OF YOUR PROJECT, BUT I'M CURIOUS.
I DON'T THINK IT'S EVEN, I THINK IT'S LESS THAN ONE 20.
'CAUSE I DROVE BY THERE AND TO ME IT, AND SO IN, IN TERMS OF COVERAGE, UM, YOU KNOW, ESSENTIALLY ONE 50 AND UP IS HOW YOU GET A LOT OF, YOU DON'T NEED AS MANY TOWERS.
UM, IF YOU CAN GO A LITTLE BIT HIGHER.
AND, AND IS THIS TOWER GONNA BE OPEN FOR OTHER CARRIERS BEYOND T-MOBILE? LIKE CAN VERIZON, AT AND T CAN THEY ALL COME IN AND PUT THEIR, THEIR MISSION, THEIR, UM, EQUIPMENT UP ON TOP OF THE TOWER? OBJECTION FOUR.
SO WE CAN HAVE FOUR CARRIERS ON THE FOUR SIDES OF THE, THE STRUCTURE ESSENTIALLY.
SO THEY'LL BE AT DIFFERENT ELEVATIONS ON THE STRUCTURE.
SO ONE CARRIER WILL BE AT THE TOP 10 FEET BELOW THEM, ANOTHER CARRIER, AND THEN THEY'LL ALL POINT IN EVERY DIRECTION.
SO THEY HAVE COVERAGE IN 360 DEGREES.
A QUESTION, WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU BRING IN ADDITIONAL CARRIERS, THEN DO THEY NEED, UH, MORE REAL ESTATE ON THE GROUND TO HOUSE THEIR EQUIPMENT? SO, UH, DO YOU FORESEE THE FOOTPRINT OF THIS THING GROWING? SO NO.
UM, ON THE SECOND PLAN THAT YOU HAD UP EARLIER, UM, THAT IT, IT CONTEMPLATES ADDITIONAL PROPOSED, UH, EQUIPMENT ON THE, ON THE GROUND.
SO, UM, YOU CAN SEE EXISTING, OR SORRY, EXCUSE ME, WHERE, SO PROPOSED T-MOBILE
SO WE, WE HAVE THE PROPOSED COMPOUND SHOWN THERE.
IT'S 70 BY 24 FOR THE FULL OVERALL AREA.
HOWEVER, EACH INDIVIDUAL CARRIER IS ONLY GONNA TAKE UP LIKE A 10 BY 20 AREA ROUGHLY.
AND THAT'S FOR THEIR EQUIPMENT CABINETS.
THINK OF TWO OR THREE REFRIGERATOR SIZE CABINETS AND THAT'S WHERE ALL OF THE GROUND EQUIPMENT IS MOUNTED.
AND THEN THEY'LL ALL HAVE THEIR ANTENNAS UP ON TOP OF THE TOWER.
SO WE WON'T NEED TO GO BEYOND WHAT WE'RE FENCING, WE'RE FENCING IN ANTICIPATION OF HOPEFULLY HAVING MORE CARRY.
IS THAT LAND JEFF OWNED BY AUDUBON OR IS THAT OWNED BY THAT'S OWNED BY THE SEWER AUTHORITY.
IT IS THE, SO OH, AONS NOT FAULT.
NO, THEY, UH, I I CAN PULL UP A PARCEL MAP, BUT GENERALLY THERE'S A PARCEL STATION OR YEAH.
STATION AVENUE TO THE LOWER RIGHT, LOWER LEFT IS, IS JUST THE SEWER AUTHORITY.
THE, THE DEED SHOWS IT AS BEING THE, UH, THE AUTHORITY OPPOSED THE PROPERTY.
MONTGOMERY COUNTY AUTHORITY OWNS THE PROPERTY.
UH, ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR THESE FOLKS? SO I'LL TAKE ANY PROPOSAL FOR A, UH, APPROVAL OR A DENIAL TO, UH, AS A, UH, AS A, UH, RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISORS.
ANYBODY WANT TO DO THAT? UH, FEEL FREE.
[00:20:01]
UM, I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT IT, UH, MOVE FORWARD, UH, TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS RECOMMENDED FOR APPROVAL.JERRY'S MADE A, A MOTION TO APPROVE, UH, RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISORS FOR THIS NEW SUPERSIZED, UH, ANTENNA.
CAN I JUST CLARIFY, THE RECOMMENDATION IS TO RECOMMEND THE APPROVAL OF THE APPLICATION, RIGHT? CORRECT.
YOU KNOW, WHATEVER, WHATEVER
I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT WAS CLEAR.
WE'LL DO HOWEVER, WORD IT HOWEVER YOU THINK IT NEEDS TO BE.
YOU GUYS CAN EITHER SUPPORT THE APPLICATION, OPPOSE THE APPLICANT, YOU KNOW, RECOMMENDED A DENIAL, OR YOU CAN JUST STAY NEUTRAL.
SO WE ARE RECOMMENDING A, WE'RE RECOMMENDING A, UM, RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL.
RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL TO THE SUPERVISOR.
IS THAT THE RIGHT TERMINOLOGY? YES.
IF THAT'S, IF THAT'S THE MOTION YOU INTEND TO MAKE.
YES, THAT, IS THAT THE MOTION YOU INTEND TO MAKE? DO I HAVE A SECOND ON THAT MOTION THAT WE INTEND TO MAKE? I'LL SECOND THAT WE HAVE TWO SECONDS.
ALL IN FAVOR? SOUNDS LIKE WE HAVEN'T MADE.
I HAVE T-MOBILE, SO I EXPECT BETTER SERVICE.
[GENERAL DISCUSSION ITEMS]
SIT THERE.SO WE'RE MOVING DOWN TO THIS MAP, RIGHT? WELL, WE'RE GONNA, ANTHONY'S GONNA TALK ABOUT THE, UH, THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP.
WHICH YOU HAVE EIGHT AND A HALF BY 11.
SO IT'S NOT GONNA BE LONG FOR ME TONIGHT UNLESS YOU HAVE QUESTIONS THAT'LL DICTATE OTHERWISE.
BUT, UM, THERE'S BEEN NO, IF YOU RECALL, WE, THE LAST TIME WE DISCUSSED THE RIGHT WAY MAP, WE HAD MADE SOME REVISIONS.
WE HAD TALKED ABOUT, UM, CERTAIN, UM, CERTAIN ROADWAYS BEING RECLASSIFIED UNDER THE RECOMMENDED, RECOMMENDED CHANGE TO THE RIGHT WAY MAP.
THERE'S FROM THE, I APOLOGIES FOR THE EIGHT AND A HALF BY 11 AS WELL.
IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE IN THE OFFICE, BUT MY SCHEDULE GOT A LITTLE FURTHER AROUND.
SO IT'S HOME PRINT EIGHT BY 11.
BUT SINCE THE LAST MEETING, THERE'S BEEN NO CHANGE ON, ON THE MAP THAT'S IN FRONT OF YOU TODAY FROM THE ONE THAT WAS PREVIOUSLY DISCUSSED.
THE DATE AS YOU CAN SEE IS THERE'S BEEN NOTHING CHANGED.
UM, SO THERE WERE A FEW ROADWAYS THAT WE TALKED ABOUT RECLASSIFYING.
UM, I THINK WE HAD COME TO AN AGREEMENT, OR AT LEAST THE, YOU ALL DIDN'T HAVE ANY OBJECTIONS TO THE RECLASSIFICATIONS THAT WE DISCUSSED.
THERE WAS, JUST TO GO OVER 'EM AGAIN, THE CHANGES WERE RIDGE PIKE IN THE UPPER LEFT, THE UPPER LEFT HAND CORNER OF THE MAP, UM, BEING CHANGED FROM A COLLECTOR, WHICH IS AN 80 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY REQUIREMENTS TO AN ARTERIAL HUNDRED FOOT RIGHT OF WAY REQUIREMENT.
UM, YEAGER ROAD, UH, WAS BEING CHANGED FROM RESIDENTIAL VILLAGE, UH, DESIGNATION, WHICH WAS REALLY JUST A, A CARRYOVER DESCRIPTION FROM THE 2010 COMP PLAN.
SO THE MAP WAS OKAY, BUT THERE WAS A DISCREPANCY IN THE COMP PLAN TECH.
SO IT, IT'S REALLY JUST KIND OF BRINGING BOTH WORLDS TOGETHER UNDER THE REVISED COMP PLAN AND THE MAP.
UM, IN TERMS OF YEAGER ROAD, THE SECOND CHANGE TO THE MAP, THE, THE REAL CHANGE TO THE MAP WAS ROUTE ONE 13, WHICH IS KIND OF IN THE, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY THE CENTER OF THE MAP KIND OF SPLITS THE MAP FROM LEFT TO RIGHT, UM, THAT WAS BEING RECOMMENDED TO CHANGE FROM A COLLECTOR TO AN ARTERIAL.
SO AN 80 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY TO A HUNDRED FOOT RIGHT OF WAY.
UM, THE OTHER CHANGE EGYPT ROAD AT THE LOWER RIGHT HANDS, UH, PORTION OF THE MAP BEING RECOMMENDED TO CHANGE FROM A COLLECTOR, WHICH IS AN 80 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY TO AN ARTERIAL HUNDRED FOOT.
UH, THEN WE HAD BLACKROCK ROAD, WHICH IS KIND OF IN THE LOWER RIGHT CENTER OF THE MAP BEING CHANGED FROM COLLECTOR 80 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY TO ARTERIAL.
WE HAD CIDER MILL ROAD BEING CHANGED, WHICH IS, THAT'S AT THE, I GUESS IT WOULD BE THE SOUTHEAST CORNER OF THE MAP, UM, BEING RECOMMENDED TO CHANGE FROM A FEEDER, WHICH IS A 60 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY TO A COLLECTOR, 80 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY.
AND THEN WE HAD MENNONITE ROAD, UH, WHICH IS KIND OF IN THE, UH, CENTER PORTION OF THE MAP, UM, BEING CHANGED FROM A FEEDER 60 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY TO A COLLECTOR, 80 FOOT RIGHT OF AWAY.
SO THAT'S ALL REFLECTED ON THE MAP THAT YOU HAD IN FRONT OF YOU.
UM, WE HAD DISCUSSED THAT AT THE LAST MEETING.
SO AGAIN, NO CHANGES PROPOSED FROM WHAT YOU HAD SEEN BEFORE.
UM, AND, UM, JEFF AND I HAD DISCUSSED, AND I LOOKED THROUGH BEFORE TONIGHT AS TO WHETHER THERE WOULD BE ANY CHANGES REQUIRED IN THE ALDO LANGUAGE AS A RESULT OF ANY CHANGES THAT WE WOULD RECOMMEND TO THE MAP.
AND ALL THE, THERE'S NO SPECIFIC, UM, UH, CLASSIFICATION DESCRIBED IN THE TEXT IN THE SDO ASSOCIATED WITH ANY ROAD.
[00:25:01]
IT'S ALL JUST REFLECTIVE OF THE MAP AND THE LANGUAGES YOU READ THROUGH SDO.SO IT ALL POINTS BACK TO THIS MAP.
SO THERE DOESN'T APPEAR TO BE ANY RESIDUAL CHANGES NECESSARY TO THE SDO OR THE ZONING, UM, AS A RESULT OF ANY CHANGES WE WOULD MAKE TO THE RIGHT WING MAP.
UM, SO THAT'S THE SUMMARY OF THE ROADS THAT WERE CHANGED.
AGAIN, AS WE HAD DISCUSSED THAT AT THE LAST MEETING AND THE MAP IN FRONT OF YOU REFLECTS ALL THOSE CHANGES.
UM, IT WOULD BE, IF, IF THERE AREN'T ANY OBJECTIONS OR CHANGES DISCUSSED TONIGHT WOULD BE THE MAP THAT WE'D RECOMMEND TO MOVE FORWARD FOR CHANGE.
I GUESS WE CAN TAKE A, A LITTLE BIT STEP TO THE SIDE IF, IF ZACH, IF YOU WOULDN'T MIND EXPLAINING THE PROCESS TO READOPT THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP AND THE OFFICIAL MAP, JUST SO WE'RE CLEAR OF WHAT THE EXPECTATIONS ARE ON THE PROCESS.
SO THE MPC REQUIRES THAT THE TOWNSHIP ADOPT AN OFFICIAL MAP, WHICH IS ESSENTIALLY A, UH, A DEPICTION OF THE INTENTIONS UNDER THE COMP PLAN.
UM, ONCE THAT GETS, ONCE THAT GETS KIND OF DRAFTED AND PREPARED, IT COMES TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
YOU GUYS HAVE 30 DAYS TO MAKE A DECISION, UM, AND OR 45 DAYS, SORRY, I'M LOOKING AT THE WRONG NUMBER.
YOU HAVE 45 DAYS TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.
UM, IF YOU DON'T, THEN THE BOARD OF CAN PROCEED WITH ADOPTING THE, THE MAP WITHOUT YOUR GUIDANCE.
OBVIOUSLY GUYS HAVE BEEN CONSIDERING THIS FOR A LOT MORE THAN 45 DAYS.
BUT, UM, AT THIS POINT, UH, A RECOMMENDATION FOR APPROVAL WOULD JUST MEAN THAT THIS WOULD PROGRESS TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS FOR ADOPTION.
YEAH, THAT'S THE OFFICIAL MAP.
THIS IS THIS, THIS IS THE ULTIMATE RIGHT OF WAY, THE ULTIMATE RIGHT OF WAY MAP IS THIS IS PART OF THE OFFICIAL MAP.
THE OFFICIAL MAP INCLUDES THE MAP OF ALL THE PUBLIC ROADS IN THE TOWNSHIP, PUBLIC PARKS, DIFFERENT ASPECTS OF THE COMP PLAN THAT ARE MAPPED OUT AND FORMALLY SET DOWN.
SO EVENTUALLY THEY'RE GONNA BE, THEY'RE GONNA BE MIRRORED TO EACH OTHER, RIGHT? RIGHT AWAY.
NO, THE INFORMATION IS NOT EXACTLY THE SAME.
BUT THEY WILL, THE, THE PROCESS TO ADOPT 'EM WILL BE EXACTLY THE SAME.
SO THEY WILL BE TWO SEPARATE MAPS.
I WAS GONNA SAY, SO, SO ARE WE GONNA APPROVE THE ULTIMATE RIGHT OF WAY AS A SEPARATE ENTITY? YES.
THAT BECOMES ITS OWN, THAT'S ITS OWN MAP.
AND, AND THAT THEN ALSO FOLDS INTO THE OFFICIAL MAP.
THIS IS ULTIMATELY COMPASS, ULTIMATELY THE QUOTE UNQUOTE OFFICIAL MAP.
IT IS CITED SEPARATELY IN THE ALDO, WHICH CITES THE ULTIMATE RIGHT OF WAY MAP.
IT HAS A REFERENCE TO SAYING, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE DEVELOPING ON THIS TYPE OF ROAD, YOU HAVE TO DEVELOP TO THIS STANDARD.
THOSE ROADS ARE DEFINED ON THE OFFICIAL RIGHT OF WAY MAP ON FILE AT THE TOWNSHIP, WHICH RIGHT NOW IS FROM 1997.
UM, SO WE, SO WE SHOULD APPROVE, LOOK AT APPROVING THIS ULTIMATE RIGHT OF WAY AS, AS A SEPARATE ENTITY, WHICH FOLDS IN, I THINK YOU CAN MAKE ONE RECOMMENDATION FOR BOTH AT THE END OF THE DAY.
AS LONG AS YOU MAKE A RECOMMENDATION, UM, I DON'T THINK IT MATTERS WHETHER THEY'RE FOLDED TOGETHER.
AND REALLY IT ESSENTIALLY MEANS WE HAVE TO HAVE, WE'LL HAVE A HEARING AT THIS, AT THE SUPERVISOR LEVEL.
LIKE, LIKE NO, NO, I UNDERSTAND.
LIKE THIS IS OUR REC THIS IS AS A PLANNING COMMISSION.
WE ARE, WE ARE RECOMMENDING TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS THAT THIS BE THE ULTIMATE RIGHT WAY AND ULTIMATELY BE THE OFFICIAL MAN.
BE PART OF THE OFFICIAL MAP, RIGHT? AS PART OF THE OFFICIAL MAP.
WELL, WHAT WE LOOK AT THE OFFICIAL MAP AND THEN WE CAN DO ONE RECOMMENDATION BOOK.
THE LARGE PRINTED MAP THAT YOU HAVE WROTE THERE IS, IS THE LATEST DRAFT OF THE OFFICIAL MAP.
AND I HAVE A FEW CHANGES, A FEW TWEAKS I MIGHT WANNA MAKE.
UM, JUST IN TERMS OF GRAPHICS, I'M HOPING IT READS OKAY.
BUT GENERALLY WHAT THE MAP, WHAT WE'VE DONE WITH THE MAP IS WE'VE TAKEN A LOT OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS WE NEED FROM THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, WHICH SHOWS AREAS OF PRESERVATION, AND THAT'S THE AREAS IN YELLOW.
UM, SO WE'VE DONE, WE, WE'VE DONE OPEN SPACE TO POTENTIALLY PRESERVE THAT REALLY JUST IDENTIFIES PARCELS.
AND IN THIS CASE IT'S JUST ABOUT EVERY PARCEL IN ATTACHED THAT'S OVER 10 ACRES THAT IF THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY TO PRESERVE IT IN SOME SENSE, WHETHER IN FEE OR IN TOTAL OR BUYING DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS, WHATEVER THAT MAY BE, IT IDENTIFIES ON THE, ON THE MAP FOR US.
SO IT'S OH, LIKE, LIKE A WISHLIST? YES.
ESSENTIALLY THIS IS A WISHLIST THAT COMES OUTTA THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
AND THEN WHAT IT ALSO SHOWS HERE, YOU'VE GOT THE CIRCLES THAT HAVE THE NUMBERS IN THEM ONE THROUGH 12, ONE THROUGH 14, I THINK.
AND THAT IDENTIFIES THE DIFFERENT TRAFFIC PROJECTS THAT, UM, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THAT WE'RE CURRENTLY WORKING ON THAT.
UM, THEIR WISHLIST ITEMS, YOU KNOW, IT GOES THROUGH EVERYTHING FROM HERE, FROM INCREASING
[00:30:01]
THE, THE OFFSET INTERSECTION AT LEWIS AND VAUGHN TO, UM, OVER HERE ON NUMBER 10, THE MENNONITE ROAD, BRINGING THAT UP TO, UH, THE, THE COMPLETE STREET STANDARD.UM, THEY'RE ALL LISTED UP HERE IN THIS CHART.
YOU KNOW, ESSENTIALLY THE, THE LABEL NUMBER, WHAT GENERALLY THE PROJECT TYPE IS AND WHAT THE DESCRIPTION IS.
ANTHONY PROVIDED ME ALL THIS INFORMATION AND A COUPLE SEPARATE ONES.
I SORT OF CONSOLIDATED IT ALL DOWN TO ONE, UM, PLAN, UM, ONE LIST.
SO AGAIN, THERE'S A FEW THINGS I WANNA TWEAK THAT, THAT MIGHT MAKE IT A LITTLE BIT MORE READABLE JUST IN TERMS OF GRAPHICS.
BUT GENERALLY THIS IS THE CONTENT WE WANT TO HAVE HERE.
IT SHOWS THE EXISTING TOWNSHIP PARKLAND AND OPEN SPACE IN THE GREENS, THE, THE PARCELS WE, WE WOULD LIKE TO LOOK AT AND HOPEFULLY PRESERVE IN SOME SENSE IN THE YELLOWS AND THE FUTURE TRAFFIC PROJECTS IN, IN THE, THE NUMBER, YOU KNOW, BULLET POINTS.
UH, THE TRAFFIC PRO, THE ROAD PROJECT.
THESE WERE JUST WHAT, LIKE THE HIGH PRIORITY ONES WEREN'T, WASN'T THE LIST A LITTLE BIT LONGER MAYBE? YEAH, SO THOSE WERE, UM, WHAT WAS DESCRIBED AS YOUR HIGHER PRIORITY CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROJECTS.
AND THEY WERE ALL DESCRIBED IN THE COMP PLAN, I GUESS THAT WAS ADOPTED AS WELL.
SO IT WAS BASICALLY TAKING THE CAPITAL PROJECTS THAT HAD BEEN DISCUSSED AT TOWNSHIP AND STAFF LEVEL THROUGH THE YEARS THAT HAVE KIND OF SURFACED TO THE TOP, UH, ACT 2 0 9 IMPROVEMENTS, THAT SORT OF THING.
AND, AND ROLLED THEM INTO THE OFFICIAL MAP SO THAT IT'S, IT'S OUT THERE.
PEOPLE UNDERSTAND AS THINGS BE DEVELOPED THERE, HERE'S THE PROJECT, HERE'S WHERE THEY'RE LOCATED.
AND ALSO, UM, AS JEFF MENTIONED, IF YOU LOOK AT THE OUTLINE, UH, JEFF NOTED HIM AS COMPLETE STREETS.
IF I CAN MAKE A RECOMMENDATION, JUST CALL 'EM ACTIVE TRANSPORTATION.
THAT'S I THINK WHAT I CALLED THAT.
UM, I DON'T THINK THAT, THAT DIDN'T MAKE IT OVER THERE, BUT, UM, IN THE, IN THE LIST IT JUST TALKS ABOUT IMPROVEMENTS.
YOU SEE, I SEE NUMBER FIVE THERE.
JEFF, YOU HAVE SECOND AVENUE ROUNDABOUT AND BRIDE.
WHAT WERE YOU THINKING ABOUT? I THINK THAT'S A TYPO.
I I DIDN'T KNOW IF YOU THINKING ABOUT SOMETHING SPECIFIC, I GET RID OF ONE AND GET, IF YOU'RE LOOKING FOR A NEW BRIDE, I THINK THAT'S A PERSONAL ISSUE.
I DON'T THINK, WELL, THAT'S WHY WHAT WERE THINKING ABOUT, UM, I THINK JEFF MARRY THE BRIDGE TOGETHER, SO, YEAH.
THIS WAS A COPY AND PASTE, SO I'LL CHECK ANTHONY'S TYPING.
SO, BUT YEAH, IT ALSO INCLUDED, MY, MY POINT WAS NOT TO CRITICIZE JEFF OBVIOUSLY, BUT JUST TO KIND OF POINT OUT THAT THOSE, WHAT HE HAS LISTED ON THE LIST ALSO INCLUDE THE COMPLETE STREETS WERE, UH, PROJECTS THAT WERE IN THE ADOPTED ACTIVE TRANSPORTATION PLAN, WHICH WERE LIKE TRAIL SIDEWALKS AND THAT SORT OF STUFF.
SO IT SHOWS THEM ALL VISUALLY ON THE MAP.
SO YEAH, EVERYONE KNOWS, I THINK A FEW OF THEM ARE LISTED MENNONITE ROAD, THE ROAD CROSSING, YOU SAID THAT WAS A TPI JUST, I GOT RID OF THAT, SOME OF THAT LANGUAGE JUST 'CAUSE IT WAS MORE CLEAR JUST TO SAY THE, THE PROJECT TYPE MM-HMM
AND WE CAN TALK AND, AND I CAN WORK THROUGH THE PROJECT TYPE IF I DON'T HAVE IT QUITE CORRECT.
WELL, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THIS ANTHONY, UM, IS WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THE, UH, THE VAUGHN AND, UH, LEWIS ROAD.
I MEAN, I SEE, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, THEY'RE MOVING A LOT OF DIRT AND MOVING THINGS AROUND, BUT I DON'T SEE ANY ROAD, UH, IS WHAT'S, WHAT'S THE TIMETABLE OR WHAT, WHAT'S THE PROCESS OF GETTING THE ROAD STARTED? WELL, AGAIN, I, SO I, UH, I DON'T KNOW THERE, SO THAT LAST, I KNOW THERE WAS A PRECON, I GUESS, MEETING THAT WAS HELD RIGHT WITH, UH, WITH THE PROJECT.
I KNOW THEY WERE MOVING DIRT AND STUFF LIKE THAT.
SO I THINK THEY'RE, THEY'RE GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS.
I'M NOT SURE WHEN THEY PLAN TO GET TO THE ROAD.
I, I DON'T KNOW THE EXACT DATE.
WE CAN CHECK WITH OUR INSPECTOR ON THAT AND WHAT THEIR TIMETABLE IS.
BUT GENERALLY RIGHT NOW THEY'RE, THEY'RE GONNA STORM WATER AND GETTING THAT WORKED OUT, THAT'S USUALLY THE FIRST STEP.
I THINK AS, I THINK IT WAS ALSO STRONGLY ENCOURAGED TO WAIT TO DO ANY ROAD CONSTRUCTION AS BEST AS POSSIBLE UNTIL AFTER SCHOOL WAS OUT.
SO, SO WE'RE HOPING THAT, THAT, OBVIOUSLY WE CAN'T CONTROL WHEN THEY DO IT.
ALL WE CAN DO IS SUGGEST, BUT I SUGGESTED THAT THEY, THEY PUSH THAT OFF TILL AT LEAST THE BEGINNING OF JUNE TO AT LEAST ALLEVIATE A LITTLE BIT OF THE ISSUE.
I MEAN, YOU SEE THEM MOVING ALL THIS DIRT, BUT YOU DON'T SEE ANY ACTIVITY.
IT'S A NICE LITTLE MOUNTAIN UP THERE, ISN'T IT? WHAT'S THAT? IT'S A NICE LITTLE MOUNTAIN.
WE CAN ALWAYS USE A LITTLE SHOVEL THAT IN OUR YARD IT LOOKS LIKE.
SO I WANNA POINT OUT THAT THE, THE LOWER THE INSET MAP DOWN TO THE LOWER LEFT ON THE PLANS THAT YOU HAVE, I WANTED TO INCLUDE NON UPPER PROVIDENCE OWNED OPEN SPACE IN THERE JUST TO GIVE A SENSE OF WHAT THE OTHER OPEN SPACE WAS.
AND SOME OF THE PARTIALS THAT ARE SHOWN IN YELLOW ARE REDUNDANT, ARE THE SAME AS THE PARTIAL SHOWN ON THE OTHER MAP.
I WANNA WORK WITH ZACH AND I'M NOT SURE THAT WE CAN REALLY PUT THIS ON THERE, BUT ONE THING I WOULD LIKE TO SAY ON THIS OFFICIAL MAP THAT IS IF OTHER CONTROLLED OPEN SPACE EVER BECOMES AVAILABLE TO BE DEVELOPED FOR WHATEVER REASON, ALLAH, THE, THE PARKHOUSE SITUATION THAT THE TOWNSHIP WOULD LOOK TO CONTROL THAT AS, AS OPEN, KEEP THAT AS OPEN SPACE AS BEST THEY COULD, HOWEVER THEY COULD.
SO I, I WANNA WORK ON A LITTLE BIT OF THAT LANGUAGE AND I, I'M SPRINGING THIS ON ZACH RIGHT NOW.
SO, UM, IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE, I KIND OF WANT TO THINK IF WE CAN PUT THAT ON THERE JUST TO,
[00:35:01]
I MEAN, LET'S SAY SCHOOL CLOSES DOWN, LET'S SAY THE SCHOOL DISTRICT CLOSES THEIR PROPERTY ON BECHTEL ROAD, YOU KNOW, INSTEAD OF LETTING THAT DEVELOP INTO 15, 20 TOWNHOUSES, IF IT'S ON OUR MAP OF SAYING, HEY, WE'D LIKE TO GET IT, THEN WE, WE, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A CHANCE THE TOWNSHIP COULD ACQUIRE IT IN SOME WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM.SO WHAT DESIRE, WHAT WOULD YOU, OTHER THAN, YOU KNOW, APPROVING THIS, WHAT, WHAT KIND OF RECOMMENDATIONS WILL WE MAKE TO THIS? I THINK YOU JUST MAKE A RECOMMENDATION THAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS ADOPT.
I'M TALKING ABOUT IN OUR DISCUSSIONS HERE, WHAT WOULD WE BE AGAINST OR FOR HERE, IF THERE'S ANYTHING THAT YOU SEE THAT YOU DON'T WANT TO INCLUDE IN TERMS OF ROADWAY PROJECTS OR IN TERMS OF, UM, OPEN SPACE THAT OR OTHER PARCELS THAT YOU WANT TO ADD CAN EVER GET THIS THING TO MOVE WHEN I WANTED TO, UM, YOU KNOW, THE, THE UC PARCELS THAT WE MAY HAVE MISSED.
SO, UM, WELL, I THINK ALL FOR OPEN SPACE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ALL FOR MORE OPEN SPACE.
UM, YOU KNOW, THE TRAIL NETWORK IS ALSO SHOWN ON HERE.
IT'S SHOWN IN THE, IN THE BLUE LINES.
WE ARE IN THE PROCESS OF PUTTING TOGETHER AN RFP FOR A WHOLE NEW TRAIL MASTER PLAN.
SO THAT WILL BE, UM, THAT WILL CHANGE THIS MAP AT THAT POINT IN TIME.
BUT IF THERE'S TRAIL CONNECTIONS THAT YOU WANNA SEE, I HAVE THOUGHT ABOUT ADDING, I KNOW WE'VE DISCUSSED, UM, SIDEWALK CONNECTIONS AND, AND SOME PLACES WHERE WE'RE LACKING SIDEWALK CONNECTIONS.
IF YOU'D LIKE TO SUGGEST THAT I FIGURE OUT A WAY TO GRAPHICALLY SHOW AREAS THAT WE WANT TO INCREASE SIDEWALK CONNECTIONS, UM, I CAN CERTAINLY DO THAT.
THERE'S ONE AREA SHOWN ON EGYPT ROAD DOWN HERE, NUMBER 13, AND ANTHONY HAS IDENTIFIED IN THE A TP OF WHERE SIDEWALK CONNECTION SHOULD BE DEVELOPED OR BE CONSTRUCTED.
IF THERE'S OTHER AREAS THAT YOU KNOW OF THAT YOU WANT TO SEE IT HAPPEN, WHETHER, YOU KNOW, THAT'S OAKS, ROERS, FORD, BETWEEN TWO OTHER SUBDIVISIONS, WHATEVER IT MAY BE.
UM, THAT CAN CERTAINLY GO ON HERE AS, AS A GRAPHIC.
I ANSWER WITH THIS JEFF, AND YOU GUYS MIGHT ASK SOME TOO.
I'M JUST LOOKING AT SOME OF THESE OPEN SPACES WHERE YOU HAVE NO YELLOW, NO GREEN, NO NOTHING.
WHAT IS, WHAT IS THE STATUS OF THAT STUFF? WELL, SOME OF IT, LIKE IN THE CENTER HERE IN, IN THE, IN THE DEBT CENTER THAT'S FARNER OR I'M SORRY, RAIDERS.
SO WHEN I KNOW THAT THEY'RE NOT GOING TO BE DEVELOPED, WHETHER THAT'S RAIDERS OR THE MONTGOMERY COUNTY PARKS, UM, THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT, THAT AREN'T HOA PROPERTY OR THEY ARE HOA PROPERTY, BUT THEY HAVEN'T BEEN DEDICATED YET, UM, THAT'S NOT, THAT'S NOT SHOWN IN A COLLAR ON HERE.
SOME OF THOSE, IF YOU REFER DOWN TO THE MAP ON THE BOTTOM WILL BE SHOWN.
SO LIKE EVERYTHING ALONG ONE 13, THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, THOSE RETAIN RETENTION BASINS AND SOME OF THOSE OTHER THINGS, THEY'RE RIGHT ALONG ONE 13 ACROSS THE STREET FROM OUR RAIDERS.
THOSE ARE SHOWN ON THE LOWER MAP SAYING THAT THEY'RE ALREADY OPEN SPACE.
I DID HAVE THIS MAP ALL SORT OF MESHED TOGETHER WITH ALL OF THE DIFFERENT COLORS TOGETHER AND IT REALLY BECAME DIFFICULT TO READ.
IT WAS JUST A LOT OF GETTING THE COLORS TO READ SEPARATELY WAS A BIG CHALLENGE.
SO THAT'S WHY I SEPARATED OUT THE TWO MAPS, AND I'VE JUST DONE THAT IN THE LAST DAY OR TWO.
SO I'M NOT A HUNDRED PERCENT SOLD ON IT YET.
BUT THERE'S, THAT'S SORT OF THE THOUGHT PROCESS BEHIND THE TWO MAPS SHOWING WHAT WE'RE NOT NECESSARILY SHOWING AS OPEN SPACE ON OUR MAP MAY BE CONTROLLED BY SOMEBODY ELSE ON THE, SHOWN ON THE OTHER MAP.
WELL, MY ONLY ISSUE WITH THIS OR RECOMMENDATION OR WHATEVER YOU WANNA CALL IT, WOULD BE THAT, YOU KNOW, LET'S GRAB AS MUCH OPEN SPACE AS WE CAN MM-HMM
I MEAN, I SEE A LOT OF, LIKE YOU SAID, THAT'S WHY I'M ASKING, I SEE A LOT OF WHITE YET WHERE YOU DON'T SEE ANY ROADS OR DEVELOPMENTS OR WHATEVER IN DIFFERENT PLACES.
SO I'D LIKE TO GRAB ALL THAT IF WE CAN.
AGAIN, IT'S A WISHLIST, RIGHT? RIGHT.
AND AND SOME OF IT DOESN'T SHOW, YOU'LL RUN INTO SOME AREAS LIKE DOWN IN, IN THIS LOWER PORTION HERE, YOU KNOW, IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S OPEN, BUT IT'S, IT IS DEVELOPED AS, AS THE BUSINESS PARK DOWN THERE.
SO WHILE IT LOOKS OPEN, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S ALREADY DEVELOPED AS A BUSINESS PARTNER.
IT JUST DOESN'T SHOW THE BUILDING FOOTPRINTS.
UM, SAME THING WITH LIKE THE GOLF COURSE.
I DIDN'T INCLUDE THE GOLF COURSE BECAUSE IT'S A PRIVATE RECREATIONAL FACILITY.
UM, VARNER, I CAN LOOK THROUGH IT AND, AND DOUBLE CHECK MY WORK.
I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM DOING THAT.
I I WILL ABSOLUTELY CHECK AND GRAB AS MUCH MORE.
I'M JUST SAYING THAT, YOU KNOW, THE ONLY THING I WOULD SAY ABOUT THIS MAP AND, AND, AND AS A RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE LET'S GRAB AS MUCH WHEN WE KNOW THAT THERE'S A POSSIBILITY OF AN OPEN SPACE, LET'S GRAB IT.
THAT'S THE ONLY THING I'M SAYING.
AND AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, JUST LOOKING AT WHAT YOU GOT HERE, I CAN'T TELL WHICH IS OPEN OR, YOU KNOW, ALREADY OWNED FOR OR, OR PROPOSED FOR SOMETHING ELSE.
BUT IF A LOT OF THIS WHITE, WE CAN GRAB SOME OF THIS.
I, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE US GRAB AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE.
[00:40:01]
THAT'S MY, THAT'S I MORE OF A RECOMMENDATION OR A SUGGESTION, NOT A, NOT A CRITICISM OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.I THINK YOU MAKE A GOOD POINT ABOUT NOT MAKING IT TOO, UH, LIKE TOO MANY CALLERS AND IT'S JUST TOO BUSY.
BUT, UH, I THINK TOM MADE A GOOD POINT.
GRAB WHATEVER YOU CAN AND WHAT WE HAVE TO RELY ON YOUR ASSESSMENT OF WHAT'S AVAILABLE AND YOU KNOW, WHAT'S, WHAT'S POTENTIALLY GRAVEL.
I'D BE SURPRISED IF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WEREN'T OF THE SAME MONEY.
AND I THINK THAT BECOMES NOW A MATTER OF, UH, MONEY.
YOU SAY GRAB, YOU KNOW, YOU JUST DON'T SAY, OKAY, THAT'S MY PROPERTY.
I MEAN IT'S, NO, I UNDERSTAND.
I MEAN, THERE'S A LOT OF FACTORS I'M JUST SAYING THAT WE WANT.
SO I UNDERSTAND AND I THINK, AND I, AND I WOULD BE SURPRISED IF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS DIDN'T AGREE TODAY, BASED ON A LOT OF DIALOGUE THAT'S BEEN HAPPENING WITH DEVELOPMENT THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE TOWNSHIP, THAT THEY AREN'T ALSO THE SAME MINDSET THAT WE WANT TO TRY TO PRESERVE AS MUCH OPEN SPACE AS WE POSSIBLY CAN.
I THINK THAT'S A PRIORITY FOR, FOR US.
I THINK WE ALL WANT AS MUCH OPEN SPACE AS WE CAN GO MOVING FORWARD.
BUT AGAIN, UNDERSTANDING THERE'S A LOT OF FACTORS INVOLVED.
LEMME SHOW YOU ONE OTHER MAP REAL QUICK.
I DON'T HAVE TO PRINT IT OUT, BUT I CAN SHOW YOU ON THE SCREEN.
ACTUALLY, I'M PRETTY HAPPY WITH WHAT YOU DO AT MARK AS YELLOW.
IT'S NICE TO SEE IN ALL THAT YELLOW.
BUT THIS IS THE MAP WITH ALL OF THE, UM, ALL OF THE OPEN SPACE TOGETHER.
WHETHER THAT'S PRIVATELY CONTROLLED, PUBLICLY CONTROLLED, HOA GOLF COURSE, ACTIVE REC.
SO YOU CAN SEE THAT A LOT OF THOSE AREAS DO FILL IN.
I STILL, I AGREE THERE'S STILL A LOT OF WHITE ON THERE.
UM, BUT, BUT IT, IT BECOMES I THINK, A LITTLE LESS READABLE.
BUT, YOU KNOW, YOU GET A BETTER SENSE OF, I'M NOT LOOKING THIS AS, YOU KNOW, I'M JUST SAYING, I'M NOT SAYING I'M NOT TAKING AS CRITICISM.
I'M JUST, I, I GET THAT THE VISUAL OF THIS IS HARD TO READ AND, AND I'M STILL STRUGGLING THROUGH IT.
I LITERALLY HAD TO SITTING IN MY DESK FOR TWO DAYS STARING AT IT, TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT I, WHAT I COULD, HOW I COULD MAKE THE POINT THAT I WANNA MAKE WITH THIS ONE, ONE THOUGHT I HAD, UH, AND AGAIN, THIS IS NOT A CRITICISM JUST TOSSING IT OUT, BUT IF YOU WANTED TO COMBINE THEM, IT MIGHT NOT BE AS IMPORTANT TO SHOW THESE INDIVIDUAL OTHER OWNERS MM-HMM
MAYBE JUST SHOW IT ALL AS ONE, ONE OTHER COLOR.
YOU KNOW, AND MAYBE IT'S A GRAY OR SOMETHING.
AND THEN THE, THE TOWNSHIP IN THE COLORS OF YOUR PRIMARY MAP, OBVIOUSLY WE KNOW THAT BIG TRIANGLE DOWN HERE IN THE LEFT, THAT'S PARKHOUSE.
SO WE KNOW THAT'S ALREADY TAKEN.
UM, BUT YEAH, I MEAN, I MEAN EVEN IF IT'S, YOU KNOW, JUST A LITTLE PIECE LIKE UP HERE IN THE LEFT CORNER, YOU HAVE JUST THAT LITTLE, I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THAT IS OVER HERE.
UM, UP THERE IN THE CORNER THERE.
LOOK, I'M, I'M LOOKING AT IT RIGHT HERE.
OH, THAT HE GOING TO, YEAH, I'M LOOKING DOWN.
I'M SHOWING, THERE IT IS ON THIS HERE.
THIS LIKE, WHAT IS THIS? IS IT JUST A, I MEAN THIS LOOKS SMALL.
UH, WHAT, WHAT IS SOMETHING LIKE THIS? LEMME ZOOM IN.
WHICH PIECE AGAIN? JUST, JUST THIS LITTLE RECTANGLE HERE.
WELL, THAT, THAT'S ACTUALLY THE VFW, BUT I DO HAVE THAT HIGHLIGHTED IN YELLOW TO BE THAT IF SOMETHING WERE TO HAPPEN WITH THE VFW AND THEY WERE TO GO AWAY, THE TOWNSHIP WOULD LOOK TO, WELL THAT'S THE VFW.
BUT YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE ARE OTHER PIECES IN THAT SAME AREA THAT, THAT QUALIFY.
I MEAN THE STUFF AROUND FOR EDGE, THERE'S SOME STUFF BEHIND SOME OF THE HOUSES ON MENNONITE ROAD THAT, THAT, THAT ARE JUST OPEN.
YOU KNOW, THAT DEFINITELY WE CAN ADD TO IT THAT THAT'S NOT AN ISSUE.
THAT'S ALL GOOD STUFF THAT I THINK THAT'S GOOD STUFF.
CAN I MAKE A RECOMMENDATION, JEFF? SURE.
UM, I THINK THAT WHERE YOU HAVE IT IDENTIFIED, THERE'S OPEN SPACE TO POTENTIALLY PRESERVE.
I THINK THAT YOU MAY WANT TO MAKE THAT OPEN SPACE SLASH UH, RECREATION AREAS TO POTENTIALLY PRESERVE.
UM, I JUST, THERE ARE LIMITATIONS IN TERMS OF THE USE OF EVIDENT DOMAIN IN TERMS OF WHAT YOU CAN USE AN AREA FOR.
YOU CAN'T CONDEMN PROPERTY FOR OPEN SPACE.
YOU CAN CONDEMN IT FOR RECREATION USE OR RECREATION AREAS.
SO I THINK HAVING THAT ON HERE WITH NO SPECIFIC INTENTION AT THIS TIME, BUT KNOWING THAT POTENTIALLY THAT COULD BE SOMETHING THE TOWNSHIP WOULD WANT TO PURSUE.
I THINK IT MIGHT C FOR FUTURE RE THAT ARGUMENT IF, IF IT EVER CAME TO THAT POINT.
JUST TO BROADEN THE SCOPE, NOT JUST OPEN SPACE.
[00:45:01]
AND IF YOU WALK IN WARD A LITTLE BIT, OUR SECTION OF HORSE FOR, IF YOU WILL, THE UPPER PROVIDENCE PARK DOESN'T MATCH THAT OFI MEAN, THEY'VE GOT CURBING AND SIDEWALK.
THERE IS SOME SIDEWALK, BUT NOT EVERYWHERE.
SO MAYBE, I DON'T KNOW WHETHER IT'S A HIGH PRIORITY.
IT WOULDN'T BE I WHOLE THING, BUT IT WOULD BE SOMETHING TO CONSIDER FOR FUTURE.
I, WELL, A GOOD EXAMPLE WOULD BE FOURTH AVENUE.
YOU COULD BOUNCE FOURTH AVENUE IN RO FORD.
IT'S ALL SIDEWALK, THEN ALL OF A SUDDEN IT STOPS.
GREEN STREET WE HAVE DONE, WE HAVE JEN'S OFFICE HAS DONE SOME STUDY ON AND, AND THERE'S SOME SERIOUS IMPEDIMENTS TO PUTTING SIDEWALKS IN THERE.
UM, IT IS SOMETHING THAT WE CAN PUT ON THERE AS, AS AN AREA OF FUTURE STUDY.
I, I WOULDN'T RECOMMEND IT IT BEING A HIGH PRIORITY, BUT YEAH, IT'S A HIGH PRIORITY.
I MEAN, I THINK THE SAME GOES FOR OAKS FOR, FOR THE AREA DOWN IN OAKS.
I MEAN THERE'S A, THERE'S A LOT OF, YOU CAN SEE THE BLACK LINES DOWN HERE.
THERE'S, THERE'S NO SENSE, THERE'S NO RHYME OR REASON TO WHERE THE SIDEWALKS ARE DOWN IN, IN THIS SECTION, NEAR THIS PURPLE LINE DOWN IN HERE.
I'M SORRY, I JUST MOVED OUTTA IT.
BUT, UM, YOU KNOW,
NO, BUT, BUT CONTINUING THE SIDEWALKS THERE MIGHT MAKE MORE SENSE BECAUSE IT'S A FLATTER, THERE'S LESS IMPEDIMENTS TO IT.
THE RESIDENTS MIGHT BE THE BIGGEST IMPEDIMENT, BUT, UM, OH YEAH.
THE RESIDENTS ARE ALWAYS GONNA BE IMP I UNDERSTAND THAT.
SO, UM, AND EVEN, EVEN THE AREA OF, OF MONTCLAIR UP HERE ON BRIDGE STREET BY THE MEADOWS, I MEAN THERE, THERE'S REALLY NO SIDEWALKS IN THERE, BUT YOU KNOW, WITH THE, THE POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT OF ONE 40 WHITAKER, THERE'S A BIG QUESTION ABOUT HOW DO PEOPLE USE THE, HOW DO PEOPLE GET AROUND HERE? HOW DO PEOPLE WALK AROUND THERE? SO IF, IF, IF THAT'S SOMETHING YOU'D LIKE TO SEE ON THIS MAP, I CAN FIGURE OUT A WAY TO GRAPHICALLY REPRESENT THAT THESE ARE AREAS YOU SHOULD STUDY, FUTURE SIDEWALK CONNECTIONS.
BUT WHAT, WHAT YOU CONNECTIONS YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
'CAUSE WHEN WHITAKER DEVELOPS, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO PUT SOMETHING WELL, WHITAKER YEAH.
OBVIOUSLY PUT THEIR OWN SIDEWALK.
SO IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE CONNECTIONS FROM WHITAKER, DO SOMETHING ELSE THROUGHOUT THE WHOLE DEVELOPMENT.
AND IF YOU LOOK HERE, IT'S THIS AREA THAT, THAT YOU SEE WHERE ALL THESE REALLY TIGHT BOXES ARE.
THAT'S THE MEADOWS, RIGHT? THE BLUE LINE IS EGYPT ROAD, A POTENTIAL TRAIL ON EGYPT ROAD, THEN BRIDGE AVENUE IN HERE.
THERE'S SOME SIDEWALKS ALONG BRIDGE STREET.
UM, BUT THEN EVERYTHING BEHIND THAT, THERE'S NO SIDEWALKS.
EVERYTHING ON THE OTHER SIDE, THERE'S NO SIDEWALKS.
AGAIN, THERE'S A LOT OF SLOPE.
THERE'S A LOT OF HOUSES RIGHT UP ON THE ROAD.
AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AMELIA STREET MAYBE DOING, MAYBE DOING SIDEWALKS THERE.
RIGHT? I MEAN, WE GOT LOADS OF SIDEWALK ISSUES ALL OVER THE TOWNSHIP.
I MEAN, LACK OF, SO I MEAN, WE COULD, WE COULD BE HERE ALL DAY LONG, YOU KNOW.
WELL, AND I DON'T THINK WE HAVE TO DECIDE EXACTLY.
IT DOESN'T NEED TO BE THIS BLOCK TO THAT BLOCK.
BUT I'M IF, IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH IT, IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH PUTTING THAT ON THE MAP, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT BECOMES A WISHLIST ITEM OF LOOKING AT SIDEWALK CONNECTIVITY THROUGH IN THESE CERTAIN AREAS.
WELL, MY QUESTION TO THAT WOULD BE THE COST.
IS IT WORTH THE COST TO DO THAT IF IT HASN'T BEEN THERE FOR A HUNDRED YEARS AND ALL OF A SUDDEN, WHAT'S THE COST OF PUTTING THOSE SIDEWALKS IN? LIKE, ON VAUGHN ROAD, AGAIN, I'M JUST USING MY NEIGHBORHOODS VAUGHN ROAD.
I MEAN, IS THERE ANY BENEFIT IN PUTTING SIDEWALKS THERE, UH, IN THE COST OF BUYING THE PROPERTY AND, AND THE CONSTRUCTION? IS IT, IS IT REALLY WHERE, YOU KNOW, I'D RATHER PAY, USE THAT MONEY TO PRESERVE MORE OPEN SPACE.
SO I LOOK AT IT AS A LOW PRIORITY FOR EXISTING NEIGHBORHOODS.
LIKE, YOU KNOW, A HOURLY WELL, YEAH.
WELL, V GOES UP TO THE END OF YOUR DEVELOPMENT ACTUALLY, AND IT STOPS.
I DON'T KNOW WHY YOU DIDN'T GO FURTHER.
I TRIED TO GET 'EM DO IT, BUT THEY DIDN'T
UM, YEAH, I, I DON'T, I I, I MEAN IT'D BE NICE TO DO IT, BUT I DON'T SURE IT'S A PRIORITY.
'CAUSE IT, IT CERTAINLY, IT'S BEEN GOING ON FOR A LOT LONGER THAN ANY OF US HAVE BEEN AROUND.
BEEN DOING WHAT, WHAT IT CAN ALSO DO IS, LET ME USE THE EXAMPLE OF THE HANER ROAD MINOR SUBDIVISION.
WE DIDN'T SHOW ANY SIDEWALKS IN THERE.
WE DIDN'T SHOW ANY TRAIL CONNECTIONS IN THERE.
SO WHEN THEY CAME IN AND SAID, WELL, WE'RE JUST GONNA GET THE WAIVER BECAUSE WE DON'T SEE THAT YOU HAVE CONNECTIONS ANYWHERE ELSE.
BUT IF YOU REMEMBER AJ'S BIG POINT WAS I USE THAT ROAD ALL THE TIME AND I'M CONSTANTLY OUT THERE.
I WOULD LIKE TO SEE SIDEWALKS ALONG IT.
AND MAYBE WE'RE MAKING SOMEONE DO A SIDEWALK TO NOWHERE, YOU KNOW, WHICH IS GONNA HAPPEN WITH EMORY MANOR, BUT AT LEAST IT SHOWS THAT THEIR SIDEWALKS CAN GO THERE.
AND MAYBE EVENTUALLY THEY DO CONNECT, MAYBE NOT IN OUR LIFETIMES, BUT MAYBE, YOU KNOW, IN, IN THE NEXT GENERATION OF DEVELOPMENT AND MANAGEMENT AND, AND SUPERVISORS AND THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT IT BECOMES A HIGHER PRIORITY FOR THEM.
[00:50:01]
THIS DOES IS THIS PUTS IT ON A WISHLIST OF SOMETHING THAT WHEN THOSE DEVELOPMENTS KIND OF COME FORWARD, AS MINOR AS THEY MAY BE, IT SHOWS THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THE TOWNSHIP IS DEFINITELY INTERESTED IN, OR AT LEAST, OR AT LEAST THOUGHT ABOUT.IF THEY ARE, I'M NOT SAYING YOU HAVE TO BE, YOU COULD CERTAINLY SAY, YOU COULD CERTAINLY SAY, WELL JEFF, WE APPRECIATE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT WE DON'T WANT IT ON THE MAP.
BUT WE'RE, WE'RE GOING THROUGH THAT NOW WITH THE MILLENNIUM SAYING IT WAS ON EGYPT ROAD WHERE, WHERE THERE'S A FOR THE PROPERTY STOP.
AND THEN IT STOPS, AND THEN THE, WE WOULD LIKE TO EXTEND RIGHT FURTHER, BUT WE HAVE TO GET HOMEOWNER APPROVAL, BLAH, BLAH, BLAH.
I THINK WE NEED TO CONTINUE TO PURSUE.
SEE, AND, AND, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT AND I, I, I THINK YOUR POINT IS, WELL THANK YOU JEFF YEAH.
BUT I, I LOOK AT WHAT MAKES ME MAKE IT NOT A PRIORITY IS THE COST.
AND, AND THE COST ISN'T GONNA GO DOWN.
NO, IT'S NOT GONNA
BUT IF, IF, IF YOU LOOK AT IT, AND THE SAME THING WITH OPEN SPACE.
YOUR PRIORITY IS OPEN SPACE RIGHT NOW.
THE NEXT BOARD MAY NOT BE IN, WE CAN AMEND THE MAP WHEN THE NEXT BOARD IS IN THERE.
UM, YOUR JOB TODAY IS TO PUT ON THIS MAP WHAT YOU THINK THE PRIORITY IS, AND IF YOU AGREE THAT THAT'S OPEN SPACE AND ONLY OPEN SPACE OR OPEN SPACE IN A FEW TRAILS OR WHATEVER THAT MAY BE, THAT'S WHAT'S GONNA GO ON THE MAP FOR YOU.
BECAUSE WHAT THIS DOES, THIS GIVES A DEVELOPER OR A POTENTIAL DEVELOPER OR SOMEONE MOVING INTO THE TOWNSHIP AN IDEA OF WHAT COULD HAPPEN.
SO AGAIN, SO AT THIS POINT, ARE WE MAKING, UH, RECOMMENDATIONS TO, TO, UH, ADD TO THIS MAP AND THEN ASKING IT TO BE APPROVED BY THE SUPER, MOVING IT TO THE SUPERVISOR RECOMMENDATION? ARE YOU PLANNING ON AMENDING THE MAP, JEFF? BASED ON, I I IT, DEPENDING ON WHAT YOU, WHAT CHANGES YOU WOULD LIKE TO SEE, I MAY BRING THE MAP BACK TO YOU.
ANTHONY'S MAP CAN JUST HANG OUT THERE WAITING.
YOU CAN MAKE A RECOMMENDATION ON THAT.
WE CAN, WE CAN APPROVE THE ULTIMATE RIGHT AWAY AND WE'RE DONE WITH THAT.
WE'LL RUN THE HEARING AT THE SAME TIME TO MAKE LIFE EASIER.
BUT, BUT YEAH, YOU COULD CERTAINLY MAKE THAT RECOMMENDATION TONIGHT.
AND THAT'LL JUST SORT OF STAND IN MY POCKET.
AND THEN ONCE WE GET THROUGH THE LAST THINGS OF, OF THIS MAP, THEN WE WILL, YOU KNOW, WE'LL GET TO THAT.
AND IF YOU WANNA THINK ABOUT IT, WE DON'T HAVE TO MAKE THE DECISION TONIGHT.
WE CAN PUT THIS ON FOR THE SECOND MEETING IN MAY AND DISCUSS IT SOME MORE.
WELL, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG AND I, I LIKE THAT SUGGESTION.
BUT SO WHAT WE THINK ABOUT IS THREE IS I SEE IN THREE THINGS, RIGHT? ONE WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, A WISHLIST OF OPEN SPACE.
TWO WOULD BE, UH, CONNECTIVITY OF SIDEWALKS AND PUTTING SIDEWALKS, TRAILS IN.
WELL, THAT WOULD BE THE THIRD ONE WOULD BE TRAILS.
YOU KNOW, THROUGH SOME OF THESE.
LIKE, WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD, ANY TRAILS OR CONNECTING ANYTHING EITHER TO YOU GUYS.
WE EVER VOTED ON ANYTHING, SO, SO THE SIDEWALKS, YEAH.
SO THAT'S THE THREE THINGS I SEE.
DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANYTHING ELSE THEY WOULD LIKE TO ADD TO THAT LIST? NO, I THINK THAT'S A GOOD LIST.
AND THEN YOU'RE WELCOME TO TAKE THESE MAPS AND SCRIBBLE ON THEM.
THINK ABOUT IT, THEN GO OUR NEXT MEETING.
THINK ABOUT THOSE THREE THINGS.
DRAW ON THESE MAPS, ANYTHING YOU WANT.
AND IF YOU WANT THE PDF OF IT, I, I CAN SEND THE PDF OF IT.
IF YOU'RE LIKE JERRY, WHO PROBABLY USE THE BLUEBEAM A LOT AND, AND DRAWS ON THEM, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE WELCOME TO TO DO THAT TOO.
I CAN SEND HER ON THE PDF TOMORROW AND, UM, THEN WE CAN COME BACK AND WE CAN COMPARE NOTES AT THE NEXT MEETING.
I THINK THAT'S A GOOD SUGGESTION.
DO YOU WANT TO APPROVE, UH, ANTHONY'S MAP THOUGH? I, I WOULD PREFER TO JUST TO GET THAT.
I'LL TAKE A RECOMMENDATION AND APPROVE THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP.
ANYBODY WOULD LIKE TO DO THAT.
I, I'LL MAKE THE MOTION TO APPROVE THE ULTIMATE RIGHT OF WAY MAP AS PROPOSED, UH, TONIGHT.
SO WE GOTTA, WE GOTTA, BUT WHAT WE REALLY DIDN'T ASK, IS THERE ANY, ANY OTHER ROADS WE WANT TO ON THIS THAT WE DIDN'T IDENTIFY YOU AND I DON'T HAVE ANY, BUT I DON'T THINK SO.
THINK, I THINK WE SHOULD ASK THAT JUST TO MAKE SURE.
AND I THINK APPROVING THIS MAP AS ANTHONY'S PROPOSED IS MY RECOMMENDATION.
A COUPLE YEARS FROM NOW, THINGS MIGHT LOOK DIFFERENT.
MAYBE, YOU KNOW, A YEAR FROM NOW, WHO KNOWS.
BUT RIGHT NOW YOU, EVERYBODY'S HAPPY WITH THIS MAP.
WE'RE GONNA, YEAH, WE GOTTA MOVE THIS, START MOVING THESE THINGS FORWARD.
ALRIGHT, SO WE HAVE A, WE DO HAVE A RECOMMENDATION, WE HAVE NO OTHER ISSUES, SO I'LL TAKE A SECOND IF WE HAVE IT.
ALL IN FAVOR OF PROVING, UH, ANTHONY'S, UH, RIGHT OF WAY MAP, SAY AYE.
SO I WILL SAY ONE THING ABOUT THE, THE TRAFFIC SITUATION A COUPLE TIMES NOW.
I MEANT TO PULL OVER HALFWAY ON A ROAD AND YOU KNOW, YOU CAN PULL THESE, NOBODY'S BEHIND YOU.
ALL OF A SUDDEN YOU PULL OVER AND YOU LOOK IN YOUR MIRROR, OH CHRIST, THERE'S A WHOLE LINE OF CARS COMING UP BEHIND ME.
[00:55:01]
TAKE OFF AGAIN.UM, IT'S JUST SOMETHING I HAVE EXPRESS.
AND WHAT'S IT GONNA BE LIKE 20 YEARS FROM NOW? YOU KNOW? SO WE'LL ALL HAVE FLYING CARS.
PROBABLY WON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THAT 20 YEARS FROM NOW.
I CAN BE AROUND 20 YEARS FROM NOW,
SO, UH, AND THEN THE, THE, UH, OFFICIAL MAP WILL TAKE THOSE THREE SUGGESTIONS.
LOOK AT THOSE THREE THINGS, THE OPEN SPACE, THE, UH, SIDEWALK CONNECTIONS AND EVENTUAL, UH, TRAIL CONNECTIONS.
AND WE'LL SEE WHERE WE CAN APPROVE THIS OR, UH, MAKE SUGGESTIONS TO JEFF.
AND THEN WE'LL, UH, WE'LL, WE'LL VOTE ON THAT NEXT TIME.
IS THAT FIRE FOR EVERYBODY? YEAH.
IS THAT EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT? SURE.
WE'RE ALL LEGAL AND EVERYTHING, SO.
IS THAT GOOD, JEFF? THAT WORKS FOR ME.
[DISCUSSION: FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS]
PLAN COMMISSION MEETING IS MAY 7TH.WE'LL HAVE A QUEST REDEVELOPMENT PRELIMINARY PLAN ON THERE.
AND, UM, THEY ALSO HAVE A MINOR SUBDIVISION OR A SUBDIVISION PLAN.
IT'S A LITTLE BIT MORE OF A LEGAL DOCUMENT.
THEY HAVE TO SUBDIVIDE THE PROPERTY FOR LEGAL REASONS.
WE'LL TRY TO RUN THOSE TOGETHER.
UM, THAT SHOULD BE THE ONLY LAND DEVELOPMENT ON THERE AS FAR AS I CAN TELL AT THIS POINT.
AND THEN, UM, MAY 21ST WE'LL PUT ON THE OFFICIAL MAP.
AND YOU KNOW, I THINK AT THAT POINT I'LL BRING BACK SOME INFORMATION ABOUT THE RIDGE PIPE REZONING AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
'CAUSE WE SORT OF LET THAT DROP A LITTLE BIT.
WELL, JUST A QUESTION, UM, CAN, IS IT, IS IT SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH THAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS APPROVE THIS ULTIMATE RIGHT AWAY AND IN OF ITSELF ONLY TO ESTABLISH WHAT IS COLLECTOR VERSUS ARTERIAL? UM, WITHOUT BEING PART OF THE OFFICIAL MAP? WELL, I MEAN, FOR FUTURE DEVELOPMENT, I MEAN, SOMEBODY COMES IN TOMORROW.
I MEAN, NOTHING'S BEEN APPROVED HERE, BUT IF, IF THIS, IF THIS RIGHT OF WAY MAP IS APPROVED, UH, THEY'RE GONNA NEED TO ADHERE TO WHAT IS A COLLECTOR, WHAT IS AN ARTERIAL, I GUESS SACK.
COULD I MAKE RATHER, RATHER THAN WAITING SIX MONTHS, NINE MONTHS, I MEAN, HOW LONG IT'S GONNA TAKE US TO FINISH? WE'LL FINISH THAT MATH.
I MEAN, I, I THINK WHAT WE COULD WE DO, COULD I MAKE IT AN OFFICIAL APPLICATION AS OF TOMORROW? AND THEN THE PENDING DOCTRINE AND PENDING
PENDING ORDINANCE USUALLY APPLIES TO ZONING.
UM, LAND DEVELOPMENT SUBDIVISION LAND DEVELOPMENT STUFF IS USUALLY UP UNTIL THE DATE THAT THE ORDINANCE HAS PASSED UNTIL THAT DATE.
YOU'RE NOT, YOU DON'T HAVE TO COMPLY WITH IT.
UM, WELL, I MEAN, I I GUESS THE QUESTION IS, IS IS THERE ANY LIKELY SITUATION WHERE A USE MAY BE PERMITTED ON AN ARTERIAL OR COLLECTOR THAT IS NOT CURRENTLY DESIGNATED AS AN ARTERIAL OR A COLLECTOR? LIKE IS THAT SOMETHING THAT IS REALISTICALLY GONNA HAPPEN? I DON'T THINK SO, BUT I CAN CERTAINLY DIG INTO IT MORE.
YEAH, I MEAN WE MAY JUST WANT TO EVALUATE THAT AND MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE COVERED IN CASE THERE IS AN ISSUE.
BUT I, I WOULD TEND TO THINK THAT IF IT ACTUALLY IS AN ARTERIAL OR A COLLECTOR, IT'S ALREADY KIND OF DESIGNATED THAT WAY.
WE KIND, WE KIND OF WENT THROUGH THE DISCUSSION.
I FORGET WHO ALL WAS INVOLVED ON LONG EGYPT ROAD.
I THINK KEVIN WAS INVOLVED IN THE DISCUSSION.
UH, BETWEEN, UH, COLLEGEVILLE ROAD AND EGYPT ROAD, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A WHOLE STRETCH OF PROPERTY ON EGYPT ROAD KNOW SIDEWALKS.
I MEAN, HOW MANY, HOW MANY USES ARE DICTATED BY ARTERIAL COLLECTOR? I KNOW WE HAD THE ISSUE AROUND, UM, UM, ARCADIA AND LIKE WHERE THAT DEVELOPMENT IS WHERE THEY CAN ONLY HAVE CERTAIN USES THAT ARE ON COLLECTORS.
THING, HOW ABOUT THIS? I'LL LOOK INTO IT.
I'LL SPEND THE NEXT COUPLE DAYS LOOKING INTO IT AND IT BECOMES AN ISSUE.
IF WE REALLY THINK THERE'S SOMETHING POTENTIAL WE CAN QUEUE THIS UP FOR A HEARING IN, IN JUNE OR JULY AT THE SUPERVISORS.
I MEAN, THAT KIND OF HEARING IS A, IS A 10 TO 15 MINUTE HEARING.
THEY WOULD, WE CAN ADD THAT TO THEIR AGENDA FAIRLY EASILY.
SO I I THINK IT'S A LEGITIMATE CONCERN.
I I JUST DON'T KNOW HOW REALISTIC, LIKE HOW LIKELY IS IT TO ACTUALLY BECOME A PROBLEM? YEAH.
I HAVE NO IDEA HOW REALISTIC IT IS.
I'LL, I'LL HAVE TO LOOK AT IT.
I'LL HAVE TO SEE WHAT'S CHANGING AND WHAT THE ZONING IS ON THOSE.
'CAUSE I HAVEN'T MADE THE CORRELATION BETWEEN THE TWO YET.
SO I, I CAN DO THAT AND THEN IF WE HAVE TO QUEUE IT UP TO BE AN ACTUAL HEARING, GET THAT ADOPTED FIRST, WE'LL DO THAT.
UH, THE SUPERVISORS CAN HAVE A HEARING AT THE BEGINNING OF THEIR MEETING.
AND THEN, UM, SO 21ST WE HAVE NOTHING PLANNED.
WELL, WE'LL HAVE THE OFFICIAL MAP DISCUSSION.
[01:00:01]
WE HAVE NO, UH, APPLICANTS NO.AND THEN, UH, THE ENVIRONMENTAL ADVISORY COUNCIL IS ON THE 14TH.
WHY ARE WE DOING IT ON THE 14TH? THEY, THEY'RE HAVING A REPRESENTATIVE COME IN AND TALK ABOUT BIRD.
SO, BECAUSE THEY ONLY WANNA COME INTO ONE MEETING, SO I CAN'T MAKE IT.
I'M ALREADY, I DON'T THINK I CAN MAKE IT EITHER.
BUT I WANTED TO HEAR THAT 'CAUSE I THOUGHT THAT WAS, IT SOUNDED INTERESTING.
THEY'LL HAVE A, THEY'LL HAVE A VIDEO OF IT.
YEAH, THEY'LL HAVE A VIDEO OF IT AND YEAH, YOU CAN BE ONLINE.
I, 'CAUSE I I JUST DON'T UNDERSTAND WHAT THAT'S ALL ABOUT, BIRDHOUSE.
I'M, I'M NOT SURE EITHER, BUT I, I'M, I'M NOT HAPPY ABOUT MISSING IT EITHER, BUT MY WIFE MAKES ME, I DIDN'T KNOW WE MOVED.
I DIDN'T KNOW WE MOVED IT BECAUSE THEY, THE, THE, THE, UH, BIRDHOUSE PEOPLE ASK US TO.
DO WE WANT TO DISCUSS ANYTHING ELSE ON THIS ACTION ITEM LIST THAT WE WANT TO MAYBE START? AND THERE'S AN ITEM THAT WE IDENTIFIED AS A HIGH PRIORITY ITEM, WHICH IS THE HIGH CRASH AREA IMPROVEMENTS.
DO WE WANNA ASK YOU OR AS A, AS A BOARD, DO WE WANT TO ASK ANTHONY TO START MOVING THAT? WHICH ONE? I'M SORRY I COULDN'T HEAR BECAUSE I'M MAKING A LOT OF NOISE.
WE HAD APPROVED OR MADE AS PART OF OUR ACTION LIST, UH, UH, IDENTIFY AND IMPLEMENT HIGH CRASH AREA IMPROVEMENTS AS A HIGH PRIORITY ITEM.
AND IT HAPPENS TO FALL SPECIFICALLY IN OUR TRAFFIC CONSULTANTS FAIRVIEW.
AND NOW THAT HE'S FINISHED TO THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP, HE HAS NOTHING TO DO.
CASEY
AGAIN, IT'S TALKS ABOUT LIKE A HIGH, UM, HIGH CRASH CORRIDORS.
THERE'S A SAFETY ANALYSIS APPENDIX ATTACHED TO THE COMPLAIN THAT WAS ADOPTED AND THAT DID A VERY, LIKE OVER LIKE A PURVIEW GENERAL LOOK AT LIKE CRASH DATA AND STUFF AND ASSESSED A PRIORITY OR, OR I THINK IT WAS FOUR OR FIVE, UM, LOCATIONS THAT KIND OF SURFACED UP TO THE TOP OF, UM, LIKE A, THE, UH, PRIORITY LIST IF YOU WILL, UH, FOR, FOR FUTURE STUDY.
SO THAT'S KIND OF LIKE STEP ONE.
ARE THEY, ARE THEY, ARE THOSE FIVE DIFFERENT THAN THE ONES THAT ARE ALREADY BEING WORKED ON? NO, THOSE, SO THERE'S NOTHING CURRENTLY.
WELL, I MEAN IN THE, IN THE PLAINS WORK, LIKE, LIKE LET'S SAY, UH, YOU KNOW, 29 AND UH, UH, WHATCHA MCCALL DOWN THERE WHERE THE YYS IS? UH, YEAH, THIS WOULD THIS IS SEPARATE.
SO THIS WAS, LOOKED AT CARTER LIKE LENGTH, LENGTH OF ROADWAY WISE IN TERMS OF LIKE RIDGE PIKE, UM, YOU KNOW, 1 13, 29, ET CETERA.
THERE WERE JUST FROM A, FROM A SAFETY PERSPECTIVE, THEY WERE LIKE CRASH DATA WAS ANALYZED AND WE UH, WE LOOKED AT IT AND SAID, OKAY, FROM ALL THE DATA THAT WE'VE ASSESSED, THESE FOUR OR FIVE FLOAT TO THE TOP FOR FUTURE INVESTIGATION AS TO WHAT MAY BE CAUSING THESE CRASHES.
LIKE WHAT, WHY? AND SO IT'S KIND OF SET UP THE, IT'S KIND OF GIVEN THE BALL TO START RUNNING I GUESS, IF YOU WILL.
YOU KNOW, SO IT'S KIND OF SET UP THE, THE AREAS, I'M NOT SURE FOCUS, I'M NOT SURE ANY OF US REMEMBER WHAT THOSE FIVE WERE.
YEAH, WHY DON'T WE JUST GO OVER THOSE TO REHASH IT AT THE MEETING.
YEAH, I WAS GONNA SAY, WHY DON'T WE, WON'T WE TAKE THAT TILL THE 21ST? YEAH, I CAN, I CAN BRING THAT DATA TOO.
WE OVER WHY DON'T, AND THAT'LL KICK IT OFF.
WHY DON'T WE PICK UP THIS POINT? THAT'LL, WELL, OKAY.
LET'S PICK ONE OF OUR ITEMS THAT WE PICKED THAT JEN CAN WORK ON FOR THAT.
JEN, NEED SOME HOMEWORK? YEAH, WELL, JEN LOOKS ALONE.
I DON'T SEE ANYTHING SPECIFICALLY FOR JEN, BELIEVE IT OR NOT, ON THIS LIST LINES THAT I HAVE.
WELL, IT'S, IT'S ALL TRAFFIC CONSULTANT SUPERVISORS, JEFF, US.
IS THERE ANYTHING, YOU KNOW, JEFF, THAT WE MISSED OR SHOULD BE LOOKING AT WORK IN THE, IN THE, UH, IN YOUR COMP? SO IT'S NOT ON THE COMP PLAN, WHICH JUST ALWAYS HAPPENS IS YOUR ANNUAL MS FOUR.
I MEAN THAT'S JUST MY ONGOING HOMEWORK FOREVER.
UM, THE TWO ITEMS I DISCUSSED WERE THE MS FOUR AND THEN THE, UM, CHAPTER NINE THREE, THE SEWAGE FACILITIES PLANNING, WHICH ARE RULE THOSE, THOSE JUST KEEP GOING AND GOING AND GOING AND WE JUST DO THEM AND WE'RE REQUIRED TO DO THEM, SO THEREFORE THEY'RE NOT ON THE LIST.
SO THAT'S MY BACKGROUND HOMEWORK THAT YOU GUYS DON'T SEE.
UM, I CAN TELL YOU THAT THE MS FOUR, SO THE CURRENT MS FOUR PERMITS EXPIRED, UM, BACK
[01:05:01]
IN 2023, I THINK IT IS INDEFINITELY EXTENDED UNTIL DEP GETS THEIR ACT IN HERE.THERE'S A DRAFT DOCUMENT OUT THERE.
UM, WE'VE REVIEWED IT, THERE'S PRETTY SIGNIFICANT CHANGES TO IT, BUT UNTIL ANY ACTION IS FORMALIZED BY DEP, WE'VE RECOMMENDED TO TIM TO TABLE.
WE DON'T THINK APPLE PROVIDENCE SHOULD BE THE GUINEA PIG.
SOMEBODY ELSE CAN FIGURE IT OUT AND THEN WE'LL COME IN AND DO IT CHEAPER AFTER THEY'VE FIGURED OUT THE WAY TO DO IT.
BUT, UM, I CAN TELL YOU THAT, THAT ONE OF THE BIG ITEMS, THERE'S SEVERAL, BUT DO YOU REMEMBER HOW WE DID THE STREAM BANK RESTORATION ON GREENWOOD AVENUE ASSOCIATED WITH THE WB HOMES DEVELOPMENT? UM, 3 57 GREENWOOD.
THAT WAS REQUIRED FOR POLLUTION REDUCTION.
UM, THAT'S HOW DEP CHOSE TO MEASURE IT IN THE OLD MS FOUR PERMIT.
THEY'RE NOW THROWING THAT IN THE TRASH AND WE'RE STILL GONNA GET THAT STREAM BANK APPROVED.
UM, EVERY, THE WORK, THE CONSTRUCTION WORK WAS ALL DONE IN THE FALL.
AT THIS POINT WE'RE WAITING FOR GRASS GROW FOR A LACK OF BETTER TERM.
THEY PUT THEIR LIVE STAKES IN.
WE WILL SCHEDULE THE EP TO COME OUT AND HAVE THEM ACCEPT THAT PROJECT THAT WAS DONE.
UM, BUT IN THE FUTURE, INSTEAD OF DOING A, A CALCULATION FOR POUNDS OF SEDIMENT TO DO POLLUTION REDUCTION, DEP THINKS THAT JUST BY REDUCING VOLUME RUNOFF YOU'LL GET THE BYPRODUCT OF REDUCED POLLUTANT.
SO THE NEW ANALYSIS IN THE NEXT PERMIT CYCLE WILL BE COMPLETELY VOLUME BASED BASED ON MAPPING THAT DEP HASN'T PROVIDED TO US YET.
THEY'VE COME OUT WITH A NEW SPREADSHEET.
UM, YEAH, IT'LL BE QUITE A IS THERE ANYTHING THAT WE NEED TO BE WORKING ON IN PREPARATION FOR ANYTHING? NOPE.
WE'VE RECOMMENDED TIM TO SIT, BECAUSE REALLY THERE'S NOTHING, THERE'S A DRAFT DOCUMENT OUT THERE.
I'VE READ THE INSTRUCTIONS ON, IT'S LIKE A 14 PAGE DOCUMENT ON HOW TO PREPARE THE SPREADSHEET THAT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO DO BY SEPTEMBER OF 2026.
THAT'LL BE THE FIRST ACTION THAT HAPPENS IF AND WHEN THIS IS ADOPTED IN THE FORMAT THAT IT IS, IS SEPTEMBER, 2026.
UM, THAT WE'LL DO CALCULATIONS AND SUBMIT STUFF TO DEP.
UM, BUT WITHOUT KNOWING FOR SURE THAT THE DRAFT DOCUMENT IS GOING TO BE UNCHANGED.
NO, THE ONLY OTHER ITEM THAT ON MY LIST HERE THAT I HAVE IS THE RIDGE PIKE ZONING.
I BRING THAT BACK AND, AND I, WE WILL GO OVER SOME MORE THINGS WITH THAT ON THE 21.
UM, WE DO HAVE AN AGENDA THEN FOR MM-HMM
UH, ANYTHING ELSE, JEFF OR ZACH? THERE IS ONE THING, ROBERT, THAT WE KIND OF, I GUESS SKIPPED OVER, BUT I KNOW IT'S NOT A BIG DEAL FOR OUR TOWNSHIP, BUT IS BIKING.
WE DON'T WHERE CAN YOU BIKE ACROSS OUR TOWNSHIP? ALTHOUGH THE TRAILS COULD, COULD SATISFY THAT REQUIREMENT.
THAT'S THE IDEA IS THAT THE TRAILS ARE DESIGNED TO A POINT TO WHERE YOU CAN'T BIKE ON THEM.
I MEAN, AS MUCH AS WE WOULD LIKE TO HAVE 10 FEET, THAT'S PROBABLY NOT REALISTIC, BUT EIGHT FEET DOES ALLOW FOR A, A BICY BICYCLIST AND A PEDESTRIAN TO COEXIST.
SO THAT'S OUR STANDARD TO DESIGN THEM.
BUT THAT'S, I THINK LOOKING AT THE CONNECTIONS, YOU KNOW, FROM A BICYCLE STANDPOINT IS ALSO SOMETHING VERY VALUABLE.
I CAN'T TELL YOU HOW MANY TIMES I'VE DRIVEN UP BEEN AN OR MINGLE ROAD AND THAT SEEMS TO BE A BIG CUT THROUGH FOR BICYCLISTS.
FOR WHATEVER REASON NOW, YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T WANT TO OVERBOARD IT.
IF YOU LOOK AT POTSTOWN, FOR EXAMPLE, WHERE THEY PUT THE, THE CARS IN ON A DIAGONAL.
YEAH, THAT'S, THAT'S TERRIBLE.
SO I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD GO THAT RADICAL.
BUT
AGAIN, UH, I I'LL JUST NOTE THAT, UM, IF THE, IF YOU'RE INTERESTED, I GUESS YOU CAN ONLY, SO MONTGOMERY COUNTY HAD DONE A, A STUDY, UM, UH, BIKE MON, IT'S CALLED, I FORGET WHEN IT WAS DONE.
2010, I FORGET, I FORGET THE YEAR IT WAS DONE.
BUT, UM, THEY WENT THROUGH AND ANALYZED THE COUNTY AS A WHOLE.
THE UPPER PROVIDENCE WAS, WAS IN THERE.
UM, AND THEY MADE SOME RECOMMENDATIONS BASED ON, YOU KNOW, THEIR STUDY AS TO WHERE FUTURE BIKE CONNECTIONS, WHERE THEY WOULD RECOMMEND FUTURE BIKE CONNECTIONS.
UM, ONE 13 IS ONE OF THE, WELL, I UNDERSTAND WHAT DOES, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? THEY RECOMMENDING A SEPARATE LANE OR WHATEVER FOR BYS ONLY? CORRECT.
SO WHERE CARTER'S WHERE THEY, THEY FELT WOULD BE, UM, GOOD AREAS FOR FUTURE BIKE ACCOMMODATIONS.
BUT THAT WOULD BE SEPARATE FROM THE WALKING TREE, CORRECT? YEAH.
YEAH, BECAUSE THERE'S REQUIREMENTS FOR, YOU KNOW, DEPENDING ON YOUR SPEEDS, THE TYPE OF ROADS, HOW WIDE IT IS, YOU KNOW, HOW, HOW, HOW WIDE THAT WIDTH SHOULD BE FOR A BICYCLIST.
SO THEY WENT THROUGH AND DID COMFORT LEVEL AND IT'S A WHOLE, IT'S FUN READING IF YOU EVER WANT TO GO THROUGH IT.
BUT IT, IT DOES, THE SHORT OF IT IS THEY, THEY HAVE LIKE RECOMMENDATIONS PLUS OUT.
[01:10:01]
IF YOU'RE EVER CURIOUS THE THOUGHT OF BIKE LANES IN UPPER PROVINCE, BIKE MONKA WOULD BE A PLACE, IF YOU TYPED IT UP IN GOOGLE, IT'LL POP UP, IT'S ELECTRONIC AND YOU CAN TAKE A LOOK.THAT'S ON, ON, THAT'S ON SOME OF THE MAJOR HIGHWAYS.
LIKE ONE, LIKE I, I KNOW FOR, FOR SPECIFICALLY FOR ONE 13 IN THE AREA OF PARKHOUSE AND THE ROUNDABOUT AND THE BRIDGE, UH, THEY MADE RECOMMENDATIONS 'CAUSE WE, WE, THAT WAS PART OF THE DESIGN COORDINATION FOR THE ROUNDABOUT WAS COURTING WITH MONTGOMERY COUNTY WITH ACCOMMODATIONS.
WHO DOES THAT STATEMENT? THAT'S THE COUNT.
SO JUST, JUST THE MATCHING OF THIS.
AND THEY, THERE'S A LOT KIND OF FLUSHED OUT IN THAT DOCUMENT.
SEE SOMEBODY RIDE A BIKE FROM PARK HOUSE TO UP THAT HILL.
UH, IS THERE ANY UPDATE ON OUR DIALOGUE WITH, UH, UM, WE PLAYING PHONE TAG? BUT WE UH, I HAVE, WE HAVE, WE HAVE NO SCHEDULED SIT DOWN AT THIS POINT.
WE BOTH HAVE, I GUESS I WAS AWAY FOR A, A WEEK, ALMOST A WEEK.
AND, UH, ANYHOW, WE, I'M WORKING ON IT WITH, UH, WITH BILL.
ANYTHING ELSE AT THIS POINT? ANYBODY? ANYTHING? COMMENTS? GOOD STUFF? GOOD STUFF? I THINK TONIGHT ALL GOOD STUFF.
UH, I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT WE, UH, ADJOURN MEETING.
ALRIGHT, JERRY, TAKE A SECOND.