[00:00:01]
BEEN CONTACTED UP[CALL TO ORDER / MOTION TO APPROVE April 2, 2025 AGENDA]
PROBABLY AT SEVEN O'CLOCK.I'M GONNA CALL TO ORDER THE APRIL 2ND, 2025 PLANNING, COMMISSION MEETING FOR UPPER PROVINCE STATUTE.
AND WE'LL START WITH LOOKING AT THE AGENDA, AND I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE AGENDA FOR THIS EVENING FROM SOMEBODY.
I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.
YOU HAVE A SECOND? I'LL SECOND THAT.
OKAY, THEN WE'LL GO TO PUBLIC COMMENT FOR ITEMS, THE THINGS ARE NOT ON THE AGENDA.
ANY COMMENTS FROM ANYTHING? ANYBODY ON NON AGENDA ITEMS? OKAY.
UM, I WANT TO THANK THE COMMISSION.
I, I HAVE BEEN ON VACATION WITH MISS THE LAST TWO MEETINGS.
I WANT TO THANK THE COMMISSION FOR COVERING FOR ME.
I KNEW IT WAS IN GOOD HANDS AND I TRIED TO WATCH IT ON TELEVISION OR ON MY PHONE AND, UH, IT WAS HARD TO FOLLOW, BUT I DID TRY TO PHONE IT, SO THANKS GUYS.
[GENERAL DISCUSSION ITEMS]
LET'S MOVE TO THE, UH, FIRST ITEM TONIGHT IS, UM, A DISCUSSION OF THE MEETING MINUTES THAT WERE FROM MARCH 5TH, AND I ASSUME EVERYBODY'S HAD A CHANCE TO READ THEM, AND IF NOT, THEY'RE IN YOUR PACKET NOW.IF ANYBODY NEEDS A SECOND, I'LL TAKE IT.
IF NOT, I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES FROM MARCH 5TH.
I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES FROM MARCH 5TH.
[APPLICATIONS TO BE HEARD ON April 2, 2025]
RIGHT ALONG.SO WE HAVE A FEW APPLICANTS THIS EVENING, AND THE FIRST ONE ON THE AGENDA IS GLOBUS MEDICAL LOOKING FOR, UM, UH, DISTRICT ZONE TAX AMENDMENT.
IS THERE ANYBODY HERE FROM THAT GROUP? AND THERE IS NOT.
I BELIEVE THEY, THEY, THEY CONTACTED ME AND SAID THAT THEY WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO MAKE IT.
MR. MR. ESLER SENT, SENT A LETTER.
UM, I ADVISED HIM THAT, YOU KNOW, GENERALLY SINCE THIS WAS A PRETTY MINOR TEXT AMENDMENT, THERE WASN'T MANY QUESTIONS AT THE MEETING, THE INTRODUCTION MEETING ON MARCH 5TH, THAT, UM, I FELT COMFORTABLE IF HE WASN'T HERE.
AND IF THE PLANNING COMMISSION WANTS TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION, THAT'S CERTAINLY ACCEPTABLE.
IF THEY WOULD RATHER SAY, SINCE HE'S NOT HERE, WE'D RATHER NOT MAKE A RECOMMENDATION.
UM, I CAN CERTAINLY ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT IT.
WELL, I THINK JOE COME UP WITH A QUESTION.
I THINK JOE HAS ONE QUESTION HE, UH, BROUGHT UP TO ME JUST A LITTLE BIT AGO.
SO, JOE, WON'T YOU ASK THAT QUESTION THAT JEFF, SEE IF HE CAN ANSWER IT? YOU KNOW, AS WAS PRESENTED, IT INDICATED THAT 75% OF THE FACILITY WAS GOING TO BE, UH, OFFICE RESEARCH FACILITY AND 25% WAS GOING TO BE MANUFACTURING.
UM, WHAT HAPPENS IF A YEAR FROM NOW IT BECOMES A HUNDRED PERCENT MANUFACTURING? IS THERE ANY LIMITS ON ONCE THE TEXT AMENDMENT'S APPROVED AND TENANT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S, THERE'S NO DEVELOPMENT AS I UNDERSTAND IT, BUT ONCE THAT'S APPROVED, THEY'RE OPEN TO WHATEVER THEY WANT TO DO.
YES, THEY CAN DO JUST LIKE ANY OTHER BUSINESS, YOU CAN, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S A, IT'S A MENU OF ITEMS THAT YOU CAN DO AS A PER, AS AS ALLOWED USES, AS PERMITTED USES.
I MEAN, THERE'S NO LIMIT ON THE PERCENTAGE BECAUSE WE DIDN'T WRITE THAT IN THE ORDINANCE.
I DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S REALLY A LIMITATION WE WANT TO GOVERN.
NO, IT'S JUST, I WAS, I WAS FROM THE PERSPECTIVE OF I DON'T KNOW WHAT 25% MANUFACTURING THEY TALKED ABOUT THAT THE, YOU KNOW, A FEW SUPPLY TRUCKS COMING IN, IN AND OUT OF THE FACILITY AND WHATEVER IT BECAME A HUNDRED PERCENT MANUFACTURING, YOU KNOW, WHAT DOES THAT DO TO TRUCK TRAFFIC? UM, WHATEVER.
UH, AND I THINK THAT THAT'S A VALID CONCERN.
UM, I, I DON'T THINK WE'D WANT TO CHANGE THE ORDINANCE AT THIS POINT, BUT I CAN ASK 'EM IF THEY HAVE A CHANGE IN FOCUS THAT THEY CONTACT US, AND IF WE NEED TO LOOK AT PARKING AND, AND LOADING AND UNLOADING AT THAT TIME, THEN MAYBE WE CAN DO THAT.
I I THINK THEY MIGHT BE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT.
THAT'S DID IT IS SPECIFICALLY MANUFACTURING OF PHARMACEUTICALS AND HEALTHCARE PRODUCTS? YES.
YEAH, IT IS THE, THE SCOPE OF, OF WHAT THEY'RE ALLOWED TO MANUFACTURE THERE IS FAIRLY LIMITED AND IT IS ALONG WITH PHARMACEUTICAL AND HEALTHCARE PRODUCTS.
IT'S ALSO THE ASSEMBLY OF MEDICAL EQUIPMENT, ROBOTICS AND SCIENTIFIC EQUIPMENT.
IN ADDITION, THE WAY IT WAS DESCRIBED AT THE, AT THE BOARD MEETING, GRANTING THEM THE HEARING WAS WHAT THEY'D BE MANUFACTURING.
THERE WOULD BE MED PACKS, WHICH ARE, AGAIN, NOT CLOSE TO A DOCTOR.
UM, THEY, THE, THE, YOU OPEN THE PACKET AND YOU PUT IT ON A WOUND AND
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IT WOULD INSTANTLY STOP THE BLEEDING.SO THAT'S WHAT, THAT'S WHAT THEY SAID.
THEY'D BE MANUFACTURING THERE.
SO THERE'S SOME CHEMICALS INVOLVED, BUT THERE'S NOT A LOT OF HEAVY MACHINERY WITH IT.
AND IT'S REALLY ASSEMBLING THE PARTS FROM ELSEWHERE HERE.
DID THEY TAKE OUT THE, BECAUSE I, IN THE BACKGROUND INFORMATION, THE ORDINANCE TEXT STILL SAID REUSE OF EXISTING, UH, BUILDINGS, BUT THEN IT LOOKS LIKE THE LETTER IN THIS STACK SAYS THAT THEY STRUCK IT.
AND, AND, AND I DIDN'T REALIZE THIS, BUT I, I JUST RESENT THE SAME PACKET OF INFORMATION THAT WE SENT AT THE FIRST MEETING.
I REALLY SHOULD HAVE UPDATED THE ORDINANCE.
THAT'S WHY I BROUGHT AROUND WHAT I JUST HANDED OUT FOR THE ENTERTAINMENT.
UM, WE DID TAKE THAT OUT OF, OF THE OFFICIAL LANGUAGE.
WE SUBMITTED THE COUNTY FOR THEIR REVIEW AND WE, WE CLEANED UP THE ORDINANCE THAT THEY HAD SUBMITTED, PUT THE APPROPRIATE TITLE, UH, TOOK OUT THAT LINE ABOUT REUSE OF BUILDINGS BECAUSE THAT WAS RAISED TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING.
AND, UH, WE MODIFIED IT TO, UM, UH, RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT FACILITIES INSTEAD OF JUST GENERIC RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT.
UM, SO IT, IT FAIRLY MINOR CHANGES.
AND I THINK MOST OF THEM CAME FROM THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
BUT THAT RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT IMPLIES DOES NOT APPLY MANUFACTURING WELL, THAT, THAT'S WHY RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT IS A DISTINCT USE RESEARCH AND DEVELOPMENT FACILITY IS A DISTINCT USE IN THE DISTRICT FROM THE MANUFACTURING OF THE PHARMACEUTICAL, UH, AND IN HEALTHCARE PRODUCTS, IN THE MANUFACTURING, ASSEMBLY OF MEDICAL EQUIPMENT, ROBOTICS, AND SCIENTIFIC EQUIPMENT.
THOSE ARE DISTINCT AND SEPARATE USES.
I WASN'T YOUR OFFICE LEE, JEFF, WHAT WAS THE, UH, YOU'RE GOING TO, UH, UTILIZE THE CURRENT BUILDING AND REMODEL IT OR? YES.
THEY, THEY'RE FITTED OR THEY'RE GONNA RETROFIT THE BUILDING.
UM, THEY HAVE TO, I'M NOT SURE THEY'RE COMPLETELY GUTTING THE INTERIOR, BUT THEY ARE, THEY WILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE BUILDING PERMIT PROCESS AND THE FIRE, UM, MARSHAL WILL REVIEW THEIR PLANS FOR ALL OF THAT.
SO THE INTERNAL, NOTHING'S GONNA HAPPEN EXTERNALLY, BUT INTERNALLY WILL BE REVIEWED BY AGAINST THE BUILDING CODE AND THE FIRE CODE.
AND, UH, SINCE YOU WEREN'T HERE BEFORE, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THAT I LIKED ABOUT WHAT YOU MENTIONED WAS THAT IT WAS A HOMEGROWN BUSINESS.
I GUESS THEY STARTED HERE, IF I'M NOT MISTAKEN.
UH, AND IT WOULDN'T ADD, I'M JUST LOOKING BACK AT THE MATERIALS, THEY DON'T ANTICIPATE ADDING ANY ADDITIONAL PARKING TO WHAT THEY ALREADY HAVE.
SO IT'D BE ABOUT 200 GOOD JOBS IN THE COMMUNITY FROM A COMPANY THAT STARTED AROUND HERE.
SO I WOULD BE OKAY WITH THE RECOMMENDATION IF WE WANTED TO MAKE ONE.
UM, WELL, YOU KNOW, FOR ME, I MEAN, NOT NOT BEING HERE, BUT TRYING TO READ UP ON IT, YOU KNOW, ANYTHING THAT, UH, TAKES THAT EMPTY BUILDING AND MAKES IT USEFUL.
AGAIN, THIS, YOU KNOW, AS LONG AS IT'S, YOU KNOW, DANGEROUS OR ANYTHING, WHICH DOESN'T SOUND LIKE THIS IS VERY DANGEROUS.
THEY POINTED OUT ALSO AT OUR FIRST DISCUSSION ON IT AND THAT THE BOARD DISCUSSED IN THE HEARING THAT THESE ARE THINGS YOU CAN DO LITERALLY ACROSS THE STREET AT GLAXO OR ACROSS THE STREET AT PFIZER AND DOW.
AND THE ISSUE THAT, THE ISSUE ON THE BOARD ISSUES THE BOARD HAD WAS CHEMICALS.
AND I'M SURE THEY'LL GET INTO MORE DETAIL AT THE HEARING, BUT YOU KNOW, THE, THE FIRE MARSHAL IS COMFORTABLE WITH IT BECAUSE HE WILL BE PROVIDED A LIST OF, OF THE CHEMICALS AND WHAT HAPPENS INTERNALLY IN THOSE BUILDINGS.
WELL, THEY CAN'T BE TOO HARMFUL FULL IF THEY'RE GOING ON YOUR CHEST IF YOU'RE BLEEDING.
ONE WOULD HOPE WE THINK THEY'RE NOT PUTTING ITY IN THERE.
AND, AND, AND, YOU KNOW, WELL, CAN ONLY DEAL WITH WHAT'S I UNDERSTAND THAT, UNDERSTAND, AND I PERFECTLY FRANK, THERE'S, THERE'S, IF THERE'S ANY LIMITS, ONCE YOU KNOW IT, IT'S APPROVED.
I MEAN, WHAT, WHAT COVERS THE, MR. PETERS HAS A POINT, AND I KNOW THE FIRE MARSHAL AND THE BUILDING CODA OFFICER, THEY HAVE, THEY ALWAYS HAVE ISSUES WITH FINDING A BUILDING.
THE USE OF A BUILDING HAS CHANGED AND WE'RE NOT MADE AWARE OF IT.
WE HAVE HAVE SOME THINGS IN PLACE TO SORT OF PROTECT OURSELVES AND TO BE NOTIFIED WHEN A USE CHANGES OR SOMETHING TO THAT EFFECT.
IT'S NOT PERFECT, BUT, YOU KNOW, WE DO HAVE SOME SYSTEMS IN PLACE TO SORT OF CATCH THOSE THINGS AND GO BACK AND EVALUATE THEM TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE AS SAFE AS WHAT WE ORIGINALLY APPROVED.
WELL, THAT WOULD BE DONE THROUGH SOME SORT OF INSPECTION, I WOULD ASSUME.
'CAUSE HOW ELSE WOULD WE KNOW THAT THEY'RE INCREASED IN PRODUCTION TO 30% OF THE BUILDING? WELL, THAT, AND, AND IF, IF, LIKE, YOU KNOW, AS AN EXAMPLE, THERE WAS A, A DISTILLERY THAT MOVED INTO ONE OF THE INDUSTRIAL BUILDINGS DOWN OFF OF HOLLOW ROAD, AND WE HAD NO IDEA, AND THEY HAD HUGE VATS OF, OF VERY FLAMMABLE ALCOHOL THERE, BUT THEY DIDN'T HAVE THE FIRE PROTECTION FOR IT.
THE FIRE MARSHAL WENT IN THERE TO DO SOMETHING AND, AND CAUGHT WIND OF IT BASICALLY.
AND WE, WE HAD TO SHUT THEM DOWN BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T SUPPOSED TO BE DOING THAT THERE.
AND THEY NEEDED TO RETROFIT SOME THINGS AND THEY CHOSE NOT TO, AND THEY MOVED OUT.
SO THOSE ARE THE THINGS THAT THE FIRE MARSHAL AND, AND THE BUILDING CODE OFFICER ARE VERY GOOD AT THAT.
THAT'S THEIR GENERAL YEAH, I MEAN, I AGREE WITH KEVIN.
I MEAN, I THINK THIS IS, YOU KNOW, A GOOD UTILIZATION.
WELL, BEFORE WE DO THAT, I WANNA MAKE SURE ANTHONY AND JEN DON'T HAVE ANYTHING THEY WANT
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TO ADD TO, UH, TO ANY OF THIS.NOTHING YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH, WHATEVER THEY'RE DOING.
DON'T SEE ANY, ANYTHING THAT'S GONNA HARM ANYBODY OR CHANGE ANYTHING.
YEAH, THEY WERE REUSING EVERYTHING AND NOT INTRODUCING ANY EXTRA PREVIOUS COVERAGE.
SO YOU COMFORTABLE, YOU HAVE ANY TRAFFIC IN PARKING AND ALL THAT? YOU'RE COMFORTABLE? YEAH, THERE'S NO, UH, NO CHANGE IN USE.
THEY JUST REALLY REQUIRED TRAFFIC TRA YOU KNOW, TRANSPORTATION REVIEW, SO.
UH, I WILL, UH, TAKE A MOTION TO, UH, TO APPROVE, UH, THIS, UH, TAX AMENDMENT IF, UH, IF SOMEBODY WOULD LIKE TO MAKE THAT, THINK IT'LL BE A RECOMMENDATION TO APPROVE, TO APPROVE.
I WILL MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISORS TO APPROVE THE ZONING TAX AMENDMENT.
THE MOTION FOR THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO APPROVE THE ZONING TAX.
JEFF, YOU COULD TELL MR. ELER, HE DOESN'T HAVE EVER HAVE TO SHOW UP TO THE APPROVEMENT
UH, OUR LIST OF, UH, AGENDA ITEMS. WE HAVE HTC ASSOCIATES, AGRI TAX AMENDMENT, CONDITIONAL USE PLAN.
ARE THEY DOING ALL THAT TONIGHT? WELL, THEY'RE NOT DOING THE CONDITIONAL USE TONIGHT.
RIGHT NOW THE ONLY QUESTION FOR YOU IS IF YOU WANT TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION ON THE ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT.
SOMEBODY HERE FROM THEM WANTS TO MAKE ANY STATEMENTS.
I'M AN ATTORNEY FROM, UH, BLUEBELL, AND I'M HERE ON BEHALF OF THE APPLICANT, HTC ASSOCIATES.
UH, PRINCIPALS OF HTC ASSOCIATES ARE ALSO HERE.
IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, UH, MR. LOU GAMBONE AND MS. LOGAN SCOTT, UH, YOU KNOW, THE PROPERTY, I THINK YOU, YOU HAD HEARD FROM, UH, THE BRIGHTER, SMARTER ONE, WHO'S MY SON WHO WAS HERE LAST TIME, AND IT'S ON THE CORNER OF, UH, UH, MENNONITE AND ALLSTATE, UH, 12 ACRES.
UM, THE PROPOSAL TONIGHT IS TO REQUEST A TEXT AMENDMENT, UH, FOR WHAT IS CALLED AGRI IN PENNSYLVANIA.
UH, IT PROMOTES THE, UH, PRESERVATION AND RENOVATION OF, UH, HISTORICAL BUILDINGS, FARM BUILDINGS, AND, UH, IT ALLOWS FOR OPEN SPACE.
IF YOU HAVE SOME QUESTIONS, WE'LL BE HAPPY TO ANSWER THEM.
UM, I THINK A LOT OF THE QUESTIONS THAT WE'RE, THAT, THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE ASKING UP AT THE LAST MEETING, BUT AGAIN, WE'LL GO OVER ANYTHING YOU WISH.
WELL, I WASN'T HERE, SO I'M GONNA ASK A QUESTION.
WHAT, UH, IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING OF THE ZONING HERE.
IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING OF, UH, YOU'RE GONNA MEET WITH THE ZONING BOARD.
IT'S, I'LL SORT OF EXPLAIN THE PROCESS.
THERE'S, THERE'S SORT OF LIKE THREE APPLICATIONS AT THIS POINT.
THERE'S THE ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT, WHICH IS IN FRONT OF YOU.
THEY'VE ALSO PUT IN A CONDITIONAL USE AND A TENTATIVE LAND DEVELOPMENT PLAN.
IF THEY'RE GRANTED THE AG RETAIN, THEY WOULD MOVE TO TENTATIVE LAND DEVELOPMENT ON THAT PORTION OF IT.
THEY'VE ALSO PUT IN SOME PICKLEBALL COURTS, AND THEY WOULD LIKE TO PUT A PICKLEBALL CLUB IN.
THAT IS, PART OF THAT WOULD BE AS A SPECIAL EXCEPTION TO THE ZONING HEARING BOARD.
AGAIN, IT WOULD PROBABLY COME BACK HERE AND YOU'D HAVE SOME DISCUSSION ON, ON THE PICKLEBALL PORTION OF IT.
UM, IT, BUT THAT'S SORT OF A SEPARATE PROCESS.
AND THEN IF THEY WERE TO GET THE SPECIAL EXCEPTION, AND THIS, GRANTED THE WHOLE PROCESS WOULD SORT OF COME BACK TOGETHER AT THE LAND DEVELOPMENT, AND THEN IT'D BE YOUR TYPICAL LAND DEVELOPMENT, TENTATIVE, PRELIMINARY, FINAL.
IN, IN A, IN A NUTSHELL, MR. WRIGHT, WE'RE, WE ARE DOING THIS IN A TWO STEP PROCESS, BUT WE WANTED TO BE COMPLETELY TRANSPARENT AND OPEN ABOUT WHAT WE MAY WISH TO DO IN THE FUTURE.
WE'VE MADE, MADE NO APPLICATION FOR PICKLEBALL COURTS.
WHAT WE'RE HERE FOR THIS EVENING IS SIMPLY FOR THE TEXT AMENDMENT, WHICH WOULD PERMIT THE, UH, USE OF THE OLD BARN.
AND JUST, JUST TO ADD WHAT JEFF'S, UH, ADD TO WHAT JEFF SAID, THEY WOULD ALSO NEED CONDITIONAL USE APPROVAL FROM THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS IF THE ENTERTAINMENT ORDINANCE WERE ADOPTED.
SO THEY WOULD THEN HAVE TO COME BACK AGAIN FOR THE ENTERTAINMENT PORTION OF THIS.
'CAUSE THE ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT IS, WOULD ONLY PERMIT IT AS A CONDITIONAL USE.
SO THEY, WHAT'S IN FRONT OF US IS WHETHER OR NOT WE WANNA MAKE A RECOMMENDATION ON A ZONING CHANGE TO ALLOW THE CONDITIONAL USE OF ENTERTAINMENT.
AND THEY ALSO NEED TO GO TO THE ZONING BOARD FOR WHAT THERE WERE A LOT OF NEIGHBORS FOR WHEN YOU WERE NOT HERE, UM, WAS THE CONDITIONAL USE OF THE PICKLEBALL POINTS.
AND THAT WOULD BE, WELL, NO CONDITIONAL USE IS FOR THE AGRI, UH,
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SPECIAL EXCEPTIONS FOR THE PICKLEBALL SLASH TENNIS, ALL OF THESE GOOFY TERMS. YEAH.SO ACTUALLY THERE ARE FOUR THINGS THAT ARE ALL BUNDLED TOGETHER JUST TO MAKE IT EVEN MORE CONFUSING.
AND I KNOW, WELL, I'M CONFUSED.
SO WHAT, WHAT ARE WE, WHAT ARE WE ASKING SPECIFICALLY? WHAT ARE WE BEING ASKING TODAY? SO RIGHT NOW, THE APPLICATION IN FRONT OF YOU IS A REQUEST TO AMEND THE ZONING ORDINANCE TO ALLOW FOR AGRI AS A CONDITIONAL USE IN THE R ONE R ONE ZONING DISTRICT.
THAT'S THE FIRST STEP THAT'S SAYING, HEY, THIS IS WHAT WE WANNA DO WITH OUR PROPERTY.
UH, WE'RE NOT PERMITTED TO DO IT UNDER THE ZONING OR ORDINANCE AS IT'S CURRENTLY WRITTEN.
WE ARE PERMITTED TO DO THESE SPECIAL EVENTS ON THE PROPERTY IN ON AN INDIVIDUAL BASIS.
PLEASE AMEND YOUR ZONING, YOUR ZONING ORDINANCE.
THAT'S WHAT'S BEFORE YOU TONIGHT.
IF THIS IS ADOPTED BY THE BOARD AFTER THE HEARING ON APRIL 22ND, THEY THEN WOULD HAVE TO COME BACK IN AND GET AND FILE A NEW CONDITIONAL USE APPLICATION THAT WOULD GO TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WHO WOULD COME HERE FIRST FOR YOUR REVIEW AND RECOMMENDATION ON IT.
GO TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.
THEY WOULD HOLD ANOTHER HEARING.
THEY WOULD'VE TO PRESENT, CREATE AN EVIDENTIARY RECORD TO SHOW THAT THEY MEET ALL OF THE REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE FOR THIS USE.
IF THEY DO, AND THERE AREN'T NEIGHBORS THAT CAN APPEAR AND SHOW THAT IT'S GONNA BE, HAVE A DETRIMENTAL IMPACT GREATER THAN TYPICALLY EXPECTED, THEY WOULD GET THAT.
THEY WOULD THEN HAVE TO GO, COME IN OR GO TO THE ZONING HEARING BOARD FOR THE SPECIAL EXCEPTION RELATED TO THE TENNIS SLASH PICKLEBALL FACILITY.
AND THEN THEY COULD GO THROUGH TENTATIVE LAND DEVELOPMENT, WHICH COULD BE GOING ON SIMULTANEOUSLY, BUT PROBABLY WOULDN'T COME BEFORE YOU GUYS UNTIL THEY HAVE THOSE POINTS.
BUT, UM, SAM, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT I THINK ONE, WHAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT, UH, CAME UP IN THE, THE LAST DISCUSSION ABOUT AGRI RETAIN, 'CAUSE IT'S KIND OF A VAGUE TERM, BUT, WELL, I WAS GONNA ASK, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS.
WELL, I, I, MAYBE THE APPLICANT CAN, CAN, UH, SHED SOME MORE LIGHT ON IT.
BUT THE THING THAT I REMEMBER THAT CAUSED SOME CONSTERNATION AMONG THE PUBLIC WAS THE USE OF THE BARN AS A WEDDING VENUE.
AND THE POTENTIAL NOISE AND TRAFFIC AND THINGS THAT WOULD COME WITH THAT UNDER THIS UMBRELLA OF ENTERTAINMENT.
SO, UH, I THINK THAT, UH, AND I CAN SEE THAT.
SO, UM, SO COULD YOU EXPLAIN ENTERTAINMENT? SURE.
UM, IT, THIS IS HAPPENING ALL OVER PENNSYLVANIA IN COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE, UH, SOME HERITAGE THAT GOES BACK A COUPLE HUNDRED YEARS JUST LIKE THIS COMMUNITY IN ORDER TO PRESERVE OLD BARNS, OLD BUILDINGS AND SO FORTH.
UH, IT'S VERY DIFFICULT, UH, UNLESS YOU HAVE SOMEBODY IN LOVE WITH IT AND HAS A TON OF MONEY.
THE ONLY OTHER WAY TO DO IT IS TO ASK FOR THE ABILITY TO USE THOSE FACILITIES FOR ENTERTAINMENT OR AGRI SO THAT THAT CAN GENERATE MONEY TO RENOVATE THE BUILDINGS, MAKE THEM LOOK GOOD AND KEEP OPEN SPACE.
THERE ARE FOUR USES THAT ARE IN THE ORDINANCE THAT YOU'RE BEING ASKED TO CONSIDER, UH, TO RECOMMEND.
AND THOSE FOUR USES ARE FOR, AND I'M LOOKING AT SPECIFICALLY PAGE FOUR, UH, IN YOUR ORDINANCE PACKAGE ITEM C WELL, I'LL GIVE YOU A A MINUTE IF YOU WANT.
ACTUALLY, MIKE, I THINK YOU'RE LOOKING AT A LITTLE BIT OLDER VERSION BECAUSE AGAIN, MY MISTAKE OF PUTTING IT IN THAT PACKET OF INFORMATION.
YOU, YOU REALLY, THE LISTS ARE PRIVATE PARTIES, AGRICULTURAL THEME PLAY AREAS, VEGETABLE, FRUIT, FLOWER PICKING, FEEDING OF LIVESTOCK, RETAIL, SALE OF AGRICULTURAL COMMODITIES, AND MOBILE FOOD VENDORS IS DEFINED IN THE ORDINANCE.
GENERALLY, WHAT THIS ORDINANCE DOES DO IS IT SORT OF CODIFIES WHAT ALREADY HAPPENS AT A RAIDERS AND SOMEONE AT VA'S, NOT BARNARD'S, IT WAS VA'S, IT'S A RAIDER'S AND REDNERS FARM.
REGERS, NOT REDNER, REGERS, RENTERS REGERS.
SO, AND MRS A RAIDER HAS LOOKED AT THIS AND SHE'S COMFORTABLE WITH THIS ORDINANCE BECAUSE THIS, WHAT THEY DO ON THEIR SITE NOW IS SORT OF AN EXISTING NON-CONFORMITY.
THEY'VE DONE IT FOR SO LONG THAT I CAN'T SAY STOP, I CAN'T SAY YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO DO IT.
IT'S AN EXISTING NON-CONFORMITY TO OUR ORDINANCE TO ALLOW FOR TREE SALES AND THE RETAIL SALES AND THE FOOD SALES, THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT THEY ALREADY HAVE ON SITE.
WHAT THIS IS DOING IS IT'S KIND OF PLACING A BOX AROUND WHAT THEY ALL DO TO BETTER DEFINE IT SO THAT WE KNOW.
NOW, IF, YOU KNOW, HTC GOES ABOVE AND BEYOND, OR A RAIDER GOES ABOVE AND BEYOND, OR EVEN RENTERS OR THE ONE OF THE, THE OTHER PARCELS UP AT THE CORNER AT THE HOVAS FARM, AT THE CORNER OF, UM,
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WARTMAN AND TOWNSHIP LINE, IF THEY WERE TO START SOMETHING LIKE THIS, IT GIVES THEM PARAMETERS OF WHERE THEY, HOW THEY CAN USE THEIR FARM MORE THAN JUST GROWING, GROWING.OR ARE YOU, ARE YOU, ARE, ARE YOU, ARE YOU SAYING THAT THEY'RE DOING SOME OF THIS NOW? THEY ARE NOT, NO.
THE ONLY RED INTEGERS, THEY DO SALES OBVIOUSLY.
THEY HAVE PUMPKIN SALES, UM, AND, AND OTHER VEGETABLES AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S AN EXISTING NONCONFORMITY.
THEY'VE BEEN DOING IT, IT SORT OF FITS UNDER THE DEFINITION OF A FRUIT STAND OR A, A FARM STAND THAT'S IN THERE, BUT IT'S A LITTLE BIT BEYOND THAT.
AND, AND THEN A RAIDERS WHERE THEY HAVE THE, THE TREE SALES, THE TREE CUTTING DOWN THE PUMPKINS, UM, YOU KNOW, THEY'VE EXPANDED THAT A LITTLE BIT TO HAVE SOME STORY TIME IN THE, SOME OF THE, THE WAGON RIDES.
WAGON RIDES, THE FIRE PITS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO THE, I DO IT, IT'S INTERESTING, THIS PROPERTY, UM, FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND FROM LOOKING AT THE HISTORY OF IT IN THE SEVENTIES, UH, SIXTIES AND SEVENTIES, IT WAS, THE BARN WAS USED FOR, UM, SQUARE DANCING AND, UH, BARN DANCING.
AND UH, YOU KNOW, THEY, THEY HAD, UH, ANNOUNCEMENTS AND THAT KIND OF THING.
BUT TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTION DIRECTLY RIGHT NOW, NO, IT IS NOT BEING USED FOR THESE THINGS THAT ARE LISTED AND BACK IN THE SIXTIES AND SEVENTIES THAT WEREN'T ALL THESE HOMES RIGHT.
WHAT, WHAT, SO WHAT ARE THEY USING IT FOR TODAY? EXCUSE ME? WHAT ARE THEY USING IT FOR TODAY? UH, TODAY IT'S BEING USED AS, UH, RENTAL PROPERTY.
AND UH, AND THERE ARE ON OCCASION SOME ANIMALS THERE.
UM, AND IT IS ZONED AND ALREADY SUBDIVIDED FOR RESIDENTIAL HOUSING, BUT THEN IT TAKES AWAY THE OPEN SPACE, THE BARN, AND THE HERITAGE.
SO IF I UNDERSTAND, UM, I THOUGHT SOMEONE DURING OUR DISCUSSIONS SAID THAT THERE ARE SEVERAL PARCELS ON OLD STATE ROAD TO THE, UH, WEST OF THE BARN STRUCTURES AND WHATEVER, AND ALSO PLOT OF LOT, UH, PROPERTY TO THE EAST OF THAT, THAT WERE GOING TO MAIN BE MAINTAINED AS R ONE, MEANING THAT THERE COULD POSSIBLY BE RESIDENCE THERE.
HOWEVER, FROM THE PLANS THAT I'VE SEEN, ALL THAT PROPERTY BECOMES THIS AG AGGRO ATTAINMENT.
AND THERE'LL BE NO HOME DEVELOPMENTS.
IT WILL STRICTLY THAT, THAT'S THE PLAN I'M LOOKING AT.
SO THERE'LL BE NO, THE R ONE PLOTS OR LOTS, THE ONE, THE SUBDIVIDED LOTS WILL NOT BE DEVELOPED.
WELL, WELL, THAT'S NOT WHAT SHOWS ON THE MAP THAT YOU'RE SHOWING ME.
HOW, HOW LARGE IS THE MIDDLE PARCEL? 'CAUSE YOU'RE, YOU'RE THE ALL PARCELS TOGETHER AT 12 ACRES.
RIGHT? SO YOUR ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT ONLY ALLOWS ENTERTAINMENT IF IT'S 10 CONTIGUOUS ACRES.
IT, I'M SORRY, SAY THAT AGAIN.
THE ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT THAT YOU'RE PUTTING FORWARD ONLY ALLOWS AGRI IF IT'S 10 CONTIGUOUS ACRES.
SO IF YOU, YOU KNOW, IS HE SUGGESTING IF YOU, YOU, YOU WOULD NOT BE ABLE TO DEVELOP HOUSING ON THE TWO SIDE PARCELS BECAUSE THEN IT WOULD BE LESS THAN 10 CONTINUOUS DAYS? THAT'S CORRECT.
WELL, BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT, THAT'S NOT WHAT, WHAT I'M LOOKING AT HERE ON PAGE, UH, 28 OF NINE.
NO, HE'S GOT IT UP ON THE SCREEN.
YOU'RE LOOKING AT PAGE 28 OF 90 ALL STATE, ALL STATE ROAD, THOSE ARE THERE ON, THAT'S ALL GONNA BE DEVELOPED ALL ALONG STATE ROAD.
AND WHAT THE GREEN IS, THE LINES FOR THE, FOR THE, FOR THE PARCELS ARE STILL ON THE PLAN.
I DON'T THINK THEY WOULD TECHNICALLY GO AWAY, BUT BY PUTTING THIS DEVELOPMENT IN THERE, THE LAWN AREA AND THE PARKING LOT, THEY WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO BUILD A HOUSE AT THAT POINT THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT, AT THAT LARGE PLAN IN YOUR PACKET.
AND I APOLOGIZE MR. PETERS, BUT WHAT, THAT'S AN OVERLAY THAT OUR ENGINEER PUT TOGETHER TO SHOW WHAT WOULD BE THE COMPLETE BUILD OUT OF THE PROPERTY IF A NUMBER OF THINGS HAPPENED.
NUMBER ONE, IF, UH, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WOULD ALLOW FOR A ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT NUMBER TWO, IF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WOULD THEN ALLOW FOR US TO, UH, UH, PROMOTE A, WHAT'S CALLED A CONDITIONAL USE UNDER THE TEXT AMENDMENT, AND THEN THE BOARD CAN PUT CONDITIONS ON IT FOR US TO USE THIS PROPERTY FOR AG RETAINER.
THE, THAT'S THE ONLY WAY THIS GETS DEVELOPED AS YOU SEE IT.
IN ADDITION TO THAT, YOU WERE ALSO LOOKING AT, ON THAT PLAN, THE POSSIBILITY OF BOWL COURTS, WHICH IS ALREADY
[00:25:01]
PERMITTED, BUT THAT'S IN THE FUTURE.BUT WHAT THIS WAS DONE, WHAT WAS DONE HERE BY THE ENGINEER WAS TO OVERLAY THIS RIGHT ON TOP OF WHAT IS THE EXISTING LOT LINES ON THESE 12 LOTS.
SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS, IS THAT IF, IF, IF THE CONDITIONAL USE WERE TO BE APPROVED, UM, THIS IS ULTIMATELY WHAT COULD BE DEVELOPED AND THEREFORE, THEREFORE THERE WOULD BE NO MORE R ONE RIGHT.
SO, EXCUSE ME, JEFF, IF AT SOME POINT THEY COULD REDEVELOP THE SITE, I MEAN THAT'S, THAT'S REALISTIC.
IF, IF THEY WENT BACK TO, THEY DECIDED THAT ENTERTAINMENT WAS A COLOSSAL FLOP, AND I WOULD WISH THAT ON ANYBODY, BUT IF IT, IF IT DOESN'T WORK OUT, THEY COULD GO BACK TO HAVING RESIDENTIAL UNITS THERE AND THEY'D BE LIMITED TO THREE.
I MEAN, WE WOULDN'T, WOULDN'T GO BEYOND THAT.
I MEAN THAT I UNDERSTAND, BUT THE POINT IS, IS THAT ONCE APPROVED, IT'S A DONE DEAL, THEY COULD ALWAYS REVERT BACK.
LET ME, UM, YOU KNOW, THE PROBLEM IS, IS THAT THIS AGRI ENTITY IS, IS RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF A HUGE RESIDENTIAL COMMUNITY.
AND THAT'S THE THING THAT CONCERNS ME THE MOST.
I MEAN, UH, A RAIDER IS ON ONE 13, THAT'S A BIG THOROUGHFARE, OR WE'VE GOT MENNONITE ROAD.
THAT'S A WHOLE NOTHER TRAFFIC IS A WHOLE NOTHER ISSUE IN ANTHONY.
I MEAN, WE WON'T, I WON'T GO INTO THAT, ALL THOSE ISSUES HERE, BUT I'M JUST CONCERNED THAT, UM, AS, AS WAS COMMENTED, NOISE LEVEL, UM, YOU KNOW, UNTIL 11 O'CLOCK AT NIGHT, IT COULD BE, YOU KNOW, SEVEN DAYS A WEEK.
AND THOSE, THOSE ARE ABSOLUTE, THOSE ARE ABSOLUTELY VALID CONCERNS.
BUT JUST UNDERSTAND THE ZONING ISN'T CHANGING.
R ONE IS STILL THE ZONING DISTRICT.
THIS IS JUST AN ALLOWANCE WITHIN R ONE.
SO IT'S STILL ONLY ZONED R ONE ON DO THERE NEED TO BE REQUIREMENTS AND WILL HOPEFULLY, WILL THE SUPERVISORS HASH THAT OUT DURING THE HEARING OF NOISE CONTROLS AND TIMING CONTROLS? AND I THINK THAT'S ALREADY IN THE ORDINANCE SOMEWHAT, YOU KNOW, SO THAT THERE'S SOME PROTECTIONS FOR THOSE NEIGHBORS.
AND I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT ZACH AND I WOULD SUGGEST AT THAT HEARING, BUT AFTER, EVEN IF THIS PASSES, THE PROPERTY IS STILL ONLY ZONED R ONE.
SO THEY CAN'T DO WHAT'S IN THIS ULTIMATE PLEA.
NO, THEY CAN, BECAUSE THIS IS A SUBSECTION OF R ONE.
THIS ISN'T A STANDALONE DISTRICT.
THEY'RE NOT ASKING TO BE REZONED.
THEY, YOU KNOW, LIKE HOW WE WENT THROUGH WITH QUEST, WHERE WE WENT FROM I TWO TO CRSC.
THEY'RE ASKING FOR SOME NEW LANGUAGE TO BE AN R ONE.
AND THIS WOULD LIMIT IT TO ONLY R ONE PROPERTIES OF A CERTAIN SIZE IN THE TOWNSHIP.
AND AS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT BEFORE, THAT'S REALLY GERS THIS PROPERTY, OR RAIDER AND THE JEHOVAH'S FARM AND TOWNSHIP LINE AND, AND, UM, WARMAN.
YEAH, I, I THINK ONE OTHER POINT THAT NEEDS TO BE MADE IS THAT THE TOWNSHIP HAS A SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE THAT ESSENTIALLY ALLOWS LARGE EVENTS LIKE THIS TO HAPPEN ALMOST WITHOUT ANY REAL RESTRICTION ON THE NUMBER OF EVENTS PER YEAR.
AND THERE'S A PROCESS THAT'S IN THE ORDINANCE.
YOU CAN EITHER COME IN AND GET AN ANNUAL PERMIT OR YOU CAN DO IT EVENT BY EVENT.
AND ESSENTIALLY WHAT, IN LOOKING AT THIS ORDINANCE, WHAT WE DID IS WE WENT IN AND WE ADDED SOME MORE PROTECTIONS UNDER THAT ORDINANCE, UNDER THAT SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE TO WHAT THEY'RE PROPOSING.
ESSENTIALLY, THIS JUST ALLOWS THEM TO COME INTO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND SAY, HEY, THIS IS WHAT WE WANT TO DO.
THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS CAN IMPOSE RESTRICTIONS.
ANY OF THE RESTRICTIONS THAT ARE IN THIS VERSION OF THE ORDINANCE ARE ESSENTIALLY PULLED FROM THE SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE.
UH, THE TIME LIMITS ARE THE SAME AS IN THE SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE.
THE, THERE'S A PROVISION THAT ALLOWS THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO ESSENTIALLY IMPOSE ANY OF THE CONDITIONS THAT ARE IN THE SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE.
THERE'S REQUIREMENTS, RUN IDENTIFICATION, INSURANCE, ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF.
IF THEY THINK IT'S REASONABLE AND THE APPLICANT HAS THE OPPORTUNITY TO COME IN DURING THAT HEARING AND SAY WHY OR WHY NOT, IT IS PRACTICAL OR REASONABLE TO REQUIRE THOSE THINGS, THE BOARD CAN DECIDE WHETHER THAT'S A, THAT'S A CONDITION THAT THEY WANT TO IMPOSE.
BUT, UM, I, I, I THINK THAT IN MY MIND THIS BASICALLY JUST TAKES THAT SPECIAL EVENT ORDINANCE THAT THEY COULD DO ANYWAY AND PUTS IT IN A FORMAT WHERE THE BOARD CAN IMPOSE SOME CONDITIONS AROUND IT AND KIND OF BOX IT A LITTLE BIT AS TO
[00:30:01]
WHAT THEY CAN DO.LET ME GET SOME CLARIFICATION ON YOUR PLAN HERE.
AND I KNOW THIS IS JUST, YOU KNOW, A ROUGH SKETCH THAT SOMEBODY OVERLAY IT ON THING.
SO THE PROPERTY TO THE RIGHT OF THE POND WOULD BE YOU BEING OPEN ALL THAT.
HOW MANY ACRES IS THAT EVEN HAD IN? UH, I BELIEVE IT'S APPROXIMATELY FOUR ACRES, GIVE OR TAKE.
AND THAT WILL REMAIN OPEN SPACE? YES.
IT MIGHT BE PLANTED WITH A VINEYARD.
IT MIGHT BE PLANTED WITH, UM, FLOWERS.
UH, IT'S NOT GONNA BE BUILT ON.
AND THEN THE LAWN AREA WHERE YOU'RE CALLING LAWN AREA, WHAT'S THE PLAN FOR THAT? UH, THE LAWN AREA IS, IS GONNA BE EXACTLY AS, AS I, IT'S A LAWN.
IT'S JUST THE AREA, THE, THE FOUR ACRES OR SO ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE OF THE PLAN COULD VERY WELL BE IN AGRICULTURE.
THE LAWN AREA IS GONNA BE A LAWN.
AND THE PLAN FOR THAT WOULD BE TO, WHAT WOULD USE IT FOR WHAT PURPOSE? MAKE IT PRETTY WELL, I THINK IT'S ALSO THERE ARE OTHER USES, WHETHER IT'S A CORN MAZE OR SOME OF THE OTHER USES IN THERE FROM WHAT THEY'VE EXPRESSED TO ME.
WELL THAT, BUT THEN THERE PLAN ORDER TO MAKE THE CORN MADE.
WELL THAT DREW, I'LL LET MS. SCOTT EXPLAIN IT BETTER.
YEAH, IT'S JUST LOGAN SCOTT AND SHE'S PART OF THE DESIGN.
SO THAT OPEN LAWN SPACE IS GOING TO BE UTILIZED FOR, IF WE HAVE SUMMER CAMPS FOR KIDS.
UM, YOU COULD PUT FOOD BOUNCES, STUFF LIKE THAT OUT THERE.
YOU HAVE PEOPLE THERE FOR PICKLEBALL, LET'S SAY A SOCIAL ACTIVITIES.
UM, YOU COULD DO CORNHOLE TOURNAMENTS.
UH, YOU COULD PUT A TENT THERE FOR A WEDDING.
UM, BUT IT'S OPEN SPACE TO BE UTILIZED FOR THESE DIFFERENT EVENTS.
AND THEN EXPLAIN TO ME THE GREEN IN THERE.
'CAUSE I CAN'T READ IT 'CAUSE IT'S TOO SMALL.
WHAT'S THE GREEN AREAS? THE GREEN AREAS THAT STORMWATER.
YOU'VE LOOKED AT ALL THAT JUST ROUGHED IN IF WE'RE NOT DEVELOP NO, THIS IS ONLY A SKETCH.
I MEAN, I'VE SEEN THE PLAN, BUT THEY'RE NOT PLAN DEVELOPMENT.
YEAH, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO GO THROUGH A FULL WAY DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
UM, WELL GETTING INTO TENTATIVE, THAT'S JUST THE FIRST STEP IN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
SO ONCE THEY GO THROUGH ZONING TAX OR CONDITIONAL USE, SPECIAL EXCEPTION, THEN THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH LAND DEVELOPMENT.
SO THIS IS THE BEGINNING OF A LENGTHY PATH THAT THEY NEED TO GO DOWN.
THAT YOU'RE GONNA HAVE LOTS OF OPPORTUNITIES TO REVIEW THE TENNIS COURTS OF AIR.
NOW YOU KEEP THOSE, DOES THAT PLAY, DOES THAT BE CORRECT? THE TENNIS COURTS HAVE ALREADY BEEN RESURFACED AND THEY ARE FOR PICKLEBALL COURTS RIGHT NOW.
OKAY, BUT YOU ALREADY KEEP THOSE AT AREA.
AND WHAT ABOUT THE INDOOR PICKLE BALL? WOULD THAT BE LIKE A TENT, ONE OF THOSE BIG TENTS? NO, THAT'S LIKE A PROPOSED BUILDING.
IT'S GONNA BE A BUILDING, LIKE A FULL BUILDING.
BUT THE, TO YOUR GUYS' POINT, THE QUESTION IN FRONT OF US RIGHT NOW IS WHETHER OR NOT WE WANT TO ALLOW ENTERTAINMENT AS DEFINED IN THIS DRAFT ORDINANCE IN ANY R ONE LOTS THAT ARE OVER 10 CONTIGUOUS AREAS AT THESE TIMES OF DAY.
AND HAVE, THEY HAVE TO HAVE HISTORICAL STRUCTURES THAT WERE USED FOR AGRICULTURE SUCH AS BARNS, YOU KNOW, THE BARN YOU LOOK AT THINKING THAT A WEDDING VENUE OR PARTY, I'M SORRY, A WEDDING VENUE OR A PARTY VENUE OR YOU RENT IT OUT FOR PARTIES BIRTHDAY, WHATEVER.
AND, AND, UH, THE, THE, THE IDEA IS TO RENOVATE THIS INTO A VERY BEAUTIFUL, UH, HISTORICAL STRUCTURE.
AND THEN HOLD EVENTS IN IT AND THE POND WOULD STAY, YOU'RE GONNA CLEAN IT UP SURE.
BECAUSE SOMETIMES IT GETS KIND OF FUNKY.
IT'S COVERED ANALOGY ALL SUMMER, IT'S REAL FUNKY.
ALL OF A SUDDEN WON'T GO IN THERE.
WE'VE ALSO PROVISION IN THE ORDINANCE, WHICH IS KIND OF DIFFERENT FOR OUR ORDINANCE, THAT REQUIRES THEM TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S UP TO BUILDING CODE.
I DON'T NORMALLY CONFLATE THE TWO JUST BECAUSE I THINK IT'S SOMETIMES I THINK BUILDING CODE AND ZONING CODE AUTOMATICALLY CONFLICT, BUT WE PUT IT IN HERE TO MAKE SURE THAT THE, THAT ANY, UM, CONVERTED STRUCTURES REALLY DO MEET THE, THE CURRENT BUILDING CODE FOR SAFETY REASONS.
AND THAT THAT WAS A CONCERN OF THE FIRE MARSHAL AND SURE.
AND I'M ONLY ASKING THESE QUESTIONS.
I WASN'T HERE FOR THE OTHER ONE, SO I APOLOGIZE.
I'M JUST TRYING TO GET A, A BASE OF WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO DO.
WHAT ABOUT THE HOUSE? WHAT'S THE PLAN FOR THE HOUSE? THE PLAN FOR THE HOUSE, AND I, I, I WILL LET LOGAN SPEAK TO THIS, BUT RIGHT NOW THE PLAN FOR THE HOUSE WOULD BE LIKELY A, UM, A PLACE WHERE A BRIDE, A GROOM, A FAMILY, WHOEVER'S GOING TO HAVE A SPECIAL EVENT, WOULD HAVE A PLACE TO STAY AND WOULDN'T HAVE TO BE MOVING IN AND OUT BACK AND FORTH IF THEY WERE GOING TO HAVE AN EVENT AT THE SPACE.
AGAIN, RENOVATIONS, OLD BUILDING, MAKE IT LOOK REALLY NICE.
ONE MORE, ONE MORE QUESTION THEN I APOLOGIZE.
UM, LIKE I SAID, I'M JUST TRYING TO GET A LAY OF LAND HERE.
HOW MANY LOTS WERE PROPOSING THIS THING, JEFF? THE 12 ACRES, HOW MANY LOTS WERE APPROVED ORIGINALLY BUILDING LOTS THREE ON
[00:35:01]
THE OLD STATE SIDE AND THEN THERE WASN'T A SUBDIVISION FOR THE, LET'S SAY THE, THE PLAN SIDE TO THE RIGHT THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT.THERE'S NOTHING TO PLACE, THERE'S NOTHING OVER THERE.
BUT I WOULD ASSUME THAT THAT'S PROBABLY ABOUT THREE LOTS.
THIS, THIS SUBDIVISION WAS DONE AS PART OF THE COBB QUAKER, WHICH WAS FOX RUN AND EVERYTHING SOUTH OF, OF THAT.
IT WAS A LARGER DEVELOPMENT AND THIS WAS SORT OF WHAT WE CALL LOP SPACE LEFTOVER AFTER PLANNING.
NO, UH, I WAS JUST, UH, IF I UNDERSTAND ZACH CORRECTLY, RIGHT, IT'S REALLY UP TO THE BOARD OF, OF SUPERVISORS TO SORT OF IMPOSE ANY RESTRICTIONS.
IT'S NOT SORT OF OUR, UH, PURVIEW TO DO THAT, BUT IS ONE OF OUR ACTION STEPS PERHAPS TO RECOMMEND THAT, UH, THE BOARD CONSIDER, UH, IMPOSING SOME LIMITATIONS.
LIKE FOR EXAMPLE, INSTEAD OF 11 O'CLOCK SOMETHING EARLIER ON A SATURDAY NIGHT AND BEING SENSITIVE TO WHAT WE HEARD FROM THE COMMUNITY, RIGHT? YEAH.
SO, SO THAT IMPOSING CONDITIONS AND MAKING RECOMMENDATIONS LIKE THAT WOULD COME WHEN THEY SUBMIT THE CONDITIONAL USE APPLICATION WHEN THEY ACTUALLY COME.
AND THEN THERE'S GONNA BE A HEARING FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS THAT WILL COME HERE FIRST.
THEN WE HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY, SIR, AND YOU GUYS CAN TALK ABOUT THAT, HEAR WHAT THEY WANT TO DO.
THEY'LL PROBABLY GIVE YOU MORE DETAILS ABOUT HOW THE OPERATION'S GONNA WORK.
AND AFTER HEARING THAT, YOU CAN THEN PROVIDE SOME RECOMMENDED CONDITIONS THAT COULD BE IMPOSED BY THE BOARD.
UM, AND IN TERMS OF THE HOURS OF OPERATION, I THINK THAT WE, SO, UH, SUBSECTION 10 WE TATE EVENTUALLY COMMITTED DURING THE FOLLOWING HOURS UNLESS SPECIFICALLY ALLOWED DURING EARLIER OR LATER TIMES BY THE BOARD SUPERVISORS.
AND IT'S, UH, 10:00 AM TO 10:00 PM MONDAY TO THURSDAY, 10:00 AM TO 11:00 PM FRIDAY AND SATURDAY AND 10:00 AM TO 8:00 PM ON SUNDAY.
THAT MIRRORS WHAT'S IN THE SPECIAL EVENT ORDINANCE.
I GUESS AGAIN, I'M JUST WONDERING THAT THAT'S SORT OF THE GLOBAL, WHAT THAT ORDINANCE SAYS, BUT THIS IS A SPECIFIC SITE AND PERHAPS IT WARRANTS SOME DIFFERENT CONDITIONS.
AND, AND I THINK THAT, I THINK THAT TO THE EXTENT THAT, I THINK THAT THOSE DETAILS AREN'T REALLY BEFORE THE PLANNING COMMISSION RIGHT NOW NECESSARILY.
I THINK WHEN THEY COME BACK IN, IF, IF YOU HEAR THEM SAY, HEY, THIS IS HOW WE WANT TO OPERATE, THIS IS WHAT WE WANT TO DO.
IF THEY MAKE A COMPELLING CASE THAT THEY NEED MORE OR LESS HOURS, OR IF YOU FEEL THAT HEY, YOU, YOU GUYS ARE IN A RESIDENTIAL AREA, IT SHOULD BE LESS THAN THAT.
YOU CAN MAKE THAT RECOMMENDATION.
UM, BUT RIGHT NOW IT JUST MIRRORS WHAT THEY'RE ALLOWED TO DO UNDER THE SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE.
CAN I ASK YOU A COUPLE QUESTIONS ON THERE? YES, PLEASE.
UM, SO I'M, I NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE, THE SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE AND INTER INTER INTER OR OVERLAP RATHER WITH THIS ONE.
SO WHY DO ANY HOURS OR, YOU KNOW, RESTRICTIONS ON NOISE, ET CETERA, NEED TO BE DEFINED IN THE USE IN THE ZONING TEXT? IF THERE'S ALREADY, WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO COME FOR EVERY SINGLE WEDDING OR ANNUALLY FOR A SPECIAL EVENT PERMIT? THEY NO, THEY CURRENTLY CAN'T HOLD ALL THESE EVENTS.
BY COMING IN AND GETTING A SPECIAL EVENT PERMIT, THEY CAN GET ONE, THEY CAN GET AN ANNUAL PERMIT OR THEY CAN GET A, UH, EVENT BY EVENT.
SO PUTTING THOSE RESTRICTIONS, ESPECIALLY ESSENTIALLY THIS IS JUST ALLOWING THEM TO NOT HAVE TO NECESSARILY COME IN FOR EVERY EVENT.
SO THEY WOULD NOT NEED TO GET A SPECIAL EVENT.
THEY WOULD NOT NEED TO COME IN AND DO, BUT THEY CURRENTLY CAN DO THAT IF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS APPROVES THE SPECIAL EVENT? NO, THEY CAN.
I MEAN, BUT THE, THE PERMITS, AS LONG AS THEY MEET THE CRITERIA, THEY'RE ENTITLED TO THE PERMIT.
SO IN EXCHANGE FOR NOT HAVING, I THINK IF I CAN, ZACH, IN EXCHANGE FOR NOT HAVING TO COME IN EVERY YEAR OR EVERY TIME FOR THE SPECIAL EVENT, THERE'S GONNA BE PARAMETERS BOXED AROUND THIS USE MM-HMM
SO THERE IS A USE THAT'S PERMITTED ALREADY.
NOW WE CAN DO IT AND, AND MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE LONG-TERM ABILITY AND PUT MONEY INTO THE PROJECT, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, WE HAVE TO MEET CONDITIONS THAT ARE NOT NECESSARILY IN THE SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE RIGHT NOW.
AND SOME OF THAT CAN BE, YOU KNOW, VEGETATIVE SCREENING, FENCING, THINGS LIKE THAT TO KIND OF PROTECT THE NEIGHBORS, UH, CAN BE REQUIRING CERTAIN SOUNDPROOFING IN THE BUILDING SO THAT IF THEY ARE USING MUSIC OR SOUND SYSTEMS OR THINGS LIKE THAT, THEY, IF THEY CAN ONLY DO IT INSIDE THE BUILDING AFTER A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF TIME OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, UM, THOSE ARE ALL ALLOWABLE CONDITIONS.
WHEN YOU PUT A CONDITION ON A CONDITIONAL USE APPLICATION, IT HAS TO BE BASED ON SOMETHING IN THE ORDINANCE.
SO ESSENTIALLY THIS IS GIVING THE BOARD THE BASIS FOR, HEY, YOU CAN GO TO THE SPECIAL EVENT OR EVENTS ORDINANCE AND TAKE ANY OF THE CONDITIONS AND REQUIREMENTS THERE IF YOU FEEL THAT THEY'RE APPROPRIATE AND BRING THEM OVER AND KIND OF IMPOSE THEM ON THIS USE TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT HAVING ANY DETRIMENTAL IMPACT ON THE NEIGHBORS.
[00:40:01]
NOW, IF THEY DIDN'T, 'CAUSE ONE THING I NOTICED THE WEEKDAY HOURS CHANGED IN THIS TEXT VERSUS THE ONE WE SAW LAST TIME.SO IF, IF YOU DIDN'T HAVE THIS EXTRA, YOU KNOW, UH, YOU KNOW, USE CONDITIONAL USE, YOU WOULD BE ABLE TO, RIGHT NOW WITHOUT ANY CHANGE, GO TO GET A SPECIAL EVENT PERMIT TO HOLD A WEDDING ON A THURSDAY UNTIL 10:00 PM ON THEIR PROPERTY.
AND ALL THEY WOULD NEED TO DO IS GET AN ADMINISTRATIVE PERMIT OR THEY'D HAVE TO GO TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO GET THE, IT IS ADMINISTRATIVE, IT'S THROUGH THE FIRE MARSHAL AND THEN THEY WOULD'VE TO MEET ALL THE REQUIREMENTS THAT ARE IN THE YEAH.
AND, AND THEY WOULD HAVE, AND THE FIRE MARSHAL DOES THIS CURRENTLY WITH THE EXPO CENTERS.
THEY, THEY SORT HAVE A SET NUMBER OF EVENTS EVERY YEAR THAT THEY TALK ABOUT.
AND A LOT OF THEM ARE REOCCURRING.
SO THEY, THEY HAVE ALREADY WORKED THROUGH A LOT OF THE ISSUES, THE GUN SHOWS, THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT THEY'VE ALREADY WORKED THROUGH.
BUT THEN WHEN THERE'S NEW EVENTS THAT AREN'T IN THE NORM, THEN THEY COME BACK AND THEY WORK THROUGH A SPECIAL EVENT PERMIT ON THAT.
AND ESSENTIALLY THE BARN MARSHAL, YOU KNOW, SINCE IT'S ADMINISTRATIVE, DOESN'T HAVE A, A LOT OF LEEWAY TO DECLINE IT AS LONG AS IT MEETS THE REQUIREMENTS IN THE SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE.
AND HE ALSO DOESN'T HAVE A LOT OF, HE DOESN'T HAVE ANY LEEWAY TO REQUIRE EXTRA BUFFERING OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, THAT THE BOARD COULD IMPOSE.
THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT, JUST TALKING ABOUT.
BUT THIS DOES, DOES SAY THAT IT WILL INCLUDE, UH, PHYSICAL SCREENING BUFFERING OTHER APPROPRIATE MEANS, PREVENT ADVERSE IMPACTS ON NEIGHBORING PROPERTIES SUCH AS ODOR NOISE, DUST VIBRATION, SMOKE FLARE.
IF THIS, WE WROTE THAT INTO THE ORDINANCE, YOU'RE GIVING US THAT.
AND I, I THINK WHAT I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND IS WHAT YOU COULD DO NOW VERSUS WHAT THIS WOULD DO FOR THE TOWNSHIP.
AND IT SOUNDS LIKE RIGHT NOW YOU COULD HOST A WEDDING UNTIL 10:00 PM ON MONDAY, AS LONG AS YOU PROVE TO THE FARM MARSHAL THAT WAS GONNA BE DONE SAFELY.
AM I UNDERSTANDING THAT GENERALLY YES.
I, I CAN'T SPEAK FOR THE FIRE MARSHAL AND WHAT HIS REQUIREMENTS ARE, BUT GENERALLY, YES.
AND WE ALSO, THERE'S ALSO LANGUAGE IN HERE AROUND SCREENING OF LIKE WASTE FACILITIES.
SO IF THEY HAVE DUMPSTERS, ANYTHING LIKE THAT.
SO IF KEEP IT A CERTAIN DISTANCE FROM NEIGHBOR PROPERTIES.
SO THEN IF THIS PASSED, THEN YOU WOULD HAVE TO GET A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT AND THE SUPERVISORS, I GUESS WITH OR WITHOUT OUR RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE ABLE TO IMPOSE ADDITIONAL RESTRICTIONS TO DEAL WITH NOISE AND TIME OF DAY AND THAT SORT OF A THING.
I MEAN, IF THEY HAVE TO BE RELATED TO THE ORDINANCE, WHICH IS WHY THERE ARE SO MANY CONDITIONS IN THE ORDINANCE, WHICH WILL ALLOW THE SUPERVISORS TO RELATE BACK TO THEM AND YES.
SO THEY BE, WELL, SO WHY DO YOU WANT, THIS? SOUNDS LIKE IT GIVES YOU LESS, IT IT ALSO GIVES THEM I THINK, A LITTLE BIT MORE LATITUDE.
THEY UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY CAN DO WITH THEIR PROPERTY AND IT'S NOT A CONFLICT EVERY TIME.
IF THEY WERE TO HAVE AN EVENT AND I HAPPEN TO DRIVE BY OR THE FIRE MARSHAL HAPPENS TO DRIVE BY OR THE POLICE HAPPEN TO GET CALLED OUT THERE, IT'S NOT LIMITING.
IT'S, IT'S UNDERSTANDING WHAT THEIR PARAMETERS OF WHAT THEY CAN DO ON THEIR PROPERTY.
JUST LIKE WITH ANY ZONING REQUIREMENT, IT'S, THEY'RE TAKING A SHARED BURDEN ON HAVING MORE, UH, MORE CONDITIONS ON IT, BUT THEY'RE UNDERSTANDING BETTER WHAT THEY CAN AND CAN'T DO WITH THEIR PROPERTY AND HOW OFTEN THEY CAN AND CAN'T DO.
WELL IT ALSO DEFINES THEIR BUSINESS MODEL SO THAT THEY CAN PUT MONEY INTO THE PROPERTY, WHICH IS NOT A BAD THING.
YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE A DEFINED BUSINESS NOW THAT IS, IS BINGO ALL UNDER THING.
NOW THEY CAN INVEST IN THEIR BUSINESS AND THAT'S NOT A BAD THING FOR THE COUNTRY WITHOUT BEING FEARFUL, WITHOUT BEING GONNA CHANGE SOMETHING CHANGES A BIG MEANS ZONING OFFICE, A DIFFERENT, DIFFERENT ZONING GUY, DIFFERENT COMMISSION PLANNING COMMISSION AND THEY'RE ALL RIGHT BACK AND FRONT.
SO, AND, AND THEY'RE, I'LL ALSO NOTE THAT THERE IS A PROVISION IN HERE THAT SAYS THAT ANY SUBSTANTIAL MATERIAL CHANGE IN THE PROPOSED OPERATION OF THE AGRI DEVELOPMENT OF THE OPERATION, IF THAT CHANGES, THEN THEY HAVE TO COME BACK IN FOR A NEW CONDITIONAL USE.
SO IF SOMEONE ELSE TAKES OVER AND THEY WANT TO OPERATE A DIFFERENT TYPE OF FACILITY THAT MAYBE STILL FALLS IN THE DEFINITION, THEY WOULD NEED TO COME BACK.
I THINK I, IS THERE ANYBODY ELSE IN THE, UH, IN THE AUDIENCE THAT WANTS TO MAKE ANY COMMENTS ON THIS? OKAY, WELL, UM, YOU KNOW, I THINK ANYTHING, OH, I'M SORRY.
YOU HAVE TO COME UP FRONT AND IDENTIFY YOURSELF AND YOUR ADDRESS AND ALL THAT STUFF.
MY NAME'S JACK LORENZO AND I LIVE ON THE CORNER OF OLD STATE
I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO IT, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU.
IT'S, IT'S NOT ONLY GONNA BE A PLACE TO GO.
I'M NOT WORRIED ABOUT TRAFFIC.
IF YOU EVER STOOD ON MY CORNER, YOU'LL KNOW WHAT TRAFFIC'S REALLY LIKE.
FOR THEM TO COME IN FOR AN EVENT.
THERE'S NOTHING, UH, THERE'S 500 AND SOME CARS THAT GO PAST MY ASS EVERY SINGLE DAY.
SO I'M NOT WORRIED ABOUT THE TRAFFIC NOISE.
[00:45:01]
I'M SURE THEY'LL MAKE SURE THEY GUARANTEED ME THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE GONNA PUT ENOUGH BUFFERING IN AND THIS AND THAT, THAT THERE WON'T BE MUCH NOISE OVER THE YEARS, INCLUDING JUST BEFORE IT WAS SOLD.WE'D GO OVER FOR THE HOO NIES.
NOT ONE NEIGHBOR COMPLAINT, NOT ONE.
SO, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT WORRIED ABOUT THAT KIND STUFF.
AND THE GAME BONES ARE VERY GOOD PEOPLE, I THINK.
AND THEY WOULDN'T DO ANYTHING TO RUIN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
IN FACT, MY CASE, I THINK MY PROPERTY VALUE IS GOING TO GO UP.
BECAUSE THERE'LL BE A PLACE TO GO.
I THINK THAT YOU SHOCKED ME WHEN YOU WALKED UP HERE.
HE CAN TELL YOU THAT
I'M USED TO GETTING THE OTHER COMMENT.
I DON'T THINK SHE'S A RESIDENT.
WE NEED TO ID HER NAME, ADDRESS.
HE DOESN'T LIKE YOU'RE WELCOME.
A LOT OF PEOPLE DON'T LIKE IT, SO DON'T WORRY ABOUT IT.
UM, I LIVE ON MENNONITE ROAD, ALTHOUGH I DON'T LIVE ACROSS THE STREET FROM THE PROPOSED FACILITY.
I JUST WANT TO GIVE MY SUPPORT FOR IT.
I KNOW THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF CONCERN BY NEIGHBORS THAT ARE IN FOX RUN ABOUT TRAFFIC, ABOUT NOISE AND DIFFERENT THINGS LIKE THAT.
BUT AS JACK HAS ALREADY STATED, WHEN PEOPLE ASK ME WHERE I LIVE, I TELL 'EM ON THE HIGHWAY TO WAGMAN'S BECAUSE THAT'S EXACTLY, I MEAN, SOMETIMES IT'S HARD TO GET OUT OF MY DRIVEWAY.
BUT SOMEHOW I MANAGE, UM, I THINK I THINK ABOUT THE 55 PLUS COMMUNITY DOWN THE STREET AS WELL.
UM, I SEE THOSE WOMEN AND MEN WALKING DOWN MY STREET ALL THE TIME.
AND I THINK HOW WONDERFUL IT WOULD BE TO HAVE SOME TYPE OF, UH, FACILITY OF ENTERTAINMENT IN THIS, IN THIS TOWNSHIP ALL WE HAVE IS HOMES.
YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOWHERE TO GO TO HAVE A, A NICE PARTY OR, OR DO PICKLEBALL LIMERICK PUT PICKLEBALL COURTS IN.
I'M SURE YOU'RE AWARE AND THERE'S RESIDENTS THAT LIVE OVER THERE.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'VE SPOKEN TO ANYBODY, LIMERICK, BUT I ALSO WANTED TO ALSO POINT OUT, AND I DON'T KNOW THE SPECIFICS OF, OF HOW, HOW THEY'RE GOING TO ACTUALLY RUN THE FACILITY.
WILL PEOPLE BRING THEIR OWN PICKLEBALL PADDLES OR WILL THEY BE PROVIDING THEM? BUT IF THEY ARE PROVIDING THEM, THERE ARE NOW PADDLES THAT THEY HAVE DEVELOPED TO MITIGATE THE SOUND.
SOME PLAYERS ARE ANNOYED NOW 'CAUSE NOW THEY DON'T HEAR THAT SOUND TO KIND OF GIVE 'EM THE INDICATION THAT THE BALL'S, YOU KNOW, COMING.
SO THERE ARE WAYS THAT, YOU KNOW, THE, THE NOISE CAN BE MITIGATED.
I DO KNOW THAT IN THE PAST, IF YOU, YOU CAN LOOK UP ALL THE ARTICLES, WHICH I'M SURE YOU HAVE.
BUT TECHNOLOGY HAS COME A LONG WAY TO REDUCE THAT.
SO I THINK IT'S A GREAT, UM, WAY TO PRESERVE THE PROPERTY, UM, INSTEAD OF JUST HAVING MORE HOMES.
UM, AND IT'S ALREADY BEEN STATED.
PART OF THAT IS AGRICULTURE STILL, RIGHT? YES.
WELL, YOU KNOW, WE COULD HAVE SOME COWS MAYBE, MAYBE SOME PIG, I DON'T KNOW, SOMETHING.
RIGHT? YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW ABOUT YOU, BUT I'M JUST, I MEAN, WE'VE GOT, UM, PARK HOUSE GETTING READY RIGHT.
WHAT WE NEED IS MORE ENTERTAINMENT.
KEEP THE DOLLARS HERE IN OUR COMMUNITY.
OTHERWISE I HAVE TO KEEP GOING ELSEWHERE, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE THERE'S NOTHING, HERE'S JUST NOTHING HERE TO DO, YOU KNOW, SO THANK YOU.
HOW'S IT GOING? MY NAME IS, UH, MICHAEL VINCENT PLAO.
I LIVE, I'M 4 43 SOUTH MNET ROAD.
I'M CURRENTLY 18 YEARS OF AGE.
UM, WHEN I WAS A KID, THINGS LIKE THIS DIDN'T REALLY EXIST.
SO I'M NOT WELL OUT OF THAT RANGE OF, UH, HOW OLD ARE YOU? 18.
SO YOU WERE A KID WAY BACK IN THE OLD DAYS, HUH? YEAH.
YOU REMEMBER THE SQUARE DAYS? OKAY.
I HAD TO GO TO MY SCHOOL ON THE SNAIL.
BUT, UM, THINGS LIKE THIS DIDN'T EXIST.
WE JUST HAD WEGMANS TO GO TO AND THAT GOT BORING AFTER A WHILE.
15-YEAR-OLD KID JUST BIKING DOWN THE WEGMANS ALL THE TIME.
NOT MUCH TO DO THIS COULD GIVE KIDS THE OPPORTUNITY THAT MAYBE I DIDN'T HAVE.
TO GO PLACES, DO SOMETHING FUN, DO SOMETHING INTERESTING, HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF DIVERSITY.
BECAUSE NOT EVERYBODY CAN BIKE DOWN TO THE YMCA ALRIGHT.
OR BIKE DOWN TO PROVIDENCE TALENT CENTER OR OTHER PLACES.
THIS COULD GIVE THAT DIVERSITY, GET TO DO SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT AND, UH, BE MORE FUN.
ANYBODY ELSE? OH, WE GOT ANOTHER ONE.
HUH? ALL OF A SUDDEN WE'VE GOT CRACK.
[00:50:01]
I'M, UH, JIM MULLEN.I LIVE AT, UH, 2 0 6 COUNTRY RIDGE DRIVE, WHICH IS CAT CORNER FROM, I COULD WALK THERE.
UH, AND I'LL, I'LL SPEAK FOR THE 60 PLUS GROUP HERE.
SO PICKLEBALL INSIDE A LIFETIME ACTIVITY.
THIS COULD BE A PLACE WHERE PEOPLE COULD, KIDS COULD RIDE THEIR BICYCLES TO, AND, YOU KNOW, AND PLAY PICKLEBALL.
UM, WHERE WOULD YOU GO IF YOU HAD TO HAVE A PARTY FOR 50 OR 60 PEOPLE? RIGHT.
YOU KNOW, LIKE THE OLD FIRE HOLES ARE BEING, YOU KNOW, TORN DOWN AND TURNED INTO APARTMENTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO I THINK IT, IT, IT SERVES A LOT OF PARISH PEOPLE AND I MEAN, A LOT OF PURPOSES.
AND FRANKLY I'M SURPRISED I HAVEN'T DIED AT PULLING IN OUT OF RENTERS YET.
UM, YOU KNOW, SO, UH, I GET MY TOMATOES THERE ALL, ALL SUMMER LONG.
BUT I THINK IT'S A GREAT THING.
UH, I, I MET LOU AND UH, THEY HAD A MEETING OVER THERE AND IT WAS REALLY A POWERFUL MEETING AND THERE WAS A LOT OF SUPPORT THERE FROM THE NEIGHBORS.
PICKLE BALLS DON'T MAKE THAT MUCH NOISE.
I THINK IT'S A GREAT OPPORTUNITY, UH, TO PRESERVE A LITTLE OPEN SPACE.
ANYONE ELSE? ANYONE ELSE? NOPE.
I MEAN, I, I AGREE WITH THAT LADY THAT WAS UP HERE, MR. MR. PLANO ABOUT, YOU KNOW, ANYTHING THAT STOPS MORE HOUSES BEING BUILT IN OUR, OUR TOWNSHIP I THINK IS A GOOD THING.
EVEN IF IT'S ONLY SIX OR EIGHT OR WHATEVER THIS WOULD HOLD.
WE DON'T NEED ANY MORE HOUSING.
UM, I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS GONNA BE OPEN FOR KIDS.
IT LOOKS A LITTLE PRETTY NICE, PRETTY EXCLUSIVE.
I DON'T THINK THEY WANT A BUNCH OF KIDS ON BIKES, UH, TORN THROUGH IT, BUT I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE THEY WOULD FIND A USE WORD.
UM, AGAIN, MY, MY PREMISE IS IF WE COULD STOP MORE HOUSING BEING BUILT IN, I THINK IT'S OKAY.
SO ANYHOW, ANY OTHER COMMENTS? NO.
DOES ANYBODY WANT TO MAKE ANY KIND OF RECOMMENDATION FOR, OR AGAIN, I'LL STEP OUT AND MAKE IT
I WOULD, UH, I'LL PUT A, UH, A RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISORS THAT WE APPROVE THIS TEXT AMENDMENT AND, UM, AND, UH, MOVE TO THE NEXT PHASE AND LET THEM HAVE THEIR HEARING ON THE 23RD AND, UH, 22ND.
NOBODY SHOW UP ON THE 23RD, UH, 22ND.
AND, UM, MOVE THIS TO, UH, HOPEFULLY A A 'CAUSE I THINK THE PROPERTY DOES NEED IMPROVEMENT.
IF YOU GO DRIVE PAST THE PROPERTY, IT CERTAINLY NEEDS IMPROVEMENT.
IT'S NICE 'CAUSE IT IS OPEN, BUT IT STILL NEEDS SOME IMPROVEMENT.
LIKE I SAY, THAT FUNKY LAKE IS JUST SCARY IN THE SUMMERTIME.
UM, SO I, I'LL PUT A RECOMMENDATION THAT WE UH, WE MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO SUPERVISORS TO MOVE THIS TEXT AMENDMENT FORWARD.
AND, UH, I'LL, I'LL TAKE A SECOND IF ANYBODY WANTS OR TO DISAGREE.
CAN I ASK HIM ONE MORE QUESTION BEFORE? OH, SURE.
SO I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND THAT THE HOURS COMPONENT MM-HMM
AND I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND THIS CORRECTLY.
THIS, THEY ALREADY, THEY WOULD ALREADY HAVE THE ABILITY TO HOLD AN EVENT UNTIL 10:00 PM ON MONDAY, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER OR NOT THE ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT PASSED.
CORRECT? RIGHT NOW THE SPECIAL EVENTS ORDINANCE SAYS THAT UNLESS ADVANCE APPROVAL IS OBTAINED, THE STANDARD HOURS OF OPERATION SHALL BE AS FOLLOWS.
MONDAY TO THURSDAY, 10:00 AM TO 10:00 PM FRIDAY AND SATURDAY, 10:00 AM TO 11:00 PM SUNDAY, 10:00 AM TO 8:00 PM WITH A PERMIT THAT THAT'S COMING IN AND GETTING THE PERMIT.
BUT THEY CAN DO IT, THEY CAN DO AN ANNUAL I UNDERSTAND.
I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING.
AND THEN THIS ALSO AS WRITTEN, WOULD CONFINE THE PRIVATE PARTIES AND EVENTS.
SO PRESUMABLY THE WEDDINGS OR ANY SORT OF EVENT FULLY WITHIN THOSE STRUCTURES.
SO THAT'S THE WAY THAT THE ORDINANCE IS WRITTEN.
I ASK AGAIN THEN I HAVE A MOTION ON THE TABLE.
DO I HAVE A SECOND OR DO I HAVE A, UH, COUNTER PROPOSAL OR DO WE JUST WANT TO GO HOME? I WILL SECOND.
ALRIGHT, WE'VE GOT A SECOND THEN I WILL ASK FOR A VOTE.
ALL IN FAVOR OF MOVING THIS ORDINANCE, UH, TO THE SUPERVISORS.
A RECOMMENDATION TO SUPERVISORS SAY AYE.
WE'LL LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING, UH, YOU I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING THE NEXT STEP.
WE JUST CLEAN UP THAT LITTLE POND ARE ALL RIGHT.
SO THAT BRINGS US TO THE THIRD BEFORE WE MOVE FORWARD.
WAS THERE SOME OBJECTIONS YOU GUYS HAD THAT YOU WERE NOT GOING TO SAY OR? NO, IT, IT WASN'T
[00:55:01]
SO MUCH AN OBJECTION.IT'S JUST THAT I I ALMOST WANTED TO SAY I, I ABSTAINED.
AND, UM, WELL, MY QUESTION IS NOT, NOT TO ASK WHAT YOUR VOTE, 'CAUSE YOU ALREADY MADE IT, BUT I KNOW MY QUESTION IS, WHAT WHAT WAS YOUR UH, UH, I I JUST, I'M JUST STILL CONCERNED THAT THIS ENTERTAINMENT ENVIRONMENT IS IN THE MIDST OF A LARGE RESIDENTIAL COMMUNITY AND I JUST DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT'S GONNA BRING.
I MEAN, THERE ARE PEOPLE SAYING, GEE, IT'S A GREAT, I MEAN, IT SOUNDS LIKE, UH, PLAYGROUND.
BUT I'M SAYING, YOU KNOW, THAT WOULD BE ONE THING.
YOU KNOW, THIS, THIS ISN'T ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THE NOISE ISSUES, BUT THAT ALL IS YET TO BE PLAYED OUT.
I NEED TO SEE YOU ALL REALIZE WE HAVE 2000 UNITS RIGHT NOW.
WE CAN'T HAVE SIX MORE HOMES IS FINE.
NOW YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT OTHER DEVELOPMENTS THAT ARE ON THE TABLE.
WELL, UNFORTUNATELY WE COULDN'T STOP THEM.
BUT OTHER, OTHER, NOW WE CAN'T.
THERE ARE OTHER OTHERS THAT ARE ON THE TABLE THAT WE HAVE AN ABILITY TO DEAL WITH.
WE CAN DEAL WITH 'EM, BUT WE CAN'T STOP 'EM.
WELL, BUT WE CAN CONTROL THEM HOPEFULLY, LIKE WE DID PARKHOUSE.
WELL, PARKHOUSE IS ANOTHER DON'T FREAK.
I DON'T WANT TO GO TO PARKHOUSE.
I MEAN THAT'S, WELL, WE WEREN'T ABLE TO CONTROL TOO MUCH.
I UNDERSTAND HOW MUCH WE CONTROL, BUT THAT MAY BE WHAT HAPPENS WITH THESE OTHERS IS WE END UP, LET'S HOPE SO.
I I'M JUST SAYING SIX HOUSES DON'T BOTHER ME IN THE TOWNSHIP TODAY.
IT, IT IS THE OTHER THOUSAND 1500 THAT ARE ON THE TABLE YET TO BE DISCUSSED.
BUT ANY ONE OR TWO WE COULD STOP, JUST LIKE PARK PASS WHEN THEY WENT FROM YOU 1200, 600, WELL 600 OR SIX 10 AND THEY SAID WE'LL GO TO 5 85.
START OUT AT 1203 AND WE'RE DOWN AT 5 85.
BUT, UH, WE COULD, WE CAN, WE'RE GONNA MOVE TO THE NEXT FOREVER, BUT, WELL, WE'LL TALK LATER.
ANYBODY HEAR FROM THAT? THAT MUST BE YOU.
YOU WANT THESE FOUR HOMES, YOU'RE OUTTA HERE.
THAT'S A PART OF THE CONVERSATION.
YOU UH, WE PROBABLY PICK THE WRONG TIME TO GET IN FRONT OF ME.
UM, WE, WE WERE HERE, UM, LAST, UH, MONTH ON THE MARCH 5TH MEETING.
UM, OUR INITIAL SUBMISSION, UM, WAS A LITTLE BIT MORE OF A PRELIMINARY SUBMISSION THAN IT WAS A TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN.
UM, SO I HAD A FEW, I HAD A DISCUSSION HERE, UM, WITH YOU GUYS, UM, ABOUT, UM, WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING.
UM, AND THEN I MADE SOME REVISIONS, UM, BASED ON SOME CONVERSATIONS WITH THE TOWN ENGINEER DURING THAT MEETING.
UM, AND WE SUBMITTED A TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN.
UM, AND WHAT WE'RE LOOKING TO DO HERE IS, UH, ASK FOR A RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL TO MOVE ON TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISOR FOR THIS TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN.
UM, UM, WE, UH, AGAIN, IT'S PROPOSING A FOUR LOT, UH, SUBDIVISION.
UM, AND WE HAVE, UM, PREVIOUSLY HAD THE CAR WAY WIDTH FOR THE ROAD AT 24 FOOT.
WE HAVE UPGRADED THAT TO A 32 FOOT, UM, ON THE UPDATED, UM, TENTATIVE SKETCH.
SO YOU GUYS HAVE SEEN THIS TENTATIVE SKETCH? YES.
THE ISSUE, TOM, WAS THAT THE, SINCE THEY HAD PUT IN A LOT OF, THEY PUT IN ALMOST A PRELIMINARY PLAN LEVEL SUBMISSION, YOU KNOW, THE BIG THICK SET.
THERE WAS JEN'S LETTER WITH 19 PAGES.
SO THERE WAS A LOT OF TECHNICAL INFORMATION THAT REALLY WASN'T A TENTATIVE LEVEL, SORT OF, WE COULDN'T TACKLE IT AT TENTATIVE LEVEL.
YOU DON'T WANT TO GIVE PERMISSION TO SAY, HEY, THIS PLAN'S GREAT AT A TENTATIVE LEVEL 'CAUSE YOU STILL HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF STUFF TO CLEAN UP.
SO I MADE THE RECOMMENDATION TO THE APPLICANT TO TAKE SORT OF A STEP BACK, REDUCE THE DOWN TO JUST A TENTATIVE SKETCH LEVEL PLAN, SUBMIT ONE SHEET, WE'D RE-REVIEW IT, AND THEN THEY SORT OF HAVE A PRE-REVIEW OF THEIR PRELIMINARY PLAN SO WHEN THEY DO SUBMIT THE PRELIMINARY PLAN, THEY'D BE A STEP AHEAD.
AND WE ALSO HAD HAD TRAFFIC ISSUES.
YES, THERE, THERE WAS QUESTIONS ABOUT THE WAIVERS BETWEEN BOTH OF OUR CONSULTANTS.
WE HAD, YOU KNOW, MULTIPLE KINDS OF ISSUES THAT WE SAID THEY WEREN'T READY YET TO GET TO THE TENTATIVE PHASE.
AND THAT'S WHAT WE'RE HERE TO DO.
SO WHERE ARE WE WITH THAT, ANTHONY? WELL, I PRESUME SO YEAH, I, FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE, SO THEY, THEY, AS JEFF AND EVERYBODY SAID, THEY TOOK THE STEP BACK AND TENTATIVE.
SO OUR PREVIOUS COMMENTS STILL TECHNICALLY ARE OUTSTANDING BECAUSE THEY WERE MADE ON THE MORE
[01:00:01]
INTENSIVE PLAN SET.SO THERE WE WERE, WE BROUGHT THOSE UP IN OUR CURRENT LETTER.
SO THEY'RE ITEMS, I'LL FLAG THEM SO THAT EVERYONE'S AWARE.
SO THEY'RE ITEM NUMBER FOUR AND THE CURRENT LETTER OF OURS, ITEM NUMBER EIGHT AND NINE.
SO NUMBER FOUR WAS REGARDING, UH, THERE WAS A NOTE ON THE CURRENT PLAN THAT TALKED ABOUT DEDICATION THE ROAD.
SO WE, YOU KNOW, IT'S GETTING AHEAD OF THINGS.
SO WE HAVE TO HAVE THAT DISCUSSION DECIDE THAT'S SOMETHING THE TOWNSHIP WANTS TO ENTERTAINED.
SO THERE WAS A NOTE THAT WE ASKED TO BE REMOVED, UM, TO, WITH THAT REGARD.
NUMBER EIGHT IS REGARDING SIDEWALK CONNECTIVITY.
WE HAD SOME DISCUSSION ABOUT THAT.
INITIALLY, THERE WERE NO PLANS TO PROVIDE THE SIDEWALK ALONG EGYPT ROAD FRONTAGE.
WE, WE LET THEM KNOW THAT THE REQUIREMENT AND THE ORDINANCE IS TO PROVIDE IT AND WE WOULD WANT IT.
'CAUSE THERE'S CONNECTIONS THAT WE HAVE, UM, THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE.
UM, THAT'S BEEN SHOWN ON THE PLAN.
ALTHOUGH THERE'S A PORTION ON THE EXISTING, ON THE PROPOSED ROADWAY THAT DIDN'T HAVE SIDEWALK CONNECTIVITY DOWN TO EGYPT, WHICH WE COMMENTED ON THERE LETTER.
SO THERE'S CONNECTIVITY ISSUES, IT, I'LL PAUSE, WE UNDERSTAND IT, IT WILL COMPLY.
SO, UM, UNLESS THAT'S CHANGED, I GUESS, BUT WE WILL STILL COMPLY.
UM, AGAIN, WE, WE WOULD HAVE TO WORK WITH, UH, THE NEIGHBOR TO, UM, SEE IF WE CAN GET THAT SIDEWALK EXTENSION ALL THE WAY DOWN THROUGH EACH OF THE ROAD.
IN TERMS OF THE SIDEWALK ON THE, ON THE PROPOSED, UM, LOT, THE, THE PROPOSED DRIVEWAY ON THE NORTHERN SIDE, IT WASN'T SHOWING, EXTENDING DOWN ON THE CURRENT TENANT OF THE PLAN, I GUESS IS THE PLAN TO EXTEND THAT DOWN TO EGYPT TO PROVIDE THE CROSSING IN THE DRIVEWAY? IS THERE AN ISSUE WITH THAT? UH, UH, AGAIN, THAT JUST GOES BACK TO, UM, IF THE, UH, OUR, OUR THOUGHT PROCESS THERE WAS, UM, IF THE NEIGHBOR DOES NOT HAVE A CONNECTION, UM, THEN THERE WOULDN'T BE ANY MOVEMENT, UM, UH, FOR THE SIDEWALK ON THAT SIDE.
UM, AGAIN, IT, IF WE CAN GET THAT, UH, UH, THE NEIGHBOR TO AGREE ON THE CONNECTION THERE, THEN I, I DO AGREE THAT IT WOULD MAKE SENSE TO, UM, HAVE THAT WRAPPED FROM ALL THE WAY AROUND THE CULDESAC ON BOTH SIDES, UM, TO EACH ROAD.
HAVE YOU HAD DISCUSSIONS WITH HIM? UM, I HAVEN'T PERSONALLY.
UM, I KNOW THE APPLICANT HAS, UM, A FEW TIMES, UM, DISCUSSED THE PROJECT.
YOU, YOU DON'T KNOW HOW THAT DISCUSSION IS GOING? UH, NO.
I, I HAVEN'T BEEN A PART OF THOSE DISCUSSIONS AT THIS TIME.
SO THOSE, THOSE WERE OUR CONCERNS, TOM AND EVERYONE.
SO WE, WE WOULD STILL, REGARDLESS OF WHETHER, YOU KNOW, THE, WE WOULD SAY THAT, THAT IT'S IN THE ORDINANCE AND THAT SIDEWALK SHOULD CONTINUE TO BE EXTENDED DOWN TO EGYPT AND ACROSS ACTUALLY
UM, THE IDEA THAT WE, THIS COMES UP ON VARIOUS APPLICATIONS, SIMILAR THREE FOUR LOT SUBDIVISIONS.
WE'VE HAD ANOTHER ONE, I GUESS, UH, IT WAS A RECORDED OR THERE'S ANOTHER ONE ON SOUTH TRAP ROAD.
BUT THE IDEA IS WE WANT TO MAKE SURE, BECAUSE WITHOUT THE CONNECTION ON BOTH SIDES BEING ALL THE WAY DOWN, THOSE HOMES ON THAT SIDE WOULD HAVE TO CROSS STEP DOWN INTO THE ROAD, CROSS OVER MIDBLOCK.
SO WE WOULD PREFER CONNECTIONS BOTH SIDES, ALL THE WAY DOWN TO EGYPT, REGARDLESS OF WHAT HAPPENS WITH THAT JOINT, UM, PROPERTY.
WE UNDERSTAND THOUGH, THE OTHER DISCUSSION WAS CONNECTIVITY ALONG THE PROPERTY IS NOT CONTROLLED BY THE OWNER FROM THE DRIVEWAY TO EDEN, UM, A FEW HUNDRED FEET TO THE NORTH.
AND THAT'S A, WE UNDERSTAND THAT THAT'S, THAT'S A DESIRE OF OUR 'CAUSE THAT THEN CONNECTS THOUSANDS OF FEET DOWN EACH ROAD, I GUESS, AND CONTINUES A GAP THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW.
SO, SO LET ME UNDERSTAND THE, YOU'RE SAYING THAT THE CURRENT, THAT RESIDENCE THERE, THAT NEIGHBOR, WHATEVER YOU, WHAT YOU CALL IT, HAS THE RIGHT TO SAY NO, I DON'T WANT THE SIDEWALK OF INCIDENT.
WELL, ON THE EGYPT, ON EGYPT ROAD, IF YOU CAN, IF WE CAN ZOOM IN, YOU CAN SEE THE PROPERTY LINE, RIGHT? SO THE SIDEWALK THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WRAPS AROUND, I GUESS ON THE LOT FLOOR SIDE ON THE NORTHERN SIDE.
IT ENDS AT THE PROPERTY LINE, BUT THERE IS ROOM WITHIN THE RIGHT OF WAY TO EXTEND SIDEWALK.
BUT HE COULD SAY NO, THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING.
WE'RE NO TO THE, TO THE, ANY SIDEWALK THAT'S OUTSIDE OF THAT RIGHT OF WAY ON THEIR PROPERTY, WHICH WOULD MORE THE CASE FOR SIDEWALK ALONG EGYPT ROAD FRONTAGE FROM THE DRIVEWAY TO EDEN.
YOU, YOU TWO THINGS YOU'D LIKE TO SEE.
ONE HIGHLIGHTED PART, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE SAYING IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE BECAUSE NO ONE'S GONNA USE IT, BUT IT WOULD BE BE REQUIRED REGARDLESS.
AND THEN THE SECOND, BUT THAT IS NOT IN THE PROPERTY.
AND THE SECOND COMPONENT IS, WHILE YOU'RE THERE, WE WOULD LIKE YOU TO DO THE RED LINE AS WELL.
IF YOU CAN GET AGREEMENT FROM THE PROPERTY OWNER TO CONTINUE THE, THE OVERALL CONNECTIVITY AROUND EGYPT.
[01:05:01]
THAT WAS, AND THAT'S ON, THAT WOULD OCCUR ON PROPERTY THAT'S, YOU KNOW, TO GET THE BUFFER AND THE SIDEWALK WOULD LIKELY OCCUR PROPERTY THAT THEY DON'T CONTROL THAT PROPERTY OWNER.SO WE HAD THAT DISCUSSION, BUT THAT'S A, WE FEEL IT'S A CRITICAL CONNECTION WORTH HAVING CONVERSATION ABOUT.
'CAUSE THE IDEA WAS ON THE PRELIM ON THE PREVIOUS PLAN SET, THERE WAS ALSO TO THIS EXISTING PROPERTY OWNER ON THE CORNER, THERE WAS A CURB CUT SHOWN COMING OUT TO THE DRIVEWAY AS A POTENTIAL CONNECTION TO REMOVE THE, THE ACCESS FROM THAT PROPERTY FROM EACH OF, TO BRING IT TO PROPOSED ACCESS.
IT WAS A, I FORGET THE EVENT PRESS CARD FOR JOINING LOTS, I BELIEVE WAS CALLED.
SO, UM, BECAUSE OF THAT, IT LOOKED LIKE THERE WERE SOME CONVERSATIONS OCCURRING, WHICH WE DISCUSSED AT THE LAST PLANNING COMMISSION.
SO OUR THOUGHT WAS WITH THOSE CONVERSATIONS, ACCESS MANAGEMENT, YOU KNOW, BRING THE DRIVEWAY FROM EGYPT TO, TO THE PROPOSED ACCESS WOULD BE TREMENDOUS.
AND IF WE COULD ALSO IN THOSE DISCUSSIONS WITH THE PROPERTY OWNER GET SIDEWALK ALONG THE EGYPT ROAD FRONTAGE, UM, THAT WOULD BE A WIN FOR I THINK ULTIMATELY THAT THE FOUR LOT SUBDIVISION IN THE COMMUNITY, I GUESS, IF THAT'S SOMETHING THAT COULD.
AND YOU SAID THOSE DISCUSSIONS HAVE HAPPENED, UH, FOR THE CURB CUT? YES.
OH, FOR THE CURB CUT, NOT FOR THE SIDEWALK.
UM, NOT, I WAS NOT PART OF THAT.
YEAH, I WAS GONNA SAY, BUT YOU'RE NOT PART OF IT.
SO YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THE STATUS OR INCOME OR OUTCOME OF THOSE.
WE'LL COME ON UP AND IDENTIFY YOURSELF.
I'M ONE OF THE OWNERS OF SIX 50 EGYPT, LC.
SO I DID HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH THE OWNER, NOT REGARDING THE SIDEWALK.
THIS WAS PREM MARCH 5TH MEETING.
UM, THE CONVERSATION THAT WE HAD WAS, HE WAS PRO THIS DEVELOPMENT.
HE WAS EXCITED FOR, HE SOLD US THAT PROPERTY.
HE JUST ASKED THAT WE CAN INCLUDE IN OUR PLANS A CURB CUT FOR HIM.
HE DID NOT ASK US TO, TO MENTION THAT HE WANTED TO MOVE HIS DRIVEWAY.
HE DID NOT RECOMMEND THAT, THAT WAS NOT A CONVERSATION HAD, HE JUST WANTED A CURB CUT FOR THE FUTURE OPPORTUNITY OF CONNECTING MAYBE WHEN HE SELLS TO MARKET IT BETTER.
AND THEN THE SECOND ASK THAT HE HAD WAS REGARDING CONNECTING TO SEWER.
SO I THINK WE SHOWED THAT ON THE PRELIMINARY.
YEAH, I I WAS BUT IS THAT, I'M SORRY, GO AHEAD.
I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, I WAS GONNA ASK THIS.
THE PERSON THAT LIVES THERE IS WHO SOLD THE PROPERTY, RIGHT? CORRECT.
BUT THAT'S NOT FINAL, LIKE YOU GUYS ARE STILL TALKING OR IS THAT PRETTY MUCH YOU, YOU HAVE AN AGREEMENT AT LEAST FOR THAT? NO, IT, IT IS IN THEIR NAME.
I JUST LOOKING AT ACCOUNT TAX.
SO YEAH, WE, WE OWN THAT PROPERTY.
SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE OKAY WITH GIVING THAT CURB THAT AND ALL THAT FOR THAT WE WERE OPEN TO IT, YES.
SO WE WERE BUT YOU HAD NO, YOU HAD NO DISCUSSIONS ABOUT THE SIDEWALK.
WE DID NOT HAVE A DISCUSSION ABOUT THE SIDEWALK.
BECAUSE OTHERWISE YOU WOULDN'T HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY, SORRY, THE TOWNSHIP WOULDN'T HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO CONTINUE THAT STRETCH OF SIDEWALK ALONG EGYPT UNTIL THAT PROPERTY CAME BACK FOR SOME SORT OF SUBSTANTIAL IMPROVEMENT, RIGHT? CORRECT.
THE TOWNSHIP ALWAYS HAS THE RIGHT TO REQUIRE A PROPERTY OWNER TO INSTALL SIDEWALK.
IF THIS BECAME, TYPICALLY, IF THIS BECAME A PRIORITY SIDEWALK VERSUS ALL THE OTHER SIDEWALK PRIORITIES HAD, TYPICALLY WHEN A, WHEN SOMEONE COMES IN FOR A LAND DEVELOPMENT, IT MEANS THAT THEY HAVE SOME MONEY THAT THEY CAN KIND OF DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
AND PUTTING IN A FEW HUNDRED FEET OF SIDEWALK ISN'T AS BIG OF A FINANCIAL BURDEN AS JUST GOING UP TO JOE BLOW HOMEOWNER AND SAYING, WE'D LIKE YOU TO INSTALL, SPEND THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS TO INSTALL SIDEWALK.
YOU KNOW, AT THIS POINT THEY'RE INVOLVED IN FINANCING AND, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, THEY'RE WORKING THROUGH ALL THIS STUFF AND ADDING THAT INTO THE PROJECT ISN'T AS BIG OF AN AS.
SO THAT'S TYPICALLY WHY THIS HAPPENS AT THAT TIME.
SO WHO YOU BE IN AGREEMENT TO DO THE SIDEWALK IF THE PROPERTY OWE OWNER SAID YES? I MEAN, I GUESS THE, THE PART WOULD BE FINANCIALLY WHO WOULD PAY FOR IT.
I THINK THAT WOULD BE THE QUESTION.
UM, BUT IF IT CAME DOWN TO IT, WE WOULDN'T GET APPROVED WITHOUT THAT, THEN YES, WE WOULD BE IN AGREEMENT TO IT.
'CAUSE I THINK, YOU KNOW, YOU LOOK, WELL, WE'RE NOT SAYING THAT, I'M NOT FORAY THAT WE'RE JUST SAYING THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE YOU HAVE THAT CONVERSATION WITH THEM.
I'D BE OKAY TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION.
THIS IS STILL JUST TENTATIVE TOO.
SO WE STILL HAVE PRELIMINARY, WE HAVE FINAL, THERE'S GONNA BE MORE TIME TO HASH OUT THESE DETAILS.
ALWAYS UNDERSTAND THAT WE NEED LIKE A, WELL EVENTUALLY THERE ISN'T ANY MORE TIME.
YOU GOTTA, YOU GOTTA GET ALL DOWN, BUT YOU KNOW, IT, IT'S JUST EVENTUALLY YES, THERE'S GONNA BE MORE TIME THIS OUT.
YOU GUYS HAVE TIME TO FIGURE THIS OUT AND HOPEFULLY TALK WITH THIS PRO, YOUR HONOR.
YEAH, I'D LIKE TO SEE YOU TALK TO THAT.
BUT JEN, WON'T YOU TELL US WHAT YOUR, 'CAUSE YOU HAD 19 PAGES YOU SAID, RIGHT? YEAH, BUT NOT CURRENTLY.
I MEAN, THOSE ARE STILL HANGING ON THERE.
NO, I WENT DOWN TO FOUR, KIND OF THREE.
UM, SO MY DIVISION LAND DEVELOPMENT
[01:10:01]
COMMENT FIVE IS KIND OF WHAT WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT HERE.UM, I JUST WANNA BRING UP NUMBER SIX, WHICH HAS TO DO WITH THE POSITION OF THE EASEMENTS AND SUCH.
UM, WHEN YOU GET INTO THE FINAL DESIGN, AND I KNOW THAT YOU ARE NOT THERE YET, UM, TRY TO KEEP THOSE EASEMENTS RUNNING PARALLEL TO PROPERTY LINES AND AT PROPERTY LINES, WHEREVER THEY'RE GONNA COME ONTO THE SITE FURTHER, THE BUILDING SETBACK LINES WILL HAVE TO BE REDUCED TO COVER, YOU KNOW, WHERE THOSE EASEMENTS FALL.
UM, AND THEN THE ONLY OTHER THING THAT I WANTED TO DISCUSS BRIEFLY WAS ZONING ITEM NUMBER TWO.
AND JEFF, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN ZOOM IN KIND OF THE NORTH SIDE OF THIS FOR LOTS THREE AND FOUR.
SO YOU HAVE A 50 FOOT, UM, OFFSET FOR THE QUOTE UNQUOTE STREAM THAT'S OFF THE PROPERTY.
YEAH, THERE'S AN UNNAMED TRIBUTARY THERE THAT WE HAVE THE TOP OF PAGE.
YEAH, YOU HAVE LINE HEIGHTS ON THE PLAN, WHICH INDICATES THAT THERE'S TWO LITTLE FEEDERS THAT ARE EXISTING THAT COME UP INTO THE SITE.
ONE ON LOT THREE AND ONE ON LOT FOUR.
SO I'M JUST CURIOUS, IS IT A LINE TYPE THAT SHOULD BE CHANGED FOR THOSE? ARE THEY MAPPED WATERS? AND IF THEY ARE, THEN WHY DON'T YOU ALSO HAVE THE 50 FOOT OFFSET FOR THOSE TWO AS WELL? AND I DON'T THINK YOU'RE TOUCHING THEM LIKE I THINK THE PLAN MM-HMM
YOU KNOW, I'M, I'M JUST, WE JUST WANNA GET THAT HAMMERED OUT SO THAT IT DISPLAYS CORRECTLY WHEN YOU GET TO PRELIMINARY PLAN.
UM, THOSE WERE CONSIDERED YOU FORMAL DRAINAGE, I BELIEVE, UM, WHEN WE HAD WETLAND STUDY DONE.
UM, I'LL HAVE TO CONFIRM WITH, UH, WE'VE DONE THE WETLAND STUDY IF THEY ARE CONSIDERED OR IT'S COMMONWEALTH OR IF THEY ARE CONSIDERED THOSE, UH, A THERMAL, UM, DRAINAGE WAYS.
BUT THEN JUST PUT A DISTINGUISHING LINE TYPE BETWEEN 'EM SO THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TO ALSO SHOW THE 50 FOOT OFFSET MM-HMM
JUST CLARIFY THAT BELIEVE, GIVEN THAT THERE'S A, WE HAVE TO PROVE THIS, UM, ON OUR DRAINAGE PLANS, BUT, UH, UNDER A HUNDRED ACRES, UM, THAT DOES NOT, UH, IT WOULDN'T REQUIRE, UM, ANY JOINT, I GUESS THIS IS REALLY FOR THE CONSERVATION DISTRICT.
UM, BUT IT WOULDN'T REQUIRE, UM, ANY GENERAL PERMITS BECAUSE OF THOSE TWO STEPS WOULD HAVE LESS THAN A HUNDRED ACRES ON A SHED.
JUST LABEL THEM AS SUCH ON THE PLANT TO DIFFERENTIATE THEM.
YEAH, I JUST HAD, I HAD A QUICK QUESTION.
NO, WE DON'T NORMALLY TALK ABOUT SIGNS HERE.
THERE WAS A SIGN SHOWN, AN ENTRANCE SIGN ON HERE.
JUST, UM, WHEN YOU GET TO THE POINT OF DISCUSSING ROAD DEDICATION, IF THERE'S GONNA BE AN HOA WHO'S MAINTAINING THE STORM WATER, ET CETERA, UM, WHETHER THAT SIGN IS GONNA BE OWNED BY LOT ONE OR PART OF THE HOA, IT WOULD NEED ITS OWN EASEMENT.
AGAIN, THIS IS A DOWN THE ROAD, UM, AND WE DON'T NORMALLY TALK ABOUT, OKAY.
SIGNS YOU'LL HAVE TO GET YOUR OWN SIGN PERMIT.
WE'LL MAKE SURE THAT THERE'S AN EASEMENT EASEMENT THERE OR, UH, ACQUITTED, UM, ON LOT ONE OR THE HOA IF THERE IS ONE FOR THE PROJECT.
UM, UH, YOU HAD, YOU HAD MENTIONED ONE OF THE, UH, PREVIOUSLY LISTED WAIVERS FOR THE ROAD WIDTH AND YOU DECIDED TO COMPLY NOW WITH THE ORDINANCE, RIGHT? IF I UNDERSTOOD CORRECTLY.
UM, IT SEEMS TO ME THERE WAS ANOTHER ONE YOU WERE ASKING FOR, FOR THE THICKNESS OF PAVEMENT.
UH, HOW, HOW DO YOU, HOW DO YOU SEE THAT COME? ARE YOU STILL GONNA BE REQUESTING A WAIVER FOR THAT? UH, I, I BELIEVE WE ARE GONNA STILL TRY FOR THAT WAIVER, UM, UPON PRELIMINARY, UM, STAGE, BUT, UH, FURTHER DISCUSSION WITH THE APPLICANT, UM, REGARDING THAT.
THERE WERE THINGS THAT THEY WERE ASKING FOR.
WHAT'S THE, UH, MAYBE NOT WELL YOU, BUT, UM, WHAT, WHAT SIZE HOUSES ARE YOU LOOKING TO PUT HERE? THESE FOUR HOUSES? WHAT SIZE DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA YET? FOUR TO 6,000 SQUARE FEET.
AND THEN, SO THE PRICE WILL BE RANGE AGAIN, I'M NOT HOLDING, I'M NOT LOOKING TO BUY ONE.
I'M JUST, I MEAN, WHATEVER MARKET RATES ARE RIGHT NOW, A 4,000 SQUARE FOOT HOUSE IS TYPICALLY BEING BUILT FOR 1.4 MILLION.
SO YOU'RE LOOKING FOR A TENTATIVE RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISORS.
IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING FOR TO THAT? CORRECT.
CAN I ASK ONE MORE QUESTION? YES.
UH, AS PART OF THE, UH, FIRE MARSH'S, UH, LETTER E ALSO TALKED ABOUT FIRE HYDRANTS, ET CETERA.
YOU KNOW, THAT I I I CAN'T TELL BY THE YEAH.
SO ON OUR INITIAL SET, UM, BACK ON THE MARCH 5TH MEETING, WE DO HAVE A FIRE HYDRANT SHOWN, UM, RIGHT NOW, UH, BASED ON THIS PLAN HERE, IT'S ABOUT, UM, RIGHT ABOUT THE, THE 25 FOOT, UM, CURVE, UH, OF
[01:15:01]
THE CUL-DE-SAC.UM, RIGHT AROUND THAT AREA THERE IS WHERE WE PUT THE, WE'RE THINKING OF PUTTING THE FIRE HYDRANT FOR THIS DEVELOPMENT.
I ASSUME YOU, YOU'LL NEED WHATEVER THE FIRE MARSHAL'S LOOKING FOR YOU.
YEAH, WELL THAT, THAT'S MY CONCERN BECAUSE I, UH, AS THEY COME IN HIS LAST MEETING, I MEAN, ONE OF THESE HOUSES STARTED TO FIRE, BUT, AND PART OF THE ROAD WIDENING WAS COULD THE FIRE APPARATUS IN WITH THE FIRE HYDRANTS, YOU KNOW, THAT WHOLE PILL BEHIND THIS PROPERTY.
I MEAN THE DRY LAND, WHATEVER.
SO, UH, THE APPLICANT IS LOOKING FOR A RECOMMENDATION TO MOVE TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS FOR HIS TE SKETCH, UH, UM, FOR, UH, THIS, UH, FOR THIS FOR HOUSING PROJECT DEVELOPMENT.
AND, UH, IF, UH, I'LL TAKE A REC, UH, UH, MOTION FROM ANYBODY THAT WANTS TO MAKE IT FOR, OR AGAIN, UM, OR WHATEVER NEXT STEPS YOU WANT TO TAKE, WHICH COULD ALSO BE, WE MAKE NO RECOMMENDATION.
IT SOUNDS LIKE THERE'S STILL A FEW MINOR THINGS THAT NEED TO BE WORKED OUT.
UH, YOU DON'T SEE THEM AS MAJOR THINGS THAT SIDEWALK, ANTHONY.
I MEAN, IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'D LIKE TO SEE, BUT THERE IS NO PLANS TO, UH, OBLIGATE THE CURRENT OWNER TO DO THAT IF HE DOESN'T WANT TO.
I THINK IT'S SOMETHING WE SHOULD RECOMMEND THAT THEY INVESTIGATE FOR PULMONARY.
YES, I WOULD, I ALREADY ASKED THESE GENTLEMEN IF YOU DO THAT, AND HE SAID HE WOULD, SO, BUT, UH, BUT, UH, IF HE SAYS NO, WHICH, YOU KNOW, I'M SURE COULD COME DOWN TO COST AND WHO'S GONNA PAY FOR ALL THAT, BUT THEN WE'RE NOT LOOKING TO NOT RECOMMEND THIS BECAUSE OF THAT ISSUE.
BUT THE YELLOW ONE THEY WOULD IS ON THEIR PROPERTY, SO THEY YEAH.
AND THAT, THAT'S ALREADY, YEAH.
IT SOUNDS LIKE YOU'RE WILLING TO DO THAT.
SO I, BACK TO TAKING ANY KIND OF A MOTION, TOM, I'LL MOTION THAT WE, UH, RECOMMEND MOVING THIS FORWARD, UM, YOU KNOW, UH, THE NEXT STEP TO THE SUPERVISOR.
UM, I THINK THE APPLICANT, UM, OBVIOUSLY SUBMITTED MORE INFORMATION THAN'S REQUIRED FOR TENTATIVE, AND THEREFORE THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF DISCUSSION.
BUT I, I, I THINK AT THE END OF THE DAY, HAVING THAT DISCUSSION HELPS YOU YEAH.
I APPRECIATE IT TOO FAR DOWN THE ROAD.
A LITTLE BIT HERE ON THIS ONE.
SO IF, UH, ZACH, IF THAT'S THE CORRECT LANGUAGE, I RECOMMEND WE, YEAH, I, I THINK IT WOULD JUST BE A, A RECOMMENDATION TO, UH, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO APPROVE TENTATIVE, UH, APPROVAL.
ALRIGHT, JOE, SECOND IT ALL IN FAVOR? ALRIGHT.
AND HOPEFULLY YOU'LL WORK WITH, UH, ANTHONY AND JEN AND YOU KNOW, PICKING UP SOME OF THAT STUFF AND THANK YOU.
YOU'VE BEEN BUSY TONIGHT, JEFF.
[DISCUSSION: FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS]
AGENDA ITEMS. WELL, THERE'S A COUPLE THINGS I'D LIKE TO TALK ABOUT BEFORE WE GET THERE.UH, JUDGE AGENDA, UM, THERE'S ACTUALLY TWO.
UM, UM, I WANT TO GO WITH THIS ONE FIRST AND THEN MOVE TO THE SECOND.
ONE SECOND, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.
UM, I WAS HERE FOR A, UM, EPA, YOU KNOW, OUR, UH, ENVIRONMENTAL, UH, UH, COUNCIL ADVISORY COUNCIL MEETING THE OTHER NIGHT LAST WEEK OR TWO WEEKS AGO.
AND THERE WAS A GROUP THAT CAME IN FROM DOWN IN, UH, MONTCLAIR, A CHURCH MM-HMM
THAT WANTS TO, UH, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM, YOU TELL ME IF IT'S NOT A GOOD TERM, DEVELOP SOME OPEN LOTS THERE IN TERMS OF PUTTING IN, UH, COMMUNITY GARDENS.
DEVELOP IS PROBABLY A STRONG TERM, BUT THEY USE THE LOTS YES.
ADJACENT TO THE CHURCH FOR COMMUNITY GARDENS.
BUT THEY DID SAY THEY WOULD PUT UP FENCES AND THEY WANT TO PUT UP, YOU KNOW, AT LEAST A COUPLE, UM, YOU KNOW, UH, SHEDS OR BARNS OR SOMETHING.
SMALL BARNS OR SOMETHING TO PUT EQUIPMENT IN.
AND, UM, SHE WAS CONFUSED BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, THE, THE ENVIRONMENTAL ADVISORY COUNCIL SAID, WELL, WE'RE NOT SURE WE CAN APPROVE THAT OR NOT APPROVE IT.
AND THEN, AND THEN SO HAPPENED TO BE, THERE WAS SOMEBODY THAT CAME THAT WAS AGAINST IT.
HE SAID, I DON'T WANT ALL THESE PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, POTENTIALLY TRUMPING ON HIS PROPERTY.
SO THE QUESTION IS, IS THAT A LAND DEVELOPMENT? IT DOESN'T RISE TO THE LEVEL OF, OF FORMAL LAND DEVELOPMENT.
THE PROBLEM, THE ISSUE, THE, THE QUESTIONS WITH THAT ARE, IT'S NOT REALLY, THE ZONING DISTRICT IN PLACE DOESN'T ALLOW FOR THAT ON THAT SIZE PROPERTY BECAUSE IT'S AN AGRICULTURAL USE, FOR LACK OF A BETTER TERM.
NOT ENTERTAINMENT, JUST AGRICULTURAL.
AND SO THEY PUT A BAND IN WITH THEY DO, THEY COULD DO IT.
I'M NOT EVEN GONNA GO, I HAVEN'T EVEN LOOKED INTO THAT YET, BUT
[01:20:01]
10 BE 10 ACRES GO BOX IN THE CORNER, TURNED IT UP AND THEY'RE GOOD.SO THE FIRST ISSUE IS, DOES IT MEET ZONING? I DON'T THINK FROM A ZONING OFFICER STANDPOINT, I CAN SAY THAT IT MEETS THE ZONING, THAT THE ZONING ALLOWS FOR IT.
IF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS CHOSE TO DIRECT ME TO CHANGE THE ZONING TO ALLOW IT, WE COULD DO THAT.
UM, BECAUSE IT'S OUR PROPERTY, BECAUSE IT'S TOWNSHIP PROPERTY.
THE SECOND QUESTION THAT WE HAVE IS THAT FEMA, WE BOUGHT THAT PROPERTY WITH FEMA MONEY AS PART OF THE IDA BUYOUT PRO PROGRAM.
OUR READ OF THE ORDINANCE SAYS THAT WE CAN'T USE IT FOR ANYTHING.
THEIR READ OF THE ORDINANCE THROUGH, I THINK THEY SAID SENATOR FETTERMAN'S OFFICE.
AND I DON'T KNOW QUITE HOW THAT LINEAGE OFFICER WORKED OUT, BUT THEY SAY THAT SENATOR FEDDERMAN THINKS THEY CAN DO IT.
I DON'T, I TRUST SENATOR FEDDERMAN TO DO A VERY GOOD JOB OF WHAT HE DOES.
BUT READING THIS AND MAKING THE INTERPRETATION FOR THIS RIGHT NOW IS PROBABLY A LITTLE NARROW FOCUSED FOR THAT INTERPRETATION AT THIS POINT.
THERE'S A BUNCH OF OTHER ISSUES.
THE, THE TOWNSHIP PUTS OUT WHAT WE CALL MANAGER'S REPORT, A MANAGER'S HIGHLIGHTS REPORT.
IT'S JUST GENERAL ITEMS THAT THE MANAGER WRITES OR WE WRITE FOR THE MANAGER TO LET THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS KNOW SORT OF WHAT'S KIND OF GOING ON AND, YOU KNOW, GIVES THEM A, SOMETHING TO READ AS OPPOSED TO HAVING TO LISTEN TO, YOU KNOW, US TALK ALL THE TIME.
WE DID OUTLINE A LOT OF THOSE ISSUES IN THAT MHR THAT WENT OUT TODAY.
SO I'M WAITING FOR THE BOARD TO SAY WHAT THEY WANT THE NEXT STEP TO BE.
WHETHER THEY WANT IT TO BE COME TO A BOARD MEETING, COME TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING FOR THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION.
OR WHETHER IT BE THAT THEY JUST AT THIS POINT DON'T FEEL THAT IT IS PHYSICALLY POSSIBLE OR, OR LEGALLY POSSIBLE.
'CAUSE THERE'S A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT IT.
SO THE BOARD HAS TO SORT OF WEIGH IN ON THAT A LITTLE BIT TO GIVE US SOME DIRECTION.
MY, MY BIGGEST CONCERN WITH THAT WAS OWNERSHIP.
UH, YOU KNOW, FIVE YEARS FROM NOW, ALL THOSE PEOPLE THAT WERE HERE AND THE MINISTER THAT WAS HERE, THEY'RE ALL GONE.
AND THEN WHO OWNS THIS PROPERTY? AND ALL OF A SUDDEN THEY DECIDE WE'RE NOT GONNA GROW ANYTHING ANYMORE.
WELL, I KNOW, I MEAN, BUT I MEAN, WHO CLEANS IT UP? WE DO.
AND, AND, AND THE OTHER ISSUE IS, IS IF YOU ALLOW IT HERE, YOU ALLOW IT EVERYWHERE.
A LOT OF PLACES YOU ALLOW IT, IT HAS A VACANT MODEL.
THAT, THAT, THAT EVERY OTHER OF THE 28 25 HOMES THAT WE BOUGHT DOWN THERE BECOME SUBJECT TO THIS.
THAT IF THEY COME TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND SAY, WELL, YOU LET A DO IT, WHY CAN'T B DO IT? OKAY.
I JUST, I WAS JUST CURIOUS HOW IT GOT TO THE ENVIRONMENTAL.
IT IT WAS, THEY CAME TO ONE BOARD MEETING.
THEY WROTE A LE PASTOR, DEB, I CAN'T REMEMBER HER LAST NAME.
PASTOR DEB WROTE A LETTER TO, CALLED ME AND SAID, LOOK, YOUR BEST OPTION IS TO WRITE A LETTER TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.
COME TO THE BOARD MEETING, EXPLAIN WHAT YOU WANNA DO AND THEY'LL GIVE YOU SOME DIRECTION.
THEY DIDN'T REALLY GIVE ANY DIRECTION AT THAT TIME.
SO WE FOLLOWED UP WITH SAYING, HEY LOOK, WHY DON'T YOU COME TO THE EAC, THE, THE TOWNSHIP MANAGER DIRECTED ME TO SAY, HEY, WHY DON'T YOU COME TO THE EAC AND THAT'S A GOOD PLACE TO START.
YOU CAN COME IN WITH A GOOD PLAN.
AND THAT PLAN WAS THE FIRST WE'D SEEN OF IT.
SO IT WAS REALLY THE, THE BEGINNING OF THAT PROCESS.
WELL JUST, JUST, AND I'M SURE, UH, UH, SUE OR SOMEBODY TOLD YOU WE PUNTED THAT THING FROM HERE TO, UH, YOU KNOW, WE WOULD'VE MADE AN NFL RECORD
UH, THE SECOND THING, UM, IS WE'VE HAD SOME DISCUSSIONS.
UH, SOME BOARD MEMBERS, UH, HAVE HAD, WE'VE HAD SOME DISCUSSIONS.
THERE'S BEEN SOME DISCUSSIONS REGARDING THE, UH, SUPERVISORS, UH, POTENTIALLY NOT LISTENING AND I DON'T WANNA SAY LISTENING TO, 'CAUSE THEY CERTAINLY DON'T HAVE TO LISTEN TO US.
BUT HEARING OUR QUESTIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS AND QUESTIONS THAT WE ASKED APPLICANTS AND THAT, THAT COMMUNICATION IS NOT GETTING TO THE SUPERVISORS, UH, IS NUMBER ONE.
NUMBER TWO, UH, A COUPLE BOARD MEETINGS, SUPERVISOR MEETINGS AGO, THERE WAS A PROPOSAL AND IT WAS AJE UH, IT WAS ACCEPTED THAT, UH, ONE OF THE SUPERVISORS MARIA, UH, WOULD BECOME THE LIAISON.
AND AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS.
UH, LIAISON WITH THE, UH, UH, PARKS AND RECREATION BOARD.
AND UH, THERE WAS A DISCUSSION BETWEEN SOME PLANNING COMMISSION MEMBERS THAT, HEY, SHOULD WE HAVE THE LIAISON FROM THE SUPERVISORS? SO THAT 0.1, THE COMMUNICATIONS WOULD BE BETTER.
THERE WOULD BE A FEELING THAT IT IS BEING BETTER.
UNDERSTANDING THAT, I KNOW YOU PERSONALLY DO A LOT OF WORK BEHIND THE SCENES TO TRY TO GIVE THEM AS MUCH INFORMATION AS THEY CAN GET.
SOMETIMES THEY MAY READ IT, SOMETIMES THEY MAY NOT.
SO, UM, SO THAT'S THE TWO POINTS.
UH, BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF WHAT US AS PLANNING COMMISSIONS ARE SAYING.
AND DO THE SUPERVISORS TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT OR COULD WE HELP THEM TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT? 'CAUSE WE'VE ALREADY ASKED SOME OF THE QUESTIONS THAT THEY MAY HAVE.
AND, UH, NUMBER TWO, IS THIS LIAISON THINK SOMETHING THAT WE SHOULD TALK ABOUT, JEFF, I'M
[01:25:01]
SORRY.NO, UM,
WHEN TIM TIMBERMAN CAME IN AS OUR ATTENTION MANAGER, HE SORT OF SET IT UP SO THAT THE POLICY OF THE TOWNSHIP IS THAT A SUPERVISOR CAN BE A LIAISON TO A BOARD.
THAT THE PLANNING, THAT THE SUPERVISORS WOULD BECOME A LIAISON.
LIKE ONE WOULD GO TO MUNICIPAL AUTHORITY, ONE WOULD GO TO PLANNING COMMISSION, ONE WOULD GO TO PARKS.
IT'S NEVER REALLY WORKED OUT THAT WAY.
MOSTLY BECAUSE SUPERVISORS HAVE A LOT OF RESPONSIBILITIES AND THEY, I'M SPEAKING FOR THEM, I DON'T KNOW SPECIFICALLY, BUT MY GUESS IS THEY DIDN'T WANT ONE MORE MEETING A MONTH.
WE DON'T WANNA HAVE A THIRD OR FOURTH OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT IF WE DON'T HAVE TO.
BUT THE, THE STRUCTURE'S IN PLACE TO HAVE A LIAISON TO NAME A CERTAIN BOARD MEMBER AS A LIAISON, WHAT THAT STRUCTURE IS AND WHAT THAT RELATIONSHIP IS AND WHAT THE COMMUNICATION LEVEL IS, IS SOMETHING THAT, AS YOU AND I TALKED ABOUT THIS TODAY, TOM, IS SOMETHING THAT I THINK THIS PLANNING COMMISSION SHOULD WORK OUT WITH THAT SUPERVISOR.
IT SHOULDN'T BE WHAT I SAY IT SHOULD BE.
IT SHOULDN'T BE, YOU KNOW, I DO CERTAINLY GET THEM A LOT OF INFORMATION.
THEY'RE ON EVERY APPLICATION THAT GOES OUT TO YOU.
THEY'RE ON THE EMAILS FOR EVERY AGENDA THAT WE GET.
THEY GET EMAILS ABOUT CERTAIN THINGS.
THEY GET THEM ACTUALLY BEFORE YOU DO FOR PRE-APPLICATION THINGS.
I KEEP THEM IN THAT LOOP SO THAT THEY UNDERSTAND WHEN THINGS ARE COMING OR IF THERE'S OPTIONS FOR PART OF THOSE THINGS.
SO AGAIN, THEY, THEY ARE IN THE LOOP AND I, UM, CAN COMMUNICATION BE BETTER? IT CAN ALWAYS BE BETTER.
YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T WANNA THINK IT WORKS, BUT IT CAN ALWAYS BE BETTER.
IT CAN ALWAYS IMPROVE SOMEHOW.
UM, I THINK MY RECOMMENDATION TO YOU, TOM, IS FOR YOU TO REACH OUT TO, TO CHAIRMAN STARTLING AND SAY, HEY LOOK, CAN WE GET ONE APPOINTED TO US IF THAT'S WHAT YOU WANT THEM TO DO? AND CAN WE TALK ABOUT WHAT THAT RELATIONSHIP IS AND HOW THAT RELATIONSHIP WORKS? AND MAYBE IT BECOMES RIGHT NOW THAT HE'S JUST THE, OR THE SUPERVISOR THEY APPOINT IS JUST THE POINT PERSON FOR YOU TO CALL OR FOR ONE OF THE PLANNING COMMITTEE MEMBERS TO CALL AND SAY, HEY LOOK, I HAVE THESE CONCERNS AND I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE YOU HEAR WHAT I'M SAYING.
THAT I BROUGHT THIS UP IN A MEETING, BUT I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT YOU KNOW WHAT IT IS SO THAT HE'S THE SPECIFIC MEMBER THAT GOES THROUGH.
SO WE DON'T HAVE ONE PERSON TALKING TO SUPERVISOR YEAGER, ONE PERSON TALKING TO SUPERVISOR KELSEY.
AND THEN, YOU KNOW, ALL OF IT'S ALL OVER THE PLACE.
WE HAVE ONE PERSON THAT'S OUR SPECIFIC PERSON.
AND I THINK THAT'S, I THINK THAT COULD BE A VALUABLE RELATIONSHIP.
BUT AGAIN, THAT'S FOR YOU AS A PLANNING COMMISSION TO DECIDE IF YOU WANNA ASK.
AND I WOULD SAY THE CHAIRMAN, MR. WRIGHT, TO DEFINE WHAT THAT IS AND WHAT THAT RELATIONSHIP IS WITH WHOEVER THEY DECIDE TO APPOINT PRIOR TO THAT APPOINTMENT SO THAT WE ALL SORT OF UNDERSTAND WHAT IT'S THAT RELATIONSHIP IF WE DO START THAT, THAT WOULD TAKE CARE OF ISSUE ONE, WHICH IS MAKING SURE THEY BETTER UNDERSTAND OUR POSITIONS.
UH, AND NOT MAYBE, YOU KNOW, REDESIGN THE WHEEL EVERY TIME THEY HAVE.
WELL, I, I THINK, I THINK IT'D BE A RECIPROCAL RELATIONSHIP.
I THINK THE, THE SOMETIMES THE BOARD DOESN'T QUITE UNDERSTAND WHY THE PLANNING COMMISSION RECOMMENDS WHAT THEY DO OR WHAT HAPPENS AT THE, AT THIS LEVEL OF IT.
BECAUSE THEY CAN'T SIT THROUGH TWO HOURS OF A VIDEO TO, TO SEE THIS SO THAT THERE IS A LEVEL OF COMMUNICATION IF THE BOARD SAYS, LOOK, WE REALLY HAVE SOME ISSUES WITH APPLICATION A, WE'D LIKE YOU TO VET IT, WE'D LIKE YOU TO GO THROUGH AND ASK THESE QUESTIONS FOR US BECAUSE YOU HAVE MORE OF AN OPPORTUNITY TO DO THAT THAN WE DO AT OUR LEVEL.
'CAUSE WE'RE LIMITED 'CAUSE WE HAVE SO MUCH OTHER STUFF ON OUR AGENDA.
SO PLEASE THINK OF IT AS, AS, AS A BACK AND FORTH, NOT JUST AS A YOU POINTING AND SAYING THIS IS WHAT WE WANT YOU TO DO.
AND I WOULDN'T THINK THAT IT, I WOULDN'T THINK THAT THE LIAISON WOULD BE A VEHICLE FOR LIKE ME TO CALL PERSON A AND SAY, WELL I'VE GOT THIS CONCERN.
AND JERRY SAYS, OH, YOU KNOW, TO THE SAME PART GOT THE, THIS, I THINK THE POINT I THINK THAT TOM IS DISCUSSING IS A PERSON FROM THE PLANNING COMMISSION HAS, YOU KNOW, AN ABILITY TO COMMUNICATE DIRECTLY TO THIS A PERSON OR THE SUPERVISORS TO LET THEM KNOW WHAT OUR CONCERNS ARE ABOUT ANY GIVEN ISSUE SO THAT THEY CAN REPRESENT US, YOU KNOW, AND UNDERSTAND OUR POSITION.
UM, YOU KNOW, MORE COMPLETELY.
UM, WELL, AND I THINK THAT THAT'S, YOU KNOW, AND, AND I'LL DO THAT JEFF.
WE TALKED, YOU KNOW, AND I, I TOLD YOU I WOULD DO THAT.
I'LL REACH OUT TO BILL AND, UH, WE'LL, WE'LL SEE WHERE, WHERE IT MAKES SENSE.
MY, UH, MY, YOU KNOW, THE, THE PIECE OF THAT THAT IS STILL TO BE DEVELOPED IS WHAT WHAT DOES THAT RELATIONSHIP ABSOLUTELY.
AND YOU KNOW, SO PROBABLY WHAT I WOULD DO IS TALK TO BILL SO HE CAN GET HIS FEELINGS AND THEN I'LL BRING IT BACK TO HIS THING AND WE'LL TALK ABOUT IT WHOLE.
I THINK THAT'S A CONVERSATION YOU CAN HAVE.
AND YOU DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO HAVE IT HERE.
YOU'RE NOT MAKING ANY APPLICATION DECISIONS.
[01:30:01]
IT'S NOT REALLY, I MEAN, IF YOU HAD AN EMAIL ABOUT IT, I DON'T THINK WE'RE BREAKING ANY SUNSHINE LAWS.BE DISCOVERABLE, I GUESS IF WE HAD TO.
BUT YEAH, IT WOULDN'T NECESSARILY MEAN THAT THAT PERSON NEEDS TO ACTUALLY ATTEND THIS MEETING PER SE.
I MEAN, I'M NOT GOING THAT FAR.
BUT I WOULD, I WOULD GUESS THAT WE JUST NEED, I THINK TO ESTABLISH A BETTER AVENUE OF COMMUNICATION BETWEEN THE SUPERVISORS AND OURSELVES SO THAT, YOU KNOW, ALL THE EFFORT WE PUT FORTH TO TRY AND HELP DEVELOP THE PLANS AND, AND, AND WORK FORTH ARE COMMUNICATED TO THEM SO THAT THEY CAN IN TURN UNDERSTAND OUR POSITION AND MOVE, AGREE OR DISAGREE, MOVE THEM FORWARD APPROPRIATELY.
UH, GIVE THEM, GIVE THEM MORE EDUCATION, I GUESS.
UH, BECAUSE WE, YOU KNOW, WE, WE GO THROUGH ALL WHAT'S YOUR EXPERIENCE ON THAT, ZACH? WELL, I, I, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY THE ONE THING, UM, I HAVE SEEN ANOTHER MUNICIPALITIES AND, AND YOU KNOW, YOU GUYS ARE ALL CITIZENS OF THE TOWNSHIP.
YOU HAVE EVERY RIGHT TO GO TO A BOARD OF SUPERVISORS MEETING AND SPEAK AND GIVE YOUR, GIVE YOUR OPINIONS.
AND IF THERE'S A SPECIFIC APPLICATION OR THERE'S SOMETHING SPECIFICALLY THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION HAS DEALT WITH THAT YOU FEEL LIKE YOU WANT TO CONVEY THAT TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS DIRECTLY, YOU'RE ALWAYS FREE TO EITHER, AS JEFF SAID, REACH OUT TO THEM DIRECTLY OR GO TO A MEETING AND JUST SAY, HEY, WE, YOU KNOW, WE, WE REVIEWED THIS APPLICATION AND THESE WERE THE FIVE THINGS THAT WE WERE CONCERNED ABOUT.
WE TALKED ABOUT THAT WHEN WE WERE TALKING THIS ISSUE.
AND WE SAID, WELL, WE COULD ALSO, YOU KNOW, IN IN INFUSE OURSELVES INTO THE CONVERSATION.
I DON'T THINK YOU NEED TO DO THAT WITH EVERY APPLICATION.
I'M SURE THE BOARD PROBABLY DOESN'T WANT, BUT I ABOUT EVERY APPLICATION.
BUT TO THE EXTENT THAT THERE IS SOMETHING THAT'S IMPORTANT ENOUGH THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION IS CONCERNED ABOUT OR THAT YOU'RE SUPPORTIVE OF, OR THAT YOU WANT TO SEE THEM, THAT YOU WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE BOARD IS AWARE OF WHEN MAKING THEIR DECISIONS, I THINK IT COULD BE APPROPRIATE FOR YOU TO HAVE TOM ATTEND OR HAVE DESIGNATE SOMEONE TO KIND OF GO AND SHARE.
AND I THINK WE THINK WE TALKED ABOUT THAT BEFORE, JEFF.
MAYBE WE NEED TO TALK AGAIN ABOUT THAT.
BUT I THINK THAT, I DON'T THINK WE'RE LOOKING TO ADD MORE TIME TO SUPERVISORS MEETINGS.
I JUST, I THINK WE, WE JUST, I THINK THE CONCERN IS THAT JUST WE WANNA MAKE SURE THEY UNDERSTAND OUR POSITION HERE.
HERE'S WHY WE ALL VOTE UNANIMOUSLY TONIGHT FOR THIS PLAN BECAUSE WE THINK THIS, AND ONCE THEY SAY, OKAY, OR, YOU KNOW, WE'LL TAKE THAT UNDER, THEN I THINK WE'RE, WE'VE DONE OUR JOB.
BUT AT THE SAME, AT THE SAME TIME, I THINK THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY UNDERSTAND THAT ALTHOUGH WE SAID YES, LET'S MOVE THIS TENANT PLAN FORWARD, THAT THEY UNDERSTAND WE HAVE CONCERNS LIKE SIDEWALK ISSUES.
UH, SO THAT IT ISN'T JUST A YEAH, WE RECOMMEND APPROVAL, HOPEFULLY.
I MEAN THEY'RE THERE, WE HAVE CONCERNS THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GONNA DEAL WITH WHEN THE TIME PERMIT.
BUT LET THEM KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, HOPEFULLY THEY WOULD AGREE SUPPORT AND, YOU KNOW, AS PART OF THEIR DELIBERATIONS, CONSIDER THE PROS AND CONS OF, OF ALL THOSE ISSUES THAT WE RAISED DOWN.
YOU KNOW, THEY MAY SAY, YOU KNOW, YOU GUYS ARE CRAZY, YOU KNOW, BLAH BLAH BLAH BLAH, WHATEVER.
BUT THE TENSION MANAGER HAS BEEN HAVING ALL OF THE DEPARTMENT HEADS TRY TO, AT ONE MEETING AT THE, AT THE BOARD MEETING PER MONTH, HAD ONE DEPARTMENT HEAD, UM, COME AND SPEAK AND TALK ABOUT THEIR DEPARTMENT.
LAST MONTH IT WAS PARKS AND SHE TALKED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHAT THE EVENTS COMING UP WERE.
AND SHE WAS KIND OF ASKING FOR A LITTLE BIT OF SUPERVISOR FEEDBACK ON WHERE SHE WAS TAKING A DIRECTION OF, OF THE PROGRAMS AND STUFF LIKE THAT.
AND SHE HAD A LITTLE FEEDBACK ON THAT.
I THINK OBVIOUSLY THEY HEAR ME TALK A LOT BECAUSE THERE'S ALWAYS A LOT OF LAND DEVELOPMENT AND THEY, THEY ARE WELL INFORMED ABOUT THAT.
I THINK WHEN THAT IS, I'M NOT SURE IF IT'S MAY OR JUNE THAT I'M SCHEDULED TO SPEAK.
UM, I, I THINK MAYBE I'LL HAVE TOM COME OUT AND HAVE HIM ALSO SPEAK.
'CAUSE I THINK, AGAIN, I THINK SOMETIMES I TALK TOO MUCH AND MY VOICE, THEY, THEY TUNE ME OUT.
PEOPLE TUNE ME OUT A LITTLE BIT.
JUST, WHAT'D YOU SAY, JEFF? UM, SO I THINK HAVING TOM COME OUT AND SPEAK FROM THE PLANNING COMMISSION STANDPOINT WOULD BE BENEFICIAL.
AND, AND I THINK THAT THAT'S WHAT WILL, I THINK YOU SHOULD HAVE THE CONVERSATION WITH CHAIRMAN STERLING WELL IN ADVANCE OF THAT.
BUT ALSO, YOU KNOW, HAVE HIM HAVE TOM AS THE CHAIR COME TO THE MEETING AND SPEAK TO LEVELS OF COMMUNICATION AND, AND TO WHAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION, WHAT THEIR SORT OF ATTITUDE IS.
AND CERTAINLY HAVE A CONVERSATION AMONGST YOURSELF ABOUT THE DIRECTION OF THAT CONVERSATION SO THAT YOU CAN, SO THAT TOM REPRESENTS ALL FIVE OF YOU.
WELL, YOU KNOW, AND, AND THAT CAN HAPPEN AT, AT THE PUBLIC, AT THE BOARD MEETING.
AND, AND I THINK JUST FOLLOWING UP ON WHAT JEFF WAS SAYING, I THINK ALSO THE LESS OFTEN YOU GO, THE MORE IMPACT WHEN YOU GO, I THINK HAS, SO I, I THINK EMPHASIZING THAT,
[01:35:01]
LIKE YOU SAID, YOU DON'T NECESSARILY WANT TO BE ADDING MORE TIME ONTO ALL THEIR SUPERVISORS MEETINGS, BUT IF THERE'S A SIGNIFICANT DEVELOPMENT OR IF THERE'S SIGNIFICANT CONCERNS ABOUT SOMETHING PICKING AND CHOOSING YOUR SHOTS, YOU KNOW, I I, I THINK THAT THAT'S AN IMPORTANT THING TO REMEMBER AND I, I I I, I THINK IT'S PERFECTLY APPROPRIATE FOR THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO KIND OF DESIGNATE SOMEONE TO GO IN AND MAYBE PRESENT SOME CONCERNS OR JUST SEND A LETTER OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.THAT'S
AND I THINK THAT'S PART OF THE THING WHEN I TALK TO BILL, WE'LL KIND OF FIGURE THAT OUT, WHAT MAKES SENSE.
'CAUSE AGAIN, I DON'T WANT TO COME HERE AND SPEND ANOTHER HALF A HALF HOUR TO THEIR MEETING, WHICH THEY'RE NOT, THEY DON'T NEED, I WISH YOU WRITE AN EMAIL OR A LETTER SAYING THAT'S WHAT, HERE'S WHAT WE THINK ABOUT THIS
I MEAN, IT DOESN'T GET PLOPPED UPON THE WEB LIKE YOURS SAYS.
I BELIEVE THEY HAVE THEIR OWN REASONS FOR DOING IT THE WAY THEY DO IT.
BUT IN THAT PACKET I PUT TOGETHER THE SAME PACKET OF INFORMATION ON EVERY LAND DEVELOPMENT.
AND AS YOU SEE, I HAVE MEMOS IN FRONT OF LIKE THE ONES WE TALKED ABOUT TONIGHT.
I ALSO USUALLY PUT A MEMO OUT UNDER NATASHA LETTERHEAD THAT SAYS, THE PLANNING COMMISSION MADE A RECOMMENDATION AND MENTIONED A, B, C, AND D AS AS THEIR CONCERNS AND THE RECOMME.
AND, AND THE RECOMMENDATION WAS FOUR, NOTHING, THREE TO ONE, TWO TO TWO, FOUR TO FIVE, WHATEVER IT ENDS UP BEING.
I PUT THAT IN THERE SO THAT, THAT'S ALMOST WHEN THEY LOOK AT THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PACKET, THAT'S THE FIRST THING THEY SEE.
I'M NOT SAYING I CAPTURE YOUR THOUGHTS A HUNDRED PERCENT ACCURATELY, YOU KNOW, IT GOES THROUGH, WE WATCH THE TAPE AND WE, WE SORT OF WRITE THE RECOMMENDATION DOWN AND THEN THAT'S WHAT GETS PUT IN THE MEMO.
SO I TRY TO ENCAPSULATE IT ALL YOUR PERSONAL COMMUNICATION WITH THEM IS GONNA BE MORE VALUABLE THAN THAT MEMO.
BUT THERE IS SOME OF THAT IN PLACE NOW.
AND YOU KNOW, I THINK WE'RE ALL INDIVIDUALS AND SOMETIMES WE ACT AS A BODY AND SOMETIMES WE DON'T WRITE.
IT SEEMS LIKE MOST OF THE TIME WE ACT AS A BODY, WHICH NICE.
UM, BUT THERE IS A PROCESS, YOU KNOW, YOU WATCH THE VIDEO WRITE UP SOME MEETING MINUTES AND WE START OFF EVERY MEETING BY APPROVING THE MEETING MINUTES.
AND SOMETIMES THEY SAY THE COMMISSION AND SOMETIMES THEY SAY MR. BUSH OR YOU KNOW, WHATEVER.
SO I THINK IF YOU'RE, IF I WOULD ASSUME JEFF, WHEN YOU'RE WRITING THE MEMO FOR THE SUPERVISORS, THAT SAME MATERIAL WHERE YOU TRIED TO CAPTURE OUR THOUGHTS AND THEN WE DID SOME BASICALLY VALIDATION OF YES, THAT IS ACCURATE.
AND WE VOTED ON A BODY THAT YES, THAT IS ACCURATE.
YOU COULD PULL FROM THE MEETINGS TO FIGURE OUT IF THEY WERE, YOU KNOW, THREE PEOPLE RAISED THIS CONCERN.
THE WHOLE BODY RAISED THIS CONCERN AND YOU'D KNOW YOU'D BE REPRESENTING US FAIRLY BECAUSE WE VOTED ON THE MINUTES.
THE, THE, JUST AS A CAVEAT TO THAT, THE MINUTES DON'T ALWAYS GET APPROVED BECAUSE LET'S SAY THIS MEETING'S ON THE SECOND, THE, THE SUPERVISOR'S MEETING ISN'T UNTIL THE 21ST.
THE MEETINGS DON'T TECHNIC THE MINUTES DON'T TECHNICALLY GET APPROVED UNTIL THE SEVENTH MOVIE, THE 7TH OF MAY AT THIS POINT.
AND THAT'S PART OF THE, THAT'S PART OF THE ISSUE.
I THINK THAT'S PART, THAT'S PART OF THE ISSUE.
THERE'S A TIMING THING THERE AND ALL THAT.
SO I THINK, I THINK, I THINK THIS IS A GREAT DISCUSSION.
WE'VE HAD SOME GREAT DISCUSSIONS.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, YOUR RECOMMENDATION, JEFF, WE'LL TAKE THAT.
I'LL TALK TO BILL, WE'LL SEE WHAT HIS FEELINGS ARE OR WHAT HE THINKS AND NOW COME BACK AND WE'LL TALK ABOUT IT AND YOU CAN ASK HIM TO COME AND SPEAK TO YOU HERE.
AND HE CAN DO THAT TOO IF HE WANTS TO.
ALRIGHT JEFF, SO MOVING ON DOWN 'CAUSE YOU KNOW, THE NEXT MEETING WHILE WE, WHILE WE'RE TRYING TO JUST HAVE COMP PLAN ISSUES ON THE SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH, BECAUSE THIS IS KIND OF A, A QUICK APPLICATION AND WE HAVE THE HEARING DATE OF APRIL 22ND ALREADY SET.
I SENT AROUND THIS WEEK OR MAYBE THE END OF LAST WEEK, A, A CONDITIONAL USE FOR A TOWER ON THE LOWER PERM AND VALLEY REGIONAL SEWER AUTHORITY SITE.
IT DOESN'T EVEN RISE TO THE LEVEL OF, OF A LAND DEVELOPMENT BECAUSE IT'S A SMALL, IT'S LESS THAN 2,500 SQUARE FEET.
AND, BUT BY ORDINANCE THEY ARE REQUIRED TO GET A CONDITIONAL USE.
UM, I I, I DON'T SEE IT NECESSARILY AS AN ISSUE, BUT THEY WILL BE HERE TO SPEAK TO YOU TO, TO KIND OF GET YOUR RECOMMENDATION FOR THE BOARD MEETING.
THAT WOULD BE ON THE 22ND AND THEN WE'LL GO BACK TO THE OFFICIAL MAP ON THE RIGHT OF WAY MAP AND HOPEFULLY WRAP THOSE UP.
AND THEN THE NEXT MONTH WE'LL START TALKING ABOUT THE RIDGE PIPE ZONING AND SOME OF THAT.
AND WE ALSO AT SOME POINT, YOU KNOW, THE 16TH OR WHATEVER COULD DISCUSS THE NEXT ONE OR TWO PRIORITIES.
AS PART OF OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ACTION ITEMS TO CONTINUE DEVELOPING THE DETAILS, WE, WE CAN ADD THAT TO THE, TO THE, SO SO BASICALLY WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, THERE'S NO NO ACTIVE LAND, OTHER PEOPLE COMING ON THE 22ND OTHER THAN THIS TOWER, THE 16TH.
THE IDEA IS TO NOT HAVE ANY LAND DEVELOPMENT UNLESS WE ABSOLUTELY HAVE TO ON THE SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH.
WE KEEP THAT FOR JUST A WORKSHOP.
YOU DID SAY THAT BEFORE FOR OUR OWN SORT OF, YOU KNOW, FIXING THINGS IN THE COMP PLAN OR UPDATING THINGS THAT THE COMP PLAN RECOMMENDED.
SO THEN ON MAY 7TH RIGHT NOW, UM,
[01:40:01]
QUEST REDEVELOPMENT PRELIMINARY PLAN, THEY'VE UM, SUBMITTED A PLAN, I THINK THREE OR FOUR MONTHS AGO.THEY'VE NOW GOTTEN OUR REVIEW LETTERS, OUR INITIAL REVIEW LETTERS AND THEY'RE, THEY'VE GONE AND REVISED THE PLAN A LITTLE BIT.
AND SO THAT WILL BE REVIEWED AND THAT WILL BE ON THAT AGENDA FOR, FOR THE 1ST OF MAY, THE FIRST MEETING IN MAY.
I, I THINK THAT'S ALL I REALLY HAVE IN TERMS OF, 'CAUSE AMELIA STREET LOOKING, GOING THROUGH THE AGENDA.
AMELIA STREET ACTIVE APPLICATION, THERE'S NOTHING NEW ON THAT.
UM, 7 65 SOUTH COLLEGEVILLE ROAD, WHICH IS LOVER'S LANE.
YERKEY STATION AND HOPWOOD ROAD, THE TWO GALLMAN PLANS, THEY ARE WORKING THROUGH IT.
THE MEETING WE HAD A COUPLE WEEKS AGO, THEY'RE, THEY'RE KIND OF BEING HELD UP BY THE BRIDGE DESIGN THAT'S TAKING A LITTLE BIT LONGER THAN THEY, THEY THOUGHT IT WOULD, WHICH IS THE REALLY THE CULVERT ACROSS QUA ROAD AND 29 AND 29.
THEY'RE, THEY'RE WORKING THROUGH THAT DESIGN.
SO THAT'S GONNA TAKE A LITTLE BIT OF TIME.
ONE 40 WHITAKER, THE BOARD SORT OF NEEDS TO WEIGH IN ON THAT AND, AND START HAVING SOME DISCUSSIONS ABOUT LOWERING THAT NUMBER DOWN.
'CAUSE THEY DID COME IN WITH A PLAN AND THE BOARD WAS A LITTLE MORE AMENABLE TO IT, BUT I, I'M NOT SURE THAT THEY GOT A LOT OF DIRECTION ON IT.
SO WE SORT OF HAVE TO FIGURE OUT WHERE THEY ARE.
I JUST TALKED ABOUT EMORY MANOR ACTUALLY WE HAVE A MEETING WITH 'EM NEXT WEEK, SO WE'LL SEE WHEN THEY ARE ON THE AGENDA FOR, FOR REVIEW.
THEY, WE HAD SOME ISSUES WITH THEIR PRELIMINARY PLAN THEY SENT IN SOME.
JIM WAS BEING HARDCORE AND UM,
SO, SO WE'RE HAVING A MEETING NEXT WEEK I THINK WITH 'EM.
AND THEN WITH THE LAST ONE, WHICH IS THE RISE UP TOWER CONDITIONAL USE.
SO, UM, ONE THAT CONCERNS ME A LOT AND I SEE IT'S NOT ON HERE, SO THEY HAVE NOT SUBMITTED A APPLICATION YET.
IS THE LUTHERAN CHURCH ON LEWIS ROAD, UH, DEVELOPED BEHIND THE CHURCH? NO, THEY HAVE NOT.
THE LAST, SINCE THE LAST TIME THEY WERE AT THEY HERE OR THEY AT THE BOARD, WHICHEVER MEETING THEY CAME TO AND HAD THE DISCUSSION, THEY HAVE NOT SUBMITTED ANYTHING SINCE THEN.
I HAVE HAD A MEETING WITH THEM AND I TOLD 'EM, I'M LIKE, LOOK, YOU GOT THE TEMPERATURE OF THE ROOM.
YOU SORT OF SEE HOW PEOPLE FEEL ABOUT IT.
UM, IT'S REALLY TIME FOR YOU TO, TO FORMALIZE YOUR PLAN, WRITE YOUR ORDINANCE AND GET IT, GET THINGS SOLIDIFIED BECAUSE WE'RE ALL SPECULATING AT THIS POINT.
SO, WELL SINCE THEY HAVEN'T PUT AN APPLICATION IN YET.
AND I DON'T KNOW IF, UH, TELL ME IF I'M NOT ALLOWED TO SAY THIS, I ALREADY SAY IT, BUT YOU CAN SAY IT.
HOW CAN WE RETRACT RETRACTED? HOW, HOW CAN WE STOP THAT AS IT IS NOW NOT AN APPLICATION.
I'M NOT PUTTING A VALUE JUDGMENT ON ANYTHING HAVING TO DO WITH WHAT THEY'RE PROPOSING.
BUT FOR THEM TO DO THAT CHANGE TO THEIR PROPERTY, THEY'RE GOING TO HAVE TO REWRITE THE ZONING.
THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS HAS ULTIMATE AUTHORITY TO SAY, YES, WE'RE GOING TO LISTEN TO IT OR NO, WE'RE NOT GOING TO LISTEN TO IT.
ADOPTING THE ZONING AMENDMENT IS COMPLETELY DISCRETIONARY.
THERE'S NO TIME CLOCK, THERE'S NO MPC REQUIREMENTS.
THEY DON'T EVEN HAVE TO HAVE A HEARING.
THEY CAN REFUSE TO HAVE A HEARING.
WHICH IS, WHICH IS SORT OF WHAT HAPPENED TO LENNAR.
LENNAR WENT THROUGH THE PROCESS.
DO YOU REMEMBER THAT THE 120 SOME TOWN HOMES, THEY WENT THROUGH THE PROCESS OF THE SAME AS HTC TONIGHT, THE ENTERTAINMENT AND CLOVIS MEDICAL, THEY WERE UP THERE AND THEY MADE THEIR CASE TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS SAID, NO, WE DON'T THINK YOU'VE MET, YOU HAVEN'T MET WHAT WE ASKED YOU TO DO IN TERMS OF LOWERING THE DENSITY OR OTHER CRITERIA THAT I DON'T REMEMBER OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD.
SO WE'RE NO, WE'RE NOT GONNA GRANT YOU A HEARING RIGHT NOW.
AND THEN DON'T EVEN HAVE TO GO TO THAT LEVEL.
THEY CAN JUST TELL ME TO TELL THEM NO.
YEAH, THEY CAN JUST NOT PUT ON THE AGENDA.
AND IS THERE ANY PROACTIVE THING THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION CAN DO? AND I GET IT, I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS EVEN BIG, BUT ANY PROACTIVE THING WE COULD DO TO STOP THAT? I, I GENERALLY THINK IT'S NOT A GOOD IDEA TO PROACTIVELY OPPOSE OR ADVOCATE BEYOND GOING THROUGH THE COMP PLAN PROCESS AND SAYING, HEY, THESE ARE WHERE THE MUNICIPALITY WANTS TO GROW.
THIS IS WHERE WE MAYBE WANT TO PRESERVE.
THIS IS WHERE WE WANT TO KEEP OPEN SPACES WHERE WE WANNA KEEP AGRICULTURAL LAND.
I THINK THAT MAINTAINING THAT THROUGH THAT COMP PLAN PROCESS AND THAT LARGER BIG PICTURE PLANNING EFFORT MAKES MORE SENSE TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU HAVE SPECIFIC ZONING AMENDMENTS THAT COME BEFORE YOU.
YOU CAN CERTAINLY WEIGH IN YAY OR NAY.
YOU THINK IT'S GOOD, YOU THINK IT'S BAD, YOU MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
BUT I THINK IN TERMS OF JUST GENERALLY MAKING STATEMENTS ABOUT PRO ANTI-DEVELOPMENT, ANYTHING LIKE THAT, I THINK IT'S BEST IF THE TOWNSHIP OR THE PLANNING COMMISSION JUST LEADS IT TO THE, BUT IT'S ALWAYS MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THAT WAS THE ISSUE WITH PARKHOUSE.
RIGHT? THAT NOBODY DID ANYTHING UNTIL IT WAS TOO LATE.
NO, THE ISSUE WITH PARKHOUSE WAS THEY HAD THEIR ZONING IN PLACE FOR A VERY LONG TIME AND WE KEPT TRYING TO NEGOTIATE WITH THEM.
WELL BEFORE THEY EVEN PUT IN A PLAN.
[01:45:01]
MEETINGS WITH THEM TO DISCUSS HOW CAN, WHAT CAN WE DO? 'CAUSE WE KNOW I HAD SAID FOR 10 YEARS THAT THEY COULD DO 2,400 UNITS THERE.WE HAD MEETINGS WITH 'EM, SAY, YOU KNOW, WHAT CAN WE DO TO REDUCE THIS? WHAT CAN WE DO TO CHANGE THIS? BECAUSE THEIR ZONING WAS IN PLACE FROM WHEN MONTGOMERY COUNTY SOLD IT.
WE WERE BEHIND THE EIGHT BALL ALREADY.
OKAY, WELL IN THIS CASE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS, IS THAT THAT PARCEL IS ZONED SO THAT THAT DEVELOPMENT CANNOT TAKE PLACE WITHOUT A ZONING CHANGE.
THAT LAND USE IS NOT REALLY IT WELL IT'S NOT ALLOWED ON THAT SITE.
THAT LAND USE IS JUST MULTIFAMILY.
WHETHER IT'S A BIG, A AFFORDABLE OR LITTLE A AFFORDABLE, IT DOESN'T MAKE DIFFERENCE.
IT'S ALLOWABLE IN OTHER PORTIONS OF THE TOWNSHIP.
BUT ON THAT SITE, BUT ON THAT SITE, IT IS NOT ALLOWED.
SO NOTHING CAN HAPPEN UNLESS THEY APPLY FOR A ZONING CHANGE.
AND AT THAT THEY COULD APPLY FOR A USE VARIANCE TOO, BUT I THINK THAT'S MORE COMPLICATED BECAUSE THEY'RE ASKING TO SORT OF CONDO THE PARCEL AND DIVIDE THE USES ON THE PARCEL.
SO I DON'T KNOW QUITE HOW THAT FITS INTO A ZONING USE VARIANCE.
THAT WOULD BE A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED I THINK.
BUT FROM A TOWNSHIP STANDPOINT, THAT USE IS NOT ALLOWABLE ON THAT SITE.
FAIR SHARES ALLOWABLE LOTS OF OTHER PLACES.
WE ALL KNOW
IT'S, IT IS JUST THAT ON THAT SITE.
WE DON'T HAVE, THEY DON'T HAVE THE ZONING IN PLACE FOR IT.
WHAT WHAT CONSIDERS ME ABOUT THAT THOUGH IS THAT WHEN, LIKE TONIGHT WE HAD JUST HEARD FROM THAT FORD DEVELOPMENT, THEY'RE GONNA SELL FOR A MILLION FORD THAT DOESN'T DO OUR TOWNSHIP A LOT THE IN THE HIGHS OF THESE PEOPLE THAT ARE FIGHTING US TO SAY WE NEED MORE FORD BONDS.
WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT SAYING WE DON'T NEED MORE FOR IT, BUT YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU, WHEN YOU YOU, YOU APPROVE A DEVELOPMENT OF $1.4 MILLION HOUSE.
UH, THAT DOESN'T, I JUST RECEIVED AN EMAIL.
IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE YOU'RE TRYING TO FIND DEVELOPMENT OUT.
I WILL, I WILL SEND AROUND MONTGOMERY COUNTY.
THEY JUST PUT IT OUT YESTERDAY.
I THINK I JUST LOOKED AT IT THIS MORNING BRIEFLY.
MONTGOMERY COUNTY PUTS OUT A HOUSING REPORT ON HOUSING VALUES AND WHAT HOUSES SELL FOR.
I DIDN'T READ IT FOR GREAT DETAIL YET, BUT I'LL SEND THAT AROUND TO EVERYBODY TOMORROW.
I'LL, UH, TAKE A, UH, MOTION TO ADJOURN IF YOU READY TO ANY OTHER POINTS, KEVIN? ANYTHING? JERRY, YOU GOOD? I'M GOOD, THANK YOU.
I'LL TAKE A MOTION THEN I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN THE MEETING AND I'LL SECOND THAT MOTION.