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WHENEVER YOU ARE.[CALL TO ORDER / MOTION TO APPROVE NOVEMBER 20, 2024 AGENDA]
OKAY.WE'RE GONNA CALL THE ORDER, UH, THE UPPER PROVINCE TOWNSHIP, UH, PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING NOVEMBER 20, 20, 24.
SOME, SOME THINGS TO TALK ABOUT BEFORE WE GET TO OUR
UM, SHE RE AND GO AHEAD TONIGHT.
A NEW GUY TO THE MARRIED MET, HUH? YEAH.
YEAH, THAT'S BROUGHT, WE BROUGHT SOME NEW FACES FOR YOU JUST TO MIX IT UP.
LET'S GET STARTED WITH, UH, WE'LL CALL ORDER AND, UH, WE'LL LOOK AT THE, UH, MOTION TO APPROVE THE AGENDA FOR THIS EVENING.
WE APPROVE THE AGENDA FOR THE NOVEMBER 20TH, UH, UH, UPPER PROVINCE TOWNSHIP VOTING COMMISSION.
SO WE HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE AGENDA FOR THIS EVENING.
DO YOU HAVE A SECOND? UH, I SECOND THE MOTION.
SO AFTER THAT WE'LL TAKE A, UH, PUBLIC COMMENT FOR NON AGENDA ITEMS. THIS WILL DO NOT ON THE AGENDA TONIGHT.
ANYBODY HAS ANYTHING THEY WANT TO BRING UP, NON AGENDA RELATED, THIS IS YOUR CHANCE TO COME UP AND ADDRESS EVERYTHING.
DOESN'T SOUND LIKE WE HAVE A LOT OF THAT.
SO, UM, WE HAVE NO OTHER, WE HAVE NO MINUTES TO APPROVE OR NOTHING LIKE THAT.
SO NOW WE CAN, UM, MOVE TO OUR APPLICANT,
[ APPLICATIONS TO BE HEARD ON November 20, 2024]
WHICH, UH, TONIGHT IS, UH, UH, UM, THE PARKHOUSE CLUSTER, SUBDIVISION AND LAND DEVELOPMENT.AND I GUESS REMY, THAT'S YOU RIGHT? YOU WANNA TAKE YEAH.
CARL WIENER, UH, PAM GROUP, AND LIN MAXWELL AND LU, UM, REPRESENTING WHERE IS HOLDING THIS EVENING.
UH, THE LAST PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, UH, I WASN'T HERE, BUT I DO UNDERSTAND THAT THERE WAS EXTENSIVE DISCUSSION REGARDING THE GILMORE LETTER, GILMORE REVIEW LETTER AND OUR INTENT TO COMPLY, UH, WITH THE ELEMENTS OF THAT LETTER.
UH, SINCE THE LAST MEETING, UH, THERE WAS A MEETING ON NOVEMBER 5TH OF, UH, FOR REVIEW OF, UH, TRAFFIC.
UM, THE MEETING WAS HELD BETWEEN THE TRAFFIC ENGINEER, THE TRAFFIC, UH, THE TOWNSHIP TRAFFIC ENGINEER, UM, THE PEN, UH, REPRESENTATIVES, OUR TRAFFIC ENGINEER MATT HAMMOND, WHO WAS HERE.
UM, AND THE PURPOSE OF THAT MEETING WAS REALLY TO GO THROUGH AN EXTENSIVE REVIEW OF INTENDED TRAFFIC IMPROVEMENTS, UH, AROUND THIS SITE.
AND, AND AGAIN, MATT WAS THERE, SO I'LL LET HIM, UH, TELL YOU FROM HIS PERSONAL FIRSTHAND KNOWLEDGE, UH, WAS THAT PARTIES ARE ESSENTIALLY ON THE SAME PAGE AS TO THE APPROACHES TO TRAFFIC IMPROVEMENTS, UH, AROUND THIS SITE.
UM, AND, UH, MATT, YOU WANT TO JUST, UH, BRIEFLY SUMMARIZE, UH, THE CONCLUSIONS THAT WE REACHED? SURE.
I'LL JUST, I'LL JUST STAND IF THAT'S OKAY.
JUST MOVE THE MIC OVER, PLEASE.
SO, AS CARL HAD MENTIONED, UH, WE HAVE, UM, WE DID ON NOVEMBER 5TH HAVE A MEETING BETWEEN THE TOWNSHIP STAFF, UH, ANTHONY, VALENCIA, BOWMAN, UM, MYSELF AND PENDOT TO GO OVER SOME OF THE COMMENTS THAT WERE OUTLINED IN THE MOST RECENT REVIEW LETTER AT THE TIME, UH, ISSUED BY BOWMAN.
THE, THE, THE, THE MEETING REALLY SERVED TWO PURPOSES.
THE FIRST ONE WAS TO ACTUALLY INTRODUCE, REINTRODUCE THE PROJECT TO DEPEND ON, BECAUSE THERE HAD BEEN CHANGES TO THE PLAN SINCE LAST THEY SAW IT, NUMBER OF ACCESS POINTS, NUMBER OF UNITS, THINGS OF THAT NATURE.
BUT THE SECOND PURPOSE WAS REALLY TO DISCUSS SOME OF THE MAIN ITEMS, UH, THAT HAVE BEEN BROUGHT UP AS PART OF THESE MEETINGS.
AND ALSO, UH, BROUGHT UP IN THE, IN THE BOWMAN REVIEW LETTER.
UM, AND THOSE MAIN ITEMS, UH, INVOLVE, UH, THE PROPOSED ROUNDABOUT, THE TOWNSHIPS PROJECT TO INSTALL ROUNDABOUT AT SECOND AVENUE, BLACKROCK AND DRIED PELVIS ALSO WAS DISCUSSED WAS THE ACCESS POINT ON ONE 13 ON BLACKROCK.
I KNOW THERE WAS PREVIOUS DISCUSSION, UH, WITH THE PLANNING COMMISSION ON THAT ACCESS POINT.
WE ALSO LOOKED AT, UM, WE TALKED ABOUT SOUTH TRAP ROAD AND, UM, SOME OF THE CONCERNS HAVE BEEN RAISED BY RESIDENTS ON THAT, WHAT I'LL CALL THE HORSESHOE, UM, SOUTH TRAP ROAD DOWN ON BLACKROCK ROAD.
AND FINALLY, WE ALSO SPOKE ABOUT OLD STATE ROAD.
UM, AS HAS BEEN MENTIONED BEFORE, AS PART OF PREVIOUS DISCUSSION AND TESTIMONY, WE HAVE PROPOSED TO WIDEN ALONG OLD STATE ROAD TO MEET THE TOWNSHIP ORDINANCE FOR A DISTANCE OF ABOUT 4,000 LINEAR FEET.
BUT ONE OF THE, THE CONCERNS HAVE BEEN RAISED IN NUMEROUS TIMES BY THE RESIDENTS AND, UH, THE TOWNSHIP WAS THE INTERSECTION
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OF OLD STATE ROAD AND SECOND AVENUE AND IT'S SKEW AND THE, THE ISSUES THAT ARE, UM, FACED WITH THE SITE DISTANCE LOOKING TO THE RIGHT AND LEFT WHEN YOU'RE EXITING OUT THE OLD STATE ROAD.SO ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE DISCUSSED TO ADDRESS THAT ISSUE AND SOMETHING THAT WE WILL CONTINUE TO WORK WITH THE TOWNSHIP PLAN TO LOOK AT WAS THE POSSIBILITY OF REALIGNING OLD STATE ROAD SO THAT IT COMES DOWN, UM, ALONG OUR PROPERTY IN THE, THE, THE TOP LEFT CORNER AND, AND ESSENTIALLY COMES INTO SECOND AVENUE, RIGHT ABOUT WHERE THE EMERGENCY ENTRANCE IS ON THE OPPOSITE SIDE OF SECOND AVENUE FOR THE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT.
YOU'LL NOTICE THAT THERE'S AN AREA THERE WHERE THERE'S KIND OF A CURVATURE, UH, IN THE DEVELOPMENT.
AND THAT WAS DONE PURPOSEFULLY IN THE EVENT THAT THERE WAS A WAY TO WORK THAT OUT AND REALIGN SECOND AVENUE TO COME IN ON THE STRAIGHT SECTION, I'M SORRY, OLD STATE ROAD TO COME IN ON THE STRAIGHT SECTION.
SO THERE WAS DISCUSSION ON THAT, BUT OBVIOUSLY THERE'S SOME MORE DETAILS THAT NEED TO BE WORKED OUT ON.
HOW DO YOU PROVIDE ACCESS TO THE EXISTING RESIDENCES? UM, WHAT WOULD THE ROAD LOOK LIKE, WHERE WOULD COME IN, THOSE TYPE OF THINGS.
UM, SO YOU TALKED ABOUT THOSE BIG PICTURE TYPE ITEMS. I THINK THERE WAS A, A GREAT DISCUSSION OF ALL PARTIES.
WE UNDERSTAND WHAT THOSE ISSUES ARE.
UH, WE DID SUBSEQUENTLY RECEIVE A REVIEW LETTER, UH, FROM BOWMAN, FROM, UH, ANTHONY, UH, WITH RESPECT TO THE TRAFFIC STUDY THAT WAS SUBMITTED.
UM, I WOULD POINT OUT THAT THAT TRAFFIC STUDY DID ASSUME 600 UNITS VERSUS THE 585 THAT ARE CURRENTLY PROPOSED.
UM, SO OBVIOUSLY JUST BECAUSE OF THAT THERE ARE GONNA BE REVISIONS TO THIS STUDY, BUT WE DID HAVE A VERY, UH, DETAILED AND FRUITFUL CONVERSATION WITH RESPECT TO DIFFERENT ASPECTS OF TRAFFIC THAT WE SHOULD INCLUDE AND ANALYZE AND PROVIDE FOR IN AN UPDATED VERSION OF THE STUDY.
I WOULD SAY THAT THESE ARE TYPICAL ISSUES, UM, ISSUES THAT WE ADDRESS AS WE MOVE THROUGH THE PROCESS, ESPECIALLY THROUGH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
THESE ARE ISSUES THAT ALL THREE PARTIES, AND WHEN I SAY THREE, I MEAN THE APPLICANT, THE TOWNSHIP AND PENDOT ARE ALL AWARE OF.
AND, UM, THERE HAS BEEN DISCUSSION IN TERMS OF DIFFERENT OPTIONS AND HOW WE MOVE FORWARD.
AND IT'S MY OPINION THAT ALL OF THOSE ITEMS THAT CURRENTLY EXIST ARE ITEMS THAT CAN BE ADDRESSED AND WILL BE ADDRESSED.
AND I KNOW I'VE SAID THIS BEFORE AND I JUST, JUST TO BE CLEAR, JUST BECAUSE I SAY IT IS SO, DOESN'T MEAN IT IS, IN OTHER WORDS, FROM A TRAFFIC PERSPECTIVE, I HAVE TO SATISFY NOT ONLY THE TOWNSHIP AND ANTHONY, BUT I ALSO HAVE TO SATISFY PENDOT.
SO I HAVE TO ADDRESS THEIR CONCERNS.
I HAVE TO ADDRESS THE TOWNSHIP CONCERNS BEFORE FROM A TRAFFIC PERSPECTIVE, I CAN MOVE FORWARD.
SO THERE'S SOME MORE HOMEWORK THAT WE NEED TO DO.
THERE'S SOME MORE THINGS WE NEED TO DO, BUT I WOULD SAY, BUT FOR THE POTENTIAL REALIGNMENT OF OLD STATE ROAD AND MAYBE SOME MODIFICATIONS TO THE DRIVEWAY ON BLACKROCK ROAD, UM, I DON'T SEE ANY OTHER MAJOR CHANGES TO THIS PLAN.
THESE ARE ALL DETAILS AND ANALYSES AND FURTHER STUDIES THAT NEED TO BE DONE, BUT THESE ARE THINGS THAT WE'LL CONTINUE TO WORK WITH, UM, BOTH DEPEND ON THE TOWNSHIP ON, UH, AS WE MOVE FORWARD, UH, THROUGH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
UH, ANTHONY, WHILE WE'RE SOLD, FIRST OUR MIND, YOU WANT TO ADD ANYTHING TO THAT OR, OR COMMENT ON ANY OF THAT FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE? YEAH, SO I THINK THAT THAT WAS A GOOD SUMMARY.
UM, AND A LOT OF THOSE ITEMS, YOU KNOW, SUBSEQUENT TO THE MEETING THAT WAS HELD WITH THE DEPARTMENT, WHICH I THINK MATT SUMMARIZED WELL, SO I DON'T, I DON'T DISAGREE WITH THE CONVERSATION AND THE, YOU KNOW, THE PEOPLE THAT WERE IN THE ROOM AND OBVIOUSLY WE STILL GOT A LONG WAY TO GO AND WORK AND DO THINGS.
BUT, UM, SO OUR LETTER FROM NOVEMBER 14TH WAS ISSUED FOLLOWING THE MEETING AND A LOT OF THAT SUMMARY IS ALSO CONTAINED, UH, IN THE VIRTUAL MEETING SECTION OF THAT LETTER LETTER.
UM, SO IF YOU WANTED TO, YOU KNOW, LOOK AT IT MORE DETAILS ON PAGE THREE NINE.
UM, SO YEAH, SO I, I THINK THOSE ARE THE ITEMS THAT WERE ON MY MIND, YOU KNOW, THE COORDINATION AND WE PROBABLY HAVE IT FOR EVERYONE TO SEE, WHICH IS GREAT, THE ROUNDABOUT AND HOW IT INTERMIXES ON THIS SKETCH PLAN HERE, UM, WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT.
SO THE ISSUES ARE OUTLINED IN OUR LETTER.
WE'VE HAD SUBSEQUENT CONVERSATIONS, UM, YOU WITH TPD REGARDING THAT.
UH, AND THAT HAS BEEN COPIED ON THIS LETTER.
UM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE AT TENTATIVE SKETCHING.
WE STILL HAVE A LOT, A LOT TO WORK THROUGH, BUT I THINK THAT SUMMARY IS FROM OUR PERSPECTIVE.
DO YOU FEEL LIKE A GOOGLE PROGRESS? I THINK WE'RE, YEAH, I THINK WE'RE, I MEAN WE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT AT THE FINISH LINE, RIGHT? UM, OBVIOUSLY, BUT YES, I THINK WE'RE, THIS IS PAR FOR THE COURSE IN TERMS OF DEALING WITH THE TRAFFIC ISSUES AND WORKING THROUGH, UH, ROADWAY THAT'S PLANNED IN THE TOWNSHIP, THE ROUNDABOUT AND THE ACCESS POINTS, ALL THOSE SORTS OF THINGS.
SO I, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A LONG WAYS TO GO, BUT WE'RE MOVING, UM, AND PENTHOUSES INVOLVED AND THEY'VE SEEN THE ISSUES AND THEY'VE WEIGHED IN.
JUST, JUST SO I THINK ALL OF US UNDERSTAND IS, IS THERE ANY CHANCE OR DID TEND ON GIVE, GIVE YOU GUYS, ALAN,
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TO, IF YOU ANY INDICATION ON WHAT THEIR PLAN, WHEN THEY'RE GONNA GET THIS ROUNDABOUT STARTED DONE? IS IT GONNA BE IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT OR DOES IT LOOK LIKE IT'S DOWN THE ROAD OR, YOU KNOW, DID THEY GIVE YOU ANY IN INDICATION OF THAT? WELL, WE, YEAH, SO IT IS THE, SO THE, THE TOWNSHIP'S MOVING ROUNDABOUT PROJECT THROUGH, UM, THE, THETHEY ACTUALLY NOW HAVE, WE RECENTLY MADE LAST WEEK A RESUBMISSION OF OUR ROUNDABOUT PLANS, UH, TO THE DEPARTMENTS.
SO THAT'S OFFICIALLY, UH, IT IN THEIR HANDS I GUESS FOR REVIEW.
SO WE'LL GET PROBABLY A LETTER IN OUR PRESENT AROUND CHRISTMAS TIME.
WE'LL PROBABLY ANTICIPATE HEARING BACK FROM THEM.
SO WE'LL HAVE A, A PERSPECTIVE ON THE ROUNDABOUT IN THAT ASPECT WHEN, WHEN WE HEAR BACK FROM THEM BASED ON THE SUBMISSION.
TIMING IS STILL, YOU KNOW, STILL UP IN THE AIR.
THEY, THEY, THE APPLICANT STILL HAS TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS.
WE STILL HAVE TO GO THROUGH OUR ADMINISTRATIVE PROCESS AND THE CHECKS AND BALANCES WITH THE ROADWAY DESIGN AND WE HAVE TO COORDINATE NOW THOSE ELEMENTS WITH THE LAND DEVELOPMENT APPLICATION, THE ACCESS ON BLACKROCK, LIKE MATT SAID.
SO YEAH, INDICATIONS ON TIMING, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE GRANTS, WE HAVE, WE HAVE A GRANT, THE TOWNSHIP PROCEED FROM
BUT THERE'S OTHER GRANTS THAT WE CONTINUE TO PURSUE.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, IT'S STILL EARLY TO FIGURE OUT TIMING, BUT, UM, IS THERE A CORRELATION BETWEEN THE TWO PROJECTS IN TERMS OF ONE CAN'T GET STARTED WITHOUT THE OTHER, OR VICE VERSA, TOTALLY SEPARATE AND THEY'RE GONNA WORK, YOU'LL BE WORKING ON 'EM INDEPENDENTLY? YEAH, AND THAT'S, THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.
UM, AND THAT WAS ACTUALLY A TOPIC OF CONVERSATION DURING OUR MEETING WAS WHAT ABOUT THE INTERIM? SO WHAT HAPPENS IF ONE MOVES FORWARD VERSUS THE OTHER? RIGHT.
SO THEY HAVE STARTED THOSE DISCUSSIONS ON, WELL, IF THE ROUNDABOUT DOESN'T HAPPEN UNTIL 2027, BUT THIS DEVELOPMENT IS UNDER CONSTRUCTION AND OPEN IN 2026, WHAT HAPPENS IN THAT INTERIM 12 MONTH PERIOD? AND WE DID TALK ABOUT THINGS LIKE, UM, MAYBE THE ACCESS ON ONE 13 OR ON BLACKROCK ROAD IS BUILT BUT IS NOT OPENED UNTIL THE ROUNDABOUT IS IN.
UM, THERE'S ALWAYS DISCUSSIONS ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHAT DOES THAT INTERIM TIME PERIOD LOOK LIKE? SO AS WE PROGRESS, I MEAN THERE'S, WE'RE TALKING 20 26, 20 27 TIMEFRAMES, AND AS ANTHONY MENTIONED, NOT ONLY DID THEY HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS TO GET, OR YOU, THE TOWNSHIP HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS TO GET THE ROUNDABOUT APPROVED.
WE HAVE TO GO THROUGH THIS PROCESS AND THE PENDO PROCESS, WHICH IS GOING TO TAKE A WHILE SURE.
SO AS WE GO ON, WE'RE GONNA CONTINUE TO COORDINATE AND WE'LL PROBABLY FURTHER DOWN THE ROAD WE'LL HAVE A BETTER IDEA OF THE TIMING OF BOTH PROJECTS.
YOU KNOW, IF THE TOWNSHIP PROJECT COULD MOVE FASTER, IF THEY, IF THEY RECEIVE THEIR GRANTS, OUR PROJECT COULD MOVE FASTER, SLOWER, WHATE UNDERSTOOD.
THERE'S GONNA BE COORDINATION THAT WILL CONTINUE TO OCCUR, BUT THAT CONVERSATION HAS START.
THAT, THAT'S A GOOD WRAP UP QUESTION.
JOE, YOU HAVE, YOU TELL ME, I JUST WANTED TO COMMENT THAT, UH, YOU ADDRESSED SOME OF THE MAJOR ISSUES WITH THE TRAFFIC AND THERE ARE QUITE A FEW OTHER, OTHER ITEMS THAT HAVE BEEN ADDRESSED IN, UH, IN ALVIN'S LETTERS, UH, BOTH SEPTEMBER AND NOVEMBER LETTERS.
I PRESUME THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD ADDRESS ALL OF THOSE IN SUBSEQUENT, UH, PLANS AS WE MOVE FORWARD.
AND I DIDN'T MEAN TO DISCOUNT THE OTHER COMMENTS, UM, WITHIN THE LETTER, BUT OUR INTENTION OBVIOUSLY, UM, IS TO ADDRESS ALL OF THE ISSUES IN THE BOWMAN LETTER.
AND AGAIN, I THINK IT'S JUST STANDARD PRACTICE THAT WE AS A DEVELOPER OR ME AS THE TRAFFIC ENGINEER WORKING ON BEHALF OF DEVELOPER MUST SATISFY THE TOWNSHIP TRAFFIC ENGINEER WITH RESPECT TO ALL OF THE COMMENTS OUT THERE.
UM, IT MAY NOT BE EXACTLY WHAT IS HOW IT'S OUTLINED IN A LETTER, BUT MY, UH, MY JOB IS TO SATISFY ANTHONY SO THAT WE SIT HERE ONE DAY AND HE SAYS, YES, WE HAVE, WE ARE ON THE SAME PAGE.
WE'VE ADDRESSED ALL THE ISSUES, I'M COMFORTABLE WITH THIS PLAN, JUST THAT THERE ARE OTHER ISSUES THAT ARE OF CONCERN.
AND, AND THEY JUST ALL NEED TO BE ADDRESSED ADEQUATELY.
I, I THINK THE POINT TO KEEP IN MIND IS THAT WE ARE A TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN.
AND WE ARE ALSO COMFORTABLE THAT THE REVIEW LETTERS RELATED TO THIS TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN RAISE ISSUES THAT WE CAN ADDRESS.
AND THEY WILL BE ADDRESSED DURING THE FULLY DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
AND I THINK, I THINK YOU UNDERSTAND, AND I, I KNOW WE DO, I I THINK WE HAVE THIS UNDERSTANDING AROUND, YOU KNOW, THIS, NOBODY IN THIS ROOM WANTS SURPRISES, RIGHT? SO WE'RE GONNA ASK A LOT OF QUESTIONS AND WE MIGHT STOP YOU IN CASES LIKE THIS AND MAYBE DELVE INTO IT A LITTLE BIT.
'CAUSE NOBODY WANTS TO SURPRISE SIX MONTHS AT TIME.
AND, AND, AND AS WE'VE SAID, YOU KNOW, SOME OF THESE THINGS, TO THE
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EXTENT THAT WE CAN PROVIDE ANSWERS TODAY BASED ON WHERE WE'RE IN THE PROCESS, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO TO THE EXTENT, UNDERSTAND A LOT OF ENGINE NEED TO BE DONE AND, AND, YOU KNOW, TEASE TO BE SCRATCHES, BUT WE JUST DON'T, WE JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE'RE ALL ON THE SAME PATH LEADING UP TO THAT FINAL THING.AND I, I, I THINK THAT'S FAIR.
I THINK WE'VE GOT AGREEMENT ON THAT FOR BOTH OF US.
SO I, I THINK CARLA, THAT TOOK MOST OF MY COMMENTS,
OBVIOUSLY THE FOCUS HAS BEEN LARGELY ON TRAFFIC SINCE WE WERE HERE WITH YOU, UH, ABOUT A MONTH AGO.
SO WE'VE BEEN EXTREMELY FOCUSED ON THAT, BOTH BECAUSE WE KNOW IT'S A CONCERN TO THE TOWNSHIP AND TO THE RESIDENTS OF THE COMMUNITY.
UM, AS WE'VE SAID, WE'RE IN A TENTATIVE SKETCH PHASE, BUT I THINK WE ARE IN A POSITION TONIGHT, UH, WITH THE REVIEW LETTERS IN HAND TO SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, WE, WE ARE GOING TO COMPLY WITH AND ADDRESS EACH ONE OF THE COMMENTS IN THE REVIEW LETTERS AS WE MOVE FORWARD THROUGH THE PROCESS HERE.
UM, THE, THE BIG THING THAT WE KNOW IS STILL OUT THERE IS WE KNOW THERE ARE COMMUNITY MEMBERS WHO WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE LAYOUT OF THE HOMES MOVED TO THE NORTH SIDE OF THE PROPERTY.
AND AS WE DISCUSSED LAST MONTH, UM, I DON'T DISCOUNT THEIR, THEIR RATIONALE OR THE REASONING FOR DOING SO.
UM, AT THE SAME TIME, WE HAVE HEARD SINCE WE WERE LAST IN FRONT OF YOU FROM OTHER RESIDENTS WITHIN THE TOWNSHIP WHO HAVE TOLD US THAT THEY SUPPORT THE LAYOUT THAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE.
AND, AND I THINK THAT ECHOES WHAT WE DISCUSSED LAST TIME, WHICH IS ULTIMATELY WE WOULD LOVE TO FIND A, A A, A CONSENSUS HERE, BUT I DON'T THINK WE'RE EVER GONNA GET TO A POINT WHERE THERE'S A FULL CONSENSUS BETWEEN EVERY PERSON IN THE ROOM.
WHAT I AM CONFIDENT IN IS THAT THE LAYOUT THAT WE HAVE TODAY AND THAT WE'VE SHOWN, UM, DOES NOT CREATE ANY UNDUE SAFETY OR TRAFFIC RISKS THAT OBVIOUSLY, AS WE'VE SAID, WE'RE GONNA BE REQUIRED TO COMPLY AND SATISFY ALL THE VARIOUS, BOTH TOWNSHIP AND CONSULTANTS AND, AND OUTSIDE PERMITTING AGENCIES.
BUT WE HAVE HAD THAT CONVERSATION ABOUT IS THERE, IS THERE ANYTHING THAT RELOCATING THESE LOTS TO THE NORTH SIDE OF THE PROPERTY WE DO IN TERMS OF CREATING A SAFER COMMUNITY, SAFER ENTRANCES.
AND THE UNEQUIVOCAL ANSWER WE'VE GOTTEN FROM OUR PROFESSIONALS IS THAT DOESN'T CHANGE THE, OUR ABILITY TO CREATE A SAFE COMMUNITY HERE AND SAFE ACCESS AND EGRESS POINTS WITHIN THE COMMUNITY.
SO WE, AS I SAID, UM, WE'VE HEARD FROM PEOPLE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE AISLE HERE HAVE SAID, WE, WE ENJOY THIS.
SO WHAT, WHERE WE STILL STAND TODAY AND WHICH I THINK WE SAID LAST TIME, IS WE STILL FEEL THIS IS THE BEST LAYOUT GIVEN ALL OF THE VARIOUS VARIABLES THAT WE'VE TAKEN INTO ACCOUNT, UM, TO TRY AND GET TO THIS POINT.
OBVIOUSLY, WE'RE GONNA ITERATE AS WE GO THROUGH THE PROCESS, BUT I, I DO FEEL CONFIDENT SITTING HERE TODAY, WE'RE GONNA BE ABLE TO ADDRESS EACH OF THOSE REVIEW LETTERS.
WE'LL LET DENNY SPEAK ABOUT, UM, THE GILMORE ASSOCIATES LETTER.
AND THEN ULTIMATELY, YOU KNOW, AS MATT SAID, IT'S NOT UP TO US TO DETERMINE WHETHER WE'VE SATISFIED IT.
IT'S, IT'S SOLELY WITHIN THE, THE DOMAIN OF TOWNSHIP STAFF CONSULTANTS AND THE OUTSIDE AGENCIES.
UM, SO I THINK WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR TONIGHT IS OBVIOUSLY FEEDBACK, QUESTIONS THAT WE HAVE ON THAT, AND ULTIMATELY TO GAIN AGREEMENT HERE THAT WHAT WE'VE DONE AND WHAT WE'VE LAID OUT IN THE OVERALL LAYOUT IS BOTH, AS CARL SAID, COMPLIANT WITH THE ZONING, UM, BOTH THE TEXT OF IT AND THE SPIRIT OF IT.
AND WE'RE AT A POINT IN THE PROCESS WHERE MOVING FORWARD INTO THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS IS THE NEXT LOGICAL STEP.
SO WE CAN CONTINUE TO COME BACK TO YOU, ITERATE THROUGH THIS AND PROVIDE ANSWERS.
SO WHAT I'D LIKE TO DO FOLKS HERE, I'D LIKE THE BOARD FIRST TO ASK QUESTIONS IF WE HAVE ANY, WE'LL ASK QUESTIONS FIRST AND WE'LL TURN IT OVER TO THE PUBLIC AGAIN, UM, TO ADDRESS, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER ISSUES.
AND THEN WE'LL COME BACK TO THE BOARD ONE LAST TIME FOR ANY FOLLOW UP.
AND THEN WE'LL, WE'LL DO WHAT, WHATEVER'S NEXT.
UH, ZACH INSTRUCTS US TO TIME WOULD BE APPROPRIATE TO HAVE DISCUSSION ABOUT, UH, RESPONDING TO JEN'S CONCERNS, UH, PRESENTATION YOU TO BE WELL, JEN CERTAINLY CAN SPEAK UP IF SHE HAS, BUT, UH, JEN, I DON'T SPEAK FOR YOU, I JUST TALKED TO YOU, BUT DON'T YOU JUST TELL WHAT THE, WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT? YEAH.
UM, TOM ASKED, AND THE ITEMS IN MY LETTER ARE CONSISTENT WITH THE TENTATIVE SKETCH SUBMISSION.
THE ENGINEERING WOULD COME DURING PRELIMINARY PLAN SUBMISSION, AND IF THEY'RE REPRESENTING THAT THEY CAN, THEY CAN ADDRESS OUR CONCERNS AT THIS POINT.
I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING THAT WOULD PRECLUDE THIS LAYOUT AS SHOWN TONIGHT.
BASICALLY WHAT SHE SAID, JOE, IS THAT SHE, SHE, ALL RIGHT, NOW THEY'RE MOVING TOWARDS THE SAME THING, THAT THEY'RE MOVING TOWARD RESOLUTION OF ALL THE ISSUE OPEN ISSUE.
I, I UNDERSTAND, BUT THERE WAS A REFERENCE TO I THOUGHT SOME KIND OF A PRESENTATION THAT WAS GONNA BE MADE.
YEAH, IT'S ME UNFORTUNATELY HERE.
THOUGH I WOULD, EXCUSE ME ON ANYHOW, HOW ENGINEERING AND WE HAVE WOULD BE MS. SCOT'S, UH, PLAN, UH, LETTER OF NOVEMBER, I THINK 14TH OR SEPTEMBER 30TH.
AND EVERYTHING IN THERE ARE, ARE WILL COMPLIANCE FOR US.
AND THEY'RE ALL, THEY'RE ALL THINGS THAT WILL BASICALLY COME OUT AS SHE INDICATED DURING ENGINEERING, ONCE WE START TO DIRECTLY ALIGN THE ROADS.
AND WHEN I START DOING STORM ORDER SOILS TESTING AND THINGS LIKE THAT, PUTTING THE GEOMETRY ON THAT LAYOUT.
SO RE IF YOU ARE ANY QUESTIONS THEN FROM THE BOARD HERE, ANY, ANY FOLLOW UP QUESTIONS OR GARY, ANYTHING? I, I JUST HAD ONE COMMENT.
I MEAN, UH, IT WAS GOOD TO HEAR, UM, THE, YOU KNOW, MATT'S, UH, SUMMARY OF SORT OF THE TRAFFIC ISSUES AND I JUST, IT WAS GOOD TO HEAR, UH, THAT YOU TALKED
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ABOUT THE INTERSECTION OF SECOND AVENUE AND OLD STATE, RIGHT? THAT'S BEEN ON EVERYBODY'S MIND.EVERYBODY WHO'S DRIVEN THROUGH THEIR, UH, YOU KNOW, KNOWS WHAT A PROBLEM THAT IS.
BUT, UH, WHAT I JUST WANTED TO GET CLARITY, I MEAN, YOU, YOU INDICATED THAT IT'S ON YOUR AGENDA TO TRY AND DO SOMETHING WITH THAT.
UH, IF I RECALL SOME OF THE DISCUSSIONS WE'VE HAD HERE, THERE'S A, THERE'S AN ADJACENT PROPERTY THERE THAT'S NOT IN YOUR CONTROL.
SO HOW REALISTIC IS IT THAT YOU'RE REALLY GONNA BE ABLE TO DO SOMETHING? YEAH, AND I'LL LET MATT SPEAK, BUT, BUT WHAT WE HAVE DONE THERE IS, AND IF YOU RECALL WHEN WE CAME BACK WITH, UH, THROUGH THE ZONING PROCESS, WHEN WE REVISED THE PLAN AND ULTIMATELY SUBMITTED LIEUTENANT SKE PLAN, WE EXPLICITLY IN THAT UPPER LEFT CORNER, LEFT ROOM, AND UH, I BELIEVE IT'S MR. ST'S PROPERTY, I DON'T KNOW IF HE'S HERE TONIGHT OR, OR NOT, BUT YEAH, HE'S HERE.
SO WE'VE TALKED SPECIFICALLY ABOUT HIM AND HIS CONCERNS, OBVIOUSLY.
SO THE INTENT, AND I'LL LET MATT GET INTO MORE DETAIL, IS IF HAD GOTTEN THE TOWNSHIP AND EVERYBODY WAS TO BE AGREEABLE, WE COULD LOOK AT BASICALLY BRINGING OLD STATE ROAD DOWN AND CREATING AN ALIGNMENT ON SECOND HALF BELOW MR. S'S PROPERTY WITHOUT ENCROACHING ON IT IN ANY WAY, STAYING ENTIRELY ON, YOU GUYS MENTIONED THAT LAST TIME YOU WERE HERE, THAT YOU POTENTIALLY MOVED EVERYTHING A LITTLE BIT.
WE LEFT OURSELVES SOME ROOM UP THERE IF WE NEEDED TO DO IT.
AND AGAIN,
SO THAT WAS WHAT I WAS TRYING TO DESCRIBE BEFORE WE INTENTIONALLY THEY INTENTIONALLY DESIGNED THIS AREA SO THERE WOULDN'T BE ANY, ANY YEAH.
IMPEDIMENTS TO THE POSSIBILITY OF DOING IT.
SO THE THOUGHT WOULD BE, AND I AM TALL, BUT I'M NOT TALL ENOUGH, THOUGHT WOULD BE IS FROM THIS DRIVEWAY, AS YOU START TO CURVE THE ROUTE, GO AROUND AND BRING IT IN RIGHT ABOUT UP HERE ON PROPERTY THAT'S THERE.
AND THEN WHAT WE WOULD HAVE TO DO, OH,
DID YOU DO THAT FOR ME? YOU DID THAT EARLY.
SO IT WOULD BE TO BRING THE ROAD DOWN IN HERE.
THIS IS THAT EMERGENCY ACCESS HERE.
SO BRING THE ROAD DOWN IN HERE ON PROPERTY CONTROL.
AND THEN WHAT WE WOULD HAVE TO DO IS MAYBE CUL-DE-SAC THE ROAD HERE AND LEAVE THIS AS A STU TO BASICALLY AS A DRIVEWAY AND JUST SERVICE THESE PROPERTIES HERE.
SO IT'D ALMOST BE LIKE A BIG DRIVEWAY SERVING THREE OR FOUR PROPERTIES THAT WILL COME OFF OF THE RELOCATED SECOND AVENUE.
WE JUST HAVE TO SEE HOW THAT WORKS.
WE HAVE, IT'S A LITTLE BIT TIGHT WHEN YOU COME DOWN HERE WITH A RADIUS.
I THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN ACHIEVE.
UM, BUT AGAIN, WE PURPOSELY DESIGNED IT SO THAT WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO IT.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM THE BOARD? OKAY, WE'RE GONNA OPEN IT UP TO THE PUBLIC THEN WE'RE GONNA START.
DO YOU KNOW THE RULES? IF YOU, IF SOMEBODY ELSE SAYS SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T HAVE TO SAY IT THREE DIFFERENT WAYS, UH, WALK IN AND THEN, YOU KNOW, WE'LL TRY TO HOLD IT TO WHAT, THREE MINUTES, JEFF? IS THAT THE RULE? I CAN PUT THE CLOCK UP IF YOU'D LIKE ME TO.
I THINK WE'RE JUST, JUST KIND OF BE ON THE HONOR, ON THE HONOR SYSTEM.
SO, UH, COME UP, JUST AS YOU KNOW, COME UP AND IDENTIFY YOUR NAME AND UH, ADDRESS AND, UH, LET'S GET AT IT.
HEY, MARK CONNOLLY HERE, UH, 2 0 9 MONTGOMERY AVENUE AND, UH, BOARD MEMBER OF THE PHOENIXVILLE GREEN TEAM.
THE LAST TIME, UH, THE LAST MEETING, I UM, WANTED TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY, ALMOST AN OBLIGATION TO HAVE A WILDLIFE AND A TRAIL ACCESS THAT'S GONNA BE SAFE.
IF YOU CAN YOU ZOOM THE, UH, THE WHOLE PLAN OUT.
HE DOESN'T TAKE AN EXPERT TO RECOGNIZE THAT ANY WILDLIFE MOVEMENT, HE'S GONNA COME DOWN THAT GREEN CORRIDOR.
OKAY? THE RACCOONS THAT ARE GONNA BE IN THE DUMPSTERS IN THE DEVELOPMENT, THEY'RE GOING TO BE AROUND.
AND I'M HOPING, I NOTICED IN THE TRANSPORTATION CIRCULATION TEXT, AND CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, THERE WAS NO MENTION OF THE IDEA OF HAVING THE TRAIL AND A WILDLIFE CORRIDOR UNDER THE REBUILT BRIDGE.
SO I'M HOPING THAT THAT CAN BE PUT INTO IT.
I KNOW IT'S NOT IN YOUR PLAN, BUT THERE WILL BE ACCOMMODATIONS.
I THINK THERE'S SOME CULVERTS RIGHT NOW THAT ARE TERMINATING OFF THE HIGHWAY INTO THAT STREAM BED.
SO I, YOU KNOW, THAT AREA THERE, CERTAINLY THERE'S ENOUGH ELEVATION TO HAVE WIDTH OF THAT PASSING TO OPEN UP A REASONABLE CORRIDOR FOR WILDLIFE AND FOR PEOPLE BECAUSE AS I SAID BEFORE, THIS TRAIL SYSTEM IS GONNA BE CONNECTED.
THIS IS A ONCE IN A LIFETIME CHANCE TO HAVE THAT WHOLE COMMUNITY AND THAT WHOLE SIDE OF THE TOWNSHIP TO HAVE ACCESS TO THE TRAIL ON BOTH SIDES OF THE RIVER.
THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE A GRAY CROSSING.
UH, I THINK THERE'S SOME TEXT ABOUT A GRADE CROSSING.
[00:25:01]
SENTIMENT AND OBVIOUSLY IT'S A FUNCTIONAL REQUIREMENT, BUT I HOPE THE DESIGN CAN MOVE WITH YOUR HELP THE DEVELOPER WITH THE TOWNSHIP WITH SOME VISION AND SOME RESOLVE TO PUSH PENDOT TO MAKE THAT, THAT BRIDGE WIDE ENOUGH FOR PEOPLE AND OUR LITTLE FURRY FRIENDS.HI, RAY ROCKO, 3 74 VISTA DRIVE.
UM, SO I THANK THE PLANNING COMMISSION FOR HAVING THE DISCUSSION TONIGHT AND UM, I THINK YOU ALL KNOW THAT I'M PART OF THE GROUP THAT'S BEEN TRYING TO FOCUS ON MAKING THIS A BETTER DEVELOPMENT, HOWEVER IT COMES.
'CAUSE NONE OF US ARE REAL HAPPY IT'S COMING, BUT WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE THE BEST OF WHAT WE GOT.
AND SO I KNOW IT'S EARLY TENTATIVE SKETCH, THINGS CAN CHANGE.
UM, BUT AS I LOOK AT THE PLAN, I SIT HERE TODAY A LITTLE FRUSTRATED WITH THE GROUP, HAS SHARED A LOT OF INFORMATION WITH THE BOARD, WHICH WE HAVE TO GET BACK ON THEM FOR AND OTHERS ON SOME OF THE SUGGESTED CHANGES AND PLANS THAT WE HAD TALKED ABOUT.
AND WELL, I'M NOT LOOKING TO PAT OURSELVES IN THE BACK, BUT WE REPRESENT A PRETTY DECENT SIZED GROUP.
SO IT'S A LITTLE DISAPPOINTING TO HEAR THAT IF THERE'S A COUPLE OF PEOPLE COMPLAINING ABOUT MOVING IT SOUTH, UH, OR DOWN TO THE SECOND AVE AREA, THAT'S FRUSTRATING ON MOVING THE PLAN UP.
THAT ASIDE, I THINK THE REASON THAT WE WERE LOOKING FOR IT, AND I HONESTLY STRUGGLE FOR ANYBODY WHO LIVES HERE AND HAS TRIED TO GET OUT OF THAT ROAD ON SECOND AVENUE AND OLD STATE ROAD, IT'S A DISASTER
AND WE'RE GONNA BE PUTTING ALL THESE HOUSES IN WITH ENTRANCES ON SECOND, UH, ON OLD STATE ROAD THAT WILL LEAD PEOPLE TO MAKE THE LEFT TO GO ON SECOND AVENUE, MOVING IT DOWN TO THAT EMERGENCY EXIT ACROSS THAT OTHER DEVELOPMENT, THAT IT'S JUST GONNA BE A DISASTER BUILT RIGHT ON TOP OF THE FACT THAT WE GOT THAT NICE LITTLE ROUNDABOUT CIRCLE, WHICH I'M SURE EVERYBODY'S GONNA BE PATIENTLY LETTING PEOPLE IN AND OUT, WHICH WILL CREATE A BEAUTIFUL LITTLE BACKUP FOR THOSE WHO ARE COMING OUT OF THE DEVELOPMENT AHEAD OF THE BRIDGE ON, ON BLACKROCK ROAD.
THERE'S NO GREAT ALTERNATIVES.
UM, BUT I'M NOT SPEAKING FOR THE GROUP, BUT I THINK PART OF WHAT WE DISCUSSED WAS GETTING THAT TRAFFIC OFF OF BLACKROCK ROAD.
HE TALKED ABOUT A SAFE COMMUNITY.
UM, I'M SORRY, I DON'T MIND MAYBE FRUSTRATING FOR ANYBODY WHO MOVES IN HERE TO DRIVE A LITTLE FURTHER, TO GET CLOSER UP TO THE TOP END OF OLD STATE ROAD AND FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET THEIR WAY OVER TO ONE 13.
BECAUSE GETTING UP BLACK ROCK ROAD IS GONNA BE A NIGHTMARE.
I I JUST LOOK AT THIS NOW AND I SAY, CAN YOU IMAGINE THE TRAFFIC TRYING TO GET OUT OF THIS DEVELOPMENT, GOING INTO THAT CIRCLE, KNOWING HOW ROUNDABOUTS WORK ON ALL SIDES OF IT? AND THAT'S JUST A FUNCTION OF WHAT IT IS.
BUT I THINK IF THERE'S ANYTHING WE CAN DO TO GET THOSE ENTRANCES OUT OF THEIR DEVELOPMENTS FURTHER OFF OR OUT OF BLACKROCK ROAD, WHICH MAY BE IMPOSSIBLE, BUT I DON'T MIND MAKING ANYBODY WHO MOVES IN THEIR LIFE'S MISERABLE BECAUSE REALITY IS, IT'S ALREADY BAD.
WHERE PEOPLE ARE HERE ADDING, YOU KNOW, THOUSANDS OF MORE TRIPS TO IT.
AIN'T GONNA MAKE IT ANY BETTER.
UM, WE'LL TRY TO CONTINUE TO WORK WITH THE BOARD AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND THE GROUP HERE TO GET SOME OF THESE IMPROVEMENTS HERE.
'CAUSE YOU KNOW, REALITY IS IT'S HERE, WE GOTTA DEAL WITH IT.
BUT AS A GENTLEMAN BEFORE ME SAID, THERE'S A NUMBER OF THINGS THAT I THINK WE CAN TAKE THE TIME NOW TO DRAW A LINE IN THE STANCE ON AND MAYBE CUT SOME OF THOSE ENTRANCES ON THE BLACKROCK ROAD AND, AND SECOND AVE.
'CAUSE THAT'S JUST GONNA BE A DISASTER.
AGAIN, WE WORRY ABOUT THAT INTERSECTION RIGHT NOW, THAT'S OUT WEST INTERSECTION THAT EVERYBODY KNOWS ABOUT.
I THINK WE'RE CREATING ONE UP ON SECOND AVENUE BY HAVING THAT ENTRANCEWAY OVER THERE.
YOU DON'T HAVE TO JUST MAKE COMMENTS.
YOU CAN ASK QUESTIONS TO REMY AND HIS GROUP.
ANY QUESTIONS MAKE OFFICIAL, OFFICIAL.
UM, TORY BRIGHT, UH, 360 4 VISTA DRIVE.
UH, SO, UH, A FEW OF US HAD THE OPPORTUNITY, UH, TWO WEEKS AGO TO ACTUALLY MEET WITH ANTHONY AND MR. GRACE TO TALK ABOUT THE TRAFFIC CIRCLE.
SO WHILE THAT'S NOT PART OF THE ISSUE TONIGHT, IT IS, IT'S VERY MUCH A PART OF THIS ISSUE.
AND I THINK THAT ONE OF THE THINGS
[00:30:01]
THAT WE RECOGNIZE IS THAT THE TOWNSHIP IS DOING THEIR BEST TO HAVE FLOW OF TRAFFIC THAT CURRENTLY EXISTS THROUGH THAT, THROUGH WHAT WE KIND OF CONSIDER A FOUR POINT INTERSECTION.NOW WE KNOW THAT THERE'S 585 HOMES GOING TO BE BUILT.
WE KNOW THAT THERE'S AT LEAST TWO TO THREE CARS THAT WILL BE ADDED PER HOME.
I KNOW THAT SOME OF YOU ARE GETTING PRETTY TIRED OF LISTENING TO THIS ABOUT SAFETY, SAFETY, SAFETY AND, AND RANDY, I APPRECIATE THAT IT'S THE INTENDED INTENTION OF NVR AND MR. BERMAN TO CREATE A COMMUNITY THAT'S SAFE.
AND I BELIEVE YOU WOULD CREATE A COMMUNITY THAT'S SAFE, BUT I'M GONNA HOLD THE TOWNSHIP LIABLE IF THERE'S NOT SAFETY.
AND RIGHT NOW THAT DOES NOT LOOK SAFE.
I'M GONNA JUST POINT OUT SOMETHING 'CAUSE WE HAVE ACTUALLY CONSULTED WITH A TRAFFIC CONSULTANT.
THIS IS A FOUR POINT, I CAN'T EVEN SEE IT.
WE CAN'T GET, WE CAN'T GET TO THIS.
HUH? YOU DON'T HAVE A POINT OR NOT? I HAVE A POINT.
I THINK YOU'RE POINTING IT THE WRONG WAY.
BUT, SO THAT IS A FOUR POINT CIRCLE.
WE DON'T HAVE ONE OF THOSE THAT EXISTS CURRENTLY IN THIS TOWNSHIP.
OKAY? SO WE, SO WHEN THE TRAFFIC STUDY WAS COMPLETED, IT DID NOT TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION AT LEAST HOMES AND TRIPS FOR ADDITIONAL 585 HOMES.
AND IT DID NOT TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION A FOUR POINT TRAFFIC CIRCLE.
OKAY? NOW, WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW IF, IF I CAN'T MY, MY POINTER'S WORKING, BUT IT'S NOT WORKING FAR ENOUGH.
NOW YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, AS RAY INDICATED, CREATING A THANK YOU.
CREATING A, UH, A CIRCLE OR A ROADWAY THING, UH, CREATING A ROADWAY UP HERE THAT WILL COME IN RIGHT THERE.
DID ANYBODY MEASURE WHETHER OR NOT THAT CORNER, WHICH IS RIGHT HERE, WHERE IT STARTS TO BEND, IS THAT SAFE SPACE? SO THAT WOULD BE A QUESTION THAT I WOULD ASK THE DISTANCE, THE SIGHT LINE DISTANCE FROM THIS SPOT UP HERE, WHICH IS ACTUALLY A BEND, A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT IMPAIRMENT.
YOU CANNOT SEE COMING AROUND THAT THERE'S A HOUSE HERE, THERE'S A HOUSE HERE.
SO IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A, A ROAD THAT'S GONNA COME IN HERE, WHAT'S THE SITE LINE DISTANCE THAT'S REQUIRED? AND YOU'RE GONNA HAVE AT LEAST HALF OF THESE 420 OR SO HOMES IN HERE WANTING TO AVOID THIS TO GET OUT THIS WAY.
SO IF THIS IS ALL A NEW IDEA, WE'D LIKE FOR YOU TO STUDY IT A LITTLE BIT MORE.
WE'RE ASKING YOU TO STUDY IT TO THINK ABOUT THIS AS A PLANNING COMMISSION, MAKING SURE THAT THE SAFETY, THE LIABILITY OF THE TOWNSHIP IS, IS CONSIDERED HERE.
BECAUSE THAT WILL BE AN ACCIDENT WAITING TO HAPPEN.
AND IF I KNOW THAT THAT'S AN ACCIDENT WAITING TO HAPPEN, THERE'S OTHER PEOPLE IN THIS TOWNSHIP BECAUSE YOU'VE BEEN WARNED.
THE OTHER ISSUE WITH THE SAFETY CONSULTANT THAT WE SPOKE TO, THE TRAFFIC CONSULTANT THAT WE SPOKE TO SAID THIS AREA RIGHT HERE DOES NOT PROVIDE SUFFICIENT SIGHT LINE GOING INTO A CIRCLE COMING DOWN.
AND I KNOW WE TALKED ABOUT THE ISSUES OF THERE'S, THERE'S GONNA BE GRADING, THERE'S GONNA BE SEVEN FOOT HIGHER GRADING IN THE ROADWAYS.
THERE'S GONNA BE A CHANGE IN SPEED, BUT THAT DOES NOT PROVIDE THE SUFFICIENT SAFE ENTRANCE EGRESS.
THE BOWMAN REPORT FROM YOUR OWN TOWNSHIP TRAFFIC CONSULTANT HAS 25 ELEMENTS.
AND I'LL JUST KIND OF HIGHLIGHT A COUPLE OF THE ELEMENTS IN CASE FOLKS DID READ IT BECAUSE IT'S ACTUALLY PRETTY IMPORTANT FOR US TO READ THIS.
SO JUST LAST WEEK IT PRE WAS PRESENTED TO US THE LOCATION OF THE BLACKROCK ROAD NUMBER D IN THAT VIRTUAL MEETING.
WHILE THE STUDY DOES NOT CURRENTLY INDICATE THE AUXILIARY LANES WERE CONSIDERING MAYBE AN AUXILIARY LANE BEING ADDED, WHICH MEANS THAT THERE'S GOTTA BE SOMEBODY COMING OFF OF A MAIN LANE TO TURN INTO ANOTHER LANE
[00:35:01]
INTO THAT DEVELOPMENT.IT'S NOT SHOWN HERE, IT'S NOT SHOWN IN THAT TRAFFIC STUDY.
SO I GUESS AGAIN, WE'RE TRYING TO TALK ABOUT SOMETHING NEW HERE.
THERE ARE QUITE A NUMBER OF ELEMENTS IN THIS AROUND SITE DISTANCE CONCERNS FOR SOUTH TRAP ROAD FOR SECOND AVENUE.
AND FOR ONE 13, IT'S ALL BRAND NEW.
YES, YOU'RE GONNA ADHERE TO IT, BUT ARE YOU GONNA HOLD THEM ACCOUNTABLE TO THAT? AND THAT'S PART OF THE QUESTION.
'CAUSE YOU WILL BE LIABLE TOWNSHIP, NOT THEM.
YOU WILL BE, THEY WILL GO AHEAD AND BUILD, THEY'LL MOVE AWAY.
AND THEN YOU WILL BE LIABLE FOR THE AMOUNT OF TRAFFIC THAT'S ON THE ROAD IN ANY POTENTIAL ACCIDENTS.
I ALSO WAS, HAPPENED TO BE AT THE TOWNSHIP MEETING THE OTHER NIGHT AND NOTICE THE TOTAL NUMBER OF DEVELOPMENTS BEING PROPOSED, WHICH I DON'T HAVE THE MAP IN FRONT OF ME, BUT I THINK I COUNTED APPROXIMATELY A HUNDRED, UH, 1,300 AND SOME ODD NEW HOMES.
700 PLUS OF THOSE HOMES ARE TOWN HOMES.
400 OF 'EM ARE SITTING RIGHT HERE.
AND A QUARTER A MILE AWAY IS ANOTHER 125.
AND ANOTHER QUARTER OF MILE IS ANOTHER 125.
SO PART OF THE DILEMMA HERE IS, IS THAT TRAFFIC IN THIS AREA IS GONNA BE SUPER, SUPER CONGESTED.
I KNOW THAT THIS IS PART OF THE PLAN.
IT'S, IT MAKES SENSE TO TRY AND DEVELOP MY LITTLE GRID HERE.
782 TOWN HOMES TOTAL ARE IN, IN PROPOSAL RIGHT NOW.
SEVEN HUNDRED EIGHTY TWO A HUNDRED SEVENTY FIVE SINGLE FAMILY HOMES AND 188 CARRIAGE HOMES.
WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT PARK HOUSE 585, THAT'S JUST 585 FOR PARK HOUSE.
SO TRAFFIC, WHILE WE KIND OF MAY SAY IT'S NOT A BIG DEAL, AND IF YOU CAN GO TO THE SOUTH TRAP ROAD AREA, I LOVE THE IDEA OF MOVING INTO A CARRIAGE HOME.
I LOVE THE IDEA BECAUSE GUESS WHAT, I'M GETTING OLDER AND I'VE SAID THIS BEFORE, I'M GETTING OLDER.
I WANT A SINGLE FAMILY, SINGLE STORY, NICE, YOU KNOW, GRANITE, WHATEVER.
AND I KNOW THAT THESE ENTRANCES AND EGRESSES, IF YOU TRAVEL THE ROAD THAT I HAVE TRAVELED FOR THE LAST 25 YEARS, THOSE ARE NOT SAFE.
SO THE RATIONALE THAT WE AS, AS THE PARKHOUSE STEERING COMMITTEE ARE SAYING, HOWEVER YOU DESIGN THIS, DESIGN IT WITH SAFETY.
BUT YOU'VE GOT VAUGHN ROAD SITTING HERE.
YOU DON'T EVEN HAVE ONE SINGLE ENTRANCE GOING INTO VAUGHN ROAD, WHICH IS THE WIDEST, MOST UPDATED ROAD IN THE TOWNSHIP AROUND THIS AREA.
BUT I DON'T UNDERSTAND, WHY DON'T WE HAVE ANYTHING GOING OFF OF BOND ROAD? YOU HAVE IT COMING OFF THE OLD STATE ROAD, WHICH AGAIN IS THE OLDEST, ONE OF THE OLDEST ROADS MOST NARROW.
SURE IT'S GONNA BE UPGRADED, BUT YOU'RE GONNA HAVE THE MAJORITY OF THE POPULATION GO THE COMMUNITY GOING OUT THAT WAY.
SO AGAIN, I DON'T MEAN TO TO BELABOR THIS PROCESS AROUND WHAT YOU DO, BUT GET IT RIGHT BEFORE YOU APPROVE THIS.
LET, LET'S SEE WHAT ELSE THEY COULD DO TO MAKE IT SAFE.
WE PAY A HECK OF A LOT OF TAXES TO MAKE SURE THAT WE LIVE IN A SAFE COMMUNITY.
THE OTHER THING IS, IS I WANT TO KNOW HOW MANY FIRE AND EMS ARE GOING TO BE ADDED TO BE ABLE TO HANDLE THIS.
I KNOW WE TALKED ABOUT THIS MANY, MANY, MANY, LIKE LAST YEAR, BUT HOW MANY FIRE AND EMS, 'CAUSE I KNOW THEY'RE ALREADY STRETCHED, THEY'RE ALREADY UNDER CAPACITY FOR THEIR ABILITY FOR THE NUMBER THAT WE HAVE IN THE TOWNSHIP.
SO LET'S THINK ABOUT THE SAFETY OF THE CITIZENS THAT ALREADY LIVE HERE.
DON'T APPROVE THIS UNTIL THEY GET IT RIGHT, UNTIL THEY SATISFY THE QUESTIONS THAT WE'VE ASKED.
CAN I JUST GO UP TO ONE MORE THING HERE ABOUT THIS CIRCLE? UM, CAN I JUST GO, I JUST WANNA ASK ABOUT THAT CIRCLE.
'CAUSE THIS IS NOW THAT WE THEY CAME BACK, YOU GUYS CAME BACK AND YOU ADDED THE CIRCLE.
SO ANTHONY IS THAT THIS IS THE CIRCLE DESIGN THAT WE WENT OVER THE OTHER DAY? YES.
AND IT'S SITTING ON PART OF THEIR PROPERTY HERE.
SO THE ORIGINAL ROAD WOULD'VE GONE OUT TO HERE.
AND NOW IT'S GOING DOWN HERE, BUT NOW IT'S THE CIRCLE IS SITTING BACK.
THAT'S DIFFERENT THAN WHAT WAS ORIGINALLY PROPOSED.
[00:40:01]
PROPOSED THAT HAS BEEN SHOWN, I GUESS THROUGHOUT THE MEETINGS UNTIL TONIGHT WAS YOU OR, SO WE INITIALLY HAD A CONCEPT DRAWN BEFORE WE GOT INTO THE ENGINEERING THAT SHOWED IT TO THE RIGHTS OF THE INTERSECTION THERE.UM, BUT THROUGH THE ENGINEERING.
SO IT WOULD'VE BEEN DOWN HERE OR A LITTLE BIT FURTHER DOWN VERSUS NOW MORE, MORE TO THE, UH, PORTION OF WHICH OBVIOUSLY IS OWNED BY REUTERS FORD HOLDINGS IN THIS CORNER.
SO THIS UM, THIS CORNER HERE NOW IS CUT OFF OF IT IS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? YES.
BECAUSE OF THE GRADES THAT YOU MENTIONED EARLIER THAT WE DISCUSSED? YEAH.
ALL THE VERTICAL PROFILING IN THE ENGINEERING.
SO, SO RIGHT NOW THIS PROPERTY, THIS IS ALL FIELD.
YOU ARE GONNA HAVE HEADLIGHTS, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE LOTS OF LIGHTS IN HERE BECAUSE WE'RE GONNA HAVE A COMMUNITY.
ARE YOU BERMING ANY OF THIS? IS THAT GONNA BE A BERM? BECAUSE THEN WE'RE GONNA HAVE SITE ISSUES THEN AGAIN.
SO THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING AS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THAT BECAUSE WE'RE IN A TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN, WE DON'T HAVE CONCEPTUAL GRADING.
IT'S NOT PART OF A TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN.
ALSO, THE ROUNDABOUT OBVIOUSLY HASN'T BEEN FINALIZED.
THIS IS STILL IN DESIGN PHASES.
SO TO THE EXTENT THAT THAT'S WHERE IT ULTIMATELY LANDS AND WE LOOK AT THE GRADING WITH THE COMMUNITY, WE'RE GONNA TAKE WHATEVER STEPS, BOTH THE TOWNSHIP AND PENDOT ADVISES US.
WE NEED TO AGAIN, TO MAKE SURE IT'S SAFE AND IT FUNCTIONS THE WAY THAT IT'S INTENDED.
SO IF PENDOT SAYS, MOVE IT DOWN AND, AND GET RID OF THIS ENTRANCE, 'CAUSE NOW I'M KIND OF HEARING THAT THERE'S A POSSIBILITY YOU WOULDN'T HAVE ACCESS TO THAT ENTRANCE UNTIL THE FULL CIRCLE AND THE FULL DEVELOPMENT IS COMPLETED.
SO THAT'S WHAT I HEARD YOU TO SAY, MATT.
SO IN TERMS OF THE ROUNDABOUT, IF PENDOT TELLS THE TOWNSHIP TO MOVE THE ROUNDABOUT MM-HMM.
WE HAVE NOTHING TO DO WITH THE ROUNDABOUT.
JUST TO BE CLEAR, IT'S A TOWNSHIP PROJECT, RIGHT? THE DISCUSSION WAS WHAT HAPPENS IF THE ROUNDABOUT LAGS MM-HMM
BECAUSE AS ANYTHING HE HAD MENTIONED, THERE'S A RE PROFILING MM-HMM.
SO WHATEVER YOU SEE OUT THERE TODAY FROM A SITE DISTANCE PERSPECTIVE WILL NOT EXIST.
OKAY, WE SAW THE PLANS, I KNOW, BUT THERE'S, THERE'S BEEN A LOT OF DISCUSSION ON THE SITE DISTANCE AND THE ISSUES.
BUT THAT'S NOT GOING TO EXIST.
WHEN THE ROUNDABOUT COMES IN, THERE'S GOING TO BE A RE PROFILING, THE BRIDGE IS GONNA BE WIDENED RE PROFILING, ALL OF THAT IS OCCURRING AS PART OF THE ROUNDABOUT PROJECT.
SO THE DISCUSSION WAS DO WE HOLD OFF ON OLD UP THAT ACCESS POINT UNTIL SUCH TIME AS THE ROUNDABOUT IS IN AND ALL OF THAT RE PROFILING IS DONE? THAT'S A QUESTION THAT WAS THROWN OUT THERE.
THAT'S SOMETHING THAT EVERYONE'S GOING TO DISCUSS AND CONTEMPLATE OVER TIME.
AND IT MAY BE IN EVERYONE'S BEST INTEREST TO HOLD OFF ON THAT, BUT WE DON'T, WE'RE NOT THERE YET.
AND, AND A SECOND PIECE THAT WE DID TALK ABOUT WITH, UH, ANTHONY AND WITH MR. GRACE WAS THAT DURING THIS CONSTRUCTION, SINCE THE ONLY ENTRANCE EGRESS FOR DR THIS ROAD, WHICH IS APPROXIMATELY A HUNDRED AND MAYBE 40 HOMES OR 130 HOMES OR SO, WE DON'T HAVE AN ENTRANCE EGRESS.
SO THAT IS GONNA BE AN ISSUE OBVIOUSLY FOR THE TOWNSHIP.
ALSO AN EMERGENCY SAFETY ISSUE.
ONE THING THAT I SEE HERE, THOUGH, AGAIN THINKING ABOUT EMERGENCY SAFETY, IS THE BRIDGE IS RIGHT HERE.
THE ENTRANCE IS COMING UNDER THE BRIDGE.
I KNOW THERE'S GRADING AND I THINK WE HAVE ASKED THAT THE TOWNSHIP CONSIDER HOSTING A PUBLIC INFORMATION SESSION TO UNDERSTAND THE CORRELATION BETWEEN THIS TRAFFIC CIRCLE AND, AND WHAT'S HAPPENING HERE IN THE DEVELOPMENT.
SO THAT FOLKS CAN UNDERSTAND THIS ISN'T GONNA BE THE DIP THAT WE GO DOWN THE, THE, THE RISE THAT WE COME UP IN THE END.
NOW, AT LEAST ON THE ONE SIDE.
THE ISSUE WITH THAT IS THAT THE WAY THAT YOU'RE DESIGNING THIS, AGAIN, THIS ENTRANCE IS STILL A DANGEROUS ENTRANCE NO MATTER WHAT.
I, I UNFORTUNATELY, I, YOU KNOW, I'M NOT THE ENGINEER, BUT THEY, I'VE ASKED LIKE TWO OR THREE PEOPLE AND THEN I ASKED A TRAFFIC ENGINEER AND THEY SAID THAT, WELL WHAT TRAFFIC ENGINEER THAT YOU ASKED, DID HE COME UP WITH ANY SUGGESTIONS TO MOVE THE ENTRANCE? OKAY, BUT WHERE MOVE THE ENTRANCE IS A BIG THING.
[00:45:01]
IF, OF COURSE, AND I'LL, I'LL ASK MR. UH, I'LL ASK, UH, FOR BILL TO PRESENT AGAIN, WHY WERE WE MAKING THE RECOMMENDATION OF TAKING THIS PORTION OF THE PROPERTY AND FLIPPING IT TO THE OTHER SIDE, WHICH WAS ORIGINALLY IN A DESIGN WHICH WERE FOR HOLDINGS AND VR ACTUALLY DESIGNED, THEY HAD A SKETCH FOR OTHER PARCELS OF THE PROPERTY TO BE BUILT UPON.SO THAT'S NEITHER HERE NOR THERE AROUND.
SO THIS ENTRANCE WOULD'VE NOT BEEN EXISTING IF THE OTHER PARCELS WERE DEVELOPED.
SO IF, IF I MAY, AND I KNOW IT'S YOUR TIME, BUT THERE'S A LOT TO UNPACK HERE.
I JUST, THERE'S A FEW THINGS THAT YOU'VE MENTIONED IN YOUR STATEMENTS THAT ARE INCORRECT.
UM, SOME OF THOSE THROUGH YOUR TRAFFIC ENGINEER, WHOEVER THAT MAY HAVE BEEN THAT, THAT REVIEWED THE STUDY.
AND I JUST WANTED TO MAKE IT CLEAR SO EVERYONE UNDERSTANDS, UM, YOU KNOW, WHAT HAS BEEN SAID AND WHAT HAS ACTUALLY HAPPENED.
UM, SO, AND, AND I APOLOGIZE 'CAUSE THERE WAS A LOT SAID MM-HMM.
THE 800 PAGE TRAFFIC STUDY THAT WAS DONE AND SUBMITTED INCLUDED AN ANALYSIS OF THE FOUR FOUR POINT INTERSECTION INCLUDED AN ANALYSIS OF THE ROUNDABOUT WITH NOT ONLY, AND YOU ARE RIGHT, WE DIDN'T INCLUDE THE 585 HOMES.
SO WE ACTUALLY SHOWED MORE HOMES BEING DEVELOPED THAN ARE ACTUALLY BEING DEVELOPED.
BUT THOSE 600 HOMES THAT WE ANTICIPATED WERE INCLUDED IN ALL THOSE ANALYSIS.
NOT ONLY DID WE, AND THAT TRAFFIC STUDY, MATT WAS, WAS PROVIDED WHEN THAT TRAFFIC STUDY WAS SUBMITTED BACK IN OCTOBER.
THAT WAS WHAT WAS PRESENTED THE NIGHT BEFORE OR THAT AFTERNOON OF THE LAST PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING, C COMMITTEE MEETING.
I DON'T RECALL WHEN IT WAS PRESENTED.
IT WAS SUBMITTED FOR REVIEW SUBMITTED THEN.
AND THAT REVIEW LETTER NOVEMBER 14TH REVIEW LETTER IS NOT ONLY BASED ON THE NOVEMBER 5TH MEETING.
BUT IT'S ALSO BASED ON THE TRAFFIC STUDY THAT WAS SUBMITTED.
SO WELL, AND THAT'S WHY I'M SAYING THERE'S STILL A LOT OF CONCERNS IN THE BOWMAN LETTER FROM NOVEMBER 14TH.
YEAH, THERE'S A LOT OF, THERE'S A WHOLE PAGE OF INFORMATIONAL ITEMS AND THEN THERE'S ANOTHER PAGE OF ITEMS THAT ARE BASICALLY SUMMARIZING THE FIRST PAGE OF ITEMS. SO YES, BUT NONETHELESS THERE ARE A NUMBER OF ITEMS. BUT AGAIN, THE ANALYSIS OF THE ROUNDABOUT WITH THE 585 HOMES ABSOLUTELY INCLUDED THE STUDY.
WE LOOKED AT 2028 CONDITIONS AND WE ALSO LOOKED AT 2033 CONDITIONS.
SO WE LOOKED AT WHAT THE TRAFFIC WOULD LOOK LIKE IN 2033 OUT HERE TO MAKE SURE THAT THE ROUNDABOUT PROJECT THAT THE TOWNS WOULD BE SPENDING MILLIONS OF DOLLARS ON WOULD STILL BE ABLE TO ACCOMMODATE OUR TRAFFIC OR IF THERE WAS ANY IMPROVEMENTS NECESSARY GOING TO THE OLD STATE ROAD REALIGNMENT.
I COMPLETELY DISAGREE THAT THAT REALIGNMENT IS NOT A SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMENT IF IT CAN BE ACCOMPLISHED TO WHAT EXISTS OUT THERE TODAY.
THERE WAS, THERE'S BEEN TALK ABOUT, UM, UH, THAT INTERSECTION THAT EXISTS TODAY IS DANGEROUS AND HOW CAN WE SEND ALL THAT TRAFFIC, THAT INTERSECTION WE ARE LOOKING TO MAKE A SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMENT TO ADDRESS, TO ADDRESS NOT ONLY THE CONCERNS THAT EXIST TODAY, BUT THE CONCERNS THAT THE RESIDENTS AND THE TOWNSHIP HAVE RAISED.
AND FROM A SITE DISTANCE PERSPECTIVE, WHILE THE MEASUREMENTS HAVEN'T BEEN PROVIDED YET, I WILL ASSURE YOU, AND I THINK ANTHONY WOULD AS WELL, THAT WE MUST MEET OR EXCEED ITS SLIGHT DISTRICT REQUIREMENTS IN ORDER FOR PENNDOT TO ALLOW US TO REALIGN OLD STATE ROAD IN THAT LOCATION.
IF WE DON'T MEET THOSE REQUIREMENTS, WE NEED TO SHIFT THE ROAD.
IF WE STILL DON'T MEET THOSE REQUIREMENTS, THEN WE'LL HAVE TO LOOK AT WHAT WE NEED TO DO TO MEET THOSE REQUIREMENTS.
BUT IN NO CIRCUMSTANCE WILL PENNDOT ALLOW US TO MOVE THAT ROAD UNLESS WE PROVE TO THEM THAT WE EXCEED THEIR REQUIREMENTS FROM A SITE DISTANCE PERSPECTIVE.
SO WE'RE NOT JUST PLOPPING A ROAD ON THERE AND SAYING IT BETTER.
WE HAVE TO MEET ALL THE CURRENT CRITERIA AND DESIGN THE ROAD TO PENNDOT'S CURRENT CRITERIA, NOT MATCH WHAT WAS EXISTING FROM 40 YEARS AGO.
UM, SO THAT'S A SIGNIFICANT IMPROVEMENT FROM A SAFETY PERSPECTIVE BY REALIGNING THAT ROAD.
OKAY, THIS, THIS SCALE, BUT IT'S NOT ON THIS SKETCH RIGHT NOW.
IT'S NOT ON THIS, THIS IS THE PLAN AT THIS POINT IN TIME TO, TO GO AHEAD AND REALIGN THAT ROAD.
WE'VE COMMITTED TO WORKING WITH THE TOWNSHIP AT PENDO ON THE POSS ON THE ABILITY TO REALIGN THAT ROAD AND MAKE IT SAFE.
IT'S IN THE OFFICIAL MEETING MINUTES FROM THE MEETING WITH PENDOT AND THE TOWNSHIP.
IT'S IN, IN THESE REVIEW LETTER.
SO IT'S WELL DOCUMENTED THAT THAT IS SOMETHING WE'RE GOING TO LOOK AT.
AND WE'VE ACTUALLY GONE THIS STEP TO MAKE SURE THERE'S NOTHING IN THE WAY THAT WOULD IMPEDE THAT
[00:50:01]
REALIGNMENT TO OCCUR.I WOULD ALSO POINT OUT THAT THIS PLAN IS, UM, THE SCALE OF THIS PLAN IS SUCH THAT A SHORT DISTANCE SEEMS LIKE A SHORT DISTANCE, BUT IT'S ACTUALLY FAIRLY LONG.
THE, THE AREA BETWEEN WHERE THE SPLITTER ISLAND, WHERE THE ROAD SPLITS COMING UP, BLACKROCK TO WHERE THE BRIDGE IS, IS I BELIEVE ABOUT 400 FEET ON THE PLANET.
IT DOESN'T LOOK THAT THAT LONG.
WE, WE'VE SEEN THE PLAN, WE'VE SEEN ALL THE IN INCREMENTS.
I'M JUST, I'M JUST MAKING SURE BECAUSE WE'RE, THE COMMENTS HAVE BEEN MADE THAT, THAT THE, THAT YOUR PROFESSIONAL HAS SAID THAT THAT DRIVEWAY IS UNSAFE.
AND THE POINT WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE IS, IS THAT WE UNDERSTAND THERE'S CONCERNS AND WE'VE AGREED TO WORK TOWARDS, UM, ADDRESSING THOSE CONCERNS.
I'M CONFIDENT THAT WE WILL COME TO A PLAN AT SOME POINT.
THERE'S MORE INFORMATION THAT TOWNSHIP NEEDS.
THERE'S MORE INFORMATION THAT PENNDOT NEEDS AT THE END OF THE DAY, IF WE CAN'T PROVE BEYOND A REASONABLE DOUBT MM-HMM.
THAT THAT DRIVEWAY WILL OPERATE IN A SAFE, EFFICIENT MANNER.
ANY, UM, THOUGHT IN YOUR PROCESS WHEN YOU'RE LOOKING AT ALL THIS, THE ROADS AND WHERE THEY'RE COMING OUT THAT, HAVE YOU CONSIDERED IT ALL OR HAS ANYBODY CONSIDERED IT ALL THAT THIS COULD BE BETTER? I THINK THE QUESTION, TO BE HONEST, WE FORGET THAT WE JUST WANT TO CRITICIZE, BUT WE DON'T REMEMBER TO, LET'S, LET'S COMPARE WHAT WE HAVE IN SOME OF THE TOWNSHIP RIGHT NOW.
WE HAVE A TRAFFIC TRAFFIC CIRCLE OVER OFF OF, UH, MENNONITE ROAD.
UM, THAT IS A 700 FOOT SPAN FOR THE ENTRANCES INTO WHITE SPRINGS.
IT'S A TWO REALLY, IT'S A TWO POINT EXCEPT FOR WEGMAN'S.
THE SHOPPING CENTER ITSELF IS A THREE POINT.
IT DOES NOT SEE ANYWHERE THE AMOUNT OF TRAFFIC THAT THIS AREA WOULD SEE.
SO WE'RE TALKING, AND WE DID SEE THAT IT'S ABOUT A 375 FOOT RANGE.
WE HAVE THAT ANALYSIS, BUT THE 375 FOOT RANGE, WHEN YOU THINK ABOUT TRAFFIC THAT COMES OFF OF SECOND AVENUE, AND I DIDN'T READ THROUGH ALL OF THE COUNTS 'CAUSE I THINK THERE WAS LIKE 700 PAGES OF THAT AND LIKE FIVE, YOU KNOW, FIVE PAGES WERE OF DETAIL THAT WE REALLY NEEDED TO PAY ATTENTION TO.
BUT OF THE COUNTS THAT COME OFF OF SECOND AVENUE, THE BLACKROCK ROAD COUNT AND THE THE, UH, THE COUNT THAT WOULD COME OFF AT CERTAIN HOURS DURING DR.
BIS, YOU KNOW, DURING THE, THE PEAK HOURS OF DR.
SO YOU GUYS ARE GONNA DO YOUR, YOUR JOB.
I'M ASKING THE TOWNSHIP TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY MAKE IT RIGHT BEFORE YOU START DOING YOUR JOB, BEFORE YOU START THE CONSTRUCTION, BEFORE YOU START DOING THE BUSINESS.
AND I, I HAVE TO DO MY JOB IN ORDER FOR THE TOWNSHIP TO DO THEIR JOB.
SO IT CAN'T BE, IT CAN'T BE, WE'RE NOT LOOKING, WE'RE, I HOPE THERE'S NO EXPECTATION THAT WE'RE PUTTING A SHOVEL IN THE GROUND TOMORROW WITHOUT ALL OF THESE DETAILS BEING WORKED OUT.
NO, BUT THERE'S 25 RECOMMENDATIONS HERE FROM THEIR OWN TRAFFIC CONSULTANT THAT SAYS THERE'S SOME SERIOUS CONCERNS AND ISSUES THAT HAVE TO BE ADDRESSED.
AND, AND THAT'S ALL WE'RE SAYING IS PAY ATTENTION TO WHAT YOUR CONSULTANTS ARE TELLING YOU.
AND WE'VE COMMITTED TO ADDRESSING ALL OF THOSE, UM, ITEMS TO THE SATISFACTION OF THE TOWNSHIP AND THEIR CONSULTANTS.
SAME THING WE WOULD DO WHEN WE GET THE PENDOT REVIEW COMMENTS.
I THINK, I THINK, I THINK WE'RE GOING ROUND AND ROUND THE SAME ISSUES HERE.
WE HAVE CERTAINLY HEARD ANTHONY SAY THAT YOU GUYS ARE WILLING TO ADDRESS HIS ISSUES.
I THINK THIS BOARD, 'CAUSE WE TRUSTED OUR CONSULTANTS THAT THEY'RE GONNA TALK TO YOU, YOU'RE GONNA TALK TO THEM AND WE'RE GONNA FIGURE THIS OUT AND WE'RE NOT GONNA FIGURE OUT BUT TO KEEP GOING AROUND IT AND AROUND IT, I THINK WE'VE, WE'VE KILLED IT.
ALRIGHT, SO LET'S MOVE TO WHATEVER OTHER QUESTIONS WE HAVE.
I THINK THE TRAFFIC IS WHAT IT IS.
I THINK WE NEED ANTHONY, I THINK WE NEED TO LET YOU GUYS DO YOUR JOBS AND COME BACK AND WE'LL BEAT IT UP SMOOTH 'CAUSE WE'D LIKE TO DO SO.
UM, THERE'S GONNA BE PLENTY OF OPPORTUNITIES, PLENTY OF OPPORTUNITIES TO LEAD IT UP.
SO, YOU KNOW, AND, AND, AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE'RE CRITICIZING ALL THIS AND I THINK WE'RE LEAVING THAT THE BIGGEST PARTNER IS PENDO.
THEY COULD, THEY COULD PUT A MONKEY WRENCH IN ON ANY OF THIS.
SO I THINK UNTIL WE GET ALL THAT INFORMATION, I THINK WE, WE, YOU HEARD OUR CONCERNS.
LET'S JUST MOVE ON TO THE NEXT ISSUE.
SO WHAT'S, WHAT ELSE IS OUT THERE THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED? UM, THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW WHAT I'VE HEARD BILL, YOU'RE SITTING BACK THERE.
'CAUSE I'VE HEARD FROM BOTH SIDES THAT THERE IS SOME, THERE IS SOME INTEREST IN MOVING THE, THE, UH, PLAN A LITTLE BIT TO THE SOUTH, I GUESS.
IS THAT THE SOUTH, NORTH, NORTH, YEP.
UM, IF YOU'S BEEN REAL HONEST WITH US THAT THEY THINK THIS IS THE BEST PLAN, UM,
[00:55:02]
I AGREE WITH HIM.I THINK HE, WHEN HIS OPENING STATEMENT, I'M NOT SURE THAT, YOU KNOW, NO MATTER WHAT WAY WE GO, SOMEBODY'S GONNA BE UNHAPPY.
UM, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW YAGER ROAD THERE LOOKS LIKE A PERFECT PLACE, BUT YOU KNOW, NOBODY WANTS TRAFFIC DUMPED ONTO THEIR ROAD AND YOU KNOW, MAYBE THE STATE ROAD IS THE BEST ROAD ONE 13 OR BLACK ROAD WE CAN CALL IT.
MAYBE THAT'S THE BEST ROAD TO DUMP IT ON.
BUT, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, UM, I DON'T KNOW IF ANYBODY WANTS TO MAKE ANY MORE COMMENTS ON THAT PART OF IT.
UM, WE'RE WILLING TO LISTEN AND I KNEW BILL WOULD GET A, I KNEW THAT WOULD GET BILL.
BILL FELTON 1 33 OLD STATE ROAD.
HOW ABOUT THE, THE TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN THAT'S BEING PROPOSED WITH THE, WITH THE PINK? COME ON BILL.
WE KNOW WHAT YOU'RE PUTTING UP THERE.
CAN YOU PLEASE JUST, SO, SO WELL I'D LIKE TO SEE THE, THE TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN IF YOU COULD.
MY ROLE IS NOT TO BE VAN OF HERE, PLEASE.
NO, BUT I, I'M, I'M, I'M TRYING, I'M TRYING.
JUST MAKE YOUR POINTS AND WE'LL TRY AND CATCH.
SO, SO THE TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN, WHICH WE ALL KNOW THERE WE ARE.
JEFF, UH, HAS, HAS, SHOWS THE WHOLE PROPERTY AS IT COULD BE DEVELOPED.
AND YOU KNOW, WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING WITH THE ALTERNATE SKETCH PLAN.
SO, YOU KNOW, THE PINK ON THE, ON THE, UH, ALONG OLD STATE ROAD ON THE TOP RIGHT OF THE, UH, PICTURE HERE AND THE PINK ALONG YEAGER ROAD IS THE PROPOSED OPENS PLACE SPACE THAT THE PREVIOUS PLAN SHOWED WHAT WE'RE PROPOSING WITH THE ALTERNATIVE PLAN, WHICH I THINK, UH, ADDRESSES AND RESOLVES A LOT OF THE ISSUES THAT HAVE BEEN BROUGHT UP HERE TONIGHT.
PARTICULARLY REGARDING THE TRAFFIC.
I MEAN, THIS PLAN IS SHOWING 420 UNITS CLUSTERED ON THAT CORNER OF OLD STATE AND SECOND AVENUE AND 147 DOWN ON THE NORTHEAST CORNER OF BLACKROCK ROAD.
UM, THAT'S A LOT OF HOMES CONCENTRATED IN ONE PART OF THE PROPERTY WITH NO VIABLE ROAD TO EGRESS OUT OF THIS DEVELOPMENT, UH, YOU KNOW, OLD STATE ROAD THERE, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, UH, MOVING, MOVING THAT OVER TO A T INTERSECTION WITH A, AN EMERGENCY ROAD THAT OPENS INTO AN EXISTING DEVELOPMENT.
I MEAN, YOU KNOW, THE HEADLIGHTS, THE, THE POSSIBILITIES OF PEOPLE RUNNING THROUGH THAT INTERSECTION, THAT CREATES A DANGEROUS SITUATION, I FEEL.
UM, NOW OUR ALTERNATE PLAN, IF I COULD SEE THAT, THAT'S MY NEXT STEP HERE.
SO WHAT WE'RE SHOWING HERE IS WE COLORED AS THE PREVIOUS PLAN HAD DONE, SHOWING THE PINK BEING THE OPEN SPACE ON THIS CORNER OF OLD STATE AND SECOND AVENUE, AND THE TWO PIECES AT GER ROAD AND AT OLD STATE ROAD BEING DEVELOPED AS PROPOSED ON THE TENDER SKETCH PLAN.
UM, YOU KNOW, THIS, THIS PLAN, INSTEAD OF A 420 UNIT CLUSTER WITHOUT ANY INTERRUPTION OF, OF A HYDRO OR A NATURAL BORDER OR POT LOTS OR ANYTHING THAT'S, AT LEAST IT'S NOT SHOWING THE PLAN YET, IS A HUGE NEIGHBORHOOD, 420 UNITS.
AND THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE THE 18 UNITS UP ON HALFMAN ROAD.
SO THIS PLAN WOULD CREATE BASICALLY FIVE NEIGHBORHOODS, THE 18 UNITS, 140 UNITS RIGHT THERE ALONG OLD STATE ROAD ACROSS FROM HALFMAN ROAD, 212 UNITS ALONG OLD STATE ROAD UP NEAR YAGER, 71 UNITS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAT WOULD BE ALONG YEAGER ROAD.
AND THEN YOU HAD 147 UNITS ON THE NORTHEAST CORNER.
SO, YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK THIS PLAN SOLVES A LOT OF THE STUFF THAT WE'RE, YOU KNOW, REALLY TOSSING AROUND REGARDING THE TRAFFIC.
YOU NOW YOU HAVE SMALLER NEIGHBORHOODS WITH AN EXIT AT VARIOUS PARTS OF THE PERIMETER OF THIS PROPERTY.
INSTEAD OF FORCING 420 UNITS OUT ONTO TO WHICH ROAD, YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE DOESN'T SEEM TO BE A ROAD THAT'S GONNA MAKE SENSE TO EXIT THAT THOSE UNITS OUT THERE.
WELL, JUST PERSONALLY, BILL, WHEN I LOOK AT IT, YOU KNOW, AND I HAVE NO SCHEME IN THE GAME WHERE THE PROPERTY IS.
I'M GONNA ASK BENNY AGAIN TO JUST EXPLAIN WHY THEY LIKE IT BRIEFLY, BRIEFLY, BUT SO BEFORE YOU DO, YOU KNOW, JUST, JUST THEORETICALLY, IT LOOKS TO ME LIKE IT'S BETTER TO DUMP IT ONTO A STATE ROAD THAN ONTO A TOWNSHIP OR THIS TRACK.
YOU'RE, YOU'RE, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT DUMPING, WHAT, TWO 12 UP HERE AND 71 OVER HERE, PUTTING THEM ON TOWNSHIP ROADS,
[01:00:01]
YEAGER ROAD OR WHATEVER.ALL, ALL OF THE ROADS ARE, ARE GONNA BE IMPROVED.
WELL, I, I DON'T KNOW THAT I, I I HAVE NOT HEARD A LOT OF TALK ABOUT, I DON'T KNOW WHAT ANTHONY'S PLAN IS FOR YEAGER ROAD.
I, WE HAVEN'T HEARD ANY OF THAT.
WE KNOW STATE ROAD'S GONNA BE IMPROVED.
I MEAN, WE KNOW STATE ROAD'S GONNA, I HAVEN'T HEARD ANYTHING ABOUT YAGER ROAD.
AM I CORRECT ON ANY OF YOU? HAVE WE TALKED ABOUT YAGER ROAD AT ALL, OR? YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S, AND THE APPLICANT TEAM HAVE MENTIONED WIDENING THAT'S REQUIRED ON YAGER ON THE OLD STATE ROAD.
YEAH, WE'VE NOT TALKED ABOUT YAGER.
I DON'T THINK ANYTHING'S PROPOSED FOR YOU.
NOTHING'S BEEN PROPOSED FOR YET.
SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DUMPING ALL THAT ONTO TOWNSHIP ROADS VERSUS ONE 13, WHICH IS A STATE ROAD.
WHICH THEY GOTTA HANDLE, WE DON'T HAVE TO HANDLE.
SO JUST TENTATIVELY THAT LOOKS TO BE, NOW AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW WHERE THE HOUSES SHOULD BE.
I'M JUST TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC IN THIS CASE.
SO NOW I'M GONNA LET RANDY AGAIN EXPLAIN WHY THIS PLAN, THE ORIGINAL PLAN OR THE CURRENT PLAN IS THE BEST PLAN FOR THEM AND WHY IT MAKES SENSE.
AND, AND I, I THINK I WANT TO START WITH, I MEAN, UH, AND WE APPRECIATE, YOU KNOW, THE INPUT AND THE CREATIVITY HERE.
THE REALITY IS WE COULD ASK 10 DIFFERENT PEOPLE, A HUNDRED DIFFERENT PEOPLE TO WHAT, WHAT, HOW THEY WOULD DO THIS.
AND WE'D GET 10 OR A HUNDRED DIFFERENT ANSWERS, 10 OR A HUNDRED DIFFERENT THOUGHTS.
I HAVE TO, AND I DO TRUST IN THE PROFESSIONALS THAT WE'VE HIRED.
AND THAT'S WHAT'S A LITTLE BIT DISAPPOINTING IS IT FEELS LIKE I'M HEARING A LOT OF PEOPLE TELLING US WHAT THEIR OPINIONS ARE.
AND I, I THINK IT'S DOING A DISSERVICE TO THE PROFESSIONALS TO DISCOUNT WHAT, NOT ONLY MY PROFESSIONALS, BUT THE TOWNSHIP PROFESSIONALS ARE TELLING US, AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE HAVE TO INDU TRUST THAT THE ADVICE WE'RE GETTING FROM THEM BASED ON THE YEARS OF EXPERIENCE IS WHAT'S ULTIMATELY GONNA ALLOW US TO BUILD THE SAFEST AND BEST COMMUNITY OUT HERE.
AND BY TAKING INTO ACCOUNT ALL OF THOSE FACTORS, INCLUDING TRAFFIC, INCLUDING THE TOPOGRAPHY OF THE PROPERTY, INCLUDING THE NATURAL LAND TRUST REPORT THAT WE TALKED ABOUT PREVIOUSLY, WE'VE DERIVED AT WHAT WE FEEL ALLOWS US TO MEET THESE ISSUES THE BEST WE CAN.
AND AS I SAID BEFORE, THE OTHER THING I'M VERY CONFIDENT IN IS THAT WHAT WE'VE LAID OUT HERE, THAT, THAT THERE IS NOT A, A, A, AN IMPROVEMENT.
THAT, YOU KNOW, WE ARE LOOKING AT THIS SAYING, WELL, HEY, WHAT IF WE DID IT THIS WAY? WELL, IT AGAIN, JUST TO POINT IT OUT, NOW YOU HAVE ONE EXIT FOR THE ENTIRETY OF THOSE UNITS.
YOU'VE SHOWN IN BLUE IN THE CENTER.
WE HAVEN'T CHANGED THE FACT THAT YOU STILL HAVE THE ENTRANCES ON THE OLD STATE ROAD.
SO THE POINT IS, WE'RE ALL ENTITLED TO OUR OWN OPINIONS, BUT WHEN IT COMES TIME TO US DETERMINING WHAT THE BEST PATH FORWARD IS, I HAVE TO TRUST IN THE FACTS AND THE ANALYSIS OF OUR PROFESSIONALS.
AND THAT'S WHAT'S LED US TO SAY, THIS IS THE PLAN THAT MAKES THE MOST SENSE TO ADDRESS ALL THE STAKEHOLDERS.
WE'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO MAKE EVERYBODY IN THE ROOM HAPPY, BUT WE'RE GONNA TRY OUR DAMNEDEST TO, AND THAT'S WHAT WE'VE DONE TO AT LEAST LAY THIS OUT IN A WAY WHERE WE FEEL LIKE IT MAKES THE MOST SENSE.
AND, AND I, I APPRECIATE WE MAY HAVE A DIFFERENCE IN OPINION ON THAT, BUT THAT'S WHERE WE CAN DIFFER ON OPINION.
WE HAVE TO AGREE ON THE FACTS HERE.
AND I CONSIDER THE FACTS WHAT THE PROFESSIONALS IN THE ROOM ARE TELLING US BASED ON THEIR YEARS AND YEARS OF EXPERIENCE.
BILL, I AND MY QUESTION, ANOTHER QUESTION TO YOU, TO YOUR PEOPLE THAT WANT TO MOVE THIS, WHAT, WHAT DO I, BECAUSE I'VE HEARD FROM JEFF'S FROM WHAT DO WE TELL THE PEOPLE ON YAGER ROAD? WHAT DO WE TELL THOSE PEOPLE? WE'RE, WE'RE GONNA DUMP ALL THAT TRAFFIC ON YOUR ROOF.
IT'S NOT A PERFECT SITUATION, DON'T GET ME WRONG, BUT TRAFFIC, BUT HOW DO I EXPLAIN THAT TO SOMEBODY THAT, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE BILL FELTON COMES TO ALL THESE MEETINGS AND MAKES THIS PROPOSAL, SO WE'RE GONNA DUMP IT NOW ON THE YAGER ROAD.
HOW DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? THE, THE TRAFFIC IS GONNA BE ON YAGER ROAD, THE TRAFFIC'S GONNA BE ON OLD STATE, THE TRAFFIC IS GONNA BE EVERYWHERE.
THE BIGGER QUESTION IS HOW DO YOU SAFELY GET THE TRAFFIC FROM 420 UNITS OUT ONTO THE ROADS THAT IT'S GONNA BORDER THERE? YOU KNOW, I DISAGREE WITH YOU ON THAT THOUGH.
I THINK, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE HAVEN'T TALKED ABOUT GER ROAD AT ALL.
IT'S NEVER BEEN DISCUSSED UNTIL RIGHT NOW OR SINCE YOU PUT THIS NO, I MEAN, GER ROAD, YOU KNOW, I MEAN, IT, IT'S A, IT CROSSES THE WHOLE TOWNSHIP FOR THE BLACK ROAD.
BUT I MEAN, BLACK ROAD TURNS TO ROAD.
IT'S NEVER BEEN PART OF THIS PLAN THAT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO DO SOMETHING ROAD.
WELL, THIS WAS THE PROPOSED PLAN.
WE JUST RE-DESIGNATED WHERE THE OPEN, WHERE WE ARE SUGGESTING THE OPEN SPACE SHOULD BE.
THE OTHER PART OF THAT, I MEAN, I WAS JUST TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC IS, IS, YOU KNOW, THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN WAS PASSED THE OTHER NIGHT AND YOU KNOW, THEY'RE CALLING FOR THE LANDS FROM OLD STATE ROAD BACK TO THE MINGO CREEK TO BE CONSERVED.
WELL, YOU KNOW, THERE'S, THERE'S, IT HAS TO BE MONEY TO, TO, TO CONSERVE LAND AND THE AGENCIES THAT PROVIDE THAT FUNDING, IF THAT'S THE OPEN SPACE AND IT'S CONNECTED TO THE UPPER CHUCO VALLEY PARK AND THE SCHULL RIVER, NOW THEY'VE GOT A GREENWAY, YOU KNOW, NOW, NOW THEY'VE GOT SOMETHING TO TALK ABOUT.
UH, MARK WAS TALKING ABOUT THE WILDLIFE CORRIDOR THAT, YOU KNOW, IF, IF THE WILDLIFE ARE COMING FROM THE RIVER AND COMING UP INTO THIS DEVELOPMENT, IF THE OPEN SPACE
[01:05:01]
IS THE TWO PARCELS AT GOLD STATE AND GER ROAD, IT'S A CUL-DE-SAC FOR THE WILDLIFE.YOU KNOW, THERE'S NO THROUGH COURT THERE.
THEY RUN INTO 4 22, THERE'S A CHURCH DEVELOPMENT ON ONE PROPERTY, AND OF COURSE THERE'S SINGLE FAMILY HOMES.
THE PROPERTY'S GOING FROM OLD STATE ROAD BACK TO DOMINGO CREEK.
IF THAT'S CONSERVED LAND NOW WE, WE, WE'VE GOT SOMETHING FOR THE, FOR THE WILDLIFE, FOR THE, FOR THE POLLINATORS, FOR THE BIRDS, ALL THIS, THIS SORT OF THING, TALKING ABOUT, WELL, THANK YOU BILL.
WE'LL TAKE THAT INTO CONSIDERATION.
WE DO OUR, OUR WHAT OUR NEXT EXTENSION.
AND, AND YOU KNOW, FRED, I MEAN I, YOU, YOU GUYS ARE THE EXPERTS.
YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW WHAT, WHAT YOU NEED TO, TO SELL HOMES.
BUT I WOULD THINK THAT IF YOU'RE GONNA BE MARKETING THIS PRODUCT TO THE PUBLIC, TO ME IT SEEMS IT WOULD MAKE SENSE TO HAVE NEIGHBORHOODS, CREATE NEIGHBORHOODS THAT YOU'RE GONNA SELL TO, TO THE PUBLIC.
NOT JUST, YOU KNOW, 1 420 UNIT DEVELOPMENT.
I MEAN, YOU, YOU KNOW, HOW DO YOU PHASE THAT THROUGH CONSTRUCTION? I MEAN, I KNOW YOU HAVE HAVE AN ANSWER TO THAT, BUT, BUT, YOU KNOW, I WOULD THINK THAT, AND IF YOU, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GONNA BRING IN OTHER, UH, BUILDERS, YOU KNOW, BY SEGMENTING THIS ONE, THE FIVE DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOODS, I THINK YOU'D HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO, YOU KNOW, TO ATTRACT HIRE.
YOU GOTTA HIRE BILL AS YOUR MARKETING GUY.
I MEAN, I RESPECT THESE GUYS ARE THE EXPERTS.
THEY, AND YOU KNOW, WE, WE GOTTA RESPECT THAT WE'VE TALKED AND, AND YOU KNOW, YOUR, YOUR DEVELOPMENT IN WESTCHESTER, WE ALL KNOW WHAT THE COMMENTS ON THAT WERE AND WHY, WHY IT WAS ATTRACTIVE AND WHY YOU, YOU SOLD, RIGHT? YOU CREATED NICE LITTLE NEIGHBORHOODS WITH HEDGE ROWS AND, AND TREES LINING THE DEVELOPMENTS.
AND, AND IT WASN'T, I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS OUT THERE.
YOU COME ACROSS ONE 13 FROM PHOENIXVILLE, THAT'S GONNA BE A, A SIGNIFICANT, UH, DEVELOPMENT.
YEAH, THAT'S, IT'S, THAT'S WATER OVER THE PHOENIX.
SO IT'S GONNA BE BUILT, BUT I'M JUST TALKING ABOUT AESTHETICS.
WELL I THINK WE'RE PAST AESTHETICS TOO.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE ALL KNOW IT'S GONNA BE BUILT.
WE'RE HOPING YOU'RE GONNA BUILD THE BEST PROPERTY.
I HEARD THE WORD A MILLION TIMES.
I ALSO BELIEVE YOU'RE GONNA BUILD A NICE LOOKING PROPERTY.
I, I'M CALLING, SO THANK YOU BILL.
CAN I MAKE A COMMENT? I STILL THINK EVEN WITH THIS ALTERNATIVE PLAN, THAT SOMETHING'S GONNA HAVE TO BE DONE AT SECOND AVENUE.
AND, AND ALL, BUT YOU'RE NOW ALSO GOING TO CREATE A PROBLEM ON ALLSTATE ROAD AND YEAGER ROAD AT THAT INTERSECTION.
WHICH NOW ALSO HAS TO BE ADDRESSED.
RIGHT NOW, MAYBE IT'S NOT QUITE THE SAME SEVERITY 'CAUSE OF SIGHT LINES AND THE TURNS ON THE ROADS, BUT, SO NOW WE GOT TWO INTERSECTIONS THAT WE NEED TO CONCERN OURSELVES WITH.
SO I'M NOT SURE FROM A SAFETY TRAFFIC PERSPECTIVE THAT THIS IS REALLY MUCH OF AN IMPROVEMENT.
'CAUSE WE KNOW WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO DO THE SECOND AVENUE ANYHOW.
YEAH, I MEAN, I, I, SO I THINK IT'S GONNA BE A RELIEF.
ANOTHER PROBLEM TO ADDRESS, WHICH IS THE OLD STATE GER ROAD IS INTERSECTION.
SO WE'RE NOW JUST KIND OF COMPOUNDING THE ISSUES AND THE PROBLEMS. WHAT WE GET FROM, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE NORTH, I, I THINK THAT INTERSECTION, OLD STATE Y IS STILL HAVE TO BE ADDRESSED.
'CAUSE PEOPLE, WHAT, WHERE ARE PEOPLE GOING WHEN THEY LEAVE THE 420 UNITS? THEY'RE NOT NECESSARILY ALL GOING OUT TO SECOND AVENUE.
IF THEY'RE GOING TO PROVIDENCE TOWN CENTER OR TO 4 22 OR TO THE TOWNSHIP PARK.
THAT'S WATER UNDER THE DAM AT THIS BOOK.
IT'S, I MEAN, THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.
IT'S ALL, IT'S ONLY ON PAPER NOW.
SO WE'RE TRYING TO IN FRONT, BUT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT DUMPING 300 HOUSES ONTO YOUR ROOF AND I JUST DON'T SEE, WE GET IT.
GOOD EVENING, BLAKE WELLING 1 35 BENNINGTON ROAD.
I'D LIKE TO RAISE A COUPLE POINTS HERE.
FIRST OF ALL, WE TALKED ABOUT A LARGE VOLUME BEING DUMPED ONTO YAGER ROAD.
IT SAYS 71 UNITS THAT IS FAR LESS IN TERMS OF THE VOLUME OF TRAFFIC THAN THE 489 OR SO UNITS.
THOSE 212, MOST OF THOSE ARE GONNA GO DOWN TO JAGER ROAD RATHER THAN GOING UP TO OLD STATE.
SO WE GOT, I MEAN IF YOU, WITH NUMBERS ALL WE WANT, WE'VE GOT TWO PROBLEMS WITH THIS PLAN RATHER THAN PERHAPS JUST ONE PROBLEM THAT WE'RE GONNA ALL BE ADDRESS AS PART OF THEIR CLAIM.
I THINK YES, I UNDERSTAND THAT.
BUT JUST LET ME POINT OUT THAT WE'RE SPLITTING UP BY THIS SKETCH, A LARGE
[01:10:01]
VOLUME OF TRAFFIC THAT WOULD BE GOING THROUGH ONE OR TWO ENTRANCES INTO MULTIPLE ENTRANCES AND EXITS.INCREASES IN VOLUME WILL OCCUR REGARDLESS.
BUT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HOW MUCH TRAFFIC GETS DUMPED ONTO SOME OF THESE ROADS THROUGH A SMALLER NUMBER OF INTERSECTIONS, A SMALLER NUMBER OF ACCESS POINTS.
WITH REGARD TO THE ORIGINAL TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN, WITH THE DIFFERENCE IN COLOR SCHEME HERE, AND THEN NOW THE NEW PLAN THAT WAS DISPLAYED EARLIER, I HAVE TO WONDER, I HAVE TO WONDER, BASED ON THE COMMENTS I HEARD FROM MR. SATAN ABOUT THE JUDGMENT, THE MANY, MANY, MANY YEARS OF EXPERIENCE THAT WENT INTO THE LATEST ITERATION, WHETHER THOSE INDIVIDUALS THAT DRAFTED THE PLAN, WHETHER THEY WERE BIASED TOWARDS THE ORIGINAL SETUP, OR WHETHER THEY WERE SPECIFICALLY ASKED AS TO WHETHER THIS PLAN WOULD OFFER A BETTER SAFETY PERFORMANCE, IF YOU WILL, AND I BETTER SAFETY WITH RESPECT TO TRAFFIC CONGESTION AT THE ACCESS POINTS TO EITHER A LARGE SINGLE DEVELOPMENT OR A MULTIPLE PORTION.
AND, AND I CAN ANSWER THAT QUESTION BECAUSE I DID ASK EXACTLY THAT QUESTION.
I ASKED EXACTLY THAT QUESTION OF, OF MATT.
IN FACT, AND MATT, YOU CAN ANSWER, I WON'T SPEAK FOR YOU.
BUT IF WE SPECIFICALLY ASKED THE QUESTION, IS ANYTHING ABOUT THE ALTERNATE PLAN THAT YOU PRESENTED? DOES IT, DOES IT GIVE US A SAFER COMMUNITY? DOES IT INCREASE IN, IN ANY WAY THE ABILITY TO FLOW TRAFFIC HERE? AND MATT, I THINK YOUR ANSWER WAS UNEQUIVOCALLY NO.
IT DOESN'T CHANGE ANYTHING IN TERMS OF THE ALTERNATE PLAN HERE.
I I GUESS I'M JUST TRYING TO TAKE A, I GUESS I'M A LITTLE BIT TAKEN ABACK BY THE COMMENT THAT MY ETHICS OR DENNY'S ETHICS MAY HAVE BEEN, UM, COMPROMISED DUE TO BIAS OR SOMEONE TELLING US WHAT TO DO.
MY JOB, AT THE END OF THE DAY, WHEN WE DO THIS ON THE TRAFFIC STUDY, ON THE HOP PLANS, EVERYTHING I SUBMIT, I GOTTA SIGN AND SEAL IT AS A PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER IN THE COMMONWEALTH OF PENNSYLVANIA.
AND I HAVE TO ATTEST THAT WHAT I AM PROVIDING IS SAFE AND MEETS ALL OF THE CRITERIA.
SO RE COULD HAVE TOLD ME TO PUT ALL 600 HOUSES IN ONE CORNER ON THE CORNER OF SECOND AND OLD STATE, AND I WOULD SAY, RENNY, IT'S NOT GONNA HAPPEN.
WE'RE NOT GONNA, I I, AND MATT'S TOLD ME THAT BEFORE, SO I KNOW HE WILL SAY THAT TO ME.
'CAUSE MATT HAS TOLD ME THAT ANSWER BEFORE.
SO I'M NOT, SO MY, THERE'S NO BIAS OR INFLUENCE BY RENNY TO TELL ME WHAT I NEED TO DO.
RENNY TELLS ME WHAT HE'S LOOKING TO DO AND I TELL HIM HOW WE CAN ACCOMPLISH IT BASED ON THE CRITERIA THAT I MUST FOLLOW AS A PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER.
I THINK THE QUESTION IS, IS THIS PLAN SAFER THAN THE OTHER PLAN? THAT'S THE QUESTION.
IS THIS PLAN SAFER THAN THE OTHER PLAN? THIS PLAN IS ON THE SCREEN IN THE BLUE.
WE, WE CAN'T JUST TAKE COMMENTS FROM THE AUDIENCE.
WELL, HEY, BUT THAT'S THE QUESTION.
IT WASN'T, I DON'T THINK, LEMME REPHRASE MY QUESTION.
SO THE QUESTION IS, IS THIS ORIENTATION, THIS PLAN WHERE YOU WOULD CONSIDER TO DEVELOP THE PORTIONS IN BLUE, SAFER OR LESS SAFE THAN THE OTHER PLAN AS SHOWN EARLIER THIS EVENING? I DO NOT BELIEVE THIS PLAN IS SAFER THAN THE PLAN THAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE IN FRONT OF THE TOWNSHIP.
AND ONE OF THE REASONS I SAY THAT IS THE FACT THAT THE PLAN THAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE IN FRONT OF THE TOWNSHIP, WHETHER THE, THE, THE RESIDENTS LIKE IT OR NOT, OR THE TOWNSHIP LIKES OR NOT, PROVIDES FOR MULTIPLE WAYS TO ACCESS THE DEVELOPMENT TO DISPERSE THE TRAFFIC IN THE BEST WAY THAT WE CAN BASED ON THE PARAMETERS THAT WE HAVE TO WORK WITH.
THIS PLAN THAT'S SHOWN ON THE SCREEN NOW IS ESSENTIALLY SENDING MOST OF THE TRAFFIC TO THE NORTH ON OLD STATE DOWN YEAGER TO BASICALLY CIRCULATE AROUND BLACKROCK ROAD.
YOU'VE CONCENTRATED ALL OF YOUR ACCESS ONTO TWO ROADS, ESSENTIALLY, WHERE OUR PLAN HAS GIVEN THE ABILITY FOR PEOPLE TO CHOOSE
[01:15:01]
HOW TO GET THERE AND HOW TO LEAVE, WE'VE GIVEN MORE OPPORTUNITIES TO DISPERSE THE TRAFFIC.AND YES, THERE'S 25 COMMENTS IN THE BONE REVIEW LETTER.
AND YES, THERE'S CONCERNS WITH RESPECT, TRAFFIC CONCERNS THAT HAVE TO BE ADDRESSED.
WE WILL ADDRESS THEM AND WE WILL MEET ALL THE CRITERIA.
BUT I BELIEVE THE PLAN THAT WE HAVE IN FRONT OF THE TOWNSHIP RIGHT NOW PROVIDES FOR MORE OPPORTUNITIES TO DISPERSE THE TRAFFIC RATHER THAN CONCENTRATING ON ON TWO ROADS BEFORE IT HAS TO DISPERSE AND ESSENTIALLY GO A SECURE THIS ROUTE TO GET WHERE THEY WANT TO GET TO.
AND I THINK ALSO WHAT YOU'RE NOT TAKING INTO CONSIDERATION IS THAT ANTHONY HAS A LOT TO SAY ABOUT THIS TOO.
WE, WE WE'RE PLANNING ON HIS EXPERTISE TO ADVISE US THAT YEAH, THIS IS A GOOD SAFE PLAN.
IT WILL WORK, IT'S GONNA BE AN IMPROVEMENT, AND, AND YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU'RE PUTTING EVERYTHING ON THEM AND THAT'S FINE, YOU CAN DO THAT, BUT, YOU KNOW, GIVE SOME CONSIDERATION TO OUR OWN PEOPLE AND A GUY WHO I KNOW VERY WELL AND DOES A GREAT JOB, GIVE HIM SOME CONSIDERATION TOO THAT HE, HE'LL STOP IT IF IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.
I I HAVE, UH, FULL CONFIDENCE IN MR. VALENCIA.
I MET WITH HIM A COUPLE WEEKS AGO AND I UNDERSTAND HIS WORK.
SO LET ME BE CLEAR, I WAS NOT QUESTIONING ETHICS BY ANY MEANS.
I WAS JUST ASKING A SIMPLE QUESTION OF SAFETY OF ONE PLAN VERSUS SAFETY OF ANOTHER PLAN.
I THINK HE, I THINK HE ANSWERED THE QUESTION.
AND SO I I, YOU KNOW, I REALLY WANT TO SET THE RECORD CLEAR THAT NOBODY WAS QUESTIONING YOUR ETHICS, SIR.
UH, WE'LL WE WILL GO TILL NINE O'CLOCK.
IF I DON'T WANT TO GO, WE'LL GO
SO, UH, I LEARNED SOMETHING, UH, VERY IMPORTANT EARLY IN MY CAREER WHEN I MET ONE OF THE ENGINEERS IN THE DEVELOPMENT IN PHOENIXVILLE.
AND HE TURNED TO ME AND HE SAID, MARK, WE PAINT WITH THE BRUSH THAT WE'RE GIVEN.
I'M A PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER, I UNDERSTAND EXACTLY WHAT WAS SAID ABOUT ETHICS, BUT LET'S BE REALISTIC.
IT'S BEEN SAID IN THIS ROOM THAT THIS DESIGN MAKES THE MOST SENSE.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC A LOT, BUT THIS IS A LAND USE.
THAT DESIGN UP THERE ADDRESSES GOOD LAND USE.
WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC CONTINUOUSLY.
I JUST WANT TO MAKE MY POINT OF VIEW KNOWN IS NOT THAT A PROJECT MAKES THE MOST SENSE IN THIS SITUATION, IT'S THAT IT MAKES THE MOST MONEY.
I DON'T WANT TO LOSE SIGHT OF THAT.
THEY DO WHAT THEY'RE TOLD, THEY'RE GOOD AT IT.
IN THE CASE OF ENGINEERS, THEY HAVE ETHICS.
AND I DON'T QUESTION ANYBODY'S ETHICS.
THEY DO THE JOB THEY'RE TOLD TO DO, THEY PAINT WITH THE BRUSH THEY'RE GIVEN.
SO I SEE THE DOG, I SEE THE TAIL WAGGING THE DOG WITH THIS CONVERSATION.
THIS IS A LAND USE VISION AND EVERYBODY ELSE IS TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC.
EVERYBODY'S TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC, NOBODY'S TALKING ABOUT THE LAND.
SO I WANNA APPLAUD BILL FOR STAYING FOCUSED AND FOCUSING US ON THE FACT THAT THIS IS A PLAN.
WELL, I I, I WOULD DISAGREE WITH THAT ALSO.
SO, BUT WE'RE NOT GONNA DEBATE.
WE'RE NOT HERE TO DEBATE ANYTHING ELSE.
ZACH, WHAT'S OUR PLAN HERE? WELL, I MEAN, AT THIS POINT, UM, THEY'VE BEEN FOR THE PLANNING COMMISSION I THINK SEVERAL TIMES.
UH, THIS IS A REQUEST FOR TENTATIVE APPROVAL OR A TENTATIVE, UH, SKETCH PLAN.
UM, JUST TO REITERATE SOMETHING THAT WE'VE SAID AT OTHER HEARINGS, YOU KNOW, THIS IS THE FIRST STAGE IF YOU LOOK AT THE ORDINANCE, AND FRANKLY, THAT'S WHAT DICTATES WHERE AND HOW THE PROJECT GETS BUILT, WHAT'S IN THE ORDINANCES.
THOSE ARE THE RULES THAT THEY, THAT ALL THE ENGINEERS HAVE TO PLAY BY AND, AND NOT WILL GIVE THEIR FEEDBACK IN TERMS OF MAKING SURE THAT WHEN THEY'RE ACCESSING ON THE STATE ROADS THAT THEY'RE SAFE AND THAT THEY'RE BUILT CORRECTLY.
UM, VE SKETCH PLAN IS THE FIRST PRELIMINARY PRESENTATION OF A PROJECT.
IT'S REALLY MORE FOR THE DEVELOPER TO GET FEEDBACK IN TERMS OF HOW, UH, THE PROJECT MAY NEED TO SIGNIFICANTLY CHANGE IN ORDER TO COMPLY WITH THE TOWNSHIP ORDINANCES.
SO TO THE EXTENT THAT THE APPLICANT HAS, UH, ESTABLISH THE, UM, RATHER MINIMAL REQUIREMENTS FOR TENTATIVE APPROVAL OR FOR
[01:20:01]
TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN REQUIREMENTS, IF THEY'VE MET THOSE, THEN I THINK THAT IT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE FOR THE, THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION ONE WAY OR THE OTHER FOR THE BOARD.UM, AND I THINK KEEPING THAT IN MIND, UM, THERE IS TWO MORE PHASES OF THIS PROJECT, OF, OF THE DEVELOPMENT AND, AND KIND OF EVOLUTION OF THIS PROJECT THAT THE DEVELOP THAT THE DEVELOPER HAS TO GO THROUGH.
THERE IS SIGNIFICANTLY MORE REQUIREMENTS WHEN YOU GET TO PRELIMINARY THAN EVEN MORE WHEN YOU GET TO FINAL.
SO I THINK THAT IT'S IMPORTANT TO KEEP THAT IN MIND.
I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE A LOT OF ISSUES THAT JEN AND ANTHONY AND BOWMAN AND GILMORE HAVE RAISED RELATED TO THIS PROJECT.
I DON'T THINK THAT THE DEVELOPERS SHIED AWAY FROM THE FACT THAT THERE ARE A LOT OF THINGS THAT STILL NEED TO BE WORKED OUT.
UM, BUT TO THE EXTENT THAT THE ONE PAGE OF REQUIREMENTS FOR A TENTATIVE PLAN HAVE BEEN, THEY PRESENTED IT AND NOW IT'S BEFORE THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT, UH, YOU WOULD RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE TENTATIVE PLAN FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.
SO WITH THAT, WITH WHAT, UH, ZACH JUST SAID, UM, I THINK WE ALL UNDERSTAND WHAT HE SAID.
I HOPE, RIGHT? WE ALL, WE ALL GET IT.
SO, UM, I'LL NEED SOMEBODY TO MAKE THE PROPOSAL AND, UM, AND, UM, YOU KNOW, I KNOW THAT'S ALWAYS TOUGH, BUT SOMEBODY NEEDS TO STEP UP AND MAKE A PROPOSAL THAT WE VOTE ON A TENTATIVE APPROVAL OF THE TENTATIVE PLAN AND MOVE IT TO THE SUPERVISORS AS A YAY OR A NAY.
SO, UH, DOES ANYBODY WANT TO MAKE THAT PROPOSAL? DO WE NEED TO DO A PROPOSAL FOR WELL, NO, I MEAN THAT, THAT, THAT, THAT, THAT RECOMMENDATION OR THAT WHATEVER YOU WANNA CALL IT, LOOK FOR US TO VOTE AS A, IT APPROVED.
I MEAN, IT WOULD'VE, YOU GOTTA COME UP BILL.
WHAT? WAIT, YEAH, I, I, I THINK WE'RE DONE.
THEY'RE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE DONE.
ANYBODY ELSE? WELL, ALRIGHT, BILL, I'M SORRY.
YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, I'M GETTING ADVISED BY THE ATTORNEYS THAT WE'RE DONE.
SO AGAIN, I NEED A MOTION TO MOVE, MOVE THIS FORWARD.
I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT WE APPROVE THE TENTATIVE PLAN AS PROPOSED TONIGHT.
UH, REALIZING THAT IT IS THE TENTATIVE PLAN, UH, AND MOVING FORWARD TO, UH, THE NEXT TWO PHASES, UH, AS APPROPRIATE TO CONSIDERING ALL THE ISSUES THAT ARE BEFORE US HAVE BEEN PRESENTED AND DOCUMENTED.
SO I GOT A PROPOSAL FROM JOE TO, UH, APPROVE THE TENTATIVE SKETCH AND MOVE TO THE SUPERVISORS AS A A AND, UM, AS, AS IT IS BEEN PRESENTED.
UM, AND, UH, I'LL NEED A SECOND.
TOM, I, UH, AGREE WITH, UH, UH, JOE'S MOTION AND I SECOND THAT MOTION TO MOVE THIS FORWARD SO WE CAN UNDERSTAND THE ENGINEERING ISSUES AND, AND GET INTO THE DETAIL OF THIS PLAN AND SEE HOW TO MAKE IT BETTER.
I THINK TILL WE GET TO THAT, WE'RE GOING TO BE JUST GOING AROUND THE CIRCLE.
WE GOTTA GET TO THE ENGINEERING POINT.
SO I'M GONNA FIRST AND A SECOND.
ALL IN FAVOR OF TENTATIVE, UH, TO THE SUPERVISORS, SAY AYE.
NOW THAT'S ABOUT THE END OF OUR MEETING, SO IF YOU'RE GONNA LEAVE, PLEASE UH, BE QUIET.
[DISCUSSION: FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS]
ON OUR AGENDA, WE'VE DOWN AGENDA, FUTURE AGENDA, FUTURE EXCUSE, LONG, UM, FUTURE AGENDA ON SEPTEMBER ON DECEMBER 4TH.UH, DECEMBER 4TH, OUR NEXT MEETING.
IT'S A SHORT TURNAROUND WITH THANKSGIVING IN THE MIDDLE OF IT.
THE AGENDA'S PROBABLY NOT GONNA COME OUT TILL DECEMBER 2ND, JUST WARNING YOU.
UM, BUT THAT WILL BE THE ALEXANDER MINOR SUBDIVISION, UH, WHICH YOU ALL HAVE REVIEWS ON.
THE IDEA IS WITH HIGH SPOKE WITH SOMEONE, HAMMOND WOODS.
THERE WILL BE A SIGNIFICANT TURNOUT FOR THAT.
SO, UM, RIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS, JEFF.
RIGHT BEFORE CHRISTMAS, BUT THEY'RE BOTH ON THE FOUR.
HOPEFULLY THAT'S FAIRLY QUICK FOR THEIR SAKE.
[01:25:01]
UM, HIGH MULTIFAMILY, WE'LL GO SECOND.AND IF WE HAVE TO, IF YOU AS A BOARD FEEL WE NEED TO, WE CAN SCHEDULE 'EM FOR DECEMBER 18TH.
WHAT, AS A BACKUP, WHAT AS A SECOND MEETING FOR HIGH MULTIFAMILY, LIKE WE'VE DONE HERE WITH PAR WITH PARTIES, BUT IS THERE, IS THERE ISSUE IF WE DON'T DO IT AND WE MOVE IT TO 25? NO, I, IT CAN WE VOTE ON TONIGHT TO SUSPEND THE 18TH AND MOVE IT TO ANYTHING THAT WE DON'T GET DONE TO THE 20? CAN WE DO THAT? YES, YOU CAN MAKE THAT MOTION.
I'LL READ THAT MOTION AND WE CANCEL THE 18TH AND MOVE IT TO 25 IF WE HAVE ANY ISSUES OR WE CAN'T GET IT DONE.
I, I DON'T HAVE ANY, I'LL JUST SAY FOR THE RECORD, I HAVE NO, UM, MPC CLOCK ISSUES.
I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING THAT REQUIRES ME TO PUT SOMETHING ON THAT AGENDA.
SO IF YOU CANCEL THAT MEETING, YOU CANCEL THAT MEETING.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S THE MEETING.
I'M PROPOSING WE CANCELED THE 18.
I DIDN'T SEE ANY CARE THAT WAS ON THAT.
WELL THE ISSUE IS THAT IF HIGH MULTIFAMILY HAVE THE MEETING MEETING TONIGHT WHERE IT GOES LONG, BUT IF WE DON'T GET TO IT, WE DON'T GET IT ALL FINISHED.
WE COULD MOVE IT THE BALANCE, THE 18TH.
AND WHAT I'M SAYING IS LET'S MOVE IT TO 25 IF WE DON'T GET FINISHED.
WELL, IF WE DON'T GET IT DONE RIGHT, WE STILL LOOK AT IT ON THE FOURTH.
YOU SHOULD LOOK AT IT ON THE FOURTH.
AND IF YOU GIVE A RECOMMENDATION, I YOU DO.
AND IF WE DON'T, I'M WITH, I'M WITH YOU.
OKAY JEFF, THAT'S THAT WORK THEN.
THAT'S, THAT'S IT FOR US FOR THE YEAR.
UM, DID WE HAVE THE EAC ON DECEMBER 11TH? THE JOINT MEETING WITH THE PARK AND RICK BOARD? THAT SHOULD PROVE INTERESTING.
UM, THAT'S, I DON'T HAVE IT UP THERE, BUT THAT'S AT SIX O'CLOCK.
BILL IT'S AT SIX O'CLOCK, NOT SIX, NOT SIX 30 THOUGH.
UM, OTHER THAN THAT I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING ELSE.
CAN I, CAN I SOMETHING TO TALK ABOUT THE SUPERVISORS APPROVE THE, UH, COMPREHENSIVE PLEA.
THAT'S WHAT I JUST HEARD THAT AND UM, THERE ARE
LAST THING, REMEMBER, THAT'S FINE.
WE CAN EITHER PROBABLY STEP THAT UP.
SO I GUESS MY POINT IS, IS THAT PERHAPS WE SHOULD CONSIDER PUTTING 'EM ON OUR AGENDA FOR OUR MEETINGS TO LOOK AT THOSE ACTION ITEMS AND MAYBE ASSIGN RESPONSIVE INDIVIDUAL RESPONSIBILITIES.
I MEAN, SOME ARE PRETTY CLEAR.
I MEAN, I KNOW ONE SPECIFICALLY IS ENTITIES.
UH, THERE ARE SEVERAL THAT ARE MM-HMM.
SOME, SOME ARE LISTED AS PC, MEANING US, RIGHT? I'M LOOKING US NONE OF US HAVE ACCEPTED RESPONSIBILITY.
I GUESS MY POINT IS, IS THAT I, I THINK THAT WE, WE BE WISE TO LOOK AT TRYING TO MOVE THOSE AT LEAST HIGH PRIORITY ITEMS ALONG AT SOME PACE.
I'M NOT SAYING, YOU KNOW, LET'S, LET'S EXPEDITE OR, OR WHAT HAVE YOU.
BUT PERHAPS, YOU KNOW, ON EACH OF OUR MEETINGS AS PART OF OUR AGENDA, WE LOOK AT THOSE ACTION ITEMS AND SIGN ASSIGNED.
YOU KNOW, OKAY, LET'S TAKE THIS HIGH PRIORITY, PICK IT, LET'S, LET'S PUT THAT AS TO DO.
OR A HIGH PRO TO DO AND MAKE SURE WE HAVE SOMEBODY ASSIGNED AND MAYBE A TARGET DATE FOR A REVIEW OR HISTORICALLY, BECAUSE THE PLANS ARE LIKE 10 YEAR PLANS, RIGHT? BUT THEY'RE LIKE WITH 30 ACTION ITEMS. I MEAN A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER A YEAR.
NONE OF US ARE GONNA BE HERE IN 10 YEARS.
OH, NICOLE, WHY YOU APPLY THAT? OH, WELL BE BURNED OUT BY THEN.
SO TYPICALLY WHAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION HAS DONE, AND I SAY THIS SOMEWHAT FACETIOUS, EVEN BEFORE YOUR TIME, MR. PETERS IS THEY HAD THE FIRST SESSION OF THE MONTH WAS THE SESSION WHERE THEY HAD DEVELOPMENT AND THEY HAD DEVELOPMENTS IN AND THEY MADE THOSE DECISIONS AND, AND WENT THROUGH THOSE APPLICATIONS.
THE SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH, THEY CALLED A WORK SESSION.
AND THE WORK SESSION WAS MORE FOR ACTION ITEMS. UM, REVIEW OF COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ISSUES, REVIEW OF ZONING ISSUES.
WE CAN START TO GO BACK TO THAT.
I CAN START TO MOVE THINGS ON THE AGENDA IF THAT'S THE PLANNING COMMISSION'S WISH.
THE, NOW WE MAY STILL HAVE TO HAVE A FEW APPLICATIONS ON THE SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH BECAUSE OF THE CLOCK.
BUT GENERALLY IF, IF WE CAN, WE'LL KEEP ALL THE LAND DEVELOPMENTS TO THE BEGINNING OF THE MONTH, WHICH WORKS OUT BETTER ANYWAY BECAUSE WITH THE BOARD MEETING AT THE THIRD WEEK OF
[01:30:01]
THE MONTH, THE TYPICALLY THE THIRD WEEK OF THE MONTH, IT GIVES LAG, IT GIVES A TIME BETWEEN THE PLANNING COMMISSION RECOMMENDATION AND BEING ON THE BOARD AGENDA.WE DON'T LIKE TO HAVE IT WHERE WE FLIP TO ONE, THREE DAYS LATER WE PUT YOU ON A BOARD.
SO IF, IF YOU'D LIKE TO GO TO SORT OF THAT METHOD NEXT YEAR, IT MAY TAKE US A COUPLE MONTHS TO GET INTO THAT GROOVE.
YEAH, I CAN GO TRY AND MAKE, WE CAN DO THAT.
YOU KNOW, JUST TAKE BABY STEPS.
EVEN IF IT, IF WE CAN MAKE IT ALL WORK, I I CAN, I CAN START PUSHING MEETINGS AND, AND DEVELOPMENTS TO CERTAIN, I MEAN I ALWAYS HAVE THAT FLEXIBILITY AS LONG AS I'M NOT UNDER THE MPC CLOCK.
I DO THINK SOME OF THOSE ITEMS ARE, ARE KIND OF REALLY IMPORTANT THAT WE'VE ADDRESS.
WELL I THINK WE NEED TO LOOK AT THAT, UH, ZONING THING AGAIN BECAUSE WE THAT'S FINE.
I, I MEAN THERE'S A, WE HEAR THERE'S A, THERE HOUSES, I WON'T GO THE DETAILS, BUT THERE ARE A COUPLE OF TRAFFIC.
HIGH, HIGH TRAFFIC ACCIDENT AREAS THAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT.
I EITHER, WELL, WE'LL PLAN THAT FOR FEBRUARY BECAUSE WE ONLY HAVE ONE MEETING IN JANUARY.
'CAUSE I'M ASSUMING YOU DON'T WANNA HAVE A MEETING ON THE SECOND.
UH, IT'S ACTUALLY THE FIRST, ISN'T IT? WELL, IT'S THE FIRST, BUT TYPICALLY WE MOVE IT JUST TO THE NEXT DAY.
SO I'M PRETTY SURE EVERYBODY WOULD LIKE RATHER JUST SAY, WELL, WE'LL MEET THE SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH.
I JUST ASSUMED IT WAS THE EIGHTH.
I JUST THINK IT WOULD BE THAT'S FINE.
WE'LL WORK ON THAT FOR, FOR FEBRUARY TO GET DOZEN IN THAT SORT OF WORKFLOW.
ANY OTHER ISSUES? NOT THAT I CAN VENTURE IN PUBLIC.
I'M TAKING A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
YOU WANT, SAY THAT AGAIN? YES.
THE, THE CONSULTANT LUNCH IS AT BLOCK 29 AGAIN.
SO I, JESS SHOULD HAVE SENT YOU ALL AN EMAILS YES.
AND JUST RESPOND TO HER TO LET HER KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE.
SO IT SAYS, IT SAYS, IT SAYS, UNLESS YOU, IT'S ASSUMING YOU'RE GONNA BE THERE.
BUT YOU WANT US TO STILL RESPOND TO HER IF, IF YOU HAVE REGRETS, IF YOU CAN'T MAKE IT FOR WHATEVER REASON, LET HER KNOW.
I THINK TO THE EXTENT WE CAN GIVE THE RESTAURANT A HEADS UP, I'LL SUGGEST IT'S A SIMPLE YES JASMINE.