[CALL TO ORDER]
[00:00:07]
YEAH, SO WE TO CALL THIS MEETING WORKSHOP MEETING TUESDAY.
[DISCUSSION TOPICS]
MY GOAL IS TO JUST WALK YOU THROUGH, THROUGH WHERE WE ARE WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, GO BACK THROUGH SOME OF THE BACKGROUND OF IT, JUST BECAUSE WE HAVE TWO NEW MEMBERS AND IT'S BEEN A LITTLE BOSS THREE AND WE TALK ABOUT THIS.UM, SO AS WE MOVE FORWARD, WE'LL TALK ABOUT DEMOGRAPHICS, SOME OF THE, JUST THE MORE CHARACT DEMOGRAPHIC CHARACTERISTICS OF THE TOWNSHIP.
WE'LL LOOK AT THE HOUSING PLAN AND THE NEEDS ANALYSIS SHOWING HOW MUCH HOUSING THE TOWNSHIP NEEDS FROM A, JUST A PURELY POPULATION STANDPOINT.
GO THROUGH SOME WORKING ASSUMPTIONS ON, ON EACH OF THE, THE MAJOR LANGUAGE CATEGORIES.
AND THEN REALLY THE CRUX OF THIS IS GONNA BE TALKING ABOUT FUTURE LAND USE FOR IT.
THEY HAVE SIX HERE ON THE LIST, BUT THERE'S, THERE'S CERTAIN SUBCATEGORIES IN THE SUB PARCELS THAT CONSIDERING THAT WE'RE 95% BUILT OUT, IT'S REALLY THE LAST REMAINING PIECES OF UNDEVELOPED PROPERTY.
AND THEN THOSE PROPERTIES WE KNOW THAT ARE LIKELY TO REDEVELOP OVER THE NEXT FIVE TO 10 YEARS, OR THAT WE'VE ALREADY HEARD WHEN REDEVELOPED FOR, FOR A VARIETY OF REASONS.
UM, OUR CENSUS IS BASED OFF THE 2010 CENSUS, AND IN 2010 WE HAD A POPULATION OF 24,160 TO MY ESTIMATE.
NOW, GIVEN THE, THE POPULATION AND THE AMOUNT OF HOUSING PERMITS WE PUT OUT CERTIFICATES OF OCCUPANCY AND HOUSES WE'VE BUILT, WE'RE PROBABLY RIGHT AROUND 25,000, GIVE OR TAKE.
UM, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, IT'S STILL A STRONG INCREASE AT 14%, BUT IT IS DEFINITELY A, A SMALL INCREASE COMPARED TO WHERE WE WERE BETWEEN 1990 AND 2000 AND 2000, 2010 AT 59 AND 38%.
AGAIN, THAT'S COMPLETELY ATTRIBUTABLE TO WE'RE RUNNING OUT.
WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF DEVELOPMENT.
WE DON'T HAVE THE BIG DEVELOPMENTS THAT ARE COMING IN.
AND WHILE WE KNOW PARKHOUSE IS A BIG DEVELOPMENT, WE'RE TALKING LIKE WIDER SWATS OF THE TOWNSHIP THAT WERE DEVELOPED BETWEEN 90 AND 2000, 2000, 2010.
UM, THE AVERAGE FAMILY IS THREE 3.1 PEOPLE.
THE AVERAGE HOUSEHOLD IS 2.69.
AND THOSE TWO TERMS ARE, ARE ARE CORPORATE CONSENSUS.
IT REALLY MEANS FAMILY IS THOSE RELATED AND HOUSEHOLD ARE JUST TWO PEOPLE THAT MAY LIVE TOGETHER OR THREE PEOPLE THAT MAY LIVE TOGETHER IN, IN A HOUSE FIT TOGETHER.
WE'RE SPLIT DOWN THE MIDDLE MALE TO FEMALE.
DO YOU KNOW HOW MUCH THAT'S CHANGED? LIKE AVERAGE FAMILY HOUSEHOLD? YES, IT HAS BEEN DOWN AND I HAVE A CHART LATER ON.
ANY QUESTIONS THAT I'LL JUST JUMP IN AND I'M, BUT YES, IT HAS RUN DOWN AND AS WE GO THROUGH THE HOUSING ANALYSIS, WE SORT OF ACCOUNT FOR THAT A LITTLE BIT AND TAKE THE HOUSING SIZE DOWN.
IN TERMS OF THE POPULATION, UM, THESE ARE REALLY JUST, JUST BACKGROUND INFORMATION.
UM, YOU KNOW, THE DEMOGRAPHICS AND, AND THE AGE BY GENDER YOU CAN SEE THAT WE REALLY ARE HITTING OUR, OUR PEAK, OUR LARGEST POPULATION IS BETWEEN 50 AND AND 60 YEARS OLD.
AND YOU KNOW, THERE'S ANOTHER PEAK BETWEEN FIVE AND FIVE AND 19 OR BETWEEN BASICALLY THE TEEN YEARS.
UH, THERE IS A LITTLE BIT OF A BALL AND THIS WILL COME FROM TURN INTO PLAY A LITTLE BIT LATER, BUT THERE IS A LITTLE BIT OF A DOWN SPOT BETWEEN THE TWENTIES AND THE THIRTIES WHERE YOU, OUR POPULATION IS, IS LOWER.
WE'RE GONNA GET TO THAT AND WE'RE GONNA GET TO THAT, UH, THE RACE.
AND WHILE RACE PURPOSE HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE COMPREHENSIVE POINT, I MEAN IT FROM MY STANDPOINT, IT REALLY JUST, IT'S UP HERE JUST SO IT'S, IT'S, YOU KNOW, WE ALL KNOW THAT WE HAVE A LOT OF A API THAT LIVE IN TOWNSHIP, PAKISTAN, INDIA, THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT WE ALL SEE THEM, WE ALL, YOU KNOW, IT'S THERE, BUT I JUST WANNA PUT OUT THERE AS A CONTEXT SO WE CAN SORT OF SEE HOW THAT FITS IN THE CONTEXT OF THE TOWNSHIP, OF THE WIDER TOWNSHIP.
UM, HOUSING DETAILS, OBVIOUSLY IN THE UPPER LEFT CORNER WHERE OWNER OCCUPIED EVEN, THIS IS OBVIOUSLY BEFORE PROVINCE CENTER WENT IN, BUT I DON'T THINK THAT NUMBER'S GONNA CHANGE A LOT BECAUSE WE HAVE OVER 10,000 SINGLE FAMILY OCCUPIED UNITS.
UM, SO THAT, THAT'S A VERY LARGE NUMBER.
YOU CAN SEE THAT ON THE CHART IN, UM, CHART HAVE CLICKER IN THE, IN THE BOTTOM OF HOUSING TYPE, YOU KNOW, UM, ONE UNIT ATTACHED IS BY FAR AND AWAY THE LARGEST STRUCTURE TYPE.
UM, ONE UNIT ATTACHED THAT'S TOWNHOUSES.
IT IS, IT'S, IT IS DIFFERENT BECAUSE I'M NOT, SO NOW YOU CAN SEE, I'LL JUST HAVE THE SIDEBAR.
UM, AND THEN THE YEAR STRUCTURE BUILT, YOU CAN SEE OF WHEN OUR POPULATION WAS OBVIOUSLY
[00:05:02]
AS WE SHOWED BEFORE, THE GREAT POPULATION GROWTH BETWEEN THE 9 2 19 90 AND 2010.YOU SEE, THAT'S WHEN MOST OF THE TRUCTURE WERE BUILT.
AND AGAIN, THIS IS GONNA COME IN PLAY LATER AND IT SORT FILED AWAY FROM NOW.
AND, UM, THE NEXT HOUSEHOLD INCOME, THIS IS A NUMBER JUST TO KEEP IN MIND BECAUSE AS WE TALK ABOUT END USE, WE TALK ABOUT HOW THE TOWNSHIP'S STRUCTURED, UNDERSTANDING WHERE WE ARE WITH INCOME AND WHAT OUR FAMILY INCOME IS, WHERE OUR HOUSEHOLD INCOME IS, PLAYS INTO HOW WE REDEVELOP LAND AND WHAT WE REDEVELOP LAND INTO.
'CAUSE IT, YOU KNOW, SINCE WE'RE PRIMARILY EARNED INCOME TAX, UM, AGAIN, EDUCATIONAL PAYMENT BIRTHPLACE ARE REALLY JUST INTERESTING FACTS TO LOOK AT.
MAJORITY OF PEOPLE ARE GRADUATE PROFESSIONAL DEGREE AND RIGHT BEHIND THAT OR BACHELOR'S DEGREE IS THE HIGHEST AND GRADUATE PROFESSIONAL DEGREE, RIGHT? I THINK THAT WHAT THAT SPEAKS TO IS WE'RE A HIGHLY EDUCATED, WELL-PAID WORKFORCE IN THIS TOWNSHIP THAT THAT EXPECTS PROBABLY, YOU KNOW, A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN JUST YOUR, YOUR AVERAGE TOWNSHIP.
UM, WHEN YOU GET INTO AN EXISTING LAND USE, YOU SHOULD SEE AGAIN, IT'S, UM, A WIDE VARIETY OF THINGS.
LITTLE EASIER TO READ ON THIS CHART.
YOU'VE GOT 31.5% OF ALL OF OUR LADIES IS SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED, SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED ONE AND HALF.
MULTI-FAMILY IS 1.6 AND INSTITUTIONAL RESIDENTIAL WITH ALL OF THIS, THIS DOESN'T COUNT EVEN TO, UM, THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
AND THAT'S WHAT PARKHOUSE WAS WHEN THIS CHART WAS MADE.
THAT WOULD INCLUDE, UM, SOME OF THE DEVELOPMENTS LIKE OXFORD LEE AND, UM, THE, UH, THE OTHER WB DEVELOPMENT THAT THE MATTERS THAT AT LONGVIEW THAT ARE CURRENTLY BEING BUILT AND THEY'RE, THEY'RE FARTHER ALONG IN LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS THAN DISCHARGE MAY IS CONDOS.
INDUSTRIAL IS A PURE INDUSTRIAL, IT IS MANUFACTURING AND IT, BUT IT'S, IT'S MORE, AND ACTUALLY IF YOU TURN THE LAST PAGE OF THAT, THE WHOLE PACKET, THAT'S THE EXISTING LAND USE MAP.
IT DOESN'T TRANSLATE WELL TO THIS SCREEN UP HERE, BUT WHAT THAT SORT OF SHOWS YOU IS WHERE IT IS INDUSTRIAL IS PURE MANUFACTURING.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE GLAXOSMITH LINES AND THE PFIZER DO OF THE WORLD, WE, WE COUNT THAT AS MORE OF THE OFFICE, CORPORATE CAMPUS AND SHOPPING CENTERS AT 9.4.
INSTITUTIONAL NON-RESIDENTIAL, THAT'S THE SCHOOLS.
UM, AGAIN, WE HAVE INSTITUTIONAL RESIDENTIAL, WHICH AT THIS TIME ARE BRANDING WINE AND COLLEGE LANDING UP ON 29.
UM, AND WE'RE SITTING RIGHT ABOUT 5.1% AND EVEN IF THIS WAS DONE IN 2023, WE HAVEN'T DEVELOPED ENOUGH TO REDUCE THAT NUMBER AT ALL.
WE'RE STILL SITTING AROUND 5.1% LAND LEFT TO DEVELOP.
AND AS I SAID, THAT'S VIRGIN, THAT'S, THAT'S UNDEVELOPED AND WE'LL GET INTO WHERE IT IS IN A LITTLE BIT, BUT IT REALLY IS THE MOST DIFFICULT PROPERTIES IN THE TOWNSHIP TO DEVELOP AS WE RUN INTO WITH LOVER'S LANE, WITH KLINE ROAD, ALL OF 'EM, THEY ALL HAVE SOME ISSUES THAT GO ALONG WITH IT AND THEY'RE MOSTLY ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES AND THAT'S WHY WE WANNA GO BACK TO THOSE ORDINANCES AND MAKE SURE GET THOSE COME.
UM, SO FOR THE HOUSING, PULL THAT UP, JUMPING BETWEEN A BUNCH OF DIFFERENT SLIDES HERE.
SO THESE ARE ALL THE SAME INFORMATION THAT I SENT OUT, SO HOPEFULLY YOU'VE HAD A CHANCE TO SCAN A LITTLE BIT.
IT REALLY IS JUST A BEGINNING DOCUMENT.
A LOT OF IT NEEDS TO BE FILLED IN IN TERMS OF, UM, GRAPHICS AND, AND YOU KNOW, HERE I HAVE FIGURE XX THINGS LIKE THAT.
UM, THE HOUSING NEEDS ANALYSIS, THE HOUSING PLAN NEEDS ANALYSIS FLOW SET, WHAT POPULATION WE CAN EXPECT TO MOVE INTO THE TOWNSHIP OVER THE NEXT 10 YEARS AND DO WE HAVE ENOUGH HOUSING FOR THEM? DO WE HAVE ENOUGH LAND TO DEVELOP IN HOUSING FOR THAT? UM, WHEN YOU LOOK AT DELAWARE VALLEY REGIONAL PLANNING COMMISSION, THEY UM, THEY ARE SORT OF THE MEDICAL CLEARINGHOUSE FOR POPULATION FIGURES.
[00:10:01]
WHAT OUR POPULATION'S GONNA BE, THAT THEY, THEY'RE THE ONES THAT PROJECT THE POPULATION.SO WHEN YOU LOOKED AT THIS IN 2025, IT SAID WE'RE AT 24 4 7 4 9 7.
I MEAN, I THINK WE'RE A LITTLE BIT HIGHER THAN THAT AND THIS IS WHERE THEY PROJECT WE WILL BE OVER THE NEXT, UM, WE'RE GOING ON ANOTHER 30 YEARS, BUT YOU KNOW, BY 20 24, 20 45 AND 2050 WE'RE KIND, I MEAN THE CHANGE OF, YOU KNOW, 2.1 0.8%, 1.5%, THAT, THAT'S NOT REALLY GROWTH, THAT'S JUST THE GENERAL FLUX OF A TOWNSHIP.
UM, BUT WHAT IT SHOWS YOU IS, YOU KNOW, WHEN ACCORDING TO DVR PC, WE REALLY SORT OF HIT OUR PEAK AND, AND GET FULLY DEVELOPED BY 2040 AND, AND THEN EVERYTHING ELSE IS KIND OF INFIELD DEVELOPMENT.
UM, KELLY, THIS IS WHAT YOU WERE TALKING WHAT YOU WERE ASKING ABOUT THE PERSON PER HOUSEHOLD IN 1991 IT WAS, OR 1990 WAS 2.91 AND 2002 0.7, 2.82 DOWN TO 2.62.
SO THERE WAS AN AVERAGE CHANGE OF 3% EVERY YEAR.
AND SO WHAT I'VE DONE IS TAKEN THE POPULATION PROJECTION AND TOOK THAT PERSON PER HOUSEHOLD, AND THIS IS THE NUMBER OF HOUSING UNITS WE NEED.
UM, BY 2025 I REDUCED IT BY ADDITIONAL 3%.
AND, AND I, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S NECESSARILY THE BEST MATH, BUT I I THINK IT CARRIES FORWARD.
I THINK AS WE GET DOWN CLOSER TO TWO, THAT NUMBER BECOMES A LITTLE LESS REALISTIC.
I THINK YOU'RE ALWAYS GONNA HAVE TO BE TWO AND A QUARTER, TWO AND A HALF, SOMEWHERE IN THERE.
UM, BUT BY 2050 THE TOWNSHIP TO MEET THE POPULATION PROJECTION.
AND AGAIN, WE DON'T HAVE TO MEET THE POPULATION.
OBVIOUSLY THERE'S NO RULES THAT NO LAW SAYING WE HAVE TO, BUT USING THEIR MATH MATH, WE NEED TO HAVE 13,084 HOUSING PEOPLE OF WHATEVER TYPE.
NOW LOOKING AT IT NOW, WE HAVE 55% SINGLE TENANT ATTACHED, 31% SINGLE TIME ATTACHED DOWN THE LINE.
WE DON'T HAVE ANY MOBILE HOMES OR ANY VOTES, NOT THAT.
UM, SO WHAT WE WOULD DO AS TAKING THOSE TWO CHARTS, WORKING THE MATH OUT, THESE ARE THE NUMBERS THAT OF THE DIFFERENT HOUSING TYPES THAT WE NEED TO HAVE USING THE SAME PERCENTAGE, KEEPING THE SAME PERCENTAGES IN 2040, WE NEED TO HAVE 6,500 SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED, 3,700 SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED AND 1600 MULTIFAMILY.
THESE ARE THE NUMBERS WE CURRENTLY HAVE ON THE TOP.
AND SO THESE, THESE ARE THE NUMBERS WE NEED TO HAVE.
WHAT THAT SHOWS US IS MOVING THROUGH WHAT'S IN THE LAND ON PROCESS THE CEO'S ISSUED, WHAT'S UNDEVELOPED.
WE WILL HAVE, WE ALREADY CAN HAVE 1800 NEW UNITS JUST ON THE WAY THINGS ARE TODAY IN TERMS OF ZONING, IN TERMS OF WHAT'S IN THE QUEUE, WHAT'S UNDEVELOPED.
UM, THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE GO UP OR DOWN A LITTLE BIT DEPENDING ON, I MEAN I USE STEEP SLOPES AND THINGS LIKE THAT NECESSARILY THIS PROCESS BECAUSE THAT'S A LITTLE TOO COMPLICATED AND THE NUMBERS ALWAYS CHANGE, BUT THE, THE THINGS GET SURVEYED.
BUT GENERALLY OVER TIME, BETWEEN NOW AND 2050, WE HAVE A DEFICIT OF 38 HOW WE UNITS, WHAT THAT TELLS ME IS WE'RE RIGHT ON TRACK WITH WHERE WE'RE DEVELOPING.
WHAT THIS ALSO DOESN'T HAVE IN THERE IS IT DOESN'T HAVE PARKHOUSE LISTED IN THERE.
NOW WHETHER THAT IS THE 600, THE 200 THAT THEY JUST PUT OUT LAST NIGHT OR THE 1200, WE ARE EXCESS.
WE HAVE AN EXCESSIVE AMOUNT OF HOUSING FOR WHAT OUR POPULATION PROJECTION IS EXCESSIVE OR WE ARE, WE ARE, WE HAVE MORE HOUSING THAN IF EVERYTHING WAS TO BUILD OUT LIKE IT IS NOW, WE WOULD'VE MORE HOUSING THAN WE NEED.
AND I'M NOT SAYING THAT THAT'S A BAD THING OR THAT WE NEED TO NOT DEVELOP, BUT IT IS JUST A FACTOR TO UNDERSTAND THE KIND OF DEVELOPMENT THAT MAY COME INTO THE TOWN.
WHAT DOES THAT TAKE? THAT IS SHOWING THESE YEARS? ACTUALLY TELL ME WHAT THAT'S OKAY, SO BETWEEN 2030 AND 2040, THERE'S 1,578 NEW PEOPLE THAT ARE GONNA BE IN TOWNSHIP ACCORDING TO PETER.
APPRECIATE BY THE PERCENTAGES OF, BY USING THE, THE FAMILY CALCULATION 2.23 PER UNIT UNIT, WE WOULD NEED 663 NEW UNITS TO SUPPORT THOSE TO SUPPORT FOR THOSE PEOPLE MOVING IN.
[00:15:01]
PER, IF WE KEEP THE PERCENTAGES THE SAME, IT WOULD BE 360 6 SINGLE ATTACHED, 115 SINGLE S ATTACHED AND 15 MULTIFAMILY.THAT'S ALL BASED ON THE ASSUMPTION OF POPULATION PROTECTION.
YES, IT ALL GOES BACK TO THAT.
SO THEN WHAT WAS SAYING, SO WHATEVER NUMBER GOES THERE IS, SO WE'RE RIGHT.
I SAID WE'RE RIGHT ON PASSED THE SIDE THOUGH, RIGHT THERE ENOUGH, YES, BECAUSE WHAT WE HAVE, WHAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW IS THESE ARE THE PROJECTED UNITS LANDED ON THE PROCESS AND EVEN THE CO'S ISSUE RIGHT NOW, UM, YOU KNOW WE HAVE THOSE, THOSE COS HAVE BEEN ISSUED SINCE THE 2020 CENSUS AND WE HAVE 387 ACRES DEVELOPED UNDEVELOPED, NOT INCLUDING PARKING.
NOT INCLUDING PARKING, WELL 3 87 ACRES USING IT.
THIS IS THE ASSUMPTION IS ALSO THAT EVERYTHING IN OUR CURRENT ZONING HAS THAT IT'S ALL VACANT RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY SHOWS R ONE TWO.
SO GENERALLY 3 87, THE ORDINANCE TO CHANGE THE R TWO THAT'S ON THE TABLE PARK HOUSE, DOES THAT CHANGE THE R THAT THEN ORDINANCE ELSEWHERE? R TWO ISN'T IT IS OS IT'S A SEPARATE ORDINANCE AND AND I DIDN'T PUT PARKHOUSE IN THIS CALCULATION ALL BECAUSE AS WE'RE DOING THIS, PARKHOUSE WAS ALL OVER THE PLACE.
AND, AND IT, IT JUST, IT SHOULDN'T, EXISTING LAND DEVELOPMENTS SHOULDN'T FACTOR INTO THIS AS MUCH BECAUSE THEY'RE THERE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE EXISTING HOMES.
I ONLY PUT IT IN THIS WAY SO THAT YOU CAN UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, WHAT SORT OF QUEUED UP AS THE COMP PLAN IS GETTING PRINTED THAT IS NOT TAKING INTO ACCOUNT IT IS RIGHT NOW, THE, THE NUMBER FOR 300 8700 ALL ACRES IS PURELY BASED ON BASE R ONE ZONING, WHICH IS ONE UNIT PER ACRE OR R TWO WITH THE ASSUMPTION THAT YOU GET, UM, WATER AND SEWER BECAUSE IF YOU HAVE WATER AND SEWER, YOU HAVE 15,000 SQUARE FEET PER AC PER MILE AND IF YOU DON'T BEND THE CALCULATION BACK BASICALLY BACK TO R ONE, SO IT'S FOUR UNITS VERSUS ONE UNIT PER, SO THAT'S HOW THAT CALCULATION SORT OF WORKED OUT.
THAT'S WHAT THE SECOND SESSION SAYS.
IF, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE CERTAIN ALLY MIXED AND MIXED USE ZONE DISTRICTS AND THOSE HIGHER DENSITY REQUIRE COMPLIANCE WITH SPECIFIC CONDITIONS.
I DIDN'T GO THROUGH AND LOOK AT EVERY
BUT, BUT THE TAKEAWAY IS THAT'S DEVELOPING EVERY SQUARE ACRE WE HAVE, RIGHT? CONSIDER THE COST AS PEOPLE WHO AFFORD NO, THIS IS PURELY AN EXERCISE IN HOUSING NEEDS IF THERE'S PEOPLE SO DO CHEAPER AND YES, ANECDOTALLY YES, I THAT'S THAT PART OF IT IS WE UNDERSTAND WHAT KIND OF HOUSES MAY NEED TO BE BUILT IN THIS TOWN AND I THINK WE'LL GET INTO THAT DISCUSSION A LITTLE BIT WHEN WE GET INTO FUTURE LAND USE.
UM, BUT THIS IS PURELY JUST LOOKING AT THE NUMBERS SAYING WE HAVE A HUNDRED PEOPLE WHERE EMPLOYED OR DO WE HAVE ROOM TO PUT THOSE HUNDRED PEOPLE SOMEWHERE AND SHOULD WE BE CONCERNED IF WE THEM LIKE REALLY SHOULD THAT, SHOULD THE QUESTION BE TURNED AND SAID WE REALLY NEED TO HOUSE, EVERYBODY NEEDS TO BE TOWNSHIP, MAYBE LIKE CHESTER COUNTY WHERE SOME OF THOSE TOWNSHIPS WE DON'T WANT A OF PEOPLE AND WE'RE GONNA MAKE IT SO THAT IT'S GONNA BE, I DUNNO.
AND AND WE'RE WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT THAT BECAUSE REALLY PROBABLY PRE SO THAT'S WHY THE GROWTH CURVE IS INTERESTING.
SO IF YOU IT THEY, THEY'LL COME AND MAYBE WE DON'T WANT THEM TO COME.
WELL, WHERE GOING MATCH DRAWN GENERALLY IS THE CLOSER YOU'RE TO A FOUR 20 MINUTE CHANGE, THE HIGHER DENSITY.
[00:20:01]
FEET FROM THERE WE, WE DOWN TOWN UP THERE.SO YEAH, I I DON'T WELL YOU NEED TO BILL ANYMORE.
THERE'S NO PRESSURE WHATSOEVER.
BUT AGAIN, AGAIN, REMEMBER THAT MEANS EVERY SINGLE UNDEVELOPED PARCEL GETS DEVELOPED SO THAT, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.
AND THAT'S ALL PRIVATE AND IT'S ALL PRIVATELY OWNED.
NO, BUT AS WE'RE GONNA GET INTO, WE HAVE OPTIONS.
IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT EVERY SINGLE ACRE THAT GETS DEVELOPED, EVERY SINGLE AC THAT CAN BE DEVELOPED SHOULD BE DEVELOPED.
IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT JUST BECAUSE IT'S AN OPEN SOURCE WITH 10 ACRES AND THAT THERE SHOULD BE 10.
I GUESS THE OTHER THING YEAH, THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S ONE THING WE'LL TALK ABOUT WHEN MINUTE GET TO THAT.
DOES THAT ALSO GIVE US THE OPPORTUNITY TO RAISE? UM, NO, I MEAN WE'RE, WE'RE NOT GONNA HELP TO GRANT THAT, RIGHT? NO, YOU'RE NOT COMPELL TO EVER GRANT THEM.
YOU'RE NOT COMPELLED TO EVER OH, NO.
WHAT I'M SAYING IS THEY, THEY'VE GOT ONE THAT DOESN'T AND I MEAN WE HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY SEPARATE PARCELS, WE DON'T HAVE THEM TOGETHER.
WOULDN'T NECESSARILY CAN'T A SMALLER PARCEL PARCEL.
THAT'S WHAT WE NEED TO LOOK AT.
YOU WERE ASKING THE QUESTION OF WHAT, WHAT ELSE OSR TWO APPLIES TO YES.
AND AND THERE ARE SOME SITUATIONS RIGHT WHERE WE TAKE AND, AND WE'RE GONNA, WE'LL GET INTO THAT.
OKAY, WE'RE GETTING TO FUTURE LAND.
I'M TRYING TO GET, ALRIGHT, SO YES, ABSOLUTELY SAME HOUSE, SAME PERCENTAGE OF, SO AGAIN, KEEP THIS NUMBER IN THE BACK OF YOUR MIND FOR A LITTLE BIT AND THEN WE'RE GONNA SORT OF GO INTO SOME WORKING ASSUMPTIONS FOR ALL OF THE NAVY ACTUALLY.
BUT THIS LAST PART'S GONNA TAKE A LONG TIME.
SO WORKING ASSUMPTIONS, THIS IS WHAT I'VE NOTICED OVER THE PAST FIVE TO 10 YEARS.
I TRY NOT TO PUT COVID, I TRY TO PUT COVID IN SORT OF THE BACK POCKET.
IT HAPPENED, IT HAD SOME EFFECT ON LAND USE.
IT'S KIND OF GETTING BACK TO NORMAL.
I DON'T KNOW IF DELIVERY BACK TO BACK TO NORMAL.
UM, BUT IT, IT LANDED OPEN FROM A PROCESS FROM GETTING BACK TO NORMAL.
BUT RESIDENTIAL WE HAVE AN INCREASE IN DEMAND DENSITY.
OBVIOUSLY WE SEE THAT WITH ALL OF OUR
THE ONE WE JUST GOT FOR NINE LOTS ON NINE ACRES, UM, NEAR YOU ON MENNONITE ROAD.
OBVIOUSLY THAT'S BASED ZONING.
I CAN'T TELL YOU HOW MANY TIMES I HAD A DISCUSSION WITH THEM WHERE THEY WANTED TO PUT SELF STORAGE OR MULTI-FAMILY OR TOWNHOUSES THERE, LIKE BEATING THEM BACK ONLY USING FAMILY DISASTER.
IS THAT WHAT SHOULD BUILD DEMAND FOR DENSITY OR IS IT DEVELOPER PREFERENCE? IT'S BOTH.
IT'S DEMAND FOR DENSITY BECAUSE THE HOUSING, THE PEOPLE BUYING OUT DEVELOPER, THE PEOPLE, THE PEOPLE THAT NEED HOUSING AREN'T PEOPLE BUYING HOUSING, THEY'RE NOT BUYING, THEY MIGHT BE BUYING SOME OF THE, THE OPENING PRICE ONES.
WHEN WE LOOK BACK TO OUR, OUR AGE CHART AND YOU'VE GOT THE 25 TO 35 OR 20 TO 35, THEY'RE NOT COMING OUT LOOKING FOR THE 500 600 AND THE AND THE SEVEN 50,000 HOUSES.
THEY'RE LOOKING FOR APARTMENTS OR THEY'RE LOOKING FOR OPENING PRICE POINT HOUSES.
BUT, BUT JEFF JUST PLEASE WHAT THEY SAY THAT THOSE
SO AGAIN, LOOK, I I CAN'T CONTROL WHAT THEY'RE GONNA BUILD THERE.
WELL I MEAN I CAN'T CONTROL WHAT THE PRICE THEY'RE GONNA SELL UP FOR.
AND, AND THE ONE THING YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND IS LAND DEVELOPMENT.
THIS TOWNSHIP VERY EXPENSIVE, ESPECIALLY AS WE GET INTO LESS LAND AVAILABLE,
[00:25:01]
THE INFRASTRUCTURE COST FOR PARKHOUSE IS GOING TO BE EXTREMELY HIGH BECAUSE THEY HAVE A LOT OF ROADS, A LOT OF PIPES, A LOT OF ALL THE OTHER STUFF.AND THAT'S WHERE THE MAIN EXPENSE FOR DEVELOPMENT WOULD I LIKE THEM TO BE AROUND 400, 3 50.
IF THAT 600 MOVES FORWARD, I THINK THAT WOULD BE GREAT BECAUSE I THINK THAT IS AN OPENING.
BUT THAT WHEN THEY TALKED ABOUT IT IN THE LAST MEETING, THAT WAS THE FIRST I'VE HEARD ANYTHING ABOUT IT AND WE CERTAINLY HAVEN'T GOTTEN TO THAT LEVEL TO WHERE WE CAN HAVE THAT DISCUSSION.
UM, MOST OF OUR SMALL PARCELS TEND TO 15 ACRES.
THEY HAVE ENVIRONMENTAL CONSTRAINTS BUT THEY HAVE LESS IMPACT TO THE TOWNSHIP INFRASTRUCTURE.
LET'S TAKE LOVERS LANE FOR EXAMPLE.
IT'S 11 HOMES AND IT DOESN'T HAVE MUCH IMPACT.
IT HAS IMPACT ENVIRONMENTALLY BUT IT DOESN'T HAVE A LOT OF IMPACT TO THE TOWNSHIP IN TERMS OF POPULATION.
EVERYBODY KNOWS AND WE'RE GONNA GET A LOT OF PRESSURE ON AND WE'RE GONNA GET A LOT OF PRESSURE OUT AT THE END OF THAT RAIL LINE ON OUR SIDE OF THE RIVER.
AND WHY ON OUR SIDE OF THE RIVER? WELL BECAUSE THE RAIL LINES STAY ON IT'LL, BUT IT WON'T LIVE HERE TO GET TO THAT.
IT'LL, IT WILL COME OUT THE CIRCLE.
IT WON'T JUST STICK TO PHOENIX THOUGH.
AND PHOENIX CERTAINLY BUILDING MORE THAN THEIR FAIR SHARE OF APARTMENTS AND BUILDING UP AND THEY'LL PROBABLY BE READY FOR IT.
WE'RE NOT DOING ANYTHING IN THE MONTCLAIR AREA AND I WANT TO TIGHTEN THINGS UP IN THE MONTCLAIR AREA.
I DON'T WANT THE DENSITY THAT PEOPLE ARE GONNA START ASKING ABOUT AT THE TRAIN STATION TO COME INTO MONTCLAIR AND PORT PROVIDE THAT AREA.
RIGHT? LIKE, LIKE WE'VE TALKED ABOUT WITH FEMA GRANTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT IS, YOU KNOW, I ALREADY GET A LOT OF PHONE CALLS FOR, HEY THIS PROPERTY IS ON SALE FOR SALE DOWN ON ON WALNUT STREET.
CAN I BUY AND PUT THREE APARTMENTS? SO IT'S NOT EVEN TALKING LARGE NUMBERS, NOT 25, NOT 50, IT'S THEY WANT TO TAKE THESE HOUSES AND CONVERT THEM INTO THREE OR FOUR APARTMENTS AND YOU KNOW, I, IT'S HARD TO SAY NO.
I MEAN I DON'T SAY NO, IT'S HARD TO LIMIT THAT DEVELOPMENT BECAUSE OUR SIZE AND OTHER THINGS.
SO YOU KNOW, I JUST HAVE TO PULL EVERYTHING TO THAT, UM, FIX OUR ON THIS SIDE.
BUT I, I THINK WE NEED TO BE COGNIZANT.
I'M THINKING UM, LARGE PARCELS, THERE ARE SOME ENVIRONMENTAL CONSTRAINTS.
YOU LOOK
UM, IT'S, IT'S JUST SOMETHING KEEPING THE BACK OF YOUR MIND AS YOU GO FROM PROCESS THE ADDITIONAL AMONS, WE HAVE LUNCH TODAY AND CAN YOU EXPLAIN THAT, THAT ORDINANCE THAT'S GOING THROUGH THE STATE RIGHT NOW? WE DO WHAT POTENTIAL ALLOWS IS FOR IN ALSO, SO WE DERESTRICT THE PROPERTIES AND WE NAMED THE PERSON WHO LIKE WANTS TO MOVE IN.
UM, SO SHE BILL SIGNS THE DEED RESTRICTION, HER NAME IS PUT ON THERE AND AS LONG AS SHE'S LIVING THERE BE IN WALL STREET CAN EXISTS.
IF SHE MOVES OUT OR SOMETHING ELSE HAPPENS AND, AND SHE LEAVES IT, THAT DEED S HAS TO CHANGE TO SOMEONE ELSE.
SO ONE BILL CHILDREN CAN MOVE IN, BE IN THAT ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT WHERE
[00:30:01]
HE HAS TO TAKE IT APART AND GET RID AND THE HEAT RESTRICTION GOES.IT ABSOLUTELY IS THE ONLY, YOU KNOW IN BELIEVE THEY'RE THINKING ABOUT THIS IN HARRISBURG, A CLUB IN THE LAST 10 YEARS, I'VE HAD ONE FAMILY COME TO ME, THEY BOUGHT A HOUSE AND THEY LIKE, AFTER THEY CLOSED EVERYTHING AND SAID WE FOUND OUT WE HAD THIS HEAT RESTRICTION, WE HAVE THE IN SUITE AND WE DON'T WANT IT.
WE DON'T WANNA HAVE IN SWEEP WHAT WE DO.
SO WE TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS OF REMOVE HEAT RESTRICTION.
I MEAN THEY TAKE OUT, REMOVE THE STOVE AND IN PART TOWNSHIP, IN THIS TOWNSHIP WE HAVE TO, IT HAS TO BE INCLUSIVE OF, I MEAN IT HAS TO BE IN THE STRUCTURE.
IF WE GO OUTSIDE OF THE STRUCTURE, IT IS, IT HAS TO ZONING, NOT THAT HAPPENS.
SO, AND THEN CONVERSION, AS I SORT OF TALKED ABOUT, THERE ARE, THERE'S A GOOD PUSH FOR CONVERSIONS OF SINGLE FAMILY HOUSES IN APARTMENTS AND, AND OTHER THINGS TO, YOU KNOW, INCREASE THE, THE DWELLING COUNT IN OFFICE AND OFFICE PARK.
UM, THERE'S VERY, THERE ISN'T MUCH DEMAND FOR TYPICAL OFFICE SPACE.
AND WHAT I MEAN BY TYPICAL OFFICE SPACE IS THE ONE-OFF BUILDING THAT RENTS TO A LONG AND FOSTER AND THEN A CPA FIRM AND SOMEONE ELSE AND SOMEONE ELSE, THEY HAVE FOUR OR FIVE TENANTS.
THE OFFICE MARKET FOR THAT IS REALLY KIND OF DEAD.
UM, THAT'S WHY WE'RE GETTING A LOT OF CONVERSION OF EXISTING BUILDINGS, CONVERSATION, CONVERTING IT INTO APARTMENTS, CONVERTING IT INTO, UM, SOME OTHER THINGS.
UM, MIXED USE IN EXISTING BUILDINGS.
YOU KNOW, THAT'S SORT OF WHERE THIS IS EVOLVING TO.
AND, AND WE HAVE YET TO REALLY GET FAR ALONG IN THAT PROCESS.
BUT THAT'S WHERE WE GET A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT.
A LOT OF THAT COMES FROM THE HYBRID WORKING AND SCHEDULING.
UM, THAT THERE JUST ISN'T A NEED FOR AS MUCH SPACE ANYMORE BECAUSE EVERYTHING IS CO IS SHARED.
UM, AND THAT ALSO HAS A BIG IMPACT ON PARKING, WHICH THEN HAS A BIG IMPACT ON STORMWATER.
'CAUSE IF YOU HAVE A HUGE PARKING FIELD, YOU DON'T NEED THAT PARKING FIELD.
AND ALL THAT DOES IS CREATE MORE STORM WATER, MORE RUN OFF, MORE THINGS WE NEED TO CONTROL ON THE LONG RUN.
AND IF WE LOWER THAT DOWN, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THERE'S A WAY TO, TO SAVE A LITTLE BIT ON PAPER, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
UM, WITH THE OFFICE PARK, I DON'T THINK IT'S NECESSARILY A, A BULLET POINT HERE, BUT WITH THE OFFICE PARK, I THINK THERE'S STILL A STRONG DEMAND FOR THAT.
I THINK GLAXO, SEI, UM, DOW JUST SIGNED FOR 10 MORE YEARS.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE HOW MANY EMPLOYEES THAT IS, BUT THEY DID JUST SIGN A 10 YEAR LEASE FOR, FOR THEIR SITE.
PFIZER RE-UPPED AFTER THEY SOLD TO UM, CHRISTIAN WAKEFIELD AND, AND THE OTHER NAMED PARTIES IN THAT ARTICLE FROM JOURNAL WE SENT AROUND, UM, LAOS USED TO BE DOING ALL RIGHT.
UM, SEI SEEMS TO BE GETTING A LOT OF PEOPLE BACK IN THE BUILDING, SO I THINK YOU'RE GETTING A LOT OF PUSHBACK TO THAT TYPE OF OFFICE ENVIRONMENT WHERE IT'S A MORE OF A CORPORATE CAMPUS.
AGAIN, THE HARD PART IS JUST THE ONE OFF BUILDINGS THAT DON'T HAVE, UM, YOU KNOW, LONG TERM TENANTS IN THERE OR LONG TERM LIFESTYLE CENTER FOR A PROCESS.
UM, RETAIL AND I WANT TO BE, I DON'T KNOW THEIR NAME, BUT I WANT TO JUST MENTION THAT WE HAVE PROVINCETOWN CENTER.
UM, WE APPRECIATE THE INVITE AND UH, SULLIVAN, THE OWNER.
UM, WHAT I MEAN HERE BY VARIABLE DEMAND FOR LARGE SHOPPING CENTER IS YOU'RE NOT GONNA SEE THE DAYS OF SOMEONE COMING IN WITH A LARGE, OTHER THAN WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT WITH QUEST, A LARGE SHOPPING CENTER, YOU'RE NOT GONNA SEE THE PROVIDENCE TOWN CENTERS AGAIN.
YOU'RE NOT GONNA SEE EVEN THE, THE QUARTER, THE PROVIDENCE, WHICH IS THE TARGET AND GIANT UP RIDGE AND TOWNSHIP LINE.
THOSE DAYS ARE, ARE PAST US AND, AND THE RETAIL WE HAVE, FIRST OF ALL, WE DON'T HAVE THE AREA AND SECONDLY THE RETAIL WE HAVE IS TO FILL IN THOSE AREAS.
UM, THERE'S SOME DEMAND FOR SMALL RETAIL SPACES.
I THINK I I THINK YOU EVEN TEXAS, PROVIDENCE TOWN CENTER, IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING FROM THE BUILDING IMPROVEMENT SIDE THAT THE OLD STAPLES BUILDING IS RENTED AND THAT THE OLD CHARLIE'S IS RENTED.
THAT THEY'RE IN PROCESS OF GETTING 'EM DEVELOPED.
I DON'T KNOW IF I'M SPEAKING OUT OF TURN.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, SO SOME OF THE HOLES WE'VE SEEN OVER THERE, THEY'RE, THEY'RE GETTING FILLED IN AND I THINK THEY'RE GREAT.
UM, I THINK IT WOULD BE INTERESTING DEVELOPMENT FOR WHEN THEY GET IN AND I THINK OFFER THEM BECAUSE OF WHAT WE'VE TALKED ABOUT QUEST, BUT THEY WANT TO SIT DOWN AND TALK ABOUT HOW WE CAN LOOK AT THEIR ZONING AND WHAT THEIR ZONING HAS FOR THEM.
THEIR ZONING IS PRETTY OLD AND YOU KNOW, THEY'RE NEW PLAYERS IN THE TOWNSHIP AND WE WANT TO WORK WITH 'EM.
SO THAT'S PART OF WHAT'S GONNA GO IN HERE IS
[00:35:01]
WORKING WITH PROVINCETOWN CENTER TO MAKE SURE THAT THEIR ZONING REPRESENTS WHAT THEY WANT TO HAVE IN THE TOWNSHIP AND HOW THEY WANT THEIR SHOPPING CENTER TO MOVE FORWARD.CAN'T SAY THEY'RE GONNA GET ALL OF IT.
CAN'T SAY WE'LL AGREE TO ALL OF IT, BUT YOU KNOW, AT LEAST WE CAN HAVE A CONVERSATION.
YEAH, JEFF, HE'S BEEN GREAT AS FAR AS MAKING THAT OVER.
SO WHEN YOU SAY CHANGE YOUR ORDINANCE, MOVE FORWARD, WHAT, WHAT DOES THAT JUST MEAN? JUST LOOKING AT THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN AND I WON'T SPEAK FOR THEM, BUT I THINK THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN IS IT'S SOMEWHAT LIMITING IN TERMS OF WHAT WAS WRITTEN FOR 2008, 2009, 2010 IN TERMS OF A LIFESTYLE CENTER, A TOWN CENTER.
I DON'T KNOW IF RE I DON'T THINK RETAIL IS IN THE SAME PLACE.
I MEAN IT IS JUST, IT'S JUST NOT, AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT CHANGES THAT NECESSARILY MEANS, AND I WOULD DEFER TO THEM AS RETAIL EXPERTS TO TELL ME, HEY, HERE'S WHAT WE THINK WORKS BETTER FOR US.
I'M NOT SAYING THAT WE'RE GOING TO GIVE THEM EVERYTHING, BUT JUST TO UNDERSTAND WHAT WOULD WORK BETTER FOR THEM SO THAT WE CAN BETTER APPROACH AND MAKE THAT EVEN MORE SUCCESSFUL THAN IT'S, AND I GUESS JUST HOW WE UP, UM, YOU KNOW, WE TRY TO KEEP IT OUR EAR OUT THERE, WHAT'S HAPPENING AROUND US, YOU KNOW, WE WERE INTERESTED IN IT AND PLAN AND I THINK WE'RE JUST WANNA ENGAGE A LITTLE BIT MORE OF WHAT'S HAPPENING AROUND US BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY WHAT'S NOT HAPPEN ON OUR NEIGHBORS IMPACTS US.
SO I THINK WE WANTED TO REACH OUT AND START TO CREATE DIALOGUE AND WE DON'T KNOW WHERE THAT GOES.
WE DON'T COME HERE WITH A PRECONCEIVED NOTION OF WE WANT TO CHANGE OUR ZONING TO DO THIS.
WE DON'T COME WITH A PRECONCEIVED NOTION OF WE WANT THIS TO HAPPEN ON OUR NEIGHBORS PROPERTY, BUT I THINK WE CAN'T BE PASSIVE ANYMORE AND WE WANT BE ENGAGED IN THAT PROCESS SO THAT UM, YOU CAN HEAR WHAT WE HAVE TO SAY AND WE ALSO KNOW WHERE YOUR HEAD IS AND WHAT COMES THAT PIPELINE THAT AFFECTS OUR ASSET AND HOW WE MARKET IT AND HOW WE TRY TO MATCH.
SO, UH, THIS IS JUST US BEING HERE AND PRESENT AND TRYING TO BE, UH, AWARE OF WHAT'S GOING ON.
AND THAT'S ALL ABOUT THE LAND DEVELOPMENT? NO, IT'S, I KNOW IT'S, IT'S NOT REALLY USED FOR ANYTHING OTHER THAN, THERE'S A COUPLE BASINS ON THERE THAT THEY PROGRAM IS PART OF THE STORMWATER CONTROL OFF OF THE, THE ROUNDABOUT OFF OF OUR POLAR ROADS.
THE ONE YOU SEE SORT OF BRIGHT AS YOU GO THROUGH THE ROUNDABOUT AND THERE'S ANOTHER ONE UP ON THE FRONT SORT OF BEHIND, IT'S A LITTLE HARD TO SEE, BUT IT'S SO WHITE SPACE AT TOP PARCEL.
THE SAME PEOPLE OWN THE APARTMENTS AND IT'S OWNED FOR RESIDENTIAL OR NO, IT'S OWNED IO THREE.
SO IT'S THAT IT IS INTERCHANGE OFFICE AND IT'S GOT A REALLY LONG STRING OF WHAT REALLY BAD NAME INTERCHANGE, OFFICE, RETAIL SERVICE AND SOMETHING ELSE DISTRICT.
I THE CATCH ALL OF IO THREE WHEN IT WAS WRITTEN, IT WAS WRITTEN AS, WE HAD A LOT OF DEMAND BY UM, WYATT AT THE TIME BECAUSE THEY WERE PFIZER IS AND GLAXO AND SOME OF THE OTHER LARGER LAND DEVELOPERS THAT THERE WAS NOWHERE TO EAT IN TOWNSHIP.
THERE WAS NOWHERE TO SHOP IN THE TOWNSHIP AND A LOT OF THE RESIDENTS WERE LEAVING AND GOING ELSEWHERE.
A LOT OF THEIR EMPLOYEES WERE GOING ELSEWHERE, GOING OUT OF THE TOWNSHIP AND COMING BACK LATE AND THEY DIDN'T LIKE, THEY DIDN'T STAY FOR LUNCH AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO THE TOWNSHIP WANTED TO HAVE A RETAIL CENTER NEAR THE CENTER OF TOWN TO BUILD THAT.
SO IT BECOMES A SORT OF CATCHALL, THEY'RE DEVELOPED UNDER WHAT ARE CALLED LAND USE, UM, GROUP B AND THAT'S SORT OF THE RETAIL END OF IT.
THERE'S A LAND GROUP A WHICH IS OFFICE 'CAUSE YOU CAN STILL DO BASIC, YOU KNOW, ONE OFF OFFICE BUILDINGS IN THERE AND THAT'S WHAT IS LIMITED TO THE TOP HALF OF OUR POLAR ROAD IS ONE OFF OFFICE BUILDINGS, 15 TO 65 FEET, SOMEWHERE IN THERE.
AND THEN THE TOWNHOUSES, UH, WHITE SPRINGS FARM ARE ALSO IN THE I THREE DISTRICT.
EXCUSE ME, THOSE ARE A RESULT OF A LAWSUIT.
SO THAT'S WHY THAT GOT SORT OF FOLDED IN THERE AS A RESIDENTIAL USE GROUP.
I'M SORRY, I SAID EVERY I GET IT.
IT'S, IT'S, YOU KNOW, OTHER, IT'S NOT LIKE, UH, NO OUR CO OKAY, THERE'S THREE, WHICH MEANS IT'S NOT, IT'S INTERCHANGE OFFICE AND PRIMARILY IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE OFFICE.
THE OTHER USES RETAIL AND TOWN HOMES AND NOW THE APARTMENTS HAVE ALL SORT BEEN THROWN IN THERE AND EVOLVED OVER TIME.
THAT WAS NOT THE INTENTION OF THE INTENTION OF IO THREE.
IT COULD BE MORE APARTMENTS, IT COULD
[00:40:01]
BE OFFICE, IT COULD BE RIGHT NOW THE WAY IT'S WRITTEN, THE ONLY THING YOU CAN PUT THERE IS OFFICE.NOW IF OBVIOUSLY THOUGHT ABOUT LAND COMES TO US AND SAYS, HEY, WE WANNA PUT MORE PERFORMANCE OVER THERE, THAT'S SOMETHING YOU HAVE TO CONSIDER FROM A REZONING.
IT'S NOT WRITTEN TO ALLOW THAT AND IT'S NOT WRITTEN TO ALLOW RETAIL.
SO, UM, SO YOU KNOW, THERE'S SOME OTHER THINGS WITH SMALLER RETAIL SPACES, YOU KNOW, SECOND FLOOR WITH THE RETAILER OFFICE AND THE PER FLOOR, THAT'S WHERE YOU GET THE YERKES MIXED USE.
THINGS LIKE THOSE USES THAT ARE IN SMALLER OLDER AREAS THAT SORT OF REDEVELOP PEOPLE WANT TO PUT, AGAIN, WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF PUSH FOR IT, BUT IT'S, IT IS AN OPTION TO LOOK AT SOME, PUTTING SOME DENSITY IN HOUSING TO SAVE OTHER PROPERTIES.
YOU PUT SOME RETAIL WITH WITH SOME SECOND FLOOR RESIDENTIAL.
UM, AGAIN MIXED WITH OTHER USES AND, AND UM, YOU KNOW THAT THE, THAT THE RESIDENTIAL SORT OF THE RETAILS MIXED IN WITH WITH NOT NECESSARILY JUST BEING A RETAIL CENTER.
I THINK THAT'S WHERE SOME OF THE RETAIL, SO THAT'S WHAT REQUEST WOULD BE.
UM, INDUSTRIAL, THAT'S OUR LARGEST AREA OF AVAILABLE LAND.
IF YOU LOOK AT, AT MOST OF THE WHITE SPOTS ON THERE ON THE LAST PAGE, IT REALLY IS, UM, ALMOST ALL INDUSTRIAL LAND.
AND IF IT'S NOT, IF IT IS, IF IT IS NOTED AS INDUSTRIALLY ZONED LAND, IT'S, IT'S UNDERDEVELOPED.
SO THOSE ARE PROPERTIES THAT ARE, YOU KNOW, SELF STORAGE FACILITIES OR REALLY FENCED STORAGE TRUCK FACILITIES, THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT CAN BE SOLD AND CONVERTED TO A USE FAIRLY EASILY.
UM, WELL THE PINK IS WHAT'S CURRENTLY USED AS INDUSTRIAL, BUT THAT, AND THE WHITE IS, IS WHAT'S NOT THE, UH, BUT THE, BUT THE PINK IS REALLY UNDERDEVELOPED LAND AND IT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, THAT'S UM, THAT'S WHY IT'S IMPORTANT.
IT REALLY IS UNDEVELOPED AND CAN BE FLIPPED TO A USE IF THERE'S A USER THAT COMES IN.
IT'S NOT LIKE AN OFFICE BUILDING WHERE IT'S HARDER TO TAKE DOWN FOR A SECTION OF HOUSES OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
IT'S TRANS TRANSITORY LAND USE.
AND WHAT IS VACANT? WHY IS WHITE IS JUST VACANT? LIKE YEAH, I MEAN IT, IT IS NOT ANY ONE SPECIFIC DEVELOPER.
I WOULD SAY MOST OF IT DOWN THERE IS A LOT ON LAND DEVELOPMENT.
UM, THEY, THEY ARE PROBABLY THE LARGEST PROPERTY OWNER IN THE TOWNSHIP, UM, IN TERMS OF UNDEVELOPED AND DEVELOPED PROPERTY.
AND YEAH, THE WHITE THE WAY AROUND RIGHT AROUND 4 22 IS WHERE, UM, NOW THE VACANT MAN THAT NOT SURE OF THAT COULD AT ANY POINT.
THAT'S SOME OF THE WHAT WE CAN DEVELOP RESIDENTIAL.
UM, AND WHAT THIS IS, THESE ARE SORT OF THE, THE FIVE AREAS OF FOCUS AND, AND I'LL TALK ABOUT WHY THESE SORT OF COME INTO PLAY, BUT THROUGHOUT THE TOWNSHIP YOU'VE GOT THE, THE RIDGE PI QUARTER UP HERE, SECOND AVENUE SORT OF BEHIND PARKHOUSE HERE, THE ROUTE 29 INTERCHANGE, WHICH INCLUDES
YOU'VE GOT SOME DOWN HERE AT LONGFORD AND HOLLOW ROAD AND LONGFORD AND HOLLOW ROAD.
THERE'S ACTUALLY SORT OF THIS, THIS PROBABLY SHOULD REALLY BE THAT SIZE OR ENCOMPASSING A LOT OF THAT AREA.
AND THEN THERE'S THIS, THAT'S THE FOUR TWENTY TWO BUSINESS CENTERS THEY CALL IT, WHICH IS ARNOLD'S EXPO CENTER, TARGET, LOWE'S,
WELL, SO OUR FIRST DISCUSSION FOR FUTURE LAND USE IN RIDGE PIKE, AND I THINK I CAN SAY THIS CERTAINLY IN PUBLIC NOW WE KNOW WE HAVE A POTENTIAL USER FOR THAT SITE.
IT, IT'S, IT'S A, WHAT'S BEEN DEFINED AS AN ACUTE MEDICAL FACILITY MORE THAN LIKELY WE KNOW IT'S GONNA BE A HOSPITAL.
I DON'T KNOW WHERE THEY'RE IN THE PROCESS, BUT I'VE HEARD FROM THREE COMPLETELY INDEPENDENT PEOPLE, OH, WHEN, WHEN'S YOUR HOSPITAL COMING IN? AND JUST OUT OF THE BLUE I GOT A PHONE CALL FRIDAY AFTERNOON, UH, FROM A DEVELOPER THAT'S DEVELOPED SOMETHING ALONG HERE AND THE, THE PIECE THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT FOR THE HOSPITAL IS RIGHT HERE.
WHAT THEY'RE ALSO DOING THOUGH IS THEY'RE LOOKING AT BUYING UP EVERYTHING ALONG HERE TO MAKE THIS, YOU KNOW, ALL WHITE, ALL WHITE.
FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, THEY'VE LOOKED AT ALL OF THAT AND THERE'S ENOUGH DISCUSSION OUT THERE WITH COMMERCIAL DEVELOPERS OR COMMERCIAL REAL ESTATE AGENTS THAT HAVE CALLED THAT.
I DON'T FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE TALKING ABOUT THAT.
IT'S PROBABLY LEHIGH VALUE POSSIBLY.
SO IF FOR WHATEVER THAT'S WORTH LEHIGH VALLEY, THAT'S MY UNDERSTANDING AGAIN, IT ALL WITH WHATEVER
[00:45:02]
CRIMINAL TRUTH YOU WANT TO, WHAT THIS MEANS FOR RIDGE BIKE IS IF SOMETHING LIKE THAT TO COME IN, THAT'S, THAT'S A GAME CHANGING LAND USE THAT NOT ONLY DOES THAT SET US UP IN TERMS OF EARNED INCOME TAX, IT SETS US UP IN TERMS OF A LONG TERM USE.I MEAN THESE GENERALLY HOSPITALS DON'T STAY PUT.
THEY STAY PUT AND THEY HAVE, THEY HAVE AN ABILITY TO DEVELOP A LAND AROUND BECAUSE THEY BECOME THE CENTER OF IT.
YOU KNOW, A HOSPITAL GOES IN THE, THE SINGLE OFFICE BUILDINGS WITH A COUPLE DOCTORS IN IT GO IN THERE, YOU KNOW, THEN YOU HAVE THE ASSOCIATED OTHER THINGS, THE X-RAY FACILITY, THE, YOU KNOW, THE COLONOSCOPY FACILITIES, THINGS LIKE THAT.
BUT GENERALLY THAT'S WHAT'S COMING IN HR AND LEMME BACK UP.
REALLY WHAT I WANT TO ACCOMPLISH TONIGHT IS THESE AREAS THAT WE TALK ABOUT.
I IT'S A FAIRLY SIMPLE QUESTION.
DO WE WANT TO ENCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT? DO WE WANT TO DISCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT OR DO WE WANT TO JUST SIT BACK AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS? NOW BY SAYING ENCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT, THAT MEANS LOOKING AT THE ZONING LOOKING AND I'M NOT SAYING NECESSARILY REZONE IT BECAUSE THE MOMENT I WRITE ZONING FOR IT, THE MOMENT SOMETHING ELSE COMES IN AND THEY SAY, I'M GONNA LIKE THAT, WE WANT YOU TO DO THIS, BUT WRITE SOMETHING IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN SAYING THAT POTENTIAL IS AMENABLE TO PROVIDING THE ZONING FOR THIS TYPE OF USE FOR MEDICAL FACILITY FOR OFFICE BUILDINGS OR SOMETHING TO THAT EFFECT FOR THIS SITE SPECIFICALLY.
UM, YOU KNOW, IF THAT'S SOMETHING THE COURT'S COMFORTABLE WITH, THAT'S WHAT THE LAND USE THE FUTURE LAND USE PLAN WOULD SET.
AND, AND I DON'T NEED A SPECIFIC VOTE, BUT GENERALLY DO YOU THINK WE SHOULD ENCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT DISCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT OR JUST SIT BACK AND WAIT ON ENCOURAGE IT IN TERMS OF WRITING IT THAT WE'RE OPEN TO THE IDEA OF I DON'T WANT TO REWRITE THE ZONING NOW BECAUSE AGAIN, IF IF, IF I PUT DOWN ZONING FOR A CERTAIN USE, SOME OTHER ADJACENT USE IS GONNA COME IN THERE AND WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO JUST CHANGE THAT ZONING TO BEGIN WITH.
BUT IF WE WRITE THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THAT REDEVELOPMENT OF THE RIDGE PIPE CORRIDOR THROUGH THE USE OF A ACUTE MEDICAL FACILITY AND ASSOCIATED LAND USES IS SOMETHING WE
LIKE THAT SEEMS TO MAKE SENSE.
MAKE, RIGHT? YEAH, WE DON'T, FROM PERSPECTIVE HOW PEOPLE STANDPOINT WHEN YOU SAY THAT'S WHAT'S DRIVING THE NEED FOR A HOSPITAL, ARE THE OTHER HOSPITALS NEEDS, ARE THE OTHER HOSPITALS OVERWHELMED? TO ME, A HOSPITALS KIND OF LIKE A SCHOOL, RIGHT? YOU DON'T GO A SCHOOL UNLESS YOU, YOU DON'T GO A HOSPITAL UNLESS YOU CAN'T ACCOMMODATE OUR POPULATION THAT YOU SHOWED US THAT WE DON'T DEVELOP IS SLOW.
RIGHT? BUT OUR IT'S GETTING OLDER BUT IT'S GETTING OLDER THAT I'M NOT INTERESTED IN HOW YOU ALL A SUDDEN SAY, SURE.
THEY WERE LOOKING TO PLACE A FACILITY WHERE THERE WAS A PAYER MIX WHERE THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE HAD COMMERCIAL COMMERCIAL INSURANCE, UM, AND THEY WERE MOVING OUT CITY WHERE SO TO SPEAK, AND THEY WERE LOOKING TO LOCATE WHERE THEY HAD SURE.
POPULATION BE MORE LEHIGH IS, AND I THINK LEHIGH LOOKING TO EXPAND AND WE ARE, I THINK THEY MUST LOOK AT PHOENIXVILLE AND, AND POTSTOWN AND SAY WE CAN TAKE THEIR BUSINESS, WE CAN TAKE SOME OF THEIR BUSINESS INTERCHANGEABLE INFIELD.
RIGHT BEHIND ALL THOSE CAR DEALERS ARE A BUNCH OF MEDICAL BUILDINGS AND YOU CAN GO GET JUST ABOUT ANY SCHEME YOU WANT OR SURGERY OFF SOME OF THOSE BUILDINGS NOW.
SO THIS SORT OF GOT SOME OF HOW, YEAH, MY UNDERSTANDING THIS IS NOT A LEVEL ONE TRAUMA HOSPITAL, BUT I I I THINK THEY, I AM NOT BECAUSE THEY'RE VERY, VERY, THEY'RE VERY VAGUE ABOUT WHAT THEY WANT.
[00:50:03]
THAT NO, I AGREE WITH YOU.THOSE ARE QUESTIONS THAT WE WANT KEEP IN MIND AS IF, IF IN WHEN TERMS, AND YOU KNOW HOW THIS IMPACTS WHAT SORT OF FACILITY, I'M JUST LOOKING AT THIS AS IF THIS IS SOMETHING WE WANT TO WRITE IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN BECAUSE THIS BECOMES OUR GUIDING POLICY DOCUMENT FOR THE NEXT 10 YEARS.
IS IT SOMETHING WE WANT TO WRITE IN THERE THAT, LOOK, WE'RE OPEN TO THAT BROAD OF A LAND USE AND THAT MUCH OF A CHANGE? BECAUSE RIGHT NOW IT'S A COMMERCIAL QUOTE.
SO TO WRITE THIS, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO SAY, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO AGREE THAT THIS TYPE OF USE IS A COMPLETE CHANGE AND WE THINK THAT CHANGE FOR THIS CORRIDOR IS GOOD BECAUSE IT'S, IT WOULD DRIVE REDEVELOPMENT OF IT WAS YES, IT WOULD DRIVE THE REDEVELOPMENT OF EVERYTHING OUT THERE.
AGAIN, THAT'S, I CAN'T SPEAK FOR THE PART DOWN AT
WELL, I MEAN I CAN'T SPEAK TO HOW THE MEDICAL SIDE OF IT WORKS.
I CAN SPEAK TO HOW THE, THE LAND DEVELOPMENT, IF, IF THIS COMES IN, IT REALLY IS A GAME CHANGER FOR THE WHOLE AREA BECAUSE RIGHT NOW IF YOU LOOK AT THIS TOWNSHIP, WE'RE HITTING A CEILING OF EARNING
WE, WE REALLY ARE BECAUSE OUR POPULATION'S NOT GONNA GROW.
OUR INCOME'S OBVIOUSLY GONNA GO UP AS HOPE GOES UP.
UM, SO WE'RE HITTING THAT POPULATION CAPITAL WHERE THE EARNED INCOME TAX ISN'T GONNA GO MUCH HIGHER.
NOW IF THE HOSPITAL DOESN'T GO IN, THE TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT THAT'S GONNA GO IN THERE IS GONNA BE RETAIL, IT'S GONNA BE SOME SORT OF TARGET.
I MEAN NOT TARGET, OBVIOUSLY LOWE'S, HOME DEPOT HAS BEEN POKING AROUND THAT AREA FOR A VERY LONG TIME.
AND IF THAT'S WHERE WE WANT TO KEEP IT, THAT'S WHAT WE CAN KEEP, WE COULD DO HIGHER IN MEDICAL.
WELL, AND THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING IS ONCE YOU GET MEDICAL, YOU GET SOMETHING LIKE THAT, YOU GET IN SORT OF THAT AND I'LL PROBABLY, THAT'S WHY YOU GUYS, THEY DON'T GO ANYWHERE.
IT'S HARD TO PICK UP, RIGHT? SO AGAIN, I'M NOT TRYING TO GET AN APPROVAL FOR THIS LAND DEVELOPMENT NOW, OBVIOUSLY NOT, BUT FROM MY PROFESSIONAL STANDPOINT, I THINK ENCOURAGING DEVELOPMENT IN HERE IS THE RIGHT WAY TO GO.
ENCOURAGING THAT KIND OF DEVELOPMENT, LIKE YOU SAID, THE RIGHT KIND OF DEVELOPMENT, NOT JUST ANY DEVELOPMENT.
HEY, JUST WE'RE OPEN THE BUSINESS, BUT IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE THAT'S WHAT WE'RE WRITING, THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THEN THAT KIND OF DEVELOPMENT IS THE SMART WAY TO GO.
IF, IF YOU DID THAT WOULD FIX ALL THE DOWN WATER, YOU FIX SOME OF THAT WACKINESS YOU SEE ON THAT ROAD, IT'S LIKE A HOUSE AND THEN ATED SHED AND THEN PART OF THAT IS, IS TOPOGRAPHY.
SO YOU, YOU'VE GOT SOME ISSUE WHERE THAT LIMES ON ONE SIDE THERE'S A LOT OF ISSUES, BUT IF YOU HAVE A MAJOR LAND DEVELOPMENT, THEY HAVE TO LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, ALL OF THE IMPACTS THAT THEY MAY CAUSE AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT THEY'RE SPECIFICALLY LOOKING AT THE SITE BOARD IS BECAUSE OF ITS PROXIMITY TO 4 22 WITHOUT BEING ON 4 22.
SO IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT, WE WE'LL MOVE FORWARD AND SORT SAY RIGHT DEVELOPMENT, RIGHT TIME THAT YES, YES.
WELL FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, WELL REMEMBER WE ALSO HAD, UM, AUTOZONE, THEY WERE IN THE PROCESS FOR A WHILE AND THEY WAS FARTHER DOWN THE ROAD.
HOLTE IS SORT OF THIS NEBRASKA CITY PIECE HERE, YOU SAID NO THESE TIMES, RIGHT? AND THAT, THAT'S WHAT WILL GENERALLY HAPPEN IS WE'LL START TO GET BACK ALREADY BEFORE THIS EVENT I WAS GETTING, HEY, WE WANT TO PUT APARTMENTS ON THIS PIECE, YOU KNOW, WE WANT, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE THIS LARGER PIECE WE WANT PUT APARTMENTS UP THERE AND I AGREE WITH YOU, YOU'RE SMART, YOU'RE,
[00:55:01]
YOU'RE SCALP.IT'S NOT A GOOD IDEA TO PUT 'EM UP THERE.
BUT THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT THE QUESTIONS I WAS GETTING BEFORE THIS OF, HEY, I SEE THIS IS AVAILABLE, WHAT CAN I PUT THERE? NOW SECOND AVENUE, WE ALL KNOW THIS LOVELY GREAT PIECE OVER HERE IS WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS ONE OF THE LARGEST SECTIONS OF TAMPA TOWNSHIP THAT'S NOT DEVELOPED AT ALL.
WHAT I WANT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO SAY IS I WANT TO SAY THE AREAS THAT AREN'T DEVELOPED SHOULD STAY AS OPEN SPACE AND TOWNSHIP SHOULD ACTIVELY RECRUIT TO PURCHASE THAT OPEN SPACE.
THE AREAS THAT AREN'T DEVELOPED THAT NEED TO REDEVELOP AND WHERE THE INFRASTRUCTURE'S ALREADY IN PLACE, WE SHOULD ENCOURAGE THE DEVELOPMENT THERE AND FOCUS THE LAND USES FOCUS THE HIGHER DENSITY AND HIGHER INTENSITY LAND USES TO GO THERE.
THAT'S MY ONLY, BECAUSE WHEN YOU TAKE OUT THE 139 ACRES THAT THAT'S SITTING RIGHT IN FRONT OF SOME WHITE, THAT'S 139 HOMES, YOU DON'T WANT TO TAKE A 10 ACRE PARCEL, PUT 10, 8, 10 HOUSES ON IT, AND THEN YOU HAVE THE DEFICIT OF 139 SORT OF THROWS THE CALCULATION OUTTA WHACK.
YOU TAKE THESE, YOU TAKE THIS DENSITY AND YOU PUT IT WHERE THERE'S ALREADY INFRASTRUCTURE IN PLACE AND WE'LL GET TO THAT IN A SECOND, BUT YOU, YOU ACTIVELY GO OUT AND THE SENSOR'S NEVER REALLY DONE THIS ACTIVELY GO OUT AND TRY TO GET THE AVAILABLE OPEN SOURCE HUNDRED UNITS.
WE, WE ENCOURAGE THAT WE, WE WE SOLICIT AND ENCOURAGE AND SAY NO APPROVAL BECAUSE THAT'S THE PAY.
BUT RIGHT NOW SOMEONE CAN COME INTO THEIR 30 ACRE PARCEL AND PUT 30 HOME LOAN.
OKAY? IT, IT, IT IS MY SUGGESTION TO THIS BOARD THAT WE, WHILE WE CAN'T TAKE THAT AWAY FROM THEM, OBVIOUSLY BECAUSE THAT WOULD BE A TAKING AND AGAINST EVERYTHING WE, YOU KNOW, WE CERTAINLY DON'T WANT
WE DON'T WANT TAKE YOUR PROPERTIES FROM YOU, BUT WE WANT BUY YOUR DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS SO THAT IT WILL, THIS WILL SAY OPEN SPACE IN PERPETUITY.
YOU'RE NOT SUGGESTING A FEASIBLE TRANSFER OF OWNERSHIP.
NO, BUT A TRANSFER A TDR TO THE TDR RIGHT? THE RIGHT DEVELOPMENT, RIGHT EITHER DEVELOPMENT, RIGHT? SO THAT THIS REMAINS OPEN SPACE, NO PRIVATE OPEN SPACE UNLESS THERE'S A PIECE THAT WE DECIDED WANT, OBVIOUSLY THERE'S THE FLEXIBILITY IN, THERE'S ENCOURAGING HIGH DENSITY.
I'M NOT SAYING THERE'S A DENSITY TRADE OFF HERE.
IF WE'RE LOOKING AT MEETING, STILL MEETING THAT 38 NUMBER OF DEFICIT AND STILL BEING ON TRACK FOR THAT, THAT WHAT HAS TO HAPPEN IS EVERY SINGLE PIECE HERE HAS TO DEVELOP THE HOUSES.
MY SUGGESTION TO THIS BOARD IS STOP THE DEVELOP ON THESE PIECES, ON THE PIECES THAT DON'T HAVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE AND DON'T HAVE OTHER THAN A SINGLE FAMILY ATTACHED HOUSE ON IT.
NOW LOOK AT FINDING WAYS TO PRESERVE THAT, WHETHER THAT'S WORKING THROUGH THE COUNTY OPEN SPACE FOR WORK OR AG, OTHER AG DISTRICTS AND OTHER THINGS LIKE THAT TO SAVE THESE PROPERTIES FROM EVER BEING DEVELOPED AT ALL AND, AND NOT TRADING IN A LEGAL SENSE, BUT PUTTING THE DEVELOPMENT IS STILL GOING TO COME TO ACCOUNT NO MATTER WHAT IN THE AREAS THAT ARE IN THE INFRASTRUCTURE EXISTS.
NOW, COULD WE WORK WITH DELTA FOR SOME OF THIS? IS THAT ABSOLUTELY.
I MEAN, FIRST OF ALL, WE ALWAYS KNOW WE HAVE TO FIND A WILLING TO SELL.
I MEAN THAT, THAT'S PART OF IT.
BUT, AND THERE'S A PIECE HERE, WE JUST JUMP AHEAD A COUPLE PIECES.
THERE'S A PIECE RIGHT HERE, NUMBER SIX, FRONT BOTTOM THAT'S OWNED BY, UM, MR. WALKER LONGTIME RESIDENT.
THE HOUSE WAS BUILT IN 18 90, 18 70 SOMETHING.
HE APPROACHED THE COUNTY OPEN SPACE BOARD ABOUT SELLING HIS PRO SELLING HIS DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS TO THAT PIECE.
NOW HE'S ALREADY DEVELOPED, I'M SORRY, THIS MATT CUT OFF.
HE'S ALREADY DEVELOPED HALF OF HIS PROPERTY WALKER TRACK OLYMPIC ROAD.
HE APPROACHED THE COUNTY BOARD ABOUT BUYING HIS DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS.
THEY CALLED ME LESS THAN SIX MONTHS AGO AND SAID THEY, WOULD THAT BE SOMETHING THE TOWN SHOULD BE INTERESTED IN WORKING WITH US ON.
NOW THERE CERTAINLY IS SOME FINANCIAL COMMITMENT TO THAT.
AND I SAID, WELL, I DIDN'T REALIZE THAT MR. WALKER WANTED TO DO THAT.
AND THEY SAID, WELL, HE APPROACHED US, HE'S REALLY INTERESTED IN DOING IT.
AND I SAID, WE'RE WORKING THROUGH THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN PROCESS.
I'LL PUT IT OUT THERE AS A PLANNING COMMISSION MOVE FORWARD IF THEY WANT TO DO THAT, YES, WE WANT TO BE INVOLVED IN, IN PRESERVING THAT PROPERTY.
WE'RE NOT TALKING GREAT SEED VISTAS, WE'RE NOT TALKING, YOU KNOW, EVEN THE JOIST TRACT IN TERMS OF HOW IT LOOKS.
BUT IT IS A PIECE OF OPEN GROUND ON THE LEFT.
AND I WANT ENCOURAGE THIS TO NOT BE DEVELOPED BECAUSE HE HAS TALKED TO DEVELOPERS.
ED MULLIN'S, HIS ATTORNEY, AND ED KNOWS THAT HE OF COURSE, AND ED KNOWS HE COULD PROBABLY GET EIGHT TO 10 HOUSES.
I'D RATHER I I WOULD, I WOULD BE DOWN THIS ROAD.
[01:00:01]
OUT, WE SHOULD TRY TO BUY AS MUCH OF THE DEVELOPMENT BECAUSE THAT'S THE ONLY WAY YOU'RE GONNA STOP IT.THE ONLY WAY TO REALLY STOP IT IS TO BUY THE BRIGHT AS IT COMES UP.
LOOK, THERE'S A WHOLE LOT, THERE'S A WHOLE LOT OF QUESTIONS THAT HAPPEN TO BE ANSWERED, A WHOLE LOT OF PROCESS WE HAVE TO GO THROUGH TO EVEN GET TO THEM.
IT'S NOT EVEN THE FINANCIAL SIDE OF IT, BUT UP TO THIS POINT, THE TOWNSHIP HAS ALWAYS SAT BACK AND SAID, HEY, IF SOMETHING COMES TO US, MAYBE WE'LL TALK TO THEM ABOUT IT.
I WANT TO GET MR SHEETS IN A ROOM AND TALK TO HER BACK BECAUSE SHE OWNS I THINK THIS PIECE AND THIS PIECE.
I WANNA GET MR. HOFFMAN, WHO OWNS THIS PIECE, UM, MOSCARELLA, WHO OWNS THIS PIECE, CICIO WHO OWNS THAT PIECE.
I GONNA GET THEM IN A ROOM AND SAY, HEY, WHAT CAN WE DO TO MAKE SURE THAT THIS NEVER DEVELOPS? AND, AND HOW CAN WE PARTNER WITH YOU TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT THAT HAPPENS? MIKE CICIO, WHO'S ON OUR ZONING HEARING BOARD, HE'S LIKE, I'M NEVER GONNA DEVELOP THAT'S, THAT'S MY HUNTING GROUND, WHICH IS GREAT, BUT HE COULD CHANGE HIS MIND TOMORROW AND I CAN'T STOP WHO THE NEXT OWNER OR THE NEXT OWNER.
HE'S THE ONE WHO BUILT THE HOUSE.
EVERYBODY KNOWS THE HOUSE THAT'S AROUND SECOND AVENUE.
IT'S A REALLY BRAND NEW BIG HOUSEHOLD.
YEAH, WELL I'M NOT SURE LOCATION, BUT THE HOUSE OF, YEAH.
WHEN WE DO THAT, PEOPLE, YOU CAN LIVE IN IT, YOU CAN STILL SELL IT, YOU CAN STILL SELL IT IN A SINGLE FAMILY HOUSE.
BUT THE LAND IS ALWAYS, IT'S NEVER GONNA BE ABLE TO BE DEVELOPED.
IT IT'S LIKE THE UM, THE, THE THE RAIDER FARM.
I REMEMBER THAT THE RAIDER FARM SOLD THEIR DEVELOPMENT RATES AND IT'S ACTUALLY LIKE, UM, THIS PIECE HERE IS GREEN UP IN THE CORNER.
CAN'T REMEMBER THEIR LAST NAME.
THEY, UM, AND THE TOWN WAS INVOLVED IN THIS AND GAVE SOME MONEY TO THE COUNTY.
THEY SOLD THEIR DEVELOPMENT RIGHTS.
NOW THEY CAN TURN AROUND AND SELL THIS TO SOMEONE ELSE, BUT THEY CAN'T DEVELOP ONE MORE HOUSE WHERE YOU CAN BUILD ANOTHER HOUSE DEPENDING ON WHAT WE DO.
THAT MIGHT BE PART OF THE SUGGESTION THAT IT ABSOLUTELY A BUNCH OF PEOPLE, IT'S HARD FOR THEM TO NAVIGATE OUT.
BLACKROCK, LIKE A COUPLE MORE HOUSES THERE, RIGHT THERE.
BUT, BUT UNDERSTAND THERE'S ENVIRONMENTAL CONSTRAINTS AND, AND A LOT OF THAT IS GONNA AFFECT THE, IF HOUSES ARE GONNA GO INTO HERE, THE INFRASTRUCTURE HERE HAS TO BE ALL REPLACED.
AND WHILE IT FALL ON THE BURDEN OF DEVELOPERS, IT COMES DOWN TO A COST.
AND IF I'M SAYING, I'M TALKING ABOUT NUMBER SIX, NUMBER SIX, TO ME, I'M NOT THAT PASSIONATE ABOUT NUMBERS.
AND AND I'M NOT SAYING WE HAVE TO BE ABSOLUTELY PASSIONATE ABOUT ANY OF THESE.
I JUST, I'M USING THIS ONE AS MY JUMPING OFF POINT.
IT WOULD MAKE PEOPLE BETTER ARE GETTING IT'S RIGHT NEXT TO THEM TOO.
WELL, I'M NOT DOING THIS WELL, OBVIOUSLY JUST THERE IS ANOTHER SIDE TO IT TOO.
I GUESS WHAT WE'RE GONNA TRY TO SAY BEHIND YOU, WELL, AND AGAIN, I I THINK IT'S, IT'S FAR HE'S DONE.
I, I THINK IT, IT IS, IT IS A LONG PROCESS.
THIS TOWNSHIP HAS NEVER, NONE OF THE BOARD'S EVER DIRECTED ME TO EVER GO DOWN THIS ROAD BEFORE IT WAS REALLY, LET'S REACT.
IF SOMETHING COMES AVAILABLE THEN SELL US.
YOU KNOW, WELL, HEY, WE'LL INVESTIGATE DEFINITELY IN TIME.
I THINK IT'S REALLY TIME FOR US TO, WE WANT TO PRESERVE THE LAND LEFT.
WELL YEAH, OBVIOUSLY THAT'S, THAT'S SOMETHING WE HAVE TO RIGHT NOW.
BUT THAT COULD ALSO BE YOU TRANSFER IT TO A YEAH, SINCE I'VE BEEN ON THE BOARD, WE HAVEN'T DONE MUCH NO AT ALL TO DEAL TO FARM AND SOME OF THINGS DOWN IN
WELL, AND, AND BEFORE THAT IT WAS 2006, 2008, MONTGOMERY COUNTY HAD A PROGRAM WHERE THEY HAD A CERTAIN POT OF MONEY FOR EVERY MUNICIPALITY.
WE HAD TO WRITE AN OPEN SPACE PLAN.
AND THEN YOU FROM DOING THAT, YOU CAN GO OUT AND YOU TAKE FROM YOUR POT OF MONEY AND BUY PROPERTIES.
THE PROPERTIES WE, WE BOUGHT FROM IT WERE, UM, NOT THE PROPERTY, THE JOAN PROPERTY
[01:05:01]
AND THE OTHER JOAN PROPERTY OR OUR SIN UP AT TAYLOR FARM.MONTGOMERY COUNTY DOESN'T HAVE THAT PROGRAM ANYMORE.
I WISH THEY DID, BUT UM, EVERYWHERE THERE'S A LOT OF MONEY COMING PROCESS, WHICH IS GREAT.
I THINK THAT SHOULD BE WHAT THE COUNTY IS THERE FOR.
BUT, UM, IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN LOOK AT AND I HAVEN'T, YOU KNOW, A VERY HIGH LEVEL UNDERSTANDING OF LIKE THE, THE FARM ACTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
BUT AGAIN, WE NEED TO LOOK INTO THEM AND GUESS THE DIRECTION OF THE BOARD.
I DON'T WANT BRING THESE THINGS TO YOU AND YOU GO, WELL NO, I DON'T WANNA SPEND ANY MONEY ON ANY OF THOSE.
I'D RATHER KNOW THAT THE OPPORTUNITY'S THERE WITHOUT COMING UP WITH A DOLLAR FIGURE.
AND AT LEAST THERE'S A DESIRE IN THERE TO SAY YES.
I THINK WE SHOULD PROACTIVELY INTO, I MEAN OBVIOUSLY THERE'S, IF I COME BACK WITH, WELL THE SHEATH PROPERTY IS GONNA SELL FOR 17 MILLION, YOU OKAY WITH THAT? THERE'S OTHER THINGS WE HAVE TO CONSIDER, BUT JUST TO UNDERSTAND THAT, THAT WE CAN GO THROUGH THAT PROCESS AND THE 10 TALK CATCH UP.
YOU, WELL, AND, AND THAT SORT OF LEADS INTO THIS NEXT SECTION.
UM, THIS IS THE, THE 29 R CORAL ROAD, UM, 4 22 INTERSECTIONS PROPERTY.
IT, THERE'S A LOT OF ANSWERS TO THAT QUESTION.
NO, WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH HOUSING FOR OPENING PRICE POINT NEW HOUSES.
IT'S ALWAYS BEEN MY CONTENTION.
YOU CAN LIVE IN AN AREA LIKE OAK, YOU CAN LIVE IN AN AREA LIKE RIDGEWOOD.
YOU CAN LIVE INBO, YOU CAN LIVE IN A LOT OF THOSE THAT AREN'T EXPENSIVE HOUSES, BUT THEY'RE OLD.
IT DEFINITELY SHOWS TAKE AND I THINK WE'VE DONE A GREAT JOB, MONEY, HOA AND KEEPING UP WITH IT AND ENFORCING THE RULES.
BUT THERE'S OTHER AREAS, ORCHARD COURT, SOME AREAS OF OAKS, SOME AREAS OF BURG THAT IT HASN'T.
BUT ALSO THE ARGUMENT IS, WELL I WANNA BE ABLE TO BUY A NEW HOUSE AND I CAN'T ALWAYS CONTROL THAT.
PEOPLE DON'T WANT TO BUY AN EXISTING 1940S, 1960S HOUSE AND REHAB BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT COMES IN AT THAT PRICE POINT WAS THINKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW.
WELL, AND THAT'S SORT OF WHERE I'M KIND OF GOING WITH THREE AND THREE A HERE THREE IS 1000 CAMPUS DRIVE.
AND THEN RIGHT NOW'S IN THE OFFICE BUILDING, UM, I CAN PULL 'EM UP ON GOOGLE STREET VIEW IF YOU WANT TO GET A LOOK AT THEM.
UM, HERE, LEMME JUST DO THAT SIZE.
WELL, THEY'RE ALL, ALL FOUR S.
IT'S A LITTLE HARD TO SEE, BUT UM, THERE IS PART OF THE DRIVEWAY THERE.
AND THEN YOU MOVE UP TO SOME HOTELS ON CAMPUS DRIVE.
UM, LOOKING BACK THIS DIRECTION, JUST I DON'T NO, YOU REALLY DON'T.
IT IT IS THIS PRELIMINARY IN HERE.
UM, AND ACTUALLY THEY HAVE AN APPROVAL.
THERE IS A MENT APPROVAL, THERE'S A MIRROR.
THIS THEY, NO, THOSE ARE, IT'S AN EMPTY IRON MARK.
IT'S BEEN TAKEN FOUR OR FIVE YEARS NOW.
UM, WHAT I HAVE SITTING ON MY DESK IS A PROFESSIONAL SERVICES AGREEMENT WITH A HOME BUILDER THAT WANTS TO TAKE THIS PROPERTY AND PUT TOWNHOUSE IN THE STAFF TOWNHOUSE.
AND THE DISCUSSION I'VE HAD WITH THEM, WHEN I ASKED PRICE POINT, THEY WERE TALKING THREE 50 TO FOUR.
OH, SO WHERE THOSE HOUSES THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT ARE GONNA GO IN, ARE GOING TO BE IN PLACES LIKE THIS.
THERE IS ALSO THIS SECTION HERE, WHICH IS 204 CAMPUS, THIS IS A REALLY LARGE PIECE WHICH SEE A PARKING AND I THINK THERE ARE TWO USERS IN THERE YOU SIDE.
[01:10:01]
I KNOW THAT THIS ONE, IF IF, IF WE DO WHAT IF SOMETHING CHANGES FOR THIS ONE, SOMETHING IS GONNA CHANGE HERE.IS YEAH, THIS IS THE MADISON APARTMENT.
ONE OF THE THINGS I IS THAT ACTUALLY, AND I WOULD SAY THAT'S SOMETHING WE COULD WRITE IN ANY OF, I DEFINITELY, I SEE SOME GIANT
SO AGAIN, GOING BACK TO THIS AND THAT GO LOOKING AT THREE AND THREE A, THE QUESTION REALLY COMES ENCOURAGE DEVELOPMENT, HER REDEVELOPMENT FOR, FOR STAND PATH OR DISCOURAGED DEVELOPMENT AT ALL.
AND JUST SAY, WE WANT OFFICE BACK.
WE THINK OFFICE IS COMING BACK.
WE WANT TO KEEP THIS OFFICE IN MY PROFESSIONAL OPINION IS NOT COMING.
YOU'RE GONNA GET SCI, IT'S PROBABLY GONNA BUILD ANOTHER BUILDING.
I THINK THEY'RE GONNA LOOK TO EXPAND INTO YOUR FUTURE.
UM, PFIZER AND DOW, I THINK WITH DOW BEING LOCKED IN 10 YEARS, I THINK THE NUMBER FOUR IN HERE, THE ARTICLE THAT WE ALL READ IN THE JOURNAL ABOUT THEM WANTING TO SPEND 1.4 MILLION.
I'M NOT SURE WHERE IT'S GONNA GO.
I WANT TO PRESERVE THE CAMPUS LOOK OF IT.
I THINK YOU'VE MENTIONED TO NEW BILL HOW YOU WANT TO KEEP, YOU KNOW, THE, THE BUCOLIC LOOK TO IT.
YOU THROW ANOTHER 1.4 MILLION SQUARE FEET OF OFFICE BASED IN THERE.
AGAIN, I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT'S GONNA PROGRESS.
I THINK BEFORE, I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING WE DO ENCOURAGE THREE AND THREE A AND YES, I THINK WE WOULD PUT THOSE, PUT THE CONTROLS IN THERE WITH THAT ZONING IF WE WERE TO REWRITE IT TO MAKE SURE THAT IT WAS SMALLER LOT SOMETHING THAT WAS MORE AFFORDABLE.
BECAUSE THAT, AND IT REALLY DOES CREATE AN AREA WHERE IT INFRASTRUCTURES AREN'T USED.
THREE TO THREE BECOME RESIDENTIAL AND SOMETHING HAPPENS A LOT FOR THIS ADDITIONAL WHATEVER.
THOSE PEOPLE ARE COMMUTING ACROSS THE STREET.
FOUR, THEY'RE TAKING ARTERIAL ROADS TO PROVINCE.
YOU'RE LIMITING, UM, BACK TO YOUR COMMENT, DENSITY BELONGS, YES, DENSITY BELONGS IN THIS AREA.
AND THE FIRST MEETING I HAD WITH THE ONLY MEETING I HAVE WITH LENAR WITH NUMBER THREE WAS, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE KIND OF COMING IN AT THE END OF SOMETHING.
THEY DON'T HAVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE COSTS, THEY DON'T HAVE THE TRAIL COSTS, THE ROAD COSTS, THE SEWER COSTS, SEWER WATER, SEWER WATER IN IT.
NOW DOES THAT HAVE TO BE ADAPTED? DOES IT HAVE TO BE CHANGED? A LITTLE BIT.
BUT I TOLD HIM LIKE ALL OF THAT MONEY YOU THINK YOU'RE SAVING BY COMING IN HERE IS GOING BACK INTO THE TOWNSHIP.
AND YOU'RE GONNA FIND A WAY TO SPEND THAT IN THE TOWNSHIP.
AND THAT MEANS THERE'S GONNA BE A WAY TO CROSS OUR COAL ROAD AT 29TH ON A BIKE OR WALK.
WE'RE GONNA FIGURE SOMETHING OUT.
I DON'T WANT PEOPLE, I DON'T WANT PEOPLE WALKING OVER TO YOU AND I WANT PEOPLE WALKING, HAVING A COUPLE DRINKS AND STUMBLING BACK.
SO, YOU KNOW, I WANT THAT TO BECOME PART OF WHAT FEEDS IN THE PROVINCE, TOWN CENTER AS DOES THE APARTMENT AND WALK TO PARK THE CONNECTION DOWN.
YOU CAN CONNECT DOWN HERE THROUGH DOWN LIKE POLAR ROAD SIDE, THE MIDDLE, AND YOU GET TO THE PER HUMAN TRAIL.
I MEAN, I TECHNICALLY PUT YOU FOR WEALTHY IF YOU LIKE.
UM, SO IF, IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH THREE AND THREE A, I WANT TO ENCOURAGE REDEVELOPMENT AND ENCOURAGE THE RESIDENTIAL SIDE OF IT BECAUSE THAT'S WHERE I THINK THE, I DON'T THINK THE OFFICE, THERE'S A FINANCIAL, THE, THE MAIN DRIVER OF REVENUES IS PUT HOUSING STOCK, AIV OUT OFFICE.
EVEN IF IT DOESN'T GET OCCUPIED NEXT YEAR, THERE'S NO BUSINESS PRIVILEGE TAX.
WE'RE NOT DERIVING BUSINESS REVENUE FROM THE BUSINESSES THAT ARE THERE.
AND IF IT GOES TO RETAIL, THAT'S DEMANDING, YOU KNOW, MOSTLY LEASE SERVICES FOR
[01:15:01]
YEAH, I MEAN IF YOU TO RETAIL, THAT'S PROBABLY OUR, FOR LACK OF BETTER FROM OUR LEASE PROFIT BECAUSE IT, IT'S A LOW, IT'S A LOWER INCOME.THEY, THEY PROBABLY DON'T LIVE IN THIS TOWNSHIP BECAUSE THEY PROBABLY CAN'T AFFORD TO.
AND AND WE DON'T GO TO BUSINESS.
UM, WHEN YOU LOOK AT NUMBER TWO, THAT'S AS WE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER, THAT'S THE, THE SITE ON THE NORTH SIDE OF OUR PEARL ROAD, UM, RIGHT NOW WITH
AND THAT'S SORT OF WHAT IT'S, HOW IT'S GEARED.
THE OFFICE BUILDING CAN'T DRIVE, WHICH LIKELY IS NOT HOW THAT SITE'S EVER GONNA UP, NOT LIKELY TO GO THAT DIRECTION.
THIS IS ONE OF THE THINGS, AND I'VE ASKED BRAD BASEY THE LAND DEVELOPMENT REPRESENTATIVE, WHAT PLANS DO YOU HAVE? LIKE WE DON'T HAVE ANY, WELL ANY DEVELOPER HAS IT.
SO I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD REALLY DO ANYTHING AT THE POINT.
I'D RATHER HOLD THE LINE IN OFFICE ON THIS BECAUSE THEN IF OFFICE EVER DOES COME BACK FOR WHATEVER REASON, WE HAVE A SPACE TO PUT IT.
AND IF WE'RE ENCOURAGE RESIDENTIAL OR ANYTHING ELSE, AUTO IS PROBABLY GONNA JUMP UP.
AND I DON'T WANT NECESSARILY THIS, SO MY SUGGESTION TO YOU, MY RECOMMENDATION TO YOU IS THAT FOR NUMBER TWO TO SORT OF HOLD THE LINE AND USE THE ZONING
MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING WE DO LOOK AT FOR OPEN SPACE WHERE IF YOU DEVELOP IT, IT'S NOT THE, IT'S NOT THE WORST THING IN WORLD.
IT'S MAYBE YEAH, I THINK YEAH, R ONE ROUND ITSELF FIVE R ONE ALSO FIVE IS UM, YES IT IS R ONE.
IT'S VERY, UM, IT'S NOT VERY DEVELOPABLE.
IT ALSO HAS, IT'S THE HOME TO BALD EAGLE RIGHT THERE AT THE CORNER.
IT'S ALL FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND OWNED BY ARMON.
AND I'M NOT SAYING THAT WE NEED TO BUY OFF 'EM OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, BUT IT'S SOMETHING THAT AS WE DO HORSE SHOOTING WITH THEM IN THE FUTURE AS OUR WATER LINE HOPPER, MAYBE WE LOOK AT ACQUIRING SOME OF THIS.
MAYBE WE LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THIS IS JUST AN AREA THAT'S RIGHT NEXT TO 4 22 AS TOWN OPEN SPACES.
IS IT REALLY GONNA SERVE ANYBODY? IS IT REALLY GONNA HELP ANYBODY OUT? IS IT REALLY GONNA BE ANYTHING ANYBODY IS GONNA GO VISIT? ABSOLUTELY NOT.
BUT IT IS RIGHT NEXT TO THE RIVER IT IS OR THE CREEK.
IT'S AN AREA THAT I JUST WANT TO SORT OF PUT BACK TO MIND.
DO WE WANT TO SEE, DEVELOP FOR WHATEVER THAT MIGHT OR MIGHT NOT BE.
OR WE GONNA THROUGH THE LINE AND SAY WE DON'T WANT THIS TO REALLY MOVE FORWARD WAY.
THE BUSINESS ARE THAT STEEP SOURCE THAT MAY INCLUDE MOST.
AND THEN NUMBER ONE, I DID THIS IN THE PACKAGE ORDER, BUT NUMBER ONE IS THE QUEST SITE AND WE TALKED ABOUT THAT.
UM, THEY WILL BE IN TO YOUR BOARD MEETING ON THIS MONTH TO TALK MORE ABOUT WHERE THEY'RE AT.
THEY SENT US SOME REPORTS IN TERMS OF, UM, FINANCIAL IMPACTS.
SO, UH, YOU KNOW, TOWNSHIP IMPACTS AND SOME TRAFFIC STUFF.
THERE'S SOME QUESTION ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WHAT ENTRANCES WOULD BE ON BLACKROCK ROAD.
THEY'RE LOOKING TO MAYBE HAVE A HEARING IN JUNE.
I DON'T KNOW IF THE BOARD'S COMFORTABLE WITH THAT, BUT WE CAN HASH THAT OUT AT OUR MEETING IN MAY IF THEY WANT TO DO THAT.
OR IF YOU WANT TO CONTINUE TO PUSH THEM TO SORT OF LOOK AT THE SITE AND MAYBE CHANGE SOME THINGS OR GET, GET RID OF SOME THINGS.
THAT'S ONE THAT PROBABLY IS NOT GONNA BE THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN BECAUSE AS WE GET PUBLISHED, WE'LL JUST SORT OF SAY, YOU KNOW, IT'S SUBJECT LAND THIS POINT.
UM, THEN MOVING MORE TO THE CENTER OF THE TOWNSHIP.
SEVEN HERE IS, IS UM, RIGHT BEHIND THIS DEVELOPMENT.
IT'S SORT OF THE TOP OF THE HILL HOLLOW ROAD RUNS DOWN ON THIS SIDE.
UH, HASSAN ROAD IS HERE, FELL AND
NOW THIS PIECE HERE WITH THE CURSOR ON IT, I THINK IT'S STEEPED.
I ALSO THINK THAT, FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, THERE'S A SEVERE ARSENIC PROBLEM THERE BECAUSE OF WHEN IT WASN'T ORCHARD.
SO I DON'T KNOW HOW DEVELOPABLE IT IS.
YEAH, IT'S, IT'S, UM, THIS PIECE HERE'S PRETTY DEVELOPABLE.
I MEAN I KNOW THE GENTLEMAN WHEN THIS PIECE WENT IN, HE WAS PRETTY UPSET ABOUT OTHER DEVELOPMENT AROUND HIM.
I THINK IT'S, IT'S FAIRLY DEVELOPABLE.
UM, THIS IS SOMETHING THAT I WOULD, FROM A PROFESSIONAL STANDPOINT RECOMMEND SAYING R ONE AND SORT OF ENCOURAGING, NOT ENCOURAGING DEVELOPMENT OF, I WOULD RATHER SEE IT OPEN SPACE.
[01:20:07]
OH REALLY? THAT'S NEVERTHAT'S WHY, THAT'S WHY THE RESIDENTS THERE.
I I GAVE ME A LOT OF QUESTIONS.
I UNDERSTAND BECAUSE THAT'S USUALLY WHEN THINGS START TO HAPPEN.
THAT'S WHEN THINGS START TO HAPPEN.
IF THIS TAKES RIGHT HERE, AND THAT'S THE ONE I'M MOST AFRAID OF MOVING FORWARD IS THAT LOAN.
HOW MUCH PROPERTY IS IT? WELL MAYBE THAT'S, WHICH IS 20, WHICH IS PRETTY GOOD SIZE AND ONE AND IT'S UNDER ONE.
THIS IS OWNED BY MICHAEL'S DOCK.
THAT'S A PRETTY DEVELOPABLE PIECE.
IS THERE, IS THERE ANY OTHER LAND OTHER THAN THE PARKHOUSE PARCEL THAT HAS INSTITUTIONAL OVERLAY ON IT? NO.
I MEAN NOTHING THAT'S HAS, IT'S NOT, THERE'S SOME OTHER STATE OWNED LANDLOCK ALONG THE RIVER I CAN SHOW YOU ON THE MAP.
IT'S REALLY JUST INDIVIDUAL PARCELS THAT HAVE A CHURCH OR AT ONE POINT IN TIME WHERE IT HAS SCHOOL ON THEM.
AND WE'VE NEVER CLEANED THAT ORDINANCE UP.
I HAVE PROBABLY TWO PAGES OF CLEANUP THAT ORDINANCE, BUT BECAUSE OF PARK HOUSE, I HAVE NOT BEEN ABLE TO, I DON'T WANNA TOUCH THAT ORDINANCE WANT, I DON'T WANNA UNDERSTAND THAT.
THAT'S WHY THE DENSITY PARKHOUSE IS BEING CONSIDERED BECAUSE OF THE INSTITUTIONAL.
BUT I THINK YOU TOLD YEAH, IT IS BEEN INSTITUTIONAL SINCE INSTITUTIONAL WRITTEN INTO, THEY SUBDIVIDED THE PROPERTY TO GET THE OTHER PARCELS AWAY FROM THE PARKHOUSE INSTITUTION AT THAT TIME.
COULD THE BOARD HAVE TAKEN THE INSTITUTIONAL AWAY? NO, BECAUSE THERE'S A LANGUAGE IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE THAT SAYS ANY SUBSEQUENT OR ANY SUCCESSOR PARCELS CONTINUE THE INSTITUTIONAL OVER EVEN THOUGH THEY WERE DOWNSIZING.
UM, AND THAT LANGUAGE WAS IN, WAS IN THERE WELL BEFORE THAT YEAR.
DID THE INSTITUTION OVER 13 BELIEVE WHAT, WHAT THE ISSUE IS WHILE IT'S INSTITUTIONAL OVERLAY? AND THAT WAS ACCOUNTING FOR THE PARKHOUSE FACILITY AS WE SEE IT TODAY.
WHAT WAS PUT IN THERE, AND WHAT I'VE EXPLAINED IS THERE WERE PREVIOUS SUPERVISORS FROM THIS BOARD THAT FOR OTHER DEVELOPMENTS IN THE TOWN, PUT SOME THINGS IN THE ORDINANCE, HAVE SOME THINGS IN THE ORDINANCE THAT WEREN'T IDEAL AND THAT'S WHAT PARKHOUSE IS BENEFITING FROM.
TO MAKE IT EASY TO DO THE 1200.
AND I CAN SHOW YOU THE, THAT'S WHY I CAME ACROSS THE PLANS FOR RIDGEWOOD WHEN IT WAS THE INSTITUTIONAL WITH BASICALLY IT LOOKS LIKE A PORTION OF PARKHOUSE IN THERE WITH, YOU KNOW, APARTMENT BUILDINGS AND, UM, ASSISTED LIVING FACILITIES AND THINGS LIKE THAT THROUGHOUT THERE.
SO IT'S AN INTERESTING PLAN, BUT IT WENT AWAY WHEN THE ECONOMY CRASHED.
BUT THE, THE ORDINANCE NEVER CHANGED TO GET RID OF THE 12 TO 15 UNIT PER ACRE ASSISTED FACILITY.
BUT THAT TINY
SO IT LOOKS LIKE GENERALLY IN HERE YOU HAVE AROUND AROUND IT'S ALL R ONE YOU HAVE GOOD WHEN YOU JUST SAY, BUT AGAIN, MAYBE THERE'S A WAY WE CAN MOVE THINGS MAGIC.
I WOULDN'T, WELL THIS ONE HERE, THE ONE NEXT THIS YEAR, THAT ONE, THIS IS HOLLOW ROAD RUNS BETWEEN.
SO WHILE IT'S STEEP, IT'S VERY EXCESSIVE.
THE ONLY THING I'VE HEARD ABOUT THAT IS IT'S GOT, WELL NOW I'VE HEARD IT'S GOT SWAMP, BUT IT ALSO HAS, IT ALSO HAS, BECAUSE IT WAS ORCHARD, THERE'S, YEAH.
SO, SO IS THAT, THAT WE SAVE IT OR NO ONE'S GONNA DEVELOP IN ANY WAY? FROM WHAT I UNDERSTAND, NO ONE'S TOUCHING THE OTHER ONE.
WE, WE DEFINITELY NEED TO LOOK AT AND SEE IF WE CAN SOMEHOW FIGURE WAY TO DEVELOP.
I THINK MOVING FORWARD IN DISCUSSIONS
[01:25:01]
AND SEEING, BECAUSE YOU MIGHT GET TWO OR THREE PEOPLE THAT ARE SUSCEPT.YOU DUNNO HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE GONNA SAY YES OR NO.
SO MAY WANNA TALK TO, JUST SUPPOSED TO START.
UM, ALL RIGHT, NUMBER EIGHT IS, UM, NUMBER EIGHT IS AN INTERESTING PARCEL.
SO LEMME PULL IT UP HERE JUST SO THAT WE CAN TURN IT.
IT'S THIS PIECE RIGHT HERE THAT'S SOUTH OF EGYPT ROAD AND RIGHT OFF THE ALONG ROAD.
IT DOES HAVE A CREEK THAT RUNS THROUGH IT, SOME RAILROAD TRACKS AND SOME POWER LINES.
SO THERE'S SORT OF SOME THINGS GOING ON OWNED BY ONE LAND DEVELOPMENT.
THEY HAVE APPROACHED ME ABOUT A POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT OF THE TOWNHOUSES AND APARTMENTS AND I SAID, NO, I'M NOT INTERESTED.
THEY WENT TO JOHN WHEN HE WAS ON THE BOARD AND SORT OF BROUGHT THE SAME THING TO HIM.
HE SAID, NO, NOBODY'S INTERESTED IN DOING THAT.
I'M NOT GETTING ANY DEVELOPMENT PRESSURE FROM THEM.
BUT IT'S SOMETHING, IT IS A LARGE PIECE RIGHT? ON AN INDUSTRIAL EDGE AND A RESIDENTIAL EDGE.
IS IT SOMETHING WE'RE INTERESTED IN PUSHING A DIRECTION? IS IT SOMETHING WE JUST SORT OF WANT TO WAIT, SIT BACK AND LET THE INDUSTRIAL ZONING STAY AS IT IS? THAT DOES MEAN THAT THE WAY OUR INDUSTRIAL ZONE HAS WRITTEN ANY LAND, JUST ABOUT ANY LAND USE CAN GO THERE AND IT'S NEVER THE GOOD ONES THAT GO IN INDUSTRIAL.
INDUSTRIAL IS SORT OF OUR CATCHALL OF IF THEY WANT TO BUILD A BIG PORN STORE HERE, THEY COULD.
I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU DO ON THE WEEKEND THOUGH.
OR A TRUCKING COMPANY COULD GO OR A TRUCKING COMPANY COULD GO.
SO YOU'RE SAYING WHAT WE WOULD BUY THERE? WELL, I MEAN IF YOU'RE INTERESTED IN BUYING IT, I MEAN THAT'S, THAT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENT EQUATION.
THAT'S NOT A QUESTION I WAS REALLY ASKING IT, IT IS REALLY ENCOURAGING DEVELOPMENT OR TYPE OR, OR LOOKING AT THE CURRENT ZONING AND SAYING HOW CAN WE KEEP A TRUCKING COMPANY FROM COMING DOWN TO THIS PORTION OF LOAN FOR RIVER? WELL HOW CAN DO WE HAVE ANY TO ANYTHING? WELL YOU YOU, EVEN IF THEY OWN IT ALREADY, WE CAN CHANGE IT ON THEIR OWNERSHIP.
THE COMP PLAN, YOU GOT THE COMP PLAN KIND OF LONG GOALS ATTENDED TOWNSHIP.
IS THIS SOMETHING THAT WE WANT TO SEE GO INDUSTRIAL, GO RESIDENTIAL OR DO WE WANT TO WAIT, SIT BACK AND WAIT? BESIDES THAT IS HOW WE TO CAN'T GET'S ONE THING.
THAT'S SO WE DON'T GET, SO AT WHAT POINT, HOW DO WE HAVE THAT DISCUSSION ON WHAT WE'RE
YOU KNOW, WHATEVER WE FEEL IS APPROPRIATE.
UM, NOW HOW THAT, HOW THAT POLICY COMES INTO PLAY.
WE SORT HAVE TO WORK OUT LEGALLY AND AS WE CHANGE THE ZONING, THIS POLICY DOCUMENT, THIS PLAN IS GONNA GO THROUGH AND MAKE A LOT OF SUGGESTIONS, CHANGE THIS ZONING, CHANGE THAT ZONING, REVISE THIS, YOU KNOW, WRITE THIS PLAN, ALL OF THESE DIFFERENT THINGS.
YOU GOT A WHOLE LOT OF ACTION ITEMS THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION'S GONNA TAKE UP AND FEED YOU AS A BOARD ORDINANCE CHANGE.
SO IF YOU AS A BOARD SAY, I WANT TO SEE THIS BECOME RESIDENTIAL, EVENTUALLY THE PLANNING COMMISSION WILL SAY, THIS IS SOMETHING WE'RE BEHIND JEFF AS OUR PLANNING DIRECTOR, CAN YOU BREAK THAT ORDINANCE REZONE THIS AND WE'LL MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD.
THEY ADOPT THIS RESOLUTION AND THAT CHANGE.
AND THEN YOU AS A BOARD WOULD HAVE THAT GO THROUGH THAT PROCESS.
GOD SEEMS LIKE A NO BRAINER TO MAKE IT R ONE.
NOW WITH R ONE, WE DO HAVE THE OPTIONS TO GO INTO OSR TWO, OSR ONE, THERE'S OTHER OPTIONS AND WE CAN INVESTIGATE THAT BEFORE WE MAKE THAT FULL COMMITMENT.
BUT THERE'S OTHER OPTIONS IN TOWNSHIP ZONING ORDINANCE THAT ALLOW YOU TO DO NOT JUST IF IT'S 28 ACRES, 28 HOMES, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN?
[01:30:01]
SO JUST AS A CAVEAT, JUST SO WE UNDERSTAND THAT, BUT WE CAN WRITE THIS POLICY TO SORT OF SAY, BUT AGAIN, WE'VE GOT A PROPERTY UP AGAINST THE RIVER.THERE'S ONLY ONE DIRECTION GO.
RIGHT? BECAUSE WE CERTAINLY DON'T WANT SEND THEM, YOU DON'T WANT TO SEND THEM THIS WAY.
WHEN I LOOK AT THIS, I THINK ABOUT ALL OF THESE PROPERTIES THAT ARE ON THIS SIDE OF 4 22 MM-HMM
SO IF THAT'S WHERE YOU WANT TO GO WITH IT, THAT'S WHAT WE'LL RATE IN ABOUT IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT.
NUMBER NINE IS, IT IS KIND OF A STRANGE PARCEL.
IT IS ABOUT 10 ACRES AND THE, THIS PIECE THAT'S ACROSS THE STREET IS ACTUALLY THE TWO PARCELS ARE Z.
SO THEY'RE TECHNICALLY ONE PARCEL, THEY'RE JUST SEPARATED BY THE ROAD.
UM, THIS IS 10 GOING THROUGH 20 ACRES IS ZONE GUARD TWO.
NOBODY HAS EVER APPROACHED ME OR BRIAN OR LEE ABOUT IT.
AND IT'S A STRANGE THING BECAUSE IT'S ON A FULLY IMPROVED INTERSECTION.
IT'S ALREADY AROUND RESIDENTIAL, IT'S ALREADY AROUND TOWNHOUSES.
WE'RE SURPRISED THAT IT'S NEVER BEEN DEVELOPED.
THAT'S THE LITTLE RED SQUARE RIGHT THERE.
YOUR THOUGHT IS, MY THOUGHT IS AGAIN, I REALLY POINTED OUT, JUST SO WE UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S THERE, I DON'T THINK CHANGING THE ZONING FROM R TWO IS REALLY NECESSARY.
I DON'T CERTAINLY WANT TO GO HIGHER.
UM, BUT IF THEY WERE TO COME IN WITH A TOWNHOUSE DEVELOPMENT, I DON'T THINK IT'S SILVER WORTH DEVELOPMENT HERE.
I'M JUST TRYING TO GO THROUGH WHAT EXISTING VALUES OF THE UNDEVELOPED PROPERTIES WE HAVE THAT YOU MAY SEE.
SO YOU UNDERSTAND IT AND SOMETHING I CAN PUT IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
MY SUGGESTION WOULD BE TO SAY NO CHANGES NECESSARY TO THE ZONING OF THIS UNTIL, YOU KNOW, SUCH TIME THAT THAT DEVELOPER COMES BY TO YOU KNOW, THE PROPERTY THAT, SO IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT, I'LL BE BACK.
UM, THE LAST SECTION HERE, AND I'M COMING IN PRETTY CLOSE TO MY TIME, IS THE OAKS INTERCHANGE.
WE HAVE A LOT OF NEWER DEVELOPMENT THAT'S GONE IN THERE.
THE OAK SHOPPING CENTER, NEST, SOME OF THE THINGS ARE ARE QUITE NICE IN THERE.
OTHERS AREN'T
FEDEX HAS ACTUALLY TURNED OUT TO BE A NICE DEVELOPMENT IN TERMS OF IT'S A GOOD LAND USE.
I WISH THEY COULD HIDE THE TRUCKS A LITTLE BIT MORE, BUT THAT'S DEBATE.
IT'S, I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE WORSE.
RIGHT? I THOUGHT THEY BEHAVE THE SUB TOO
BUT THE QUESTION IS, THERE'S, MY POINT IS THERE'S SO MANY LAYERS OF ZONING HERE.
YOU CAN SEE THAT THE RED WE TELL THE, THE ORANGE SALMON COLOR IS, IS INDUSTRIAL.
WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE ZONING MAP, IT'S GOT M1, M TWO, IT'S GOT A-C-R-S-C OVERLAY, WHICH IS THE COMMUNITY REGIONAL SHOPPINGS AND THEIR OVERLAY THAT WHEN THEY HIT, WHEN TOTALLY WHEN THEY HIT 80% OF CRSC USES IN THIS DEVELOPMENT, ALL OF THE INDUSTRIAL GOES AWAY NOW ALL THE WAY FROM 2005 TO 2015.
I BATTLED WITH BRAD ABOUT THAT NUMBER EVERY TIME THEY CAME IN WITH THE DEVELOPMENT, WHETHER IT WAS TARGET, LOWE'S, GANDER MOUNTAIN WAS LOOKING AT DOING SOMETHING HERE, BUT THE SWIM COMPANY WASN'T IN GOLDFISH GOLDFISH.
UM, WHEN THEY CAME IN, I WAS ALWAYS LIKE, THIS IS A-C-R-S-C USE, SO YOU NEED TO UPDATE THE CHART.
THEY WOULD NEVER SUDDENLY THEY'D FIND ANOTHER 200 SQUARE FEET OR 500 SQUARE FEET OR A THOUSAND SQUARE FEET OF, OF INDUSTRIAL PROPERTY.
SO THAT NUMBER WILL NEVER COME CLOSE TO THE 80%.
SO MY SUGGESTION HERE IS, AND MY PREFERENCE IS TO WORK WITH OTTAWA LAND DEVELOPMENT TO REWRITE THIS ZONING, TO GUIDE THEM TO CLEAN UP THE AREAS THAT NEED TO BE CLEANED UP.
AND THAT'S THE CARPET COMPANY AND THE, AND THE FURNITURE COMPANY THAT'S UP IN THE FRONT.
THERE'S THAT VACANT AREA THAT'S UP IN THE FRONT TURN.
WRITE SOMETHING IN THERE THAT ENCOURAGES REDEVELOPMENT OF THOSE SO THAT WHEN YOU FIRST DRIVE INTO TOWNSHIP, YOU SEE SOMETHING, EVEN IF IT'S ANOTHER FEDEX SORT OF DEPOT, AT LEAST THAT'S CLEANED UP.
IT LOOKS SO JUNKY PERSON IN TOWNSHIP THAT THAT LOOKS SKETCHY.
AND THAT'S WHAT I WANT TO GET CLEANED UP AND, AND YEAH, I MEAN THE CARNIVAL DOWN THERE, I DON'T KNOW IF I'D LET MY KID RIDE OF THE RIDES DOWN THERE OVER WEEKEND, BUT YOU KNOW, THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT BECOME AN ENTERTAINMENT HUB AREN'T A BAD IDEA.
AND THAT HELPS THE RESTAURANTS OUT THERE DOWN IN THAT AREA.
DO THEY NEED MORE RESTAURANTS MAYBE? IS IT HARD TO GET INTO 'EM? ABSOLUTELY.
SO YOU CAN'T HAVE A SUCCESSFUL RESTAURANT IF THERE'S NOT A SUCCESSFUL, IF THERE'S NOT A BIG DRAW THAT'S THERE, YOU KNOW, THE LIGHT SHOW AROUND CHRISTMAS.
WELL THE ONE, TWO YEARS AGO DOES REALLY SHOW, I DIDN'T EVEN BOTHER IT, BUT GENERALLY I THINK IT CAN BE BECOME A NICE ENTERTAINMENT RETAIL, YOU KNOW, DESTINATION PLACE FOR THIS TOWNSHIP.
[01:35:01]
IT'S NOT THAT FAR FROM KING PRUS.PEOPLE WILL GO, OH, THIS IS JUST RIGHT UP THE ROAD.
I'M NOT GONNA BOTHER TRAFFIC IN KING PRUSSIA.
LET'S GO UP HERE AND SEE C LA OR SOMETHING ELSE.
BUT WE NEED TO REWRITE THE ZONING GAMES.
THIS IS ONE OF THOSE AREAS THAT NEEDS TO NEED WORK.
AND IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT, THAT THAT WILL BE A SUGGESTION TO YOU BE SOMETHING THAT WE WORK ON.
RESIST NOT RESISTANT, BUT NOT THEY'RE HAPPY WITH HOW IT IS BECAUSE IT ONLY BENEFITS THEM.
THEY CAN PLUG AND PLAY ANY RETAIL INDUSTRIAL ABSOLUTELY.
ZONING UNDER STATE LAW, YOU HAVE TO AFFORD FOR EVERY LAND USE IN THE TOWNSHIP.
AND WE DO THAT BY SAYING ANY USE NOT COMMITTED SOMEWHERE ELSE IN THIS ORDINANCE IS ALLOWED IN AN M DISTRICT.
AND THAT'S WHY IT'S ALL CONCENTRATED THERE.
SO WE'VE KEPT OURSELVES OUT LEGAL JEOPARDY BY ALLOWING EVERYTHING UNDER STATE LAW WE'RE REQUIRED TO, BUT AS A RESULT WE HAVE THIS LITTLE PIECE OF THE TOWN THAT ISN'T SO DESIRABLE AS A GATEWAY ENTRANCE TO THE SO YOU TAKE AWAY THE M TWO, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE THINKING? NO, I, I THINK AGAIN, WE NEED TO HAVE AN AREA THAT, THAT CONSOLIDATES, THAT ALLOW FOR ANYTHING.
WE ABSOLUTELY DO FROM A LEGAL STANDPOINT.
MY, IT'S A CATCHALL PROVISION.
BASICALLY IT PROTECTS YOU FROM A CHALLENGE, THE JURY CHALLENGE LAW THAT ANY PERSON CAN COME IN AND SAY, PUT ON PROPERTY REASON COURT.
THEY'RE ALLOWED TO DO IT, BUT IT'S SO LONG AS YOUR ORDINANCE PROVIDES FOR IN SOME WAY IN A SPECIFIC DISTRICT, THEN THEY'RE NOT ALLOWED TO SPECIFICALLY STOPS.
DOES DO M1, DOES M1 AND M TWO DO THOSE SENSOR NEED TO BE REVISED AND MAYBE CONSOLIDATED? THERE'S A LOT OF OVERLAP BETWEEN M TWO AND THEN M TWO SAYS ANYTHING YOU CAN DO IN M1, YOU CAN DO AN M TWO THAT DOESN'T MAKE ANY SENSE STANDPOINT, THEN WHY DO YOU HAVE TWO? YOU KNOW, THERE'S A FEW THINGS IN M TWO, YOU CAN'T DO AN M1.
THOSE ARE THE THINGS I THINK WE NEED TO CLEAN UP.
IT'S REALLY REWRITE, BUT IT IS WORTHY ABLE TO REWRITE.
BUT I THINK, I KNOW WE TALKED ABOUT WHAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
I THINK GOING THROUGH AND TRYING TO SIMPLIFY OUR ZONING ORDINANCE IS SOMETHING WE NEED TO DO OVER THE NEXT 10 YEARS.
WE HAVE VILLAGE COMMERCIAL, PROFESSIONAL BUSINESS OFFICE, NEIGHBORHOOD CONVENIENCE, COMMERCIAL COMMUNITY, REGIONAL SHOPPING CENTER.
NONE OF THEM REALLY MAKES SENSE FROM A RETAIL STANDPOINT.
AND MOST OF OUR RETAIL ISN'T IN THOSE DISTRICTS.
IT'S IN THE, THE IO DISTRICT, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
UM, IT, THEY'RE WRITTEN FOR OTHER DEVELOPMENTS THAT ARE 20 YEARS OLD THAT AREN'T HAPPENING.
AND I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE SUGGESTIONS I'M GONNA BE MAKING IN THIS IS WE NEED TO GO THROUGH AND REFINE ALL OF OUR ZONING DISTRICTS TO HAVE JUST A PURE COMMERCIAL.
COMMERCIAL DOESN'T MEAN ANYTHING.
IF YOU CAN DO ANYTHING ON A HALF ACRE, AN ACRE, THREE ACRES OR FIVE ACRES THAT YOU KNOW, BUT THEN COMMUNITY REGIONAL SHOPPING CENTER, YOU ONLY GET FIVE ACRES AND YOU GET SEVEN ACRES.
IT, IT ALL BLURS TOGETHER AND THERE'S NO REASON FOR IT.
I THINK WE NEED TO CLEARLY DEFINE WHAT ZONING HIT TO KEEP US FROM RUNNING INTO THE PROBLEM WE'VE RUN INTO WITH SOME OF THESE, THESE ISSUES.
WILL WE ALWAYS HAVE THOSE ISSUES? ABSOLUTELY.
BECAUSE IT'S THE ZONING HISTORY, HISTORY, IT'S A ZONING ORDINANCE, IT'S A LIVING, BREATHING THING.
AND AS JOE HAS ALWAYS TOLD US, YEAH, YOU WRITE SOMETHING AND THEN FIVE MINUTES LATER SOMEONE COMES IN AND GOES, OH, GUESS WHAT I, YOU KNOW, I SEE THIS LOOPHOLE AND I MIGHT USE IT AND IT'S NOT WHAT YOU INTENDED, BUT IT'S HOW IT GETS RIGHT AFTER THE FACT.
SO WE'LL DO OUR BEST TO CLEAN ALL THOSE THINGS UP.
BUT AS PART OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, I THINK THE NEXT STEP AFTER THAT IS TO CLEAN UP THE ZONING ORDERS AND CONSOLIDATE IT SO THAT WE'RE GETTING RID OF THE FLOW FOR A VERY LONG TIME.
THE WAY THE BOARD, WELL BEFORE YOU OPERATED AND THE PLANNER BEFORE ME OPERATED THE ZONING DIRECTOR REPORT RYAN OPERATED WAS, HEY LOOK, IF THERE'S SOMETHING THAT WANTS TO COME IN, LET'S JUST WRITE SOMETHING IN THERE SO THAT THEY CAN HAVE THEIR LITTLE POCKET.
AND THEN, YOU KNOW, WE, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT SPOT ZONING BY ANY STRETCH, BUT WE'LL MAKE THE LANGUAGE SO IT CAN ONLY GO IN THIS ONE SPOT.
I MEAN, THE REACTIONARY VERSUS REACTIONARY ZONING IS YOU'RE, YOU'RE TWEAKING EVERYTHING AS YOU GO PROACTIVE.
YOU'RE COMING UP WITH A PLAN, COMING UP WITH, UM, IT'S, IT'S JUST USING A DIFFERENT, SO THAT'S, THAT'S GENERALLY WHERE I WANT TO PLAN TO GO.
I MEAN, I HOPEFULLY I'VE EXPLAINED THIS SO THAT WHEN WE DO GET IN FRONT OF THE BRAND PAGING AUDIENCE, AGAIN, IT'S, IT, I MEAN WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON IT.
AND I TAKE FULL BLAME FROM THAT AND I, I DO APOLOGIZE.
WE'RE GONNA GET THIS THING THROUGH THE PROCESS.
MY NEXT STEP NOW IS TO TAKE WHAT YOU'VE SAID HERE, PUT IT IN WORD FORM, FINISH UP SOME OTHER LITTLE DETAILS OF THE PLAN, YOU KNOW, FIX THE,
[01:40:01]
YOU KNOW, THE MATH XX AND, AND TABLE XX SO THAT, YOU KNOW, I CAN GET ALL THOSE NUMBERS IN THERE, GET SOME STUFF IN ANTHONY AND JEN TO FILL OUT THE DOCUMENT IN TERMS OF, UM, ENGINEERING, CIVIL ENGINEERING AND TRAFFIC ENGINEERING.AND WE SHOULD HAVE A FULL DOCUMENT.
HOPEFULLY WE'LL HAVE IT IN FRONT OF THE, THE, THE BOARD OR THE PLANNING COMMISSION AT THEIR JULY MEETING.
AND THEN WE'LL SET THE PROCESS UP FOR YOU OR DOCUMENT, AND YOU'LL HAVE TO HAVE A HEARING.
YOU'LL HAVE TO, UM, YOU KNOW, HAVE PUBLIC COMMENT AND PUT ON A PRESENTATION SLIDES AND WE'LL GO THROUGH ALL THIS SORT OF STUFF IN THE LANGUAGE AND LEARN SPECIFIC THINGS LIKE THAT.
AGAIN, WHY DOES IT TAKE 10 YEARS TO GET THROUGH? JUST, I DON'T THINK IT'S GONNA TAKE 10 YEARS INITIALLY TO GO THROUGH THEM.
IT'S REALLY, IT IS DE IT DEPENDS ON HOW MUCH EFFORT YOU PUT IN GETTING IT DONE.
NOW I CAN LOAD THE PLANNING COMMISSION UP WITH THREE APPLICATIONS AND THEN ANOTHER HOUR DISCUSSION OF COMPREHENSIVE PLAN OR ZONING ORDINANCE CHANGES AND WE CAN GO FOUR OR FIVE HOURS AND I CAN BRING IT TO YOU AND THE SAME THING CAN SORT OF HAPPEN.
WE'VE TENDED TO SORT OF TRY TO KEEP OUR MEETINGS AS BRIEF AS POSSIBLE, WHICH MEANS SPREADING THINGS OUT OVER TIME SO THAT WE ONLY HAVE ONE OR TWO LAND DEVELOPMENTS ON.
AGAIN, WHEN IT'S PARKHOUSE, THAT'S A DIFFERENT ANIMAL.
BUT WHEN IT'S QUEST AND WHEN IT'S, UH, YOU KNOW, THE 4 25 SOUTH MIDNIGHT ROAD, THEY'RE 20, 25 MINUTES LONG.
BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY AT, AT A BOARD MEETING, IT STILL ADDS AN HOUR.
AND AT LEAST PREVIOUS BOARDS HAVE ALWAYS SAID, I DON'T WANT TO KEEP, I DON'T WANT THESE MEETINGS TO GO AT 10 O'CLOCK AT NIGHT, 11 O'CLOCK AT NIGHT IF THEY DON'T HAVE TO.
WELL, ABSOLUTELY, AND, AND SOME OF IT, IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT'S ON MY PLANNING COMMISSION AGENDA, JEN AND I WERE JUST TALKING ABOUT THIS TODAY.
THERE'S A TON ON THERE THAT IS JUST REALLY OLD, BUT IT IT'S THE DEVELOPER SIDE OF IT THAT'S NOT MOVING FORWARD.
I I, I LOVE, I WOULD LOVE TO HAVE A PLAN, LIKE WE JUST GOT AN UPDATED PLAN FROM LOVER LANE, UM, THURSDAY LAST WEEK.
UM, BUT WE JUST GOT AN UPDATED PLAN FROM THEM AND WE'RE GONNA PUSH THAT FORWARD.
I THINK THEY WANNA BE ON THE SECOND MEETING IN JUNE.
SO, YOU KNOW, WHEN WE HAVE PLANS WE TRY TO MOVE IT FORWARD WITH THE COMP PLAN.
WE'LL BE PUSHING THAT FORWARD AND WE'LL BE JOINING UP WITH LAND USE PLANS AND LAND LAND DEVELOPMENT TO GET THAT MOVING FORWARD, TO GET THAT THROUGH THE PROCESS.
UM, AND THEN ONCE WE GET TO THAT, WE'RE ALSO GONNA PRIORITIZE THESE THINGS.
THE PLANNING COMMISSION WILL GO THROUGH AND PRIORITIZE ALL OF THE ACTION ITEMS THAT MAY IDENTIFY IN THE PLAN.
OBVIOUSLY REDOING THE ZONING, YOU KNOW, APPROACHING BUSINESS OWNERS, APPROACHING HOMEOWNERS, THINGS LIKE THAT, ABOUT PRESERVING OPEN SPACE.
AND THEY WILL, THEY'LL PRIORITIZE IT AND THAT'S BE THE FIRST THING WE WORK ON.
GUESS WHAT? I'M NOT GOING TO, IF WE GET TO THE POINT TO WHERE WE DON'T HAVE LAND AT ALL, I DON'T STOP HAVING PLANNING MACHINE.
I WANNA STILL HAVE THOSE MEETINGS AND WORK ON THINGS IN TERMS OF ZONING AND OFFICIAL MATH AND OTHER PLANS THAT THIS TOWNSHIP STILL WE'LL GET THERE.
NO, THE CONTENT PROCESS IS GONNA WRAP UP BY SEPTEMBER.
SO WE'RE NOT GONNA WRITE ANYTHING NEW AGAIN.
IT'S GONNA BE A LOT OF POLICY SUGGESTIONS AND THEN THE, AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION WILL DECIDE WHICH ONE THEY WANT TAKE UP OR IF THE BOARD THINKS THAT ONE IS A PRIORITY OVER ANOTHER, YOUR DIRECTION YOU CAN MAKE A DIRECTION AT, AT A BOARD MEETING.
SO WE MAKE A MOTION TO DIRECT THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO WORK ON ORDINANCE TODAY.
WE SHOULD GIVE THEM SOME DIRECTION.
AND IF YOU GIVE THEM DIRECTION, THAT'S GREAT.
AND THEN THEY'LL, THEY'LL TAKE IT UP AND WE'LL WORK ON WHEN YOU SAY PRIORITY A, IS THIS WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT? THE AREAS? WHAT WILL HAPPEN IS AFTER I WRITE IT, I WILL PULL OUT EVERYTHING THAT'S AN ACTION ITEM, WHETHER THAT'S REWRITING THE ZONING INTERCHANGE, UM, YOU KNOW, WRITING A PLAN.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE, WE WANT TO PRIORITIZE IS, IS UPDATING THE TRAIL PLAN.
THERE'S AN OFFICIAL MAP THAT GOES ALONG WITH THIS THAT SHOWS A LOT OF ROAD CONNECTIONS AND HOW THE ROAD CHANGE UPDATING THAT, THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT ARE GONNA BE ACTION ITEMS THROUGHOUT THE DOCUMENT.
PULL THOSE TOGETHER AND LIST AND THEN WE'LL PRIORITIZE THEM.
AND WE'LL IDENTIFY WHO'S IN CHARGE OF DOING IT.
SO IF IT IS, YOU KNOW, UPDATING THE ACTIVE TRANSPORTATION PLAN, THE TRACKING A BREAK TASK FOR THAT WHEN WE TOOK IT OFF, LOOK AT THAT.
IF THERE'S ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER IT NOW.
UM, IF THERE'S ANYTHING THAT COMES UP LATER ON, YOU CAN EMAIL ME AND YOU GET, DO THEY HERE TO SORT OF BACK UP IN CASE SOMETHING CAME UP? THEY WILL HAVE PIECES IN THIS.
I MEAN, MS. FOURS A BIG PIECE AND THERE'S GONNA BE SOME DISCUSSION OF THAT.
THAT'S MOSTLY THE FOCUS OF YOUR SECTION.
[01:45:01]
SECTION.WE TALKED ABOUT IT AND IT, A LOT OF OUR ROADS HAVE A DESIGNATION, WHETHER THEY BE COLLECTOR OR MATERIAL, THINGS LIKE THAT.
WE'VE LOOKED AT REDOING THAT, UPDATING THAT FROM 2000, I THINK 1996 IS OUR LAST OFFICIAL RIGHT OF WAY MAP.
SO DISCUSSIONS TONIGHT HELPS TAILOR OUR, HOW WE VIEW THE ROADS.
I'M DRAWING A BLANK NOW BECAUSE I'VE JUST BEEN INFO DOWN FOR THE LAST TWO HOURS, BUT CAPITAL PROVEN ACROSS.
YEAH, SOME OF THAT WILL GO IN THERE.
WE'LL IDENTIFY WHAT PROJECTS NEED TO BE MOVING FORWARD SO THAT WE CAN AGAIN, PRIORITIZE 'EM, LOOK FOR FUNDING, LOOK FOR STEPS OF DEVELOPMENT IN TERMS OF IT'S A TRAIL PLAN.
WHAT CAN WE DESIGN SO THAT WE CAN GO AND ASK FOR FUNDING ALL OF THAT.
COULD WE GET THE, THE TRAIL MASTER GUY TO COME IN AND HELP US WITH THE PLAN? THAT WAS BOB.
YEAH, WE HAVE A, WE HAVE A PROPOSAL FROM HIM.
I DON'T THINK WE HAVE A DOLLAR FIGURED.
I MEAN, I THINK IT IS A VERY INTERESTING PROJECT.
YOU MIGHT BE A LITTLE OUT THERE AT TIME, BUT MIGHT BE SOMEONE OUT THERE THINK OF THIS.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S WHY ONE OF THE THINGS THAT, ONE OF THE REASONS I SORT OF PUSHED FORWARD WAS BECAUSE I THINK BETWEEN GILMORE BOWMAN, MYSELF, WE'VE BEEN SO CLOSE TO OUR TRAIL PLAN FOR SO LONG THAT WE CAN'T SEE ANYTHING BUT THAT.
AND WE NEED, WE NEED A NEW