[00:00:06]
[CALL TO ORDER]
GOOD EVENING.I'M CALLING TO ORDER OUR, UH, UPPER PROVIDENCE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING FOR WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 7TH, 2022.
AND, UH, SO THIS IS CALLED ORDER FIRST, UH, UH, PIECE OF BUSINESS WILL BE ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS ON NON AGENDA ITEMS. THESE ARE NON AGENDA ITEMS. EVERYBODY, HOPEFULLY YOU GOT A COPY OF THE AGENDA.
THESE WOULD BE NON AGENDA ITEMS. ANYTHING, ANY COMMENTS? OKAY.
UM, AGAIN, JEFF, YOU WANT TO ASK, JEFF HAS A SIGNUP SHEET OVER HERE.
IF ANYBODY WANTS TO MAKE COMMENTS ON TONIGHT'S AGENDA, WE'D ASK YOU TO SIGN IN SO THAT WE CAN, UH, YOU KNOW, MOVE IT ALONG VERY QUICKLY AND KEEP IT MOVING SMOOTHLY.
UM, AND, UH, SO IF YOU'D LIKE TO MAKE A COMMENT, WE'D JUST ASK YOU TO SIGN UP, BUT YOU CAN STILL MAKE COMMENTS IF YOU DON'T SIGN UP.
BUT WE'RE STILL GONNA ASK FOR YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS WHEN YOU DO COME UP.
UM, WE'RE GONNA KEEP, TRY TO KEEP IT TO TWO, TWO AND A HALF MINUTES PER PERSON SO THAT EVERYBODY GETS A CHANCE TO COMMENT THAT WANTS TO MAKE A COMMENT.
UM, WE'RE GONNA HERE TO LISTEN TONIGHT.
WE'RE HERE TO GET SOME FACTS AND, UH, WE APPRECIATE EVERYBODY IF THEY WOULD KEEP IT, UH, ON THE UPPER SIDE OF CIVILITY IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, WE WON'T ACCEPT ANY KIND OF, UH, FALSE COMMENTS OR ACCUSATIONS OR THINGS THAT DON'T REALLY PERTAIN TO THE, TO THE ACTUAL, UH, APPLICATION.
SO PLEASE, LET'S KEEP IT THAT WAY.
UM, WE APPRECIATE EVERYBODY BEING HERE.
AND, UH, FROM THAT, WE'LL GET STARTED WITH THE AGENDA.
[GENERAL DISCUSSION ITEMS]
SO THE FIRST THINGS WE GOT, UH, WE HAVE TO APPROVE THE MINUTES FROM NOVEMBER 2ND, 2022, AND NOVEMBER 16TH, 2022.SO WITH THAT, UM, I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO EITHER DISCUSSION, FURTHER DISCUSSIONS, OR A MOTION TO APPROVE.
UH, JEFF, CAN WE DO BOTH AT ONCE? SURE.
YOU CAN DO BOTH AT ONCE, RIGHT? WELL, I'LL ACCEPT BOTH AT ONCE, RIGHT? BOB'S MADE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE MINUTES FROM, UH, THE SECOND AND THE 16TH.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS ABOUT THE MINUTES? OKAY.
SO MINUTES HAVE BEEN APPROVED.
THE NEXT THING ON THE AGENDA IS A GRANT LETTER FOR THE GREENWOOD AVENUE.
AND IF YOU LOOK IN YOUR PACKET, YOU'LL SEE THAT'S IN THERE AND WE HAVE TO VOTE THAT WE'RE AFFIRMATIVE ON THAT, RIGHT, JEFF? THAT EVERYTHING'S COOL? YEAH, I, I'LL GIVE JANET, CAN YOU APPROVE IT IF, IF JEN COULD DESCRIBE IT REAL QUICK? SURE.
THE LETTER JUST STATES THAT IT COMPLIES WITH YOUR CURRENT PLANNING.
IT DOES STATE WITH OUR CURRENT PLAN, YES.
WE'RE LOOKING TO GET A GRANT FOR SEWER ALONG GREENWOOD AVENUE.
SO, UH, IF YOU HEARD JEN APPLIES, SO, UH, IF EVERYBODY'S OKAY WITH THAT, WE'LL TAKE A, UH, WE'LL TAKE A MOTION TO, UH, APPROVE THAT.
UM, THOSE, UH, THAT FIRST, UH, GRANT LETTER.
I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.
KELLY'S MADE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE GRANT LETTER FOR GREENWOOD AVENUE.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS? BOB'S MADE A SECOND.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS ON THAT LETTER? ALL IN FAVOR? AYE.
SO WE MOVED ON TO THE SECOND THING WE HAVE TO, UH, PROVE TONIGHT.
AND THAT WOULD BE, UH, AGAIN, A PLANNING MODULE FOR 1 24 YOKI ROAD, YOKI STATION, WHICH WE'VE, UH, WE'VE, UH, HAD ON OUR AGENDA MANY TIMES OVER THE LAST COUPLE YEARS.
AND SO CAN YOU EXPLAIN EXACTLY WHAT THAT IS, JEFF? SURE.
IT'S, IT'S JUST A LETTER OR A NOTIFICATION DEP ENVIRONMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION THAT WE'RE AWARE OF THE PROJECT, THAT IT COMPLIES WITH OUR CURRENT ZONING, AND THAT, UM, THEY CAN MOVE FORWARD, DETERMINE IF A PLANNING MODULE, WHICH IS THE SEWAGE TREATMENT THAT IT WOULD GENERATE, UM, THAT, THAT IS ACCEPTABLE TO THE TOWNSHIP.
WE'VE HAD GILMORE LOOK AT THE PLAN, LOOK AT THE, LOOK AT ALL THE INFORMATION, AND, AND THEY'RE COMFORTABLE WITH IT.
WE JUST NEED A PLANNING COMMISSION SIGNATURE.
AND, UH, JEFF, UH, ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT FROM ANY BOARD MEMBERS? ALL RIGHT.
SO I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THAT LETTER GOING OUT TO, UH, TO THE GUY FOR THE EPA.
BOB'S MADE A MOTION TO APPROVE THIS LETTER WE'LL BE SENDING OUT FOR THE UPPER PROVIDENCE, UH, GREENWOOD AVENUE CEMETERY.
SO, EXTENSION PROJECT, I'LL TAKE
[00:05:01]
A SECOND.UH, ANY OTHER COMMENTS? ALL IN FAVOR? AYE.
OKAY, SO THAT'S PASSED ALSO, JEFF.
[APPLICATIONS TO BE HEARD ON DECEMBER 7, 2022]
MOVE ON TO THE APPLICATION.THIS IS, UM, THIS IS THE PARK HOUSE RESIDENTIAL CARE COMMUNITY FOR SENIOR CITIZEN, AND WE'RE ANXIOUS TO HEAR ALL ABOUT THIS.
MR. MULLEN, ARE YOU GONNA BE THE SPEAKER TO START? YES, SIR.
UH, CAN YOU HEAR ME? YEP, WE CAN HEAR YOU.
AND BEFORE YOU DO ED, I'M SORRY, I WANTED TO, WE, WE HAD AGREED I WAS GONNA MAKE A COUPLE OPENING, UH, COMMENTS TO CLARIFY BEFORE YOU MAKE THE PRESENTATION.
I MEANT TO TURN IT OVER TO, I FORGOT.
ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE SOLICITOR.
UM, AND I WANTED TO MAKE SOME COMMENTS ABOUT THE BACKGROUND HERE BECAUSE I THINK IT WOULD BE HELPFUL IN TERMS OF DIRECTING WHATEVER COMMENTS ARE GOING TO BE MADE, UM, THIS EVENING.
UH, A PROPERTY CAN BE ZONED FOR MORE THAN ONE USE, AND THIS PROPERTY IS ZONED FOR MORE THAN ONE USE ON THE ZONING MAP.
IT'S ZONED AS OPEN SPACE, BUT ALSO UNDER THE ZONING ORDINANCE, IT MEETS THE CRITERIA FOR AN INSTITUTIONAL USE.
JEFF, DO YOU HAVE THAT AVAILABLE? UH, THE ZONING MAP, NO, I CAN GET THAT PART.
THE, THE ORDINANCE LANGUAGE THAT WE HAD, UH, I THINK IT WAS NUMBER FOUR.
SO YOU SEE THERE AS A PERMITTED CONDITIONAL USE AS A LICENSED NURSING CONVALESCENT RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY.
THAT LANGUAGE HAS BEEN IN PLACE FOR MANY YEARS.
UM, THAT LANGUAGE GOES BACK TO BEFORE THE COUNTY EVER SOLD THE PROPERTY.
IT WAS NEVER CHANGED BY THIS BOARD OF SUPERVISORS OR THE PREVIOUS BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, OR THE ONE BEFORE THAT.
IT'S BEEN IN PLACE A LONG TIME.
WHEN THE APPLICANT CAME HERE A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, I GUESS IT WAS TWO NOW, UM, AND THEY ASKED WHETHER THE TOWNSHIP WAS INTERESTED IN MAKING ANY ZONING CHANGES TO FACILITATE THE PLAN THAT THEY WERE THEN CONSIDERING.
THEY DID NOT MEAN WILL YOU CHANGE IT FROM OPEN SPACE TO INSTITUTIONAL.
INSTITUTIONAL WAS ALREADY ALLOWED ON THE PROPERTY.
WHAT THEY WERE ASKING WAS, WILL YOU CHANGE SOME OF THE CRITERIA IN THAT INSTITUTIONAL ORDINANCE TO FACILITATE OUR PLAN? AND OF COURSE, THAT THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.
AND THEN THERE BECAME SORT OF A PUBLIC CRY, UM, AND A LOT OF SIGNS ON, ON YARDS THAT SAID, NO ZONING CHANGES FOR PARKHOUSE.
AND THE REASON WHY I'M MAKING THESE PRELIMINARY COMMENTS IS THAT I THINK IN THAT PROCESS, AN IMPORTANT DETAIL WAS LOST.
I THINK I KNOW FROM PHONE CALLS I GOT, UM, AND CONVERSATIONS I HAD AT WEGMANS OR WHEREVER, I'M ALSO A TOWNSHIP RESIDENT THAT, THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE THOUGHT WHEN THEY PUT UP A SIGN THAT SAID, NO, NO ZONING CHANGE, THAT THEY MEANT DON'T CHANGE IT FROM OPEN SPACE TO SOMETHING ELSE THAT WOULD ALLOW THIS PROJECT.
AND THAT WAS ALREADY ON THE BOOKS.
IT IT, THERE IS NO, SO, SO WHAT HAPPENED WAS, WHEN THEY CAME BACK NOW WITH THIS PLAN, THEY SAID, OKAY, WE HAD A PRIOR PLAN THAT REQUIRED SOME CHANGES TO THE ZONING ORDINANCE AND YOU DIDN'T WANNA MAKE THOSE.
WE'RE NOW HERE ON A PLAN THAT DOESN'T REQUIRE AN ORDINANCE CHANGE.
SO NOBODY'S ASKING FOR AN ORDINANCE CHANGE ANYMORE.
THE, THE ONLY ORDINANCE CHANGE WAS TO MAKE TWEAKS ON THE, ON HOW THE ACTUAL PLAN LOOKED.
IT WAS NEVER ABOUT LETTING INSTITUTIONAL USE IN FOR THE FIRST TIME.
AND I THINK THERE WAS SOME CONFUSION ABOUT THAT.
SO IF ANYBODY IS HERE, I'M BRINGING IT UP IN CASE ANYBODY WAS THINKING OF SAYING, PLEASE DON'T CHANGE IT FROM OPEN SPACE TO INSTITUTIONAL, IT'S ALREADY ZONED FOR INSTITUTIONAL.
UM, THE NOW THE PROCESS THAT WE'RE HERE ON, JUST SO THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS, IS THERE'S TWO THINGS THAT ARE PENDING.
ONE IS A TENTATIVE SKETCH APPLICATION.
SO WHEN YOU DEVELOP LAND, YOU SUBMIT FIRST TENTATIVE, THEN PRELIMINARY, THEN FINAL.
SO THERE'S THREE SEPARATE STEPS IN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
AND WE'RE ONLY AT THE FIRST ONE AT THE SAME TIME.
THEY'RE ASKING FOR THE CONDITIONAL USE APPROVAL.
SEE THAT, THAT THE USES BY CONDITIONAL USE IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE, THERE ARE USES THAT ARE PERMITTED, THERE ARE USES THAT ARE NOT PERMITTED.
AND IN BETWEEN THERE ARE CONDITIONAL USES.
THOSE ARE PERMITTED USES, BUT THEY REQUIRE THE PROOF OF ADDITIONAL CRITERIA.
THEY'RE NOT JUST AUTOMATICALLY ALLOWED.
THEY'RE ALLOWED IF YOU PROVE SOME ADDITIONAL THINGS.
AND SO THE CRITERIA THERE, WELL, THERE'S, THERE'S THAT PAGE, AND THEN THERE'S ANOTHER PAGE, AND YET ANOTHER ONE BEYOND THAT THAT SETS FORTH SOME CRITERIA THAT THEY HAVE TO PROVE TO GET CONDITIONAL USE APPROVAL.
AND THAT IS A SEPARATE THING FROM THE TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN.
[00:10:01]
APPROVAL IS A FORMAL HEARING UNDER THE ZONING ORDINANCE.WE'LL HAVE A COURT'S STENOGRAPHER HERE AT A LATER DATE, UM, FOR THEM TO PRESENT THEIR CONDITIONAL USE APPLICATION, WHICH MEANS PROVING THAT THEY MEET THE CRITERIA IN THE ORDINANCE.
UM, AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION UNDER THE LAW MAKES A RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISORS ON THAT HEARING.
AND THEN SEPARATELY, THE TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN IS PENDING, UM, WHICH IS THE FIRST STEP OF THREE IN THE ACTUAL LAND DEVELOPMENT, UH, PROCESS.
UM, THERE ARE, AGAIN, THERE ARE NO REQUESTS TO CHANGE AN ORDINANCE.
THERE ARE THERE, THERE'S NO CHALLENGE TO A CURRENT EXISTING ORDINANCE.
THIS REQUEST IS WITHIN THE CONFINES OF THE EXISTING ORDINANCE.
SO WITH THAT AS, UM, AND, AND TO FOLLOW UP ON WHAT TOM SAID, EVERYONE HERE WILL GET A CHANCE TO SPEAK.
UM, WE'VE DECIDED TO GO TILL 10 TONIGHT.
AND IF 10 DOESN'T DO THE JOB AND THERE'S MORE, AND THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOT BEEN HEARD, WE'VE ALREADY PLANNED ON COMING OUT FOR ANOTHER NIGHT AND ANOTHER NIGHT AFTER THAT, IF THAT'S WHAT IT TAKES, NOBODY WILL BE DENIED THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE PUBLIC COMMENT IF THEY WISH TO DO SO.
UM, SOMETIMES WHEN WE HAVE LARGE CROWDS, WHAT WE DO ASK IS IF, IF SOMEONE SAYS SOMETHING JUST THE WAY THAT YOU WOULD'VE SAID IT, THAT BY SHOW OF HANDS, YOU CAN SORT OF INDICATE THAT YOU SUPPORT WHAT THAT PERSON SAID IN LIEU OF, YOU KNOW, HAVING YOUR OWN SEPARATE TIME.
BUT YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY ENTITLED TO YOUR OWN TIME.
EVERYBODY WHO'S HERE AND EVERYBODY WHO SHOWS UP LATER.
SO WITH THAT BACKGROUND IN, THANK YOU FOR WAITING MR. MULLEN.
UH, I APOLOGIZE FOR MISSING YOU.
THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT'S VERY HELPFUL.
WE ALL FIND THAT HELPFUL INFORMATION THAT, UH, UH, MR. BRELIN JUST, JUST PRESENTED, SO PLEASE KEEP THAT IN MIND AS WE HEAR WHAT'S GOING ON HERE TONIGHT.
UH, FOR THE RECORD, I'M ED MULLEN BERG RUBIN MULLEN, MAXWELL LUPIN.
I'M HERE REPRESENTING WARRIORS FORD HOLDINGS, LLC.
THE OWNERS OF ATTRACTIVE GROUND CONSIST OF APPROXIMATELY 182 ACRES LOCATED ON ROUTE ONE 13 BETWEEN SECOND AVENUE, OLD STATE ROAD AND YE ROAD BEFORE YOU TONIGHT, AS JOE INDICATED, IS THE TENTATIVE OF SKETCH PLAN FOR RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY, ALONG WITH A REQUEST FOR CONDITIONAL USE FOR THE RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY, WHICH WE CONSIST OF A MIXTURE OF SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED DWELLINGS, TOWN HOMES, MULTI-FAMILY UNITS THAT WOULD BE SOLD AS CONDOMINIUMS AND APARTMENTS FOR A TOTAL OF 1,203 DWELLING UNITS.
ALL OF THESE UNITS WOULD BE, UH, AGE RESTRICTED TO 62 AND UP.
THE PROPOSAL IS FOR A RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY FOR SENIOR CITIZENS.
THAT IS A PERMITTED USE IN THE IN INSTITUTIONAL DISTRICT.
AS MR. BRN SAID, THE PLAN IS A BY RIGHT PLAN.
WE DO NOT NEED ANY REZONING, UH, IN ORDER TO PROCESS THIS PLAN.
THE RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY IS DEFINED IN YOUR ZONING ORDINANCE AS A FACILITY CONSISTING OF INDIVIDUAL RESIDENTIAL LIVING UNITS EXCLUSIVELY FOR PERSONS WHO ARE 62 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER.
AND FOR MARRIED COUPLES WITH ONE SPOUSE OR BOTH SPOUSES AGE 62 OR OLDER.
SUCH FACILITY MAY PROVIDE PERSONAL CARE AND HEALTHCARE SERVICES, INCLUDING RESIDENT NURSING BEDS AND NURSING CARE FOR THE LIVING UNITS.
WE DON'T PROPOSE ANY NURSING BECAUSE OF THE PROXIMITY OF PARKHOUSE NURSING AND REHABILITATION CENTER, BUT WE WILL BE PROVIDING 45 ASSISTED LIVING UNITS, WHICH IS 90 BEDS.
WITH ME TONIGHT ARE GARY BERMAN, A MEMBER OF WARRIOR FOR HOLDINGS, LLC, MATT HAMMOND, TRAFFIC ENGINEER FROM T P D, RON CLO, CIVIL ENGINEER FROM BOWLER ENGINEERING, BOB HOYER, PLANNER FROM HOER DESIGN.
ERIC HETZEL OF VH CREATIVE SERVICES LLC, WHO CAN DISCUSS THE COMMUNITY IMPACT OF THE PROPOSAL.
AND BRAD CLASSON OF W BRADFORD CLASSON AND ASSOCIATES WHO CAN DEAL WITH MARKET RESEARCH.
WE RECEIVE REVIEW LETTERS FROM GILMORE ASSOCIATES DATED JUNE 29TH, 2022, GRACE PLANNING ASSOCIATES, SEPTEMBER 27TH, 2022.
THE TOWNSHIP FIRE MARSHAL DATED OCTOBER 6TH, 2022.
MCMAHON ASSOCIATES DATED JUNE 24TH, 2022, AND MONTGOMERY COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION DATED SEPTEMBER 23RD, 2022.
WE HAVE REVIEWED ALL OF THOSE REVIEW LETTERS AND WE'LL ADDRESS ALL OF THEM.
UH, THE TOWNSHIP THAT YOU PROBABLY KNOW RECENTLY RECEIVED A CFA GRANT IN THE AMOUNT OF $249,000 FOR DESIGN WORK OF A ROUNDABOUT AT THE INTERSECT OF DRIV BUS ROAD, ROUTE ONE 13 AND SECOND AVENUE.
ADDITIONALLY, KEEP IN MIND THAT OUR PROPOSAL WILL GENERATE APPROXIMATELY 1 MILLION IN TRAFFIC IMPACT
[00:15:01]
FEES.FURTHER, BECAUSE WE HAVE STATE ROADS INVOLVED, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO GET PENDOT INVOLVED IN THIS PROCESS.
I SHOULD MENTION THAT WE DO HAVE SOME ISSUES WITH THE COUNTY PLANNING, UH, LETTER, UH, WHEREAS WE REALLY DON'T WITH THE OTHERS.
BUT THE COUNTY PLANNING LETTER GOES ON AND TALKS ABOUT A LOT OF THINGS WITH NO CITATION AUTHORITY, NO ORDINANCE CITATION, AND SAYS THAT WE SHOULD HAVE A, UM, WE SHOULD END UP GETTING AN EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES FACILITY AT OUR LOCATION TO SERVE THE PEOPLE THAT WILL BE LIVING THERE.
OBVIOUSLY, THEY'RE NOT AWARE THAT RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET, LESS THAN ONE MILE FROM OUR LOCATION, THERE IS EXACTLY THAT, UH, FRIENDSHIP, AMBULANCE AND LOCAL FIREMEN THAT WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR THOSE EMS SERVICES.
UH, AT THE CONDITIONAL USE HEARING, WE WILL BE REQUIRED TO DEMONSTRATE THAT WE CAN COMPLY WITH SECTION 180 2, 1 99 B OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
UH, GENERICALLY I CAN STATE THAT WE WILL NOT ADVERSELY AFFECT PUBLIC INTEREST.
THE PROPOSED DEVELOP WILL COMPLY WITH THE LETTER OF INTENT OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY AND WELFARE WILL BE PROTECTED THROUGH PROPER INGRESS AND EGRESS, OFF STREET PARKING AND LOADING AREAS, NO NOISE, GLARE OR ODOR EFFECTS ON ADJOINING PROPERTIES.
WE WILL PROPERLY INSTALL REFUGE AND SERVICE AREAS AND PROVIDE ALL UTILITY SCREENING AND BUFFERING AS REQUIRED BY THE ORDINANCE.
WE'LL COMPLY WITH A SIGN ORDINANCE, PROVIDE REQUIRED YARDS AND OPEN SPACES, AND IT WILL GENERALLY BE COMPATIBLE WITH ADJACENT PROPERTIES.
I SHOULD MENTION THAT THE COUNTY ALSO POINTED OUT THAT, UH, THE PROPOSAL IS NOT IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE TOWNSHIP'S 2010 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, WHICH BY THE WAY, IS IN THE PROCESS OF BEING REVISED.
HOWEVER, IF YOU GO TO PAGE 93 OF THE 2010 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, YOU WILL SEE LANGUAGE IN THERE THAT IF THE COUNTY EVER DECIDES TO SELL THE PROPERTY, WHICH WHEN THIS WAS DONE IN 2010, THIS COUNTY STILL OWNED, THAT, UM, RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT WOULD BE THE APPROPRIATE INFILL IF THE COUNTY SOLD.
AND WE SHOULD PRESERVE OPEN SPACE TO THE EXTENT POSSIBLE.
UH, SO CONSIDER THE FACT THAT OUR PROPOSAL IS 8.46 DWELLING UNITS PER ACRE PERMITTED BY THE ORDINANCE IS 12 UNITS PER ACRE.
SO WE'RE ROUGHLY AT 70% OF THE PERMITTED DENSITY.
AND IN ADDITION, THE INN DISTRICT REQUIRES A 50% OPEN SPACE.
SO HALF OF OUR SITE WILL BE OPEN SPACE, AND THAT'S PRESERVING OPEN SPACE IN MY OPINION.
ALSO AS MR. BRENO, SECTION 3 0 3 C OF THE MUNICIPALS PLANNING CODE CODE CLEARLY INDICATES THAT WHEN ZONING IS DIFFERENT FROM THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE ZONING MUST BE FOLLOWED, NOT THE PLAN.
UM, THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE HERE WHO OBVIOUSLY WANNA BE HEARD, AND SO I'M GONNA STOP TALKING AND GIVE EVERYBODY A CHANCE, INCLUDING THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO ASK QUESTIONS OR TELL US WHAT YOU THINK.
SO, UH, COMMISSION MEMBERS, DO ANY OF YOU HAVE ANY PRELIMINARY QUESTIONS AFTER MR. MULLIN'S STATEMENTS OR DO YOU WANT TO GO RIGHT TO THE PUBLIC COMMENT? YOU GO INTO PUBLIC COMMENT.
UM, JEFF GENERALLY OVERSEES THAT.
I THINK WHAT, YOU HAVE THE LIST OVER THERE.
THE LAST WE SPOKE OF THIS DEVELOPMENT AND THE ZONING, THERE WERE MANY REQUIREMENTS FOR IMPERVIOUS AREAS.
DOES THIS PLAN MEET THE, UH, PERCENTAGE OF LAND USE THAT WOULD BE IMPERVIOUS? THE OTHER THING WAS THERE ARE SETBACKS THAT WERE CONSIDERABLE FROM THE BOUNDARY EDGES.
DOES THIS PLAN MEET ALL OF THOSE SETBACKS, WHICH WERE INCLUDED IN OUR ZONING PLAN? THOSE ARE, UM, I GUESS JEN THAT WOULD BE CLOSEST TO YOU.
WE HAVE, JUST SO YOU PEOPLE UNDERSTAND, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN THE TOWNSHIP GETS A, AN APPLICATION TO DEVELOP LAND, IT GETS SENT OUT TO VARIOUS CONSULTANTS.
AND WE HAVE UP HERE ON THE, ON THE DAAS, WE HAVE OUR TRAFFIC CONSULTANT IN ANTHONY AND IN JEN, WE HAVE OUR GENERAL CIVIL ENGINEER.
THEY EACH ISSUE REVIEW LETTERS AT EACH STEP, AND THEN IT'S A PROCESS WHERE, AND INCLUDING IMPERVIOUS AND SETBACKS, UH, WELL KNOWS IT WOULD BE JEN JEN'S OFFICE.
AND THEN SHE DOES A REVIEW LETTER THAT ADDRESSES EACH OF THOSE ISSUES.
SO NORMALLY WHAT HAPPENS IN THIS PROCESS, EVERY, EVERY MONTH, ACTUALLY WITH A MUCH SMALLER CROWD HERE ON OTHER APPLICATIONS, UM, IT'S A PROCESS OF US SAYING TO THE
[00:20:01]
PERSON SITTING THERE, YOU SAW OUR ENGINEER'S LETTER, CAN YOU COMPLY WITH EACH OF THESE REQUIREMENTS? THEN THEY SAY, YES, YOU KNOW, WE DO COMPLY IN THIS CASE.JEN, I, I THINK IMPERVIOUS IS.
AND YOU MIGHT HAVE HAD A SETBACK REFERENCE IN YOUR LETTER FROM WHEN I LOOKED AT IT TODAY.
THE PLAN CURRENTLY SHOWN IS ADEQUATE AND SATISFIES THE ORDINANCE AND ANY FURTHER CHANGES, WE JUST ASKED THEM TO VERIFY IT ON THE NEXT PLAN SUBMISSION.
AND WITH THE IMPERVIOUS AREAS ALSO INCLUDED THE IMPERVIOUS AREA.
SETBACKS AND IMPERVIOUS AND STORMWATER MANAGEMENT.
YOU STATE YOUR ADDRESS FOR US TOO.
VICTORIA BRIGHT, 360 4 VISTA DRIVE.
AND THANK YOU, UH, FOR HOSTING THIS.
IT'S BEEN, UH, TWO YEARS IN THE MAKING APPARENTLY.
SO, UH, AND I APOLOGIZE BECAUSE I JUST DOWNLOADED THE PACKET TODAY OFF OF THE TOWNSHIP'S WEBSITE TO SHOW THAT THERE WAS AN AGENDA.
WE KNEW THAT, THAT THE MEETING WAS HAPPENING, BUT WE DIDN'T ACTUALLY HAVE THE INFORMATION OF THE PACKET.
SO I'VE LITERALLY HAD ABOUT AN HOUR OR SO, YOU KNOW, BETWEEN WORK AND DINNER TO REVIEW IT.
SO I'M SURE THAT OTHER PEOPLE HAVE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO, MA'AM, IF I MAY, IF I MAY FOR A SECOND.
THE AGENDA WENT OUT LAST WEEK.
IT WAS POSTED AS OF LAST WEEK, AS OF LAST WEDNESDAY, AND THE PACKET MAYBE THURSDAY, THE, I'M NOT SURE WHAT HAPPENED, BUT THE PACKET IS COPYRIGHT PROTECTED AND SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN PUT ON THE WEBSITE TO BEGIN WITH.
I'M NOT SURE HOW THAT GOT THERE.
SO, BUT THE, THE, THE PLANS IN THERE ARE COPYRIGHT PROTECTED, SO I SHOULD NOT, I CAN BE HELD LIABLE FOR PUTTING THOSE PLANS OUT THERE.
THEY SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN DISTRIBUTED.
ALL OF THE INFORMATION THAT'S IN THE PACKET IS, IS WORTHY FOR DISCUSSION THOUGH.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT I'M, THAT'S WHY I'M HERE TO PRESENT CUZ WHAT I LOOKED AT WAS INFORMATION THAT I'D LIKE TO GATHER MORE INFORMATION ABOUT, UM, WITH THAT'S WITHIN THE PACKET.
CERTAINLY THE, THE, UH, INFORMATION HAVING BEEN PRESENTED MAY 23RD, 2022 TO THE TOWNSHIP.
NOW WE'RE JUST GETTING THE INFORMATION.
SO THE APPLICATION IS MAY 23RD, 2022.
AND IT'S BEEN ON THE AGENDA LISTED AS AN ACTIVE ITEM SINCE MAY 20, 23, 20 22.
SO, AND AS I'VE STATED IN MANY MEETINGS, YOU, YOU, YOU COULD ALWAYS COME AND LOOK AT A RIGHT TO KNOW REQUEST.
WE'VE HAD NUMEROUS PEOPLE DO THAT.
IT'S BEEN SITTING AT THE COUNTER WAITING FOR PEOPLE TO, TO LOOK AT THE PACKET.
WELL THAT'S, THAT'S GOOD TO KNOW THAT THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO HAVE IT ALSO ON THE AGENDA IN THE FUTURE.
UM, SO ONE QUESTION THAT I HAD WAS, CUZ I WAS TRYING TO DO THE COUNT HERE THAT THE APPLICATION FOR THE REQUEST FOR THE COUNTY REVIEW THAT'S ON PAGE 19 REFERENCED THAT THERE ARE APPROXIMATELY 185 ACRES BEING CONSIDERED.
UM, 142 ACRES WOULD BE IMPACTED.
THAT LEAVES I GUESS ABOUT 40 SOME ACRES THAT ARE GONNA BE CONSIDERED OPEN SPACE.
WE'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GONNA DO WITH THAT OPEN SPACE.
UM, SO THAT'S THE FIRST QUESTION.
I HAVE A, I HAVE A LIST OF QUESTIONS, SO WELL KEEP, KEEP PLEASE KEEP BYPASS PAST THE TWO MINUTES.
WELL, WE ARE GOING TO TRY TO STICK TO, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THREE THIS, THERE'S SOMETHING ELSE THAT I SHOULD HAVE SAID AT THE BEGINNING.
THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR PEOPLE TO OFFER PUBLIC COMMENT AND OPINION UNDER THE SUNSHINE LAW.
IT ACTUALLY IS NOT A QUESTION AND ANSWER SESSION, AND IT IS NOT AN OPPORTUNITY FOR YOU TO ASK QUESTIONS.
NOW, IN THE, IN THE SPIRIT OF CIVILITY AND NEIGHBORLINESS, IF A PERSON HAS A COUPLE QUESTIONS LIKE, HEY, HOW MANY ACRES IS IT THAT, THAT'S OKAY, BUT A PERSON WITH A LAUNDRY LIST OF QUESTIONS CAN'T TAKE OVER THE PODIUM AND WE'LL BE STICKING WITH THE THREE MINUTES.
SO I WOULD SAY CERTAINLY, AND I, AND I'M NOT AN ATTORNEY, SO I DON'T WANNA ASK A LOT OF QUESTIONS TO TRY AND GET ANSWERS TO SOMETHING THAT ISN'T MEANINGFUL TO ME AS A COMMUNITY MEMBER AND A TAXPAYER IN THE COMMUNITY.
SO WHAT I'M ALSO CONCERNED ABOUT IS THE, WHICH REALLY GETS TO ME IS THE, UH, NUMBER OF, UH, APPROXIMATELY 1,205 UNITS, UM, TWO PERSONS PER UNIT FOR AT LEAST THE REFERENCE OF DWELLING UNITS.
SO THAT'S APPROXIMATELY ABOUT 2,400 PERSONS
[00:25:01]
WITH THAT INCLUDED 154 SINGLE FAMILY UNITS, WHICH ASSUMES AT LEAST TWO PERSONS PER UNIT.SO, WE'LL KIND OF RUN NUMBERS HERE, AND AGAIN, I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE THIS OUT, THAT APPROXIMATELY THERE'S ABOUT POSSIBLY 2,500 NEW MEMBERS, NEW RESIDENTS COMING INTO AN AREA, WHICH IS ABOUT 10% OF OUR TOWNSHIP'S POPULATION.
SO THAT'S 10% INCREASE TO THE POPULATION.
MY QUESTION IS, IS WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO ABOUT TAXES WHEN IT COMES TIME TO BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THE INFRASTRUCTURE IN THIS COMMUNITY? TAXES ARE OF COURSE AN ISSUE FOR THE SUPERVISOR, SO THAT'S NOT FOR THIS.
SO CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, EMERGENCY SERVICES, POLICE RESPONSE, SENIOR LIVING, UH, SENIOR LIVING DOES REQUIRE SOME SPECIFIC SPECIALIZED SERVICES AND THAT SPECIALIZED SERVICE IN OUR COMMUNITY.
UM, NO, NO, I THINK WE HAVE MAYBE ONE OR TWO, MAYBE THREE SENIOR LIVING CENTERS IN THIS COMMUNITY THAT HAVE PROBABLY NO MORE THAN 140 BEDS.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT 2,500 POTENTIAL, AN INCREASE OF SENIOR LIVING OF 2,500.
I'M A SENIOR, I'M GONNA BE THERE.
I JUST WANNA KNOW WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO TO SUPPORT THAT POPULATION.
THIS IS JUST NOT THE RIGHT FORUM FOR THE TAXATION QUESTION.
YEAH, I, AND I THINK YOU'RE, IT'S A, IT'S A PLANNING COMMISSION QUESTION.
WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO TO PLAN TO SUPPORT THAT POPULATION? THAT'S NOT THE KIND OF QUESTION THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION WOULD ANSWER TONIGHT.
THE, THE PLANNING COMMISSION COULD TRY TO ANSWER BASIC QUESTIONS THROUGH THE CONSULTANTS ABOUT THE NUTS, NUTS AND BOLTS OF THE PLAN.
AND, AND PLEASE KEEP IN MIND ALSO TENTATIVE SKETCH PLANS ARE THE FIRST OF THE THREE STEPS BECAUSE THE PLAN DOESN'T HAVE TO BE ENGINEERED YET.
IT'S, THAT'S WHY IT'S CALLED TENTATIVE AND THAT'S WHY THEY USE THE WORD SKETCH.
IT IS A VERY, IT GIVES PEOPLE A VERY GENERAL IDEA OF WHERE THE PROJECT IS HEADED.
IT'S REALLY THE PRELIMINARY PLAN.
THAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT STEP OF THE THREE.
AND IT'S THE FIRST TIME THAT THE PLANS ARE FULLY ENGINEERED AND WILL INCLUDE, UM, YOU KNOW, A LOT MORE DETAIL.
SO NOW ON THE, ON THE NUMBERS THAT YOU ARE SUGGESTING AS THE POPULATION INCREASE, I WOULD LEAVE IT TO THE APPLICANT WHETHER THEY, YOU KNOW, AGREE OR WANNA A COMMENT ON WHETHER THEY THINK THE NUMBERS ARE RIGHT.
BUT IN TERMS OF THE CONCLUSIONS THAT FOLLOW FROM THAT, WHAT PERCENTAGE IT IS OF THE TOTAL POPULATION, THAT'S JUST MATH.
THAT'S NOT ANYTHING THE PLANNING COMMISSION HAS TO BE ASKED OR COMMENTED ABOUT UNLESS YOU'RE ASKING IT RHETORICALLY.
SO, IN TERMS OF YOUR ACTUAL NUMBERS, IN TERMS OF THE, IT'S AN INFRASTRUCTURE QUESTION THAT I WOULD ASK OF OBVIOUSLY THE APPLICANT OF HOW THEY'RE GONNA IMPROVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE IN THE COMMUNITY GIVEN THAT IT'S POTENTIALLY 2,500 SENIORS.
SO THAT'S ALSO ANOTHER ISSUE THAT COMES UP A LOT WITH LAND DEVELOPMENT PLANS.
THE, AN APPLICANT IS NOT REQUIRED TO MAKE IMPROVEMENTS TO THE COMMUNITY.
THEY CANNOT BE FORCED TO MAKE OFFSITE IMPROVEMENTS.
OTHERWISE, IT'S THROUGH THIS LAW THAT WE HAVE CALLED ACT 2 0 9 FOR TRAFFIC INTERSECTION IMPROVEMENTS THAT THEY HAVE TO PAY A FEE TOWARDS.
BUT YOU CAN'T MAKE THEM DO OFFSITE IMPROVEMENTS IS A COMMON QUESTION.
AND WE PROBABLY GIVE THAT ANSWER, YOU KNOW, A COUPLE TIMES EVERY MONTH.
THE REASON THE NUMBER, THE POPULATION'S BIG IS CUZ IT'S A HUGE PIECE OF GROUND.
BUT, BUT THAT, SO THEY'RE NOT DEVELOPING IT IN A WAY THAT'S, AGAIN, THEY'RE NOT ASKING FOR RELIEF FROM THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
ACTUALLY, I BELIEVE THAT THE, THE CURRENT APPLICATION IS ONLY HA OF HALF THE YIELD THAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY ALLOWED UNDER THE ORDINANCE.
SO THEY'RE ACTUALLY ALLOWED A GREAT MANY MORE PEOPLE FOR WHATEVER, YOU KNOW, FOR THEIR OWN REASONS THEY DID NOT PUT IN FOR THE FULL, UH, NUMBER.
UM, BUT THE, THE NUMBERS ARE WHAT THE NUMBERS ARE.
SO I AM GONNA JUST ASK AGAIN ON PAGE 27 OF, UH, GRACE PLANNING ASSOCIATES DOCUMENT SECTION NUMBER 14, SECTION 180 2 DASH 83.
UM, GIVEN THE NUMBER OF UNITS PROPOSED, IT IS HIGHLY RECOMMENDED THAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS REQUEST A COMMUNITY IMPACT STATEMENT AND MARKET ANALYSIS FOR THIS PROPOSED LAND DEVELOPMENT TO BETTER UNDERSTAND THE IMPACT AND VIABILITY OF THE PROJECT.
AND WE WILL HAVE BOTH OF THEM AT THE CONDITIONAL USE HEARING.
THOSE ARE REQUIRED BY ORDINANCE.
ANOTHER QUESTION THAT I MA'AM, YOU'RE REALLY WAY OVER THE THREE MINUTES AND YOU, YOU STILL HAD IT WITH THE QUESTIONS.
YEAH, NO DISRESPECT INTENDED, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE HERE.
UM, THE, BECAUSE I'M A RESIDENT THAT I HAVE TO DODGE VEHICLES EVERY SINGLE DAY TO GET TO MY EMPLOYMENT.
MAYBE WE COULD JUST GET TO YOUR, ONE MORE OF YOUR QUESTIONS BEFORE WE GIVE SOMEONE ELSE A TURN.
REFLECTING ON THE BLACK ROCK ROAD ENTRANCES, UM, THE PLAN ITSELF REFERENCES ONE, MAYBE ONE ENTRANCE, TWO ENTRANCES I THINK I SEE ON MY MAP.
UM, AND IS THAT A STATE, UH, HIGHWAY
[00:30:01]
PENDOT ISSUE? MM-HMM.SO ANY ADDITIONAL ENTRANCES BESIDES THE FOUR THAT CURRENTLY EXIST FOR PARKHOUSE NURSING FACILITY? THERE'S TWO ADDITIONAL, AND IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S ONE UP AROUND, I'M NOT QUITE SURE WHAT THAT IS, BUT STATE HIGHWAY OCCUPANCY PERMITS STATE HIGHWAY ARE THE, OR TOTALLY WITHIN THE PURVIEW OF PENDOT.
THAT'S A SEP WHOLE SEPARATE PROCESS.
SO THEREFORE THE BRIDGE THAT IS, UH, UNDERLYING THE, THAT OVERRIDES THE CREEK THERE, THAT'S A PENDOT ISSUE.
SO WOULD WE BE PETITIONING PENDOT FOR SOME CLARIFICATION OR WOULD WE COME TO THE TOWNSHIP FOR CLARIFICATION ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS? UM, PROBABLY, YOU KNOW, THREE HOURS A DAY DURING THAT AREA OF TRAFFIC.
ANTHONY, DO I RECALL CORRECTLY THAT WE WERE ALREADY LOOKING AT THE, THAT BRIDGE EVEN BEFORE THIS APPLICATION WAS IN? UH, YOU MEAN US AS THE TOWNSHIP OF PENDA AS A TOWNSHIP AND WITH THROUGH PENOC? YES.
WE, WE HAD SOME DIALOGUE, I GUESS WHEN WE WERE PURSUING THE GRANT FOR THE ROUNDABOUT PROJECT AT THE INTERSECTION.
WE, WE HAD SOME DIALOGUE WITH THE DEPARTMENT ABOUT THE BRIDGE THERE.
I BELIEVE IT MIGHT NOW BE ON THEIR, UH, TIP PROGRAM TO ADDRESS WHEN WE HAVE NO IDEA.
BUT IT, IT'S PART OF OUR, UH, IT'S INCORPORATED OUR PRELIMINARY ENGINEERING RIGHT.
FOR THE ROUNDABOUT RIGHT AT THIS TIME.
WELL, I, AGAIN, SENIOR LIVING, I'M NOT OPPOSED TO, UH, 2200 SENIORS TRYING TO CROSS OVER THAT LITTLE BRIDGE, UH, AT A TIME OF TRAFFIC MIGHT BE A SAFETY ISSUE FOR OUR COMMUNITY.
I I, I THINK I JUST WOULD ASK THAT THE, THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION TAKE CONSIDERATION OF WHAT MR. GRACE'S RECOMMENDATION WAS OF IMPACT STUDY.
SO, AND SO, SO THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS THIS IS NOT DIRECTED TO YOU, BUT YOU, YOU, YOU REMINDED ME OF ONE OTHER COMMENT I WAS GOING TO MAKE.
UM, THE, THE PLANNING COMMISSION'S JOB AND THE SUPERVISOR'S JOB WITH A LAND DEVELOPMENT PLAN IS TO LOOK AT THE, WHAT WE CALL THE SAL, THE SUBDIVISION AND LAND DEVELOPMENT ORDINANCE, WHICH HAS MANY, MANY REQUIREMENTS FOR HOW YOU HAVE TO BUILD BUILDINGS, WHAT IMPERVIOUS YOU HAVE, WHAT SETBACKS YOU HAVE TO HAVE, HOW MUCH, YOU KNOW, OPEN SPACE.
AND IT'S A PROCESS OF DOTTING ISS AND CROSSING TS TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PLAN COMPLIES WITH EVERY DETAIL OF THE SAL DO.
UM, WHAT IT IS NOT IS AN EXERCISE OF DISCRETION ON WHETHER ANYBODY UP HERE LIKES THE PLAN, DOESN'T LIKE THE PLAN, WHETHER THE SUPERVISORS LIKE THE PLAN OR DO NOT LIKE THE PLAN.
IT WHEN MR. MULLEN CALLED IT A BY RIGHT PLAN, THAT MEANS UNDER THE, THE ZONING ORDINANCE, THEY DON'T NEED ANYTHING FROM THE TOWNSHIP.
AND THE WAY IT CHANGES TO THE ZONING ORDINANCE, THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO THE APPROVAL IF THEY DO DOT ALL THEIR I'S AND CROSS ALDER T'S, WHICH IS WHAT THE PROCESS IS ABOUT, WHETHER IT'S A LITTLE PROJECT OR A BIG PROJECT THAT DOESN'T CHANGE.
AND, AND ONE, ONE FINAL QUESTION, IF I COULD ASK THE APPLICANTS, WAS THERE A CONSIDERATION OF WHY IT CHANGED FROM THE 600 UNITS IN, UH, 2020 TO, UH, NOW 1,203 OR 1,205, ACTUALLY IS WHAT THE NUMBERS COME TO? YEAH, IT WAS TO, IT WAS TOTALLY DIFFERENT CONCEPT.
UH, WE WERE TRYING TO REPLICATE, UH, WILLIAMSBURG AND WAS SHOPPING AND WE WERE TRYING TO DO A HORSE FARM AND WE WERE TRYING TO DO ALL SORTS OF THINGS THAT WE THOUGHT WOULD MAKE SENSE.
BUT THE PROBLEM WAS THAT IN ORDER TO FACILITATE THOSE USES, WE COULD NOT HAVE THE AGE RESTRICTION OF 62 MM-HMM.
THEN WE CAME BACK AND SAID, WELL, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO BE 8 62 AND UP, SO WHAT SHOULD WE DO? AND THIS IS WHAT WE CAME UP WITH.
AND, AND, AND 1,203 WAS CONSIDERED AN ANALYSIS FOR THIS COMMUNITY TO, THE DEMAND IS 1,203.
IT'S BASICALLY WHAT PLANNED OUT THROUGH OUR PLANNING CONSULTANTS WHEN WE WANTED TO HAVE SINGLES, TOWNHOUSES, UH, SALE APARTMENT UNITS AND APARTMENTS, UH, WE COULD GO LIKE ALL APARTMENTS.
AND JUST FOR YOUR FRUSTRATION LEVELS, JUST TRY TO PUT YOUR QUESTIONS AND FORM, NOT LOOKING FOR AN ANSWER, BUT JUST TO GIVE US SOME THOUGHTS AS WE PROGRESS THROUGH THIS PROCESS.
WE'LL TAKE THOSE QUESTIONS, NOT TO GIVE YOU ANSWERS, BUT MAYBE JUST TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THE THOUGHT OF THE COMMUNITY IS.
SO DON'T, DON'T NECESSARILY COME UP HERE LOOKING FOR ANSWERS, UH, AT THIS POINT FOR, YOU KNOW, WE'LL BE HERE FOR A LOT LONGER AND THAT'S OKAY.
BUT YOU KNOW, I, THE, THE, THE APPLICANT IS NOT REQUIRED TO ANSWER QUESTIONS EITHER AT THIS POINT.
IF ED WANTS TO DO THAT, THAT'S FINE, BUT, UM, BUT, UH, SO TRY, TRY TO MAKE IT SO WE UNDERSTAND THE FEEL OF THE COMMUNITY INSTEAD OF LOOKING FOR AN ANSWER AT THIS PARTICULAR MEETING.
THERE'S GONNA BE OTHER MEETINGS.
[00:35:08]
GOOD EVENING.LISA MOSSI, THREE 11 MONTGOMERY AVENUE OAKS.
UM, I DO HAVE A QUESTION FOR JOE.
WHAT I HEARD TONIGHT WAS THAT WE'RE NOT GONNA HAVE A NURSING COMPONENT IN THIS DEVELOPMENT.
SO TO ME, THAT JUST SOUNDS LIKE IT'S AGE RESTRICTED TO 62.
THAT DOESN'T SEEM TO MEET THE CRITERIA OF INSTITUTIONAL TO ME.
SO COULD YOU EXPLAIN TO ME AND EXPLAIN TO THE AUDIENCE WHY THAT MEETS THE CRITERIA? BECAUSE I WOULD THINK THERE'S A NURSING COMPONENT OR A CARE COMPONENT IN THERE SOMEWHERE, IF THE YEAH.
UM, WHEN WE FIRST, WHEN WE FIRST GOT THE APPLICATION, UM, WE WERE OF COURSE TO, IN DUE DILIGENCE, WE WERE LOOKING AT EVERY POSSIBLE OPPORTUNITY TO SEE WHETHER THE PLAN WAS SUBJECT TO CHALLENGE OR, OR REJECTION OR, OR EVEN MODIFICATION JUST TO, TO GAIN LEVERAGE IF WE COULD DO THAT.
UM, AND I THOUGHT THAT WAS ACTUALLY AN AREA OF INQUIRY MM-HMM.
THERE WAS A CASE DECIDED OUTTA WAR SISTER TOWNSHIP LAST YEAR ON THIS VERY ISSUE, WHICH WAS DECIDED NOT FOR THIS APPLICANT, BUT WAS DECIDED IN A WAY THAT'S FAVORABLE TO THIS APPLICANT ON THAT POINT.
AND IN THE, IN THE, UM, IN, IN WARCHESTER, UM, MR. MULLEN MIGHT RECALL THE DETAILS BETTER, BUT I THINK WHAT HAPPENED WAS ALL THEY HAD WAS A LETTER THAT SAID, IF YOU LIVE IN A HOME IN A, IN A HOUSE HERE IN THIS COMMUNITY, BUT YOU HAVE A MEDICAL NEED, YOU'LL HAVE FIRST PRIORITY TO GO INTO OUR MEDICAL BUILDING OVER THERE.
AND, YOU KNOW, THE TOWNSHIP'S ARGUMENT WAS YOU'RE JUST CALLING IT, UH, YOU'RE JUST CALLING IT, UH, SENIOR WITH A, A MEDICAL OVERLAY TO PUT MORE UNITS IN OF SINGLE FAMILY HOMES.
AND I THOUGHT THAT WAS GOING TO BE A, A BASIS TO CHALLENGE IT.
BUT THERE'S A, THERE'S A WRITTEN COURT DECISION THAT WENT UP TO COMMONWEALTH COURT AND THAT WAS AFFIRMED AFFIRMING, UH, JUDGE SILO IN NAS TOWN.
UM, AND IT KIND OF PUT THAT TO BAD.
THAT'S, THAT'S INTERESTING BECAUSE WHEN I WAS ON THE BOARD, THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT WE ACTUALLY CHANGED THE ZONING TO PREVENT BECAUSE OF THE RIDGEWOOD DEVELOPMENT.
JEFF MIGHT REMEMBER THAT, BUT I'LL LEAVE THAT AT THAT.
SO THE, MY QUESTION ON THIS, AND, AND IT'S REALLY JUST A GENERAL QUESTION.
IT'S STUFF FOR PEOPLE TO MULL OVER HERE IS WHO'S GONNA RUN THIS FACILITY? WHO IS, IS THERE GONNA BE EMPLOYEES HERE AND WHO'S GONNA RUN IT? BECAUSE, UH, DR.
RIFKIN, WHO WAS THE ORIGINAL PURCHASER OF THE PARK HOUSE FACILITY, SOLD THAT FACILITY IN 2017 AND DIDN'T WANNA BE IN THE BUSINESS ANYMORE.
HE SOLD OFF ALL OF US IN NURSING HOMES AS, AS I RECALL.
SO NOW ALL OF A SUDDEN HE WANTS TO GET BACK INTO IT BECAUSE HE GOT HIS, BECAUSE BECAUSE WE SLAPPED HIM DOWN WITH HIS RESIDENTIAL PROPOSAL.
SO MY CONCERN IS THAT THIS PROPOSAL COMING IN HERE NOW, WHICH IS QUITE FRANKLY HORRIFYING TO ME, UM, IS, IS IS A BAIT AND SWITCH.
BECAUSE NOW WE'RE GONNA GO, WE'RE GONNA COME BACK TO THE BOARD AND WE'RE GONNA SAY, YOU KNOW, WE COULD GET YOU THAT LITTLE FARM COMMUNITY THAT WAS SO SWEET AND EVERYTHING ELSE, IF YOU'LL JUST CHANGE THE, THESE ZONING.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF, I, THAT'S KIND OF WHERE I'M THINKING WITH THIS.
BUT I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO RECOMMEND TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION THAT NOT ONLY DO WE DO THE COMMUNITY IMPACT STUDY, BUT WE ALSO DO A FEASIBILITY STUDY WHETHER SOMETHING LIKE THIS HAS A MARKET, BECAUSE THERE ARE 88 NURSING HOMES IN MONTGOMERY COUNTY.
LISA, LET ME JUST INTERRUPT YOU A SECOND.
WE DID DO THAT STUDY AND THEN WE'LL BE AT THE SUPERVISOR'S MEETING.
BECAUSE IT'S, THERE'S 88 NURSING HOMES IN MONTGOMERY COUNTY ALREADY, WHICH THE NEXT HIGHEST NUMBER I THINK IS IN PHILADELPHIA.
WE ARE BY AND THEN BUCKS COUNTY AT 52.
SO I, I, I THINK WE HAVE MORE THAN OUR SHARE OF NURSING FACILITIES.
WE HAVE THREE RIGHT HERE IN THE TOWNSHIP ON, JUST ON THE BAIT AND SWITCH POINT THAT YOU RAISED, UM, I WOULD POINT OUT THAT, UH, MOST OR ALL OF THE SUPERVISORS, NOT INCLUDING TOM, CUZ HE WASN'T ON YET, BUT I BELIEVE THEY ALL MADE STATEMENTS THAT THEY WOULD NOT CHANGE THE ORDINANCE THAT WAS MEANING CHANGE TO ACCOMMODATE THAT FIRST PLAN.
UM, I'VE HAD NUMEROUS CONVERSATIONS WITH THE APPLICANT AND I'LL ALWAYS CONTINUE TO LOOK FOR WAYS TO TRY TO MAKE THIS PLAN BETTER EVEN AFTER PRELIMINARY APPROVAL.
BUT, UM, TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE, IT'S NOT A CASE WHERE THEY'RE TRYING TO SAY, NOW THAT WE'VE SCARED YOU WITH THIS, NOW, WILL YOU CONSIDER GOING BACK TO THE OTHER, UM, THAT WE'VE, I CAN TELL YOU I ASKED THAT QUESTION MM-HMM.
[00:40:01]
WHEN IT'S ENGINEERED MM-HMM.THERE'D BE A LOT, THERE'D HAVE TO BE A LOT LESS LINES ON, BUT THE SUPERVISOR'S ALREADY COMMITTED TO NOT CHANGING, UM, THE ORDINANCE, WHICH WOULD BE, THAT WOULD HAVE TO HAPPEN TO GO BACK TO THAT OTHER PLAN.
AND BASED ON THE SUPERVISOR'S COMMENTS, I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.
UM, THE ONLY OTHER THING THAT I WOULD SAY IS THAT FOR ONCE I AGREE WITH THE COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION LETTER, UH, ABOUT THE EMS, UH, BEING PART OF THIS.
THESE ARE, IF THIS IS AN AGE RESTRICTED AGE, WHATEVER, WHATEVER WE'RE CALLING THIS CUZ IT'S NOT A, IT'S IT'S NOT A NURSING FACILITY.
SO WHATEVER WE'RE CALLING THIS, THIS IS GONNA BE A COMMUNITY OF ELDERLY PEOPLE, 1200 TO 2,400 ELDERLY PEOPLE TAKING UP OUR EMS SERVICES.
THEY SHOULD HAVE THEIR OWN DEDICATED EMS SERVICE.
I'M SORRY, WE JUST WENT THROUGH, UH, A TAX INCREASE TO PAY FOR 24 7 EMS AND FIRE IN THIS TOWNSHIP.
AND I DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR TO INCREASE OUR TOWNSHIP BY 10% SIMPLY TO ACCOMMODATE THIS DEVELOPMENT PLAN, WHICH BY THE WAY, OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN NEVER CONSIDERED THIS LAND TO BE DEVELOPED AT ALL.
SO THE, THE, THE PLANNING ASPECT OF THIS IN THE COMMUNITY IMPACT ASPECT OF THIS IS HUGE.
AND THAT'S REALLY ALL I HAVE TO SAY.
UM, APPARENTLY JEFF HAS STEPPED OUT, SO I'LL JUST TAKE THE NEXT PERSON WHO WANTS TO COME UP AND IDENTIFY THEMSELVES.
UM, I ACTUALLY, OKAY, WELL YEAH, WE'RE NOT, I DON'T THINK THAT'S ON THE AGENDA FOR TONIGHT.
THAT'S WHEN, UH, YOU PUBLIC NON, NON AGENDA ITEMS CERTAINLY IS.
WHERE'S IT AT? THAT'S, NO, THOSE ARE ACTIVE.
THOSE ARE, EXCUSE ME, THOSE ARE ACTIVE APPLICATIONS.
THE, THE AGENDA STOPS OR IT SAYS ADJOURNMENT.
EVERYTHING AFTER THAT IS THINGS THAT ARE ON OUR PLANNING BUT NOT ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION TONIGHT.
SO, SO AGAIN, ANY WHO'S NEXT? UH, LOOKS LIKE, UH, IS IT JAMES WARLOW? WHAT MARCO? SORRY, I CAN'T READ THE WRITING.
COULD I ASK A QUICK CLARIFICATION FROM THE APPLICANT WHILE THE, UM, YOU MENTIONED THE FEASIBILITY REPORT WOULD BE MADE AVAILABLE FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS? DOES THAT MEAN YOU'RE NOT PREPARED TO TALK ABOUT IT THIS EVENING? YES, WE COULD TALK ABOUT THIS EVENING.
UM, MICHAEL KJA 1 0 4 BENNINGTON ROAD.
I WAS CURIOUS ABOUT THESE IMPACT STUDIES THAT YOU GUYS REFERENCE.
ARE ALL THOSE COPYWRITTEN AS WELL? THE IS WHAT COPYWRITTEN OR PLAN IMPACT STUDIES? NOW THE, THE PLANS THAT WE RECEIVE ARE SOMETIMES COPYRIGHTED AND IT POSES, UM, A, IT POSES A DIFFICULTY FOR US BECAUSE TECHNICALLY UNDER THE COPYRIGHT LAW WE'RE THEN STUCK.
UM, WE CAN, WE CAN LET PEOPLE COME SEE IT, BUT WE CAN'T SEND IT OUT OR LET PEOPLE TAKE COPIES OF IT AWAY.
UM, BUT THE OTHER DOCUMENTS ARE NOT THAT ARE NOT THAT.
SO THEY ARE MADE OF PUBLIC, BUT WE HAVE TO COME AND PRIVATELY TO SEE THEM.
WELL, YEAH, WELL YOU HAVE TO SUBMIT, I BELIEVE THAT TOWNSHIP GENERALLY REQUIRES RIGHT TO NO REQUESTS FOR ALL DOCUMENTS JUST SO THEY CAN KEEP TRACK OF WHO ALL THEY'VE GIVEN THINGS TO.
I MEAN, YOU CAN COME TO THE WINDOW AND JUST ASK AND SAY, I'D LIKE TO SEE THIS DOCUMENT.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT CHERYL WOULD DO EITHER.
HAVE YOU FILLED OUT THE FORM RIGHT THERE, JUST EXPLAINING IT.
AND IF WE CAN PULL IT FOR YOU RIGHT AWAY, WE'D LOOK AT, WE'D GRAB IT FOR YOU.
I'M TALKING GENERALLY ABOUT ANYTHING.
WE'LL PULL IT FOR YOU AS FAST AS, AS BEST WE CAN.
WE DO HAVE A CERTAIN TIMEFRAME IF WE CAN'T GET TO THE DOCUMENTS RIGHT THERE DUE TO STAFFING OR WHATEVER ELSE.
BUT THIS APPLICATION HAS BEEN SITTING OUT THERE FOR A WHILE.
CAUSE WE KNEW PEOPLE WOULD BE THERE.
UM, AND QUESTION FOR YOU, MR. VALENCIA, YOU REFERENCED THAT THE, THE SINGLE LANE BRIDGE ON ONE 13 MIGHT BE INVOLVED AT THE GRANT FOR THE CUL-DE-SAC ROUNDABOUT THAT'S OCCURRING AT DR BUS SECOND AVENUE.
YEAH, SO DUE TO THE PROXIMITY OF THE LO SO IT'S, WE'RE STILL IN PRELIMINARY ENGINEERING, SO I DON'T THINK'S FINAL YET.
SO WE'RE STILL, UH, YOU KNOW, IN, IN THE DESIGN PROCESS, BUT IT'S ASSUMED AS PART OF OUR, UH, ROUNDABOUT, WHICHEVER, WHEREVER IT ENDS UP, HOWEVER IT LOOKS GEOMETRICALLY THAT THE, THE BRIDGE IS, UH, IS TO BE REPLACED AS PART OF THAT PROJECT.
UM, IN THE EVENT THAT BRIDGE IS COMPROMISED UNDER CONSTRUCTION, IN THEORY WE'D BE REROUTED TO ER ROAD OR OLD STATE ROAD.
THERE'S NO INFRASTRUCTURE THERE FOR STORMWATER MANAGEMENT.
THERE'S ALREADY CONSTANT FLOODING.
[00:45:01]
THERE'S GONNA BE QUITE THE IMPACT HERE ON THE LOAD.WHERE WILL THE REROUTE OCCUR THEN? WE, I MEAN WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN INTO THOSE.
I MEAN I CLEARLY, I UNDERSTAND THE CONCERN, UM, BUT PART OF THE PROCESS, I GUESS WITH THE BRIDGE WOULD INVOLVE DIALOGUE WITH THE DEPARTMENT SINCE THE PEN NOT OWNS THE BRIDGE, UH, WE CAN'T MAKE A CALL I GUESS OBVIOUSLY ON THEIR BRIDGE.
BUT THOSE CONCERNS WOULD BE VET THROUGH OUR ENGINEERING AND, YOU KNOW, THROUGH THE PROCESS WITH THE DEPARTMENT.
THOSE SORTS OF DISCUSSIONS WOULD, WOULD ENSUE AND WE WOULD, WE WOULD TRY TO FIGURE THAT OUT IF, IF THERE'S AN ISSUE.
I GUESS IT'S RAISED, UH, REGARDING THAT.
UM, PRIOR TO IT BEING PARKHOUSE KNOWN AS THE POOR HOUSE, UM, RUN BY THE QUAKERS AND MENNONITES, UM, THERE'S STRONG BELIEFS OF EXTENSIVE POTTERS FIELDS, WHICH ARE LARGE MASS GRAVE SITES.
HAS THERE BEEN ANY ULTRASOUND OR ZONING IMPERVIOUS CHECKS WHEN WHAT, WHAT WILL OCCUR IN THE EVENT? GO ON.
UM, REGARDING THE GRAVE SITES, THEY WILL ALL BE TREATED, UM, WITH RESPECT AND PROTECTED.
UM, WE WILL IDENTIFY WHERE THEY ARE.
WE UNDERSTAND FROM THE FORMER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION MEMBER, I DON'T THINK HE'S STILL THERE OR NOT.
MIKE STOKES, HE HAS SOME IDEA WHERE THEY ARE AND WE CERTAINLY WILL NOT DISTURB ANY GRAVES.
SO THEN IN RESPONSE TO THAT, IN THE EVENT THAT THERE IS A FOUNDATION BEING DUG, YOU PENETRATE A MASS BURIAL SITE, WHAT KIND OF REMEDIATION MODIFICATIONS, LOSS OF DWELLING UNITS WILL YOU THEN THOSE STUDIES WILL BE DONE BEFORE ANY FOUNDATION ARE DONE.
WILL THOSE BE MADE PUBLIC OR ARE THOSE GONNA BE COPYWRITTEN AS WELL? THAT THEY SHOULD ALL BE PART OF THE PLAN THAT WE'RE SUBMITTING TO THE TOWNSHIP SO ANYBODY CAN SEE 'EM.
UH, YOU MADE REFERENCE TO A MILLION DOLLAR IMPACT TO INFRASTRUCTURE.
A MILLION DOLLARS FOR INFRASTRUCTURE MODIFICATIONS REGARDING THIS PROPERTY IS PROBABLY ONE, 100TH OF THE IMPACT WHEN IT COMES TO STORMWATER MANAGEMENT.
THAT IS GROSSLY LACKING IN OLD STATE ROAD, SECOND AVENUE, THE INTERSECTION OF DRABBY BLACKROCK ONE 13.
WHAT KIND OF ADDITIONAL IMPACTS WILL YOU GUYS BE SUSTAINING YOURSELVES? THE TOWNSHIP ORDINANCE REQUIRES, AND WE WILL COMPLY WITH THE ORDINANCE THAT WE TAKE THE 50 YEAR STORM BEFORE DEVELOPMENT AND REDUCE IT TO A TWO YEAR STORM.
SO THERE WILL BE A VAST IMPROVEMENT IN THE ENTIRE AREA WHEN WE DEVELOP THE SITE.
THE, THE MILLION DOLLAR REFERENCE, I THINK WAS TO THE 2 0 9.
THE 2 0 9 THAT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH STORM WATER.
WELL, YEAH, BUT I THINK THAT'S ANOTHER QUESTION, A SEPARATE QUESTION.
BUT OLD STATE ROAD, THERE'S EXTENSIVE TRAFFICS THAT'S GONNA BE IMPACTED HERE.
I'VE NOT SEEN THE TRAFFIC IMPACT STUDY BY PENDOT.
I'M ASSUMING IT'S NOT BEEN MADE AVAILABLE PUBLIC AS WELL.
SO WE HAVE TO FILE A RIGHT TO KNOW TO ACQUIRE THAT.
NO TRAFFIC STUDY HASN'T BEEN SUBMITTED AT THIS POINT.
I DON'T, ONE HAS NOT OCCURRED YET, NO.
SO I'M ASSUMING ONE WILL BE OCCURRING BEFORE ANY FURTHER ADVANCEMENTS IN APPROVALS BEFORE PRELIMINARY APPROVAL.
UM, I LIVE RIGHT ON THE LEFT SIDE, UM, BUTTS RIGHT UP TO MY BACKYARD.
I'VE SEEN EXTENSIVE BALD EAGLES, BOGGED TURTLES.
BALD EAGLES ARE NO LONGER ON THE ENDANGERED SPECIES LIST BECAUSE OF DECADES OF PRESERVATION.
AND I GUESS RESPECT THOSE FLOOD PLAIN AREAS, OR, SORRY, UH, WETLANDS ARE HEAVILY SATURATED WITH BOG TURTLES AND THEY ARE ON THE ENDANGERED SPECIES LIST.
I'M HOPING THAT THE PROPER IMPACTS AND REVIEWS ARE WITHIN THE APPROPRIATE DISTANCES BECAUSE AGAIN, THEY ARE ON THE ENDANGERED SPECIES LIST AND FEDERAL LAWS PROTECT EVERYONE.
SO I HOPE THAT'S, WE'RE FULLY AWARE OF THE BOB TOTAL REQUIREMENTS AND WE'LL DO THE NECESSARY STUDIES.
AS A QUICK ASIDE, I DUCKED OUT WITH MR. NOON.
HIS QUESTIONS WERE ABOUT AMELIA STREET AND A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT APPLICATION.
WELL, WHEN YOU WERE AT, THIS LADY HERE IN FRONT WAS ON YOUR LIST, SHE ALSO HAD THE SAME A QUESTION ABOUT AMELIA STREET ALSO.
I'LL POKE MY HEAD OUT AGAIN RIGHT AFTER, UH, MR. FELTON COMES UP AND AS HE SPEAKS, UM, HE'S NEXT ON THE LIST, SO I'LL DUCK OUT TO MAKE SURE THEY DON'T HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS.
YEAH, THIS, THIS, THIS YOUNG LADY RIGHT HERE IN THE FRONT.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK.
I'LL TRY TO KEEP IT, UH, TO COMMENTS AND NOT QUESTIONS.
UH, I GUESS THE, THE, THE FIRST THING THAT, YOU KNOW, WHEN I LOOK AT THIS PLAN, I SEE A SINGLE FAMILY TOWNHOUSE APARTMENTS, RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT.
[00:50:02]
I MEAN, I DON'T SEE EVEN A RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY FOR SENIOR CITIZENS.I MEAN, THE TYPE OF STRUCTURE OR BUILDING THAT WOULD HOUSE THAT TYPE OF FACILITY.
I DON'T SEE IT BEING A SINGLE FAMILY DEVELOPED.
SO MY BIGGEST CONCERN WITH THIS PLAN IS THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACES THAT ARE BEING PROPOSED ON THIS PLAN.
I MEAN, EVEN IF THEY'RE CONSIDERING SOME SORT OF RESIDENTIAL, UH, UH, FACILITY TO HOUSE SENIORS ASSISTED LIVING.
THIS, TO ME, THIS IS, THIS WOULD BE INDEPENDENT LIVING.
I DON'T SEE HOW THAT COULD BE ASSISTED LIVING UNLESS THERE'S A, A NURSE LIVING IN EACH HOME.
UH, BUT, BUT SOME SORT OF DESIGN THAT WOULD REDUCE THE IMPACT ON THE LAND AND KEEP THE IMPERVIOUS TO A MINIMUM TO, YOU KNOW, CLUSTER THE BUILDINGS, MAKE THEM A TYPE OF STRUCTURE THAT WOULD ALLOW FOR MANY BEDS THAT YOU'RE LOOKING TO GET, BUT NOT, NOT THIS SUBURBAN SPRAWL TYPE DEVELOPMENT.
THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD BE MY, UM, FOLLOWING UP ON WHAT MR. UH, HI JACK HAD BROUGHT UP ABOUT, UH, THE GRAVES THAT MIGHT BE ON THIS SITE.
WOULD THE TOWNSHIP REQUIRE AN ARCHEOLOGY STUDY OF THIS LAND? BECAUSE I, I THINK IT'S NOT JUST THESE GRAVES THAT MIGHT BE HERE, BUT THE, THESE LANDS WERE INHABITED BY THE LEI INDIANS, YOU KNOW, WAY BEFORE THE EUROPEANS GOT HERE AND AROUND, NOT JUST THIS SITE, BUT A LOT OF THE SURROUNDING SITES.
THERE'S BEEN ARTIFACTS FOUND THAT INDICATE THAT THIS WAS A SETTLEMENT, NOT JUST A, UH, A HUNTING LAND OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
SO I WOULD SUGGEST THAT AN ARCHEOLOGY STUDY WOULD BE, UH, AN IMPORTANT THING TO DO.
UM, YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY TO DO SOME SORT OF DEVELOPMENT HERE THAT COULD IMPLEMENT, YOU KNOW, THE LATEST TECHNOLOGY WHEN IT COMES TO SUSTAIN SUSTAINABLE BUILDING, SUSTAINABLE DESIGN, UH, REDUCE THE, THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACE, YOU KNOW, ON, ON SURFACE PARKING LOTS HAVE GOTTA BE THE WORST THING WE COULD DO TO THIS LAND.
LET'S PUT ALL THE PARKING INSIDE THE, THE FOOTPRINT OF THE BUILDING.
LET'S, IF IT, IF IT'S FOR SENIORS, DO THEY EVEN NEED AUTOMOBILES? YOU KNOW, MAYBE THERE'S A, A SHARED A CAR SHARE PROGRAM AND THERE'S, UH, YOU KNOW, ELECTRIC VEHICLES INSIDE THE FOOTPRINT OF THE BUILDING FOR THE, THE SENIORS TO USE WHEN THEY DO WANT TO GO OUT.
AND THEN SOME SORT OF, UH, UH, SERVICE, YOU KNOW, TO TAKE THEM TO, UH, UH, UH, PROVIDENCE TOWN CENTER OR INTO PHOENIXVILLE OR WHEREVER THEY'D WANT TO GO.
LET'S, YOU KNOW, FROM A TRAFFIC STANDPOINT, LET'S DO WHAT WE CAN DO WITH THIS DEVELOPMENT TO MINIMIZE AND LIMIT THAT AS WELL.
SO I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION IS GONNA DO MOVING FORWARD.
UM, I, I WOULD HOPE TO SEE THERE MIGHT BE SOME SORT OF CITIZENS COMMITTEE THAT MIGHT GET INVOLVED.
I, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S OPENING A CAN OF WORMS, BUT CAN'T DO THAT.
UH, I THINK THERE'S SOME, SOME IDEAS THAT MIGHT BE HELPFUL THAT, THAT, UH, WE COULD MAKE THIS INTO A, UH, LEGACY DEVELOPMENT AND NOT, NOT WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT HERE.
SO NEXT ON THE LIST, UH, IS THAT DAVID TIMMY? WHAT WAS THAT LAST NAME? TENANT.
HE'S THE, UH, HE'S THE MODERATOR.
PLEASE MAKE SURE YOU'RE TALKING TO THE MIC.
YEAH, I I I THOUGHT THIS WAS MORE JUST SO I'LL BE A LITTLE BIT BRIEFER THAN, YOU KNOW, FOR ME, HIS PASSION'S STILL THERE.
UM, THOUGHT YOU WANTED TO HEAR FROM THE COMMUNITY 3 0 9 VISTA DRIVE.
WE COME OUT OF THAT BOTTLENECK THAT'S GONNA BE AFFECTED RIGHT, EVERY DAY.
ALL THAT DEVELOPMENT HAS BEEN POSITIVE.
BUT I GOTTA TELL YOU, I'M, I'M REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT THIS REPRESENTS.
UM, I SEE, I MEAN, WE'RE BURSTING AT THE SEAMS RIGHT NOW JUST TO GET OUT OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD.
JUST ALL THE STREETS AROUND US ARE MORE AND MORE DIFFICULT TO NAVIGATE.
AND THAT'S BEFORE ALL THOSE APARTMENTS UP AT WEGMANS ARE FILLED UP.
AND I SEE JUST HOW CRAZY THAT IS AT WHAT THAT ROUNDABOUT IS UP THERE.
AND TO THINK ABOUT HAVING TO COME
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OUTTA MY NEIGHBORHOOD INTO THAT SAME KIND OF AN ENVIRONMENT.I THINK THAT IS JUST HORRIBLE.
AND HAVE ANOTHER 2000 OR MORE CARS BE PART OF THAT WHOLE PROCESS IS JUST GONNA MAKE THINGS WORSE.
AND FOR ME TO HAVE THAT DISRUPTION OVER THE NEXT, HOWEVER LONG THIS DEVELOPMENT IS, IS GONNA MAKE OUR LIFE WORSE.
UM, THIS IS NOT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE COMMUNITY.
YOU, YOU REFERENCED, I THINK EARLIER, MR. BRE, ALL THE SIGNS THAT ARE OUT THERE, THE COMMUNITY'S BEEN VERY CLEAR IN TERMS OF WHAT WE THINK ABOUT WHAT SHOULD BE DONE HERE.
THIS IS THE ONLY PERSON'S GONNA BENEFIT IS AN OPPORTUNIST INVESTOR.
SO I WOULD REALLY JUST DO WHATEVER WE CAN TO NOT ALLOW THIS TO GO FORWARD.
THAT'S MY REQUEST FROM YOU AND I GUESS WILL HAVE THOSE SAME CONVERSATIONS AT THE SUPERVISOR LEVEL.
JUDY SHEETS ONE 17 OLD STATE ROAD.
UM, MY COMMENT, I AGREE WITH MOST EVERYBODY WHO HAS COME BEFORE ME, BUT MY COMMENT IS ABOUT THE HISTORY OF OUR TOWNSHIP.
UM, WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE ROOTED IN HISTORY, BUT, UM, I DON'T, THIS IS THE FIRST I'VE SEEN THIS PLAN AND TELL YOU THE TRUTH.
UM, I'M WONDERING IF THERE'S BEEN ANY CONSIDERATION TO THE HISTORIC ONE ROOM SCHOOLHOUSE THAT'S LOCATED ON ONE ON OLD STATE ROAD.
I HAVE A, A PICTURE OF IT, A POOR PICTURE OF IT, BUT, UH, MY FATHER ATTENDED THIS IN THE, UH, ON THE PROPERTY.
IS IT ON THE PROPERTY? YES, IT IS.
UM, I CAN'T SPEAK TO WHAT THEIR PLANS ARE, BUT THEY DO SHOW THE STRUCTURE ON THE BUILDING, ON THE, ON THE PLANS.
I CAN'T, I CAN'T TELL FOR THIS PLAN.
I CAN SHOW IT TO YOU AFTERWARDS IF YOU LIKE MS. SHEETS.
ARE THEY PRESERVING IT? I'M NOT SURE WHAT I ALL I, ALL I KNOW IS THAT IT IS ON THE PLANS.
I THINK THAT'S A QUESTION FOR MR. MULLEN.
THERE IS A CONNECTION, UH, WITH THIS BUILDING TO, UM, CHRISTIAN SANDERSON.
I DON'T KNOW, YOU'RE PROBABLY NOT FAMILIAR WITH IT.
I'M NOT REALLY TOO FAMILIAR WITH HIM EITHER.
HE WAS A TEACHER, A POET, A MUSICIAN, A COLLECTOR.
THERE WAS A MUSEUM OVER IN CHADS FORD, UH, OVER IN THAT AREA.
THEY'RE VERY MUCH AWARE OF HIM.
UH, HE, HIS FIRST TEACHING JOB WAS IN THIS BUILDING IN THE, IN THE 1920S.
UM, IT, WE WILL COMMIT TO DO OUR BEST TO KEEP THE BUILDING AND AT WORST CASE, MOVE IT INTACT SOMEWHERE ELSE ON THE SITE.
IT WOULD, IT WOULD BE NICE IF WE COULD USE THIS AS AN HISTORICAL BUILDING FOR ARTIFACTS OF A TOWNSHIP, YOU KNOW, IF THEY COULD SEE FIT TO, TO EITHER SELL OR DONATE AN ACRE OF PROPERTIES ALONG WITH THIS BUILDING.
YOU KNOW, WE CAN TALK TOWNSHIP'S USE, WE CAN TALK TO THEM ABOUT THAT BEFORE, YOU KNOW, AS THE STEPS PROCEED.
YOU HAVE NO, I SAID WE CAN THOUGH.
PAT CANNING ON THE 1515 ACRE ROAD.
I, MY MY COMMENT IS, I'M JUST A LITTLE SHOCKED AT THE, THE LACK OF INFORMATION WE GOT TONIGHT FROM THE APPLICANT.
AND I'D LIKE THE SECOND LEASES, UH, IDEA THAT I THINK WE NEED AN INDEPENDENT STUDY DONE BY THE TOWNSHIP INSTEAD OF MAYBE HAVING TO ACCEPT, UM, WHAT THEY GIVE US.
YOU WANNA SPEAK YOUR NAME, SIR.
UM, I'M, UH, I HAVE A, A POINT OF VIEW OF THIS PROPERTY IN A LARGER SCALE OF THINGS.
UM, I WAS LUCKY ENOUGH TO BE THE FIRST, UH,
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HERITAGE CARD OR MANAGER THAT LOOKED AT THE RIVER AND THE NATURAL RESOURCES, THE RECREATIONAL OPPORTUNITIES.UM, AND I SERVED TO MOVE THAT ALONG, UM, ALONG THE RIVER IN THAT POSITION.
I'VE ALSO BEEN FOR 33 YEARS, UM, A BOARD MEMBER OF THE PHOENIX IRON CANAL AND TRAIL ASSOCIATION, WHICH IS NOW KNOWN AS THE GREEN TEAM IN PHOENIXVILLE.
AND, UH, WE HAVE PRETTY MUCH FINISHED THE GREENWAY IN PHOENIXVILLE THROUGH GOOD PLANNING AND, UM, AN UNDERSTANDING OF HOW THESE WATERWAYS ARE INCREDIBLE ASSETS IN THE COMMUNITY AND THAT THE LANDS SURROUNDING THEM AND THE VIEW SHEDS ARE SO IMPORTANT.
UM, SO I'VE BEEN INVOLVED WITH THE CANAL ASSOCIATION, SO I HAVE, UM, A VERY DEEP APPRECIATION AND UNDERSTANDING OF THESE OPEN SPACES.
UM, AND AS A OWNER OF PROPERTY AND THE TOWNSHIP, I KNOW THAT, UM, WE'RE DOING PRETTY GOOD.
SO WHEN YOU'RE DOING PRETTY GOOD, YOU NEED TO START THINKING ABOUT THE FUTURE BECAUSE THERE'S MORE PEOPLE IN THE FUTURE THAN THERE ARE TODAY OR HAVE EVER BEEN.
THERE ARE GONNA BE MORE PEOPLE THAT YOUR DECISION EFFECTS THAN IN THIS ROOM THAT ARE ALIVE IN