[00:00:06]
[CALL TO ORDER]
GOOD EVENING.I'M CALLING TO ORDER OUR, UH, UPPER PROVIDENCE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING FOR WEDNESDAY, DECEMBER 7TH, 2022.
AND, UH, SO THIS IS CALLED ORDER FIRST, UH, UH, PIECE OF BUSINESS WILL BE ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS ON NON AGENDA ITEMS. THESE ARE NON AGENDA ITEMS. EVERYBODY, HOPEFULLY YOU GOT A COPY OF THE AGENDA.
THESE WOULD BE NON AGENDA ITEMS. ANYTHING, ANY COMMENTS? OKAY.
UM, AGAIN, JEFF, YOU WANT TO ASK, JEFF HAS A SIGNUP SHEET OVER HERE.
IF ANYBODY WANTS TO MAKE COMMENTS ON TONIGHT'S AGENDA, WE'D ASK YOU TO SIGN IN SO THAT WE CAN, UH, YOU KNOW, MOVE IT ALONG VERY QUICKLY AND KEEP IT MOVING SMOOTHLY.
UM, AND, UH, SO IF YOU'D LIKE TO MAKE A COMMENT, WE'D JUST ASK YOU TO SIGN UP, BUT YOU CAN STILL MAKE COMMENTS IF YOU DON'T SIGN UP.
BUT WE'RE STILL GONNA ASK FOR YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS WHEN YOU DO COME UP.
UM, WE'RE GONNA KEEP, TRY TO KEEP IT TO TWO, TWO AND A HALF MINUTES PER PERSON SO THAT EVERYBODY GETS A CHANCE TO COMMENT THAT WANTS TO MAKE A COMMENT.
UM, WE'RE GONNA HERE TO LISTEN TONIGHT.
WE'RE HERE TO GET SOME FACTS AND, UH, WE APPRECIATE EVERYBODY IF THEY WOULD KEEP IT, UH, ON THE UPPER SIDE OF CIVILITY IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, WE WON'T ACCEPT ANY KIND OF, UH, FALSE COMMENTS OR ACCUSATIONS OR THINGS THAT DON'T REALLY PERTAIN TO THE, TO THE ACTUAL, UH, APPLICATION.
SO PLEASE, LET'S KEEP IT THAT WAY.
UM, WE APPRECIATE EVERYBODY BEING HERE.
AND, UH, FROM THAT, WE'LL GET STARTED WITH THE AGENDA.
[GENERAL DISCUSSION ITEMS]
SO THE FIRST THINGS WE GOT, UH, WE HAVE TO APPROVE THE MINUTES FROM NOVEMBER 2ND, 2022, AND NOVEMBER 16TH, 2022.SO WITH THAT, UM, I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO EITHER DISCUSSION, FURTHER DISCUSSIONS, OR A MOTION TO APPROVE.
UH, JEFF, CAN WE DO BOTH AT ONCE? SURE.
YOU CAN DO BOTH AT ONCE, RIGHT? WELL, I'LL ACCEPT BOTH AT ONCE, RIGHT? BOB'S MADE A MOTION TO ACCEPT THE MINUTES FROM, UH, THE SECOND AND THE 16TH.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS ABOUT THE MINUTES? OKAY.
SO MINUTES HAVE BEEN APPROVED.
THE NEXT THING ON THE AGENDA IS A GRANT LETTER FOR THE GREENWOOD AVENUE.
AND IF YOU LOOK IN YOUR PACKET, YOU'LL SEE THAT'S IN THERE AND WE HAVE TO VOTE THAT WE'RE AFFIRMATIVE ON THAT, RIGHT, JEFF? THAT EVERYTHING'S COOL? YEAH, I, I'LL GIVE JANET, CAN YOU APPROVE IT IF, IF JEN COULD DESCRIBE IT REAL QUICK? SURE.
THE LETTER JUST STATES THAT IT COMPLIES WITH YOUR CURRENT PLANNING.
IT DOES STATE WITH OUR CURRENT PLAN, YES.
WE'RE LOOKING TO GET A GRANT FOR SEWER ALONG GREENWOOD AVENUE.
SO, UH, IF YOU HEARD JEN APPLIES, SO, UH, IF EVERYBODY'S OKAY WITH THAT, WE'LL TAKE A, UH, WE'LL TAKE A MOTION TO, UH, APPROVE THAT.
UM, THOSE, UH, THAT FIRST, UH, GRANT LETTER.
I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.
KELLY'S MADE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE GRANT LETTER FOR GREENWOOD AVENUE.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS? BOB'S MADE A SECOND.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS ON THAT LETTER? ALL IN FAVOR? AYE.
SO WE MOVED ON TO THE SECOND THING WE HAVE TO, UH, PROVE TONIGHT.
AND THAT WOULD BE, UH, AGAIN, A PLANNING MODULE FOR 1 24 YOKI ROAD, YOKI STATION, WHICH WE'VE, UH, WE'VE, UH, HAD ON OUR AGENDA MANY TIMES OVER THE LAST COUPLE YEARS.
AND SO CAN YOU EXPLAIN EXACTLY WHAT THAT IS, JEFF? SURE.
IT'S, IT'S JUST A LETTER OR A NOTIFICATION DEP ENVIRONMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION THAT WE'RE AWARE OF THE PROJECT, THAT IT COMPLIES WITH OUR CURRENT ZONING, AND THAT, UM, THEY CAN MOVE FORWARD, DETERMINE IF A PLANNING MODULE, WHICH IS THE SEWAGE TREATMENT THAT IT WOULD GENERATE, UM, THAT, THAT IS ACCEPTABLE TO THE TOWNSHIP.
WE'VE HAD GILMORE LOOK AT THE PLAN, LOOK AT THE, LOOK AT ALL THE INFORMATION, AND, AND THEY'RE COMFORTABLE WITH IT.
WE JUST NEED A PLANNING COMMISSION SIGNATURE.
AND, UH, JEFF, UH, ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT FROM ANY BOARD MEMBERS? ALL RIGHT.
SO I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THAT LETTER GOING OUT TO, UH, TO THE GUY FOR THE EPA.
BOB'S MADE A MOTION TO APPROVE THIS LETTER WE'LL BE SENDING OUT FOR THE UPPER PROVIDENCE, UH, GREENWOOD AVENUE CEMETERY.
SO, EXTENSION PROJECT, I'LL TAKE
[00:05:01]
A SECOND.UH, ANY OTHER COMMENTS? ALL IN FAVOR? AYE.
OKAY, SO THAT'S PASSED ALSO, JEFF.
[APPLICATIONS TO BE HEARD ON DECEMBER 7, 2022]
MOVE ON TO THE APPLICATION.THIS IS, UM, THIS IS THE PARK HOUSE RESIDENTIAL CARE COMMUNITY FOR SENIOR CITIZEN, AND WE'RE ANXIOUS TO HEAR ALL ABOUT THIS.
MR. MULLEN, ARE YOU GONNA BE THE SPEAKER TO START? YES, SIR.
UH, CAN YOU HEAR ME? YEP, WE CAN HEAR YOU.
AND BEFORE YOU DO ED, I'M SORRY, I WANTED TO, WE, WE HAD AGREED I WAS GONNA MAKE A COUPLE OPENING, UH, COMMENTS TO CLARIFY BEFORE YOU MAKE THE PRESENTATION.
I MEANT TO TURN IT OVER TO, I FORGOT.
ALWAYS WAIT FOR THE SOLICITOR.
UM, AND I WANTED TO MAKE SOME COMMENTS ABOUT THE BACKGROUND HERE BECAUSE I THINK IT WOULD BE HELPFUL IN TERMS OF DIRECTING WHATEVER COMMENTS ARE GOING TO BE MADE, UM, THIS EVENING.
UH, A PROPERTY CAN BE ZONED FOR MORE THAN ONE USE, AND THIS PROPERTY IS ZONED FOR MORE THAN ONE USE ON THE ZONING MAP.
IT'S ZONED AS OPEN SPACE, BUT ALSO UNDER THE ZONING ORDINANCE, IT MEETS THE CRITERIA FOR AN INSTITUTIONAL USE.
JEFF, DO YOU HAVE THAT AVAILABLE? UH, THE ZONING MAP, NO, I CAN GET THAT PART.
THE, THE ORDINANCE LANGUAGE THAT WE HAD, UH, I THINK IT WAS NUMBER FOUR.
SO YOU SEE THERE AS A PERMITTED CONDITIONAL USE AS A LICENSED NURSING CONVALESCENT RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY.
THAT LANGUAGE HAS BEEN IN PLACE FOR MANY YEARS.
UM, THAT LANGUAGE GOES BACK TO BEFORE THE COUNTY EVER SOLD THE PROPERTY.
IT WAS NEVER CHANGED BY THIS BOARD OF SUPERVISORS OR THE PREVIOUS BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, OR THE ONE BEFORE THAT.
IT'S BEEN IN PLACE A LONG TIME.
WHEN THE APPLICANT CAME HERE A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO, I GUESS IT WAS TWO NOW, UM, AND THEY ASKED WHETHER THE TOWNSHIP WAS INTERESTED IN MAKING ANY ZONING CHANGES TO FACILITATE THE PLAN THAT THEY WERE THEN CONSIDERING.
THEY DID NOT MEAN WILL YOU CHANGE IT FROM OPEN SPACE TO INSTITUTIONAL.
INSTITUTIONAL WAS ALREADY ALLOWED ON THE PROPERTY.
WHAT THEY WERE ASKING WAS, WILL YOU CHANGE SOME OF THE CRITERIA IN THAT INSTITUTIONAL ORDINANCE TO FACILITATE OUR PLAN? AND OF COURSE, THAT THAT DIDN'T HAPPEN.
AND THEN THERE BECAME SORT OF A PUBLIC CRY, UM, AND A LOT OF SIGNS ON, ON YARDS THAT SAID, NO ZONING CHANGES FOR PARKHOUSE.
AND THE REASON WHY I'M MAKING THESE PRELIMINARY COMMENTS IS THAT I THINK IN THAT PROCESS, AN IMPORTANT DETAIL WAS LOST.
I THINK I KNOW FROM PHONE CALLS I GOT, UM, AND CONVERSATIONS I HAD AT WEGMANS OR WHEREVER, I'M ALSO A TOWNSHIP RESIDENT THAT, THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE THOUGHT WHEN THEY PUT UP A SIGN THAT SAID, NO, NO ZONING CHANGE, THAT THEY MEANT DON'T CHANGE IT FROM OPEN SPACE TO SOMETHING ELSE THAT WOULD ALLOW THIS PROJECT.
AND THAT WAS ALREADY ON THE BOOKS.
IT IT, THERE IS NO, SO, SO WHAT HAPPENED WAS, WHEN THEY CAME BACK NOW WITH THIS PLAN, THEY SAID, OKAY, WE HAD A PRIOR PLAN THAT REQUIRED SOME CHANGES TO THE ZONING ORDINANCE AND YOU DIDN'T WANNA MAKE THOSE.
WE'RE NOW HERE ON A PLAN THAT DOESN'T REQUIRE AN ORDINANCE CHANGE.
SO NOBODY'S ASKING FOR AN ORDINANCE CHANGE ANYMORE.
THE, THE ONLY ORDINANCE CHANGE WAS TO MAKE TWEAKS ON THE, ON HOW THE ACTUAL PLAN LOOKED.
IT WAS NEVER ABOUT LETTING INSTITUTIONAL USE IN FOR THE FIRST TIME.
AND I THINK THERE WAS SOME CONFUSION ABOUT THAT.
SO IF ANYBODY IS HERE, I'M BRINGING IT UP IN CASE ANYBODY WAS THINKING OF SAYING, PLEASE DON'T CHANGE IT FROM OPEN SPACE TO INSTITUTIONAL, IT'S ALREADY ZONED FOR INSTITUTIONAL.
UM, THE NOW THE PROCESS THAT WE'RE HERE ON, JUST SO THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS, IS THERE'S TWO THINGS THAT ARE PENDING.
ONE IS A TENTATIVE SKETCH APPLICATION.
SO WHEN YOU DEVELOP LAND, YOU SUBMIT FIRST TENTATIVE, THEN PRELIMINARY, THEN FINAL.
SO THERE'S THREE SEPARATE STEPS IN THE LAND DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.
AND WE'RE ONLY AT THE FIRST ONE AT THE SAME TIME.
THEY'RE ASKING FOR THE CONDITIONAL USE APPROVAL.
SEE THAT, THAT THE USES BY CONDITIONAL USE IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE, THERE ARE USES THAT ARE PERMITTED, THERE ARE USES THAT ARE NOT PERMITTED.
AND IN BETWEEN THERE ARE CONDITIONAL USES.
THOSE ARE PERMITTED USES, BUT THEY REQUIRE THE PROOF OF ADDITIONAL CRITERIA.
THEY'RE NOT JUST AUTOMATICALLY ALLOWED.
THEY'RE ALLOWED IF YOU PROVE SOME ADDITIONAL THINGS.
AND SO THE CRITERIA THERE, WELL, THERE'S, THERE'S THAT PAGE, AND THEN THERE'S ANOTHER PAGE, AND YET ANOTHER ONE BEYOND THAT THAT SETS FORTH SOME CRITERIA THAT THEY HAVE TO PROVE TO GET CONDITIONAL USE APPROVAL.
AND THAT IS A SEPARATE THING FROM THE TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN.
[00:10:01]
APPROVAL IS A FORMAL HEARING UNDER THE ZONING ORDINANCE.WE'LL HAVE A COURT'S STENOGRAPHER HERE AT A LATER DATE, UM, FOR THEM TO PRESENT THEIR CONDITIONAL USE APPLICATION, WHICH MEANS PROVING THAT THEY MEET THE CRITERIA IN THE ORDINANCE.
UM, AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION UNDER THE LAW MAKES A RECOMMENDATION TO THE SUPERVISORS ON THAT HEARING.
AND THEN SEPARATELY, THE TENTATIVE SKETCH PLAN IS PENDING, UM, WHICH IS THE FIRST STEP OF THREE IN THE ACTUAL LAND DEVELOPMENT, UH, PROCESS.
UM, THERE ARE, AGAIN, THERE ARE NO REQUESTS TO CHANGE AN ORDINANCE.
THERE ARE THERE, THERE'S NO CHALLENGE TO A CURRENT EXISTING ORDINANCE.
THIS REQUEST IS WITHIN THE CONFINES OF THE EXISTING ORDINANCE.
SO WITH THAT AS, UM, AND, AND TO FOLLOW UP ON WHAT TOM SAID, EVERYONE HERE WILL GET A CHANCE TO SPEAK.
UM, WE'VE DECIDED TO GO TILL 10 TONIGHT.
AND IF 10 DOESN'T DO THE JOB AND THERE'S MORE, AND THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO HAVE NOT BEEN HEARD, WE'VE ALREADY PLANNED ON COMING OUT FOR ANOTHER NIGHT AND ANOTHER NIGHT AFTER THAT, IF THAT'S WHAT IT TAKES, NOBODY WILL BE DENIED THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE PUBLIC COMMENT IF THEY WISH TO DO SO.
UM, SOMETIMES WHEN WE HAVE LARGE CROWDS, WHAT WE DO ASK IS IF, IF SOMEONE SAYS SOMETHING JUST THE WAY THAT YOU WOULD'VE SAID IT, THAT BY SHOW OF HANDS, YOU CAN SORT OF INDICATE THAT YOU SUPPORT WHAT THAT PERSON SAID IN LIEU OF, YOU KNOW, HAVING YOUR OWN SEPARATE TIME.
BUT YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY ENTITLED TO YOUR OWN TIME.
EVERYBODY WHO'S HERE AND EVERYBODY WHO SHOWS UP LATER.
SO WITH THAT BACKGROUND IN, THANK YOU FOR WAITING MR. MULLEN.
UH, I APOLOGIZE FOR MISSING YOU.
THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT'S VERY HELPFUL.
WE ALL FIND THAT HELPFUL INFORMATION THAT, UH, UH, MR. BRELIN JUST, JUST PRESENTED, SO PLEASE KEEP THAT IN MIND AS WE HEAR WHAT'S GOING ON HERE TONIGHT.
UH, FOR THE RECORD, I'M ED MULLEN BERG RUBIN MULLEN, MAXWELL LUPIN.
I'M HERE REPRESENTING WARRIORS FORD HOLDINGS, LLC.
THE OWNERS OF ATTRACTIVE GROUND CONSIST OF APPROXIMATELY 182 ACRES LOCATED ON ROUTE ONE 13 BETWEEN SECOND AVENUE, OLD STATE ROAD AND YE ROAD BEFORE YOU TONIGHT, AS JOE INDICATED, IS THE TENTATIVE OF SKETCH PLAN FOR RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY, ALONG WITH A REQUEST FOR CONDITIONAL USE FOR THE RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY, WHICH WE CONSIST OF A MIXTURE OF SINGLE FAMILY DETACHED DWELLINGS, TOWN HOMES, MULTI-FAMILY UNITS THAT WOULD BE SOLD AS CONDOMINIUMS AND APARTMENTS FOR A TOTAL OF 1,203 DWELLING UNITS.
ALL OF THESE UNITS WOULD BE, UH, AGE RESTRICTED TO 62 AND UP.
THE PROPOSAL IS FOR A RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY FOR SENIOR CITIZENS.
THAT IS A PERMITTED USE IN THE IN INSTITUTIONAL DISTRICT.
AS MR. BRN SAID, THE PLAN IS A BY RIGHT PLAN.
WE DO NOT NEED ANY REZONING, UH, IN ORDER TO PROCESS THIS PLAN.
THE RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY IS DEFINED IN YOUR ZONING ORDINANCE AS A FACILITY CONSISTING OF INDIVIDUAL RESIDENTIAL LIVING UNITS EXCLUSIVELY FOR PERSONS WHO ARE 62 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER.
AND FOR MARRIED COUPLES WITH ONE SPOUSE OR BOTH SPOUSES AGE 62 OR OLDER.
SUCH FACILITY MAY PROVIDE PERSONAL CARE AND HEALTHCARE SERVICES, INCLUDING RESIDENT NURSING BEDS AND NURSING CARE FOR THE LIVING UNITS.
WE DON'T PROPOSE ANY NURSING BECAUSE OF THE PROXIMITY OF PARKHOUSE NURSING AND REHABILITATION CENTER, BUT WE WILL BE PROVIDING 45 ASSISTED LIVING UNITS, WHICH IS 90 BEDS.
WITH ME TONIGHT ARE GARY BERMAN, A MEMBER OF WARRIOR FOR HOLDINGS, LLC, MATT HAMMOND, TRAFFIC ENGINEER FROM T P D, RON CLO, CIVIL ENGINEER FROM BOWLER ENGINEERING, BOB HOYER, PLANNER FROM HOER DESIGN.
ERIC HETZEL OF VH CREATIVE SERVICES LLC, WHO CAN DISCUSS THE COMMUNITY IMPACT OF THE PROPOSAL.
AND BRAD CLASSON OF W BRADFORD CLASSON AND ASSOCIATES WHO CAN DEAL WITH MARKET RESEARCH.
WE RECEIVE REVIEW LETTERS FROM GILMORE ASSOCIATES DATED JUNE 29TH, 2022, GRACE PLANNING ASSOCIATES, SEPTEMBER 27TH, 2022.
THE TOWNSHIP FIRE MARSHAL DATED OCTOBER 6TH, 2022.
MCMAHON ASSOCIATES DATED JUNE 24TH, 2022, AND MONTGOMERY COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION DATED SEPTEMBER 23RD, 2022.
WE HAVE REVIEWED ALL OF THOSE REVIEW LETTERS AND WE'LL ADDRESS ALL OF THEM.
UH, THE TOWNSHIP THAT YOU PROBABLY KNOW RECENTLY RECEIVED A CFA GRANT IN THE AMOUNT OF $249,000 FOR DESIGN WORK OF A ROUNDABOUT AT THE INTERSECT OF DRIV BUS ROAD, ROUTE ONE 13 AND SECOND AVENUE.
ADDITIONALLY, KEEP IN MIND THAT OUR PROPOSAL WILL GENERATE APPROXIMATELY 1 MILLION IN TRAFFIC IMPACT
[00:15:01]
FEES.FURTHER, BECAUSE WE HAVE STATE ROADS INVOLVED, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO GET PENDOT INVOLVED IN THIS PROCESS.
I SHOULD MENTION THAT WE DO HAVE SOME ISSUES WITH THE COUNTY PLANNING, UH, LETTER, UH, WHEREAS WE REALLY DON'T WITH THE OTHERS.
BUT THE COUNTY PLANNING LETTER GOES ON AND TALKS ABOUT A LOT OF THINGS WITH NO CITATION AUTHORITY, NO ORDINANCE CITATION, AND SAYS THAT WE SHOULD HAVE A, UM, WE SHOULD END UP GETTING AN EMERGENCY MEDICAL SERVICES FACILITY AT OUR LOCATION TO SERVE THE PEOPLE THAT WILL BE LIVING THERE.
OBVIOUSLY, THEY'RE NOT AWARE THAT RIGHT ACROSS THE STREET, LESS THAN ONE MILE FROM OUR LOCATION, THERE IS EXACTLY THAT, UH, FRIENDSHIP, AMBULANCE AND LOCAL FIREMEN THAT WILL BE AVAILABLE FOR THOSE EMS SERVICES.
UH, AT THE CONDITIONAL USE HEARING, WE WILL BE REQUIRED TO DEMONSTRATE THAT WE CAN COMPLY WITH SECTION 180 2, 1 99 B OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
UH, GENERICALLY I CAN STATE THAT WE WILL NOT ADVERSELY AFFECT PUBLIC INTEREST.
THE PROPOSED DEVELOP WILL COMPLY WITH THE LETTER OF INTENT OF THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
PUBLIC HEALTH, SAFETY AND WELFARE WILL BE PROTECTED THROUGH PROPER INGRESS AND EGRESS, OFF STREET PARKING AND LOADING AREAS, NO NOISE, GLARE OR ODOR EFFECTS ON ADJOINING PROPERTIES.
WE WILL PROPERLY INSTALL REFUGE AND SERVICE AREAS AND PROVIDE ALL UTILITY SCREENING AND BUFFERING AS REQUIRED BY THE ORDINANCE.
WE'LL COMPLY WITH A SIGN ORDINANCE, PROVIDE REQUIRED YARDS AND OPEN SPACES, AND IT WILL GENERALLY BE COMPATIBLE WITH ADJACENT PROPERTIES.
I SHOULD MENTION THAT THE COUNTY ALSO POINTED OUT THAT, UH, THE PROPOSAL IS NOT IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE TOWNSHIP'S 2010 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, WHICH BY THE WAY, IS IN THE PROCESS OF BEING REVISED.
HOWEVER, IF YOU GO TO PAGE 93 OF THE 2010 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, YOU WILL SEE LANGUAGE IN THERE THAT IF THE COUNTY EVER DECIDES TO SELL THE PROPERTY, WHICH WHEN THIS WAS DONE IN 2010, THIS COUNTY STILL OWNED, THAT, UM, RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT WOULD BE THE APPROPRIATE INFILL IF THE COUNTY SOLD.
AND WE SHOULD PRESERVE OPEN SPACE TO THE EXTENT POSSIBLE.
UH, SO CONSIDER THE FACT THAT OUR PROPOSAL IS 8.46 DWELLING UNITS PER ACRE PERMITTED BY THE ORDINANCE IS 12 UNITS PER ACRE.
SO WE'RE ROUGHLY AT 70% OF THE PERMITTED DENSITY.
AND IN ADDITION, THE INN DISTRICT REQUIRES A 50% OPEN SPACE.
SO HALF OF OUR SITE WILL BE OPEN SPACE, AND THAT'S PRESERVING OPEN SPACE IN MY OPINION.
ALSO AS MR. BRENO, SECTION 3 0 3 C OF THE MUNICIPALS PLANNING CODE CODE CLEARLY INDICATES THAT WHEN ZONING IS DIFFERENT FROM THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THE ZONING MUST BE FOLLOWED, NOT THE PLAN.
UM, THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE HERE WHO OBVIOUSLY WANNA BE HEARD, AND SO I'M GONNA STOP TALKING AND GIVE EVERYBODY A CHANCE, INCLUDING THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO ASK QUESTIONS OR TELL US WHAT YOU THINK.
SO, UH, COMMISSION MEMBERS, DO ANY OF YOU HAVE ANY PRELIMINARY QUESTIONS AFTER MR. MULLIN'S STATEMENTS OR DO YOU WANT TO GO RIGHT TO THE PUBLIC COMMENT? YOU GO INTO PUBLIC COMMENT.
UM, JEFF GENERALLY OVERSEES THAT.
I THINK WHAT, YOU HAVE THE LIST OVER THERE.
THE LAST WE SPOKE OF THIS DEVELOPMENT AND THE ZONING, THERE WERE MANY REQUIREMENTS FOR IMPERVIOUS AREAS.
DOES THIS PLAN MEET THE, UH, PERCENTAGE OF LAND USE THAT WOULD BE IMPERVIOUS? THE OTHER THING WAS THERE ARE SETBACKS THAT WERE CONSIDERABLE FROM THE BOUNDARY EDGES.
DOES THIS PLAN MEET ALL OF THOSE SETBACKS, WHICH WERE INCLUDED IN OUR ZONING PLAN? THOSE ARE, UM, I GUESS JEN THAT WOULD BE CLOSEST TO YOU.
WE HAVE, JUST SO YOU PEOPLE UNDERSTAND, WHEN, WHEN, WHEN THE TOWNSHIP GETS A, AN APPLICATION TO DEVELOP LAND, IT GETS SENT OUT TO VARIOUS CONSULTANTS.
AND WE HAVE UP HERE ON THE, ON THE DAAS, WE HAVE OUR TRAFFIC CONSULTANT IN ANTHONY AND IN JEN, WE HAVE OUR GENERAL CIVIL ENGINEER.
THEY EACH ISSUE REVIEW LETTERS AT EACH STEP, AND THEN IT'S A PROCESS WHERE, AND INCLUDING IMPERVIOUS AND SETBACKS, UH, WELL KNOWS IT WOULD BE JEN JEN'S OFFICE.
AND THEN SHE DOES A REVIEW LETTER THAT ADDRESSES EACH OF THOSE ISSUES.
SO NORMALLY WHAT HAPPENS IN THIS PROCESS, EVERY, EVERY MONTH, ACTUALLY WITH A MUCH SMALLER CROWD HERE ON OTHER APPLICATIONS, UM, IT'S A PROCESS OF US SAYING TO THE
[00:20:01]
PERSON SITTING THERE, YOU SAW OUR ENGINEER'S LETTER, CAN YOU COMPLY WITH EACH OF THESE REQUIREMENTS? THEN THEY SAY, YES, YOU KNOW, WE DO COMPLY IN THIS CASE.JEN, I, I THINK IMPERVIOUS IS.
AND YOU MIGHT HAVE HAD A SETBACK REFERENCE IN YOUR LETTER FROM WHEN I LOOKED AT IT TODAY.
THE PLAN CURRENTLY SHOWN IS ADEQUATE AND SATISFIES THE ORDINANCE AND ANY FURTHER CHANGES, WE JUST ASKED THEM TO VERIFY IT ON THE NEXT PLAN SUBMISSION.
AND WITH THE IMPERVIOUS AREAS ALSO INCLUDED THE IMPERVIOUS AREA.
SETBACKS AND IMPERVIOUS AND STORMWATER MANAGEMENT.
YOU STATE YOUR ADDRESS FOR US TOO.
VICTORIA BRIGHT, 360 4 VISTA DRIVE.
AND THANK YOU, UH, FOR HOSTING THIS.
IT'S BEEN, UH, TWO YEARS IN THE MAKING APPARENTLY.
SO, UH, AND I APOLOGIZE BECAUSE I JUST DOWNLOADED THE PACKET TODAY OFF OF THE TOWNSHIP'S WEBSITE TO SHOW THAT THERE WAS AN AGENDA.
WE KNEW THAT, THAT THE MEETING WAS HAPPENING, BUT WE DIDN'T ACTUALLY HAVE THE INFORMATION OF THE PACKET.
SO I'VE LITERALLY HAD ABOUT AN HOUR OR SO, YOU KNOW, BETWEEN WORK AND DINNER TO REVIEW IT.
SO I'M SURE THAT OTHER PEOPLE HAVE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO, MA'AM, IF I MAY, IF I MAY FOR A SECOND.
THE AGENDA WENT OUT LAST WEEK.
IT WAS POSTED AS OF LAST WEEK, AS OF LAST WEDNESDAY, AND THE PACKET MAYBE THURSDAY, THE, I'M NOT SURE WHAT HAPPENED, BUT THE PACKET IS COPYRIGHT PROTECTED AND SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN PUT ON THE WEBSITE TO BEGIN WITH.
I'M NOT SURE HOW THAT GOT THERE.
SO, BUT THE, THE, THE PLANS IN THERE ARE COPYRIGHT PROTECTED, SO I SHOULD NOT, I CAN BE HELD LIABLE FOR PUTTING THOSE PLANS OUT THERE.
THEY SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN DISTRIBUTED.
ALL OF THE INFORMATION THAT'S IN THE PACKET IS, IS WORTHY FOR DISCUSSION THOUGH.
I THINK THAT'S WHAT I'M, THAT'S WHY I'M HERE TO PRESENT CUZ WHAT I LOOKED AT WAS INFORMATION THAT I'D LIKE TO GATHER MORE INFORMATION ABOUT, UM, WITH THAT'S WITHIN THE PACKET.
CERTAINLY THE, THE, UH, INFORMATION HAVING BEEN PRESENTED MAY 23RD, 2022 TO THE TOWNSHIP.
NOW WE'RE JUST GETTING THE INFORMATION.
SO THE APPLICATION IS MAY 23RD, 2022.
AND IT'S BEEN ON THE AGENDA LISTED AS AN ACTIVE ITEM SINCE MAY 20, 23, 20 22.
SO, AND AS I'VE STATED IN MANY MEETINGS, YOU, YOU, YOU COULD ALWAYS COME AND LOOK AT A RIGHT TO KNOW REQUEST.
WE'VE HAD NUMEROUS PEOPLE DO THAT.
IT'S BEEN SITTING AT THE COUNTER WAITING FOR PEOPLE TO, TO LOOK AT THE PACKET.
WELL THAT'S, THAT'S GOOD TO KNOW THAT THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO HAVE IT ALSO ON THE AGENDA IN THE FUTURE.
UM, SO ONE QUESTION THAT I HAD WAS, CUZ I WAS TRYING TO DO THE COUNT HERE THAT THE APPLICATION FOR THE REQUEST FOR THE COUNTY REVIEW THAT'S ON PAGE 19 REFERENCED THAT THERE ARE APPROXIMATELY 185 ACRES BEING CONSIDERED.
UM, 142 ACRES WOULD BE IMPACTED.
THAT LEAVES I GUESS ABOUT 40 SOME ACRES THAT ARE GONNA BE CONSIDERED OPEN SPACE.
WE'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GONNA DO WITH THAT OPEN SPACE.
UM, SO THAT'S THE FIRST QUESTION.
I HAVE A, I HAVE A LIST OF QUESTIONS, SO WELL KEEP, KEEP PLEASE KEEP BYPASS PAST THE TWO MINUTES.
WELL, WE ARE GOING TO TRY TO STICK TO, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THREE THIS, THERE'S SOMETHING ELSE THAT I SHOULD HAVE SAID AT THE BEGINNING.
THIS IS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR PEOPLE TO OFFER PUBLIC COMMENT AND OPINION UNDER THE SUNSHINE LAW.
IT ACTUALLY IS NOT A QUESTION AND ANSWER SESSION, AND IT IS NOT AN OPPORTUNITY FOR YOU TO ASK QUESTIONS.
NOW, IN THE, IN THE SPIRIT OF CIVILITY AND NEIGHBORLINESS, IF A PERSON HAS A COUPLE QUESTIONS LIKE, HEY, HOW MANY ACRES IS IT THAT, THAT'S OKAY, BUT A PERSON WITH A LAUNDRY LIST OF QUESTIONS CAN'T TAKE OVER THE PODIUM AND WE'LL BE STICKING WITH THE THREE MINUTES.
SO I WOULD SAY CERTAINLY, AND I, AND I'M NOT AN ATTORNEY, SO I DON'T WANNA ASK A LOT OF QUESTIONS TO TRY AND GET ANSWERS TO SOMETHING THAT ISN'T MEANINGFUL TO ME AS A COMMUNITY MEMBER AND A TAXPAYER IN THE COMMUNITY.
SO WHAT I'M ALSO CONCERNED ABOUT IS THE, WHICH REALLY GETS TO ME IS THE, UH, NUMBER OF, UH, APPROXIMATELY 1,205 UNITS, UM, TWO PERSONS PER UNIT FOR AT LEAST THE REFERENCE OF DWELLING UNITS.
SO THAT'S APPROXIMATELY ABOUT 2,400 PERSONS
[00:25:01]
WITH THAT INCLUDED 154 SINGLE FAMILY UNITS, WHICH ASSUMES AT LEAST TWO PERSONS PER UNIT.SO, WE'LL KIND OF RUN NUMBERS HERE, AND AGAIN, I'M JUST TRYING TO FIGURE THIS OUT, THAT APPROXIMATELY THERE'S ABOUT POSSIBLY 2,500 NEW MEMBERS, NEW RESIDENTS COMING INTO AN AREA, WHICH IS ABOUT 10% OF OUR TOWNSHIP'S POPULATION.
SO THAT'S 10% INCREASE TO THE POPULATION.
MY QUESTION IS, IS WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO ABOUT TAXES WHEN IT COMES TIME TO BE ABLE TO SUPPORT THE INFRASTRUCTURE IN THIS COMMUNITY? TAXES ARE OF COURSE AN ISSUE FOR THE SUPERVISOR, SO THAT'S NOT FOR THIS.
SO CERTAINLY, YOU KNOW, EMERGENCY SERVICES, POLICE RESPONSE, SENIOR LIVING, UH, SENIOR LIVING DOES REQUIRE SOME SPECIFIC SPECIALIZED SERVICES AND THAT SPECIALIZED SERVICE IN OUR COMMUNITY.
UM, NO, NO, I THINK WE HAVE MAYBE ONE OR TWO, MAYBE THREE SENIOR LIVING CENTERS IN THIS COMMUNITY THAT HAVE PROBABLY NO MORE THAN 140 BEDS.
WE'RE TALKING ABOUT 2,500 POTENTIAL, AN INCREASE OF SENIOR LIVING OF 2,500.
I'M A SENIOR, I'M GONNA BE THERE.
I JUST WANNA KNOW WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO TO SUPPORT THAT POPULATION.
THIS IS JUST NOT THE RIGHT FORUM FOR THE TAXATION QUESTION.
YEAH, I, AND I THINK YOU'RE, IT'S A, IT'S A PLANNING COMMISSION QUESTION.
WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO TO PLAN TO SUPPORT THAT POPULATION? THAT'S NOT THE KIND OF QUESTION THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION WOULD ANSWER TONIGHT.
THE, THE PLANNING COMMISSION COULD TRY TO ANSWER BASIC QUESTIONS THROUGH THE CONSULTANTS ABOUT THE NUTS, NUTS AND BOLTS OF THE PLAN.
AND, AND PLEASE KEEP IN MIND ALSO TENTATIVE SKETCH PLANS ARE THE FIRST OF THE THREE STEPS BECAUSE THE PLAN DOESN'T HAVE TO BE ENGINEERED YET.
IT'S, THAT'S WHY IT'S CALLED TENTATIVE AND THAT'S WHY THEY USE THE WORD SKETCH.
IT IS A VERY, IT GIVES PEOPLE A VERY GENERAL IDEA OF WHERE THE PROJECT IS HEADED.
IT'S REALLY THE PRELIMINARY PLAN.
THAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT STEP OF THE THREE.
AND IT'S THE FIRST TIME THAT THE PLANS ARE FULLY ENGINEERED AND WILL INCLUDE, UM, YOU KNOW, A LOT MORE DETAIL.
SO NOW ON THE, ON THE NUMBERS THAT YOU ARE SUGGESTING AS THE POPULATION INCREASE, I WOULD LEAVE IT TO THE APPLICANT WHETHER THEY, YOU KNOW, AGREE OR WANNA A COMMENT ON WHETHER THEY THINK THE NUMBERS ARE RIGHT.
BUT IN TERMS OF THE CONCLUSIONS THAT FOLLOW FROM THAT, WHAT PERCENTAGE IT IS OF THE TOTAL POPULATION, THAT'S JUST MATH.
THAT'S NOT ANYTHING THE PLANNING COMMISSION HAS TO BE ASKED OR COMMENTED ABOUT UNLESS YOU'RE ASKING IT RHETORICALLY.
SO, IN TERMS OF YOUR ACTUAL NUMBERS, IN TERMS OF THE, IT'S AN INFRASTRUCTURE QUESTION THAT I WOULD ASK OF OBVIOUSLY THE APPLICANT OF HOW THEY'RE GONNA IMPROVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE IN THE COMMUNITY GIVEN THAT IT'S POTENTIALLY 2,500 SENIORS.
SO THAT'S ALSO ANOTHER ISSUE THAT COMES UP A LOT WITH LAND DEVELOPMENT PLANS.
THE, AN APPLICANT IS NOT REQUIRED TO MAKE IMPROVEMENTS TO THE COMMUNITY.
THEY CANNOT BE FORCED TO MAKE OFFSITE IMPROVEMENTS.
OTHERWISE, IT'S THROUGH THIS LAW THAT WE HAVE CALLED ACT 2 0 9 FOR TRAFFIC INTERSECTION IMPROVEMENTS THAT THEY HAVE TO PAY A FEE TOWARDS.
BUT YOU CAN'T MAKE THEM DO OFFSITE IMPROVEMENTS IS A COMMON QUESTION.
AND WE PROBABLY GIVE THAT ANSWER, YOU KNOW, A COUPLE TIMES EVERY MONTH.
THE REASON THE NUMBER, THE POPULATION'S BIG IS CUZ IT'S A HUGE PIECE OF GROUND.
BUT, BUT THAT, SO THEY'RE NOT DEVELOPING IT IN A WAY THAT'S, AGAIN, THEY'RE NOT ASKING FOR RELIEF FROM THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
ACTUALLY, I BELIEVE THAT THE, THE CURRENT APPLICATION IS ONLY HA OF HALF THE YIELD THAT THEY'RE ACTUALLY ALLOWED UNDER THE ORDINANCE.
SO THEY'RE ACTUALLY ALLOWED A GREAT MANY MORE PEOPLE FOR WHATEVER, YOU KNOW, FOR THEIR OWN REASONS THEY DID NOT PUT IN FOR THE FULL, UH, NUMBER.
UM, BUT THE, THE NUMBERS ARE WHAT THE NUMBERS ARE.
SO I AM GONNA JUST ASK AGAIN ON PAGE 27 OF, UH, GRACE PLANNING ASSOCIATES DOCUMENT SECTION NUMBER 14, SECTION 180 2 DASH 83.
UM, GIVEN THE NUMBER OF UNITS PROPOSED, IT IS HIGHLY RECOMMENDED THAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS REQUEST A COMMUNITY IMPACT STATEMENT AND MARKET ANALYSIS FOR THIS PROPOSED LAND DEVELOPMENT TO BETTER UNDERSTAND THE IMPACT AND VIABILITY OF THE PROJECT.
AND WE WILL HAVE BOTH OF THEM AT THE CONDITIONAL USE HEARING.
THOSE ARE REQUIRED BY ORDINANCE.
ANOTHER QUESTION THAT I MA'AM, YOU'RE REALLY WAY OVER THE THREE MINUTES AND YOU, YOU STILL HAD IT WITH THE QUESTIONS.
YEAH, NO DISRESPECT INTENDED, BUT THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE HERE.
UM, THE, BECAUSE I'M A RESIDENT THAT I HAVE TO DODGE VEHICLES EVERY SINGLE DAY TO GET TO MY EMPLOYMENT.
MAYBE WE COULD JUST GET TO YOUR, ONE MORE OF YOUR QUESTIONS BEFORE WE GIVE SOMEONE ELSE A TURN.
REFLECTING ON THE BLACK ROCK ROAD ENTRANCES, UM, THE PLAN ITSELF REFERENCES ONE, MAYBE ONE ENTRANCE, TWO ENTRANCES I THINK I SEE ON MY MAP.
UM, AND IS THAT A STATE, UH, HIGHWAY
[00:30:01]
PENDOT ISSUE? MM-HMM.SO ANY ADDITIONAL ENTRANCES BESIDES THE FOUR THAT CURRENTLY EXIST FOR PARKHOUSE NURSING FACILITY? THERE'S TWO ADDITIONAL, AND IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S ONE UP AROUND, I'M NOT QUITE SURE WHAT THAT IS, BUT STATE HIGHWAY OCCUPANCY PERMITS STATE HIGHWAY ARE THE, OR TOTALLY WITHIN THE PURVIEW OF PENDOT.
THAT'S A SEP WHOLE SEPARATE PROCESS.
SO THEREFORE THE BRIDGE THAT IS, UH, UNDERLYING THE, THAT OVERRIDES THE CREEK THERE, THAT'S A PENDOT ISSUE.
SO WOULD WE BE PETITIONING PENDOT FOR SOME CLARIFICATION OR WOULD WE COME TO THE TOWNSHIP FOR CLARIFICATION ABOUT WHAT HAPPENS? UM, PROBABLY, YOU KNOW, THREE HOURS A DAY DURING THAT AREA OF TRAFFIC.
ANTHONY, DO I RECALL CORRECTLY THAT WE WERE ALREADY LOOKING AT THE, THAT BRIDGE EVEN BEFORE THIS APPLICATION WAS IN? UH, YOU MEAN US AS THE TOWNSHIP OF PENDA AS A TOWNSHIP AND WITH THROUGH PENOC? YES.
WE, WE HAD SOME DIALOGUE, I GUESS WHEN WE WERE PURSUING THE GRANT FOR THE ROUNDABOUT PROJECT AT THE INTERSECTION.
WE, WE HAD SOME DIALOGUE WITH THE DEPARTMENT ABOUT THE BRIDGE THERE.
I BELIEVE IT MIGHT NOW BE ON THEIR, UH, TIP PROGRAM TO ADDRESS WHEN WE HAVE NO IDEA.
BUT IT, IT'S PART OF OUR, UH, IT'S INCORPORATED OUR PRELIMINARY ENGINEERING RIGHT.
FOR THE ROUNDABOUT RIGHT AT THIS TIME.
WELL, I, AGAIN, SENIOR LIVING, I'M NOT OPPOSED TO, UH, 2200 SENIORS TRYING TO CROSS OVER THAT LITTLE BRIDGE, UH, AT A TIME OF TRAFFIC MIGHT BE A SAFETY ISSUE FOR OUR COMMUNITY.
I I, I THINK I JUST WOULD ASK THAT THE, THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION TAKE CONSIDERATION OF WHAT MR. GRACE'S RECOMMENDATION WAS OF IMPACT STUDY.
SO, AND SO, SO THAT EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS THIS IS NOT DIRECTED TO YOU, BUT YOU, YOU, YOU REMINDED ME OF ONE OTHER COMMENT I WAS GOING TO MAKE.
UM, THE, THE PLANNING COMMISSION'S JOB AND THE SUPERVISOR'S JOB WITH A LAND DEVELOPMENT PLAN IS TO LOOK AT THE, WHAT WE CALL THE SAL, THE SUBDIVISION AND LAND DEVELOPMENT ORDINANCE, WHICH HAS MANY, MANY REQUIREMENTS FOR HOW YOU HAVE TO BUILD BUILDINGS, WHAT IMPERVIOUS YOU HAVE, WHAT SETBACKS YOU HAVE TO HAVE, HOW MUCH, YOU KNOW, OPEN SPACE.
AND IT'S A PROCESS OF DOTTING ISS AND CROSSING TS TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PLAN COMPLIES WITH EVERY DETAIL OF THE SAL DO.
UM, WHAT IT IS NOT IS AN EXERCISE OF DISCRETION ON WHETHER ANYBODY UP HERE LIKES THE PLAN, DOESN'T LIKE THE PLAN, WHETHER THE SUPERVISORS LIKE THE PLAN OR DO NOT LIKE THE PLAN.
IT WHEN MR. MULLEN CALLED IT A BY RIGHT PLAN, THAT MEANS UNDER THE, THE ZONING ORDINANCE, THEY DON'T NEED ANYTHING FROM THE TOWNSHIP.
AND THE WAY IT CHANGES TO THE ZONING ORDINANCE, THEY HAVE A RIGHT TO THE APPROVAL IF THEY DO DOT ALL THEIR I'S AND CROSS ALDER T'S, WHICH IS WHAT THE PROCESS IS ABOUT, WHETHER IT'S A LITTLE PROJECT OR A BIG PROJECT THAT DOESN'T CHANGE.
AND, AND ONE, ONE FINAL QUESTION, IF I COULD ASK THE APPLICANTS, WAS THERE A CONSIDERATION OF WHY IT CHANGED FROM THE 600 UNITS IN, UH, 2020 TO, UH, NOW 1,203 OR 1,205, ACTUALLY IS WHAT THE NUMBERS COME TO? YEAH, IT WAS TO, IT WAS TOTALLY DIFFERENT CONCEPT.
UH, WE WERE TRYING TO REPLICATE, UH, WILLIAMSBURG AND WAS SHOPPING AND WE WERE TRYING TO DO A HORSE FARM AND WE WERE TRYING TO DO ALL SORTS OF THINGS THAT WE THOUGHT WOULD MAKE SENSE.
BUT THE PROBLEM WAS THAT IN ORDER TO FACILITATE THOSE USES, WE COULD NOT HAVE THE AGE RESTRICTION OF 62 MM-HMM.
THEN WE CAME BACK AND SAID, WELL, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO BE 8 62 AND UP, SO WHAT SHOULD WE DO? AND THIS IS WHAT WE CAME UP WITH.
AND, AND, AND 1,203 WAS CONSIDERED AN ANALYSIS FOR THIS COMMUNITY TO, THE DEMAND IS 1,203.
IT'S BASICALLY WHAT PLANNED OUT THROUGH OUR PLANNING CONSULTANTS WHEN WE WANTED TO HAVE SINGLES, TOWNHOUSES, UH, SALE APARTMENT UNITS AND APARTMENTS, UH, WE COULD GO LIKE ALL APARTMENTS.
AND JUST FOR YOUR FRUSTRATION LEVELS, JUST TRY TO PUT YOUR QUESTIONS AND FORM, NOT LOOKING FOR AN ANSWER, BUT JUST TO GIVE US SOME THOUGHTS AS WE PROGRESS THROUGH THIS PROCESS.
WE'LL TAKE THOSE QUESTIONS, NOT TO GIVE YOU ANSWERS, BUT MAYBE JUST TO UNDERSTAND WHAT THE THOUGHT OF THE COMMUNITY IS.
SO DON'T, DON'T NECESSARILY COME UP HERE LOOKING FOR ANSWERS, UH, AT THIS POINT FOR, YOU KNOW, WE'LL BE HERE FOR A LOT LONGER AND THAT'S OKAY.
BUT YOU KNOW, I, THE, THE, THE APPLICANT IS NOT REQUIRED TO ANSWER QUESTIONS EITHER AT THIS POINT.
IF ED WANTS TO DO THAT, THAT'S FINE, BUT, UM, BUT, UH, SO TRY, TRY TO MAKE IT SO WE UNDERSTAND THE FEEL OF THE COMMUNITY INSTEAD OF LOOKING FOR AN ANSWER AT THIS PARTICULAR MEETING.
THERE'S GONNA BE OTHER MEETINGS.
[00:35:08]
GOOD EVENING.LISA MOSSI, THREE 11 MONTGOMERY AVENUE OAKS.
UM, I DO HAVE A QUESTION FOR JOE.
WHAT I HEARD TONIGHT WAS THAT WE'RE NOT GONNA HAVE A NURSING COMPONENT IN THIS DEVELOPMENT.
SO TO ME, THAT JUST SOUNDS LIKE IT'S AGE RESTRICTED TO 62.
THAT DOESN'T SEEM TO MEET THE CRITERIA OF INSTITUTIONAL TO ME.
SO COULD YOU EXPLAIN TO ME AND EXPLAIN TO THE AUDIENCE WHY THAT MEETS THE CRITERIA? BECAUSE I WOULD THINK THERE'S A NURSING COMPONENT OR A CARE COMPONENT IN THERE SOMEWHERE, IF THE YEAH.
UM, WHEN WE FIRST, WHEN WE FIRST GOT THE APPLICATION, UM, WE WERE OF COURSE TO, IN DUE DILIGENCE, WE WERE LOOKING AT EVERY POSSIBLE OPPORTUNITY TO SEE WHETHER THE PLAN WAS SUBJECT TO CHALLENGE OR, OR REJECTION OR, OR EVEN MODIFICATION JUST TO, TO GAIN LEVERAGE IF WE COULD DO THAT.
UM, AND I THOUGHT THAT WAS ACTUALLY AN AREA OF INQUIRY MM-HMM.
THERE WAS A CASE DECIDED OUTTA WAR SISTER TOWNSHIP LAST YEAR ON THIS VERY ISSUE, WHICH WAS DECIDED NOT FOR THIS APPLICANT, BUT WAS DECIDED IN A WAY THAT'S FAVORABLE TO THIS APPLICANT ON THAT POINT.
AND IN THE, IN THE, UM, IN, IN WARCHESTER, UM, MR. MULLEN MIGHT RECALL THE DETAILS BETTER, BUT I THINK WHAT HAPPENED WAS ALL THEY HAD WAS A LETTER THAT SAID, IF YOU LIVE IN A HOME IN A, IN A HOUSE HERE IN THIS COMMUNITY, BUT YOU HAVE A MEDICAL NEED, YOU'LL HAVE FIRST PRIORITY TO GO INTO OUR MEDICAL BUILDING OVER THERE.
AND, YOU KNOW, THE TOWNSHIP'S ARGUMENT WAS YOU'RE JUST CALLING IT, UH, YOU'RE JUST CALLING IT, UH, SENIOR WITH A, A MEDICAL OVERLAY TO PUT MORE UNITS IN OF SINGLE FAMILY HOMES.
AND I THOUGHT THAT WAS GOING TO BE A, A BASIS TO CHALLENGE IT.
BUT THERE'S A, THERE'S A WRITTEN COURT DECISION THAT WENT UP TO COMMONWEALTH COURT AND THAT WAS AFFIRMED AFFIRMING, UH, JUDGE SILO IN NAS TOWN.
UM, AND IT KIND OF PUT THAT TO BAD.
THAT'S, THAT'S INTERESTING BECAUSE WHEN I WAS ON THE BOARD, THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT WE ACTUALLY CHANGED THE ZONING TO PREVENT BECAUSE OF THE RIDGEWOOD DEVELOPMENT.
JEFF MIGHT REMEMBER THAT, BUT I'LL LEAVE THAT AT THAT.
SO THE, MY QUESTION ON THIS, AND, AND IT'S REALLY JUST A GENERAL QUESTION.
IT'S STUFF FOR PEOPLE TO MULL OVER HERE IS WHO'S GONNA RUN THIS FACILITY? WHO IS, IS THERE GONNA BE EMPLOYEES HERE AND WHO'S GONNA RUN IT? BECAUSE, UH, DR.
RIFKIN, WHO WAS THE ORIGINAL PURCHASER OF THE PARK HOUSE FACILITY, SOLD THAT FACILITY IN 2017 AND DIDN'T WANNA BE IN THE BUSINESS ANYMORE.
HE SOLD OFF ALL OF US IN NURSING HOMES AS, AS I RECALL.
SO NOW ALL OF A SUDDEN HE WANTS TO GET BACK INTO IT BECAUSE HE GOT HIS, BECAUSE BECAUSE WE SLAPPED HIM DOWN WITH HIS RESIDENTIAL PROPOSAL.
SO MY CONCERN IS THAT THIS PROPOSAL COMING IN HERE NOW, WHICH IS QUITE FRANKLY HORRIFYING TO ME, UM, IS, IS IS A BAIT AND SWITCH.
BECAUSE NOW WE'RE GONNA GO, WE'RE GONNA COME BACK TO THE BOARD AND WE'RE GONNA SAY, YOU KNOW, WE COULD GET YOU THAT LITTLE FARM COMMUNITY THAT WAS SO SWEET AND EVERYTHING ELSE, IF YOU'LL JUST CHANGE THE, THESE ZONING.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF, I, THAT'S KIND OF WHERE I'M THINKING WITH THIS.
BUT I WOULD ALSO LIKE TO RECOMMEND TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION THAT NOT ONLY DO WE DO THE COMMUNITY IMPACT STUDY, BUT WE ALSO DO A FEASIBILITY STUDY WHETHER SOMETHING LIKE THIS HAS A MARKET, BECAUSE THERE ARE 88 NURSING HOMES IN MONTGOMERY COUNTY.
LISA, LET ME JUST INTERRUPT YOU A SECOND.
WE DID DO THAT STUDY AND THEN WE'LL BE AT THE SUPERVISOR'S MEETING.
BECAUSE IT'S, THERE'S 88 NURSING HOMES IN MONTGOMERY COUNTY ALREADY, WHICH THE NEXT HIGHEST NUMBER I THINK IS IN PHILADELPHIA.
WE ARE BY AND THEN BUCKS COUNTY AT 52.
SO I, I, I THINK WE HAVE MORE THAN OUR SHARE OF NURSING FACILITIES.
WE HAVE THREE RIGHT HERE IN THE TOWNSHIP ON, JUST ON THE BAIT AND SWITCH POINT THAT YOU RAISED, UM, I WOULD POINT OUT THAT, UH, MOST OR ALL OF THE SUPERVISORS, NOT INCLUDING TOM, CUZ HE WASN'T ON YET, BUT I BELIEVE THEY ALL MADE STATEMENTS THAT THEY WOULD NOT CHANGE THE ORDINANCE THAT WAS MEANING CHANGE TO ACCOMMODATE THAT FIRST PLAN.
UM, I'VE HAD NUMEROUS CONVERSATIONS WITH THE APPLICANT AND I'LL ALWAYS CONTINUE TO LOOK FOR WAYS TO TRY TO MAKE THIS PLAN BETTER EVEN AFTER PRELIMINARY APPROVAL.
BUT, UM, TO THE BEST OF MY KNOWLEDGE, IT'S NOT A CASE WHERE THEY'RE TRYING TO SAY, NOW THAT WE'VE SCARED YOU WITH THIS, NOW, WILL YOU CONSIDER GOING BACK TO THE OTHER, UM, THAT WE'VE, I CAN TELL YOU I ASKED THAT QUESTION MM-HMM.
[00:40:01]
WHEN IT'S ENGINEERED MM-HMM.THERE'D BE A LOT, THERE'D HAVE TO BE A LOT LESS LINES ON, BUT THE SUPERVISOR'S ALREADY COMMITTED TO NOT CHANGING, UM, THE ORDINANCE, WHICH WOULD BE, THAT WOULD HAVE TO HAPPEN TO GO BACK TO THAT OTHER PLAN.
AND BASED ON THE SUPERVISOR'S COMMENTS, I DO NOT BELIEVE THAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN.
UM, THE ONLY OTHER THING THAT I WOULD SAY IS THAT FOR ONCE I AGREE WITH THE COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION LETTER, UH, ABOUT THE EMS, UH, BEING PART OF THIS.
THESE ARE, IF THIS IS AN AGE RESTRICTED AGE, WHATEVER, WHATEVER WE'RE CALLING THIS CUZ IT'S NOT A, IT'S IT'S NOT A NURSING FACILITY.
SO WHATEVER WE'RE CALLING THIS, THIS IS GONNA BE A COMMUNITY OF ELDERLY PEOPLE, 1200 TO 2,400 ELDERLY PEOPLE TAKING UP OUR EMS SERVICES.
THEY SHOULD HAVE THEIR OWN DEDICATED EMS SERVICE.
I'M SORRY, WE JUST WENT THROUGH, UH, A TAX INCREASE TO PAY FOR 24 7 EMS AND FIRE IN THIS TOWNSHIP.
AND I DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR TO INCREASE OUR TOWNSHIP BY 10% SIMPLY TO ACCOMMODATE THIS DEVELOPMENT PLAN, WHICH BY THE WAY, OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN NEVER CONSIDERED THIS LAND TO BE DEVELOPED AT ALL.
SO THE, THE, THE PLANNING ASPECT OF THIS IN THE COMMUNITY IMPACT ASPECT OF THIS IS HUGE.
AND THAT'S REALLY ALL I HAVE TO SAY.
UM, APPARENTLY JEFF HAS STEPPED OUT, SO I'LL JUST TAKE THE NEXT PERSON WHO WANTS TO COME UP AND IDENTIFY THEMSELVES.
UM, I ACTUALLY, OKAY, WELL YEAH, WE'RE NOT, I DON'T THINK THAT'S ON THE AGENDA FOR TONIGHT.
THAT'S WHEN, UH, YOU PUBLIC NON, NON AGENDA ITEMS CERTAINLY IS.
WHERE'S IT AT? THAT'S, NO, THOSE ARE ACTIVE.
THOSE ARE, EXCUSE ME, THOSE ARE ACTIVE APPLICATIONS.
THE, THE AGENDA STOPS OR IT SAYS ADJOURNMENT.
EVERYTHING AFTER THAT IS THINGS THAT ARE ON OUR PLANNING BUT NOT ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION TONIGHT.
SO, SO AGAIN, ANY WHO'S NEXT? UH, LOOKS LIKE, UH, IS IT JAMES WARLOW? WHAT MARCO? SORRY, I CAN'T READ THE WRITING.
COULD I ASK A QUICK CLARIFICATION FROM THE APPLICANT WHILE THE, UM, YOU MENTIONED THE FEASIBILITY REPORT WOULD BE MADE AVAILABLE FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS? DOES THAT MEAN YOU'RE NOT PREPARED TO TALK ABOUT IT THIS EVENING? YES, WE COULD TALK ABOUT THIS EVENING.
UM, MICHAEL KJA 1 0 4 BENNINGTON ROAD.
I WAS CURIOUS ABOUT THESE IMPACT STUDIES THAT YOU GUYS REFERENCE.
ARE ALL THOSE COPYWRITTEN AS WELL? THE IS WHAT COPYWRITTEN OR PLAN IMPACT STUDIES? NOW THE, THE PLANS THAT WE RECEIVE ARE SOMETIMES COPYRIGHTED AND IT POSES, UM, A, IT POSES A DIFFICULTY FOR US BECAUSE TECHNICALLY UNDER THE COPYRIGHT LAW WE'RE THEN STUCK.
UM, WE CAN, WE CAN LET PEOPLE COME SEE IT, BUT WE CAN'T SEND IT OUT OR LET PEOPLE TAKE COPIES OF IT AWAY.
UM, BUT THE OTHER DOCUMENTS ARE NOT THAT ARE NOT THAT.
SO THEY ARE MADE OF PUBLIC, BUT WE HAVE TO COME AND PRIVATELY TO SEE THEM.
WELL, YEAH, WELL YOU HAVE TO SUBMIT, I BELIEVE THAT TOWNSHIP GENERALLY REQUIRES RIGHT TO NO REQUESTS FOR ALL DOCUMENTS JUST SO THEY CAN KEEP TRACK OF WHO ALL THEY'VE GIVEN THINGS TO.
I MEAN, YOU CAN COME TO THE WINDOW AND JUST ASK AND SAY, I'D LIKE TO SEE THIS DOCUMENT.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT CHERYL WOULD DO EITHER.
HAVE YOU FILLED OUT THE FORM RIGHT THERE, JUST EXPLAINING IT.
AND IF WE CAN PULL IT FOR YOU RIGHT AWAY, WE'D LOOK AT, WE'D GRAB IT FOR YOU.
I'M TALKING GENERALLY ABOUT ANYTHING.
WE'LL PULL IT FOR YOU AS FAST AS, AS BEST WE CAN.
WE DO HAVE A CERTAIN TIMEFRAME IF WE CAN'T GET TO THE DOCUMENTS RIGHT THERE DUE TO STAFFING OR WHATEVER ELSE.
BUT THIS APPLICATION HAS BEEN SITTING OUT THERE FOR A WHILE.
CAUSE WE KNEW PEOPLE WOULD BE THERE.
UM, AND QUESTION FOR YOU, MR. VALENCIA, YOU REFERENCED THAT THE, THE SINGLE LANE BRIDGE ON ONE 13 MIGHT BE INVOLVED AT THE GRANT FOR THE CUL-DE-SAC ROUNDABOUT THAT'S OCCURRING AT DR BUS SECOND AVENUE.
YEAH, SO DUE TO THE PROXIMITY OF THE LO SO IT'S, WE'RE STILL IN PRELIMINARY ENGINEERING, SO I DON'T THINK'S FINAL YET.
SO WE'RE STILL, UH, YOU KNOW, IN, IN THE DESIGN PROCESS, BUT IT'S ASSUMED AS PART OF OUR, UH, ROUNDABOUT, WHICHEVER, WHEREVER IT ENDS UP, HOWEVER IT LOOKS GEOMETRICALLY THAT THE, THE BRIDGE IS, UH, IS TO BE REPLACED AS PART OF THAT PROJECT.
UM, IN THE EVENT THAT BRIDGE IS COMPROMISED UNDER CONSTRUCTION, IN THEORY WE'D BE REROUTED TO ER ROAD OR OLD STATE ROAD.
THERE'S NO INFRASTRUCTURE THERE FOR STORMWATER MANAGEMENT.
THERE'S ALREADY CONSTANT FLOODING.
[00:45:01]
THERE'S GONNA BE QUITE THE IMPACT HERE ON THE LOAD.WHERE WILL THE REROUTE OCCUR THEN? WE, I MEAN WE HAVEN'T GOTTEN INTO THOSE.
I MEAN I CLEARLY, I UNDERSTAND THE CONCERN, UM, BUT PART OF THE PROCESS, I GUESS WITH THE BRIDGE WOULD INVOLVE DIALOGUE WITH THE DEPARTMENT SINCE THE PEN NOT OWNS THE BRIDGE, UH, WE CAN'T MAKE A CALL I GUESS OBVIOUSLY ON THEIR BRIDGE.
BUT THOSE CONCERNS WOULD BE VET THROUGH OUR ENGINEERING AND, YOU KNOW, THROUGH THE PROCESS WITH THE DEPARTMENT.
THOSE SORTS OF DISCUSSIONS WOULD, WOULD ENSUE AND WE WOULD, WE WOULD TRY TO FIGURE THAT OUT IF, IF THERE'S AN ISSUE.
I GUESS IT'S RAISED, UH, REGARDING THAT.
UM, PRIOR TO IT BEING PARKHOUSE KNOWN AS THE POOR HOUSE, UM, RUN BY THE QUAKERS AND MENNONITES, UM, THERE'S STRONG BELIEFS OF EXTENSIVE POTTERS FIELDS, WHICH ARE LARGE MASS GRAVE SITES.
HAS THERE BEEN ANY ULTRASOUND OR ZONING IMPERVIOUS CHECKS WHEN WHAT, WHAT WILL OCCUR IN THE EVENT? GO ON.
UM, REGARDING THE GRAVE SITES, THEY WILL ALL BE TREATED, UM, WITH RESPECT AND PROTECTED.
UM, WE WILL IDENTIFY WHERE THEY ARE.
WE UNDERSTAND FROM THE FORMER COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION MEMBER, I DON'T THINK HE'S STILL THERE OR NOT.
MIKE STOKES, HE HAS SOME IDEA WHERE THEY ARE AND WE CERTAINLY WILL NOT DISTURB ANY GRAVES.
SO THEN IN RESPONSE TO THAT, IN THE EVENT THAT THERE IS A FOUNDATION BEING DUG, YOU PENETRATE A MASS BURIAL SITE, WHAT KIND OF REMEDIATION MODIFICATIONS, LOSS OF DWELLING UNITS WILL YOU THEN THOSE STUDIES WILL BE DONE BEFORE ANY FOUNDATION ARE DONE.
WILL THOSE BE MADE PUBLIC OR ARE THOSE GONNA BE COPYWRITTEN AS WELL? THAT THEY SHOULD ALL BE PART OF THE PLAN THAT WE'RE SUBMITTING TO THE TOWNSHIP SO ANYBODY CAN SEE 'EM.
UH, YOU MADE REFERENCE TO A MILLION DOLLAR IMPACT TO INFRASTRUCTURE.
A MILLION DOLLARS FOR INFRASTRUCTURE MODIFICATIONS REGARDING THIS PROPERTY IS PROBABLY ONE, 100TH OF THE IMPACT WHEN IT COMES TO STORMWATER MANAGEMENT.
THAT IS GROSSLY LACKING IN OLD STATE ROAD, SECOND AVENUE, THE INTERSECTION OF DRABBY BLACKROCK ONE 13.
WHAT KIND OF ADDITIONAL IMPACTS WILL YOU GUYS BE SUSTAINING YOURSELVES? THE TOWNSHIP ORDINANCE REQUIRES, AND WE WILL COMPLY WITH THE ORDINANCE THAT WE TAKE THE 50 YEAR STORM BEFORE DEVELOPMENT AND REDUCE IT TO A TWO YEAR STORM.
SO THERE WILL BE A VAST IMPROVEMENT IN THE ENTIRE AREA WHEN WE DEVELOP THE SITE.
THE, THE MILLION DOLLAR REFERENCE, I THINK WAS TO THE 2 0 9.
THE 2 0 9 THAT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH STORM WATER.
WELL, YEAH, BUT I THINK THAT'S ANOTHER QUESTION, A SEPARATE QUESTION.
BUT OLD STATE ROAD, THERE'S EXTENSIVE TRAFFICS THAT'S GONNA BE IMPACTED HERE.
I'VE NOT SEEN THE TRAFFIC IMPACT STUDY BY PENDOT.
I'M ASSUMING IT'S NOT BEEN MADE AVAILABLE PUBLIC AS WELL.
SO WE HAVE TO FILE A RIGHT TO KNOW TO ACQUIRE THAT.
NO TRAFFIC STUDY HASN'T BEEN SUBMITTED AT THIS POINT.
I DON'T, ONE HAS NOT OCCURRED YET, NO.
SO I'M ASSUMING ONE WILL BE OCCURRING BEFORE ANY FURTHER ADVANCEMENTS IN APPROVALS BEFORE PRELIMINARY APPROVAL.
UM, I LIVE RIGHT ON THE LEFT SIDE, UM, BUTTS RIGHT UP TO MY BACKYARD.
I'VE SEEN EXTENSIVE BALD EAGLES, BOGGED TURTLES.
BALD EAGLES ARE NO LONGER ON THE ENDANGERED SPECIES LIST BECAUSE OF DECADES OF PRESERVATION.
AND I GUESS RESPECT THOSE FLOOD PLAIN AREAS, OR, SORRY, UH, WETLANDS ARE HEAVILY SATURATED WITH BOG TURTLES AND THEY ARE ON THE ENDANGERED SPECIES LIST.
I'M HOPING THAT THE PROPER IMPACTS AND REVIEWS ARE WITHIN THE APPROPRIATE DISTANCES BECAUSE AGAIN, THEY ARE ON THE ENDANGERED SPECIES LIST AND FEDERAL LAWS PROTECT EVERYONE.
SO I HOPE THAT'S, WE'RE FULLY AWARE OF THE BOB TOTAL REQUIREMENTS AND WE'LL DO THE NECESSARY STUDIES.
AS A QUICK ASIDE, I DUCKED OUT WITH MR. NOON.
HIS QUESTIONS WERE ABOUT AMELIA STREET AND A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT APPLICATION.
WELL, WHEN YOU WERE AT, THIS LADY HERE IN FRONT WAS ON YOUR LIST, SHE ALSO HAD THE SAME A QUESTION ABOUT AMELIA STREET ALSO.
I'LL POKE MY HEAD OUT AGAIN RIGHT AFTER, UH, MR. FELTON COMES UP AND AS HE SPEAKS, UM, HE'S NEXT ON THE LIST, SO I'LL DUCK OUT TO MAKE SURE THEY DON'T HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS.
YEAH, THIS, THIS, THIS YOUNG LADY RIGHT HERE IN THE FRONT.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK.
I'LL TRY TO KEEP IT, UH, TO COMMENTS AND NOT QUESTIONS.
UH, I GUESS THE, THE, THE FIRST THING THAT, YOU KNOW, WHEN I LOOK AT THIS PLAN, I SEE A SINGLE FAMILY TOWNHOUSE APARTMENTS, RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT.
[00:50:02]
I MEAN, I DON'T SEE EVEN A RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY FOR SENIOR CITIZENS.I MEAN, THE TYPE OF STRUCTURE OR BUILDING THAT WOULD HOUSE THAT TYPE OF FACILITY.
I DON'T SEE IT BEING A SINGLE FAMILY DEVELOPED.
SO MY BIGGEST CONCERN WITH THIS PLAN IS THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACES THAT ARE BEING PROPOSED ON THIS PLAN.
I MEAN, EVEN IF THEY'RE CONSIDERING SOME SORT OF RESIDENTIAL, UH, UH, FACILITY TO HOUSE SENIORS ASSISTED LIVING.
THIS, TO ME, THIS IS, THIS WOULD BE INDEPENDENT LIVING.
I DON'T SEE HOW THAT COULD BE ASSISTED LIVING UNLESS THERE'S A, A NURSE LIVING IN EACH HOME.
UH, BUT, BUT SOME SORT OF DESIGN THAT WOULD REDUCE THE IMPACT ON THE LAND AND KEEP THE IMPERVIOUS TO A MINIMUM TO, YOU KNOW, CLUSTER THE BUILDINGS, MAKE THEM A TYPE OF STRUCTURE THAT WOULD ALLOW FOR MANY BEDS THAT YOU'RE LOOKING TO GET, BUT NOT, NOT THIS SUBURBAN SPRAWL TYPE DEVELOPMENT.
THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD BE MY, UM, FOLLOWING UP ON WHAT MR. UH, HI JACK HAD BROUGHT UP ABOUT, UH, THE GRAVES THAT MIGHT BE ON THIS SITE.
WOULD THE TOWNSHIP REQUIRE AN ARCHEOLOGY STUDY OF THIS LAND? BECAUSE I, I THINK IT'S NOT JUST THESE GRAVES THAT MIGHT BE HERE, BUT THE, THESE LANDS WERE INHABITED BY THE LEI INDIANS, YOU KNOW, WAY BEFORE THE EUROPEANS GOT HERE AND AROUND, NOT JUST THIS SITE, BUT A LOT OF THE SURROUNDING SITES.
THERE'S BEEN ARTIFACTS FOUND THAT INDICATE THAT THIS WAS A SETTLEMENT, NOT JUST A, UH, A HUNTING LAND OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
SO I WOULD SUGGEST THAT AN ARCHEOLOGY STUDY WOULD BE, UH, AN IMPORTANT THING TO DO.
UM, YEAH, I MEAN, I THINK THERE'S AN OPPORTUNITY TO DO SOME SORT OF DEVELOPMENT HERE THAT COULD IMPLEMENT, YOU KNOW, THE LATEST TECHNOLOGY WHEN IT COMES TO SUSTAIN SUSTAINABLE BUILDING, SUSTAINABLE DESIGN, UH, REDUCE THE, THE IMPERVIOUS SURFACE, YOU KNOW, ON, ON SURFACE PARKING LOTS HAVE GOTTA BE THE WORST THING WE COULD DO TO THIS LAND.
LET'S PUT ALL THE PARKING INSIDE THE, THE FOOTPRINT OF THE BUILDING.
LET'S, IF IT, IF IT'S FOR SENIORS, DO THEY EVEN NEED AUTOMOBILES? YOU KNOW, MAYBE THERE'S A, A SHARED A CAR SHARE PROGRAM AND THERE'S, UH, YOU KNOW, ELECTRIC VEHICLES INSIDE THE FOOTPRINT OF THE BUILDING FOR THE, THE SENIORS TO USE WHEN THEY DO WANT TO GO OUT.
AND THEN SOME SORT OF, UH, UH, SERVICE, YOU KNOW, TO TAKE THEM TO, UH, UH, UH, PROVIDENCE TOWN CENTER OR INTO PHOENIXVILLE OR WHEREVER THEY'D WANT TO GO.
LET'S, YOU KNOW, FROM A TRAFFIC STANDPOINT, LET'S DO WHAT WE CAN DO WITH THIS DEVELOPMENT TO MINIMIZE AND LIMIT THAT AS WELL.
SO I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION IS GONNA DO MOVING FORWARD.
UM, I, I WOULD HOPE TO SEE THERE MIGHT BE SOME SORT OF CITIZENS COMMITTEE THAT MIGHT GET INVOLVED.
I, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S OPENING A CAN OF WORMS, BUT CAN'T DO THAT.
UH, I THINK THERE'S SOME, SOME IDEAS THAT MIGHT BE HELPFUL THAT, THAT, UH, WE COULD MAKE THIS INTO A, UH, LEGACY DEVELOPMENT AND NOT, NOT WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT HERE.
SO NEXT ON THE LIST, UH, IS THAT DAVID TIMMY? WHAT WAS THAT LAST NAME? TENANT.
HE'S THE, UH, HE'S THE MODERATOR.
PLEASE MAKE SURE YOU'RE TALKING TO THE MIC.
YEAH, I I I THOUGHT THIS WAS MORE JUST SO I'LL BE A LITTLE BIT BRIEFER THAN, YOU KNOW, FOR ME, HIS PASSION'S STILL THERE.
UM, THOUGHT YOU WANTED TO HEAR FROM THE COMMUNITY 3 0 9 VISTA DRIVE.
WE COME OUT OF THAT BOTTLENECK THAT'S GONNA BE AFFECTED RIGHT, EVERY DAY.
ALL THAT DEVELOPMENT HAS BEEN POSITIVE.
BUT I GOTTA TELL YOU, I'M, I'M REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT WHAT THIS REPRESENTS.
UM, I SEE, I MEAN, WE'RE BURSTING AT THE SEAMS RIGHT NOW JUST TO GET OUT OF OUR NEIGHBORHOOD.
JUST ALL THE STREETS AROUND US ARE MORE AND MORE DIFFICULT TO NAVIGATE.
AND THAT'S BEFORE ALL THOSE APARTMENTS UP AT WEGMANS ARE FILLED UP.
AND I SEE JUST HOW CRAZY THAT IS AT WHAT THAT ROUNDABOUT IS UP THERE.
AND TO THINK ABOUT HAVING TO COME
[00:55:01]
OUTTA MY NEIGHBORHOOD INTO THAT SAME KIND OF AN ENVIRONMENT.I THINK THAT IS JUST HORRIBLE.
AND HAVE ANOTHER 2000 OR MORE CARS BE PART OF THAT WHOLE PROCESS IS JUST GONNA MAKE THINGS WORSE.
AND FOR ME TO HAVE THAT DISRUPTION OVER THE NEXT, HOWEVER LONG THIS DEVELOPMENT IS, IS GONNA MAKE OUR LIFE WORSE.
UM, THIS IS NOT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE COMMUNITY.
YOU, YOU REFERENCED, I THINK EARLIER, MR. BRE, ALL THE SIGNS THAT ARE OUT THERE, THE COMMUNITY'S BEEN VERY CLEAR IN TERMS OF WHAT WE THINK ABOUT WHAT SHOULD BE DONE HERE.
THIS IS THE ONLY PERSON'S GONNA BENEFIT IS AN OPPORTUNIST INVESTOR.
SO I WOULD REALLY JUST DO WHATEVER WE CAN TO NOT ALLOW THIS TO GO FORWARD.
THAT'S MY REQUEST FROM YOU AND I GUESS WILL HAVE THOSE SAME CONVERSATIONS AT THE SUPERVISOR LEVEL.
JUDY SHEETS ONE 17 OLD STATE ROAD.
UM, MY COMMENT, I AGREE WITH MOST EVERYBODY WHO HAS COME BEFORE ME, BUT MY COMMENT IS ABOUT THE HISTORY OF OUR TOWNSHIP.
UM, WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE ROOTED IN HISTORY, BUT, UM, I DON'T, THIS IS THE FIRST I'VE SEEN THIS PLAN AND TELL YOU THE TRUTH.
UM, I'M WONDERING IF THERE'S BEEN ANY CONSIDERATION TO THE HISTORIC ONE ROOM SCHOOLHOUSE THAT'S LOCATED ON ONE ON OLD STATE ROAD.
I HAVE A, A PICTURE OF IT, A POOR PICTURE OF IT, BUT, UH, MY FATHER ATTENDED THIS IN THE, UH, ON THE PROPERTY.
IS IT ON THE PROPERTY? YES, IT IS.
UM, I CAN'T SPEAK TO WHAT THEIR PLANS ARE, BUT THEY DO SHOW THE STRUCTURE ON THE BUILDING, ON THE, ON THE PLANS.
I CAN'T, I CAN'T TELL FOR THIS PLAN.
I CAN SHOW IT TO YOU AFTERWARDS IF YOU LIKE MS. SHEETS.
ARE THEY PRESERVING IT? I'M NOT SURE WHAT I ALL I, ALL I KNOW IS THAT IT IS ON THE PLANS.
I THINK THAT'S A QUESTION FOR MR. MULLEN.
THERE IS A CONNECTION, UH, WITH THIS BUILDING TO, UM, CHRISTIAN SANDERSON.
I DON'T KNOW, YOU'RE PROBABLY NOT FAMILIAR WITH IT.
I'M NOT REALLY TOO FAMILIAR WITH HIM EITHER.
HE WAS A TEACHER, A POET, A MUSICIAN, A COLLECTOR.
THERE WAS A MUSEUM OVER IN CHADS FORD, UH, OVER IN THAT AREA.
THEY'RE VERY MUCH AWARE OF HIM.
UH, HE, HIS FIRST TEACHING JOB WAS IN THIS BUILDING IN THE, IN THE 1920S.
UM, IT, WE WILL COMMIT TO DO OUR BEST TO KEEP THE BUILDING AND AT WORST CASE, MOVE IT INTACT SOMEWHERE ELSE ON THE SITE.
IT WOULD, IT WOULD BE NICE IF WE COULD USE THIS AS AN HISTORICAL BUILDING FOR ARTIFACTS OF A TOWNSHIP, YOU KNOW, IF THEY COULD SEE FIT TO, TO EITHER SELL OR DONATE AN ACRE OF PROPERTIES ALONG WITH THIS BUILDING.
YOU KNOW, WE CAN TALK TOWNSHIP'S USE, WE CAN TALK TO THEM ABOUT THAT BEFORE, YOU KNOW, AS THE STEPS PROCEED.
YOU HAVE NO, I SAID WE CAN THOUGH.
PAT CANNING ON THE 1515 ACRE ROAD.
I, MY MY COMMENT IS, I'M JUST A LITTLE SHOCKED AT THE, THE LACK OF INFORMATION WE GOT TONIGHT FROM THE APPLICANT.
AND I'D LIKE THE SECOND LEASES, UH, IDEA THAT I THINK WE NEED AN INDEPENDENT STUDY DONE BY THE TOWNSHIP INSTEAD OF MAYBE HAVING TO ACCEPT, UM, WHAT THEY GIVE US.
YOU WANNA SPEAK YOUR NAME, SIR.
UM, I'M, UH, I HAVE A, A POINT OF VIEW OF THIS PROPERTY IN A LARGER SCALE OF THINGS.
UM, I WAS LUCKY ENOUGH TO BE THE FIRST, UH,
[01:00:01]
HERITAGE CARD OR MANAGER THAT LOOKED AT THE RIVER AND THE NATURAL RESOURCES, THE RECREATIONAL OPPORTUNITIES.UM, AND I SERVED TO MOVE THAT ALONG, UM, ALONG THE RIVER IN THAT POSITION.
I'VE ALSO BEEN FOR 33 YEARS, UM, A BOARD MEMBER OF THE PHOENIX IRON CANAL AND TRAIL ASSOCIATION, WHICH IS NOW KNOWN AS THE GREEN TEAM IN PHOENIXVILLE.
AND, UH, WE HAVE PRETTY MUCH FINISHED THE GREENWAY IN PHOENIXVILLE THROUGH GOOD PLANNING AND, UM, AN UNDERSTANDING OF HOW THESE WATERWAYS ARE INCREDIBLE ASSETS IN THE COMMUNITY AND THAT THE LANDS SURROUNDING THEM AND THE VIEW SHEDS ARE SO IMPORTANT.
UM, SO I'VE BEEN INVOLVED WITH THE CANAL ASSOCIATION, SO I HAVE, UM, A VERY DEEP APPRECIATION AND UNDERSTANDING OF THESE OPEN SPACES.
UM, AND AS A OWNER OF PROPERTY AND THE TOWNSHIP, I KNOW THAT, UM, WE'RE DOING PRETTY GOOD.
SO WHEN YOU'RE DOING PRETTY GOOD, YOU NEED TO START THINKING ABOUT THE FUTURE BECAUSE THERE'S MORE PEOPLE IN THE FUTURE THAN THERE ARE TODAY OR HAVE EVER BEEN.
THERE ARE GONNA BE MORE PEOPLE THAT YOUR DECISION EFFECTS THAN IN THIS ROOM THAT ARE ALIVE IN THIS TOWNSHIP IN THE FUTURE ON MATTERS SUCH AS THIS.
THIS IS AN IMPORTANT THING THAT OUR CULTURE IS MISSING RIGHT NOW.
AND WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY BECAUSE WE ARE IN A VERY GOOD POSITION FINANCIALLY, AND WE'RE SMART PEOPLE AND WE SEE THE BALANCE OF THINGS ROUGHLY.
AND I THINK THIS IS A PERFECT SITUATION WHERE WE'RE LOOKING AT BALANCE IN THE TOWNSHIP AND WE'RE SAYING, WHAT'S ENOUGH? WHERE DO WE NEED TO ALLOW THINGS TO HAPPEN? AND WHERE DO WE NEED TO TAKE ACTION? AND I THINK THIS PROPERTY AS OPEN SPACE AND IT'S, UH, ADJOINING PROPERTIES IS SUCH AN OBVIOUS CALL THAT I CAN'T IMAGINE THAT ANYBODY SUPPORTS IT EXCEPT THE OWNERS AND OTHER ENTITIES ASSOCIATED WITH CONSTRUCTION.
UH, I SERVE ACTUALLY ON THE CHESTER COUNTY ENERGY AND ADVISORY BOARD.
I AM A RESIDENT OF CHARLESTOWN, ALTHOUGH I OWN A PROPERTY AT 2 0 9 MONTGOMERY AVENUE, AND I'VE LIVED THERE IN THE PAST.
UH, I'VE BEEN PART OF THE CLIMATE ACTION PLAN, AND I THINK THAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE NEED TO DO AND EVERY DISCUSSION FROM THIS POINT FORWARD IS CONSIDER THE CARBON EMISSIONS ASSOCIATED WITH EVERYTHING THAT WE DO.
IT'S GETTING DAMN HOT OUT THERE.
THIS WAS THE COOLEST SUMMER WE WILL EVER HAVE.
WE NEED TO TAKE ACTION IN EVERY ONE OF OUR DECISIONS TO UNDERSTAND THE IMPACT.
50% OF THE EMBODIED, OF THE ENERGY OF ANY BUILDING THAT IS BUILT IS BUILT INTO IT DURING CONSTRUCTION.
THAT'S A BIG CARBON FOOTPRINT THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT RIGHT THERE.
AND I'M HOPING THAT THE TOWNSHIP IS STARTING TO SHIFT OR INCORPORATE THE CARBON FOOTPRINT INTO EVERY CONVERSATION BECAUSE THIS IS WHAT SMART PEOPLE DO WHEN THEY SEE WHAT'S HAPPENING AND DECIDE TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE.
I HAVE ONE REACTION TO THE PLAN.
NEXT, JEFF, WE'RE DONE WITH OUR LIST.
YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS, SIR? JOHN WESLER, 180 COUNTRY RIDGE DRIVE.
UH, JUST TWO QUESTIONS JUST SO I CAN UNDERSTAND IT.
MAYBE I JUST NOT, UH, COMPREHEND IT CORRECTLY, BUT IF YOU CAN GO BACK POSSIBLY TO THE SLIDE THAT TALKS ABOUT THE, UH, ORDINANCE RESTRICTIONS.
IF I COULD JUST READ THAT ONE MORE TIME SO I COULD SEE THAT OR AT LEAST TAKE A SCREENSHOT OF THAT.
WOULD THAT BE ALLOWED? JEFF? JEFF'S IN THE PROCESS.
SO NOT THAT ONE, THE NEXT ONE? NO, THE ONE WITH THE HIGHLIGHT.
SO, UM, LICENSED NURSING CONVALESCENT HOME RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY FOR SENIOR CITIZENS.
JUST TRYING TO SEE WHERE THIS FALLS IN, WHERE THE, WHERE THE, UM, HOW THIS KIND OF SLIDES IN THERE WITHOUT BEING RESTRICTED.
IS IT UNDER THE WORD RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY FOR SENIOR CITIZENS? IS THAT HOW THAT GETS IN WITH, IS THAT HOW THE LOOPHOLE IS WITHOUT IT BEING APPROVED, IS IT'S, WELL, IT'S NOT A, YEAH, I MEAN IT'S NOT A LOOPHOLE, BUT THAT, I THINK THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE INTENDING IS THAT, THAT USE THE DEFINITION OF RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY IS A FACILITY CONSISTING OF INDIVIDUAL RESIDENTIAL LIVING UNITS EXCLUSIVELY FOR PERSONS
[01:05:01]
WHO ARE 62 YEARS OF AGE OR OLDER THAN FOR MARRIED COUPLES WITH ONE SPOUSE OR BOTH SPOUSES AGE 62 OR OLDER.SUCH FACILITY MAY PROVIDE PERSONAL CARE AND HEALTHCARE SERVICES, INCLUDING NURSING BEDS AND NURSING CARE FOR THE LIVING UNITS.
WE DO PROPOSE, UH, THE ASSIST OF THE LIVING.
HE, HE'S READING THE DEFINITION EARLIER IN THAT SAME ORDINANCE, IN THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
THE FIRST THING IT HAS IS DEFINING EVERYTHING.
SO IF YOU GO ONLINE AND LOOK AT THE ZONING ORDINANCE, OKAY, THAT RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY TERM, ALL THE WAY AT THE START OF THE ORDINANCE UNDER DEFINITIONS, THAT'S WHAT HE'S READING.
AND THOSE ARE THE, SO THE CRITERIA ARE IN A COUPLE DIFFERENT PLACES.
SO I'D HAVE TO GO BACK AND READ THAT A LITTLE BIT MORE CLEARLY THEN, CUZ TO ME THAT THIS DOESN'T HAVE THAT, THAT COMPONENT OF RESIDENTIAL CARE CUZ THEY'RE NOT PROVIDING CARE.
AND I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED FURTHER IN MY WE'RE WE'RE, I'M PRETTY COMFORTABLE THAT THEY SATISFY IT, ESPECIALLY AFTER THE WAR DECISION.
BUT I DO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING BECAUSE I ORIGINALLY HAD THE SAME THOUGHT.
AND THE SECOND QUESTION I HAD IS I HEARD SOME RUMBLINGS THAT THERE WAS POTENTIAL CONSIDERATION OR INTEREST FROM THE STATE OR SOME LEVEL FOR SOMEBODY TO POSSIBLY PURCHASE THIS BACK.
IS THAT SOMETHING THAT IS ACCURATE OR IS THAT FALSE? YOU KNOW, THERE'S, PEOPLE HAVE CONVERSATIONS MAYBE EVERY LOOKS INTO EVERY POSSIBILITY.
UM, I DON'T KNOW ANY OF THE DETAILS.
I WAS NOT A PARTY TO THE CONVERSATIONS.
I BELIEVE STAFF OR SOME COMBINATION WITH THE SUPERVISORS MAY HAVE LOOKED INTO IT.
IT PROBABLY IS NOT REALISTICALLY FEASIBLE IN LIGHT OF THE VALUE OF THE LAND.
WE WOULD NEVER BE ABLE TO, I MEAN, THE VALUE OF THE LAND IS, I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT IS, BUT SOMEWHERE, YOU KNOW, BETWEEN 50 AND A HUNDRED MILLION AND YOU'RE NEVER GOING TO BE ABLE TO GET A GRANT THAT YOU'RE GOING TO ACQUIRE THAT WITH.
AND EVEN IF YOU GOT A GRANT FOR THAT MUCH MONEY, YOU KNOW, WOULD YOU SPEND IT ALL IN ONE PLACE IN THE TOWNSHIP REGARDING ONE PROJECT WHEN THERE'S PEOPLE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE TOWNSHIP WHO HAVE THEIR OWN LOCAL CONCERNS TOO.
SO I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANY REAL, UM, TRACTION TO ANY CONVERSATION ALONG THOSE LINES.
YEAH, I JUST THINK THAT, YEAH, APPRECIATE THAT.
I JUST THINK THAT THAT NUMBER THREE NEEDS TO BE VETTED AGAIN A LITTLE BIT BETTER.
WHETHER IT NEEDS TO GO MONTGOMERY COUNTY IS THE ULTIMATE DECISION MAKER OR IF IT GOES TO THE STATE, I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS ISN'T WESTCHESTER COUNTY, SO, YOU KNOW.
WE GOT ANOTHER LADY WHO WAS AHEAD OF YOU.
COULD YOU PLEASE GO BACK TO THE MAP, THE MORE OR LESS TRIANGLE NORTH OF, UH, OLD STATE ROAD? I DON'T SEE ANY BUILDING ON THAT.
IS THAT PART OF THE OPEN SPACE? THE FAR LEFT? YES.
AND WHAT PERCENTAGE OF THE OPEN SPACE IS THAT RECTANGLE? NO IDEA.
COULDN'T THAT OPEN SPACE BE INCORPORATED INTO WHERE YOU'RE BUILDING? I'M SORRY.
NO, THEY, YOU'RE SAYING YOU'RE PRESERVING OPEN SPACE, BUT TO ME THAT'S NOT PRESERVING OPEN SPACE WITHIN THE COMMUNITY YOU'RE BUILDING.
SO WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS YOU'D RATHER SEE BUILDINGS ON THAT.
NO, I'D RATHER SEE THAT OPEN SPACE.
IF YOU HAVE TO BUILD SOMETHING THERE, INCORPORATE IT INTO WHERE YOU ARE BUILDING.
WE DO, THERE IS A REQUIREMENT IN THE ORDINANCE THAT AVOIDS OPEN SPACE BEING ONE CIRCLE HERE IN ONE SQUARE THERE.
AND, AND THE BULK OF IT IN THE MIDDLE IS CONTIGUOUS.
UM, I BELIEVE THAT PROVISION IN THE ORDINANCE DOESN'T CAPTURE EVERY SQUARE FOOT OF THE OPEN SPACE, BUT IT CAPTURES A LOT OF IT.
I THINK JEN REVIEW IN MIND THAT THEY, THAT THERE'S SOME, SOME CLARIFICATION NEEDED ON SOME OF THEIR OPEN SPACE AND HOW IT'S ALLOCATED AND HOW IT MEETS OUR ORDINANCE, WHICH IS A FAIRLY STANDARD COMMENT FOR THIS LEVEL.
NOT 1200 UNIT LEVEL, BUT THIS LEVEL OF APPLICATION SUBMISSION.
I'VE BEEN A LIFELONG RESIDENT OF THIS TOWNSHIP.
SO I'VE SEEN THIS TOWNSHIP BACK WHEN IT WAS A RURAL, BEAUTIFUL COMMUNITY.
MOSTLY FARMS. YOU DON'T WANT ANY OF US HERE, RIGHT? YOU LIKE IT ALL AGO? I LIVE IN ONE OF THE NEW DEVELOPMENTS.
I GREW UP IN MONTCLAIR WITH A NUMBER OF OTHER PEOPLE IN HERE, A LOT OF FRIENDS IN HERE.
AND WHAT I'M WORRIED ABOUT IS A TRAFFIC PROBLEM.
I MEAN, WILL THIS TRAFFIC THAT THEY'RE
[01:10:01]
LOOKING AT, ARE THEY GOING TO LOOK AT MORE THAN JUST BLACKROCK ROAD, SECOND AVENUE, YOU KNOW, RIGHT IN THE AREA.ARE THEY GONNA LOOK AT WHAT'S THE EFFECT ON 29 BLACKROCK ROAD? WHAT'S THE EFFECT GOING DOWN 29? WHAT'S THE EFFECT ON ONE 13 GOING OUT TO RIDGE PIKE? IS IT GOING TO ACTUALLY TAKE A LOOK AT THAT TRAFFIC THROUGH THE WHOLE TOWNSHIP? CAUSE I'VE SEEN THIS WHERE YOU COULD GET ANYWHERE IN A TOWNSHIP QUICKLY.
YOU HATE TO SAY IT, BUT IT IS, IT'S PROGRESS.
BUT TO PUT THIS MANY HOUSING UNITS IN AND BRING IN AT LEAST 1200 NEW CARS, IF NOT PROBABLY CLOSER TO 2000, TO PUT THAT TRAFFIC ON ALL THE ROADS OF THE TOWNSHIP.
NOT JUST, THESE IS ONE OF MY CONCERNS.
YOU KNOW, WILL THEY TAKE A LOOK AT ALL THAT A MILLION DOLLARS ISN'T GOING TO FIX THAT PROBLEM THROUGHOUT THIS TOWNSHIP? I MEAN, YOU'RE LOOKING AT ADDING TRAFFIC LIGHTS OR CIRCLES OR SOMETHING SOMEWHERE IN OTHER LOCATIONS TO TAKE UP ALL THAT DIFFERENT TRAFFIC THAT'S GOING THROUGH THE WHOLE TOWNSHIP, NOT JUST RIGHT NEAR THIS.
THE OTHER THING I WAS THINKING ABOUT IS YOU'RE PUTTING IN ALL THESE HOUSING UNITS AND YOU'RE GONNA SAY THEY'RE GONNA RELY ON THE NEW SERVICES WE HAVE JUST DOWN THE STREET FOR AMBULANCE AND FIRE.
WELL, THAT SEEMS LIKE A REAL BURDEN FOR WHAT WE HAVE IN THIS TOWNSHIP, BECAUSE HOW MANY MORE AMBULANCE ARE WE GONNA HAVE TO PUT IN? IF YOU'RE BRINGING IN SENIOR CITIZENS WHO NORMALLY WOULD USE THAT SERVICE MORE FREQUENTLY THAN THE REST OF THE TOWNSHIP, ARE WE GOING TO HAVE SOMETHING TO COVER IT OR SHOULD THEY HAVE THEIR OWN SERVICES AVAILABLE TO 'EM? I MEAN, IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE A FACILITY.
A FACILITY SHOULD HAVE THOSE SERVICES.
I'M NOT SURE WHY THEY'RE NOT REQUIRED TO HAVE IT.
YOU KNOW, THEY'RE SAYING, OH, WELL, WE'LL PROVIDE IT.
WELL HOW ABOUT THEY PROVIDE THE FULL SERVICE TO THAT AND STOP RELYING ON THE TOWNSHIP FOR ALL THESE THINGS.
AND THE LAST THING I HAVE, AND IT'S JUST A QUESTION, UH, FOR YOU JOE, IS IT POSSIBLE THAT THEY CAN ACTUALLY RELEASE THOSE DOCUMENTS? THEY'RE COPYRIGHTED FOR YOU TO PUT 'EM ON THE WEBSITE SO THAT WE ALL CAN SAY IT? I MEAN, IT CAN BE DONE.
IT'S JUST A MATTER OF A LETTER THAT I DID ASK ONCE BEFORE AND I GOT, I GOT A NO.
UM, I DON'T KNOW IF THE ANSWER HAS CHANGED OR IS THERE A REASON YOU CAN'T JUST RELEASE THOSE FOR HIM TO PUT 'EM ON A WEBSITE FOR US TO VIEW SO WE DON'T HAVE TO COME DOWN HERE ALL THE TIME TO REQUEST THEM? WELL, I GUESS THAT IT'LL BE PART OF THE, UH, CONDITIONAL USE HEARING WITH IN FRONT OF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.
AND AT THAT POINT, WILL WE BE ABLE TO SEE THE DOCUMENTS ON THE WEBSITE? ABSOLUTELY.
YOU'LL HAVE THEM PUBLISHED FOR THE WEBSITE.
THE COPYRIGHT, I THE COPYRIGHT DOESN'T PREVENT PEOPLE FROM SEEING THE PLANS ARE THERE THAT ARE ON THE TABLE.
IT'S JUST MEANS WE, YOU CAN'T TAKE COPIES.
AND WE DID TRY AND WE I DON'T SEE WHY THEY'RE HOLDING THAT BACK.
IT DOESN'T WELL, THAT'S THEIR DECISION.
THEY WOULD, THEY COULD CHOOSE TO ANSWER THAT.
YOU'RE KINDA ASKING WHY WOULD YOU HOLD THAT BACK? WHY WOULDN'T YOU LET US SEE THAT? IS IT K YOU KNOW, IS THERE SOMETHING THAT YOU DON'T WANT US TO SEE AHEAD OF TIME? NO, THE ONLY THING WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS BEING, IS THE PLAN.
ANYTHING ELSE YOU CAN SEE ADDED COPY.
YEAH, BUT WE HAVE TO COME DOWN HERE AGAIN.
AND HE SAID THE PLAN IS COPYRIGHTED.
SO THE OTHER DOCUMENT THEY REFERRED TO THE OTHER WOMAN HAD THAT THEY SAID SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN PUBLISHED IS OKAY BEING PUBLISHED.
THE WOMAN EARLIER THAT HAD THAT ONE DOCUMENT, SHE, I'M SORRY MR. SAP, IF YOU'RE GONNA CONTINUE, WHICH IS PERFECTLY FINE, JUST AT THE MIC, INTO THE MIC AS YOU CAN GET, BUT YEAH.
MAKING YOUR INNER KARAOKE THAT THE WOMAN EARLIER HAD THAT, THAT SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN PUBLISHED.
RIGHT? THAT'S WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT.
WHY CAN'T THAT DOCUMENT BE PUBLISHED? GET A WAIVER TO PUBLISH THAT DOCUMENT? WE UNDERSTAND THE QUESTION.
WE JUST ARE NOT IN CONTROL OF THE ANSWER.
WELL THESE GENTLEMEN ARE ARE
FACT, WELL, JUST SO YOU GUYS KNOW, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU, WE WITH COPYRIGHT, IF WE DON'T HAVE A, WE DON'T POST IT IF IT'S COPYRIGHTED, WE DID BY OR IN ERROR THIS ONE TIME.
BUT IN GENERAL, WE NEED YOUR YES TO DO THAT.
YOU'RE JUST TALKING ABOUT THE PLAN AND WE DON'T HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH ANYBODY LOOKING AT THE PLAN, BUT EVERYTHING ELSE IS AVAILABLE TO THE TENANT.
SO THERE, BUT CAN WE, CAN WE PUT THE PLAN BACK ON THE INTERNET? YEAH.
CAN THEY PUT IT IN THE INTERNET? SO I'M ASKING CAN THEY PUBLISH IT ON THE INTERNET INSTEAD OF HAVING IT JUST AVAILABLE HERE ON SITE, MAKE THAT DECISION OR NOT? WELL, IT IS AVAILABLE BUT NOT ON THE INTERNET.
WE TOOK IT, I SAW IT ON THE INTERNET.
NO, WE TOOK SAID IT, BUT THAT WAS IN ERROR.
THAT WAS A MISTAKE THAT WAS CORRECTED.
WE'RE TALKING TWO DIFFERENT THINGS.
THE PLAN IS COPYRIGHT EVERYTHING ELSE.
YOU GO ON TO THE TOWNSHIP WEBSITE, YOU GO UNDER PLANNING COMMISSION, YOU GO UNDER AGENDA AND BESIDES THE 10, IT SAYS MATERIALS AND YOU OPEN THAT UP AND THERE'S LIKE 80 PAGES AND IT'S EVERYTHING THAT WE'VE SUBMITTED NOW, I'LL BE AVAILABLE.
I GOT THE IMPRESSION EARLIER THAT IT WAS TAKEN DOWN.
AND THIS IS THE PLAN HERE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT? YES.
[01:15:01]
IT'S, IT IS AVAILABLE.WELL, THE ANSWER, THE ANSWER IS THAT THE ENGINEER THAT'S HERE IS NOT AUTHORIZED TO MAKE THAT DETERMINATION.
WE CAN CERTAINLY ASK AND WE WILL GET BACK TO YOU.
AND, AND IF IT'S AVAILABLE, THEN YOU CAN PUT IT SIR JAMES HOFFMAN, 1199 SECOND AVENUE.
AND I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION REGARDING THE, UH, THAT ONE HIGHLIGHTED PAGE, IF YOU CAN BRING THAT BACK UP PLEASE.
I'M SORRY, WHICH PAGE? THE HIGHLIGHTED PAGE, THE HIGHLIGHTED AREA ON THAT ONE, UH, PAGE THAT THE GENTLEMAN YEP.
PRIOR WAS TALKING ABOUT, UM, IN THAT HIGHLIGHTED DEFINITION, UM, IT'S TALKING TO FACILITY, YOU KNOW, REGARDING RE REFERRING TO A FACILITY.
UH, I'M ASSUMING ALL THOSE PARTICULAR UNITS THAT WILL BE SINGLE FAMILY OR UH, CONDOS OR TOWN HOMES WOULD BE INDIVIDUALLY DEED.
IS THAT INDIVIDUALLY DEEDED? IS THAT CORRECT? YES.
WELL, I MEAN, JUST THE HOUSES, I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT THE APARTMENT COMPLEXES, BUT THE, THE CONDOS, THE ONE WOULD BE NORMALLY INDIVIDUALLY DEEDED.
UM, YOU LIVE IN AN INDIVIDUALLY DEEDED HOME, I ASSUME? YES.
UM, IS YOUR HOUSE CONSIDERED A FACILITY BY SOME PEOPLE? IT MAY BE.
I THINK WHAT IT, WHAT THE, I MEAN, WE'RE TALKING, THE ANSWER TO YOUR QUESTION IS THAT THERE WILL BE A HOMEOWNER'S ASSOCIATION, THERE'LL BE A PLANNED UNIT COMMUNITY UNDER A SET OF RULES AND REGULATIONS THAT WILL MAKE THE ENTIRE PROJECT THE FACILITY.
UM, AND THEY'RE ALL GONNA BE FOR SENIORS 62 AND UP FACILITY DOESN'T MEAN ONE BUILDING.
I I THINK THERE'S AN OXFORD DICTIONARY SOMEWHERE THAT WOULD DISAGREE WITH THAT DEFINITION.
HI, DIANA KSH, 2 65 OLD STATE ROAD.
UM, FIRST OF ALL, I'D JUST LIKE TO SAY THIS IS, IF YOU COULD GO BACK TO THE PLAN, UM, IT'S RATHER HEARTBREAKING, UH, FOR A FAMILY WHO JUST MOVED TO THIS COMMUNITY ABOUT A YEAR AND A HALF AGO.
WE SPECIFICALLY CAME OUT THIS TO FROM WHERE WE WERE LIVING IN SEARCH OF WHAT WE HAVE, WHICH IS RIGHT OFF OLD STATE ROAD, THIS BEAUTIFUL LAND AND THIS OPEN SPACE.
SO IT'S REALLY HEARTBREAKING TO SEE THIS.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO KNOW IF ANYBODY'S THOUGHT ABOUT THE IMPACT TO THE KIDS RIDING THE SCHOOL BUSES.
OUR HIGH SCHOOL KIDS HAVE TO STAND OUTSIDE AND PITCH BLACK DARKNESS RIGHT NOW TO GET TO SCHOOL ON TIME.
UM, HAS ANYONE THOUGHT ABOUT THE IMPACT TO THE BUS SCHEDULE AND WHAT'S GONNA HAVE TO HAPPEN TO THAT SCHEDULE IN ORDER TO MAKE SURE THE KIDS CAN GET TO SCHOOL ON TIME? WHICH IS BASICALLY WHAT WHAT WE'RE SAYING IS THE KIDS ARE GONNA HAVE TO GO OUT EVEN EARLIER.
THEY'RE GONNA BE VERY FEW CHILDREN CONSIDERING THE, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE TRAFFIC.
OH, YOU GONNA LEARN THE RIGHT, THANK YOU.
I RETRAINED MYSELF IN I ABOUT 10 HOPMAN.
UM, I RESIDE AT 1515 YEAGER ROAD AND, UM, MY HUSBAND WAS UP HERE A LITTLE EARLIER AND I'M, I'M LOOKING AT THIS MAP AND YOU'VE INVITED US TO MAKE COMMENTS.
AND, UH, THE COMMENT THAT I WANNA MAKE TO, TO YOU ALL HERE AS WELL AS TO THE APPLICANT AS WELL AS TO OUR COMMUNITY, WHICH IS WHERE THE RUBBER IS GOING TO MEET THE ROAD WITH THIS DEVELOPMENT.
I UNDERSTAND THAT THIS GUY, THIS APPLICANT OWNS THIS LAND.
I UNDERSTAND THAT THEY'RE PROBABLY GONNA BUILD SOMETHING ON THIS LAND AND THERE'S REALLY LITTLE THAT WE CAN DO FOR THAT SPECIFIC FACT THAT THEY OWN IT AND THEY'RE GONNA BUILD SOMETHING ON IT.
WHAT I SEE WHEN I LOOK AT THIS IS THEY TOOK THE HU THE 180 ACRES THAT THEY COULD, THEY SQUEEZED AS MUCH RESIDENTIAL, AS MUCH CONCRETE, AS MUCH PARKING LOT, AS MUCH BUILDING AS THEY COULD INTO THIS PIECE OF PROPERTY.
AND THEY HAVE GIVEN THE BARE BONED MINIMUM OF BEAUTY AND, AND, UH, CONSIDERATION TO OUR COMMUNITY, TO THE FAMILIES, TO THE HOMES THAT ARE ON THE PERIMETER, UH, AND THE PERIPHERY OF THIS LAND.
AND I JUST AM DISGUSTED WITH THE ENTIRE PROCESS HERE.
AND I THINK THAT WE, WE ALL HERE ARE THE LITTLE PEOPLE AND WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO GET THEM TO CHANGE THIS BUILDING AND THIS DEVELOPMENT AND MAKE IT SOMETHING THAT IS GOING TO BENEFIT US,
[01:20:01]
NOT THEM.I DON'T WANNA BUTCHER YOUR LAST NAME.
UH, GEORGE MINTER, 3 0 6 QUAIL DRIVE.
UH, JUST ACROSS THE STREET ACTUALLY.
UM, THANK YOU MEMBERS OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
UM, THIS PROJECT COMES BEFORE YOU AS THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
AND WHILE A LOT OF THE DISCUSSION SOUNDS LIKE THERE'S NO DISCRETIONARY APPROVALS, UH, I THINK THE PLANNING COMMISSION STILL HAS A ROLE TO MAKE SURE THAT THIS PROJECT, UH, PROTECTS THE ENVIRONMENT, SERVES THE COMMUNITY, MEETS ALL THE REQUIREMENTS, UH, OF THE ZONE, THE INSTITUTIONAL ZONE.
ONE OF THE REASONS THIS WAS INSTITUTIONAL ZONING, UH, WAS THAT IT WASN'T GONNA BE RESIDENTIAL ZONING.
IT WASN'T GOING TO BE RESIDENTIAL SPRAWL.
UH, IT HAD AN INSTITUTIONAL USE AND I THINK IT WAS ANTICIPATED THAT OTHER INSTITUTIONAL USES CHURCHES OR SCHOOLS OR UH, UH, NURSING HOME FACILITIES.
UH, I DON'T REALLY SEE THIS PROJECT AS A NURSING HOME FACILITY.
I SEE IT AS INDIVIDUAL RESIDENCES.
UH, PRIMARILY IN THE NORTHERN PART.
UH, THEY LOOK LIKE INDEPENDENT LIVING UNITS, WHICH IS CURIOUS TO ME BECAUSE WHEN YOU LOOKED AT THE CONDITIONAL USES THAT ARE PERMITTED USES, IT'S, IT'S ASSISTED LIVING, IT'S NURSING CARE, THERE'S SOME EMPLOYEE WORK, WORK RELATED HOUSING.
UH, THIS ALL LOOKS LIKE INDEPENDENT LIVING.
THIS DOES NOT LOOK LIKE ASSISTED, DOES NOT LOOK LIKE NURSING HOME.
UM, SO I WOULD ASK THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO, TO ENSURE THE PROJECT HAS SOME SAFEGUARDS THAT IT IS IN FACT ASSISTED LIVING IF THAT'S WHAT IT'S GOING TO BE.
IT IS IN FACT NURSING CARE, UH, NOT SIMPLY A TOWN HOME PROJECT.
UH, THE, THE TYPE OF INTENSE RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT WE'RE SEEING HERE.
YOU'RE ALREADY BUILDING AND HAVE ALREADY PERMITTED UP BY THE, UH, PROVIDENCE TOWN CENTER.
YOU HAD A COMMERCIAL PROJECT AND NEEDED RESIDENTIAL.
YOU HAD THIS KIND OF INTENSE, UH, RESIDENTIAL USE GETS PART OF THIS BEING INSTITUTIONAL WAS TO PREVENT MORE SUBURBAN SPRAWL TO MOVE SOUTH.
UH, YOU'VE GOT SEVERAL PROJECTS THAT ARE 80 AND 90 UNIT PROJECTS, UH, THAT ARE ALREADY ALL BUILT ALL AROUND IT TO BUILD MORE IS JUST SIMPLY NOT WHAT THE INSTITUTIONAL HOME IS ALL ABOUT.
SO I WOULD ASK THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO REALLY THINK THAT ONE THROUGH, UH, AND MAKE SURE THAT THE INSTITUTIONAL USE AND THE NEEDS FOR INSTITUTIONAL USE IS IN FACT MET BY WHATEVER GETS DEVELOPED ON THIS BAR.
PLEASE, THANK YOU FOR THOSE COMMENTS.
AND PLEASE BE ASSURED THAT YOU KNOW, WE'RE RESIDENTS OF THE TOWNSHIP ALSO, AND WE'RE, WE UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GONNA DO OUR JOB, WE'RE GONNA DO OUR JOB.
AND UH, I CAN JUST TELL YOU, I'VE BEEN HERE FOR OVER 30 YEARS NOW.
I GOTTA TELL YOU, I REALLY APPRECIATE ALL THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSIONS PREVIOUS TO YOU GUYS AND OUR BOARD OF SUPERVISORS HAVE DONE.
I THINK THIS IS AN EXCELLENT DEVELOPMENT.
I CAN'T TELL YOU HOW HAPPY I AM THAT I LIVE HERE.
I KNOW THAT YOU ALL LIVE HERE WITH US.
SO I WANTED TO JUST SAY THANK YOU AND I APPRECIATE YOU FOR THAT.
IT SOUNDS LIKE THIS FIGHT FOR US PROBABLY WAS LOST 10 YEARS AGO WHEN THE COUNTY SOLD THE LAND.
RIGHT? SORRY, FOR, FOR MYSELF FOR NOT GETTING MORE INVOLVED THEN DIDN'T KNOW.
BUT THE REALITY IS WE'RE HERE TODAY, SO LET'S DEAL WITH IT.
RIGHT? WHAT CAN WE DO ABOUT IT? THEY SAY ALL POLITICS IS LOCAL AND I'VE SERVED ON THE SCHOOL BOARD NOT MANY YEARS AGO.
AND I GUESS ALL I WOULD TELL YOU IN THAT REGARD IS, UM, HAVING SERVED ON THE SCHOOL BOARD, IT'S TOUGH FOR THE PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY TO UNDERSTAND THE NUANCES THAT GET INVOLVED WITH THIS.
SO I'M NOT EVEN GONNA PRETEND TO TELL YOU AND SIT AND PICK ON WHAT CAN BE DONE OR NOT DONE WITH THIS DEVELOPMENT.
CUZ THERE'S SOMEBODY JUST STATED THEY'RE GONNA BUILD SOMETHING ON IT.
LET'S TRY TO MAKE IT AS MEANINGFUL AS POSSIBLE FOR US TO LIVE WITH.
IT'S CLEARLY GONNA BE A DISASTER FOR US.
SO I JUST ASK THAT WE MAKE IT AS PAINFUL AS POSSIBLE FOR THEM TO DO THIS.
I THINK THE COMMUNITY IS HERE TO SUPPORT WHATEVER YOU WANT OR NEED.
SO PLEASE, WHAT I ASK OF YOU IS HELP US TO HELP YOU DO WHATEVER WE CAN.
NO DISRESPECT TO THEM TO SLOW THIS THING DOWN.
I DON'T CARE IF IT CRAWLS RIGHT.
SLOWNESS IN BUILDING AND TOWNSHIPS IS KEY.
[01:25:01]
A BIG ENVIRONMENT ENVIRONMENTALIST.I WILL TAKE THAT TO THE T TO SLOW THIS THING FROM HAPPENING.
SO ANYTHING WE CAN DO TO HELP SLOW THAT PROCESS.
CUZ AS YOU SLOW PROCESS THINGS CHANGE.
THIS WASN'T THE PLAN I SAW TWO YEARS AGO.
THAT PLAN WAS LOOKING A LOT BETTER THAN THIS ONE WAS, RIGHT? SO I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NEXT PLAN'S GONNA LOOK LIKE, BUT I WOULD JUST ASK THAT WE IN THE COMMUNITY ARE HERE, WERE ASKING FOR YOUR HELP, YOUR ELECTED OFFICIALS.
THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR YOUR TIME.
I'M NORMA DAVENPORT, LIVE AT 100 BENNINGTON ROAD AND MY PROPERTY BACKS UP WHERE THE TRIANGLE, WHERE IS TO THE LOW, TO THE LOWER LEFT SIDE OF THE PROPOSED BUILDING.
SO MY PERSPECTIVE IS REALLY FISCAL MORE THAN ANYTHING ELSE.
UM, IT'S GONNA BE CLEAR THAT ONCE THIS PROJECT, IF IT IS APPROVED, BEGINS PEOPLE, THE 35 RESIDENTS IN MY DEVELOPMENT, MANY WILL LEAVE, LEAVE.
THE RESIDENTS IN VISTA WILL ALSO LEAVE BECAUSE WE'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO GET OUT.
AND WITH SO MANY PEOPLE PLACING THEIR HOMES ON THE MARKET AT THE SAME TIME, IT'S GONNA TAKE PROPERTY VALUES AND THAT'S GONNA HAVE A LONG TERM IMPACT ON THE TOWNSHIP.
MY WIFE AND I MOVED HERE FROM PHILADELPHIA BECAUSE WE WANT TO LIVE IN THE SUBURBS AND THIS TOWNSHIP IS PROBABLY THE BEST THAT WE COULD HAVE CHOSEN TO LIVE IN.
AND WE LOVE COMING HERE EVERY DAY.
I'VE BEEN A POLICE OFFICER IN PHILADELPHIA FOR 32 YEARS.
I DRIVE AN HOUR BACK AND FORTH EVERY DAY.
AND I LOVE EVERY MINUTE OF IT COMING HERE.
FRUSTRATION CREATES CONFLICTS, AND YOU'RE GONNA NEED MORE POLICE UP HERE.
IN ADDITION TO THAT, AS THE PROPERTY VALUES START TO FALL, THE QUALITY OF YOUR RESIDENCE WILL BEGIN TO CHANGE.
AND YOU'RE GOING TO BEGIN TO START SEEING MORE CRIME IN OTHER ISSUES BECAUSE THE MONIES IN THE TOWNSHIP ARE GOING TO COME DOWN.
I UNDERSTAND THAT THE PROPERTY HAS TO BE DEVELOPED IN SOME WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM.
IF I OWNED IT, I WANNA DO SOMETHING WITH IT AS WELL.
BUT TO BUILD THAT ON THEIR PROPERTY CHANGES THE CHARACTER OF THIS TOWNSHIP.
AND IT'S GOING TO CHANGE THE PEOPLE WHO WILL WANT TO LIVE HERE.
SO PLEASE MAKE A DECISION NOT JUST FOR US TODAY, BUT LOOKING 10, 20, 30 YEARS DOWN THE ROAD, IT'S GONNA BE DIFFICULT ENOUGH FOR PEOPLE RETIRING.
YOU LOOK AT INTEREST RATES GOING UP, WHICH IS ALREADY CAUSING PROPERTY VALUES AT ALL.
TO DO THAT HERE IN THIS COMMUNITY IS REALLY GONNA HURT US.
IT NOT ONLY HURT US, BUT FOR PEOPLE WHO ARE RETIRING, ARE PAYING, RETIRING A COUPLE YEARS, IT'S GONNA COST ME AND MY WIFE SOMETHING TO LOSE A HUNDRED OR $150,000 OF EQUITY OUT OF OUR HOME BECAUSE IT'S PROJECT I GET.
I MAY NOT BE CONSIDERED ABOUT THAT, BUT I THANK YOU FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO VOICE OUR CONCERNS AS A RESIDENT HERE.
WE HAVE NOBODY ELSE ON THE LIST IS EDDIE BELLS.
WE HAVE ANOTHER GENTLEMAN, YOUR ADDRESS, NAME FILTER THROUGH ALBUMS 13 ROAD YEAH.
FROM THE FIREHOUSE, WHICH YOU LOVE.
YOU'RE ALL FAMILIAR WITH SHANNON DELL DOWN IN LOWER PROVIDENCE? SURE.
IF THIS PLAN GETS KICKED OUT OR THE PLAN BEFORE WHICH WAS KICKED OUT, HOW MUCH OF A CHANCE IS THERE FOR DALE TO BE BUILT HERE? WE, BECAUSE YOU, YOU KNOW, MEXICO, THERE IS A POSSIBILITY, DISTINCT POSSIBILITY THAT COULD, COULD HAPPEN HERE.
AS WE SAID, WE'RE ONLY AT 70% OF THE PERMITTED DENSITY, SO YOU COULD END UP HAVING ALL APARTMENTS.
WE, WE, YOU KNOW, HIGH RISE IS, THAT'S NOT OUR PLAN, BUT ABSOLUTELY.
IT'S A HYPOTHETICAL QUESTION FOR YOU.
OH, HOLD ON, MA'AM, WE GOT GOT, I THINK THIS GENTLEMAN'S NEXT.
MARK DAVIS, 1 22 BYINGTON ROAD.
UM, YOU'VE ALREADY GONE THROUGH THE EXPLANATION OF HOW THIS FITS THE ORDINANCES AND I JUST WANNA SAY THAT IS FASCINATING THAT THIS CLEARLY NOT ASSISTED LIVING COMMUNITY SOMEHOW CLASSIFIES ASSISTED LIVING.
UH, THERE'S A PHRASE THAT THE KIDS USE FOR FOLLOWING THE LETTER OF THE RULE WITH THE INTENT OF GOING AGAINST THE SPIRIT OF IT.
IT'S CALLED MALICIOUS COMPLIANCE.
WE TOOK AWAY THE CUTE LITTLE WILLIAMSBURG, WE SAID NO.
SO LET'S TRY TO INFLICT AS MUCH HARM ON THE COMMUNITY AS WE CAN WHILE FOLLOWING THE RULES.
THIS IS MY SECOND TIME UP HERE TONIGHT.
JUDY SHEETS ONE 17 OLD STATE ROAD.
[01:30:02]
I MISSED HOW MANY SINGLE FAMILY HOMES THERE WERE IN THIS DEVELOPMENT.HOW MANY ARE 153? 153? I I'M SURE YOU WANNA SELL ALL THOSE.
AND I'M JUST WONDERING HOW MANY FAMILIES 62 AND ABOVE ARE GOING TO CONTINUE TO PURCHASE THESE HOMES AT, AT THAT AGE.
PEOPLE ARE DOWNSIZING, THEY'RE MOVING TO FLORIDA, ARIZONA, OR PARTS UNKNOWN.
HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE GOING TO WANT A SINGLE FAMILY HOME AT, I MEAN, I DON'T WANT THE, I DON'T WANT TO SEE ANYTHING STARTED AND THEN FAIL.
AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, REST OF THE COMMUNITY WOULDN'T WANNA SEE IT FAIL, BUT I, I CAN'T SEE WHO WOULD WANNA BUY THEM.
WELL, OUR, OUR MARKET STUDIES SHOW THAT THERE IS AN INCREASING NEED FOR SENIOR HOUSING AND AT A CORRESPONDING DECREASE OF AVAILABLE SENIOR HOUSING.
AND WE ARE CONVINCED AND HAVE BEEN ADVISED BY OUR EXPERTS THAT THERE WILL BE NO PROBLEM MARKETING ALL OF THESE UNITS.
MY NAME'S SUSAN DENBY AND I LIVE AT 1 35 BENNINGTON ROAD.
THANK YOU FOR HOLDING THIS TONIGHT AND MAKING IT A SPECIAL EVENING FOR US TO HELP AIR OUR, OUR CONCERNS.
ONE THING I REALLY WOULD ASK YOU TO CONSIDER IS LIKE HOW, HOW BEAUTIFUL THIS AREA TRULY IS.
THE ONE REASON I MOVED HERE WAS BECAUSE OF THE SCENERY.
AND WHEN YOU COME DOWN ONE 13, YOU SEE SUCH A BEAUTIFUL SETTING AND I HATE TO LOSE ALL OF THAT.
AND I HOPE THAT YOU WOULD CONSIDER THE HEIGHT THAT NO, UH, YOU KNOW, KEEP IT TO A SEC, LIKE TWO STORIES.
KEEP IT TO ONE STORY ACTUALLY.
IF IT'S PEOPLE WHO ARE OLDER, THEY DON'T WANT TWO STORIES.
AND TO MAKE THIS INTO SOMETHING WHERE IT STARTS TO LOOK LIKE KING OF PRIA MAKES ME SICK TOO.
AND THIS AREA WAS, IS NOT A CITY.
IT, IT NEEDS TO STAY OPEN AND NOT HAVE 1200 NEW HOUSES HERE.
HOW MANY HOUSES ARE RIGHT HERE WITHIN THIS VICINITY RIGHT NOW? ARE THERE 1200? YOU'RE GONNA DOUBLE IT.
I, I JUST IS IS I ASK THE, THAT YOU CONSIDER OPEN SPACE AGRICULTURALLY PROTECTED.
WHERE ARE ALL THOSE THINGS THAT WERE IN, IN YOUR PLANS? SUSTAINABILITY, WHERE IS IT? PLEASE SHOW IT HERE.
SO LISA MOSSIE AGAIN, JUST, UM, AS WE'RE SITTING HERE THINKING ABOUT THIS, JEFF, I THINK YOU WERE OUTTA THE ROOM WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT THIS, BUT THIS, THERE'S NO NURSING COMPONENT WITH THIS AND WE'VE KIND OF TALKED ABOUT THAT A LOT TONIGHT.
AND WE TALKED ABOUT HOW THIS IS KIND OF AN AGE RESTRICTED COMMUNITY.
YOU WERE, YOU WERE ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION, YOU WERE, YOU WERE OUR PLANNER WHEN I WAS ON THE BOARD, AND WE TALKED ABOUT THIS WITH RIDGEWOOD, AND MY CONCERN HERE IS THAT WE APPROVED THIS UNDER THIS, UNDER THIS LIKE LOOSELY INTERPRETED I N DISTRICT AND ALL OF A SUDDEN THEY COME TO US MIDWAY THROUGH THE PROJECT AND SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT? WE REALLY CAN'T, WE REALLY CAN'T SUSTAIN THE AGE RESTRICTED.
SO NOW WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO OPEN IT UP TO EVERYBODY, THEN WE'RE GONNA HAVE IMPACTS TO OUR SCHOOLS.
JUST LIKE WHAT HAPPENED WITH RIDGEWOOD AND WE CHANGED OUR ZONING BECAUSE OF WHAT HAPPENED TO RIDGEWOOD AND NOW WE'VE GOT THIS.
SO I'M JUST SAYING BEFORE BULLDOZERS HIT THE GROUND, WE BETTER BE 100% SURE THAT THIS IS GONNA BE A VIABLE, SUSTAINABLE COMMUNITY.
AND I DON'T TRUST ANYTHING THAT COMES FROM THIS GROUP AS FAR AS FEASIBILITY STUDIES, COMMUNITY IMPACT STUDIES, ANYTHING.
THERE IS, THANK I WOULD JUST, UM, POINT OUT ONE THING IN RESPONSE TO THAT.
ALTHOUGH THERE'S FEASIBILITY STUDIES REFERENCED IN, IN THE ORDINANCE AND THEY'RE PROVIDING FEASIBILITY STUDIES NORMALLY WHEN WE CAN REQUEST A FEASIBILITY STUDY WHEN AN APPLICANT COMES TO THE, THE TOWNSHIP AND SAYS, I NEED YOU TO CHANGE THE ZONING ORDINANCE.
[01:35:01]
AND THAT PUTS THE DISCRETION UP HERE WITH THE SUPERVISORS.AND THEY SAY, AND I'VE BEEN INVOLVED WITH THIS NUMEROUS TIMES IN DIFFERENT PLACES WHERE THEY SAY, YOU KNOW, NOT SO FAST, WE'LL CONSIDER CHANGING THE ORDINANCE ONLY IF WE KNOW THAT THE PROJECT WILL BE FEASIBLE, IF IT'S GONNA FAIL, WE'RE NOT GONNA CHANGE THE ORDINANCE TO FACILITATE FAILURE WHEN THEY DON'T NEED AN ORDINANCE CHANGE.
THEY CAN'T BE COMPELLED, THEY'RE ALLOWED TO FAIL.
I MEAN, WHAT YOU SAY COULD HAPPEN MIGHT HAPPEN, BUT THAT COULD HAPPEN WITH EVERY LAND DEVELOPMENT PROJECT THAT COMES IN.
I DON'T, BUT WHAT WOULD WE DO WITH IT? I CAN'T, WE CAN'T, WE COULDN'T USE IT AS A BASIS.
THEY HAVE TO GO PAST THE CONDITIONAL USE HERE AND PROVE THAT THEY MEET THE CRITERIA.
BUT OTHERWISE THEY, THEY MEET THE CRITERIA BY A LOOSE INTERPRETATION OF THE TERM FACILITY.
IF YOU LISA, IF YOU, JOE, YOU KNOW, YOU GOTTA SPEAK INTO THE MIC.
I MEAN, WE'RE NEVER GONNA PICK THIS UP.
WE CAN'T BE YELLING OUT, SPEAK UP.
THE, THE, I WAS SAYING IT GENERALLY, BUT THEN IT SEEMED TO APPLY THE MOST TO YOU.
NO, UH, UNDER THAT, I DON'T THINK IT IS THAT LOOSE.
I HEAR WHAT EVERYBODY'S SAYING, BUT UNDER THE WAR DECISION, IT'S NOT THAT LOOSE.
IT'S JUST NOT, I MEAN I JOE, MAYBE IT'D HELP IF I READ FROM THE WAR SISTER DECISION WHERE IT SAID THE RED AND THE WAR.
WHAT THEY HAD WAS, UH, 164 DETACHED INDEPENDENT LIVING VILLA UNITS 170 ATTACHED INDEPENDENT LIVING CARRIAGE HOUSES.
AND THEN THEY HAD A SENIOR CARE COMPLEX, 61 SENIOR INDEPENDENT LIVING UNITS.
AND THEN THERE WAS 80 ASSISTED LIVING FACILITIES.
AND THE DEFINITION OF THE ORDINANCE WAS, IT'S A RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT RESTRICTED TO THE ELDERLY THAT PROVIDES A CONTINUUM OF ACCOMMODATION AND CARE FROM INDEPENDENT LIVING UNITS TO PERSONAL CARE AND NURSING HOMES, INDEPENDENT LIVING UNITS ARE DWELLING UNITS LOCATED WITHIN A RESIDENTIAL LIFE CARE FACILITY.
AND THE COURT SAID THAT THEY'RE SEPARATE LIVING UNITS AND EVERYTHING ELSE WERE PERFECTLY FINE.
AND IT GOT APPEALED IN THE COMMONWEALTH COURT.
I ACTUALLY COULDN'T, I WAS STUNNED WHEN I GOT THE DECISION.
I I THOUGHT THAT THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT THERE WAS SOMETHING TO WORK WITH THERE AND THERE JUST IS NOT.
I'M, ED COULD I ASK YOU THIS? SOMETHING ON THAT, IN THE WAR DECISION, DID THEY HAVE PERSONNEL ON SITE THAT PROVIDED ADDITIONAL CARE IN THAT COMMUNITY? OH, YES.
I MEAN, ON, ON THE CONTINGENT PROPERTY? NO, I'M JUST ASKING.
BUT AS WE DEVELOP THIS AND WE GO THROUGH THE STAGES, OBVIOUSLY SINCE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SENIOR LIVING, RIGHT? WE'RE GONNA HAVE THE ASSOCIATION THAT'S GONNA TAKE CARE OF ALL EXTERIOR MAINTENANCE.
THERE'S GONNA BE DOWNSTAIR MASTER BEDROOMS THAT THERE'S GONNA BE ALARMS IN THE, IN THE HOUSES TO PUSH A BUTTON.
THERE'S GOING TO BE FULL TIME 24 HOUR SEVEN STAFF IN THE ASSISTED LIVING.
BUT IT'LL, IT'LL BE, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT'S SO IT'S A STEPPING PROCESS IS WHAT YOU'RE, WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING ABSOLUTELY.
SINGLE FAMILY TO ASSISTED LIVING TO ABSOLUTELY.
AND ASSISTED LIVING IS WHERE THE NURSING IS AVAILABLE RIGHT NEXT DOOR? NO, NO, THEY'RE THEY'RE ASKING WHERE IN THE OVERALL LAYOUT OF THE DESIGN WITH THE, THE MEDICAL COMPONENT, THE, THE CARE, WHICH BUILDING IS, LET'S HAVE RON, YOU WANNA SHOW, WHICH IS THE ASSISTED LIVING BUILDING, BY THE WAY, EVERYBODY'S BEEN GREAT ALL NIGHT AND VERY COURTEOUS, BUT LET'S KEEP IT ROLLING WITH THE COURTEOUSNESS WITHOUT CAT CALLING.
AND THAT'S THE 45 UNIT, 90 BED ASSISTED LIVING FACILITY.
SO THERE'S 45 UNITS FOR 1200 PEOPLE TO 2,400 PEOPLE LIVING THERE FOR ASSISTED LIVING.
AND THAT IS CONTIN CONSIDERED A CONTINUUM OF CARE.
I I I I'M SURE YOU'LL READ IT AND HAVE OPINIONS ABOUT IT.
WE'LL CHALLENGE IT
BUT I'M TELL MY INTERPRETATION WAS THAT IT MET THE, THAT THAT DECISION APPLIED TO THIS APPLICATION.
UH, I'VE BEEN LISTENING TO EVERYTHING.
YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS, NAME AND ADDRESS, PLEASE.
I LIVE AT FIVE STARLING COURT IN PHOENIXVILLE, WHICH IS MONTGOMERY ACADEMY.
AND I'VE LIVED HERE FOR 20 YEARS.
AND WHEN I CAME TONIGHT WITH THE PLANNING COMMISSION, I HAD GREAT CONCERNS WHEN I SOLD 1200.
I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'S A RIGHT TO BUILD, BUT I ALSO KNOW THOSE ROADS VERY WELL IN THE BRIDGE IN THE RIVER.
[01:40:01]
TO THE FOOTPRINT THAT THIS WILL BRING.SURELY THE TOWNSHIP AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION MUST HAVE SOME SAY IF IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE 1200 UNITS.
UH, THERE ARE RETIREMENT COMMUNITIES LIKE, UH, WHITE WHO, HORSE VILLAGE THAT I'M VERY FAMILIAR WITH.
BUT WITH ALL OF THE PEOPLE THERE, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE ALL OF THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE TO WORK THERE.
AND THAT BRIDGE IS TINY AND THEY FLOOD.
IT'S, IT JUST, TO ME DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.
I LOOK AT IT AND I THINK I, I JUST DON'T SEE IT.
AND I'VE LOOKED AT PLANS AND I, I JUST DON'T.
SO I'M HOPING THAT THE TOWNSHIP HAS A REAL SENSE OF WHO WE ARE AND WHERE WE'RE GOING.
MY CHILDREN, MY GRANDCHILDREN LIVE HERE.
AND THAT WE WON'T DO SOMETHING THAT CHANGES THAT FOOTPRINT SO DRASTICALLY AND PUTS TRAFFIC ON THOSE ROADS.
SO THANK YOU FOR WHAT YOU DO THERE.
I'VE ALSO BEEN A RESIDENT OF MONTCLAIR, PENNSYLVANIA.
UM, THE IMPORTANT THING THAT I ACTUALLY WANNA BRING OUT HERE IS, UM, I HAD BORN AND RAISED IN MONTCLAIR AND THEN OBVIOUSLY I'VE GOTTEN OLDER.
I MOVED AWAY, LIVED IN CONSHOHOCKEN, AND I WAS ABLE TO SEE HOW BIG AND DEVELOPED THAT PARTICULAR AREA CAME.
UNFORTUNATELY, I HAD TO MOVE BACK HOME.
SO MY QUESTION IS, I USED TO RIDE HORSES WITH MY BEST FRIENDS.
UM, I USED TO PLAY ON THIS LAND, BUT THE QUESTION THAT I HAVE IS, BEING A YOUNG SINGLE WOMAN, NOW, HOW ARE WE GONNA END UP, WHO ARE ALL THESE PEOPLE, THESE HOUSES NOW THAT THEY'RE BUILDING THE TOWNHOUSE COMMUNITIES, ALL THESE TOWNHOUSES, ALL THESE RETIREMENT HOMES.
I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHAT 62 YEAR OLD IS GONNA BE ABLE TO AFFORD A HALF A MILLION DOLLAR HOUSE.
MAYBE EVEN A HUNDRED, OR EXCUSE ME, LIKE A MILLION.
IF YOU LOOK AT SOME OF THESE RETIREMENT COMMUNITIES, THEY'RE LIKE $900,000.
WHO THE HELL CAN AFFORD THAT? THIS IS THE THING THAT WE'RE BRINGING IN.
LISTEN, I UNDERSTAND THAT THIS HAS TO BE BUILT.
I GET THAT I RESPECT IT, BUT AT THE SAME POINT IN TIME, IS IT ABOUT MONEY OR IS IT ABOUT MAKING A COMMUNITY THAT GENERATIONS BEYOND ME WILL BE ABLE TO LAST DRIVE THROUGH, LIVE THROUGH.
AND AS THE GENTLEMAN, AS THE POLICE OFFICER SARAH OVER THERE WAS SAYING, YOU BRING IN A LOT OF THINGS, YOU START TO MOVE PEOPLE OUT, MORE CRIME, YOU'VE GOT MORE ISSUES.
SO IF YOU'RE GONNA DO SOMETHING LIKE THIS, OBVIOUSLY YOU'RE GOING TO AT LEAST RESPECT THE AREA, RESPECT THE COMMUNITY, AND MORE IMPORTANTLY, RESPECT THE PRICES BECAUSE YOU KEEP DRIVING UP.
WHAT'S HAPPENING IS YOU'RE PUSHING THE PEOPLE THAT YOU GUYS DON'T WANT IN THE COMMUNITY.
CUZ NOT EVERYBODY CAN AFFORD HALF A MILLION MILLION DOLLAR HOMES.
AND PEOPLE LIKE ME WHO MAYBE WANNA RAISE A FAMILY HERE, WE CAN'T.
SO ALL AS I ASK IS THAT ALL OF YOU GUYS, PLEASE LOOK AT THE THINGS, TRAFFICS, HOW IT'S GONNA AFFECT SCHOOL, HOW IT'S GONNA AFFECT WILDLIFE, HOW IT'S GONNA IMPACT FUTURE GENERATIONS, AND MORE IMPORTANTLY, HOW MUCH IS IT GONNA DRIVE UP PRICES.
I MOVED HOME AND FORTUNATELY I WAS ABLE TO MOVE HOME.
NOW WHERE THE HECK ARE THESE 62 YEAR OLD PEOPLE COMING FROM? I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHERE ARE THEY COMING FROM? YOU WANT 'EM ALL HERE? THAT'S GREAT, BUT WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN WHEN THEY CAN'T AFFORD IT? WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN TO THE COMMUNITY WHEN OTHER PEOPLE CANNOT AFFORD THOSE HOMES? IT IS GONNA HAVE TO DROP DOWN TO 55 OR A LOWER.
THAT'S MY WHOLE CONCERN IN REGARDS TO THAT IS ONE, WHO ARE THE PEOPLE? WHERE ARE THEY COMING FROM, AND HOW MUCH MORE IMPACT DO YOU GUYS WANNA TAKE UP? THERE'S NOT MUCH LAND AROUND, THERE'S NOT MUCH LAND LEFT.
PEOPLE WANNA BE ABLE TO MOVE TO THIS COMMUNITY.
PEOPLE WHO GREW UP HERE WOULD LIKE TO MOVE HOME BECAUSE IT IS HOME.
THANK YOU GUYS FOR LETTING ME SPEAK.
BUT AGAIN, I JUST ASK YOU, PLEASE THINK ABOUT IT.
WE KNOW THERE'S, SOMETHING'S GONNA BE BUILT.
JUST THINK ABOUT THE PRICING, THINK ABOUT THE COMMUNITY, THINK ABOUT HOW IT'S GONNA AFFECT EVERYTHING, AND LET'S COME ACROSS TO THE BEST SOLUTION FOR YOU GUYS AND FOR ALL OF US.
CAN OUR SEWER WATER TREATMENT PLANT SUSTAIN ADDITIONAL 1200? I'M SORRY, YOUR NAME AGAIN, SIR, JUST SO I MAKE SURE I NOTE IT.
MICHAEL KJA 1 0 4 BENINGTON ROAD.
CAN OUR SEWER WATER TREATMENT PLANT SUSTAIN AN ADDITIONAL 1200 INDIVIDUALS FECAL MATTER DISCHARGE? EVERYTHING? YEAH, THE TOWNSHIP'S FLOW GOES TO THE REGIONAL.
UH, WE JUST HAVE CONVEYANCE LINES AND I DO BELIEVE THERE'S EDU'S THERE FOR THAT.
OUR OAKS EDS ARE AVAILABLE, RIGHT? I THINK WE CONFIRMED THAT ALREADY.
I HAVEN'T HEARD ANYBODY ASK THAT QUESTION YET.
THEY CERTAINLY DO HAVE TO CONFIRM IT BEFORE THEY EVER GET APPROVALS.
[01:45:01]
AND I, I THOUGHT I, I DO BELIEVE THE CAPACITY IS THERE AND THE DEVELOPER NEEDS TO PURCHASE ADDITIONAL EDS FOR THE MM-HMM.WE'RE GETTING SOME PEOPLE COMING BACK.
IS THERE ANYBODY WHO WANTS TO SPEAK WHO HASN'T SPOKEN YET? NORMALLY WE STICK WITH, YOU KNOW, ONE TIME PER CUSTOMER, BUT WE, WE DO HAVE A LITTLE TIME LEFT FOR PEOPLE SECOND, BUT BOB, DO YOU WANT TO GO, LET'S TAKE A REAL QUICK, UH, COMMENT, UH, FOLLOW UP ON WHAT, UM, MRS. SHEET SAID AND WHAT, UH, MS. MOSSY SAID REGARDING THE, THE AMOUNT OF SINGLE FAMILY HOMES HERE.
BECAUSE I THINK THEY HAVE A GOOD POINT IN IS THERE TRULY A MARKET FOR THAT AGE GROUP, SINGLE FAMILY HOMES, AND IF THEY DON'T GET SOLD, IS THERE A HARDSHIP NOW IN FRONT OF THE SUPERVISORS? AND, AND THE OTHER POINT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ALL TALKING ABOUT HOW THIS IS GONNA AFFECT US, BUT THE POINT I'D REALLY LIKE TO MAKE IS HOW IT'S GONNA AFFECT THE ENVIRONMENT.
I MEAN, THIS IS THE RURAL PART OF THE TOWNSHIP.
OF COURSE IT ALWAYS HAS BEEN SINCE THIS WAS BOUGHT TO BE A FARM IN 1801 AND THAT'S WHAT IT'S BEEN EVER SINCE.
FINAL COMMENT IS WE HAVE THIS DENSITY OF ZONING AND CONSTRUCTION GOING ON AT PROVIDENCE OF PARK TOWN.
I DON'T THINK WE NEED IT HERE.
SO I'M BOB DELROSE, 3 0 1 VISTA DRIVE.
I'M SORRY, COULD YOU SAY THAT AGAIN? YEAH.
UM, NUMBER ONE, THE ISSUE ON THE DOCUMENTS AND EXPOSURE TO THE DOCUMENTS.
YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND THE RIGHT TO KNOW.
I UNDERSTAND THAT IT'S BEEN EXPOSED, RIGHT? GOT THERE TODAY.
UM, BUT GIVE SOME CONSIDERATION.
GIVE SOME CONSIDERATION TO THE PEOPLE WHO NEED TO DEAL WITH THESE DOCUMENTS.
LIKE FOR US TO THINK WE CAN GET THIS THING AN HOUR BEFORE THE MEETING AND COME IN HERE PREPARED AND SPEAK INTELLIGENTLY ABOUT IT, THAT'S NOT REALLY FAIR, RIGHT? SO I THINK GETTING DOCUMENTS EARLIER IN SOME WAY, SHAPE OR FORM IS REALLY IMPORTANT TO US.
AND I THINK UNDERSTANDING THE PROCESS THAT HAS TO BE GONE THROUGH HERE AND THE TIMELINE FOR THAT PROCESS IS HELPFUL.
AND I THINK IT WOULD BETTER PREPARE US.
WE MIGHT COME IN WITH DIFFERENT COMMENTS, BETTER THOUGHT THROUGH SITUATIONS.
I'D LIKE TO HEAR MORE ABOUT THAT TIMELINE.
I'D LIKE TO SEE IT IN WRITING SO THAT WE KNOW TO GO AND REQUEST THE DOCUMENTS IF THAT'S WHAT WE HAVE TO DO.
IF THEY CAN'T BE MADE AVAILABLE TO US ANY OTHER WAY.
BUT I THINK HELP US GET READY IN THAT PROCESS.
YOU GUYS WANNA DO YOUR JOB, WE HAVE TO DO OUR JOB.
AND THAT'S ONE WAY TO DO THAT.
AND NUMBER TWO IS, YOU KNOW, I LOOK AT THIS THING AND I JUST LOOK AND SAY, EVERYBODY TAKE A LOOK AT THAT.
I DON'T CARE WHAT THE NUMBERS SAY, I DON'T CARE ABOUT THE LITTLE BIT OF OPEN GROUND AT THE BOTTOM, 70%.
THAT IS A REALLY DENSE, DENSE, DENSE LOOKING PLAN UP THERE.
AND I THINK IT'S UNFAIR TO IMPOSE THAT ON THE COMMUNITY.
NO ONE WANTS IT THAT I KNOW I TALK TO A LOT OF PEOPLE IN MY COMMUNITY, EVERYBODY OPPOSES IT.
NO ONE THINKS IT'S A GOOD THING.
I LOOK AT THE FACES IN THE CROWD, I LOOK AT YOUR FACES.
I DON'T THINK ANYBODY THINKS IT'S A GOOD THING EXCEPT THE FOLKS WHO ARE TRYING TO PUSH IT THROUGH.
AND IT'S OBVIOUSLY ABOUT GETTING BENEFIT FROM THE INVESTMENT THAT'S BEEN MADE HERE AND REALIZING SOMETHING ON THAT, RIGHT? I DON'T THINK ANYBODY WHO ACTUALLY LIVES HERE THINKS IT'S A GREAT THING AND I THINK WE SHOULD STAND UP AND DO SOMETHING ABOUT IT.
AND WE'RE LOOKING TO YOU GUYS TO DO THAT, RIGHT? TO THINK ABOUT US, THINK ABOUT THE SENTIMENT THAT YOU'RE ADHERING HERE.
WE'RE POINTING OUT INDIVIDUAL THINGS AS BEST WE CAN, BUT THE OVERALL SENTIMENT IN THIS ROOM, AND IF YOU WENT AND SURVEYED THE COMMUNITY AROUND HERE, YOU WOULD HEAR MUCH MORE OF THIS.
AND IN A MUCH STRONGER FASHION, I THINK, THAN EVEN SOME OF THE PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM ARE TALKING.
I UNDERSTAND THERE'S AN INVESTMENT HERE.
I UNDERSTAND SOMEBODY'S GONNA WANT TO DO SOMETHING TO MAKE SOME MONEY ON THAT, BUT THIS IS JUST TOO MUCH.
WE CAN'T SWALLOW THIS AND IT'S NOT A GOOD THING.
I THINK IT VIOLATES THE SPIRIT OF THE RULE, RIGHT? YOU MIGHT HAVE SMART LAWYERS FIGURING OUT HOW TO MAKE IT COMPLY TECHNICALLY.
BUT I THINK IT GOES BEYOND THAT.
I THINK THE SPIRIT IS WHAT MATTERS HERE.
I LOOK AT THE WORDS THAT WERE ON THAT PAGE UP THERE AND SAY, SURE, YOU CAN SHOEHORN THIS IN TO MAKE IT COMPLY WITH THOSE WORDS, BUT ISN'T OUR JOB AND YOUR JOB TO DO THE RIGHT THING AND ISN'T THE RIGHT THING TO PROTECT US? AND THIS GOES A LITTLE BIT TOO FAR.
ANYBODY CAN SEE THAT FROM LOOKING AT THIS.
RIGHT? YOU MIGHT AGAIN LOOK FOR SOME TECHNICAL WAY TO CALL IT A FACILITY, BUT IT'S NOT A FACILITY.
WE KNOW THAT IN LOOKING AT THE PLAN.
I HAVEN'T STUDIED THE PLAN IN DETAIL, BUT I THINK IT'S CLEAR ENOUGH JUST IN LOOKING AT THIS, SEEING IT AND HEARING IT AND JUST ASK YOU GUYS FOR HELP.
[01:50:02]
MR. WELL, ONE THING I CAN, I CAN TELL YOU ONE THING ABOUT MR. WELLING HAD SIGNED UP.I'M SORRY, MR. WELLING HAD SIGNED UP IN THE TIE.
I CAN TELL YOU ONE THING ABOUT THE TIMELINE THAT, THAT YOU MIGHT FIND HELPFUL RATHER THAN ME REGURGITATING IT ALL HERE.
UH, IF YOU GO TO THE WEBSITE FOR THE DEPARTMENT OF COMMUNITY AND ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, THEY HAVE A DROPDOWN FOR MUNICIPAL AND THEN THEY HAVE A LIBRARY OF PUBLICATIONS ON EVERY MUNICIPAL ISSUE.
AND THEY HAVE ONE CALLED SUBDIVISION IN LAND DEVELOPMENT.
AND IT HAS THE WHOLE PROCESS SPELLED OUT IN PLAIN ENGLISH FOR REGULAR PEOPLE, UH, TO UNDERSTAND.
UM, AND IT'S, I HAVE THOSE AS WELL.
IF, I MEAN, IF SOMEONE WANTS TO CONTACT ME, I'VE EMAILED THEM TO PLENTY OF PEOPLE.
I KEEP THE CENTER FOR LOCAL GOVERNMENT HANDBOOKS READY? SO NAME.
I LIVE AT 1 35 BENNINGTON ROAD.
I THANK YOU FOR SERVING THE COMMUNITY AND I APPRECIATE YOU LISTENING TO US.
UH, I HEARD SOMETHING EARLY ON FROM THE APPLICANT ABOUT PRESERVATION OF OPEN SPACE AND, AND, AND THAT TYPE OF VISION.
AND I, I WAS ALARMED AT HEARING THAT BECAUSE I THINK THERE WAS AN OPINION OR AN ASSERTION.
THIS IS ANY KIND OF A, AN ATTEMPT AT PRESERVING SOME OPEN SPACE.
YEAH, THERE'S A CHUNK THERE AND SOMETHING, UM, I I WANNA GET BACK.
I REALLY APPRECIATE YOUR LISTENING, BUT I REALLY HEARD SOME KEY POINTS THAT I HOPE YOU TOOK NOTES ON.
UM, MR. KJA READ SOME GREAT POINTS ABOUT IMPACT ON WILDLIFE, IMPACT ON, YOU KNOW, THIS AREA OF OPEN SPACE THAT WE ALL VALUE.
UH, I AGREE WITH MS. BOSSY, THIS IS HORRIBLE.
I'D LIKE TO REPEAT THE SCREAM THAT I HEARD, BUT I DON'T THINK I CAN REASONABLY REPEAT THAT, UH, AND DO JUSTICE TO IT.
UM, WE HEARD A LOT OF GREAT STATEMENTS FROM FOLKS, UH, MR. DAVENPORT, UH, THANK YOU TO HIM FOR RAISING THE ISSUE OF THE POTENTIAL IMPACT OF HOW THIS COULD LEAD TO A DEGRADATION IN THE QUALITY OF LIFE OF THIS COMMUNITY.
SO I I I JUST ASK THAT YOU SERIOUSLY CONSIDER SOME OF THE KEY POINTS MALICIOUS COMPLIANCE.
AND, AND WHETHER THIS REALLY TRUE, TRULY MEETS THE VISION WE WANT FOR THIS COMMUNITY.
I SEE ROOTED IN HISTORY, I I HEARD SOME POINTS ABOUT, GEE, ARE WE REALLY CONSIDERING THAT PART OF OUR VISION WHEN WE THINK OF THAT ONE ROOM SCHOOLHOUSE IN THE POTTERS FIELDS GROWING IN PROMISE.
THIS IS NOT THE PROMISE WE WERE LOOKING FOR IN THE COMMUNITY.
WHO'S MY NEIGHBOR? I'LL, UH, I'VE BEEN DEFERRING.
I JUST, I HAVE, I JUST HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS.
JUST PULL THE MIC DOWN AND CLOSER TO YOU.
I OFTEN HAVE A I UNDERSTAND SPEAKING VOICE.
UM, SO A QUESTION THAT I HAVE, BECAUSE I, AGAIN, I GUESS I CHEATED, I HAVE SOME OF THE DOCUMENTS THAT WERE AVAILABLE.
UM, THERE WERE 15 RECOMMENDATIONS FROM THE MONTGOMERY COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION.
AND I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THE, UH, AUDIENCE KNOWS THAT THOSE RECOMMENDATIONS HAVE SOME SPECIFIC IMPACT TO THE ACTUAL DELIVERY OF THIS PROPOSAL.
UM, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I ALSO WANTED TO ASK IS TO THE APPLICANTS, HAVE YOU CONSULTED WITH MONTGOMERY COUNTY OFFICE OF HOMELESS SERVICES, THE MONTGOMERY COUNTY DEPARTMENT OF BEHAVIORAL HEALTH AND INTELLECTUAL SERVICES? BECAUSE WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DEVELOPMENT OF A FACILITY, WHICH I'VE DEVELOPED A NUMBER OF THEM, THEY TYPICALLY ARE CONGREGATE CARE.
UH, WE KNOW THAT PARKHOUSE HAS AN IMD EXCLUSION, UH, CMS, WHICH IS MEDICARE, MEDICAID CAN PAY FOR SERVICES THERE.
SO OUT OF 1,205 UNITS, ARE YOU GOING TO BE BILLING MEDICARE FOR SERVICES THAT ARE OFFERED TO THIS RESIDENT POPULATION? IF IT'S A FACILITY, IF IT'S A RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY, IT IS ELIGIBLE TO BE FEDERALLY FUNDED THROUGH MEDICARE, BECAUSE THAT WOULD INCLUDE SERVICES COMING TO AN INDIVIDUAL'S HOME OR TO A FACILITY WHERE MEDICARE CAN BE BILLED.
SO AGAIN, AN IMPACT AROUND, AGAIN, THE, THE QUESTION ABOUT WHAT THE DEFINITION IS OF A RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY VERSUS WHAT THIS IS,
[01:55:01]
THIS IS NOT A RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY.I THINK YOU HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE DOING OUR HOMEWORK BECAUSE THERE ARE FEDERAL LAWS THAT SAY YOU ALSO HAVE TO ALLOW ACCOMMODATIONS FOR MANY DIFFERENT TYPES OF NEURODIVERSITY POPULATIONS.
AND THAT IS AN IMPORTANT FACTOR BECAUSE WE HAVE A HOMELESS POPULATION IN MONTGOMERY COUNTY THAT IS SITTING THERE WITHOUT HOUSING TONIGHT AND, AND TINTED, OKAY.
AND WE'RE NOT DOING ANYTHING ABOUT THOSE INDIVIDUALS, BUT IF WE ALLOW THIS, THIS IS DISGUSTING.
IT'S AN, IT'S AN, IT'S AN IMPACT THAT SPEAKS LOUD AND CLEAR ABOUT WHAT UPPER PROVIDENCE TOWNSHIP WILL ALLOW.
UH, GLENN OER 1 97 DRIVABLE BUS ROAD.
UH, DOES ANYBODY REALLY KNOW THE, THE DEFINITION OF RESTRICTED USE RELATIVE TO AGE RESTRICTED USE? DOES THAT MEAN THAT I'M A, I'M 67 AND I HAVE FOUR GRANDCHILDREN.
SO MY GRANDKIDS COME OVER TO MY HOUSE ALL THE TIME.
SOMETIMES THEY GET THE SCHOOL BUS AT MY HOUSE.
WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN? CAUSE THIS IS AN INDEPENDENT ASSOCIATION THAT'S GONNA BE MANAGING THIS PROPERTY.
SO WHAT'S GONNA STOP A GRANDPARENT FROM HAVING THEIR CHILDREN STAY WITH THEM IN THE RESIDENCE AND PUTTING THEM ON A SCHOOL BUS? THEY WOULD BE VIOLATING THE RULES OF THE COMMUNITY.
THERE'S CERTAINLY NOTHING WRONG WITH THE GRANDCHILDREN COMING TO VISIT.
TYPICALLY IN HOMEOWNERS ASSOCIATIONS, THERE'S A, AN EXCLUSION SAYING THE CHILDREN CAN LIVE THERE FOR A PERIOD UP TO 30 DAYS FOR IF THE PARENTS ARE ON VACATION OR SOMETHING.
BUT IF YOU REGISTER YOUR CHILD WITH THE SCHOOL DISTRICT, HAVE THE SCHOOL BUS PICK 'EM UP, YOU COULD END UP LOSING YOUR HOUSE.
UM, YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO DO IT.
AND THERE WAS EVEN ONE, ONE CASE IN LANSDALE BOROUGH WHERE THE HOMEOWNER'S ASSOCIATION WAS BOTH PARTIES HAD TO BE 55 AND UP.
AND WHAT HAPPENED? NO, I'M SORRY.
IT HAD TO HAVE AT LEAST ONE PERSON 55 YEARS OR OLDER.
AND THE HUSBAND DIED AND THE WIFE WAS 45 AND THEY MADE HER MOVE.
SO, BUT THE ASSOCIATION HAS TO POLICE THAT.
THE ASSOCIATION WHAT HAS TO POLICE THAT.
AND THEY'RE PART OF THE COMMUNITY.
THEY'RE ACTUALLY RESIDENTS OF THE COMMUNITY, RIGHT? ABSOLUTELY.
AND ARE THOSE, IS THOSE RULES, ARE THOSE RULES WRITTEN OR THEY WILL BE WRITTEN BY THE ASSOCIATION, ONE THAT IS DEVELOPED.
THEY WILL BE WRITTEN AND SUBMITTED TO MR. BREMOND DURING THE PROCESS OF PRELIMINARY PLAN.
THEY'LL BE WRITTEN BEFORE THE, BEFORE THE, UH, BEFORE PRELIMINARY PLAN APPROVAL.
UM, AND ANOTHER QUESTION ABOUT, I'M ASSUMING THAT THE DARK BROWN OR BASINS, HANG ON, SIR.
THERE'S A LOT OF TALKING IN THE AUDIENCE.
IF WE COULD JUST PLEASE HANG ON A LITTLE LONGER AND AND BE RESPECTFUL TO THE PERSON AT THE PODIUM.
ARE THE, IS THE DARK BRAND BASINS CATCH BASINS? THAT'S THE FLOOD PLAIN, ISN'T IT? I I DON'T THINK THEY'RE SHOWING YET.
YEAH, THE ENGINEER SAID IT'S, THEY'RE ALL STEEP SLOPES.
BUT IS THERE CATCH BASINS UP THERE? THERE WILL BE.
THIS, THIS IS THE, THE TENTATIVE PLAN IS AN ENGINEER.
BUT I MEAN, ALL THAT WATER IS GOING TO BE GOING DOWN INTO THAT CREEK THAT GOES UNDER ONE 13 THAT GOES DOWN INTO THE PARK AND INTO THE RIVER.
AND THE SEDIMENT BUILT UP THERE RIGHT NOW IS, YOU KNOW, HUGE.
AND THE OTHER CONCERN I HAVE IS A, THE INTERSECTION OF OLD STATE AND SECOND AVENUE.
VERY BLIND AND VERY DANGEROUS.
IS THERE A PLAN TO CHANGE THAT? AND MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S GONNA COME LATER, BUT YOU CAN'T HAVE THAT INTERSECTION RIGHT NOW.
YOU'LL, SOMEBODY'S GONNA GET KILLED.
THAT WILL BE WORKED OUT BETWEEN OUR TRAFFIC ENGINEER AND THE TOWN TRAFFIC ENGINEER.
NEXT, ANYONE ELSE? OH, NICHOLAS HARRISON.
AND, UH, TO GO OVER THE RULES AND REGULATIONS AND ASK YOU GUYS QUESTIONS.
I'M ASSUMING THAT EVERYBODY UP HERE ON THE BOARD IS A RESIDENT OF THE TOWNSHIP.
IS THAT CORRECT? YOU'RE ELECTED OFFICIALS.
WELL THAT'S NOT, THAT'S NOT, WE ARE RESIDENTS, BUT WE ARE NOT ELECTED OFFICIALS.
THAT'S POINT FROM, I LIVE RIGHT BEHIND THAT TRIANGLE TO
[02:00:01]
THE FAR LEFT.I BOUGHT MY HOUSE BECAUSE I CONSIDERED IT AND I STILL CONSIDER IT RIGHT NOW AS IT SITS WITHOUT THAT MONSTROSITY AS PROBABLY ONE OF THE MOST BEAUTIFUL PIECES OF LAND IN THIS TOWNSHIP.
I CAN, I CAN SIT HERE ARISE QUESTIONS OF A SHOEHORN BECAUSE THIS CLEARLY DOES NOT FIT THE DEFINITION OF THE EXCEPTION OF THIS.
I DRIVE MY SON EVERY DAY THROUGH THAT ONE 13 CORRIDOR PASS AND ALL THAT GREENLAND.
AND HE EVEN SAYS TIME AND TIME AGAIN, DADDY, LOOK HOW BEAUTIFUL THAT AREA IS.
DOES ANYBODY UP HERE BEHIND THE BOARD LIVE IN A THOROUGH THROUGH PASSING THIS AREA? OR ARE YOU JUST SEEING THIS ON A PRINT LIKE THIS? I PASS THROUGH IT A LOT, YES.
DO YOU LIVE AROUND THIS AREA? YES.
WOULD YOU WANT THIS? THAT'S NOT A QUESTION I'M GONNA ANSWER AT THIS POINT.
OKAY, WELL WE CLEARLY KNOW AND I'M SURE THERE'S A LOT OF PEOPLE THIS ROW RIGHT HERE THAT WILL ARGUE THE FACT THIS IS NOT A USE UNDER THE EXCEPTION.
THIS IS A SHOEHORN AND EVERYBODY INCLUDING THIS ROW AND YOU GUYS UP HERE ARE FALLING BACK ON THE WAR STER DECISION.
AND YOU ALL KNOW THAT THIS DOES NOT FIT IT.
US HERE IN THE ROOM, THESE TOWNSHIP RESIDENTS CAN FIGHT.
AND WE SHOULD MAKE THIS AS HARD AS WE CAN FOR THIS LINE OF PEOPLE RIGHT HERE CUZ THEY'RE ALL IN IT FOR THE MONEY NOT PRESERVING THIS BEAUTIFUL LAND.
ANYBODY ELSE? NONE LISTED, NONE LISTED.
ANYBODY ELSE WANNA SPEAK BEFORE WE MOVE FORWARD? OKAY.
UM, I ASSUME THAT THAT WILL, THEY WILL BE LISTED IN THE MINUTES WHEN THE MINUTES ARE ADOPTED AND APPROVED.
ON THE, AT ASSUMING WE HAVE THEM BY THE JANUARY 4TH MEETING, BE AT THE JANUARY MEETING BASED ON WORKLOAD.
WE TRY TO HAVE THEM AT THE FIRST MEETING OF THE MONTH, BUT WITH THE HOLIDAYS? NO, NO.
UM, CAN I SAY A COUPLE THINGS PLEASE? OH, PLEASE, ED, JUST TO KIND OF WRAP IT UP.
UH, BASICALLY I THINK, AND I UNDERSTAND FROM THE POINT OF VIEW OF PEOPLE LIVING NEAR WHO MAY NOT BE HAPPY, THEY'RE USED TO DRIVING BY, THEY'RE USED TO HAVING IT GREEN.
UH, BOTTOM LINE IS THE, THE TOWNSHIP ZONED THIS FOR WAY MORE UNITS THAN WE ARE ASKING FOR.
UM, MR. GRACE, IN 0.8 OF HIS LETTER SAYS THAT IN HIS PROFESSIONAL OPINION, WE MEET THE CONDITIONS FOR RESIDENTIAL CARE FACILITY.
THE COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION SAID THE MONTGOMERY COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION BELIEVES THAT THIS PROJECT IS CONSISTENT WITH THE TOWNSHIP'S CURRENT ZONING.
SO THE PROFESSIONAL PLANNERS ARE SAYING THAT WE DO MEET THE CRITERIA.
UH, YOUR SOLICITOR HAS ALSO SAID THAT, UH, AND I THINK YOU'RE AWARE THAT WHEN WE'RE DEALING WITH THE SUBDIVISION LAND DEVELOPMENT ORDINANCE, YOU HAVE NO DISCRETION.
SO IF WE MEET THE CRITERIA IN THE ORDINANCE, WHICH WE'RE WILLING TO DO, THEN YOU'VE GOTTA APPROVE THE PLAN.
THE CONDITIONAL USE IS A PERMITTED USE.
IT'S NOT AN VARIANCE, IT'S NOT SOMETHING OUTSIDE THE ORDINARY.
IT'S A USE THAT IS ALLOWED, PROVIDED WE MEET THE CONDITIONS, WHICH FRANKLY ARE VERY SIMPLE TO MEET.
SO I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE GETTING A LOT OF INPUT FROM PEOPLE WHO JUST SAYING, I DON'T LIKE IT, I DON'T LIKE THE TRAFFIC, I DON'T LIKE THE, THE ANIMALS.
I DON'T LIKE THIS, I DON'T LIKE THAT.
BUT BOTTOM LINE IS WE'RE ALLOWED TO DO THIS AND WE WOULD ASK THAT YOU RECOMMEND IT TO THE SUPERVISORS.
WELL, WE'RE NOT READY TO DO THAT TONIGHT.
YOU KNOW, AND YOU KNOW THAT ED, AND I APPRECIATE YOU, YOU KNOW, TELLING US WHAT OUR JOBS ARE, BUT YOU KNOW, WE, WE, WE KNOW THAT WHAT WE HAVE TO DO AND WE KNOW THE RULES AND WE HAVE MR. BRETON, WHEN WE DON'T KNOW THE RULES, HE MAKES SURE THAT WE KNOW THE RULES.
SO, YOU KNOW, I APPRECIATE YOU GIVING US THAT EDUCATION.
WE, WE HAD ENVISIONED A COUPLE OF NIGHTS ON THIS BECAUSE WE KNOW THAT THERE'S A LOT OF PUBLIC OPINION ON IT.
UM, AND I DON'T KNOW, JEFF, WHEN WE WERE NEXT, LOOKING AT HAVING IT ON THE AGENDA, IT, THE, IT'S THE SECOND MEETING OF JANUARY AND OF COURSE MY CALENDAR'S NOT UP.
SO I, I HAVE TO QUICKLY PULL UP THAT DATE.
UM, CAUSE WE DON'T WANT, WE DON'T WANNA HAVE IT BE A SITUATION WHERE THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO, FOR WHATEVER REASON, COULDN'T MAKE IT TONIGHT.
THERE WAS KIND OF A STATED SEVERAL TIMES PEOPLE SAID, OH, I ONLY FOUND OUT ABOUT THIS AT THE LAST SECOND.
I HAVEN'T HAD A CHANCE TO FORMULATE MY THOUGHTS.
UM, SO SINCE WE HAVE A, YOU KNOW, A TIME EXTENSION, WHAT WE WOULD AT LEAST PUT IT OFF FOR AT LEAST ONE MORE MEETING FOR, FOR, FOR COMMENT.
[02:05:01]
AND I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, THE COMMENTS ARE MADE ABOUT, YOU KNOW, DIGESTING THE DOCUMENTS AND LOOKING AT THE, AND WE GOTTA GIVE PEOPLE A CHANCE TO DO THAT.AND I THINK THAT'S ONLY FAIR TOO.
THEY GET THAT CHANCE TO DIGEST THE DOCUMENTS.
SO, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOT GONNA BE ANY VOTES OR NOTHING DONE TONIGHT.
JANUARY 18TH IS THE NEXT TIME.
NOW THERE'S A PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING BEFORE THAT.
THERE'S A PLANNING COMMISSION ON JANUARY 4TH.
IT, THIS WILL NOT BE ON THE AGENDA.
NOW YOU CAN COME AND COMMENT ON IT.
CAUSE WE ALWAYS HAVE A SECTION WHERE YOU CAN COMMENT ON NON AGENDA ITEMS. BUT THIS SPECIFICALLY WILL NOT BE ON THE AGENDA THAT NIGHT.
SAME BAT TIME, SAME BAT CHANNEL.
WELL, AND IT WOULD BE BETTER FOR ANYBODY WHO DOES WANT TO COMMENT TO COME WHEN IT'S SCHEDULED AND NOT TAKE ADVANTAGE OF THE, THE NEXT MEETING WHERE WE HAVE THE OFF THE AGENDA COMMENTS BECAUSE IT'S BETTER IF PEOPLE HERE WHO WE CAN ANSWER QUESTIONS.
IT REALLY WOULDN'T BE AS PRODUCTIVE IF YOU COME TO THE ONE ON THE FOURTH.
IT'S BETTER TO COME TO THE ONE ON THE 18TH FOR SURE.
AND, AND I WELCOME YOU FOLKS TO PLEASE READ THE DOCUMENTS.
I MEAN, I KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, IT LOOKS, IT LOOKS, BUT YOU KNOW, THE COURT'S RULED AND, YOU KNOW, WE'RE, WE CAN'T CHANGE THE COURT TO SOMEBODY'S POINT, YOU KNOW, WE, WE CAN'T MAKE UP RULES.
THE COURT STILL MAKES THOSE RULES.
SO WE'RE GONNA TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT ALSO.
YOU COME UP HERE, MA'AM, IF YOU WANNA SPEAK, THIS WILL BE THE LAST ONE.
UNLESS JEFF, IS THIS, YOU KNOW, I HAVE NO ONE ELSE LISTED.
SO WE'RE GONNA TAKE THIS YOUNG LADY IN.
I LIVE, UM, 3 31 MEADOWVIEW DRIVE IN TRAP AD JOINING UPPER PROVIDENCE.
I'D JUST LIKE TO SAY I'VE LIVED IN HOMEOWNER DEVELOPMENTS AND AS THESE GENTLEMEN SAID, THIS WILL BE COVERED BY A HOMEOWNER'S ASSOCIATION.
I KNOW THAT HOMEOWNER'S ASSOCIATIONS ELECT PEOPLE AND AS TIME CHANGES THEY CAN CERTAINLY CHANGE THE RULES.
SO THEY COULD CERTAINLY CHANGE THAT RULE FROM 62 PLUS TO 55 PLUS OR TO WHATEVER THEY WANT IN THEIR HOMEOWNER'S ASSOCIATION.
SO LET'S PLEASE KEEP THAT IN MIND AS WELL.
I'M SORRY, COULD I GET YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS AGAIN HERE? HOW ABOUT I HAVE YOU FILL HER OUT AGAIN.
I'LL, ANY OTHER COMMENTS? THANK YOU FOR COMING OUT HERE TONIGHT.
SOMETIMES IT'S, UM, SO JEFF, WHAT, WHAT'S ON OUR FUTURE AGENDA? OH, I'M SORRY.
LET ME JUST GET HER ADDRESS REAL QUICK.
WHEN YOU SEE THE ADDRESS AND LAST NAME, SOMETIMES IT GETS MUDDLED.
ASK JOE, IN YOUR HISTORY, WHAT DO YOU THINKS THEY'RE GETTING? SO MUCH.
SO WHAT'S THE FUTURE AGENDA, JEFF? UM, IF, IF LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, WE'RE STILL HAVING OUR MEETING.
FOLKS, IF YOU'RE DONE, PLEASE LEAVE.
PLEASE GO OUT IN THE HALLWAY IF YOU WANT.
WE STILL HAVE A MEETING TO, UH, COMPLETE, SO PLEASE, ED, JUST LEAVE IT THERE.
ED, JUST, WELL, YOU'RE HALFWAY.
I'LL SEND SOMEONE IN TO CLEAN UP.
I'M SURE THIS MEETING'S NOT ADJOURNED.
PLEASE, PLEASE MOVE ON, PLEASE.
UH, I THINK IT'S QUITE ENOUGH IF EVERYBODY'S READY.
[DISCUSSION: FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS]
HERE, HERE'S OUR AGENDA CUTS.WE HAVE NO OTHER MEETINGS SCHEDULED FOR THIS MONTH.
WE'VE CANCELED THE DECEMBER 21ST MEETING.
UM, THAT WILL BE THE VOTE FOR CHAIR, VICE CHAIR SECRETARY AGAIN.
UM, LOVER'S LANE WILL BE ON THAT APPLICATION.
THEY'VE, THEY'VE SUBMITTED A REVISED PLAN.
I THINK WE'RE STILL WAITING ON SOME OTHERS.
UM, SPRING FORWARD SCHOOL DISTRICT HAS COME BACK WITH SOME CHANGES TO THEIR MINOR SUBDIVISION THAT YOU SAW MAYBE SIX MONTHS AGO NOW.
[02:10:01]
BEEN QUITE A WHILE.UM, SO WE JUST, YOU'VE ALREADY GIVEN A RECOMMENDATION ON THAT, BUT BECAUSE THERE WERE SOME MINOR CHANGES TO THE PLAN, I THINK WE'RE GONNA RUN IT BACK THROUGH IN FRONT OF YOU JUST TO MAKE SURE IT'S ALL CLEAN AND, AND PROPER.
AND THEN WE HAVE THE ENVIRONMENTAL, WELL THEN WE HAVE JANUARY 18TH IS THE, UM, THE PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING AND I THAT'S INCORRECT THERE.
THAT SHOULD SAY SEVEN O'CLOCK.
AND THE ENVIRONMENTAL ADVISORY COUNCIL MEETING FOR JANUARY 18TH RIGHT NOW IS SCHEDULED FOR SIX O'CLOCK.
I THINK RIGHT NOW OUR PLAN FOR THAT MEETING IS TO HAVE REORGANIZATION.
AND I WAS TALKING TO SARAH SATO TODAY.
SHE'S GOING TO FIND A COUPLE OTHER MEMBERS OF EACS FROM REGIONALLY THAT THEY'RE IN THE AREA AND HAVE THEM COME AND GIVE YOU SOME INFORMATION.
I THINK THAT WAS WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT.
HAVING, TRYING TO SEE WHAT OTHER PEOPLE ARE DOING SO THAT WE CAN GET SOME GUIDANCE.
I THINK THAT WAS YOUR, WHAT YOU REQUESTED FOR LAST MONTH.
WE'LL MAKE IT A LO RELATIVELY SHORT MEETING JUST BECAUSE WE'LL HAVE THIS MEETING.
I, I WAS GONNA SUGGEST THAT MAYBE WE COULD KEEP THAT ONE YEAH.
TO A HALF HOUR, 45 MINUTES MAYBE.
AND THAT'S ALL I HAVE EXCEPT TO WISH EVERYBODY MERRY CHRISTMAS AND A HAPPY NEW YEAR.
UH, ANY OTHER COMMENTS BY BOARD? ANY, ANY FEEDBACK, COMMENTS, ADDITIONAL THINGS? NOTHING.
IF THERE'S NOTHING ELSE, I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
NICOLE HAS MADE A MOTION TO ADJOURN.