Sep 19, 2022 Board of Supervisors

AND NOW'S THE TIME FOR PUBLIC COMMENT AND UH, IF YOU'RE GOING TO MAKE PUBLIC COMMENT, I NEED YOU TO COME FORWARD, STATE YOUR NAME, YOUR STREET ADDRESS, AND PLEASE TRY TO CONTAIN YOUR REMARKS TO THREE MINUTES, BUT ANYONE WOULD LIKE TO MAKE PUBLIC COMMENT THIS EVENING.

UH, WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE EXECUTIVE SESSION REPORT.

SO NO ONE,

[EXECUTIVE SESSION REPORT]

UH, LAST FRIDAY, THIS BOARD HELD AN EXECUTIVE SESSION WHERE WE DISCUSSED OUR ONGOING CONTRACT NEGOTIATIONS WITH OUR POLICE AND FIREFIGHTERS.

UH, THAT'S THE UPPER UPPER PROVIDENCE TOWNSHIP POLICE ASSOCIATION AND THE INTERNATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF FIREFIGHTERS LOCAL 53 67.

AND WE ALSO DISCUSSED A PERSONNEL MATTER THAT WE WILL VOTE ON LATER IN THIS MEETING.

UH, I THINK EVERYBODY'S HAD A CHANCE TO REVIEW THE BILL LIST.

AND, UH,

[APPROVAL OF BILL LIST]

I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO APPROVE THE BILL LIST.

I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE BILL LIST OF AUGUST 1ST TO AUGUST 31ST TWO TH 2022 IN THE AMOUNT OF 2,000,800, $3,369 AND 68 CENTS.

SECOND, THAT ALL RIGHT, I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO APPROVE THE BILL LIST FOR THE PERIOD AUGUST 1ST THROUGH AUGUST 31ST, 2022 IN THE AMOUNT OF 2,000,800, $3,369 AND 68 CENTS.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR SAY AYE.

AYE, AYE.

AND HE OPPOSED.

[APPROVAL OF MINUTES]

AND WE HAD TWO SETS OF MINUTES IN OUR PACKET.

UH, ONE FROM OUR AUGUST 15TH, REGULAR MEETING AND THE OTHER FROM OUR AUGUST 27TH, UH, ADMINISTRATIVE WORKSHOP, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.

I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES FROM AUGUST 15TH, 2022 FOR THE REGULAR, UM, BOARD OF SUPERVISORS MEETING MINUTES AND AUGUST 25TH, 2022 FOR OUR WORKSHOP.

I'LL SECOND THE MOTION.

I HAVE A MOTION AND I SECOND TO APPROVE THE MINUTES FOR AUGUST 15TH, REGULAR MEETING AND THE AUGUST 25TH WORKSHOP.

NOW WE HAVE, UH, PUBLIC HEARING THIS EVENING.

AND UH,

[PUBLIC HEARING]

I'LL TURN IT OVER TO OUR SOLICITOR.

UH, NOTICE WAS SENT THE, IN, IN THE CASE OF A REZONE, YOU HAVE TO SEND NOTICE TO, UM, THE AFFECTED PARCELS, WHICH IN THIS CASE IS A PARCEL.

THANKS BILL.

UH, GOOD EVENING, EVERYONE.

THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING, UH, PURSUANT TO THE PENNSYLVANIA MUNICIPALITIES PLANNING CODE, WHICH DICTATES THAT IF YOU AMEND A ZONING ORDINANCE, THAT THERE ARE IS A CERTAIN WAY THAT YOU HAVE TO DO IT, WHICH INCLUDES CERTAIN PUBLIC NOTICE REQUIREMENTS AND AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO BE HEARD, UH, PRIOR TO, UH, ANY VOTE ON THE ORDINANCE.

UM, IN, IN, WE WILL BE RECEIVING COMMENT FROM ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO MAKE IT.

UM, AFTER I ADMIT A FEW DOCUMENTS ON BEHALF OF THE TOWNSHIP AS ADVERTISED THE, UM, THIS IS AN ORDINANCE REZONING PARCEL NUMBER 6 1 0 0 4 4 3 5 0 0 4, TO BE LOCATED ENTIRELY WITHIN THE NC NEIGHBORHOOD CONVENIENCE COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICT.

CURRENTLY IT'S SPLIT ZONED AND AMENDING THE TOWNSHIP ZONING MAP TO INDICATE THAT REZONING AND DEMANDING THE CODE OF THE TOWNSHIP TO PERMIT OFFICE SHOPS AND STORAGE FOR BUILDING PLUMBING, ELECTRICAL, AND OTHER CONTRACTORS AND SUPPLIERS IN THE NC NEIGHBORHOOD CONVENIENCE COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICT.

THE FIRST EXHIBIT IS A COPY OF THE ACTUAL ORDINANCE.

WHAT I JUST READ IS WHAT WE CALL THE HATER.

THE PART THAT GETS RUN IN THE PAPER, BUT ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO VIEW, UH, THE ENTIRE ORDINANCE THAT HAS BEEN AVAILABLE AND CONTINUES TO BE AVAILABLE FOR INSPECTION.

EXHIBIT TWO IS A COPY OF THE LEGAL NOTICE THAT WAS RUN ADVISING EVERYONE OF TONIGHT'S, UH, HEARING.

AND SINCE THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE HERE, I GUESS THE AD WORKED AND ATTACHED TO THAT IS THE LIST OF PEOPLE TO WHOM,

[00:05:01]

AND THAT PROPERTY OWNER WAS AFFECTED THROUGH HIS COUNSEL, UH, WAS ADVISED OF THE HEARING AND THE, UH, CONTENTS OF THE ORDINANCE.

SO THAT'LL BE ADMITTED AS EXHIBIT TWO, COLLECTIVELY WITH THE LIST OF NAMES.

EXHIBIT THREE IS THE AFFIDAVIT OF POSTING AND MAILING SIGNED BY JEFF GRACE.

AND HE'S ATTESTING TO THE FACT THAT HE MADE ALL THE CORRECT NOTIFICATIONS AS REQUIRED BY THE MUNICIPALITIES PLANNING CODE.

THAT'LL BE EXHIBIT THREE, EXHIBIT FOUR IS A COPY OF THE POSTING OF THE ACTUAL PROPERTY ADVISING OF TONIGHT'S HEARING, WHICH IS ALSO A REQUIREMENT OF THE MUNICIPALITY'S PLANNING CODE.

EXHIBIT FIVE IS A PROOF FROM THE NEWSPAPER THAT THE AD ACTUALLY WAS RUN AS IT WAS SCHEDULED TO BE RUN.

SO IT WAS RUN IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE MUNICIPALITIES PLANNING CODE NOTICE REQUIREMENTS.

AND EXHIBIT SIX IS A COPY OF A LETTER FROM GILMORE ASSOCIATES, WHICH IS THE TOWNSHIP'S ENGINEERS.

AND THAT'S A LETTER DATED AUGUST 16TH, WHICH WAS A REVIEW OF THE PROPOSED ORDINANCE.

SO THOSE SIX DOCUMENTS WILL BE ADMITTED.

UM, AND THEY'RE AVAILABLE FOR ANYBODY WHO WISHES TO SEE THEM.

OF COURSE.

AND BEFORE WE GET THE PUBLIC COMMENT, I'LL ASK WHETHER MR. MULLEN, WHO IS THE PERSON WHO SUBMITTED THE REQUEST FOR THE REZONING, UH, WHETHER HE HAS ANYTHING HE WISHES TO PRESENT, UH, SUGGEST IS THAT OKAY? WHAT I WOULD SUGGEST IS THAT, UM, I'M GONNA PRESENT BOTH WITNESSES AND THEN QUESTIONS CAN BE ASKED OF BOTH OF THEM AFTER THEY TESTIFY.

CUZ IF YOU ASK THE FIRST WITNESS QUESTIONS, THE SECOND ONE MAY ANSWER THAT.

SO LET'S HEAR FROM BOTH OF'EM BEFORE WE GET STARTED.

JIM COMING UP AND SIT IN THIS CHAIR AND GET THAT MICROPHONE.

AND YOU'VE ALREADY STATED YOUR NAME AND WOULD YOU STATE IT AGAIN FOR THE RECORD? SURE.

JAMES DURKIN AND YOUR BUSINESS ADDRESS? SEVEN 50 WEST WASHINGTON.

AND WHAT IS YOUR RELATION? NORTHTOWN.

WHAT IS YOUR RELATIONSHIP TO 1406 PROPERTIES SU THE APPLICANT.

I AM THE CFO.

NOW, PRIOR TO PURCHASING THE PROPERTY, DID YOU INQUIRE AS TO WHAT THE USES HAD BEEN MADE PREVIOUSLY OF THE PROPERTY? YES.

AND WHAT WERE YOU TOLD? OKAY.

I'M ACTUALLY GONNA READ A LETTER FROM, UH, THE PR PRIOR OWNER.

OKAY, PLEASE, PLEASE BE ADVISED THAT WHEN MY SON, RANDY, FRETZ OPERATED HIS BUSINESS FROM 1752 RIDGE PIKE, UPPER PROVIDENCE, HIS BUSINESS CONSISTED OF THE FOLLOWING SERVICES AT, AT THE PROPERTY.

HE SOLD LANDSCAPES SUPPLIES, MULCH, CRUSHED STONE, CONCRETE, SAND, TOP SOIL, AND OTHER AGGREGATES.

ALSO HE MAINTAINED LARGE STOCKPILES OF DIRT, MULCH, CRUSHED AND UN CRUSHED CONCRETE.

AND HE MADE PRECAST PRODUCTS SUCH AS CONCRETE BLOCKS AND JERSEY BARRIERS ON, ON THE PROPERTY.

HE HAS, UH, AND HAD A TOP SOIL SCREEN, CRUSHER, TUB, GRINDER, SHREDDER, AND OTHER CONSTRUCTION EQUIPMENT, WHICH HE STORED.

HE ALSO RECYCLED BOTH TREE STUMPS AND CONCRETE, AND HE RENTED STORAGE SPACES AND PARK TRAILERS ON, ON HIS PROPERTY.

THANK YOU, RUTH FRITZ.

NOW, DO YOU HAVE, UH, PHOTOGRAPHS OF THE PROPERTY? I DO.

AND PERHAPS, UH, UNFORTUNATELY WE ONLY HAVE SEVEN, SO WE HAVE ONE FOR EACH OF THE SUPERVISOR, ONE FOR JOE AND ANTHONY AND JEN YOU'LL HAVE TO FLIP A COIN AS, YEAH, PLEASE DISTRIBUTE THERE.

[00:10:24]

YOU GOT AN EXTRA ONE.

BRING IT BACK NOW.

WOULD YOU DESCRIBE FOR THE BOARD? YOU DON'T HAVE TO GO THROUGH ALL THE PICTURES.

CAN YOU DESCRIBE FOR THE BOARD WHAT PICTURES? ONE AND TWO SHOW.

SURE.

THAT IS AN OVERHEAD.

UH, AND IT SHOWS THE ACTUAL, OUR ACTUAL PROPERTY.

UH, IT ALSO SHOWS THE, UH, THE NEIGHBOR ON EITHER SIDE ONE IS WAINS NURSERY AND THE OTHER ONE IS SUPERIOR TREE.

AND DID THE SECOND PHOTOGRAPH SHOW MORE OF THE SAME? YES IT DOES.

YEP.

IT, IT JUST SHOWS, SHOWS MORE OF MORE OF THE SITE FURTHER BACK.

AND WHAT WERE YOUR PLANS FOR THE PROPERTY? WHAT DID YOU WANNA DO? WHAT, WHAT WE WANTED TO DO WAS, WAS TO TAKE THE EXISTING USE AND MOVE IT INDOORS AND, AND ALSO SUPPLY A NEED FOR THE TOWNSHIP OF MOVING, MOVING CONTRACTORS IN, INTO A WAREHOUSE ENVIRONMENT.

AND WHAT DID YOU DO TO PURSUE THAT? UH, WE, WE WENT, UH, WE WENT THE ZONING BOARD AND THEY, UH, TURNED THIS DOWN.

AND IN FACT THEN WE FILED AN APPEAL WITH THE COURT OF COMMON POLICE.

IS THAT CORRECT? CORRECT.

AND RECENTLY THE COURT OF COMMON POLICE FOUND AGAINST US, IS THAT CORRECT? CORRECT.

AND WE'RE GOING TO APPEAL THAT DECISION TO THE COMMONWEALTH COURT, CORRECT? YES.

UH, THEN, THEN WHAT DID YOU DO AFTER THE ZONING HEARING BOARD TURNS YOU DOWN? SO WHAT DID YOU DO THEN? WE STARTED TO, UH, USE THE PROPERTY AS A RECYCLING YARD, JUST AS IT HAD BEEN.

AND YOU HAD A LARGE PILE OF CRUSH CONCRETE, DID YOU NOT? YES.

AND YOUR NEIGHBORS GOT VERY UPSET ABOUT THAT? YES.

AND TO WHOM DID YOUR NEIGHBORS COMPLAIN TO THE, TO THE TOWNSHIP? TO, TO THE D P AND SOIL CONSERVATION.

SO DID THE MONTGOMERY COUNTY CONSERVATION DISTRICT OR DEP OR THE TOWNSHIP INDICATE IN ANY FASHION THAT WHAT YOU WERE DOING WAS IMPROPER OR ILLEGAL? NO.

UH, NOW WHAT DID YOU DO AS A RESULT OF THE NEIGHBOR'S COMPLAINTS? I MEAN, HAVE THEY ALL COMPLAINED ABOUT THIS UGLY TALL PILE? WE ACTUALLY MET, MET WITH THE, MET WITH THE NEIGHBORS HERE IN THIS ROOM AND, UH, LISTENED TO THEIR, UH, PROBLEMS AND THEIR COMMENTS.

AND THEN WE FILED THE APPLICATION FOR REZONING OF THE PROPERTY AND THE ADDED USE BY CONDITIONAL USE FOR OFFICES, SHOPS AND STORAGE FOR BUILDING PLUMBING, ELECTRICAL, OR OTHER CONTRACTORS? CORRECT.

IS THAT CORRECT? YES.

UH, DID YOU PROPOSE ANYTHING ELSE IN THE ORDINANCE TO AMELIORATE THE USE AS VIS-A-VIS THE NEIGHBORS? YEAH, THERE WAS A COUPLE THINGS.

UH, ONE IS THAT, UH, NONE OF THE TRACTOR TRAILERS THAT WOULD, THAT WOULD COME INTO THIS PLACE WOULD BE TYPICAL USE THERE, UH, UH, OVER THE WV 40 SIZE.

BE A REAL, A REAL NEED FOR THIS, UH, FOR THIS TYPE OF BUILDING AND, AND THAT IT WOULD ACTUALLY POTENTIALLY MITIGATE THE EFFECTS IN, IN THE TOWNSHIP.

WE ALSO AGREED TO MAKE THE FACADE, THE RIDGE PIKE AND, UH, LOOK, LOOK LIKE RETAIL.

UM, AND THEN, UH, WE, WE ALSO AGREED TO, TO THE TYPE THREE, MOST STRINGENT LANDSCAPE BARRIER AROUND IT.

UH, AND THE LAST THING WAS NO OUTDOOR STORAGE OF INVENTORY TOOLS ON EQUIPMENT.

NOW, DID YOU, IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE REQUIREMENT OF THE ORDINANCE AS POINTED OUT BY GILMORE, HAVE A MARKET AREA STUDY AND NEIGHBORHOOD IMPACT ANALYSIS PREPARED? YES.

AND WHO DID THAT? UH, THAT, THAT ESCAPES ME, I'M SORRY.

AND ACTUALLY THE, IT IS ATTACHED TO WHAT I SUBMITTED TO THE BOARD, UH, BEHIND THE PICTURES.

YOU'LL SEE THE STUDY FROM, EH, CREATIVE SERVICES, THE AGE STANDING FOR ERIC ZEL.

WHO'S AN A I C P PLANNER.

UH, AND WHAT DID ERIC ZEL FIND? HE FOUND THAT THERE WOULD

[00:15:01]

AND IS THAT BECAUSE TODAY PEOPLE ARE USING SELF STORAGE FACILITIES, PRIVATE GARAGES, OR OTHER OUTBUILDINGS AND RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS? YES.

SO HE FELT THAT DISUSE WOULD ACTUALLY IMPROVE THE SITUATION? CORRECT.

UM, NOW, DID HE ALSO FIND THAT THE ORDINANCE LIMITATIONS, UH, MITIGATE POTENTIAL NEGATIVE IMPACTS? YES.

NOW, DID YOU ALSO HAVE A TRAFFIC STUDY PERFORM BY TRAFFIC PLANNING AND DESIGN? YES.

AND THAT'S ATTACHED TO WHAT WE SUBMITTED TO YOU ALSO.

AND WHAT DID, UH, WHAT DID THE TRAFFIC STUDY SHOW? OKAY.

IT, UH, WE HAD A ACCESS FEASIBILITY TO BRIDGE TO RIDGE PIKE AND, AND IT IDENTIFIED THAT, THAT THERE WOULD BE ADDITIONAL TRAFFIC GENERATED, BUT THERE'D ONLY BE LESS THAN 1% ADDITION.

CORRECT? I BELIEVE IT WAS 0.9%.

UM, DID THE UPPER PROVIDENCE TOWNSHIP PLANNING, COMMISSION RECOMMEND, UH, ANY PARTICULAR ACTION TO THE BOARD? YES.

AND WHAT WAS THAT ACTION? THEY RECOMMENDED THEY, UH, UNANIMOUS, UNANIMOUS, UNANIMOUSLY APPROVED IT AND RECOMMENDED IT.

NOW, IF FOR SOME REASON THE BOARD SHOULD DECIDE NOT TO ADOPT THIS ORDINANCE, WHAT WILL YOU DO? WE WILL GO BACK TO A, GO BACK TO A RECYCLING CENTER.

UH, THAT'S ALL THE QUESTIONS I HAVE FROM MR. DIRK.

AND ED, CAN YOU COME UP PLEASE? NO, I HAVE COPIES OF THOSE.

WHY? UH, YOU'VE BEEN SWORN IN, UM, AGAIN, STATE YOUR NAME AGAIN, EDWARD GLEASON.

AND WHAT IS YOUR BUSINESS ADDRESS? 6 0 7 EASTON ROAD.

AND BY WHOM WERE YOU EMPLOYED? UTIS ENGINEERING.

AND ARE YOU A LICENSED PROFESSIONAL REGISTERED PROFESSIONAL ENGINEER IN THE COMMONWEALTH? I AM.

AND WAS YOUR COMPANY RETAINED BY THE APPLICANT TO DO ENGINEERING WORK ON THIS PROJECT? YES.

AND DID YOU PREPARE CROSS SECTIONS SHOWING HOW NEIGHBORS WILL BE IMPACTED BY THE PROPOSED BUILDING? WE DID.

AND BEFORE WE GET TO THOSE PICTURES, CAN YOU DESCRIBE WHAT WILL BE DONE WITH THE SITE, UH, BY WAY OF IMPROVEMENTS TO MAKE SURE THE NEIGHBORS DON'T SEE THIS BUILDING? SURE.

IN ORDER TO SCREEN AND SORT OF BLOCK THE VIEW FROM THE TWO PROPOSED BUILDINGS AT TOTAL, A LITTLE OVER A HUNDRED THOUSAND SQUARE FEET, UM, WE'VE PREPARED A SITE DESIGN THAT INCLUDES BOTH A 25 FOOT, UH, TOWNSHIP TYPE THREE LANDSCAPE BUFFER.

AND, UM, WE'LL ALSO BE PROPOSING, UH, SCREENING FENCES AND, UM, VERTICAL ELEVATION CHANGES, UH, INTO THE SITE DESIGN TO, AGAIN, TRY TO SCREEN BLOCK AND OTHERWISE HIDE THE BUILDING.

WELL, WILL THERE BE, IN FACT, WILL THERE BE RETAINING WALLS? THERE WILL BE RETAINING WALLS, UH, ON BOTH SIDES OF THE, OF THE SITE.

AND HOW ABOUT BURS? ON TOP OF THE RETAINING WALLS? THERE WILL BE BES, UH, LOCATED WITHIN THE LANDSCAPE BUFFERS TO HELP RAISE THE, EXCUSE ME, UM, ELEVATE THE LANDSCAPING TO PROVIDE EVEN MORE SCREENING.

AND THE NEIGHBORS WERE CONCERNED ABOUT FALLING OVER THE BERM AND DOWN THE WALL.

SO WE'RE GONNA PUT A FENCE ON TOP OF THE BERM, IS THAT CORRECT? CORRECT.

THERE WILL BE, UM, SCREENING FENCES AND OTHER PROTECTION AS REQUIRED, UM, AND TREES, UH, IN THE BUFFER.

THAT'S THE LEFT COLUMN ON THE FIRST THREE PAGES OF THE RENDERED EXHIBITS.

NOW WHY DON'T WE LOOK AT THE CROSS SECTIONS AND YOU CAN DESCRIBE TO THE BOARD WHAT PEOPLE ARE GONNA SEE NOW, AND IN A FEW YEARS WHEN THE TREES BROKE? ABSOLUTELY.

SO WE HAVE A AS SHOWN ON THE SCREEN, IT'S A PLANNED LABELED SITE PERSPECTIVES.

WHAT WE LOOKED AT FOR EACH OF THE PROPERTIES THAT WERE ADJACENT TO THE PROPOSED DEVELOPMENT WAS, UM, TO DEVELOP RENDERED PERSPECTIVE VIEWS OF WHAT THE SITE WILL LOOK LIKE ONCE CONSTRUCTION IS STARTED.

AND

[00:20:01]

AND THEN WHAT THE VIEW FROM THE SAME LOCATION WOULD LOOK LIKE, UM, IN THE FUTURE, ONCE THE LANDSCAPING THAT'S GOING TO BE PROPOSED IS MATURED AND FULLY FILLED IN.

UM, AND YOU KNOW, IN MOST CASES THE VIEW OF THE EXISTING BUILDING OR OF THE PROPOSED BUILDING FROM THE NEIGHBORS IS MINIMAL AT BEST.

A LOT OF THE TIMES, FOR EXAMPLE, IN, UH, VIEW NUMBER TWO, UM, THE BUILDING THAT IT LOOKS LIKE YOU'RE SEEING IS ACTUALLY AN EXISTING SHED.

UH, SO IN THAT CASE, WE WON'T BE SEEING THE PROPOSED PROJECT BUILDING AT ALL.

UM, OTHERWISE AGAIN, IN MOST CASES, ONCE THE LANDSCAPE IS FULLY MATURE, UM, YOU'RE GOING TO JUST BE SEEING VERY LITTLE OF THE BUILDING, UM, BECAUSE AGAIN, OF, BECAUSE OF THE RETAINING WALLS, THE FENCE THAT WILL BE PROPO PROPOSED AND THE VEGETATION WILL THE FENCE, UH, WILL THE RETAINING WALLS AND THE BERM ALSO HOLD DOWN NOISE FROM TRAFFIC IN THE, IN THE DEVELOPMENT.

YES, IN GENERAL, THE LANDSCAPING, THE FIRM AND THE ELEVATION DIFFERENCES, UH, PROVIDED BY THE RETAINING WALL, UM, WILL ALL HELP WITH SOUND MITIGATION.

UM, THAT'S ALL THE QUESTIONS I HAVE OF THIS WITNESS AND WERE AVAILABLE TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE.

UH, ONE THING THAT, UH, AND WE'LL DEFINITELY GET QUESTIONS ABOUT MR. UM, WHEN I WENT THROUGH THE LITANY DOCUMENTS THAT WE ADMITTED INTO THE RECORD, UH, WE DID NOT, WE DON'T HAVE A LETTER FROM THE COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION.

NOW THEY'VE HAD 30 DAYS, THIS FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE ELDERS HERE, THIS UNDER STATE LAW, WHEN THERE ARE PLANNING AGENCIES INVOLVED, UH, WE HAVE A COUNTY PLANNING AGENCY AND A TOWNSHIP PLANNING COMMISSION, THE TOWNSHIP PLANNING COMMISSION RECOMMENDED APPROVAL OF THE ORDINANCE, THE COUNTY, WE HAVE THEM REVIEW EVERY ORDINANCE ALSO, UH, THEY'RE GIVEN 30 DAYS BY STATE LAW.

THEY, IT WAS SUBMITTED TO THE COUNTY ON AUGUST 15TH.

SO THEY HAVE HAD 30 DAYS.

UM, WE'LL HAVE TO GIVE SOME THOUGHT TO POSSIBLY HOLDING THE RECORD OPEN.

NOW I WILL SAY WHAT THEY GIVE IS ONLY A RECOMMENDATION ANYWAY, NO MATTER WHAT THEY SAID, BUT THERE IS NO REQUIREMENT THAT THEY MAKE A REPORT OR RECORD THAT'S RIGHT.

THAT'S ONLY BE GIVEN 30 DAYS TO DO SO.

SO I DON'T NECESSARILY SEE IT AS A PROBLEM, BUT SINCE WE WERE, IT WAS AN OPPORTUNITY TO OFFER ADDITIONAL COMMENTS.

THAT WOULD BE THE ONLY OTHER THING THAT I SEE OUT THERE THEY'VE HAD MORE THAN 30 DAYS.

SO MOST OFTEN YOU WOULD NOT HOLD IT UP FOR THAT.

UM, DO, DO, DO THE BOARD MEMBERS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OF THE TWO WITNESSES WHO HAVE TESTIFIED? DOES IT USUALLY TAKE THEM LONGER THAN 30 OR THIS IS UNUSUAL AND WE'LL GET IT SOON.

IF WE WAIT, I WOULD, IN MY EXPERIENCE, THEY ALMOST ALWAYS GET IT DONE WITHIN THE 30, VERY RARE THAT THEY DO NOT.

I DON'T KNOW WHY THEY, I DON'T, I JUST GOT BACK IN TOWN TONIGHT, SO I DON'T KNOW WHY THEY, I DIDN'T HAVE A CHANCE TO TRACK THAT DOWN.

I MIGHT JUST MENTION THAT ON ANOTHER MATTER, PRESENTLY PENDING BEFORE THE BOARD PARKHOUSE, IT'S WAY OVER 30 DAYS THAT WE'VE GOTTEN NO REPORT FROM THE COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION, FRANKLY, I THINK EVER SINCE THEY STARTED, WHERE I DON'T SEND YOU THE CHECK AND THE FORM TO SEND TO THEM AND THEY SEND US A BILL SOMEDAY JUST HASN'T BEEN WORKING VERY WELL.

NOTED.

HAVE A QUESTION OR TWO, I MAY.

UM, WHEN WERE THESE PICTURES TAKEN? WHEN WERE THEY TAKEN? THEY WERE TAKEN PRIOR TO US CLEANING THE PLACE UP AFTER WE BOUGHT IT.

SO I'M ASSUMING THAT THE PICTURES ON THE, THE REST OF THE PICTURES THAT ARE, UH, LIKE ALL THE WAY BACK HERE, UH, ARE PICTURES OF WHAT IT LOOKED LIKE BEFOREHAND.

RIGHT? SO IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THAT ANYMORE.

WE DON'T HAVE THE DRUMS OF 55 GALLON DRUMS. THAT'S ALL, BUT CLEANED UP.

WE DID A, A PHASE ONE BEFORE WE BOUGHT IT AND CLEANED UP THE PROPERTY.

GOTCHA.

SO NOW YOU, YOU, YOU WENT TO THE ZONING HEARING BOARD.

I JUST SAW THAT.

I CUZ SOMETIMES I'M HARD OF HERE AND I WANNA MAKE SURE THAT I HEARD IT CORRECTLY.

YOU WENT TO THE ZONING HEARING BOARD AND THE ZONING HEARING BOARD TURNED YOU DOWN.

IN FACT, ONE OF THE MEMBERS SAID THIS REALLY SHOULD BE A REZONING REQUEST RATHER THAN A BUNCH OF VARIANCES.

YOU ALL, YOU, THEN YOU APPEALED IT TO THE COMMONWEALTH TO THE COMMON POLICE COURT.

I'M SORRY.

I APOLOGIZE.

COMMON POLICE COURT.

THEY TURNED YOU DOWN YOU THIS WEEK OR ACTUALLY LAST WEEK THEY TURNED YOU DOWN THE JUDGE AND, AND FRANKLY DID IT IMPROPERLY THERE'S A RULE 14 OF THE MONTGOMERY COUNTY RULES.

AND UM, IT REQUIRES THAT WE'D BE GIVEN AN OPPORTUNITY TO ARGUE OUR CASE.

IT DIDN'T GIVE US AN OPPORTUNITY TO ARGUE, JUST TURNED IT DOWN.

SO WE HAVE A GOOD APPEAL.

PROPERTY'S GONNA LOOK LIKE.

UM, AND, AND I ASSUME THAT THIS IS SOME KIND OF A RENDERING AS TO WHAT THE, WHAT THE

[00:25:01]

EVENTUALLY NOW I, I COUNT THESE THINGS.

IT LOOKS LIKE YOU'VE GOT LIKE 40, ROUGHLY 40.

ARE YOU GONNA HAVE 40 DIFFERENT CONTRACTORS IN THERE? ODDS ARE NO, BECAUSE SOMEBODY WILL TAKE TWO OR THREE OR MAYBE EVEN FOUR UNITS AND COMBINE THEM DEPENDING HOW BIG THEY ARE.

BUT THEORETICALLY, YES.

BUT, BUT THAT'S JUST REALISTICALLY NOT GONNA HAPPEN.

THEORETICALLY YOU COULD HAVE 40, YOU COULD END UP WITH 20, IF EVERYBODY COMES IN AND TAKES TWO UNITS.

UM, THAT, UM, WE DON'T HAVE A COPY OF THAT LETTER FROM THE FRITZ'S.

UM, JUST, I DO HAVE ONE AND, AND THE PURPOSE OF THAT LETTER WAS WHAT, SINCE I, I JUST UNDERSTAND WHAT, WHAT KIND OF BEARING THAT LETTER HAS ON WHAT'S HAPPENING HERE.

WHAT HAPPENED IS, AND JEFF CAN CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG.

UH, WHAT HAPPENED WAS THE REALTOR WHO WAS SELLING THE PROPERTY FOR THE ESTATE OF RANDY FRITZ WANTED TO BE ABLE TO SHOW BUYERS WHAT HAD BEEN DONE THERE AND WHAT COULD BE DONE THERE.

MRS. FRITZ THEN WROTE THIS LETTER TO JEFF.

AND I DON'T, YOU YOU'D COMMENT JEFF AS TO WHAT HAPPENED AFTER THAT.

BUT I THINK YOU ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THESE USES HAD IN FACT BEEN THERE.

I, I ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THE LETTER, AS FAR AS I UNDERSTOOD IT WAS CORRECT.

AND KEPT IT ON FILE FOR ANY FUTURE APPLICANT OR ANY FUTURE LANGUAGE THAT WOULD COME IN.

I TRY TO DO THAT WITH A LOT OF NONCONFORMING USES BECAUSE IT GIVES ME A BETTER SENSE OF WHAT'S THERE AND WHAT CAN CONTINUE AND WHAT CANNOT.

UH, UNTIL WE REACHED THE PAIN THRESHOLD WITH THE APPLICANT WHERE HE, WE, WE, WE REQUESTED AS MANY AS WE COULD AND GOT AS MANY AS WE COULD.

BUT I, I GUESS MY, MY QUESTION TO THAT IS JUST BECAUSE MRS. FRED SAYS THAT THERE'S, THIS IS, THIS HAPPENED ON THE PROPERTY OR WHATEVER ELSE.

AND, AND THE REASON THAT I ASKED THIS IS BECAUSE I'VE BEEN ON THAT PROPERTY MANY TIMES AND I KNEW THAT FRITZ IS RELATIVELY WELL.

UM, SOME OF THE STUFF I WONDER ABOUT WHETHER THE CONCRETE WAS THERE, SOME OF THE OTHER THINGS I'M, I'M NOT ARGUING THE FACT THAT THEY WEREN'T THERE.

I JUST, I JUST FIND TO BELIEVE THAT THEY WERE KIND HARD TO BELIEVE THAT THEY WERE DOING THE CONCRETE.

IF IT WASN'T JUST FOR PERSONAL OR, OR PRIVATE, UH, WHATEVER THEY WERE USING IT, HE WAS MAKING JERSEY BARRIERS.

I SAW THAT I WAS THERE.

WHEN YOU SAY YOU WERE TURNING, IS IT AT THE COUNTY LEVEL? YOU DIDN'T HAVE A CHANCE TO SAY YOUR CASE.

WHAT WAS THERE REASONING FOR TURNING IT DOWN? IT WASN'T, THERE WAS NOTHING GIVEN.

AND IN FACT, AGAIN, IT'S JUST SEEMS LIKE THE SYSTEM'S STARTING TO FAIL.

WE HAVE A NEW PRESIDENT JUDGE WHO HAVE IT A LOVE.

I THINK SHE'S GREAT, BUT SHE'S DONE AWAY WITH ALL THE JUDGES THAT DID ZONING WORK BEFORE FLIPPED THE CRIMINAL COURT.

SO NOW WE HAVE JUDGES DOING ZONING CASES THAT KNOW NOTHING ABOUT ZONING.

AND IN FACT, MY PARTNER JUST HAD RECENTLY HAD A SIMILAR SITUATION WHERE ONE OF THE OTHER JUDGES TURNED HER DOWN WITHOUT ANY SORT OF ARGUMENT.

SO SHE'S APPEALING TO, I I'M AWARE OF A FEW OF THOSE MYSELF THAT THAT IS HAPPENING LATELY.

WE HAVEN'T HAD A CHANCE WE TO DISCUSS THE ACTUAL LITIGATION SINCE THE ORDER JUST CAME OUT.

UH, I GOT IT WHEN I WAS AWAY.

I THINK IT WAS ON FRIDAY OR THURSDAY.

TIMING WAS PERFECT, BUT IT WAS, UH, UH, IT WAS JUST ONE, A ONE SENTENCE ORDER.

AND THAT'S VERY COMMON.

THEY DON'T GIVE ALL THE REASONING SOMETIMES UNTIL YOU'D TAKEN ANOTHER APPEAL TO THE NEXT COURT UP.

AND THEN THEY WRITE A DECISION EXPLAINING THEMSELVES.

UH, I WAS HERE, GO AHEAD.

I WAS HERE FOR THE PRESENTATION TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION.

AND ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS DISCUSSED WAS SPECIFIC LANGUAGE THAT THE TOWNSHIP ONCE, UH, PARDON ME, ONE OF THE, ONE OF THE SPECIFIC LANGUAGE WE WANT IN THE LEASING AGREEMENTS THAT YOU MAKE WITH, UH, THOSE WHO WILL BE RENTING THESE, THESE UNITS SO THAT WE DON'T HAVE TO CONTINUALLY COME BACK TO ENFORCE IT, THAT WE WILL JUST ENFORCE AGAINST THE OWNER OF THE BUILDING AND THEY WILL TAKE CARE OF WHATEVER THE PROBLEM IS WITH THE INDIVIDUAL LEASES.

THAT'S CORRECT.

WE AGREED THAT WE WILL IN EACH LEASE, SPELL OUT THE REQUIREMENTS OF THE ORDINANCE, WHICH ARE THAT NO BIG TRUCKS AND, YOU KNOW, THE NOISE, ET CETERA, ET CETERA, AND THE OUTDOOR STORAGE AND OKAY, EXACTLY.

JEFF, ARE WE PRETTY SATISFIED THAT WILL KEEP US OUT OF, UH, CONTINUAL CONTINU, CONDITIONAL USE TYPE SITUATIONS WITH THIS? I, I THINK IT'S, IT'S A, A GOOD STEP.

WE'LL HAVE TO SEE HOW IT ALL PLAY.

I MEAN, I GUESS I'M BEING FAIRLY SKEPTICAL, BUT, BUT GENERALLY YES, I THINK IT'S, IT'S AN ACCEPTABLE PATH FORWARD.

AND AS I STATED AT THE PLANNING COMMISSION, JEFF AND I WORKED WITH THE ORIGINAL, MR. MULLEN SUBMITTED A DRAFT ORDINANCE THAT HE REQUESTED BE ADOPTED AND WE CHANGED THAT ORDINANCE TO, AND THAT'S WHERE WE CHANGED IT.

WE ADDED THE REQUIRE THE, UH, LIMITATIONS ON WHAT COULD BE STORED OUTSIDE, UH, THE STUFF THAT WOULD HAVE IMPACT ON THE NEIGHBORS AND ADDED A NUMBER OF, UH, SPECIFIC REQUIREMENTS,

[00:30:02]

AND, AND WE, WE WERE BOTH FAIRLY COMFORTABLE WITH IT AFTER THAT.

WITH THE, UH, CURRENT APPEAL WITHIN THE, THE COURT SYSTEM ON THE DECISION, BY THE ZONING HEARING PORT, I KNOW THAT THIS BOARD HAS 45 DAYS TO MAKE UP A SPINE.

SO IT SEEMS TO ME THAT WE SHOULD NOT BE IN A HURRY TO MAKE A DECISION HERE THAT THE, OKAY, THE, UM, LOST MY, THE, THE, THE 30, THE, THE, UM, THERE THERE'S 30 DAYS TO TAKE AN APPEAL TO THE NEXT, I DON'T KNOW WHETHER MR. MULLEN HAS DONE IT, ACTUALLY, HE HAD TO PROBABLY WORK ON THERE'S 30 DAYS TO TAKE THE APPEAL TO THE NEXT LEVEL.

UM, WHEN JEFF AND I RECOMMENDED THE ORDINANCE, IT IS, IT WAS PARTIALLY DRIVEN BY THE FACT THAT IT RESOLVED LITIGATION, TOO.

THE APPEAL WAS PENDING.

I ENTERED MY APPEARANCE FOR THE TOWNSHIP ON THE ZONING APPEAL.

HAD MR. MULLEN WON THE ZONING APPEAL.

THEN HIS CLIENT WOULD HAVE MORE LEEWAY THAN WE HAVE UNDER THE ORDINANCE.

AND SO THE ORDINANCE WAS AGREED TO, UM, YOU KNOW, PARTLY AND RESOLUTION OF THAT LITIGATION.

SO THEORETICALLY YOU COULD WAIT, BUT AS THE TIME WENT ON, THE ORIGINAL MOTIVATOR WAS THE LITIGATION.

BUT AS, AS JEFF AND I WORKED ON THE ORDINANCE, WE BECAME COMFORTABLE WITH THAT.

IT GOT TO THE POINT WHERE IT DID AS MUCH AS WE WOULD HOPE TO HAVE DONE TO, TO THE ORDINANCE, NO MATTER WHAT HAPPENED TO THE APPEAL.

SO IT, IT WAS A, IT'S NOT THE SAME LEVEL FROM A STAFF STANDPOINT, NOT THE SAME LEVEL OF IMPORTANCE THAT IT WAS WHEN WE BEGAN.

I GOTCHA.

AND I KNOW WE'RE, EVERYTHING CAME IN LAST MINUTE.

UM, I NOTICED IN THE PACKET THAT WE GOT TODAY, THERE WAS A LETTER FROM ONE OF THE NEIGHBORS THAT WANTED TO BE MADE A PARTY TO THIS HEARING THAT, UH, I'M NOT SURE IF HE WAS, YOU COULD REQUESTED AND MADE A PARTY.

I THINK HE WAS JUST LOOKING TO HAVE THAT LETTER INCLUDED IN THE INFORMATION.

HE SAYS THAT YOU CAN REQUEST SAYS HE WANTED IT INCLUDED BECAUSE HE COULDN'T BE HERE.

THERE'S NO PARTY STATUS FOR ORDINANCE HEARINGS.

IT'S NOT LIKE A CONDITIONAL USE HEARING.

SO, BUT PEOPLE CAN BE HEARD.

SO IT'S NOT REALLY A PROBLEM, WHATEVER, I DON'T KNOW EVEN WHAT THAT IS, BUT TRUE.

IF I COULD COMMENT ON, WE HAVE, WE WERE GIVEN A COPY OF IT.

AND I THINK ONE OF THE PROBLEMS IS THAT THE PERSON LIVES ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE WN PROPERTY AND HAD HEARD OUR TRUCKS MOVING AROUND WHEN THEY WERE DOING THAT BIG PILE OF A CRUSH, CONCRETE, AND WAS CONCERNED ABOUT THAT AND SAID THAT THE KEY DOESN'T CONFORM TO THE CODIFIED USES IN THE R ONE ZONE.

WELL, THAT'S, CAUSE WE'RE NOT CONFORMING.

AND THE ZONING HERE WE'RE FOUND NOT CONFORMING.

SO, SO THAT ARGUMENT DOESN'T HOLD WATER.

AND THEN ALSO TALKED ABOUT THE NOISE.

BUT IF WE PUT EVERYTHING INSIDE, THERE'S NOT GONNA BE ANY NOISE.

SO THAT'S OUR RESPONSE TO THAT LETTER.

WHEN DID MR. KEY, UM, KAINO, WHEN DID MR. KEYO BUY THE PROPERTY? WHAT YEAR WAS THAT? I HONESTLY DON'T KNOW, UH, THREE YEARS, NO, 2 22 YEARS.

SO IT'S FAIRLY RECENT WITHIN A COUPLE YEARS.

WOULD PARK OUT FRONT IN THE PARKING SPACES, AND THEN THEY WOULD HAVE A TRUCK COMING TO LOAD UP WITH SUPPLIES OR WHATEVER.

SO WHY NOT DO THE LANDSCAPING WITH THE CRUSHED CRO? I MEAN, YOU'RE CRUSHING CONCRETE NOW.

SO BEFORE THAT OPERATION WASN'T HAPPENING ON THE PROPERTY, WHEN WE STARTED DOING THAT, THE PROPERTY, THE CRUSHING OF THE CONCRETE WAS YES, ABSOLUTELY.

SO WHY DO WE NEED THE CHANGE TO DO THE LANDSCAPING REGARDLESS OF WHAT'S GOING ON TODAY OR WHAT'S GOING ON IN THE FUTURE? WELL, THAT'S LIKE GOING TO A BOWLING ALLEY AND SAYING, WHY DON'T YOU PUT UP SOME TREES SO YOU CAN CONTINUE YOUR BOWLING ALLEY.

I MEAN, WE'RE, I LIKE THAT.

WHAT WE'RE SAYING IS WE'RE THERE, WE'RE ENTITLED TO DO WHAT WE'RE DOING THERE.

SO THERE'S REALLY NO NEED FOR US TO PUT UP LANDSCAPING.

AND ALSO IT'S NOT GOING TO CUT DOWN THE NOISE AS MUCH AS BUILDINGS WOULD.

SO AS FAR AS THE NOISE GOES, THERE'S NOISE OF CRUSHING THERE'S NOISE OF TRUCKS.

HOW MANY TRUCKS TODAY GO BACK, TAKE HAULS OF THE PROPERTY.

WE RIGHT NOW, WHILE WE'RE PENDING THIS BEFORE, BEFORE YOU STOPPED, HOW MANY TRUCKS WERE GOING? UH, JIM, I DON'T KNOW, 20 A DAY DURING WHAT HOURS OF THE DAY, TYPICAL SEVEN TO THREE DAYLIGHT SHIFT, SEVEN TO THREE, SEVEN TO THREE.

AND, AND THE PROPOSED DRAWING HAS 20 DOCKS ON IT.

SO HOW THE, THE STUDY THAT YOU DID WITH THE ROAD THAT HAS 20 DOCKS ALONG THE ONE SIDE THERE, THE PURPLE BOXES OR DOCKS, I ASSUME, HOW MANY TRUCKS A DAY DO YOU ANTICIPATE WOULD BE GOING INTO THOSE 20 DOCKS? WELL, YOU FIGURE IF YOU HAVE AN ELECTRICIAN, THE, THE PRINCIPLE OF THE COMPANY, AND MAYBE THE BOOKKEEPER

[00:35:01]

THE TRUCKS TYPICALLY WE'VE TAKEN HOME BY THE EMPLOYEES OVERNIGHT.

SO THEY WOULDN'T BE PARKED THERE, BUT ON A GIVEN DAY, IT COULD BE UP TO 20.

UH, BUT OVER AS, AS, UH, TPD SAID, UH, YOU GOTTA REMEMBER, UH, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT TRIPS PER DAY AND TRIPS PER HOUR.

AND, AND ALSO YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER THAT OUR HOURS OF OPERATION WON'T BE LIKE THE COMMERCIAL USES, WHICH DON'T OPEN UNTIL LIKE 10 O'CLOCK.

WE'LL BE DONE BY 10 O'CLOCK.

WE'LL BE ALL OUT ON THE ROAD.

SO WE'RE NOT GONNA CROSS THAT TRAFFIC.

OUR TRAFFIC'S NOT GONNA HIT THE TRAFFIC.

THAT'S ALREADY THERE FOR THE COMMERCIAL USES IN THE MORNING.

BUT WOULDN'T, THOSE TRUCKS NEED TO RETURN AT NIGHT.

AND WILL THE CONTRACTORS TRUCKS BE STORED ON THE PROPERTY? NO.

SO IT'S PURELY, UH, PURELY A STORAGE FOR THEM TO COME AND LEAVE TO GRAB STUFF.

EXACTLY.

WHATEVER THEY'RE PUTTING IN THERE.

EXACTLY.

IS THERE A DIFFERENCE IN THE TYPES OF VEHICLES WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AS TO WHAT'S DOING THE, THE TRUCK TRAFFIC NOW AND WHAT YOU ANTICIPATE IN THE FUTURE? OH YEAH.

THE TRUCKS THAT WE WOULD HAVE, IF THIS ORDINANCE IS APPROVED, WILL BE SMALLER THAN THE TRUCKS THAT WE USE IN THE RECYCLING BUSINESS.

ABSOLUTELY.

OH, THEY'D BE LIKE BOX TRUCKS AND SMALLER.

WHAT THE TRUCKS WOULD WITH THE BUSINESS IN THE FUTURE.

IT'D BE LIKE, HAVE YOU SEEN LIKE AN ELECTRICIAN'S TRUCK? IT'S LIKE, YOU KNOW, A LARGE VAN A BOX.

THAT'S WHAT THEY WOULD BE.

AND, AND THE LIGHTING THAT'S ON THE PROPERTY TODAY VERSUS THE LIGHTING THAT WOULD BE FOR SECURITY OF A FACILITY LIKE THIS.

HOW IS THAT DIFFERENT? OH, THE LIGHTING WOULD BE DOWN, WOULD BE SHADED SHIELDED TO PREVENT SPILL OVER TO NEIGHBORS AND WOULD BE DOWN DRAFTED, NO HIGHLIGHTS.

WON'T BE ANY GLOW OR ANY LIGHT SPILLAGE.

AND THAT'S REQUIRED BY YOUR ORDINANCE, YOUR SUBDIVISION AND DEVELOPMENT MINORITIES.

YOU MENTIONED THAT THIS WOULD IMPROVE THE SELF STORAGE SITUATION.

IT WOULD EXPLAIN THAT FURTHER TO ME.

ARE YOU SAYING THAT THERE'S MANY CONTRACTORS USING THIS SELF STORAGE UP CLOSER TO TARGET? YES.

THAT THIS MAY ATTRACT THIS MAY ATTRACT OR OTHERS OF SIMILAR WOULD BE ATTRACTED TO THIS.

WHAT HAPPENS IS THE CONTRACTORS CAN'T FIND A PLACE TO GO.

SO THEY RENT A STORAGE UNIT AND PUT THEIR EQUIPMENT IN THERE AND THEN THEY OPERATE OUT OF THERE.

THAT'S ALL THE QUESTIONS I HAVE.

I HAVE A QUICK QUESTION.

WHEN YOU, YOU ORIGINALLY WENT TO THE ZONING BOARD, THEY DENIED, IT WENT FURTHER AND THEN IT GOT DENIED AT THE COUNTY.

WHY DID IT GET DENIED AT THE ZONING THAT INITIAL, WHY DID THEY DENY IT? WHAT WAS THEIR REASONING? WELL, THERE'S A 31 PAGE OPINION.

RECAP THAT JUST, WELL, IT JUST GOES ON BASICALLY.

IT SAYS, UM, OUR, OUR ARGUMENT WAS THAT WE HAVE A NONCONFORMING USE THE LAW IN PENNSYLVANIA IS THAT IF YOU WANT TO ENCLOSE THAT NONCONFORMING USE YOU'RE ALLOWED TO, BUT THEY FOUND THAT WE WEREN'T ALLOWED TO.

AND THEY SAID, NO, WE DON'T AGREE THAT YOU CAN ENCLOSE THE, THE USE.

AND IT'S KIND OF BASIC FUNDAMENTAL LAW IN PENNSYLVANIA THAT YOU ALWAYS HAVE THE RIGHT AS PART OF YOUR PROTECTION OF A NON-PERFORMING USE TO ENCLOSE IT.

SO, YOU KNOW, IF I'M GROWING POT, I CAN PUT IT INSIDE.

IT DIDN'T, IT, IT REALLY, YOU KNOW, I FILED A BRIEF ON APPEAL ON BEHALF OF THE TOWNSHIP WHERE WE DIDN'T THINK IT, IT WASN'T JUST A MATTER OF ENCLOSING AND EXISTING USE.

IT WAS A CHANGE OF USE.

SO THAT'S REALLY THE, THE CHANGE OF USE WAS REALLY WHAT, WELL, IT'S DID TWO THINGS.

IT'S, WHAT'S DRIVEN AN ORDINANCE THAT IS CHANGING THE USE.

AND IT ALSO WAS THE REASON THAT IT WASN'T CONSIDERED A CONTINUATION OF A NONCONFORMITY.

WHEN YOU HAVE A USE THAT PREDATES THE ZONING ORDINANCE, YOU CAN KEEP GOING WITH IT.

BUT WHEN YOU EXPAND IT, THERE ARE LIMITS TO THAT BECAUSE THEY WANT OVER TIME, NONCONFORMING USES TO GO AWAY SORTA, YOU KNOW, THEY, SO THAT THEY DON'T JUST KEEP GOING FOREVER.

SO THERE'S A TIGHT SET OF RULES FOR HOW MUCH YOU CAN EXPAND A NONCONFORMITY.

AND THAT'S KIND OF WHAT THE APPEALS ABOUT.

IT'S GET THAT GETS INTO THE NUANCES OF LAW.

AND ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS WAS THAT WE WERE SAYING YOUR ORDINANCE PROVIDES IT CAN CHANGE IN NONCONFORMING USE TO ANOTHER USE OF A SIMILAR TYPE.

UM, AND THAT'S WHAT WE WERE ARGUING IS THAT WE WERE GOING TO BE CONTINUING BASICALLY THE SAME TYPE USE THAT THEY DIDN'T INTEGRATE.

SO THE HISTORY OF THIS PROPERTY HELPED ME WITH THAT A LITTLE BIT.

THE BACK HALF THAT'S SURROUNDED BY RESIDENTIAL HOUSING IS ZONED R ONE, THE OTHER HALF IS THE

[00:40:01]

NC.

AND THAT WAS CHANGED WHEN, AND THAT WAS TO, TO MORE ALIGN WITH A LONG RIDGE PIKE AND THE COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES, A LONG RIDGE PIKE, CORRECT? CORRECT.

THAT'S WHEN DID THAT, WHEN DID THAT HAPPEN? I CAN'T TELL YOU WHEN THAT HAPPENED, BUT IT WAS, IT'S BEEN THAT WAY SINCE, BEFORE THE GAMBONE SHOPPING CENTER WAS BUILT, CUZ I REPRESENTED MB BONES WHEN THEY DID IT AND, AND THAT WAS ALWAYS NC UP THERE.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER BOARD QUESTIONS? ALL RIGHT.

ARE THERE MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC WHO HAVE QUESTIONS, UH, OR COMMENTS ABOUT THE ORDINANCE AND THIS IS NOT A BE GOOD EVENING, MR. JANOV.

THIS IS NOT A, A PARTY STATUS TYPE OF A THING.

IT'S MORE YOUR, YOUR OBLIGATION UNDER THE STATE LAWS TO RECEIVE COMMENT ON THE ORDINANCE BEFORE YOU VOTE ON IT.

IT'S NOT A HEARING WHERE PEOPLE ENTER THEIR APPEARANCES PARTIES AND GO AT EACH OTHER.

AND MR. JANOFF, MR. JANOV.

I'M SORRY.

CAN ED, CAN YOU PLEASE GIVE HIM YOUR MIC STAND? SURE.

OH, YEP.

THAT SHORT I MIGHT BE, UM, NONE OF US WILL COMMENT ON ED.

OF TRAFFIC IMPACT STUDY THAT IS REQUIRED.

JUST RAISE IT UP FOR YOURSELF PLEASE.

I'M ALSO, OH, HERE WE GO.

THERE WE GO.

I DON'T HAVE TO SING, DO I, YOUR CALL? THANK YOU, ACTUALLY, JOE, WHAT I WAS GOING TO SAY WAS THIS REALLY ISN'T, I DON'T HAVE QUESTIONS, BUT I HAVE COMMENTS AND, AND THE THINGS I LIKE TO COMMENT ON AS MUCH AS I RESPECT MR. MULLEN, MR. MULLEN'S PRESENTATION IS FILLED WITH SUPPOSITION.

IT'S HIS TESTIMONY AND HE PRESENT, HE READ A SO-CALLED EXPERTS REPORT INTO THE RECORD WITHOUT A PRESENTATION OF THAT FOR, FOR CONSIDERATION BY THIS BOARD AND THE CONCERN THAT MY CLIENT HAS.

AND I REPRESENT STANLEY ZURICH, WHO WAS A NEIGHBOR HERE.

THE, THE PROBLEM THAT WE HAVE WITH THIS PRESENTATION AND WHERE WE ARE RIGHT NOW IS THAT THE ZONING HEARING BOARD MADE A DECISION BASED UPON THE EXACT SAME SET OF FACTS AS YOU'RE HEARING THIS EVENING.

AND THEY FOUND THAT IT WAS NOT A CONTINUATION OF A NONCONFORMING USE AS MR. PRESIDENT HAS INDICATED.

AND, AND, AND AGAIN, PERHAPS AN APPELLATE COURT WILL FIND DIFFERENTLY, BUT AT THIS PARTICULAR MOMENT, THAT'S THE STATUS OF THIS PARTICULAR PROPERTY.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE GILMORE LETTER AND, AND THIS BOARD IS CHARGED WITH THE RESPONSIBILITY OF MAKING A DECISION BASED UPON INFORMATION THAT IT RECEIVES.

BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE GILMORE LETTER, I RESPECTFULLY SUBMIT TO YOU THAT THE APPLICANT HAS NOT SATISFIED WHAT YOUR OWN ENGINEER HAS REQUESTED THAT BE PRESENTED TO YOU.

AND IF YOU LOOK AT IT, IT'S HIS LETTER OF AUGUST 16TH.

HE SAYS THAT THE ZONING COMMENTS ARE THAT A MARKET AREA STUDY SHALL BE PROVIDED FOR REQUEST FOR REZONING TO THE NC DISTRICT.

IT SHOULD INCLUDE POPULATION ESTIMATES, ESTIMATED DEMAND FOR GOOD IN SERVICE, GOODS AND SERVICES, COMPETING, ESTABLISHMENT ANALYSIS, FISCAL IMPACT, AND POST CONSTRUCTION, FINANCIAL BENEFIT ANALYSIS TO THE TOWNSHIP OF THE COUNTY.

I SUGGEST TO THIS BOARD THAT YOU HAVEN'T HEARD THAT YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THAT YOU DON'T HAVE IT IN FRONT OF YOU.

IN FACT, I WOULD SUGGEST TO THE BOARD THAT GILMORE HAS NOT EVEN SEEN THE REPORTS THAT MR. MULLEN READ INTO THE RECORD IN ORDER TO GIVE YOU THE ADVICE THAT YOU'RE PAYING FOR TO FIND OUT WHAT YOUR ENGINEER REALLY HAS TO SAY ABOUT THESE SUPPOSED STATEMENTS THAT ARE MADE BY OTHERS.

THERE'S A ONE PAGE LETTER WHICH WAS HANDED OUT.

IT DOESN'T SAY ANYTHING.

IT DOESN'T COME CLOSE TO THIS.

OKAY? NUMBER TWO, A NEIGHBORHOOD IMPACT ANALYSIS SHALL BE PROVIDED FOR REQUESTS FOR REZONING TO THE NC DISTRICT.

THIS ANALYSIS SHOULD INCLUDE THE CONFORMANCE OF THE SITE TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN OF UPPER PROVIDENCE TOWNSHIP, NATURAL RESOURCE IMPACT STATEMENTS IMPACT ON THE TRANSPORTATION SYSTEM.

PUBLIC UTILITY IMPACTS, INCLUDING SANITARY, SEWER, WATER, STORM, WATER MANAGEMENT, ET CETERA, POLICE AND FIRE IMPACTS AS WELL AS NOISE ODOR, SMOKE, GLARE, OR VIBRATION, VIBRATION IMPACT ANALYSIS.

OTHER THAN MR. MULLIN'S GRATUITOUS STATEMENTS THAT DON'T WORRY ABOUT.

IT WON'T BE ANY MORE, ANY MORE NOISY IMPACT TO BE LESS NOISY.

WHAT HAVE YOU HEARD? WHAT EXPERT HAS GIVEN YOU THAT INFORMATION FOR YOU TO MAKE A RECENT AND INTELLIGENT DECISION THIS EVENING? NOW IT MIGHT BE THAT WE HAVE TO COME BACK AND MAYBE THAT WILL BE PRESENTED, BUT RIGHT NOW YOU HAVEN'T HEARD THAT.

AND YOU, YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THAT OTHER THAN MR. MULLEN'S COMMENTS.

THE THIRD ISSUE IS A REQUEST FOR, OF REZONING TO THE NC DISTRICT REQUIRES A TRAFFIC IMPACT STUDY.

THE TRAFFIC IMPACT SHALL BE ANALYZED FOR THE NC DISTRICT, SUCH AS ADEQUACY OF THOROUGH FARES AND ACCESS POINTS OFF STREET PARKING AND LOADING FACILITIES SHARED PARKING, TRAFFIC VOLUME, ET CETERA.

I'D SUGGEST TO YOU AGAIN, THAT YOU HAVEN'T SEEN THE, THE LEVEL

[00:45:01]

AND THESE ITEMS THAT GILMORE POINTS OUT IN THE LETTER ARE NOT OFF THE SEAT OF HIS PANTS OUT ON THE SEAT OF HIS PANTS.

THESE ARE ORDINANCE REQUIREMENTS FOR YOU TO CONSIDER BEFORE YOU MAKE A DETERMINATION.

YOU HAVEN'T HEARD ANY OF THEM.

YOU HAVEN'T SEEN ANY OF THEM.

AND THE DOCUMENTS THAT MR. MULLEN PRESENTED DON'T COME CLOSE TO WHAT IS REQUIRED BY YOUR ORDINANCE TO HAVE A REZONE.

I'D ALSO LIKE TO TAKE ISSUE WITH THE COMMENT ABOUT THE CONCRETE CRUSHING AND, AND, AND, AND MR. YER, YOU MADE A POINT OF IT JUST BEFORE.

AND IT'S REALLY TRUE.

THE CONCRETE CRUSHING WAS IN THE NC PORTION, WHICH IS ONLY TWO ACRES.

IT'S NOT HALF AND HALF.

IT WAS IN THE NC PORTION, WHICH FRONTS ON RICH PIPE.

THE REASON WHY MY CLIENT IS HERE THIS EVENING, AND THERE ARE OTHERS WHO I HOPE WILL, WILL SAY SOMETHING TO YOU IS BECAUSE IT'S TO RESELL THIS ENTIRE PROPERTY TO ALLOW ALL OF THIS ACTIVITY TO I IMPINGE ON THE NEIGHBORS WHO ARE ON THE EIGHT OR NINE ACRES THAT ARE IN THE BACK OF THAT PROPERTY IS, IS AN ABOMINATION.

IT'S NOT FAIR TO THOSE PEOPLE.

AND THAT, AND THAT'S THE REAL PROBLEM HERE.

IT, IT IT'S WHAT IS BEING REQUESTED IS THAT THE ENTIRE TRACK BE ALLOWED TO BE, UH, TO HAVE IMPOSED UPON IT.

ALL OF THESE INDUSTRIAL AND COMMERCIAL USES, WHICH SEVERELY IMPACT THE NEIGHBORS WHO LIVE IN THE BACK OF THAT PROPERTY, MY CLIENT INCLUDED.

SO IT'S A SIGNIFICANT MATTER THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED.

AND THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT GILMORE ASKED THAT YOU LOOK AT BEFORE YOU MAKE A DETERMINATION OF THIS REZONING.

THE OTHER THING I'D LIKE YOU TO CONSIDER IS THIS REZONING IS NOT FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE TOWNSHIP.

IT'S FOR THE BENEFIT OF MR. MULLIN'S CLIENT ALONE.

ONLY THIS ONE TRACK OF LAND ALONE WOULD BE REZONED.

AND THE PROBLEM IS THAT THAT I WOULD RESPECTFULLY SUBMIT IS CONTRACT ZONED, WHICH IS NOT PERMITTED IN PENNSYLVANIA.

YOU CAN'T REZONE, YOU CAN REZONE, BUT I WOULD SUGGEST THAT YOU CAN'T REZONE IF IT BENEFITS ONE PERSON UNDER CONTRACT UNDER THE CONTRACT ZONING THEORY.

AND THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ASKING FOR.

I WOULD ALSO RESPECTFULLY SUBMIT THAT IF YOU REZONE AND THESE BUILDINGS ARE THEN PUT UP, THEY WOULD STILL NEED VARIOUS RELIEF.

THEY'RE GONNA END UP BACK AT THE ZONING HEARING BOARD TO ADDRESS A LOT OF THE DIMENSIONAL ISSUES THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN REJECTED BY THE ZONING HEARING BOARD.

THEY'RE GONNA BE BACK AGAIN.

SO YOU'RE NOT, THEY'RE NOT REALLY SOLVING ANY PARTICULAR PROBLEM.

IN FACT, THEY'RE CREATING A NEW ONE AND A, AND A, A TERRIBLE IMPOSITION ON THE RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORS IN THE REAR OF THE PROPERTY.

AND I THINK I MIGHT BE DONE.

I THINK I AM.

ARE THERE ANY OTHER MEMBERS, UH, OF THE PUBLIC WHO WISH TO OFFER COMMENTS ABOUT THE PENDING PROPOSED ORDINANCE AND PLEASE COME FORWARD.

GLENN STAUS ONE SSTA N K O V.

ICS, 1 24 PENTE PACKER ROAD HELP BACK TO FOLLOW THERE.

UM, SO I LIVE ON PENTE PACK ROAD, WHICH IS NOT IN THE BACK OF THE PROPERTY.

IT'S ON THE OTHER SIDE OF WALTON'S NURSERY.

SO I BOUGHT MY HOUSE 18 YEARS AGO.

I MOVED FROM PHILADELPHIA.

I GOT OUT OF PHILADELPHIA FOR A REASON COME UP HERE.

IT'S NICE AND QUIET.

I GO OUT IN MY BACKYARD AT NIGHT.

I LOOK OUT BACK IT'S DARK, NOTHING.

I DON'T CARE WHAT THEY SAY ABOUT NOISE AND LIGHT.

THERE'S GONNA BE NOISE POLLUTION.

THERE'S GONNA BE LIGHT POLLUTION.

AND THAT'S NOT FAIR TO ME.

THAT'S NOT FAIR TO HIM OR ANY OF THESE OTHER PEOPLE THAT LIVE SURROUNDING THAT PROPERTY, EVEN THOUGH MY PROPERTY ISN'T RIGHT UP NEXT TO THEIRS, THE NURSERY IS NOT THAT WIDE.

I MEAN, YOU GUYS ALL KNOW WHERE IT'S AT.

I'LL BE LOOKING RIGHT AT THAT.

THAT'S NOT FAIR TO ME, 18 YEARS.

IF I WANTED THAT, I WOULDN'T HAVE MOVED OUT OF PHILADELPHIA.

NOT WHAT I'M LOOKING FOR.

I JUST, I DON'T THINK IT'S FAIR, SIR.

CAN I ASK YOU ONE THING? WHAT ABOUT THE CURRENT USE? DO YOU, DO YOU, DOES THAT, IS THAT BOTHERSOME TO YOU AT ALL? IT IS BOTHERSOME, BUT I THINK THIS WOULD BE MORE BOTHERSOME.

WELL, CAN I JUST, WHY YOU THINK IT WOULD BE WORSE AFTER THE ORDINANCE THAN IT IS NOW? OKAY.

AT NIGHT I'M LOOKING OUT IT'S, IT'S, YOU KNOW, DARK.

I I'M GONNA SEE LIGHTS.

I'M GONNA HEAR SOUND.

I, YOU KNOW, LIKE I SAID, I, THEY COULD PUT ALL THE LIPSTICK ON.

THEY WANT IT'S I'M STILL GONNA SAY IT AND HEAR IT.

UNDERSTOOD ANYONE ELSE?

[00:50:01]

GOOD EVENING.

UH, YES.

HOPE H O P E HALDEN H A L D R E N.

I LIVE AT 1 72 KLINE ROAD.

UM, I CAN BEAT OUT EVERYONE HERE.

I'VE LIVED ON MY PROPERTY 62 YEARS.

UM, THAT'S LONGER THAN ANYONE ELSE.

UM, SO THE ZONING FOR R ONE PROBABLY STARTS SOMEWHERE AROUND THE POWER LINES AND THEN GOES BACK TOWARDS BLOOMFIELD TRAP ROAD.

I CAN TELL YOU THAT SUPERIOR TREE AND THE PRIOR OWNER WHO WAS SHAFER, I CAN'T RECALL HIS NAME.

HE PASSED.

THEY DID NOT USE THAT PROPERTY FOR ANY KIND OF CRUSHING OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

UM, THE LAST STEP FRETS DID WAS THERE WAS A TRAILER BEHIND MY HOUSE, KIND OF LIKE IN THE WOODS.

UM, AND THAT'S, AS FAR AS ANYTHING THAT WAS EVER DONE, UM, THERE WAS NEVER ANY HEAVY GRINDING SCREENING OR STORAGE, UM, FROM THE BOTTOM OF MY PROPERTY, UP TO WHERE, YOU KNOW, TOWARDS LIMB FIELD TRAP ROAD.

SO I WONDER WHY, SINCE IT'S ZONED R ONE BEHIND MY PROPERTY, WHY ARE WE ALLOWED TO, UM, CRUSH STONE PU PILES OF LIKE CONCRETE THAT WERE LIKE 35 FEET HIGH, WHICH ARE GONE? WHY, WHY CAN THAT WORK CONTINUE TO BE DONE? UM, AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT THERE'S DUMP TRUCKS EVERY DAY, ALL DAY LONG UP AND DOWN OUR ROAD.

IF YOU COME OUT OF TARGET, THERE'S A SIGN THAT SAYS NO TRUCKS TO TURN, YOU KNOW, UP, UH, KLINE ROAD TOWARDS LYNNFIELD TRAP.

HOWEVER, UM, I GUESS THAT DOESN'T APPLY TO THE DUMP TRUCKS.

SO, UH, I WORK FROM HOME.

I GUARANTEE YOU THAT, UM, WHAT I'M TELLING YOU IS WHAT I KNOW FOR LIVING ON THAT PROPERTY 62 YEARS.

AND I DON'T THINK THIS IS A GOOD USE OF A VERY NARROW AND SMALL PROPERTY.

WE OWN ALMOST THREE ACRES.

THIS PROPERTY, FROM WHAT I KNOW IS LIKE 12 ACRES AND TO PUT A HUNDRED THOUSAND SQUARE FOOT OF ANYTHING ON IT TO ME IS TOO MUCH.

SO THAT'S ALL I HAVE.

ANYONE ELSE? MA'AM HOLD ON ONE SECOND.

E R M A LAST NAME IS VALLARIO V AS IN VICTOR, A L E R I O.

FROM BRIDGE SITE HERE TO ONE OF THESE, I CAN TELL YOU THAT UNDER LAND DEVELOPMENT, THIS IS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE ZONING RIGHT NOW.

3 27 EAST LYNNFIELD TRACK.

HI.

UM, I JUST WANNA LET YOU KNOW THAT, UM, ON THIS DIAG, UM, IF YOU DON'T MIND, IF I CAN WALK OVER THERE AND SHOW YOU SOMETHING, TAKE THE MIC WITH YOU, PLEASE.

I'LL GOES DOWN.

SO OUR PROPERTY OVER HERE AND THE GRADE, THOSE DOWN BEFORE, THEY'RE GOING TO CUT OUT THIS PIECE OF PROPERTY HERE AT ITS HIGHEST AT ITS HIGHEST.

SO MY PROPERTY HAVE A ON THE OTHER SIDE SO THAT THEY CAN LEVEL OUT.

NOW I UNDERSTAND WHERE'S OUR OTHER PROBLEM.

MY CONCERN IS MAJOR THOUGHT ABOUT HOW DO YOU GET FIRED FROM,

[00:55:01]

THERE'S A PROCESS THAT COMES AFTER ZONING.

ASSUMING THE ORDINANCE, IF IT GOT ADOPTED LAND DEVELOPMENT, WHERE YOU BUILD THE BUILDINGS IS SUBJECT TO A SEPARATE SET OF REVIEW, WHICH INCLUDES THE FIRE MARSHAL.

SO THE NOTHING CAN BE BUILT THAT DOESN'T HAVE FULL FIRE SAFETY TURNING.

THE FIRE TRUCK.

I'VE BEEN THERE FOR 30 YEARS.

I'M NOT SAYING THAT UNDER THAT DESIGN, THAT IT, I'M NOT, I'M NOT THE FIRE MARSHAL.

I'M NOT SAYING THAT THAT WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT IS COMPLIANT.

I'M SAYING NOTHING WOULD EVER BE APPROVED.

THAT WASN'T THE ALL THANK YOU.

MA'AM IF WE COULD JUST HAVE A LITTLE LESS TALKING OUT THERE, IT'S A LITTLE DISTRACTING, UH, ANYONE ELSE WHO WISH TO MAKE A THANK YOU? MA'AM ANYONE ELSE WISH TO MAKE A COMMENT? STAN, 180 4 KLINE ROAD, S Z, C, Z U R E K.

JUST A COMMENT.

UM, THE FAIRYTALE ABOUT ELECTRICIAN'S TRUCKS, THE MOST INNOCUOUS TYPE OF CONTRACTOR, YOU CAN GET THE LITTLE TRUCK GOING THROUGH.

UM, THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GONNA BE THERE.

THEY DON'T KNOW WHO'S GONNA RENT IT.

THEY DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, ONCE IT GETS DONE IT'S THERE ARE NOT THAT MANY ELECTRICIANS IN THIS AREA.

SO YOU'VE GOT POOL CONTRACTORS, CHEMICALS YOU'VE GOT EVERY, ANY POSSIBLE THING COULD POSSIBLY BE THERE.

THE ISSUE THAT WE TALKED ABOUT BEFORE WITH THE STUDY NOW, MYSELF AND A COUPLE OF THE NEIGHBORS FROM PETTY PACKER CALLED THE POLICE, BECAUSE WHAT HAPPENED WAS WHEN YOU GO ON WAYS AND YOU'RE, YOU'RE IN A TRUCK AND YOU HAVEN'T BEEN IN THIS AREA, IT TAKES YOU DOWN OFF OF 4 22 DOWNTOWN SHIP LINE ROAD.

AND YOU DON'T GO TO RIDGE PIKE.

YOU MAKE A RIGHT ON LINFIELD TRAP, RIGHT AT THE Y M C A AND THEN YOU GO DOWN AND YOU MAKE A LEFT ON KLINE ROAD, THE NEW, BEAUTIFUL ROAD THAT YOU JUST PUT IN TRUCK AFTER TRUCK, AFTER TRUCK, TH TRUCKS GOING DOWN THAT ROAD.

BECAUSE THAT WAY THEY, YOU KNOW, SAVE THE COUPLE MINUTES, CUZ THEY DIDN'T HAVE TO GET ON TOWNSHIP LINE ROAD TO RIDGE PIKE AND MAKE THE RIGHT.

THEN THEY GO AND THEY GO TO THE END OF OUR ROAD AT KLINE ROAD, MAKE THE RIGHT GO.

YOU'RE GOING TO KEY'S PROPERTY.

WELL THEN WHEN THEY'RE LEAVING THE PROPERTY, IT'S A BIG TRUCK.

THEY DON'T WANNA CROSS OVER, OVER BRIDGE PIKE AND HAVE TO MAKE A LEFT.

SO WHAT DO THEY DO? THEY MAKE A RIGHT THEN WHAT DO THEY DO? THEY MAKE ANOTHER RIGHT.

A PENNY PACKER AND DRIVE THESE TRUCKS RIGHT DOWN PENNY PACKER.

SO ANY STUDY THAT YOU MAY HAVE THAT SAID IT'S A NEGATIVE 1% IMPACT OR WHATEVER.

I CAN TELL YOU.

I WORK FROM HOME, MY OFFICE OVERLOOKS RICK KLEIN ROAD.

I SEE ALL THE TRUCKS GOING DOWN, CALL THE POLICE.

I THINK THEY TALKED TO THEM.

IT WAS, UH, YOU KNOW, THEY WERE DUMPING, YOU KNOW, MATERIALS OR WHATEVER THEY WERE COMING INTO THE YARD.

IT HAS SLOWED DOWN, BUT IT'S STILL HAPPENING.

AND YOU KNOW, NONE OF THIS IS, YOU KNOW, TALKED ABOUT WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT ELECTRICIAN, YOU KNOW, OKAY, A LITTLE ELECTRICIAN WITH SOME WIRES AND YOU KNOW, A LITTLE TINY PICKUP TRUCK.

THAT'S NOT, WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN.

AND WE ALL KNOW THAT.

AND THE OTHER POINT IS THE BUILDINGS THAT THEY'RE PROPOSING ARE 35 FEET HIGH NOW LIGHTING FOR A 35 FOOT HIGH BUILDING WITH A PROPERTY THAT'S ALREADY, YOU KNOW, LIKE, LIKE ONE OF THE OTHER NEIGHBORS JUST POINTED OUT LOWER.

THEY HAVE TO LEVEL IT OUT.

IT'S GONNA BE WAY ABOVE WHAT WE'RE ALL GONNA SEE.

AND RIGHT NOW WE DON'T SEE MUCH BACK THERE UNTIL, YOU KNOW, WE ALL SAW THE 35 FOOT HIGH PILE, BUT WE'RE ALL GONNA SEE THE LIGHTS NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO THAT NICE PROPERTY BACK THERE.

EVERYBODY HAS NICE BACKYARDS AND SPEND A LOT.

I JUST SPEND ANOTHER $8,000 ON LANDSCAPING, PUTTING IN NEW TREES, HOPING THAT IT DOESN'T GO IN.

BUT IF IT DOES JUST BACKING UP THE END OF MY PROPERTY, JUST SO I DON'T HAVE TO LOOK AT IT BECAUSE I SPEND A LOT OF MONEY ON MY PROPERTY AND I DON'T PLAN ON MOVING.

UM, SO AGAIN, IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S DISTURBING TO HEAR FAIRY TALES ABOUT WHAT'S GONNA BE THERE AND YOU KNOW, AND TAKE IT IT ON FAITH.

IT'LL BE GOOD.

IT'S GREAT FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

IT'S, YOU KNOW, TURNING IN INDOOR USE INTO SOMETHING IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT USING IT FOR WHAT IT WAS BEFORE, BEFORE THEY DID ALL THE WORK UP BY RICH PIKE WHERE IT WAS NC.

NOW THEY WANNA MOVE IT ALL BACK TO THE BACK END OF THE PROPERTIES.

YOU COULD NAME SUSAN VANDENBERG.

V A N D E N B U R J.

I LIVE ON LIVE FIELD TRAP.

[01:00:01]

YOUR ADDRESS, EXCUSE ME, YOUR HOUSE NUMBER 3 43.

SO I UNDERSTAND PROGRESS GENTLEMEN, BESIDES THE NOISE, MY CONCERN IS HOUSE IS GOING TO AFFECT OUR PROPERTY VALUES.

OUR OTHER ARE PEOPLE GOING TO WANNA, I RAISED MY KIDS.

I'M READY TO MOVE OUT OF THE YARD.

WHAT'S GO.

IS ANYONE GOING TO WANNA BUY OUR HOUSING WITH THIS GOING IN? WE'VE BEEN TOLD THERE'S A PUMP STATION SUPPOSED TO GO IN.

THAT'S SUPPOSED TO SUPPLY WATER AND SEWER LIKE, AND NO ONE GIVES US A STREET ANSWER OF WHEN THIS STUFF IS GOING TO BE DONE.

THAT'S NOT RELATED TO THIS PROJECT.

NO, BUT I'M JUST SAYING, HOW ARE PEOPLE GOING TO VIEW IT? IF WE HAVE THIS GOING ON, LIKE, IS ANYONE GOING TO WANNA BUY OUR HOUSES AT, AT A FAIR MARKET VALUE? YOU KNOW, THAT'S GONNA TELL, YOU KNOW, SCARE PEOPLE OFF.

WHEN I MOVED IN THERE, THE DEER WAS THERE.

WE HAD WILDLIFE, THERE WAS BEAUTIFUL SHRUBBERY.

LIKE I SAID, I UNDERSTAND PROGRESS, BUT IT'S EVERY TIME I TURN AROUND SOMETHING ELSE IS BEING BUILT.

NOW WE HA YOU KNOW, HOUSES AND YOU KNOW, STRIP WALLS AND IT'S, IT'S CONTINUOUS.

AND I MOVED THERE FOR THE BEAUTY AND THE CALMNESS AND I DON'T EVEN BACK UP TO THAT AND I CAN SEE IT AND I CAN HEAR IT.

AND IT'S JUST GONNA BE EVEN MORE.

AND YOU KNOW, IT'S ALL IT, I FEEL BAD FOR THE PEOPLE WHO BACK UP, UP AGAINST THAT PROPERTY BECAUSE IT'S GONNA BE JUST UNSIGHTLY AND IT'S A SHAME, BUT THAT'S ALL I WANNA SAY.

ANYONE ELSE HAVE ANY COMMENTS? ALL RIGHT.

LET THE RECORD REFLECT THAT NO ONE ELSE FROM THE AUDIENCE HAS INDICATED A DESIRE TO OFFER COMMENT.

UM, EXCUSE ME.

IF YOU HAVE COMMENT RELATED TO THIS THEN YOU'RE, THIS IS THE TIME TO DO THAT NAME.

JOHN D A L E R I O 3 27 EAST LYNNFIELD TRAVELER RIVER.

ALL I'VE BEEN ON THIS PROPERTY 42 YEARS.

WHEN I FIRST MOVED UP THERE, THERE WERE PLANTING CORN IN MY BACKYARD.

IT GOT ALL STRIPPED OFF.

AND FROM THERE IT JUST WENT DOWNHILL.

I'M WONDERING, SINCE YOU GOTTA GET DOWN 14 FEET, ARE YOU GOING TO BE, UH, TRACK DRILLING AND BLASTING TO GET THAT MATERIAL OUT? CAUSE WE ALL GOT WELL WATER AND YOU KNOW WHAT CAN HAPPEN? WELL, WATER, YOU AIN'T GOT YOU GET SOMETHING THAT FRACTURED THEN YOU AIN'T GOT NO MORE.

WELL, ANYWAYS, THAT'S, THAT'S ONE PART OF IT.

WHAT ELSE WAS I GOING TO SAY? DO YOU HAVE ANYBODY TO RENT THIS PROPERTY? YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU GOT ALL THESE PLACES AND THE COST OF BUILDING THIS VERSUS THE RENT YOU'RE GOING TO MAKE ON IT, IT JUST DON'T MAKE ANY SENSE TO ME.

YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? YOU GOT ALL THIS MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, TIED UP LEGAL FEES, EVERYBODY ELSE.

AND WHAT YOU'RE GONNA PUT IN THERE.

ARE YOU GONNA GET BACK OUT OF THAT? IT DON'T MAKE SENSE ANYWAYS.

THAT'S MINE.

ANYONE ELSE? ALL RIGHT.

BOARD MEMBERS.

DID ANY OF THE QUESTIONS FROM THE AUDIENCE GENERATE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS FROM ANY OF YOU? ALL RIGHT.

UM, IN TERMS OF, DID YOU, I WOULD JUST LIKE TO MOVE FOR THE EXHIBITION, THE VARIOUS EXHIBITS WE HAVE.

MEAN, IF ONE OF YOU WANTED TO TALK ABOUT THAT, WE COULD DO THAT, BUT NOT, NOT THE ORDINANCE, NOT THE ADOPTION OF THE ORDINANCE THAT CAN ONLY BE DISCUSSED OUT HERE.

AND THOSE ARE IN, UM, IT'S UP TO YOU.

THIS IS NOT A, UH, YOU DON'T HAVE A 45 DAY CLOCK RUNNING AS YOU, YOU MIGHT RECALL.

UM, THERE WAS A PROJECT ON THE OTHER SIDE OF RIDGE THAT, WHERE WE CAME IN AND HAD A COUPLE HEARINGS RELATED TO A POSSIBLE ZING ORDINANCE CHANGED THAT THAT NEVER MOVED ONTO A VOTE.

SO IT'S WHATEVER YOUR PREFERENCE IS, YOU, IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE, YOU CAN VOTE NOW ON THE ORDINANCE.

UM, YOU CAN, WE, WHAT WE, WHAT WE CAN'T DO IS DISCUSS IT IN EXECUTIVE SESSION BECAUSE IT DOESN'T MEET ONE OF THE CRITERIA FOR THAT.

ODDLY WITH THE TIMING, THE LITIGATION CAN BE DISCUSSED IN EXECUTIVE SESSION, BUT I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT YET ON THAT.

CAUSE ALL I HAVE IS A RULING AND I, I

[01:05:01]

SO IT WOULD BE UP TO ONE OF YOU TO MAKE A MOTION EITHER TO, UM, DEFER OR TO MAKE A MOTION TO ACT TONIGHT ON, ON THE APPLICATION.

I'D PREFER TO WAIT MYSELF.

THINK ABOUT IT.

MM-HMM I MEAN, IT'S A LOT TO TAKE IN.

I DON'T MM-HMM GOOD IDEA.

I AGREE.

AND WITH THE DEPENDING, UH, LITIGATION, BUT I, I JUST WANNA SAY TO FOLKS, UH, A COUPLE THINGS I, I WANNA MAKE CLEAR HERE, IT'S NOT AN ISSUE OF PROGRESS VERSUS NON PROGRESS.

THIS IS PRIVATE PROPERTY.

IF THERE WAS A PROPERTY NEXT TO YOU WHERE THEY USED TO PLANT CORN AND TODAY THERE'S HOUSES THERE IT'S BECAUSE THE FARMERS SOLD THAT LAND TO BUILD THOSE HOUSES AND TOOK A PROFIT FROM PRIVATE PROPERTY IS PRIVATE PROPERTY.

I HAVE THAT'S AS OLD AS ENGLISH, COMMON LAW.

SO I, I HEAR PEOPLE COME.

THEY, THEY THINK THAT WE CONTROL THIS, THAT I, WE, WE DON'T, I MEAN, WE, WE SIMPLY CONTROL WHAT'S ON THE ZONING MAP AND THEY'RE ASKING US TO CHANGE THE ZONING MAP.

I'M NOT COMFORTABLE.

I DON'T FEEL LIKE I HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION YET.

I WOULD LIKE TO TABLE THIS FOR, TO, TO AT LEAST THE OCTOBER MEETING.

AND THEN WE'LL SEE WHERE, WHERE WE ARE THEN.

SO, AND I, AND I WOULD ALSO JUST ADD, UM, THE, THE ORDINANCE WAS BROUGHT TO THE SUPERVISORS BY STAFF AND BY ME WITH AN INTENTION AND DESIRE TO IMPROVE THE SITUATION THAT EXISTED THERE OVER THE CURRENT, UM, SITUATION.

SO IT WASN'T, IT WASN'T ABOUT PROGRESS OR ANY OF THE OTHER SORT OF ANCILLARY ISSUES THAT WERE RAISED.

WE FELT THAT WE WERE SOLVING A PROBLEM AND THAT WITH THE CONCESSIONS WE GOT ON OUTDOOR STORAGE AND NOISE AND ALL THAT, UM, THAT IT WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS, UM, A POSITIVE.

UM, I THINK I WOULD IT MR. KEO MOVED THE PILES THAT REALLY HAD REALLY BOTHERED EVERYBODY.

AND I, I GUESS WHAT I'M HEARING IS, UM, THEY WOULD PREFER TO HAVE THE PROPERTY LIKE IT IS NOW OVER CHANGED.

IT'S A LITTLE LESS CLEAR WHETHER PEOPLE WOULD PREFER HAVING THE PILES OVER WHAT'S PROPOSED ALTHOUGH, SOME PEOPLE SEEM TO INDICATE THAT EITHER WAY THEY WOULD RATHER NOT HAVE IT CHANGE, UM, WHATSOEVER, BUT IN ANY EVENT, THE MOTIVATION WAS NOT, WAS ONLY TO TRY TO, UH, SOLVE A PROBLEM ALONG WITH, AT THAT TIME LITIGATION, WHICH TECHNICALLY IS STILL PENDING.

SO WE CAN, UM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT REALLY, WE WOULD HAVE TO RE ADVERTISE ANY FURTHER ACTION ON THIS AT WHICH TIME ADDITIONAL INFORMATION COULD BE INTRODUCED, POSSIBLY INCLUDING A LETTER FROM THE COUNTY THAT WE DON'T HAVE, UH, OR, OR MAYBE NOT, OR MAYBE OTHER THINGS.

SO WE'RE ON, WE'RE SIMPLY STOPPING HERE.

UM, IT'S NOT A MATTER OF CLOSING THE RECORD OR ANYTHING.

IT'S JUST A MATTER THAT NO ACTION IS BEING TAKEN TONIGHT ON THE APPLICATION THEN, ALTHOUGH I, I, I HEARD THE SUGGESTION AND THERE WAS EVERYONE WAS NODDING, BUT IS THAT, IS THAT THE CONSENSUS IS TO, UH, DEFER ANY ACTION ON THE APPLICATION.

DO WE NEED A MOTION THAT WOULD BE MORE CLEAR.

DO WE NEED A MOTION TO DO THAT IN A VOTE? OKAY.

UH, I'LL MAKE A MOTION THAT WE DEFER ACTION ON THE KEY REZONING AT THIS TIME, AND TO BE TAKEN UP AT A LATER MEETING.

I'LL SECOND THAT MOTION.

I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO DEFER THE KEY REZONING, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, SAY AYE.

I DIDN'T KNOW IF YOU JUST INTER INTRODUCE EVERYBODY TO JEFF HUGO AND MIKE LACKIN FROM OUR PENSION GROUP, C B I Z I INR.

YOU KNOW, THEY'RE DOING THE SAME THINGS IN ASSESSMENT.

GO.

[OLD BUSINESS (ACTION/DISCUSSION ITEMS)]

[01:10:06]

OR IS IT INR C B I Z.

I'VE ASKED THEM TO COME AND GIVE US A QU A, UH, THE SECOND QUARTERLY, UH, PENSION REPORT AS YOU KNOW, THE STOCK.

MARKET'S BEEN A LITTLE SCARY AND I THINK, UH, WANTED TO TALK ABOUT THE PERFORMANCE.

THANKS.

I'M MIKE BLACKEN, UH, PRESIDENT OF CBIZ IN R.

UM, I'M GONNA GIVE YOU A QUICK BACKGROUND ON, ON WHO WE ARE.

UH, WE CONSULT ON OVER 57 BILLION OF, UH, RETIREMENT ASSETS.

ONE OF THE LARGEST PENSION ADVISORS IN, IN THE COMMONWEALTH.

WE SIT AS A FIDUCIARY CONSULTANT ON OVER 150, SOME MUNICIPAL PENSION PLANS.

UM, WE WERE, UM, FORTUNATE TO BE WORKING WITH, UM, UPPER PROVIDENCE STARTING IN 2016.

UH, YOU WENT OUT TO, TO RFP AND WE WERE FORTUNATE TO, UH, BE WORKING WITH YOU FOLKS.

UH, WE'RE KNOWN AS THE INDEXED, PASSIVE VANGUARD MANAGERS THROUGHOUT THE COMMONWEALTH.

UM, OUR PROCESS AND OUR BELIEF IS THE MARKETS ARE EXTREMELY EFFICIENT.

IT'S VERY HARD TO BEAT THIS, UH, STOCK MARKET AND BOND MARKET.

UM, YOU DO BEST BY CONCENTRATING ON THE ALLOCATION TO TRY TO HIT YOUR ASSUMED INTEREST RATE OVER TIME.

UH, THAT'S WHAT WE HELPED WITH SINCE OUR INCEPTION WITH YOU GUYS.

ONE OF THE FIRST THINGS THAT WE DID IS WE TOOK A LOOK AT THE ASSUMED INTEREST RATE.

WE WORKED TOGETHER AS A TEAM TO TRY TO GET THAT DOWN INSTEAD OF KICKING THE CAN DOWN THE STREET, YOU AS A MUNICIPALITY, UH, WORKED HARD TO, TO LOWER THAT ASSUMED INTEREST RATE, WHICH IS THE EXACT OPPOSITE.

SO IN TIMES, LIKE, LIKE NOW, AS, AS TIM SAID, WHEN, WHEN THE MARKETS DON'T DELIVER THE RETURNS THAT WE EXPECT, YOU DON'T GET HIT AS HARD, UH, FOR USING A HIGHER ASSUMED INTEREST RATE.

SO CURRENTLY, UM, ON THE NON UNIFORM AND FIRE PLAN, BASED ON THE PREVIOUS PERFORMANCE BEFORE THIS YEAR, YOU WERE ABLE TO LOWER THAT ASSUMED INTEREST RATE ALL THE WAY DOWN TO 6.7, 5%.

UM, ON THE POLICE SIDE, YOU WERE ABLE TO LOWER THAT ASSUMED INTEREST RATE DOWN TO 7%.

UM, SINCE WE CAME IN, THE REASON THOSE CHANGES WERE MADE IS WE'RE SHARING WHAT WE EXPECT TO GET IN A RETURN OVER THE LONG RUN WITH YOUR AUDITORS AND YOUR ACTUARIES.

UH, SO IT WAS A TEAM APPROACH TO TRY TO GET THAT DOWN.

WE CAME TO, TO THAT GROUP IN, IN EARLY JANUARY AND SAID, WE DID NOT EXPECT TO GET THE SAME RETURNS FROM THE STOCK MARKET AND BOND MARKET BECAUSE VALUES RAN UP SO SO MUCH.

AND WE DID EXTREMELY WELL SINCE WE'VE BEEN FORTUNATE TO BE WORKING WITH YOU GUYS.

UM, SO AS OF YEAR TO DATE, AS TIM ALSO MENTIONED, WE WENT INTO A BEAR MARKET ON THE STOCK SIDE.

SO THE, THE, THE STOCK MARKET WAS DOWN OVER 20%.

THIS WAS THE FIRST TIME IN MY 30 YEAR CAREER, OVER 30 YEARS, THAT WITH THE MARKET BEING DOWN MORE THAN 10%, WE DIDN'T HAVE A BUYING OPPORTUNITY.

ONE OF THE COOLEST THINGS ABOUT OUR PROGRAM, IT'S SO EFFICIENT, WE'RE ALWAYS SELLING ASSETS, HIGH BUYING ASSETS LOW.

SO WE'RE ALWAYS AS A GROUP BUYING THINGS ON SALE THAT HAS DRAMATICALLY HELPED YOUR OVERALL RETURNS.

IT'S 2016.

THIS WAS THE FIRST TIME THE MARKET CORRECT BY BY 20%.

AND WE REALLY DIDN'T HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO SELL BONDS AND BUY STOCKS AT A 10% DISCOUNT.

SO, UH, THAT HASN'T HAPPENED SINCE THE EARLY EIGHTIES.

WE DO THINK IF THERE'S GONNA BE A CORRECTION GOING FORWARD.

UM, AND, AND NORMALLY WHEN YOU SEE A BEAR MARKET, YOU WILL SEE TWO TO THREE MORE CORRECTIONS.

YOU SAW THE MARKET COME BACK AND THEN COME BACK DOWN.

WE DO THINK WE WOULD HAVE A BUYING OPPORTUNITY, UM, IF, IF THE MARKET DID CORRECT, BUT AS OF THE END OF THE SECOND QUARTER, THE POLICE PENSION PLAN, THE POLICE NON UNIFORM AND FIRE USUALLY ACTUALLY USING THE SAME ALLOCATION.

SO THE SAME PERFORMANCE IS GONNA BE RELATIVELY THE SAME FOR ALL THREE PLANS.

SO AS OF SIX 30, THE PENSION PLANS WERE DOWN ROUGHLY 16.7, 8%.

THE BOND MARKET AT THAT POINT IN TIME WAS DOWN 10.33.

THE STOCK MARKET WAS DOWN OVER 20%.

SO USING THE, THE, THE ENTIRE MARKET THROUGH THE INDEXES.

SO, SO WHAT PEOPLE KNOW IS BUY IS YOU, YOU OWN EVERYTHING.

UM, WE'RE TRYING TO ALWAYS BUY THINGS ON SALE.

UM, YOU STILL BEAT THE OVERALL STOCK MARKET IN THE FIRST TWO QUARTERS BECAUSE OF SOME OF THE STRATEGIC THINGS THAT, THAT WE DID.

SO I, I KNOW THIS SOUNDS KIND OF TONE IN CHEEK THAT 16.7, 8% DOWN, WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN DOWN EVEN FURTHER.

UM, SOME

[01:15:01]

OF THE THINGS THAT WE DID DO IN THE FIRST HALF OF THE YEAR WAS WE LOWERED THE DURATION OF THE BOND PORTFOLIO, MEANING WE THOUGHT INTEREST RATES WERE GONNA GO UP.

SO WE BOUGHT MORE SHORT TERM SHORT, UH, BOND INDEXES.

SO WE WEREN'T IMPACTED AS HARD WHEN INTEREST RATES WENT UP.

AND THE OTHER THING THAT WE DID AT, AT THE END OF THE SECOND QUARTER IS WE LOWERED THE INTERNATIONAL EXPOSURE, MUCH LOWER THE MOST INSTITUTIONAL ADVISORS.

UH, THE THOUGHT THERE IS THAT EUROPE AND EMERGING MARKETS ARE GONNA GET HIT HARDER, UM, IN, IN THIS CONTINUED, UM, VOLATILITY.

SO THAT'S ALSO HELPED US OUT, UM, IF WE GO TO YEAR TO DAY PERFORMANCE, UM, AND ALSO JUST THE, JUST THE, THE YEAR TO DATE AS OF NINE 14, UH, THE COMBINED PENSIONS ARE DOWN ABOUT 15.21.

THE BLENDED BENCHMARK IS ROUGHLY DOWN 16%.

SO, SO WE DID ROUGHLY 1% BETTER THAN THE STOCK MARKET AND BOND MARKET, IF YOU SQUISHED THEM TOGETHER.

UM, THAT CAME FROM THOSE CHANGES THAT WE MADE IN, IN THE BOND PORTFOLIO AND THE, THE INTERNATIONAL, UH, EQUITIES.

UH, WE DO BELIEVE, UM, YOU, YOU COULD SEE EUROPE GO INTO A RECESSION, UM, IF NOT IN THE SECOND HALF OF THE YEAR THROUGHOUT THE WINTER, UM, WE, WE THINK THERE'S ABOUT A 50 50 CHANCE THAT, UH, WE, WE COULD GO IN A RECESSION HERE.

UM, BUT WHAT WE'VE BEEN REALLY KNOWN AT IS, IS DOING A PRETTY DARN GOOD JOB OF MAKING PROJECTIONS OVER THE LONG RUN.

IF YOU LOOK AT THE PROJECTIONS THAT WE GAVE MUNICIPALITIES 10 AND 20 YEARS AGO, WE NAILED THEM.

WHAT WE EXPECTED TO GET IS WHAT THE MUNICIPALITIES GOT.

UM, THAT'S PRETTY DIFFICULT TO DO, BUT THAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT PART OF OUR JOB.

UM, AND NOW WE'RE SHOWING AS OF JANUARY 1ST, WE THOUGHT THAT USING THE CURRENT ALLOCATION STRATEGY, UM, LONG TERM, GIVEN THAT THE MARKETS RAN SO HIGH, THAT WE WERE ONLY EXPECTING TO GET 5.6, 5% RETURN OVER THE LONG RUN.

AT THAT POINT IN TIME, THERE WERE A LOT OF FOLKS THAT WERE ARGUING WITH US, ESPECIALLY BECAUSE THAT, THAT CREATES, UM, POSSIBLY THE LOWERING OF THE ASSUMED INTEREST RATE AND, AND HIGHER MMOS IN THE FUTURE.

UM, OBVIOUSLY WE, WE WERE RIGHT.

UM, WE DO THINK THAT THE STOCK MARKET'S GONNA DO BETTER THAN THE BOND MARKET OVER THE LONG RUN, WE WOULD STAY THE COURSE.

THIS IS NOT THE TIME TO GET MORE CONSERVATIVE ON THE ALLOCATION STRATEGY.

UM, NOW YOU'RE DOWN ABOUT 15.2, 1%, UH, AS OF THE CLOSE ON, ON NINE 14, UM, WE WOULD SAY, HANG IN THERE, HAVE THE FORTITUDE.

UM, WE'RE GONNA CONTINUE TO BUY THE ASSET CLASSES THAT GO ON SALE, AND EVENTUALLY WE'RE GONNA LOOK SMART.

I JUST CAN'T TELL YOU WHEN, UH, I WISH I COULD.

UM, BUT THE STRATEGY WORKS.

IT'S NOT LIKE, SO ONE OF THE THINGS, IF SOMEBODY SAYS, WELL, WHAT DO YOU GUYS OWN? YOU OWN EVERYTHING.

WE'RE NOT SUSCEPTIBLE TO ONE COMPANY THAT THAT'S GOING TO GET HIT REALLY HARD.

UM, THE, THE STATE OF PENNSYLVANIA WOULD CHANGE WITH YOU GUYS IN A MINUTE BASED ON THE PERFORMANCE THAT YOU GUYS HAVE GOT SINCE WE'VE BEEN FORTUNATE TO WORK WITH YOU.

UM, SO WITH THAT, I'LL, I'LL KIND OF OPEN IT UP TO ANY QUESTION.

DO YOU, DO YOU OFFER UP SOMEWHAT FIGURING THIS OUT? DO DO YOU OFFER UP OPTIONS? SO LIKE SHORT TERM OPTIONS TO KIND OF PROTECT THE MONEY IN THE SHORT TERM? SO, SO FOR INSTANCE, WE TAKE 30%, WE THROW IT IN BONDS FOR A TWO YEAR BOND, PROTECT THAT, AND THEN GET BACK INTO THE STOCKS LATER.

I MEAN, CLEARLY THE BOND MARKET'S BETTER RIGHT NOW.

I AGREE WITH YOU OVER LONG RUN, THE STOCKS MADE 7.8, WE MADE 5.96 VERSUS THE BOND OF 37, 3 7.

SO CLEARLY WE WAY OUTPERFORM THE BOND MARKET, BUT IS THERE, IS THERE OPTIONS AND, AND HOW IS THAT PRESENTED TO THE TOWNSHIP TO KIND OF SAY, HEY, MAYBE THERE IS A CONSERVATIVE SHORT TERM PLAY HERE BECAUSE I MEAN, WE'RE WAITING PROBABLY TOMORROW, WEDNESDAY INTEREST RATES ARE GOING UP, YOU'RE UP JUST DECLARED THEMSELVES IN A RECESSION.

I DON'T KNOW WHERE THE US IS GOING.

I'M NOT AN ECONOMIST, BUT I DO WATCH IT EVERY DAY.

AND IT'S A BIT SCARY RIGHT NOW.

SO I, I AM IN HOUSING AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT HOUSING IS NOT LOOKING AS STRONG NEXT YEAR, WHICH DRIVES A BIG PIECE OF OUR ECONOMY.

UM, JUST, JUST WONDERING IF THERE'S OPTIONS THAT ARE EVER PRESENTED, OR IS IT JUST A REQUEST TO OLD PAR THE STOCK MARKET'S GONNA COME BACK? UM, WELL, I'M GONNA ANSWER THAT TWO WAYS.

ONE, UM, WE'RE VERY STRATEGIC.

OUR INVESTMENT COMMITTEE IS ONE OF THE, THE LARGEST IN, IN THE COUNTRY.

IN FACT, WE, WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, INSTITUTIONS LIKE, LIKE VANGUARD COME OUT AND TREAT US AS ONE OF THEIR LARGEST CLIENTS WHEN WE'RE LOOKING AT CAPITAL MARKET ASSUMPTIONS.

SO WE SEE EXACTLY WHAT YOU SAW, WHAT WE'LL DO IS WE'LL, WE'LL TAKE ADVANTAGE OF WHAT, WHAT WE CALL STRATEGIC DYNAMIC ALLOCATION, UH, CHANGES.

[01:20:01]

IN THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR, WE WENT WAY SHORT, SHORT TERM ON, UH, SHORT TERM TREASURY, INFL INFLATION, PROTECTED TREASURIES TO DO EXACTLY THAT, TO TAKE ADVANTAGE OF INTEREST RATES GOING UP.

UM, SO, SO WE, WE, WE, WE DID THAT.

WE ALSO MOVED SLIGHTLY MORE TO, UM, OUT OF YOUR, YOUR INTERMEDIATE CORPORATE BONDS INTO, INTO SAFER, SHORTER TERM BONDS.

SO WE DID THAT STRATEGICALLY.

IS THAT, WHAT IS THAT, WHAT HAPPENED IN THE MARKET OVERALL, CUZ IT'S REALLY THE SECOND QUARTER THAT HIT THE HARDEST YEAR.

WELL, WELL, WHAT, WHAT REALLY HAPPENED? UM, IT, THERE WERE A FEW THINGS THAT HAPPENED.

YOU HAD FIRST, YOU HAD ENERGY COSTS CAUSING HIGH, LARGE INFLATION.

UM, YOU HAD, UH, THE, THE RUSSIAN INVASION IN, IN UKRAINE.

UM, YOU HAD US HAVING THE, THE PAYBACK, ALL THE STIMULUS THAT, THAT WENT IN.

UM, SO YOU'RE, YOU'RE ALSO SEEING, UH, FOR THE FIRST TIME WE HAVE STRONG, UM, STRONG JOB JOB GROWTH.

UM, BUT WHAT, WHAT THAT IS DOING IS, IS THE PROBLEM IS WAGES, RIGHT? SO IF WAGES ESCALATE THE WAY THEY, THEY HAVE BEEN AND CONTINUE, THAT'S ALMOST A TAX ON CORPORATE GROWTH AS WELL.

YOU MENTIONED HOUSING, UM, YOU KNOW, HOUSING NUMBERS ARE, ARE DROPPING SIGNIFICANTLY BASED ON INTEREST RATES GOING UP.

UM, WE, WE EXPECT, UH, GIVEN, YOU KNOW, THE FED GOING 75 BASIS POINTS TO, TO 1%, YOU KNOW, ON WEDNESDAY.

UM, WE, WE THINK THAT'S GONNA CON CONTINUE TO, TO GO UP.

SO HOUSING'S GONNA GET, GET WORSE.

WE DON'T BELIEVE IN, UM, IF YOU LOOK HISTORICALLY AND GOING FORWARD, IT'S KIND OF A FIB OUT THERE THAT THERE ARE ALTERNATIVES AND YOU'RE HEARING A LOT NOW THAT FINALLY, THIS IS THE YEAR THAT ACTIVE MANAGEMENT ALTERNATIVES HEDGE IS, UM, AND OPTIONS TRADING IS GONNA BE THE WAY TO GO.

THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED IN, IN HISTORY AGAIN, AS THE STATE OF PENNSYLVANIA ASK ALL YOUR MORE ACTIVELY MANAGED BY YEAH.

THAT'S ALL I WAS GETTING AT.

IS THERE, IS THERE A POTENTIAL TO SIT, LAY DOWN OPTIONS FOR YEAH.

PRESIDENT EXPERT RICH TO LOOK AT AND HELP ADVICE? YEAH.

THERE, THERE IS NO MAGIC BOY, RIGHT? NO, I GET, I GET THAT, BUT I JUST SEE THE LAST QUARTER SCARY.

I DON'T SEE THINGS IMPROVING.

I, I WAS JUST CURIOUS AND I GET EVERYTHING YOU'RE SAYING.

UM, BUT I, I WAS JUST CURIOUS IF THERE'S OPTIONS EVER PRESENTED TO SAY, HEY, LOOK, YOU COULD DO THIS OPTION A LITTLE LESS RISKY, BUT OVER A LONG TERM, YOU MAY NOT MAKE AS MUCH, BUT YOU WON'T LOSE AS MUCH OR THERE'S THIS OPTION THAT YOU CAN LOSE MORE, BUT IN THE LONG TERM, YOU'LL LIKELY GET IT BACK.

I JUST, JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THERE'S OPTIONS LAID OUT.

WE DON'T HAVE TO GET INTO THE DETAILS THAT ON OTHERS WE DO.

AND AGAIN, I, I I'M BIASED HERE, BUT I THINK WE'RE ONE OF THE BEST IN THE COUNTRY.

WHEN I SAID WE PEGGED THAT 10, 10 YEAR NUMBER 20 YEAR NUMBER.

BECOME YOUR FOLKS ON THIS COMMITTEE ANNUALLY AND SAY, THIS IS WHAT WE, WE EXPECT TO GET, UM, GIVEN THE ASSET CLASSES, BUT IN, IN OUR WORLD, IN OUR PROCESS, IT'S MUCH MORE PROBABLE AND DEFENDABLE AND OUR EXPECTATIONS ARE GONNA BE MORE RIGHT.

UM, AND, AND 90% OF THE TIME WE'RE GONNA, WELL REALLY IF 80% OF THE TIME WE'RE GONNA GET BETTER PERFORMANCE IN USING THE PROCESS THAT WE'RE USING.

UM, WE DID DO, BUT WE ALSO HAVE DISCRETION.

SO WE DON'T, WE DON'T CALL TIM AND, AND RICH AND YOUR INVESTMENT KID COMMITTEE AND, AND, AND THE CHIEF AND SAY, HEY, UH, WE THINK YOU SHOULD DO THIS.

WE, WE, WE HAVE DISCRETION AS YOUR FIDUCIARY MANAGER.

YOU PUNTED THAT RESPONSIBILITY TO ME.

I, I WILL TELL YOU, I DON'T KNOW, A MORE EFFICIENT, MORE DEFENDABLE WAY TO DO IT IF I'M SITTING IN YOUR SEAT.

AND I DO, I SIT ON MANY, MANY BOARDS, UM, WHERE YOU, YOU HAVE DELEGATED THAT FI FIDUCIARY RESPONSIBILITY I CAN GO HOME AT AT NIGHT, KNOWING THAT THERE'S NOT SOMETHING THAT WE DID.

THAT'S GOING TO PUT YOU AT AT RISK MORE THAN THE PRUDENT MAN LAW.

I DON'T KNOW ANY MORE EFFICIENT WAY TO DO IT THAN THE WAY WE'RE DOING IT NOW.

SO HANG IN THERE.

WE DO NOT THINK THINGS ARE GONNA GET BETTER OVERNIGHT.

UM, WE DO THINK YOU'RE GONNA BENEFIT FROM, UH, EVENTUALLY FROM THE, FROM THE LONGER TERM STAY OF THE COURSE.

NOT, NOT THINK I KNOW.

I JUST CAN'T TELL YOU WHEN ANY OTHER QUESTIONS.

I, I KNOW LAST TIME YOU WERE HERE WAS HAPPY DAYS WERE HERE AGAIN.

AND, AND MR. TEPERMAN LIKES TO BRING YOU OUT AND, AND TORTURE YOU WHEN THE MARKET DOWN.

SO I, I COME EITHER WAY, BILL.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR WORK.

THANK YOU, SIR.

THANK

[01:25:01]

YOU FOR THE OPPORTUNITY.

NEXT ON OUR AGENDA IS, UH, RESOLUTION 2022 DASH 33.

UH, I'LL REQUEST A GRANT FINAL LAND DEVELOPMENT APPROVAL FOR DIVINITY EQUITIES.

AND HOPEFULLY THIS WILL BE SHORTER AND EASIER THAN THE LAST ONE.

ACTUALLY, THIS IS WE'RE HERE TODAY FOR FINAL PLAN APPROVAL.

YOUR CONSULTANTS, WE HAVE A GILMORE LETTER THAT SAYS THE FINAL PLANS ARE ACCEPTABLE.

MCMAN LETTER SAYS THIS PLANS ARE SATISFACTORY FOR APPROVAL.

UM, JOE HAS GIVEN ME THE PROPOSED RESOLUTION AND WE HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO PROBLEMS WITH IT.

UM, WE HAVE OUR ENGINEERS HERE.

WE ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MIGHT HAVE, IF YOU RECALL, THIS IS THE LEARNING EXPERIENCE IN THE BIG BUILDING AND A DENTIST'S OFFICE.

THE BUILDING TO THE LEFT, THE TAN BUILDING IS THE EXISTING REMAX OFFICE.

AND YOU'VE SEEN IT MANY TIMES BEFORE, UH, TRAFFIC ENGINEERS.

WE SATISFIED WITH, UH, IMPROVEMENTS THERE.

YES, NO, NO FURTHER ISSUES ON OUR, ON OUR END.

GREAT.

I, I JUST HAVE ONE QUESTION FOR YOU, ED.

UM, ARE YOU GUYS CONTRIBUTING ANYTHING TOWARDS COLLEGEVILLE ROAD THERE TOWARDS COLLEGEVILLE ROAD? YEAH.

THAT'S ISN'T IT? AREN'T YOU OFF OF COLLEGEVILLE? YEAH.

29.

WE'VE DONE IMPROVEMENTS ON IT.

PART OF THE PLAN.

PARDON ME? WE WE'RE APPROVING THE ROAD.

THAT'S THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING YOU.

I MEAN, YOU KNOW, YES, YES, YES, YES, YES.

YOU ARE.

YOU ARE MAKING IMPROVEMENTS THERE.

ABSOLUTELY.

AS, AS REQUIRED AND BY YOUR TRAFFIC.

YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.

THAT'S THE ONLY QUESTION I HAVE.

YEP.

IF THERE'S NO MORE QUESTIONS, UH, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.

I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO ADOPT RESOLUTION 2023 DASH 33 GRANTING FINAL LAND DEVELOPMENT FOR DAVIN EQUITIES.

I'LL SECOND ADD.

I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO ADOPT RESOLUTION 2022 DASH 33.

GRANTING FINAL LAND DEVELOPMENT APPROVAL FOR DMMI EQUITIES.

ANY OPPOSED? THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

AND ITEM NUMBER SEVEN.

CONSIDER AUTHORIZING THE EXECUTION OF THE 2020 FLOOD MITIGATION ASSISTANCE GRANT AGREEMENT PERTAINING TO 2 0 1 CANAL STREET.

THIS IS IN ADDITION TO OUR PROGRAM.

BRIAN, YOU WANNA GO AHEAD? YEAH.

JUST AS YOU INDICATED, UM, THIS IS THIS, UH, FLOOD MITIGATION ASSISTANCE GRANT ORIGINATED PRIOR TO IDA SOMETIME AGO.

UH, IN 2020, WE SUBMITTED AN APPLICATION TO FEMA AND PMA TO ACQUIRED 2 0 1 AND 2 0 5 CANAL STREET.

UM, THE VALUES, UH, THAT WERE UTILIZED IN THE APPLICATION WERE BASED ON APPRAISALS THAT WERE DONE IN 2019.

UM, BOTH PROPERTIES WERE SUBSEQUENTLY AFFECTED BY IDA AND INCLUDED AGAIN IN THE HAZARD MITIGATION, THE LARGER, UH, GRANT, THE BIO GRANT APPLICATION, UM, AND THE APPRAISALS THAT WERE DONE IN 2021 FOR THE HAZARD MITIGATION GRANT CAME IN SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER.

UM, FEMA WILL ALLOW US TO DROP ONE OF THE PROPERTIES EITHER 2 0 1 OR 2 0 5, BUT THEY WILL NOT INCREASE THE AMOUNT THAT THEY AWARDED ORIGINALLY.

SO WHAT WE'D LIKE TO DO, UM, WHAT SUSAN IS RECOMMENDING AND THE MANNER IN WHICH THE STATE HAS PREPARED, THE GRANT AGREEMENT THAT WE'RE ASKING YOU TO AUTHORIZE EXECUTION OF IS THAT WE WOULD DROP 2 0 5 CANAL STREET FROM THE PROGRAM AND PROCEED WITH OH ONE CANAL STREET BASED ON THE HIGHER APPRAISED VALUE OF $350,000.

UM, SUSAN AND I HAVE BEEN IN COMMUNICATION WITH BOTH PROPERTY OWNERS.

UH, THEY'RE ALL IN AGREEMENT.

I DON'T WANT TO GET INTO THE DETAILS OF THEIR FINANCES OR WHO'S BETTER OFF, BETTER ABLE TO, UH, UM, MAINTAIN THE STATUS QUO.

UM, BUT OUR RECOMMENDATION IS THAT THE BOARD AUTHORIZED EXECUTION OF THE GRANT AGREEMENT THAT YOU HAVE BEFORE YOU.

THERE'S NO TOWNSHIP CONTRIBUTION, CORRECT.

AND FEMA, FEMA, OKAY.

WITH THIS, THEY ARE, IT WAS PREPARED BY THEM.

AND THE, UH, I FORGOT TO MENTION THE MONEY.

UH, IT'S 100% FEDERALLY FUNDED.

2 0 5, NOT IN ANY KIND OF PROGRAM.

2 0 5 IS IN THE HAZARD MITIGATION PROGRAM AND IS A MEASURE OF, UH, BELT AND SUSPENDER.

SO TO SPEAK.

SUSAN ALSO PUT THEM IN THE SWIFT WATER IN A SWIFT WATER APPLICATION.

SO THEY ACTUALLY HAVE TWO PENDING APPLICATIONS ON THAT PROPERTY.

SO THEY HAVE TO WAIT TO SEE.

[01:30:01]

SO BRIAN, THIS SAYS ALL EXPENDITURES OR OBLIGATION OF FUNDS MUST BE USED FOR PURPOSES SET FORTH AN ATTACHMENT B.

SO DO WE HAVE, DO WE HAVE LEEWAY? I MEAN, ATTACHMENT B IS PRETTY SPECIFIC HOW YOU CAN UTILIZE THIS MONEY.

UM, AGAIN, THAT I THINK THAT TABLE AND ATTACHMENT B WAS CREATED FOUR IDA, AND IT WAS SO I'M JUST WONDERING IT'S THE LANGUAGE IS PRETTY EXPLICIT THAT WE HAVE TO USE IT EXACTLY THE WAY THAT TABLE'S CREATED.

DO WE HAVE FLEXIBILITY OR DO WE NEED TO AMEND IT TO SAY, ALL RIGHT, WELL, THINGS HAVE CHANGED SINCE WE APPLIED FOR DUE TO AA SITUATION.

I DON'T HAVE THAT EXHIBIT IN FRONT OF ME.

I THINK IT REFERS TO, UM, UM, PARTICULAR LINE ITEMS AND AMOUNTS WERE INCLUDED IN THOSE LINE ITEMS FROM BOTH PROPERTIES.

SO THERE WOULD BE A DEMOLITION THAT A DEMOLITION LINE ITEM THAT SUMS TO A PARTICULAR AMOUNT THAT WAS FOR BOTH PROPERTIES, HOWEVER, WILL JUST APPLY IT TO ONE PROPERTY.

RIGHT? YEAH.

THAT WAS MY QUESTION THOUGH.

IT'S 550, $3,000 FEELS LIKE WE MAY NOT NEED THAT MUCH.

WE WOULDN'T IN FACT FLEXIBILITY TO USE THAT MONEY FOR OTHER SOMEONE GO BACK.

WHAT WE CAN'T DO IS TAKE IT AND TRANSFER IT TO A LESSER, UH, SAY, SAY, WHEN IT'S ALL SAID AND DONE, WE HAD $180,000 LEFT.

WE CAN'T PLUCK SOMEBODY OUT OF THE HAZARD MITIGATION GRANT PROGRAM WHOSE HOME WAS VALUED AT 180,000 AND INITIATE THAT TRANSACTION.

UM, AND I, I PROBABLY SPEAK FOR THE HOMEOWNERS IN THE HAZARD MITIGATION GRANT APPLICATION.

AND FOR THESE TWO PARTICULAR HOMEOWNERS, THIS APPLICATION WAS SUBMITTED IN DECEMBER OF 2020, AND WE RECEIVED THE GRANT APPLICATION PAPERWORK LAST WEEK.

SO IT JUST, IT INCREDIBLY LABORIOUS, UH, AND LENGTHY PROCESS.

I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE DOESN'T NEED TO BE ANY AMENDED LANGUAGE SO WE CAN, IT FEELS LIKE THERE'LL PROBABLY BE LEFTOVER MONEY.

AND I DUNNO WHAT HAPPENS BECAUSE IT SAYS EXPLICITLY FOR THIS USE, WHATEVER ISN'T SO MUCH HAS CHANGED.

I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE WEREN'T LOCKED IN WHATEVER HASN'T BEEN USED FOR 2 0 1 WILL GO BACK TO THE STATE.

WE CAN'T GET OUTTA THIS ONE APPLY ELSEWHERE ALL.

YEAH, IT WOULD BE NICE TO USE IT SOMEWHERE ELSE.

IT'S LIKE, WHERE'S THAT 180 GOING, BUT I GUESS, YEAH, NO, THEY WEREN'T LET US DO THAT.

WE'LL GET IT BACK.

UH, SO I NEED, LET'S SEE, I NEED A, I NEED A MOTION TO, TO AUTHORIZE THE EXECUTION.

I'LL ENTERTAIN THAT MOTION.

I'LL MAKE THE MOTION TO AUTHORIZE THE EX EXECUTION OF THE 2020 FLOOD MITIGATION ASSISTANCE GRANT AGREEMENT, PRETENDING TO 2 0 1 CANAL STREET.

I'LL SECOND THE MOTION.

I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO AUTHORIZE THE EXECUTION OF THE 2020 FLOOD MITIGATION ASSISTANCE GRANT AGREEMENT PERTAINING TO 2 0 1 CANAL STREET.

CONSIDER AUTHORIZING THE ADVERTISEMENT FOR BIDS FOR THE GUMBY ROAD CALVERT PROJECT CALL, EXCUSE ME, CULVERT PROJECT.

CAN YOU WANNA TALK ABOUT IT A LITTLE BIT AS SURE THIS IS A CULVERT REPLACEMENT PROJECT? UM, AS FAR AS TIMELINE GOES, WE WOULD ANTICIPATE AWARD LATER THIS YEAR AND, UM, A SPRING PROJECT.

HOWEVER, WE ALL KNOW THE SUPPLY CHAIN ISSUES.

THERE'S CURRENTLY A LONG LEAD TIME ON CONCRETE PIPE.

UM, BUT WE'RE STILL, WE'RE STILL HOPEFUL FOR A SPRING PROJECT FOR THAT.

AND THE BUDGET IS APPROXIMATELY $120,000, INCLUDING THE CULVERT SURROUNDING IMPROVEMENTS AND GUIDE RAIL.

SO THIS IS ALL ENGINEERED AND DESIGNED.

WE'RE JUST PUTTING OUT BIDS FOR CONSTRUCTION.

AT THIS POINT.

IT IS, UH, WE PREPARED, UM, EASEMENTS THAT WERE, UM, REQUIRED TO DO THE WORK TEMPORARY CONSTRUCTION EASEMENTS.

UM, JOE'S BEEN WORKING ON THOSE.

I THINK THERE'S ONE OUTSTANDING, BUT THAT'S ALMOST DONE.

AND I JUST GOT THAT ONE.

I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.

FIND MY PLACE.

NUMBER EIGHT.

UH, MOTION TO, UM, I MOVE TO AUTHORIZE THE ADVERTISEMENT FOR BIDS FOR THE GUMS ROAD CULVERT PROJECT.

SECOND THAT ALL RIGHT.

I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO AUTHORIZE THE ADVERTISEMENT FOR BIDS FOR THE GUM'S ROAD CULVERT PROJECT.

ALL IN FAVOR, SAY AYE.

NUMBER NINE.

CONSIDER AUTHORIZING THE ADVERTISEMENT FOR BIDS FOR THE GREENWOOD AVENUE SEWER PROJECT.

WE NEED ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT.

NO, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.

THE ONLY, THE ONLY THING I JUMP IN IS TIM.

I DON'T KNOW HOW WE, I MEAN, WE'RE, WE'RE AUTHORIZING BIDS FOR NEXT YEAR EXPENDITURES YET.

WE HAVEN'T COMPLETED THE BUDGET YET.

SO HOW DO WE JUST, JUST MAKING SURE WE TIE THAT UP IN THE BUDGET PROCESS.

THAT'S ALL THIS PROJECT WAS BUDGETED FOR THIS YEAR.

I DON'T KNOW THAT IT'LL BE COMPLETED THIS YEAR, BUT WE'LL HAVE TO CARRY SOME CAPITAL MONEY OVER FOR

[01:35:01]

NEXT YEAR.

I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE WE DO THAT.

I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO A ADVERTISE THE, A, UM, ADVERTISEMENT FOR BIDS FOR THE GREENWOOD AVENUE SEWER PROJECT.

I'LL SECOND.

I HAVE A MOTION IN A SECOND TO AUTHORIZE THE ADVERTISEMENT FOR THE, FOR BIDS FOR THE GREENWOOD AVENUE SEWER PROJECT.

AYE, AYE.

AND HE OPPOSED.

[NEW BUSINESS (ACTION/DISCUSSION ITEMS)]

UH, THE NEXT ONE HAS TO DO WITH FIXING THAT ONE LANE BRIDGE DOWN THERE BY OAKS ELEMENTARY ON BLACK ROCK ROAD.

YAY.

UM, AND WE NEED TO GIVE PEN DOT, UH, SOME RIGHT OF WAY TO GET THAT DONE.

MM-HMM AND THEY'RE PAYING FOR IT SO THEY CAN HAVE THAT RIGHT OF WAY.

I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.

I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO AUTHORIZE THE TRANSFER OF RIGHT AWAY TO PENDOT FOR THE CULVERT WIDENING PROJECT ON BLACKROCK ROAD AT THE BRIDGE OVER CROSSMAN'S RUN NEAR OAKS ELEMENTARY.

I'LL SECOND THE MOTION.

UH, WE STARTED TALKING ABOUT THIS ALREADY.

I HAVE A MOTION AND A SECOND TO AUTHORIZE THE TRANSFER OF RIGHT AWAY TO PENDOT FOR THE CULVER WIDENING PROJECT ON BLACKROCK ROAD AT THE BRIDGE OVER CROSSMAN'S RUN NEAR OAKS ELEMENTARY, ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, SAY AYE, ANY OPPOSED? THANK YOU.

YOU KNOW HOW THAT IS? MY, MY, MY QUESTION WAS GONNA BE MORE AROUND, DO WE, DO WE HAVE ANY NEGOTIATING ROOM FOR WHEN, BECAUSE, UM, I WE'LL DEAL WITH THAT WHEN THE PROJECT COMES UP.

I IT'S, IT , BUT IT WILL, IT MAY DISRUPT.

I DON'T KNOW IF THEY GOTTA SHUT IT DOWN OR WHAT, BUT DEFINITELY NEEDS IMPROVED.

SO IT'LL BE A NICE, YEAH.

PUT THAT ON OUR, UH, ON OUR, UH, TRACKER TRACKER.

AND WE'LL GET AN, WE'LL GET YOU AN ANSWER IN THE NEXT COUPLE MEETINGS.

I, I HEAR YOU.

[MANAGER AND DEPARTMENT HEAD REPORTS]

BRIAN, YOU WANNA GIVE US SOME UPDATES ON, UH, THE FEMA BUYOUTS? YEAH, VERY, VERY BRIEFLY ON THE 44 PROPERTIES THAT ARE IN THE HAZARD MITIGATION GRANT BUYOUT PROGRAM.

UM, WE HADN'T HAVE NOT HEARD ANYTHING FORMALLY YET.

UM, I KNOW SUPERVISOR STARLING WAS IN TOUCH WITH MADELINE DEAN'S OFFICE AND MAY HAVE RATTLED A CAGE THERE.

UM, SOME FOLKS FROM FEMA WERE OUT LAST WEDNESDAY TAKING SOME PHOTOGRAPHS AND SUSAN ELLI HAS BEEN TOLD THAT THOSE PHOTOGRAPHS FOR THE LAST DOCUMENTATION THAT WAS REQUIRED BEFORE THE GRANT APPLICATIONS WOULD BE APPROVED.

SO HOPEFULLY GOOD NEWS IS TO FOLLOW.

UM, AND I JUST WANTED LET THE BOARD KNOW THAT THAT TOTAL APPLICATION, UM, THE TOTAL GRANT REQUEST, UM, COMES TO 18.9 MILLION, UM, 15 MILLION OF WHICH IS, UM, MONEY THAT'S EARMARKED FOR ACQUIRING PROPERTY.

UM, AND AS WE TAKE BITES AT THIS APPLICATION, THERE'S MANY PEOPLE THAT ARE GONNA WANT TO GO FIRST.

UM, I'VE BEEN WORKING WITH MR. LIVER, GOOD IN THE FINANCE DEPARTMENT TO, UH, SEE JUST HOW MUCH, HOW MANY, UM, PROPERTY TRANSACTIONS WE COULD FLOAT UNTIL WE GET REIMBURSED BY FEMA.

UM, IT'S GENERALLY FOUR TO SIX WEEKS FROM THE TIME YOU REQUEST THEM TO FORWARD MONEY, TO ADVANCE MONEY TO THE TOWNSHIP TILL WE RECEIVE IT.

SO WE'LL BE WORKING CLOSELY WITH FINANCE, MAKE SURE WE CAN FLOAT THAT PERIOD OF TIME, GET AS MANY PEOPLE TO SETTLEMENT AS QUICKLY AS WE CAN.

UM, WE'RE VERY MUCH AWARE THAT EVERY FIRST OF THE MONTH THAT TICKS PASSED, MOST OF THE MER CONTINUE TO MAKE A MORTGAGE PAYMENT.

SO YEAH, SO YOU'LL HAVE OUT SIX WEEKS WHEN WE'RE GONNA GET PAID WE'LL FRONT THAT MONEY AND THEN GET REIMBURSED.

TRIVIA QUESTION, THE PACKET FOR THE APPLICATION.

HOW MANY PAGES DID IT RUN? MAYBE SIX PAGES IN TOTAL.

OH, I'M SORRY.

NO.

EACH HOMEOWNER HAD TO SUBMIT EACH HOMEOWNER THAT WANTED TO PARTICIPATE IN THE PROGRAM.

UH, THE AGREEMENTS OF THE, UH, APPLICATIONS THEMSELVES.

I WOULD HAVE TO LOOK THAT'S OKAY.

I JUST WONDERED HOW THICK THE PILE WAS.

IT WAS A LOT OF PAPER .

SO WHEN THEY, WHEN THEY, WHEN THIS ALL HAPPENS AND EVERYBODY GETS THEIR MONEY DOWN THERE, DO, HOW ARE THEY, ARE THEY GONNA DEMOLITION ALL OF THOSE HOUSES? THEY'RE GONNA DO THIS ALL AT ONE TIME OR, UH, YOU KNOW, ARE THEY GONNA PAY EVERYBODY? AND THEN ALL OF SUDDEN, ONE DAY THEY'RE GONNA START DARING HOUSES DOWN.

I, I THINK FOR SEVERAL REASONS FIRST AND FOREMOST, SO THAT THE TOWNSHIP CAN FLOAT THE MONEY UNTIL WE GET MONEY BACK FROM FEMA, WE'LL TRY TO DO 10 OR SO AT A TIME.

IT MAKES IT MANAGEABLE FROM A FINANCIAL PERSPECTIVE AND IT MAKES IT MANAGEABLE FROM A DEMOLITION PERSPECTIVE AS WELL.

WELL, WE'RE GONNA TRY TO GROUP THEM TOGETHER TO REDUCE THE, UH, AMOUNT OF DISTURBANCE IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.

I CAN'T PROMISE THAT WILL ALWAYS HAPPEN.

UM, BUT AS SOON AS THE GRANT, AS SOON AS WE GET WORD THAT IT'S GONNA BE APPROVED, UH, SUSAN WILL REACH OUT TO FOLKS AND, UM, DEVELOP A, A LIST OF FOLKS THAT WANT TO GO FIRST AND PEOPLE THAT WANNA WAIT A LITTLE BIT, A LITTLE BIT OF TIME, BUT YOU'RE GONNA GROUP THEM GEOGRAPHICALLY.

SO TEND GET THE, THAT WOULD BE MY PREFERENCE, RIGHT?

[01:40:01]

CAUSE THAT WOULD MAKE SENSE TO, I THINK WE GET CHEAPER DEMOLITION PRICES.

AND IT'D BE LESS DISRUPTIVE FOR THE NEIGHBORHOOD IN GENERAL.

IF, IF THEY DID, IF THEY DID THAT ALL AT ONE TIME, IT'LL LOOK LIKE, UH, WHAT'S THE WAR ZONE.

LOOK AT WAR ZONE DOWN THERE.

HOW DO WE MANAGE? YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO SHUT.

I DON'T KNOW IF THE ELECTRICITY'S OFF IN ALL THESE PLACES, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO CUT THE SEWER OFF.

YOU'RE GONNA LIKE, HOW, HOW DO WE MAKE SURE RESIDENTS AREN'T AFFECTED IN THE AREA AS THAT'S, TO ME THAT SOUNDS LIKE MOST GYMNASTICS, MOST, MOST, IF NOT ALL THE ELECTRICAL SERVICES ARE OVERHEAD.

SO IT'LL BE EASY TO HAVE PICO CUT ONE AT A TIME AND WON'T AFFECT ANYBODY ELSE.

I ASSUME FEMA KNOWS HOW TO DO THIS.

I'M JUST MAKING SURE NOBODY ELSE GIVES THE MONEY TO THE TOWNSHIP, BUT IT'S OUR RESPONSIBILITY TO ARRANGE FOR THE DEMOLITION AND ALL THE, UH, INTRICACIES.

UM, I HAVE TAUGHT MANY OF THE HOMES TIE INTO A LARGE SANITARY SEWER INTERCEPTOR, UH, A LARGE MAINE THAT CONVEYS ABOUT 80% OF THE TOWNSHIP TO THE, UH, TREATMENT PLANT.

UM, SO WE'RE CURRENTLY EXPLORING DIFFERENT WAYS TO CAP THOSE LATERALS, TO ELIMINATE THE SEWER SERVICES AND POTENTIAL INFLOW AND INFILTRATION WITHOUT DISRUPTING SERVICE.

UM, OBVIOUSLY WE CAN'T PLUG THAT LINE FOR ANY PERIOD OF TIME.

UM, AND THEN OTHER UTILITIES LIKE COMCAST OR, YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S STILL OVERHEAD VERIZON LINES THAT BE DONE ONE AT A TIME AND TRAFFIC FLOW IS THERE, I GUESS, I ASSUME WE'LL COMMUNICATE TO EVERYBODY BEFORE THE YEAH.

AND TERMS OF THERE AND START TEARING EVERYTHING DOWN TRAFFIC.

WHEN THE CONTRACTOR MOBILIZES, THEY'LL PULL UP WITH A FLATBED, DROP OFF A TRACK HOE AND, AND PULL IT ONTO THE PROPERTY.

SO THEY'RE NOT ON THE ROAD FOR LONG.

SAME WITH DUMPSTERS WILL REQUIRE THAT WHENEVER POSSIBLE.

THEY'RE NOT ON THE ROADWAY THAT THEY'RE PLACED ON THE PROPERTY ITSELF.

I'M GONNA PUT ON MY SEWER AUTHORITY HAT RIGHT NOW.

AND, UM, WE'RE GONNA END UP WITH 40 EDUS HERE IN A TOWNSHIP, HOWEVER MANY PROPERTIES YOU'RE GONNA DO HAVE, HAVE YOU CONTACTED ANYBODY THERE TO BUY THEM BACK OR WHATEVER I'VE SPOKEN WITH MIKE MCGANN? THE ONLY OPTION AVAILABLE TO US IS TO EITHER HOLD ONTO THEM OR A FEW OF THEM IN CASE WE WANNA PUT A PARK OR A PAVILION OR A RESTAURANT DOWN THERE, UM, OR TO TURN THEM BACK OVER TO THE SORE AUTHORITY, WHICH CASE WE GET $0 BACK FOR THEM.

SORRY ABOUT THAT GUYS.

UM, I THINK THAT'S IT ON THE FEMA DISCUSSION.

THE NEXT ITEM ON OUR AGENDA IS AN ITEM THAT WE WERE BRIEFED ON BY, UH, POLICE CHIEF FREEMAN IN OUR FRIDAY EXECUTIVE SESSION.

SO I WAS JUST GIVEN THE LANGUAGE FOR THIS BY JOE.

SO I'M GONNA MAKE A STATEMENT AND I NEED ONE OF YOUR SUPERVISORS TO SAY SO MOVED AND SOMEBODY ELSE TO SAY SECOND, AND THEN YOU WON'T HAVE TO REPEAT WHAT I'M GOING TO SAY.

I'LL ENTERTAIN A MESH, A MOTION TO IMPOSE A DISCIPLINARY SUSPENSION UPON A TOWN, A UPON TOWNSHIP POLICE OFFICER BADGE NUMBER 27 AS DISCUSSED IN THE EXECUTIVE SESSION THAT PROCEEDED TONIGHT'S MEETING.

SO MOVED SECOND ONE SECOND TIME.

I HAVE A MOTION TO IMPOSE A DISCIPLINARY SUSPENSION UPON TOWNSHIP POLICE OFFICER BADGE NUMBER 27 HAS DISCUSSED IN THE EXECUTIVE SESSION THAT PROCEEDED.

TONIGHT'S MEETING ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, SAY AYE.

[CONSULTANT REPORTS]

AND, UH, CONSULTING REPORTS, JAMES.

YEP.

UH, WE BRIEFLY TOUCHED ON GREENWOOD AVENUE, UM, FOLLOWING UP ON THE TOWNSHIP LINE ROAD SEWER, UM, THERE'S A TEMPORARY CONSTRUCTION ACCESS.

THAT'S GONNA BE REQUIRED OFF OF TOWNSHIP LINE ROAD, EVEN THOUGH THAT'S NOT WHERE THE SEWER EXTENSION'S HAPPENING.

UM, WE'RE HOLDING ON THOSE EASEMENT.

UM, GETTING THOSE WORKED OUT, THEN WE'LL GET A PENDOT PERMIT.

SO ANTICIPATED CONSTRUCTION FOR THAT WOULD BE POTENTIALLY SUMMER OF 2023.

UM, THAT RESIDENTS WOULD BE ABLE TO CONNECT OUT THERE FOR TOWNSHIP LINE ROAD.

UM, THE INTERCEPTOR, WHICH I KNOW YOU GUYS ASK ABOUT, UM, WAS COMPLETED AND PUT INTO SERVICE ON AUGUST 12TH AND THEN THE TINDI RUN.

CONSTRUCTION'S ONGOING.

UM, BUT GOOD NEWS.

THEY'RE DOING FINAL TRENCH RESTORATION.

THE LATERALS AND PIPE WORKS ALL DONE.

UH, SECOND WEEK OF OCTOBER, THEY'RE ANTICIPATING PAVING GOING ON OUT THERE.

UM, TENDY RUN PUMP STATION ITSELF WILL BE AFFECTED BY THE SUPPLY CHAIN.

UM, HOPING TO GET ELECTRICAL COMPONENTS, UH, POSSIBLY LATE OCTOBER EARLY NOVEMBER.

EXCUSE ME.

THANK YOU, JEN.

$196,418 AND 65 CENTS RIDGEWOOD PHASE TWO, A RELEASE NUMBER 16 IN THE AMOUNT OF 30,000 DO $30,705 AND 91 CENTS.

NEXT, WE HAVE, UH, SOME ESCROW RELEASES THAT WE NEED TO APPROVE FOR THIS MONTH.

UM, NOTHING, UH, NO NEWS HERE, RIGHT? NO, NOTHING OUTTA THE ORDINARY.

I'LL GO AHEAD AND MAKE THE MOTION OF SOMEBODY WILL GIMME A SECOND.

I APPRECIATE IT.

I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE FOLLOWING ES ESCROW RELEASES, OXFORD LEE RELEASE NUMBER FIVE IN THE AMOUNT OF

[01:45:01]

RIDGEWOOD PHASE TWO B RELEASE NUMBER EIGHT IN THE AMOUNT OF $113,967 AND 25 CENTS.

AND RIDGEWOOD PHASE TWO C RELEASE NUMBER SIX IN THE AMOUNT OF $35,393 AND 41 CENTS.

OH SECOND.

I HAVE A MOTION IN A SECOND TO DO ESCROW RELEASES FOR THIS MONTH.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? SAY AYE.

ANY OPPOSED? ALL RIGHT.

UM, STATUS UPDATE, UH, ON, ON PENDING GRANT APPLICATION FOR ROUTE ONE 13 SECOND AVENUE, DRY, THANK YOU.

ROAD ROUNDABOUT PROJECT.

WE'RE GOING THROUGH THE PRONUNCIATION, DRY DRY BASE.

UH SO WE'RE UM, SO, UH, THE STATUS AS FAR SO WE'VE COMPLETED THE SURVEY FOR THE PROJECT.

SO WE WERE SLIGHTLY DELAYED AS PENDO WAS GOING THROUGH THE AREA DOING THEIR, UM, IT WAS THE, THE MELAN OVERLAY OPERATIONS.

SO WE HAD TO KIND OF WAIT, UH, FOR A FEW WEEKS, I GUESS, TO GET THAT GOING, BUT THAT SINCE THAT'S BEEN COMPLETED, THE SURVEY'S BEEN DONE, WE DID WETLANDS DELINEATION.

SO WE'VE MOVED ON, UH, TO OUR, UM, PRELIMINARY ENGINEERING OR AT LEAST LAYOUTS INITIAL LAYOUTS OF THE ROUNDABOUTS.

UM, WE'VE COMPLETED A, MOSTLY COMPLETED OUR TRAFFIC ANALYSIS.

UH, SO IT AS PART OF THE, THE PROCESS AS PART OF THE GRAND AWARD, UM, YOU WE'RE, IT'S A PRELIMINARY ENGINEERING SUBMISSION TO PENDOT.

SO WE'RE PREPARING A FULL PENDOT PACKAGE.

SO PART OF THAT PACKAGE, THEY REQUIRE THE TRAFFIC ANALYSIS.

THEY HAVE A BUNCH OF CHECK BOXES TO COMPLETE.

SO WE'RE GOING JUST ABOUT COMPLETE ON THE TRAFFIC ANALYSIS, BUT IT'LL BE WHAT WE'RE SEEING SO FAR BE A SINGLE LANE ROUNDABOUT IS WHAT WE'VE DETERMINED, WHICH IS WHAT WE ANTICIPATED.

SO THAT HASN'T CHANGED.

UM, SO RIGHT NOW, UH, YOU KNOW, WITH THE PARKHOUSE DEVELOPMENT, THERE'S A PUBLIC MEETING, I BELIEVE IN THE SECOND WEEK IN NOVEMBER.

UM, SO IN OUR REVIEW LETTER, WE NOTED THAT THIS PROJECT WAS IN PROCESS AND THAT THERE HAVE TO BE COORDINATION.

SO OUR GOAL IS TO TRY TO COMPLETE OUR ROUNDABOUT LAYOUTS FOR COM THERE'S TWO OPTIONS THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT, THAT WE'RE GONNA LAY OUT, UM, YOU KNOW, THAT WE'LL SHARE WITH, WITH THE STAFF AND THE BOARD, UM, TO TRY TO HAVE THAT COMPLETED IN ADVANCE OF THAT MEETING SO THAT WE CAN PROVIDE THAT FOR THE BOARD AND STAFF FOR FEEDBACK AND REVIEW.

AND THEN ALSO, SO WE CAN THEN GIVE THAT TO THE APPLICANT PRIOR TO THE MEETING SO THAT THEY'RE AWARE OF WHAT THE IMPROVEMENTS MAY LOOK LIKE.

SO THAT COORDINATION, UM, YOU KNOW, CONTINUES.

UM, SO, SO THAT'S, THAT'S, LET ME ASK A QUESTION.

IF, IF, IF, IF NO DEVELOPMENT GOES ON THERE AT PARKHOUSE PARKHOUSE PROPERTY, THEN WHEN WILL WE HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO LAY THIS ON PENDOT STORE STEP AND SAY, HERE'S THE PLANS NOD? WHEN CAN WE DO THAT AT THE SAME TIME? YEAH.

SO OUR, WHAT WE, UH, IT'S A GOOD QUE QUESTION.

SO WE, UH, OUR GOAL WAS TO, UM, HAVE THOSE PLANS IN ADVANCE OF THE MEETING AND THEN SCHEDULE A MEETING AFTER THE TOWNSHIP MEETING WITH THE DEPARTMENT, UM, SO THAT WE CAN RE YOU KNOW, SEE WHAT, HOW, YOU KNOW, WHEN ENSUES AT THE MEETING, WHAT SORT OF REACTIONS OR SUBSEQUENT ACTION ITEMS THERE MIGHT BE FOLLOWING THE MEETING.

AND THEN WE CAN GO TO PENDOT AND SAY, UM, HERE WE ARE HERE, HERE'S SOME OF OUR OPTIONS HERE, YOU KNOW, GIVE THEM THE UPDATE AND HAVE THEM LOOK AT IT AND GET THAT INITIAL FEEDBACK SO WE CAN START PREPARING THE FULL-FLEDGED, UH, PLAN.

SOUNDS GOOD.

[SOLICITOR REPORT]

THE FINAL PAVING AND THE OTHER WORK, BECAUSE THAT ASSURES THE COMMUNITY THAT MORE, THE WORK CAN GET DONE, BECAUSE IT GETS US OUT OF PREVAILING WAGE BY HAVING THEM DO THE WORK.

SOLICIT A REPORT.

UH, JUST ONE ITEM, UH, YOU'RE ALL TO DIFFERENT DEGREES.

ARE YOU AWARE OF IT? BUT HIGH POINT, UH, WHERE THAT STANDS IS, UM, THE DEVELOPER HAS DEFINITELY BACKED AWAY FROM HIS FINAL OBLIGATIONS.

AFTER SOME STUTTERING STARTS, STOPS AND STARTS WHERE HE SAID HE WOULD, HE WOULDN'T, HE HE'S DEFINITELY AT THE, I WILL NOT COMPLETE THE JOB PHASE.

SO WE HAVE TO GO AFTER A COUPLE HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS OF SECURITY AND I'VE ALREADY PUT MORE TRUST ON NOTICE.

THEY THEY'RE NOW PART OF, UH, WSFS, BUT THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT DENYING THE OBLIGATION.

SO, UM, I HAVE TO GO THROUGH THE PROCESS TO GET THE MONEY, AND I WILL BE, THERE'S NOTHING THAT NEEDS TO BE VOTED ON RIGHT NOW, BUT I WILL BE COMING BACK TO YOU WITH A, AN AGREEMENT THROUGH WHICH THE HOA WILL TAKE THE MONEY.

I MEAN, WE'LL OVERSEE IT AND WE'LL GIVE IT TO THEM IN SECTIONS, BUT THE HOA WILL TAKE THE MONEY TO FINISH OUT THE PROJECT AND THEY HAVE THEIR OWN THINGS THAT THEY WANT TO GET DONE, WHICH AREN'T PART OF THE PUBLIC MONEY, THAT'S THEIR PROBLEM, BUT WE'LL ALLOW THEM TO DO THE CONTRACTING FOR THE REMAINING MIL,

[01:50:01]

SO ALL.

SO THAT ALLOWS, UH, ACTUALLY THERE'S ENOUGH MONEY THERE.

IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S ENOUGH MONEY THERE TO GET EVERYTHING DONE, AT LEAST SUPERFICIALLY RIGHT NOW, THE AMOUNT THAT LOOKS LIKE IT GETS THERE AND THE ROUGH ESTIMATES OF WHAT THE REMAINING WORK IS, UM, THAT DOESN'T MEAN THAT THEY THEN GET TO DO THEIR PET PROJECTS WITH SECURITY MONEY FROM THE JOB THAT'S ENTIRELY ON THEM TO SOLVE THEIR OWN PROBLEMS ON THEIR SEPARATE LIST.

THIS IS ONLY THE PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS THAT WE ARE CONCERNED WITH.

AND, UM, THEIR ATTORNEY, THE HOA ATTORNEY IS GOING TO SEND ME AN AGREEMENT.

AND THEN I NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT IT HAS THE NECESSARY SAFEGUARDS IN IT, UH, FOR THE TOWNSHIP.

AND, BUT I, HE HAS NOT YET SENT IT TO ME.

SO I DO NOT YET HAVE ANYTHING TO SHOW YOU IN DETAIL.

SO THEY'LL GET THE MONEY.

THEY CAN DO THE PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS THAT WOULD'VE BEEN ON US, WHERE THEY CANNOT DO THAT, OR DO THEY HAVE TO DO NO.

NO.

THEY CAN ONLY DO THE PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS WITH THE MONEY.

THERE'LL BE NEW AGREEMENTS.

THAT'LL LOOK KIND OF LIKE THE DEVELOPER'S AGREEMENT THROUGH WHICH THE HOA WILL BE LOCKED IN ON WHAT THEIR OBLIGATIONS ARE.

BECAUSE YOU HAVE A WISH LIST THEY WANT TO DO, BUT THAT'S ON THAT, BUT THAT'S ON THEM.

THEY CAN USE THE MONEY THAT WE HAVE.

WE HAVEN'T ASKED, WELL, IF THEY COMPLETE THE PUBLIC PROJECTS, LIKE THE PAVING OF THE ROAD, AND I ASSUME ANY LIGHTS OR SIDEWALKS ANYTHING'S LEFT TO DO, AND THERE IS MONEY LEFT, THEN CAN, THAT GOES TO THE, THAT, WELL, THAT GOES TO THE DEVELOP, GOES BACK IN, THIS IS A CONSTRUCTION SET ASIDE.

SO WE JUST BE PART OF THE CONSTRUCTION LOAN STILL.

THAT'S HOW WE, WE ALWAYS HAVE TO RETURN SECURITY AFTER A JOB.

SO, YEAH.

AND MY UNDERSTANDING TOO, IS THAT THE DEVELOPER DID THE OVERALL DEVELOPMENT, BUT THE INDIVIDUAL HOMES WERE BUILT BY SOMEONE ELSE.

HAVE WE SORTED THROUGH ALL THAT? OR HAVE THEY, AS THE HOA AND, AND WHO'S RESPONSIBLE FOR, OR WAS RESPONSIBLE FOR UNTIL THEY WALKED, THEY WALKED AWAY.

THE, THE GUY THAT WE'RE DEALING WITH WAS THE DEVELOPER OF E HELD A OBLIGATION FOR THE COMMON AREAS THAT, THAT WE'RE STILL CONCERNED WITH.

HE HE'S THE ORIGINAL SENATOR OF THE DEVELOPER'S AGREEMENT.

SO THEREFORE HE'S RESPONS ULTIMATELY RESPONSIBLE FOR EVERYTHING.

HE'S SUBCONTRACTED, NV HOMES TO BUILD THE HOUSES.

ARE, ARE THOSE ROADS DEDICATED YET? SORRY.

ARE THEY LIKE, ARE THEY DEDICATED IN THEIR DEDICATION PROCESS? UM, THERE, IF THE TOWN WAS ACCEPTING THEM, YES, THERE WOULD BE DEDICATION PROCESS.

WE ARE NOT ANTICIPATING ACCEPTING ANY OF THE ROADS IN THAT AREA.

I GOTCHA.

AND THERE'S NO IMMEDIATE SAFETY CONCERN.

SO, I MEAN, IT SOUNDS LIKE THIS COULD TAKE SOME TIME HERE.

THEY DID ACTUALLY, THE, THE THING I WAS CONCERNED ABOUT WAS WHERE THEY HAD LEFT THE, THE ROUGH GRAVEL AT, THEY HAVE FIXED THAT NOW WITH HOT PATCH.

SO IS THERE IS ASPHALT, BUT WHEN YOU SAY WE WILL EVENTUALLY, WHEN THEY FINISH THE ROADS DOWN, THEY WILL ACCEPT THEM.

NO, BUT WE, SO WE WILL NEVER PLOW SALT, THOSE ROADS.

NO, THAT'S NOT.

THAT HAS NOT BEEN ANTICIPATED FOR ANY OF THE DEVELOPMENT ON THE CORNER OF BLACK ROCK AND 29 WITH THE TOLL DEVELOPMENT, THE, UM, MORGAN LANE, WHICH IS, UM, DEVELOPED BY LENAR OR, UM, CURRY SLASH ENVY HOMES.

IT WAS NEVER ANTICIPATED DURING THE DEVELOPMENT PROCESS.

WE HAD DISCUSSIONS ABOUT DEDICATING SOME ROADS.

SO THE BUSES COULD ENTER THOSE DEVELOPMENTS.

THERE'S A LOT OF CONCERN ABOUT BUSES ON BLACKROCK ROAD OR ON 29.

WE HAD A MEETING WITH THE SCHOOL DISTRICT AT THE TIME AND THEY SAID, DOESN'T MATTER IF THEY'RE DEDICATED OR NOT.

WE WON'T BE DRIVING IN THERE.

SO AT THAT POINT, TOLL SAID, WE'RE NOT GONNA DEDICATE OUR ROADS.

WE'D RATHER JUST KEEP THEM.

AND THAT WAS A SNOWBALL EFFECT FOR EVERYBODY ELSE.

SO THE HOAS INVOLVED, THEY'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR CONTRACTING IT? YES.

THERE'S SOMETHING ABOUT THE SCHOOL DISTRICT ALLOW BUSES TO GO IN THERE FOR THE KIDS NOW, I, I, HAVEN'T CERTAINLY DRIVEN OVER THERE, BUT NO, MY UNDERSTANDING IS THE SCHOOL DISTRICT WILL NEVER DRIVE IN TO ANY OF THOSE THREE SUBDIVISIONS TO PICK UP KIDS THAT THEY WILL ONLY PICK THEM UP ON BLACK ROCK ROAD OR ON 29.

AND THAT'S WHY WHEN I HAVE DRIVEN IT, YOU CAN SEE THAT THERE'S SOME PEOPLE THAT LINE UP AT, AT MR. CURRY'S DEVELOPMENT AT HIGH POINT, THEY LINE UP THERE ON THE ROAD.

AND WHEN YOU DRIVE FARTHER DOWN TO TOLL BROTHERS, THE TOLL BROTHERS, UH, PRESERVE IT PROVIDENCE.

THEY PUT IN AN AREA WHERE PEOPLE CAN ACTUALLY SIT, WHICH IS WHAT WE REQUESTED FROM EVERYBODY.

AND I THINK THAT THERE'S THERE WOULD'VE BEEN ONE ON 29, BUT THE SCHOOL DISTRICT ISN'T PICKING UP ON THE 29 SIDE AT ALL.

THANKS.

[SUPERVISORS COMMENTS]

[01:55:02]

I'VE GOT MY LITTLE RECOMMENDATIONS.

UH, THE BOOK I'M RECOMMENDING THIS MONTH IS THE DESTRUCTION BY DANA MILLBANK AND THE PODCAST, WHEREVER YOU GET THEM STRAIGHT WHITE AMERICAN JESUS WITH BRAD.

OISHI MARY TRUMP SHOW WITH MARY TRUMP AND OPENING ARGUMENTS WITH ANDREW TORRES AND THOMAS SMITH.

I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE SCORE IS, BUT GO EAGLES.

YEAH, GO BIRDS.

I HEAR YOU.

YEAH, WE'RE GONNA MOVE REALLY FAST.

NOW EVERYBODY, NOBODY SAY THE SCORE.

I'M GONNA QUICKLY RUN THROUGH THE UPCOMING EVENTS, WATCHING IT ITSELF.

EVENTS, UH, OUR NEXT TWO BOARD SUPERVISOR MEETINGS ARE OCTOBER 17TH AND THE 21ST AT SEVEN O'CLOCK, UH, PLANNING COMMISSION IS CANCELED FOR THIS WEDNESDAY, THE 21ST.

UM, UH, UPCOMING

[UPCOMING EVENTS]

UM, THE NEXT MEETING IS OCTOBER 5TH AT 7:00 PM.

AND THE, UH, ITEMS ON THE AGENDA ARE THE SOUTH LEWIS TOWN HOMES, THE AMELIA STREET TOWN HOMES, AND 5 57 HOPWOOD MINOR SUBDIVISION.

UH, THE ENVIRONMENTAL ADVISORY COUNCIL MEETS THIS WEDNESDAY, THE 21ST OF 6:00 PM.

AND THEN AGAIN, NOVEMBER 16TH, ALSO AT 6:00 PM.

UH, THE PARKS AND RECREATION COMMITTEE WILL MEET OCTOBER 12TH AT 6:00 PM AND NOVEMBER 9TH AT 6:00 PM.

THE MUNICIPAL AUTHORITY MEETING SCHEDULE IS OCTOBER 6TH, AT 7:00 PM AND DECEMBER 1ST AT 7:00 PM.

UH, THE ZONING HEARING BOARD ONLY HAS ONE HEARING SCHEDULED AT THIS TIME.

AND THAT'S SEPTEMBER 20TH AT 7:00 PM.

AND THE APPLICATION IS FOR AUTO ZONE AND, UH, BULLOCK BLACK AT 1 0 5 ROSEMONT LANE.

AND, UH, THE ACT 2 0 9 PLAN SUBCOMMITTEE MEETING IS SEPTEMBER 21ST AT SEVEN O'CLOCK.

WHAT IS THAT ACT? 2 0 9 IS OUR TRAFFICS FEE.

UM, WE, UH, BIG MAN GAVE US A MEMO.

WE'RE LOOKING FOR A RECOMMENDATION FROM THEM.

GOTCHA.

SO IF THAT RECOMMENDATION COMES FORWARD, YOU'LL SEE THAT IN OCTOBER.

GREAT.