[00:00:02]
PLEASE.[CALL TO ORDER / ROLL CALL]
TOM WRIGHT CHAIR HERE.UH, BOB HEIST, VICE CHAIR, NOT HERE.
UH, ROBERT GILDER HERE, NICOLA DANE, SECRETARY AAJ.
AIJ I'M DRAWING A COMPLETE BLANK AND I CAN'T SEE THAT FAR AGING GROUP.
UH, UH, JOE PRESENTS HERE IS THE, OUR ATTORNEY JEN GUTS, SHAW AND ANTHONY VALENCIA ARE TRAFFIC AND OR CIVIL AND TRAFFIC PERSPECTIVELY.
UM, LOOK AT OUR PUBLIC COMMENTS NOW.
SO THIS WOULD BE NON AGENDA THINGS THAT ARE NOT ON THIS PARTICULAR AGENDA.
[GENERAL DISCUSSION ITEMS]
TO A GENERAL DISCUSSIONS.WE HAVE TO APPROVE THE MEETING MINUTES FROM JULY 6TH.
SO IF EVERYBODY GETS IN YOUR PACKET, IF EVERYBODY'S HAD A CHANCE TO REVIEW THOSE, I'LL ASK THAT, UH, IF THERE'S NO OTHER COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS OR ADDITIONS OR SUBTRACTIONS, UM, I'LL ASK FOR A MOTION TO APPROVE THE JULY 6TH, 2022, UH, AGENDA MEETING, UH, MINUTES.
I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE A MINUTE.
GILLY'S APPROVED, UH, MADE A MOTION TO APPROVE MINUTES.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS REGARDING THE MINUTES FROM JULY SIX? IF NOT, I THINK VOTE ALL IN FAVOR.
WE'VE APPROVED THE MINUTES FROM JULY 6TH.
SO THAT MOVES US TO OUR AGENDA,
[APPLICATIONS TO BE HEARD ON]
WHICH IS A SHORT ONE TONIGHT.AND IT LOOKS LIKE WE HAVE, UH, FOLKS FROM THE LINFIELD TRAPPE ROAD, THREE BLOCK SUBDIVISION, AND THAT'S GENTLEMEN PUTTING HIS HAND UP.
SO YOU PLEASE COME UP WITH, IDENTIFY YOURSELF, GIVE US YOUR NAME AND WHO YOU ARE AND WHERE YOU'RE FROM AND ALL THAT STUFF.
NOW, JEFF, DO YOU HAVE A COPY OF THAT TO THE THROAT GREEK GREEK? SO WHILE JEFF IS DOING THAT, SO, SO IT'S, UH, IT'S OUR TWO, UH, PUBLIC WATER PUBLIC SEWER, WHICH REQUIRES A MINIMUM LOT SIZE OF 18,000 SQUARE FEET, WHICH WE CAN EASILY, EASILY DEAL WITH.
UM, SO THE INTENT WAS TO SIMPLY CREATE THREE LOTS.
SO PUT THE EXISTING DWELLING, UH, WHICH YOU'LL SEE AT THE TOP OF THE SCREEN ON ONE LOT AND THEN CREATE ANOTHER LOT OF JASON TO IT AND A FLAG LOT IN THE REAR.
AND OBVIOUSLY THE, THE AREA OF LOT THREE, WHICH IS THE REAR LOT THAT DOES NOT INCLUDE THE AREA OF THE FLAGPOLE PORSCHE, WHICH IS IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE ORDINANCE.
SO AGAIN, SINCE IT'S PUBLIC WATER, PUBLIC SEWER, WE THOUGHT THESE LOTS WERE OF SUFFICIENT SIZE TO ALLOW A HOUSE TO BE BUILT AND A STORM WATER MANAGEMENT FACILITY TO BE DONE BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT SEPTIC SYSTEMS OR WELLS OR SETBACKS, ET CETERA.
UM, SO WE SUBMITTED THE PLAN AS SUCH.
WE ASKED FOR A NUMBER OF WAIVERS SPECIFICALLY REGARDING THE ABILITY TO NOT HAVE TO DO SOME OF THESE THINGS NOW.
AND, AND THE REASON WE DID THAT WAS BECAUSE THE APPLICANTS THINKING THEY'RE NOT BUILDERS, THEY'RE DEVELOPERS, AND THEY THOUGHT IT WOULD BE A LOT MORE EFFICIENT IF THEY COULD SELL THESE LOTS IN THE OPEN MARKET.
AND THEN THE BUILDERS WHO BUY THESE LOTS EITHER INDIVIDUALLY OR COLLECTIVELY, AND THEN COME TO THE TOWNSHIP WITH A BUILDING PERMIT PLAN SAYING, THIS IS ACTUALLY WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO.
THIS IS THE HOUSE WE'RE GOING TO PUT IN.
THESE ARE THE IMPROVEMENTS WE'RE GOING TO PUT WITH THE HOUSE, ET CETERA, ET CETERA.
SO THE IDEA OF DOING, SHOWING ALL THAT NOW ONLY TO HAVE IT CHANGED IN THE FUTURE SEEMED, IT SEEMED KIND OF A CUMBERSOME IF YOU WILL.
SO, SO WE HAD SUBMITTED THE PLAN, UM, AND WE DID, UH, AS A RESULT OF THE PLAN SUBMISSION, UH, WE GOT A LETTER FROM GILMORE.
WE GOT A LETTER FROM MCMAHON AND WE GOT OUR LETTER FROM MONTGOMERY COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION.
UM, AND YOU'VE SEEN THE LETTERS.
UM, ANTHONY REALLY DIDN'T HAVE A WHOLE LOT TO A PINE ON BECAUSE THERE WASN'T A WHOLE LOT GOING ON FROM A TRAFFIC PERSPECTIVE.
SO THAT'S PRETTY OBVIOUS, UM, GILMORE, HOWEVER, UM, YOU KNOW, THEY DID THE REVIEW AND I THINK THE TAKEAWAY, UM, FROM GILMORE'S REVIEW IS EFFECTIVELY THAT THEY'RE JUST NOT SUPPORTING ANY OF THE WAIVERS THAT WILL REQUEST IT.
SO ONE HAD TO HAVE A QUICK CONVERSATION WITH YOU FOLKS ABOUT THAT, TO SEE WHAT YOUR THOUGHTS WERE.
UM, OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, WE'LL HAVE TO DO WITH THE TOWNSHIP REQUIRES US TO DO RELATIVE TO SEEING THIS THING COME THROUGH, UH, THE, UH, THE APPROVAL STAGE.
UH, BUT WE'RE JUST HERE TONIGHT TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION, GET YOUR THOUGHTS AND THEN TAKE WHATEVER NEXT STEP IS NECESSARY TO KEEP US MOVING FORWARD.
WELL, I JUST GENDER KIND OF GIVE US WHAT, WHAT, UH, WHAT YOU THINK IS GOING ON THERE.
SO THIS IS A PROJECT SIMILAR TO ONE THAT ACTUALLY JUST STARTED CONSTRUCTION RECENTLY.
UM, WHEN YOU DO THE MINOR SUBDIVISION, WHICH IS ESSENTIALLY WHAT THEY'RE ASKING FOR TYPICALLY A MINOR SUBDIVISIONS, TWO LOTS IN THIS CASE, IT'S THREE BACKLOG, ESPECIALLY YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE STORMWATER MANAGEMENT BACK THERE, THE SITE
[00:05:01]
SLOPES TOWARDS LINFIELD TRAPPE ROAD.SO THERE'S GOING TO BE A DISCHARGE POINT SOMEWHERE.
YOU'RE GOING TO WANT AN EASEMENT ACROSS ANY PROPERTIES THAT IT COVERS, OR YOU'RE GOING TO WANT TO TAKE THEM STRAIGHT TO THE ROAD TO GET INTO THE PUBLIC SEWER, OR I'M SORRY, PUBLIC STORMWATER SYSTEM.
UM, SO THAT'S DEFINITELY A CONCERN.
ANOTHER CONCERN IS, UM, ROAD IMPROVEMENTS ALONG THE FRONTAGE OUT HERE.
THERE'S, THERE'S NOT MUCH THERE RIGHT NOW.
UM, BUT LIKE I SAID, THE PROPERTY THAT'S UNDER CONSTRUCTION RIGHT NOW IN ANOTHER PART OF THE TOWNSHIPS, VERY SIMILAR ROAD, UM, TO THIS ONE, THEY HAD TO DO NOT WIDENING TODAY, RIGHT? BECAUSE YOU'RE NOT PUTTING IN CURB AND SIDEWALK TO NOWHERE BASICALLY, BUT THEY DID HAVE TO GRADE THE FRONTAGE WITHIN THE RIGHT OF WAY.
TAKE IT BACK AS IF THOSE IMPROVEMENTS WERE GOING TO BE THERE IN THE FUTURE.
TO MAKE SURE YOU PRESERVE THE AVAILABILITY TO DO THAT.
UM, SO ONCE AGAIN, IT'S JUST CONSISTENCIES WITH APPLICATION.
OTHER APPLICATIONS ARE IN THE TOWNSHIP AND WE'VE HAD THIS IN WITH OTHER THE, AND I'M SURE YOU ALREADY KNOW IT, BUT I'M MORE FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE OTHERS WHO WERE HERE.
SO, SO, SO UNDER THE, UNDER THE MUNICIPALITIES PLANNING CODE UNDER THE STATE LAW, IT'S NOT LAND DEVELOPMENT WHEN YOU DEVELOP ONE LOT OR TWO LOTS OR TWO RESIDENCES, BUT OVER TWO, IT BECOMES LAND DEVELOPMENT.
SO THE SCENARIO THAT BECOMES DIFFICULT FOR US IS YOU HAVE SOMEONE COME IN AND THEY SAY, WE'RE, WE'RE SUBDIVIDING THE SLOT THREE LOTS, FIVE LOTS.
AND THEY SAY, WE'RE NOT DOING ANYTHING RIGHT NOW.
WE'RE GIVING THIS LOT TO THE NEPHEW THIS LOT TO THE NIECE, AND I'M KEEPING THIS LOT, RIGHT? SO IT'S NO LAND DEVELOPMENT.
THEN EACH LOCK GETS SEPARATELY SOLD AND EACH DEVELOP EACH PERSON SENIOR PERMIT ON EACH LOT COMES IN AND SAYS, NOT LAND DEVELOPMENT.
SO I'M EXEMPT UNDER THE MPC, BUT COLLECTIVELY, IF YOU LOOK AT ALL FIVE OR THREE, IT WOULD BE LAND DEVELOPMENT.
SO IT DOESN'T HAPPEN WHEN YOU HAVE TALL COME IN WITH 45 PROPERTIES, YOU KNOW, THAT IT'S LAND DEVELOPMENT, RIGHT.
WHEN IT'S A FEW PROPERTIES AND THERE'S NO PRESENT DEVELOPMENT, BUT YOU KNOW, THERE'S GOING TO BE FUTURE DEVELOPMENT.
THEN IT BECOMES HARDER TO SAY, IT'S NOT, IT'S ONLY A SUBDIVISION OR, OR HOW MUCH ARE YOU GOING TO REQUIRE FROM THE LAND DEVELOPMENT SIDE TO ATTACH TO A CURRENT SUBDIVISION? ONLY NOW WE DID.
I THINK I HAVE THIS ASKING JEFF, IF HE RECALLS IT THE SAME, WE HAD THE PARCEL THAT WE DISCUSSED YESTERDAY HAS MAYBE WHERE IT WAS KIND OF THE SIMILAR SITUATION WITH A FEW, LOTS THAT WENT TO FAMILY MEMBERS.
YEAH, IT HAS ON, AND JUSTIN KNOWS THIS REAL WELL HAS ON, UM, HESS ROAD AND VALLEY VIEW.
THEY SUBDIVIDED OFF TWO PARCELS AND THEN HAD A LARGER PARCEL.
THAT WAS, BUT I THINK WHAT IF IT'S THAT ONE? I THINK WE HAD ONE WHERE THE APPROVAL RESOLUTIONS BASICALLY SAID, WHOEVER GOES FIRST ON ANY OF THESE LOTS, IT'S ALL LAND DEVELOPMENT THAT YOU CAN'T CLAIM.
IT'S ONLY ONE LOT, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS STARKEY BECAUSE THEY STARKEY THAT THERE WAS A TRIGGER FOR, UM, FEE IN LIEU OF AND SOME OTHER PAYMENTS.
AND IT WAS, IT WAS A QUESTION OF WHO WENT FIRST.
ALL OF THOSE FEES WERE DUE WHEN THAT, AND ALL, WHATEVER OTHER IMPROVEMENTS HAD TO BE DONE HAD TO BE DONE WHEN THAT FIRST LOT WENT AND WAS SOLD.
BUT ON THAT LOT, WE DID HAVE FULL PLANS FOR THEM PRIOR TO THE FIRST GRADING PERMIT COMING IN.
SO THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE FULL ESCROW AND THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE FULL PLANS TO ESTABLISH EVERYTHING ON THE FIRST LOT TO GO FIRST, IF IT'S THE FIRST, IF EVERYTHING'S DEFERRED NOW, THEN THERE WOULD STILL HAVE TO BE THAT TRIGGER.
AND I, AND I UNDERSTAND THE, UM, THE POINT ABOUT, I MEAN, IF THERE ARE PUBLIC OR QUASI PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS YES.
ARE NEEDS TO BE ESTABLISHED AND ABSENT THE DETAIL THAT SHOWS THAT IT'S HARD TO ASSIGN A COST OF THAT.
UM, RELATIVE TO WE, I, AND I UNDERSTAND YOUR POINT, MR. PRESIDENT, ABOUT THE, YOU KNOW, MINOR LAND DEVELOPMENT AND, OR NOT.
AND WE THOUGHT THE MITIGATING FACTOR THERE WAS BECAUSE THERE'S AN EXISTING HOUSE ON THERE ALREADY.
SO WE'RE REALLY JUST DOING TWO NEW LOTS, BUT I THINK WE'RE PROBABLY SPLITTING HAIRS AT THAT POINT.
UM, SO, UM, SO I UNDERSTAND ALL THE, ALL THE DIALOGUE AND DISCUSSION, UM, I DON'T KNOW, UH, STEVE, DO YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OF THESE FOLKS RELATIVE TO WHAT YOU WERE TRYING TO ACCOMPLISH AND WHAT YOU'RE HOPING TO DO? NO.
I MEAN, IT'S JUST, WE JUST WORK OUT FOR, AT THIS TIME TO BUILD, AND WE WERE JUST DRIVING THROUGH LOTS OF I, YOUR POINT'S NOT LOST TO ME THAT THE TWO, THERE'S ONLY TWO NEW LOTS HERE.
SO IT'S UNDER THE MPC FROM THE JUMP.
IT'S NOT MY EXAMPLE OF FIVE IT'S STARTING BELOW.
SO EVEN IF THEY DID COME IN, EACH OF THEM COULD CLAIM, EVEN IF ONE PERSON DEVELOPED BOTH NEW LOTS, RIGHT.
AND I AGREE, AND, AND, YOU KNOW, TOPOGRAPHICALLY THE WAY AND, AND, UM, THE WAY JENNIFER PUT IT OUT THERE, IT DOES SLOPE FROM THE BACK TOWARDS LINFIELD TRAPPE ROAD.
THERE IS A BIT OF A SWALE THAT GOES DOWN WHERE THE FLAG LOT IS IT TAKES IT TO THE MUNICIPAL STORM SEWER SYSTEM.
[00:10:01]
IT TAKES DOWN LINFIELD ROAD.I'M NOT SUPER CONCERNED ABOUT THE EASEMENTS, BUT I THINK THAT THE POINT WE'RE TRYING TO MAKE IS WE WERE HOPING TO DO IT THIS WAY, BUT WE'RE ALSO, I MEAN, CLIFTON AND COON OR CHESCA REAL ESTATE, UM, THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO FIGHT ANYBODY ABOUT THIS.
WE'RE GOING TO DO THE RIGHT THING THAT WE HAVE TO, BUT WE THOUGHT THAT THIS WAS WORTH A TRY BECAUSE IT ALLOWS THEM TO GET TO MARKET QUICKLY.
IT ALLOWS THEM TO SELL THE LOTS TO SOMEBODY AND ACTUALLY SHOW WHAT'S ACTUALLY GOING TO HAPPEN ON THE LAST, NOT, HEY, THIS IS WHAT WE THINK MIGHT HAPPEN.
AND THEN WHEN THINGS CHANGE AND THERE'S SOME ADMINISTRATIVE, YOU KNOW, GYMNASTICS THAT WOULD BE DONE AFTER THAT.
SO THAT WAS REALLY WHAT WE WERE AFTER.
AND WE WANTED TO HAVE THE DISCUSSION WITH, UH, WITH THE PLANNING COMMISSION OF THE ENGINEER, TRAFFIC ENGINEER AND JEFF, UH, JUST TO KIND OF, YOU KNOW, IS THIS POSSIBLE IN YOUR PERSPECTIVE, OR IS THIS A, IS THIS A HARD, NO, GO DO EVERYTHING, PUT EVERYTHING ON THE PLAN, RESUBMIT IT AND GO, AS FAR AS THE PLANNING COMMISSION GOES, I MEAN, WE'RE GOING TO TAKE THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE OTHER CONSULTANTS.
THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE THERE FOR.
I MEAN, THEY KNOW IT BETTER THAN WE DO ON A DAILY BASIS.
AND HAVE JEN THINKS THAT THIS IS NOT A GOOD FIELD RIGHT NOW, AND WE HAVE TO GO WITH THAT RECOMMENDATION.
SO THEN WHATEVER, WHATEVER NEEDS TO BE DONE BETWEEN YOU AND JEN TO MAKE THIS WORK, THEY CAN COME BACK TO US.
THEN THAT'S PROBABLY WHAT WE'RE GOING TO ADVISE YOU TO DO AT THIS POINT.
YOU KNOW, SHE HAS TO BE SATISFIED CAUSE SHE'S ADVISING US.
UH, BUT YOU KNOW, I, I, I CAN'T, I CAN'T ARGUE WITH ANY POINT YOU JUST MADE.
JEN, ARE YOU, ARE YOU NOT COMFORTABLE WITH HAVING A TRIGGER AND REQUIRING THE IMPROVEMENTS NOW, OR IS THE TRIGGER THING THAT WE TALKED ABOUT OKAY.
IN THIS CIRCUMSTANCE? WELL, WHAT DO YOU WANT THE TRIGGER TO BE FIRST PERMIT FOR EITHER OF THE TWO LOTS? SO THE FIRST PERMIT FOR THE TWO LOTS WOULD HAVE TO COME IN AND SHOW STORM OUR MANAGEMENT FOR BOTH LIGHTS.
AND THE ONLY REASON WHY I WOULD EVEN CONSIDER IT IS BECAUSE THERE'S ONLY TWO NEW LOTS, OR THEY'D BE UNDER LAND DEVELOPMENT ANYWAY.
SO EVEN IF THEY ONLY DEVELOP ONE OF THE LOTS, THEY BOTH HAVE TO BE APPROVED BY JEN AND LI IT WOULD BE, I AGREEMENT THAT THE FIRST PERMIT WOULD TRIGGER EVERYTHING THAT SHE'S SAYING HAS TO BE DONE.
THEY DON'T HAVE TO DO NOW, BUT THEY WOULD HAVE TO DO AT THE TIME OF FIRST PERMIT.
BUT FOR BOTH, FOR BOTH, THAT'S WHAT ST.
FRONT, BOTH ONE ONLY ONE MIGHT BE DEVELOPED AT THAT TIME.
AND, AND IT'S, IT'S AN EXCELLENT POINT.
UM, AND I DON'T KNOW IF MY CLIENT, THE MARKET'S CRAZY.
YOU DON'T KNOW IF TWO BUILDERS ARE GOING TO COME IN.
I, MY FEELING IS THAT PROBABLY ONE BUILDER IS GOING TO COME IN.
THEY'RE GOING TO BUY BOAT, PROBABLY BUY ALL THREE LOTS BUILD ON THE, TO REHAB THE ONE THAT'S EXISTING.
AND IT'S JUST GOING TO BE A SINGLE ENTITY.
BUT WE DIDN'T KNOW THAT I CAN'T GUARANTEE THAT WELL.
AND THAT'S THE FRUSTRATION FROM THE TOWNSHIP STANDPOINT IS IT'S THEN, AND WE HAD TO GO THROUGH THIS WITH STARKEY'S.
WE HAD TO TRACK WHAT DEVELOPMENT AND WHAT, AND WE'RE DOING IT WITH ANOTHER ONE.
WE'RE TRYING TO TRACK WHAT EACH LOT HAS TO DO BECAUSE IT'S ABOVE AND BEYOND JUST SOMEONE WALKING IN, I HAVE A HOUSE THAT'S UP ON GREEN WOOD AVENUE THAT IT'S BEEN AN EXISTING LOT.
THEY JUST WALKED IN, THEY CAME WITH A GRADING PLAN AND A BUILDING PLAN, AND THEY CAN GO, THAT'S EASY ENOUGH TO DO BECAUSE EVERYTHING ELSE IS ALREADY IN PLACE.
THE ROAD IMPROVEMENTS WERE TAKEN CARE OF ALL THAT SORT OF STUFF.
AND THEY READ THEM SUBDIVISION.
THAT'S THE PROBLEM WE'RE RUNNING INTO WITH THIS IS HOW DO WE TRACK IF YOU SELL THE BACKLOT, HOW DO WE TRACK LOT ONE AND TWO, PUTTING THE IMPROVEMENTS IN THAT IF THERE ARE IMPROVEMENTS THAT ARE NEEDED OR GRADING, LIKE THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO, AND THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S, WHAT'S GETTING TO BE DIFFICULT.
HOW DO WE TRACK THAT? UNDERSTOOD.
NOW, I MEAN, AFTER THIS MEETING, I'LL TALK TO MY CLIENT.
WE'LL TRY TO COME UP WITH WHAT WE THINK IS A REASONABLE APPROACH TO THIS.
AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, WITH YOUR CONSENT, I WOULD LIKE TO JUST AT LEAST BE ABLE TO REACH OUT TO JEN QUICKLY TO UNDERSTAND IF, IS THAT TIPPING POINT WHERE MAYBE WE SHOW A CONCEPTUAL DESIGN FOR THE PURPOSES OF ESCROW.
UM, I REALLY LIKED THE IDEA OF MAKING, YOU KNOW, NOT NECESSARILY WIDENING THE ROAD, BUT SETTING THE STAGE TO ALLOW THE ROAD TO BE WIDENED.
I THINK THAT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE.
UM, AND IF, IF THERE IS KIND OF, UM, LIKE A POINT WHEREBY YOU KNOW, ALL OF A SUDDEN, YOU KNOW, ALL THE REQUIREMENTS GET INVOKED, THEN WE IDENTIFY WHAT THAT IS.
IF MY CLIENTS ARE OKAY WITH THAT, MAYBE THAT'S A WAY TO DO IT.
IT MAY BE AT THE END OF THE DAY THAT WE'RE JUST GOING TO GO OUT, BASICALLY, YOU KNOW, AND DO ALL THE THINGS THAT WE HOPE NOT TO DO NOW.
WELL, AND PART OF IT IS YOU HAVE GOOD INTENTIONS AND THE BUILDER THAT YOU SELL TO MAY HAVE GOOD INTENTIONS, OR THEY MAY NOT.
SO THAT'S WHEN WE START TO HAVE TO FIGHT WITH THEM ABOUT WHAT WAS PROMISED AT THIS LEVEL.
AND WHAT'S IN AN AGREEMENT WHAT'S NOT IN AN AGREEMENT AND THAT'S WHERE IT GETS DIFFICULT.
I MEAN, WE'RE RUNNING INTO THAT WITH WHAT THE SUBDIVISION IS.
NOW WE'RE HAVING TO ASK HER A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF MONEY BECAUSE THE BUILDER DOESN'T WANT TO DO SOMETHING AT THIS POINT IT'S GOTTEN TO, BUT I'M ALSO, I ALSO DEFER TO GILMORE ON THIS.
I JUST WAS RAISING THE ISSUES TO, FOR TALKING, BUT ULTIMATELY WOULD DEFER TO OUR ENGINEER ON IT.
AND I DON'T MEAN TO PUT YOU ON THE SPOT YET.
AND I DON'T, THAT WASN'T MY INTENTION.
SO PLEASE DON'T TAKE IT THAT WAY.
I JUST WANTED TO HAVE A DISCUSSION FOR THE BENEFIT OF MY CLIENT.
SO HE AND HIS PARTNER CAN GO BACK AND MAKE THE RIGHT DECISION AND BASICALLY DECIDE HOW WE'RE GOING TO TALK TO THEM FOR THE NEXT STEPS.
YOU KNOW, YOU NEED TO TALK JEN, AND THEN COME BACK TO US.
I WILL ASK THE BOARD THOUGH, ANYBODY ELSE ON HERE, WRITE A QUESTIONS FOR THESE GENTLEMEN BEFORE WE MOVE ON HERE AT THIS POINT, ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS ON HIS PLAN OR HIS IDEAS
[00:15:01]
OR SO, YEAH, WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS WAIT, DO THROUGH YOU AND JEN ARE SATISFIED, JEN, SATISFIED WITH YOUR PLAN, AND THEN COME BACK TO THIS, THEN WE'LL LOOK AT THE PLAN AND SAY, OKAY, NOW, YOU KNOW, WE'LL APPROVE IT OR RECOMMEND IT TO THE, TO THE, UH, SUPERVISORS.BUT, UM, I THINK AT THIS POINT UNTIL YOU, UNTIL WE HAVE A GOOD FEELING OF WHAT NEEDS TO BE DONE IN APPROVED BEFORE YOU GET STARTED, I THINK THAT'S WHERE WE NEED TO BE.
UM, ONE FINAL QUESTION FOR THE BOARD AND THE CONSULTANTS AND JEFF.
UM, SO THIS WENT IN AS A TENTATIVE PRELIMINARY, WHICH I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS SOMETHING I THINK, I THINK WE CAN CALL IT A PRELIMINARY.
IT, IT, I I'M, I'M UNDER ORDERS FROM THE BOARD TO NOT DO PRELIMINARY FINAL.
SO MY BASIC QUESTION WAS WHEN THIS, WHEN WE DECIDED WHAT WE'RE GOING TO DO AND RESUBMIT THAT, CAN WE THEN LOOK AT THAT AS THE PRELIMINARY OR PRELIMINARY SIZE FINAL? BECAUSE I THINK THAT BY THE WAY, THE ORDINANCE IS WRITTEN, YOU CAN COME IN THERE AND PRELIMINARY.
YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HAVE TO BE ABLE TO COME UNDER A PRELIMINARY FINAL, BECAUSE THAT REQUIRES, AS WE PUT OTHER DEVELOPERS THROUGH A COMPLETELY CLEAN LETTER WHERE YOU'VE ANSWERED ALL THE QUESTIONS I WOULD RATHER GO, AND YOU DON'T WANT TO GET THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND THE BOARD TO HAVE QUESTIONS AND SAY, WELL, WE WANT YOU TO DO THIS.
AND THEN YOU HAVE TO ALTER THE PLANS.
IF I HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS ON YOU'RE YOU'RE YOU ARE FREE TO ASK THEM WHEN YOU GET IN FRONT OF THE BOARD TO ASK FOR THAT WAIVER.
I CERTAINLY CAN'T CONTROL THAT.
AND CAN'T TELL YOU NO, BUT I'LL TELL YOU THE ORDERS I WORK UNDER.
SO, WELL, ONE MORE THING BEFORE WE GO, ANTHONY, YOU DIDN'T, DID YOU HAVE ANY ISSUES WITH THIS? I MEAN, YOU SAID YOU DIDN'T, BUT LET'S AT THAT YOU'RE USING NO, I WAS GOING TO MENTION, YOU KNOW, THE APPLICANT FOR THE, UM, FOR EVERYONE HERE AT THE TOWNSHIP, BECAUSE WE, WE ECHO THE GENERAL IDEA ABOUT TRYING TO GRADE OUTS, UNDERSTANDING THAT THERE'S NO BUILDING AT THIS TIME.
NUMBER TWO, WHEN OUR LETTER KIND OF ECHOES THE SAME POINT, UM, YOU KNOW, SIDEWALK, CONNECTIVITY AND OTHER THINGS, YOU KNOW, TO KIND OF ESTABLISH WHAT THAT WOULD BE CONCEPTUALLY.
SO THAT, THAT FRONTAGE, WHETHER IT'S DEVELOPED UNDER ONE LOT, TWO, LOTS OR THREE KIND OF, YOU KNOW, GET FIGURED OUT.
SO WE DON'T HINDER ANYTHING THAT HAPPENS DOWN IN, IN THE FUTURE.
SO IT KINDA COINCIDES WITH, WITH JEN'S CONCERN AND WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT HERE.
SO I THINK WITH THAT DISCUSSION, WE CAN PROBABLY FIGURE ALL THAT OUT, WHAT, WHAT THAT SHOULD REPRESENT ALL THE PLAN.
SO I'M SORRY THAT THE BOARD, WE CAN'T, YOU KNOW, WE'RE, WE PROBABLY DON'T HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION FOR US TO MAKE A DECISION, OR IF YOU CAN COORDINATE IT WITH JED AND THERE'S NO REASON YOU CAN'T GO BACK ON THE AGENDA FOR SEPTEMBER 7TH.
I'M NOT SAYING THAT PLANS HAVE TO NECESSARILY BE CHANGED, BUT IF YOU WORK THROUGH THE WAIVERS AND THOSE DETAILS, YOU PROBABLY CAN GET BACK ON SEPTEMBER 7TH.
UM, THE WAY THE SCHEDULE SORT OF WORKS IN THE NEXT COUPLE OF MONTHS IS THE SECOND MEETING OF THE MONTH TENDS TO FALL AFTER THE PLANNING CAME AFTER THE BOARD MEETING.
SO THAT PUSHES YOU BACK ANOTHER MONTH.
SO IF YOU WANT TO GET ON THE BOARD IN SEPTEMBER, YOU'D HAVE TO BE ON THE MEETING FOR THE SEVENTH.
IF YOU CAN WORK THINGS OUT WITH JEN, IF NOT, THEN WE'LL WE'LL SCHEDULE THAT WHEN WE CAN.
I DON'T, I, I THINK THE ONE THING I DON'T WANT TO GET INTO IS TRYING TO FIGHT BY TRYING TO PUSH THIS THING FORWARD AS FAST AS WE CAN.
WE ACTUALLY ENDED UP GOING SLOWER BECAUSE I'VE SEEN THAT HAPPEN.
WE'LL LOOK AT THIS KIND OF TAKE A MACRO, LOOK AT THIS WHOLE THING AND FIGURE OUT WHAT WHAT'S THE BASICALLY WHAT'S THE QUICKEST WAY TO GET WHERE THEY WANT TO BE, WHICH IS APPROVED PLAN SO THEY CAN SELL IT.
DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING ELSE? THANK YOU.
SO WE'LL MOVE ON DOWN THE AGENDA THEN.
UM, AND WE'LL GO WITH A 3 57 GREEN WOOD, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT'S BEEN IN THE WORKS FOR AWHILE.
THIS IS THE FINAL PLAN REVIEW.
SO WE HAVE GENTLEMEN, PLEASE IDENTIFY YOURSELF JUST TO SEE YOU ALL AGAIN, STRAIGHT HORN WITH WB HOMES, ALONG WITH ME AS JAKE PICKERING WITH BOWLER ENGINEERING, I THINK EVERYBODY'S WELL VERSED IN THE MEADOWS AT LONG VIEW A PROJECT, JUST TO GIVE A QUICK UPDATE AS TO WHERE WE ARE WITH THE PROJECT.
UH, OVER THE PAST SEVERAL MONTHS, WE'VE BEEN DILIGENTLY WORKING WITH THE ENGINEER, UH, TALCUM CONSULTANTS TO ADDRESS THEIR COMMENTS, WORK OUT THE ENGINEERING DETAILS, CONTINUE TO WORK ON OUR OUTSIDE AGENCY PERMITTING.
UM, WE ARE IN RECEIPT OF THE TWO, UH, FINAL PLAN, UH, LETTERS FROM GILMORE AND MCMANN.
WE FEEL THOSE ARE CLEAN LETTERS.
THEY'RE MOSTLY ADMINISTRATIVE IN NATURE.
WE DO AGREE TO ALL THE CONDITIONS WITHIN THOSE TWO LETTERS.
AND WE'RE HERE THIS EVENING TO REQUEST FINAL PLAN RECOMMENDATION FROM THE PLANNING COMMISSION, IF YOU SEE FIT AND I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS.
UM, SO I'LL JUST GO, JUST DO, JUST SO THAT EVERYBODY IN THE BOARD CLEAR JEN AND ANTHONY, YOU GUYS OKAY WITH EVERYTHING YOU'VE SENT THE LETTER, YOU GUYS WERE AGREED TO EVERYTHING AND WE'RE GOOD WITH THAT, RIGHT? YES.
WELL THEN, UH, YOU KNOW, FORGIVE US HERE AT THE BOARD.
WE'RE GOING TO TAKE A QUICK LOOK THROUGH THE PAPERS.
UM, DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS AT THIS POINT OR CONCERNS OR COMMENTS OR AT LEAST WHAT WE DISCUSSED? WHAT, WHAT YOU'RE GOING, HOW LONG HAS IT BEEN? NOT QUITE A YEAR, BUT YEAH, IT'S BEEN AWHILE.
[00:20:01]
YOU COULD HELP ME OUT WITH THE CONSERVATION DISTRICT AND MIGHT GO A LITTLE QUICKER.W W W WE'LL REFER YOU OVER THERE, HOW'S THE TIMING WORKING.
ARE YOU GOING TO BE DONE WITH THE RESERVE? THE, THE ONLY THE STATES JUST IN TIME TO MOVE TO THIS ONE? UH, YEAH, WELL, WE'RE SOLD OUT THERE.
UM, OUR GOAL WOULD BE TO START SITE IMPROVEMENTS IN THIS, IN THE FALL.
SO, BUT I THINK WE WILL HAVE A MODEL.
COULD YOU DO ME A QUICK FAVOR? SURE.
I SAID SINCE I THINK YOU FIRST GILLY, I DON'T KNOW IF NICOLE YOU WERE ON THEN WHEN THEY FIRST APPROACHED US, BUT COULD, MAYBE YOU COULD JUST REVIEW REAL QUICKLY HIGH LEVEL YOUR PLAN AGAIN, WHERE YOU'RE AT, WHAT YOUR TIME TABLE IS ALL THAT STUFF.
UM, QUICK OVERVIEW DOES THAT WORK AVENUE IS ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE.
WE HAVE A SINGLE CUL-DE-SAC IN A LOOP ROAD AROUND 25, PROPOSED NEW SINGLE FAMILY.
THERE IS THE EXISTING FARMHOUSE DOWN HERE WITH THE PONDS THAT HISTORICAL HOME THAT IS TO REMAIN.
THAT'S LOCKED THE NUMBER 26, NOT A NEW HOME.
UM, THIS IS THE
UH, WE HAVE OUR PLANNING MODULE EXEMPTION, UH, WE'RE WELL UNDERWAY WITH OUR GPS.
UH, WE HAVE ADMINISTRATIVELY COMPLETE FROM THE CONSERVATION DISTRICT WE'RE IN TECHNICAL REVIEW.
SO WE REALLY FEEL BY THE END OF AUGUST, WE'LL BE FULLY PERMITTED.
WE'D LIKE TO START SITE IMPROVEMENTS IN THE FALL, GO THROUGH THE WINTER, START HOME CONSTRUCTION, PROBABLY IN JANUARY AND OPEN UP FOR SALES IN MARCH.
THAT'S WISHFUL THINKING THAT IS REALLY AGGRESSIVE AS SAID BY THE OWNER OF OUR COMPANY.
WELL, THAT SHOULD PROBABLY SHOULD WORK THAT.
SO YEAH, I'M TRYING TO RE YOU KNOW, UH, 26 IS THE EXISTING HOME.
25 PROPOSED NEW 26 IS THE EXISTING TWO ACRE LOT THAT THE, UM, UH, ORIGINAL FARM HOUSES GOT THE TWO PONDS OUT FRONT, ROUGHLY 11.3 ACRES OF OPEN SPACE THROUGHOUT THE, UH, DEVELOPMENT I WASN'T HERE LAST YEAR.
SO IS, WERE THERE ANY, UH, MAJOR TOPICS THAT HAD TO BE RESOLVED FROM THE FIRST TIME YOU BROUGHT THIS PLAN UP THAT JUST TO KIND OF GIVE ME CONTEXT OR WHAT WAS DISCUSSED? I DON'T THINK ANYTHING MAJOR, THERE WERE WAIVERS WE RE WE DISCUSSED.
I MEAN, FROM THE PLAN STANDPOINT, FROM SKETCH TO CONTINUE TO USE IT, HASN'T CHANGED.
I MEAN, THIS IS GENERALLY WHAT IT IS.
UM, THERE'S BEEN SOME DISCUSSIONS ABOUT THE PONDS OUT FRONT IN THE FARMHOUSE, BUT I WOULDN'T SAY ANYTHING MAJOR ON THIS PROPERTY.
UM, GILLY WAS JUST REMINDING ME, CAUSE I'M TRYING TO REMEMBER THIS ALL TO, YOU KNOW, WE TALKED ABOUT LOTS OF WHAT, 10, 11 TO FLAG LOGS WITH THERE'S SOME SLOPE ISSUES OR SOMETHING WITH THAT, BUT THERE IS A WATER COURSE THAT THEY CROSS TO GET BACK THERE.
SO THERE'LL BE A CULVERT THERE IN THE DRIVEWAY OAK OVER THAT WATERS.
I WOULDN'T SAY IT'S A RAGING RIVER.
THERE'S NO WATER IN THE SPRING.
BUT AGAIN, THAT WAS ALL DRESSED WITH JEN AND YOUR EVERYBODY'S HAPPY WITH ALL THAT, THOSE ONES, BECAUSE IT DOES LOOK A LITTLE BUSY BACK THERE, 10 11.
YOU WOULD THINK THAT THAT'S THE LOW POINT, THE WAY THE SITE'S GRADED.
THEY ACTUALLY HAVE GRAVITY SEWER OUT OF THOSE TWO LOTS.
IT DOES SLOPE SIGNIFICANTLY UP FROM THAT CULVER.
IT GOES UP AND IN MY OPINION, THOSE WILL BE THE TWO BEST LOTS IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD.
AND THEY'RE THE BIGGEST, I THINK THAT THEY ARE, THEY PROBABLY ARE, WELL NOW YOU HAVE 23 AND 24 DOWN IN THE BOTTOM THERE THAT ARE PRETTY LARGE ALSO, UH, YEAH.
FROM MY MEMORY, WHICH IS TERRIBLE.
UM, WHAT I CAN REMEMBER, I COULD SAY GUILTY JUST REMINDED ME OF THAT 10, 11.
UM, SO, UH, YEAH, I DON'T, I DON'T SEE ANY OTHER ISSUES.
AND OF COURSE IF THEY ANTHONY AND JENNER OR, OKAY.
TAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THIS, TO SEND TO THE, UH, TO THE SUPERVISORS FOR FINAL BREW.
SO I'LL TAKE A MOTION IF THAT'S WHAT, UH, YOU KNOW, OR, UH, UH, SUGGESTION OR ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS FROM ANYBODY I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO, UH, PLAN ON.
SO GILLY'S MADE A MOTION TO, UH, TO APPROVE THIS PLAN.
UM, THE GREENWOOD, UH, LONG VIEW MEADOWS AT LONGVIEW PLAN TO MOVE IT FORWARD, UH, TO FINAL REVIEW.
UM, WELL I HAVE A SECOND ON THAT.
SECOND, DO YOU HAVE ANY COMMENTS OR ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS OR FEEDBACK? IF NOT, WE'LL TAKE A VOTE ALL IN FAVOR OF PASSING THIS ON, SAY AYE.
[00:25:01]
I THINK, I THINK YOU GOT IT.[FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS FOR DISCUSSION]
DOWN OUR AGENDA, I HAVE A GERMAN NEXT UP.WELL, I GUESS I SHOULD PUT IT IN THERE THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE TALKING ABOUT.
WHAT'S ON THE NEXT, W W AS IT SORT OF OUR STANDARD RIGHT NOW, WE DON'T HAVE MUCH FOR THE SECOND MEETING.
UM, AS YOU CAN SEE FROM THE, THE, THE AGENDA THAT YOU WERE GIVEN THIS MORNING, THIS AFTERNOON, UM, WE'RE SORT OF TENTATIVELY SCHEDULING AMELIA STREET TOWNHOMES, THE KEYHOLE ZONING TEXT AND MAP AMENDMENT, AND MAYBE DEVINEY EQUITY'S FINAL PLANS WOULD PROBABLY THAT ONE, UM, FOR THE SEPTEMBER 7TH MEETING, UM, EVERYTHING ELSE, AUTO ZONE, THEY'RE GOING FOR A ZONING HEARING BOARD, UH, THEY'RE GOING FOR A VARIANCE FOR PARKING NUMBER AND PARKING SETBACK.
IS THERE ANY HEARING WILL DECIDE THAT? AND I THINK ASSUMING THAT, THAT WORKS OUT FOR THEM AT THEY'LL COME BACK IN THE, THE PLAN AND PROBABLY START THEIR PROCESS BACK UP AGAIN WITH THIS BOARD, UH, SPRINGBOARD SCHOOL DISTRICTS.
I KNOW THERE'S SOME DISCUSSION OF A TURNAROUND AND SOME OTHER REPAVING FOR THAT PROPERTY, GETTING BACK TO THE SMALL, THE MINOR SUBDIVISION.
SO THERE'S, THEY'RE WORKING THROUGH THAT AND PARK HOUSE WHERE WE'RE SORT OF HOLDING STEADY ON.
NOTHING'S CHANGED FOR THAT AT THIS POINT.
UM, PD HOME AND GARDEN, JEN JUST ISSUED A LETTER ON IT ON THEIR FINAL PLAN.
THEY SAW A LOT OF WORK TO DO ON THEIR FINAL PLAN AND THE NEWEST PLAN TO COME INTO SOUTH LEWIS ROAD TOWN HOMES.
UM, THAT ONE I WOULD ASSUME WOULD BE OCTOBER, SOMETIME AT THIS RATE.
SO IF IT'S THE BOY, IF IT'S THE PLANNING, COMMISSION'S PLEASURE.
UM, I'M RECOMMENDING THAT WE CANCEL AUGUST 17TH AND RECONVENE SEPTEMBER 7TH WHEN SUMMER WILL BE REALLY OVER AS TOM SAID, UM, AND HIT THE ITEMS THAT WE HAVE SORT OF HIGHLIGHT ON THE AGENDA.
I DON'T THINK ANY OF US WILL HAVE A PROBLEM WITH POSTPONING 17TH.
I DON'T THINK IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE WE HAVE MUCH GOING ON.
SO YOU'RE THINKING THOUGH THREE, FOUR, AND FIVE ON THE FUTURE WILL BE ON THE SEVENTH.
YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY THEIR, THEIR REVIEWS WILL COME OUT.
MAYBE SOMEBODY HAS A CONFLICT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
THEY MIGHT PULL OFF ONE OR TWO OF THEM MIGHT PULL OFF IF THEY HAVE TO.
BUT I KNOW KEYHOLE AND DAVINCI ARE BOTH REPRESENTED BY ED MULLIN.
AND HE'S SAID HE WANTS TO BE HERE ON THE SEVENTH FOR THOSE.
SO WE'LL HAVE THOSE, IF NOTHING ELSE.
SO, UH, I'LL TAKE A MOTION THEN TO, UH, UH, CANCELED AND MOVE TILL SEPTEMBER 7TH, THE AUGUST 17TH MEETING, I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO CANCEL THE NEXT MEETING.
JAMES MADE A MOTION TO CANCEL AUGUST 17TH.
DO I HAVE A SECOND? NICOLE HAS SECOND IT ALL IN FAVOR.
AND SO WE'LL JUST MOVE TO SEPTEMBER 7TH.
IF WE'LL DEAL WITH THE THREE WE GOT COMING UP AND THERE ANYTHING ELSE FOR THE GOOD OF THE BOARD? I HAVE NOTHING ELSE.
IF WE HAVE NOTHING ELSE, I'LL LOOK FOR A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
NICOLE IS MOTION THAT WE ADJOURN SECOND.